U-turn is a very powerful move. It's powerful in a different way from most moves, in that the power comes from the momentum it gives instead of damage. On Skymin, Seed Flare is a very powerful move. Yet, we banned Skymin and not Seed Flare.
I wouldn't go that far, the fact is, self-switching moves are heavily at fault not just for the brokenness of a couple of suspects but for the offensive, high-risk nature of the meta, a meta in which switching in a hard counter to the opponent's is often a liability. Given that this trend will likely continue with gen VI and parting shot, it's worth it to take the time to examine their effect on our metagame.PK said:this is stupid
U-turn? Broken? Absolutely not.
I don't want to theorymon as to what a U-turn-free metagame would be like, but a move that does a little bit of damage and then switches your Pokemon out? How can that be broken? Sure, it makes prediction a bit easier on the U-turn user's part, but prediction goes both ways. You could predict them to use U-turn, stay in (well unless you have Celebi in for some reason, then get the fuck out), and use a move of your own. Seriously, U-turn is a move that is very clearly not uncompetitive. Banning U-turn is a ridiculous idea.
e: lol @ lucaroark's absurd suggestion that staying in on a u-turn grants you more momentum than staying in on a switch
To be honest, I think you're underestimating U-turn a little bit here. U-turn can deal quite a bit of damage (exemplified by Genesect and Landorus-T), and makes prediction quite a bit easier; even though prediction goes both ways, the U-turn user is definitely favored. However, personally, I don't think U-turn is broken, as it's really just switching + damage. Outside of Pokemon weak to U-turn, I don't see that much difference between U-turn and just switching out, though depending on the Speed of both Pokemon, U-turn can help bring in a free switch.
How does wide distribution make it unfair? Wouldn't that make it more fair since it isn't exclusive to a select few mons, and since it is easily fit on to any team?Yeah distribution of the move plays a big part obviously. Baton Pass isnt as widely distributed, the same applies to Volt Switch which is like only on electric types. U-Turn is super distributed, does damage, and nothing is immune to it, making it the biggest culprit.
Honestly, I'm getting tired of the "ban everything good" philosophy that Smogon seems to have adopted. U-turn is a move. If Genesect was broken with that move, then -- hey, Genesect was rightly banned. U-turn is part of the game. There are many ways to combat it, and many teams can be successful without it. It takes skill to use (unlike Evasion/Sheer Cold etc). I wish people would look for ways to take on these threats, rather than simply removing them.
Incidentally, I think the above also applies to Keldeo. (Obviously it's not a move.) It's very useful, and thus sees a lot of use. That doesn't mean it's broken.
This also applied to Deoxys-D, but that's old news by now.
WutThere are many ways to combat it,
Wow... Zero ways to combat it? How about just staying in and taking a hit for once.... I don't know if you know this but you don't have to switch every time a counter comes in. Also you don't have to switch to a counter every time one of your opponents pokemon is already in. Its called not being predictable.... There are so few pokemon with u-turn that what you just said just seems almost laughable. I hate discussing things so generally without any specifics so lets actually see which viable pokemon have uturn....Wut
No
That's the whole point. There are absolutely ZERO ways to combat it. Switch in a bug resist? U-turn to counter. Don't switch in a bug resist? Take decent damage and u-turn to a counter. Be the best pokemon player ever and have perfect prediction all match? U-turn to a counter.
You can't hope to evaluate a move as broken in and of itself because it isn't a pokemon. It is much more complex than saying "arceus can sweep the meta: ban" or "giratina can wall the meta: ban." It is an integral part of the current metagame and if anybody believes its status can be judged as simply as anything else (as is the case with banning almost all moves and the like) then they either lack an incredibly basic grasp of the metagame or they carry with them an inherent conservative bias.