(Little) Things that annoy you in Pokémon

[Nitro Indigo]

Amazingly, that line in Toy Story 2 where Rex says that companies forcing people to buy guides to beat the game is "extortion" is still relevant today, just in a different context.

Also, there's a rule of thumb in game design that interactable objects should stand out from the background. While the Game Boy's graphics are limited, most of its platformers have lighter backgrounds and darker foregrounds, but it seems to be impossible to make a top-down game look good.

 

[QuentinQuonce]

Who's betting on a third level up move for SV? And only a third?

Slightly tangential but I noticed that as of Platinum Caterpie, Metapod, Weedle, Kakuna, Wurmple, Cascoon, and Silcoon - all of whom learn fewer than 4 moves in previous generations - had their movesets "filled in". The cocoons got Iron Defence and Bug Bite from tutoring while the bugs got Snore. Magikarp also got access to Bounce as a fourth move alongside Tackle, Splash, and Flail; Combee, Burmy, and Kricketot all got Bug Bite by level and a bunch of tutor moves each; and Beldum got four new moves via tutoring.

This idea of making sure that all Pokemon* should be able to learn, at minimum, four moves seems to have persisted because even Tynamo, which cannot use TMs in Gen V (and nothing by tutoring in its debut game), gets four moves on its own; the same is true of later Pokemon with minimal movesets like Spewpa and Blipbug. The exception to this rule is Cosmog and Cosmoem iirc.



*Aside from the obvious exceptions

 

[Nokocchi]

Slightly tangential but I noticed that as of Platinum Caterpie, Metapod, Weedle, Kakuna, Wurmple, Cascoon, and Silcoon - all of whom learn fewer than 4 moves in previous generations - had their movesets "filled in". The cocoons got Iron Defence and Bug Bite from tutoring while the bugs got Snore. Magikarp also got access to Bounce as a fourth move alongside Tackle, Splash, and Flail; Combee, Burmy, and Kricketot all got Bug Bite by level and a bunch of tutor moves each; and Beldum got four new moves via tutoring.

Weedle couldn't learn Snore. It wasn't until B2W2 gave it Electroweb that it could have a full moveset. It is also still the only Pokemon that cannot learn any move listed as Normal type on the status screen.

 

[Magcargo]

So I'm not against evasion mechanics in most games since it can be a legitimate form of damage reduction that can be an effective strategy on fast, frail characters. However, in Pokemon, the numbers seem to be skewed a bit too much in Evasions favor over other forms of damage reduction like Def / SpDef raises.

To illustrate my point, lets take two scenarios in a battle between a Toxapex and Garchomp. Toxapex 1 uses Harden as Garchomp switches in (just pretend Pex gets Harden) and another Toxapex uses Double Team as Chomp switches in. After factoring in the accuracy drop due to evasion, Garchomp's EQ will be roughly 67.4 BP against Toxapex 2. When we compare the damage of its EQ against the two...

Calcs

252 Atk Garchomp Earthquake vs. +1 252 HP / 252+ Def Toxapex: 116-140 (38.1 - 46%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 Atk Garchomp Earthquake (67 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Toxapex: 116-140 (38.1 - 46%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

After factoring averages, Garchomp's Earthquake would roughly do the same damage to both Toxapexes. I kind of wish the effects of Evasion were a bit weaker since it is buffing both defensive stats simultaneously. I'd expect the average effect of a stat raise to be a bit weaker than a +1 raise to a single defensive stat instead of being roughly the same. I imagine this is why people don't like Minimize. Its basically an Iron Defense and Amnesia in one move.

 

[Karxrida]

Do y'all want a throwback? Let's have a throwback.

This guy.

THIS GUY.

Here's the thing, I'm all here for puzzles and exploration and all that good stuff. But this guy is the nightmare of 5 year olds everywhere. The fact that there's no way to get through him unless you happen to click on a vending machine is bad game design. The vending machines don't look like vending machines, they look like random background machines and boxes etc. which Red and Blue are full of. Why would you go round pressing A on them?

I didn't have friends and I didn't know what Google was. The way I got past this guy as a kid was I took my gameboy with me on a camping trip and a random teenager was watching me play and told me the solution. Which is a nice memory until you realise I stopped playing the games months before that trip because I couldn't get past him, and put in in my gameboy on the trip because I forgot that I was stuck. Because I was like 6 and remembering stuff like that is hard for a little kidbrain.

Without that camping trip I wouldn't have beat Red and Blue until I learned what google was.

I have distinct memories of making it to at least Victory Road in RBY when I was 5 and have no fucking idea how I got past this asshole without any sort of guide. Especially since I doubt I understood how Gen I's inventory system worked.

They should have made it so getting past this dude was tied to an event flag involving possession of Erika's Badge or something.

Welcome to old games and the habit of companies back then of selling official game guides. Older Final Fantasy games are full of these!

While older games absolutely did this, many also suffered from spotty translations and/or text space limitations. Others expected you to read the manual for instructions or hints.

