Maybe they are just phoning it in at this point.
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April 7* Raid Part 2: Typhlosion (Ghost Tera)
- Thread starter Perriechu
- Start date
Ok, it took a couple tries (admittedly because I forgot to change the Tera Type to dark, although in one of my runs I missed Snarl), but I beat he Typhlosion.
252 Atk/252 Spec Def/6 HP
Tera Dark
Intimidate
Shell Bell
Power Trip
Crunch
Snarl
Bulk Up
Basically the only thing you gotta worry about is Snarl missing. Otherwise it's a breeze. It helps that since dying lets you reactivate Intimidate to weaken Typhlosion's physical moves very quickly. And while Eruption could be scary early on, later it becomes much less so because of how much health Typhlosion has lost. And even though he will remove his debuffs after some time, if you're at +2 from the Bulk Ups Play Rough will be nothing.
252 Atk/252 Spec Def/6 HP
Tera Dark
Intimidate
Shell Bell
Power Trip
Crunch
Snarl
Bulk Up
Basically the only thing you gotta worry about is Snarl missing. Otherwise it's a breeze. It helps that since dying lets you reactivate Intimidate to weaken Typhlosion's physical moves very quickly. And while Eruption could be scary early on, later it becomes much less so because of how much health Typhlosion has lost. And even though he will remove his debuffs after some time, if you're at +2 from the Bulk Ups Play Rough will be nothing.
Mine is Mild
To be fair Typhlosion was something I struggled to see "Challenging" just due to lacking a strong boosting move or good mixed offenses, and any real cheese outside Eruption spam. Ultimately I was expecting a "charizard v2" that'd just be a case of "kill it before it kills you".
Edit: by the way, tonight for the "do people ever turn their brain on in this game", shoutout to the plethora of people locking ghost types that aren't Annihilape, as well as various randos I met using Samurott which, spoilers, is the raid one thus has bug tera...
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probably should have been Rock Tera/Defense Curl/Rollout/Howl and then a handful of coverage
Kay guys I dunno about the giraffe anymore— played a few more times and realized I didn’t have a good appreciation for just how much work my original Arcanine and Toxipex buddies helped debuff in my first easy win. Basically Giraffe’s weakness is surviving with Flash Fire in tact, because you WILL get hit by at least one near-full power eruption the turn Typhlosion wipes ability. And it can even double attack that turn into Earthquake or Play Rough—
So it’s really not a given that you can survive with enough HP from chip physical attacks into the Eruption with Growl. It’s not given that you will survive the Eruption switching Growl to Light Screen. And it can always Eruption multiple times Pre-Shield. If Giraffe survives with Flash Fire into the Shield it’s probably going to win— but this is less reliable than I’d like from a Solo raid build.
Maybe I play with SpD > SpA but it’s not like even now Giraffe is blitzing through the end game.
So it’s really not a given that you can survive with enough HP from chip physical attacks into the Eruption with Growl. It’s not given that you will survive the Eruption switching Growl to Light Screen. And it can always Eruption multiple times Pre-Shield. If Giraffe survives with Flash Fire into the Shield it’s probably going to win— but this is less reliable than I’d like from a Solo raid build.
Maybe I play with SpD > SpA but it’s not like even now Giraffe is blitzing through the end game.
It didn't even try to throw a PLay Rough at Ting-Lu so I genuinely thought it was jsut something saved for later in the fight.
not playing at all into Flash Fire is really weird considering Eruption spam.
It really should have been Grass to lure people into doing it
maybe they play tested it and realized people were playing into it too much and fully removing a weakness like that was a bit much
I've definitely had it hit my Umbreon and Dachsbun with Play-Roughs as soon as someone set rain up. Maybe Ting Lu is just still taking more damage from fire than Play Rough (see, non stab, much lower attack, and also Ting Lu itself having significantly higher def than spdef)
Honestly considering how much dumb shit that should be OBVIOUSLY wrong (es literally 4x weak to stab mons) people use against raids idk how the "playtesting" phase even goes..
