Bright Powder + Sand Veil makes your attacks 60%> accurate. Thats so insanely cheap... having just a 60% chance of taking down a Garchomp is ridiculous odds, and you'll often lose several pokes to the evasion hax Garchomp if you miss while it sets up.
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The term "hax" , you know brightpowder , etc. well look here please....
- Thread starter BeachBoy
- Start date
I don't care for hax items, especially not in the D/P metagame where you're basically sacrificing such a significant amount of power (Choice items, Life Orb), speed (Choice Scarf) or durability (Leftovers) for practically nothing 93.75% of the time. The only time they work (the other 6.25%), you aren't even guaranteed that you needed them (see: a crit on a Pokemon on low health), so in reality they help even less.
For that, I think that if someone puts one of these worthless items on their Pokemon, they deserve a little more "hax" or "luck" or whatever in their lives. Because 9 out of 10 times it simply won't work and they're running around with no item in their slot.
Quick Claw is a little different, but still roughly 4 out of 5 times it won't help and very often it doesn't matter if you go first or not - in fact, it only matters if either party is about to die.
For that, I think that if someone puts one of these worthless items on their Pokemon, they deserve a little more "hax" or "luck" or whatever in their lives. Because 9 out of 10 times it simply won't work and they're running around with no item in their slot.
Quick Claw is a little different, but still roughly 4 out of 5 times it won't help and very often it doesn't matter if you go first or not - in fact, it only matters if either party is about to die.
Luck items are exactly that, luck.
Basically you're relying on a strategy that means the luck has to go in your favour which means you aren't going to win more than half your games.
Basically you're relying on a strategy that means the luck has to go in your favour which means you aren't going to win more than half your games.
With Sand Veil+Brightpowder, you have a 72% chance of missing when hitting Garchomp with Ice Beam on the first Sub. After two subs, you have a 51% chance of his not having a Sub. After 3 Subs that becomes a 37% chance. If somehow you still manage to break that Sub, there is only a 26% chance of breaking the next one. Really, is that what you want to be facing?
These items are fine, i think. In DP there are so many items you could use, if you're willing to use brightpowder, then go for it, just know that in most cases it will not be worth it. The general opinion is that skilled players don't need to use hax because they have skill, and because they are so skilled, the only way they can be beaten is hax. You have to expect that when you come to Smogon or another competitive website, they aren't just playing because it's fun, they play to win.
Face it, if you use a hax-based team, then there will be people who complain about it.
Face it, if you use a hax-based team, then there will be people who complain about it.
Pokemon battles are about having fun. If all your opps are getting pissed off because they feel they're being haxed unfairly (e.g. Brightpowder) then they're not having fun (and the majority of people don't like being Brightpowder haxed). If your opps aren't having fun they will either complain a lot, turn off their DSs/Shoddy, or just not play you.
Ergo, you won't end up having fun. Seems a bit pointless to me.
Ergo, you won't end up having fun. Seems a bit pointless to me.
You're making a choice to use that crucial one item slot on a pokemon for something that has a low probability of working at all, instead of something that will work and be useful 100% of the time. If you're making that choice you're already sacrificing strategy for luck, and that's going to have a heavy impact on how your game goes overall.
I personally don't mind it, though I could see how some would. Winning a match because of these items is like an airplane crashing. It won't happen often, but when it does, everyone will scream bloody murder.
The only Hax item I've considered using is Quick Claw, and only because I hate it once a sweeper gets so fast you can't get in ahead of the onrushing train of death. However, instead of taking a shot on Quick Claw, you can use a priority move (Which no one is bothered by), or simply be good enough you don't get in those situations.
I personally don't mind it, though I could see how some would. Winning a match because of these items is like an airplane crashing. It won't happen often, but when it does, everyone will scream bloody murder.
The only Hax item I've considered using is Quick Claw, and only because I hate it once a sweeper gets so fast you can't get in ahead of the onrushing train of death. However, instead of taking a shot on Quick Claw, you can use a priority move (Which no one is bothered by), or simply be good enough you don't get in those situations.
