Yeah, that's what I generally mean. I get that I may not have worded that the best, but there are people that try to characterize players of different stances in such a manner. I think what does appear to correlate though is that some of the most aggressive/dismissive takes on the subject, such as those characterizing the different sides, feel to me like the less informed opinions and aren't really accurate.
That's what the council says. Here's what the community said when I asked them a bit ago. Due to respect to their privacy, I'll just name them by the first letter of their names, except mine.
Then they start to talk how sometimes the meta vary between games, like how Walking Wake deserved to be banned in NatDex due to Zard Y and Z-Draco Meteor, but it doesn't seem to aply to Roaring Moon, at least not to the level of a quickban.
Is this the chatroom on showdown? Because I wouldn't really give it that much credit given the absurd takes that get said on their on a daily basis. Especially as this looks like a very cherry picked convo. People haven't really asked about it in surveys when given the chance. Also walking wake didn't run draco meteor on sets generally. It was dragon pulse. And while Moon isn't as dominant as before in this tier, natdex has far fewer stops to Moon.
They literally have the chance to ask about it in surveys. There isn't anything stopping them. People just haven't been.
It's not about not caring. It's that the way tiering works. They can't, or shouldn't, base tiering on lower tiers being affected because the first and foremost focus is the tier this is tiering for: OU.
I agree, i also can see why you are annoyed by many things said in this thread, however that seemed to be an honest question with no second thoughts, so i wouldve enjoyed an honest simple answer like "if we ban one thing out of the metagame like kingambit, then tera might be less broken and therefor not banworthy or the other way round, thats why it doesnt make sense to have two suspects at one time, the meta shifts too much"
Okay so if mega lucario isnt deemed broken in the first test because pokemon like mega salamence are around and mega lucario isnt the worst threat or even teamdestroying we should have to live with it being in the tier forever? or an example of current gen: palafin wasnt deemed broken at first but then people found new sets that broke palafins checks without any kind of problem, still since it was deemed okay in a metagame with bundle and mane and other stupid mons it should be allowed forever
It's a little more tough than that, metas can change but re-suspecting over and over starts to feel a lot like "keep redoing the vote until we get the result we want". I don't personally think the council is doing that and a 2nd suspect is due, but the bar for a 3rd suspect should be very high, but not completely off the table. In tera's case I feel like we already understand what it'll do and it's unlikely a new meta change will fundamentally change tera from failing to reach the ban threshold again to being completely overbearing and banning the biggest abusers isn't working anymore. Again though, completely locking ourselves off from re-re-visiting tera doesn't seem wise, but there better be a really good reason to vote on this three times especially if no action wins twice in a row.
Maybe they are on to something just unban volcarona :)
I don't think anyone would oppose just unbanning volc right now, but it'll probably be unbanned along with DLC release
I doubt Bungie is gonna drop come Teal Mask. Its faster than Jolteon iirc and with freeze dry its always got unresisted stab on the entire meta, off a fairy strong SpA too. FMane could possibly drop if somehow Zamazenta drops too, but unless blissey/chansey cores make a return, it would mess everything up.
i would! Fuck the moth, council was right. Way too easy for him to set up and win instantly
No. Opinion has shifted on tera since the first test, who’s to say that won’t happen again. Also who’s to say that more community projects pop up that axe tera from the metagame, similar to the ongoing teraless ou tour.
Forgive me for asking, but if you were just going to say this why respond to the thread at all, you’re not changing anyone’s minds by saying this.
Please don’t.
volc deserved to go. on some level, it always deserved to go, but we just kind of shrugged our shoulders and let it dictate matches at team preview until they decided to give it a stronger hidden power and nerf the mons that were really its only true counters
It didn't deserve to go until gen 8, and that was more due to boots. A mon having a strong endgame or Lots of pressure isn't necessarily an issue, the problem lies in that all the things that helped rein volc in, can no longer affect it, for example sr or lack of coverage.
i mean, people have been calling it "matchup moth" since gen 5. it's like going to work for over a decade with your coworker who everyone calls "boss-punchin' jeff", constantly making jokes about him punching your boss, getting him boxing gloves at the office christmas party, and then acting all surprised when your boss comes in one day with a black eye and says jeff won't be coming back
You can feel this way, but fact is all the inherent cons of running volc were removed. And being able to tera into a different type even helps it. A mon being strong based on matchup is natural, but the cons of running volc were gradually removed with first boots and then with tera gaining the coverage needed.
Agreed on this, but given this meta won't change much in the time left before DLC and ubers will be dropped anyway what are people's thoughts on running a "test" for the sake of collecting a bit more data/thoughts on a potential meta?
It's a nonstarter, which is why it's not being discussed. Suspect tests are not conducted by banning the thing being suspected, because the question is not, "Would the meta be 'better' without it?" That question is completely irrelevant to tiering policy. The question is, "Is this thing being suspected incompatible with a healthy, competitive tier?"
you mean our tiering system which for the second generation in a row is about to flop hard over itself because we are treating every DLC drop as if it's a new generation