I think they just try to play off pokemon's signature or iconic stuff (if they have one), and Thyp's after all is Eruption. Well that or being a worse Charizard :)
I finally tried a couple online with randoms. Twice as Azumarill and twice as Annihilape. Every time it seemed like the team was getting insta-wiped by double Eruption spam.
I am not seeing how this one is "easy" yet but maybe these two choices aren't good for this raid? Or maybe online randoms are pulling the timer down so fast (compared to solo) that Eruption is getting triggered very often.
I'll take my place in the back seat for a night and watch y'all wizards find the keys to the mansion, then swoop in for a new Unrivaled box mon that will never battle again
I am not seeing how this one is "easy" yet but maybe these two choices aren't good for this raid? Or maybe online randoms are pulling the timer down so fast (compared to solo) that Eruption is getting triggered very often.
I'll take my place in the back seat for a night and watch y'all wizards find the keys to the mansion, then swoop in for a new Unrivaled box mon that will never battle again
So far my craziest deaths:
Turn 1
Skill Swap
EQ
Turn 2
Blue Cheer
EQ
Ability Wipe > Sun > Eruption
*Lived*
Double Attack Earthquake *died*
Shield (now impossible to Skill Swap again)
Crazy Death B)
Turn 1:
Skill Swap
Earthquake
Turn 2:
Light Screen
Play Rough
Ability Wipe > Sun > Eruption
*Lived*
Turn 3
Green Cheer
Eruption -> It’s a new turn, I already moved my ability should be restored -> *Killed through Flash Fire*
Shield
Crazy Death C)
Turn 1
Growl
Eruption (wait, you Eruption 1st turn NOW, and never vs Skill Swap??)
Ability Wipe > Sun > Eruption *dead*
Right now Giraffe sitting at ~40% win rate, but at least the losses are fast.
Edit: A guy deleted his post about waiting to move in order to Skill Swap AFTER the first wipe— I think he deleted because he found out that Typhlosion can still Eruption and kill you. I even got double Eruption’d after doing this but it seems to increase your odds of holding the Flash Fire up a lot. Giraffe goes from like a 40% win rate to like a 70% one.
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Doing this raid online definitely has the same problem as the others, where people are only thinking about their offensive type matchup even if it's literally Ghost vs Ghost. Also, while Play Rough and EQ aren't the most threatening moves, they're a nasty surprise for people who didn't look up the moveset in advance and assumed stuff like Hydreigon or Chi-Yu would be strong picks.
I did barely manage to win alongside a Chi-Yu user but the debuff was super painful and I really don't think it's worth it to weaken Typhlosion
I did barely manage to win alongside a Chi-Yu user but the debuff was super painful and I really don't think it's worth it to weaken Typhlosion
It seems the big thing you really want for this raid is a Snarl user who doesn't have a 4x weakness to fairy or any weakness to fire. I honestly think Krookodile may be one of the best choices purely because he's a Snarl user who has Intimidate. He also gets Power Trip and Bulk Up and 2 Bulk Ups are enough for Power Trip to be stronger than a +2 Crunch. And assuming you don't miss and you invested into Spec Def you should be able to survive 2 Eruptions, even though the 2nd one has a sun boost. By the way, that's idiotic as heck. He starts the battle off with Eruption then uses Sunny Day afterwards? Are you kidding me? It's the other way around, you use the fire attack AFTER setting the sun, not before.
Tbfh I've done like 10 raids, won 7 of them, some with weird shit like one where the other 3 were miraidon, miraidon and hisuian zoroark of all things, and I can somewhat safely say that this raid boils down to 2 things
1) can people survive the first eruption and following attack
2) do you have someone on one or more of Snarl / Mud-Slap / Rain / Light Screen spam
Incidentally since on the raids I've always been on either Dachsbun (mud slap / snarl), Umbreon (snarl) and then Walking Wake (rain, actually gets snarl but feels like a waste), I am somewhat confident I have indirectly carried most of them.
4x offensive threats hardly will live
I beat Typhlosion using the Annihlape set:
Annihilape @ Shell Bell (from HoodlumCallum)
Ability: Defiant
Tera Type: Ghost / Fighting
EVs: 172 HP / 252 Atk / 84 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Rage Fist
- Screech
- Rain Dance
The 84 Speed is to outspeed Typhlosion, the rest is to maximise its attack and bulk.