People have got to stop using the gambler's fallacy when using probability to make points. The chance of breaking the sub remains the same at every point, it does not decrease.
Having said that, for most people I think it's more a matter of "I don't like hax when it happens to me". Let's be honest here.
It's true that for teams that abuse hax with brightpowder, quick claw etc...it will pay off for them once in maybe 5 or 10 battles. So we can comfort ourselves knowing that those who abuse this will actually be disadvantaging themselves by having no items for the other battles where hax does not help them.
Then again, we really can't...because we may be that 1 in 10 that hax abuse has cheated out of the win. We don't care that in the other 9 battles, they have been royally screwed by having basically no item, no hax activation and lost miserably. It only matters that they haxed against us in this one battle and we were screwed by it and cheated out of our deserving win. And because of that, we hate hax and it must be banned.
I think evilbob has hit the mark here. It's the possible devastation of missing the garchomp and having it SD up that makes brightpowder so annoying. Because frankly does anyone really care if you have brightpowder or quick claw shuckle. Like "WTF! your shuckle outsped my ninjask! HAX! I'm leaving".
As people have said, these items have their pros and cons. It's a gamble...sometimes it pays off and sometimes it doesn't. Using an earlier example, sometimes thunder will hit and KO your pokemon when an expected thunderbolt wouldn't have. Other times, it will miss and I, in turn, will be KOed. It really is no different.
Although, and I'm the first to admit this...here, outside of the battle, I'm all for saying luck is part of the game and these items have their pros and cons. But in battle, when hax happens to me, I hate it and it shouldn't be allowed. :D
Depends really. If your using Quick Claw Rhyperior, then ok, you just lost either a 8% hp recovery (i think) per turn or a +50% (Choice Band) to attack for the sake of a 12.5% (iirc it gives that much) chance to attack first. All I have to do is survive and hit back with a 4x effective move.
Yes, hax items are annoying, and I hate when stuff like Ice Beam misses Salamence (happened A LOT in Netbattle, they all used BP Salamence), but IMO you're relying on a small chance over a sure fire item, such as Leftover or Choice Band which automatically give you their effects.
Yes, hax items are annoying, and I hate when stuff like Ice Beam misses Salamence (happened A LOT in Netbattle, they all used BP Salamence), but IMO you're relying on a small chance over a sure fire item, such as Leftover or Choice Band which automatically give you their effects.
You were right when you said that the game is ridden with luck, that is an inevitable fact that we players deal with. Hax items just add to the luck. they reduce skill, and can allow a lesser skilled player to win just because their focus band activated two times in a row on their sweeper. We all know that once flich hax or freeze hax can change a game, why would we then add those sorts of game swinging luck influences to the game?
Gambler's fallacy. You could maybe say that in theory there was a 26% chance of breaking the fourth sub before you stared on the first, or if all those numbers were decided at the same time, but after you hit or miss the first time the effective probability goes back to 72%.
There's nothing wrong with hax items. They're less reliable items with more payoff, like using Zap Cannon vs Thunderbolt.
what happens when the knock off itself misses cos of brightpowder? xD *sarcasm*
If you're so annoyed by them, why don't you use it? The opponent chooses to sacrifice x1.5 Speed, or 6.25% recovery each turn, or x1.3 attacking stats for an improved chance of hitting with a critical or having your attack miss, so why should you complain? Why don't they complain about how you wouldn't have OHKO'd, but because you had an item that boosted your attack, it made it into the OHKO range?
QFE.
On top of this, when a Garchomp is subbed and Swords Dancing and you have trouble hitting it, you're pretty much going to get your whole team swept by it.
While I myself only use standard fare(Lefties, LO, CB, etc), if the player on the other end wants to use hax items, I'm not complaining. In my view, luck is a general part of Pokemon battles. While I don't clause hax items, I just don't use them.
I say screw hax items. When I lose solely because the other person got that miniscule chance for their hax item to activate it's complete bullshit. I don't care how uncommon these scenarios are. They're bullshit when they do happen.