Turn 1 is to spam Screech, then keep spamming Rage Fist.
Rain Dance can be used if it feels like Eruption is dealing too much damage.
The only thing I regret using Annihilape is that I wished I used Houndoom, since I like Houndoom a lot and still think it can be a useful mon against Typhlosion with Flash Fire + Nasty Plot + Snarl.
Annihilape @ Shell Bell (from HoodlumCallum)
Ability: Defiant
Tera Type: Ghost / Fighting
EVs: 172 HP / 252 Atk / 84 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Rage Fist
- Screech
- Rain Dance
The 84 Speed is to outspeed Typhlosion, the rest is to maximise its attack and bulk.
Turn 1 is to spam Screech, then keep spamming Rage Fist.
Rain Dance can be used if it feels like Eruption is dealing too much damage.
The only thing I regret using Annihilape is that I wished I used Houndoom, since I like Houndoom a lot and still think it can be a useful mon against Typhlosion with Flash Fire + Nasty Plot + Snarl.
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You should be running Adamant nature, not Modest.
Also worth noting that if you have already built an Annihilape with 252 HP / 252 Att for previous raids, you don't have to go through the hassle of redoing the EV spread since simply swapping to a Jolly nature lets you outspeed Typhlosion by one point.
Thanks for the feedback. I meant Adamant, not Modest. The Annihlape I had recently caught just so happened to have a Modest nature.
Regarding the Jolly nature, I never considered running the nature. I chose Adamant because at the time everyone else was running Adamant. I assume because they wanted Annihilape to have more firepower. That being said, a Jolly nature can allow Annihlape to invest more into its bulk.
my only problem with the tera raid build Im using (flutter mane btw Im a violet player so my sister traded me it for an iron jugulis) is that the flutter mane my sister gave me is tera fairy and ghost tera shards in my opinion are the hardest type of tera shard to get 50 of in time for a 7 star raid event
I recommend 172 SpDef rather than HP. You take special hits better since your HP stat is naturally high. Plus, you get more recovery from Shell Bell:
0+ SpA Tera Ghost Typhlosion Shadow Ball vs. 172 HP / 0 SpD Annihilape: 222-264 (54.9 - 65.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
VS
0+ SpA Tera Ghost Typhlosion Shadow Ball vs. 0 HP / 172 SpD Annihilape: 186-222 (51.5 - 61.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
The only downside is taking more play rough damage but it’s still pretty weak for a SE hit. You still take more from SB than PR.
Oranguru is super solid for this raid, I use
Oranguru @ Leftovers
Bold 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpDef
Symbiosis
- Instruct
- Skill Swap
- Rain Dance
- Light Screen
Use Skill Swap in turn 1, congrats, now you're immune to both Shadow Ball and Eruption! Earthquake and Play Rough do pretty much nothing.
Now you're free to fully support your team.
Light Screen obviously is great, Rain Dance counters Sunny Day and nerfs Eruption.
Finally the classic Instruct to make one of your partners the frontman of doom.
You need of course someone to do the damage for you.
It is very satisfying to see Annihilape spamming double Rage Fists to shatter shields like porcelain
Oranguru @ Leftovers
Bold 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpDef
Symbiosis
- Instruct
- Skill Swap
- Rain Dance
- Light Screen
Use Skill Swap in turn 1, congrats, now you're immune to both Shadow Ball and Eruption! Earthquake and Play Rough do pretty much nothing.
Now you're free to fully support your team.
Light Screen obviously is great, Rain Dance counters Sunny Day and nerfs Eruption.
Finally the classic Instruct to make one of your partners the frontman of doom.
You need of course someone to do the damage for you.
It is very satisfying to see Annihilape spamming double Rage Fists to shatter shields like porcelain
This did it for me on my second online try.
Dachsbun, Annihilape, Miraidon, Bellibolt
The ability wipe into Eruption after a Sunny Day was set makes this raid not a lot of fun. I await to see if there's a reliable solo strategy. I might jump in and help with Dachsbun some more at some point but this might not be a farming raid for me.
Huh, my in-game Annihilape I use for most general raids and is slower than Typhlosion also solo’d it
Last time around, I mentioned how the raid boss having an ability that's useful for blunting its own assault means that Skill Swap and Trace users have a leg up.
That might be settling in as an intentionally designed feature.
Stantler @ Eviolite
Ability: Intimidate
Jolly Nature
EVs: 218 HP / 252 Def / 40 Spe
- Role Play
- three of Skill Swap, Helping Hand, Sand Attack, Rain Dance, Reflect, Light Screen
The target speed to beat this time is 236, so the path of least investment to 237 is 40 EVs and the + nature. With that, you can Role Play before the obvious turn 1 Eruption, then you're immune to both special attacks, and the physical attacks have been weakened by Intimidate and almost full Eviolite bulk so you basically don't have to worry about your own HP forever. Even after the pozwipe disables Flash Fire for a turn, simply tanking an Eruption isn't too bad (thanks Wyrdeer, just for existing, despite being barred from Paldea yet!)
The reason to run both Role Play and Skill Swap is so you can take the boss's ability, Skill Swap it to a teammate so they don't have to worry about Eruption either, then use Role Play to copy it back from the teammate (not the boss, in case the shield is up). Meanwhile, the boss thinks you don't have Flash Fire on the second Role Play turn, and have that tempting uninvested SpD stat to aim for...whoops! Alternatively, if one of your teammates is Defiant Annihilape, you can use the sequence Skill Swap-Skill Swap-Role Play rather than Role Play-Skill Swap-Role Play, as that forces the boss to use an Intimidate that nets +1 Attack.
Some teammates like Miraidon or Iron Jugulis are impossible to Skill Swap with, so you won't always be able to set up blanket immunities for the strongest move all around, and if someone brought Azumarill they likely aren't going to appreciate being swapped, so there's still some benefit to using Rain Dance, not to mention reversing the weather affects everyone all in 1 turn rather than taking 6. Sucks that Stantler doesn't get Mud-Slap for hitting through shields, and has to make do with Sand Attack instead, but it's something to do early on if you're not using the "pass the escape pods" approach.
That might be settling in as an intentionally designed feature.
Stantler @ Eviolite
Ability: Intimidate
Jolly Nature
EVs: 218 HP / 252 Def / 40 Spe
- Role Play
- three of Skill Swap, Helping Hand, Sand Attack, Rain Dance, Reflect, Light Screen
The target speed to beat this time is 236, so the path of least investment to 237 is 40 EVs and the + nature. With that, you can Role Play before the obvious turn 1 Eruption, then you're immune to both special attacks, and the physical attacks have been weakened by Intimidate and almost full Eviolite bulk so you basically don't have to worry about your own HP forever. Even after the pozwipe disables Flash Fire for a turn, simply tanking an Eruption isn't too bad (thanks Wyrdeer, just for existing, despite being barred from Paldea yet!)
The reason to run both Role Play and Skill Swap is so you can take the boss's ability, Skill Swap it to a teammate so they don't have to worry about Eruption either, then use Role Play to copy it back from the teammate (not the boss, in case the shield is up). Meanwhile, the boss thinks you don't have Flash Fire on the second Role Play turn, and have that tempting uninvested SpD stat to aim for...whoops! Alternatively, if one of your teammates is Defiant Annihilape, you can use the sequence Skill Swap-Skill Swap-Role Play rather than Role Play-Skill Swap-Role Play, as that forces the boss to use an Intimidate that nets +1 Attack.
Some teammates like Miraidon or Iron Jugulis are impossible to Skill Swap with, so you won't always be able to set up blanket immunities for the strongest move all around, and if someone brought Azumarill they likely aren't going to appreciate being swapped, so there's still some benefit to using Rain Dance, not to mention reversing the weather affects everyone all in 1 turn rather than taking 6. Sucks that Stantler doesn't get Mud-Slap for hitting through shields, and has to make do with Sand Attack instead, but it's something to do early on if you're not using the "pass the escape pods" approach.