 

[Hematite]

So I'm not against evasion mechanics in most games since it can be a legitimate form of damage reduction that can be an effective strategy on fast, frail characters. However, in Pokemon, the numbers seem to be skewed a bit too much in Evasions favor over other forms of damage reduction like Def / SpDef raises.

To illustrate my point, lets take two scenarios in a battle between a Toxapex and Garchomp. Toxapex 1 uses Harden as Garchomp switches in (just pretend Pex gets Harden) and another Toxapex uses Double Team as Chomp switches in. After factoring in the accuracy drop due to evasion, Garchomp's EQ will be roughly 67.4 BP against Toxapex 2. When we compare the damage of its EQ against the two...

Calcs

252 Atk Garchomp Earthquake vs. +1 252 HP / 252+ Def Toxapex: 116-140 (38.1 - 46%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 Atk Garchomp Earthquake (67 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Toxapex: 116-140 (38.1 - 46%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

After factoring averages, Garchomp's Earthquake would roughly do the same damage to both Toxapexes. I kind of wish the effects of Evasion were a bit weaker since it is buffing both defensive stats simultaneously. I'd expect the average effect of a stat raise to be a bit weaker than a +1 raise to a single defensive stat instead of being roughly the same. I imagine this is why people don't like Minimize. Its basically an Iron Defense and Amnesia in one move.

An evasion modifier does have a smaller effect than a Defense modifier!

The five "main" stats essentially start at 2/2, and then a +1 becomes 3/2 (1.5x), a +2 becomes 4/2 (2x), and so on while a -1 becomes 2/3 (0.67x), a -2 becomes 2/4 (0.5x) and so on.
Accuracy and evasion instead start at 3/3, such that a +1 becomes 4/3, a +2 becomes 5/3, a -1 becomes 3/4 and a -2 becomes 3/5, and so on.
It has been this way in the main series since Gen II, and the distinction was apparently already made as early as Pokémon Stadium in Gen I, although it was not implemented in the actual RBY. (Source but fair warning that it's Bulbapedia and might not be worth opening)

That doesn't balance the effect enough in practice, in my opinion (nor most players', I think), but it does do exactly what you suggest already!

Edit: FWIW, I think evasion is more of an issue on "fast, frail characters" than on tanky ones.
Relying on RNG alone to decide between a one-hit KO and an attack that does absolutely nothing is much worse as a player than dealing with something that's balanced around needing to be attacked several times either way and that can't abuse the free turns as efficiently. It also gives both players time to react to their luck in the short term before it gets too out of hand.
Bad luck catches up to passive Pokémon that don't exert a lot of pressure eventually, but when something is designed to "KO or be KOed" every turn and you're relying on pure luck to draw the line between the two, neither player really has a fair amount of control and the game is in no one's hands. This is much worse design than "just averaging out" the damage a wall or something takes.

 

[Magcargo]

An evasion modifier does have a smaller effect than a Defense modifier!

The five "main" stats essentially start at 2/2, and then a +1 becomes 3/2 (1.5x), a +2 becomes 4/2 (2x), and so on while a -1 becomes 2/3 (0.67x), a -2 becomes 2/4 (0.5x) and so on.
Accuracy and evasion instead start at 3/3, such that a +1 becomes 4/3, a +2 becomes 5/3, a -1 becomes 3/4 and a -2 becomes 3/5, and so on.
It has been this way in the main series since Gen II, and the distinction was apparently already made as early as Pokémon Stadium in Gen I, although it was not implemented in the actual RBY. (Source but fair warning that it's Bulbapedia and might not be worth opening)

That doesn't balance the effect enough in practice, in my opinion (nor most players', I think), but it does do exactly what you suggest already!

Oh shoot, you're right. I got evasion mixed up with Accuracy since I wasn't reading this site correctly. I think I looked at the Accuracy table by mistake.

In that case. maybe the Evasion mechanics are fine relatively speaking.

 

[Siggu]

Do y'all want a throwback? Let's have a throwback.

This guy.

THIS GUY.

Here's the thing, I'm all here for puzzles and exploration and all that good stuff. But this guy is the nightmare of 5 year olds everywhere. The fact that there's no way to get through him unless you happen to click on a vending machine is bad game design. The vending machines don't look like vending machines, they look like random background machines and boxes etc. which Red and Blue are full of. Why would you go round pressing A on them?

I didn't have friends and I didn't know what Google was. The way I got past this guy as a kid was I took my gameboy with me on a camping trip and a random teenager was watching me play and told me the solution. Which is a nice memory until you realise I stopped playing the games months before that trip because I couldn't get past him, and put in in my gameboy on the trip because I forgot that I was stuck. Because I was like 6 and remembering stuff like that is hard for a little kidbrain.

Without that camping trip I wouldn't have beat Red and Blue until I learned what google was.

I'll see your complaint and raise it:

This Snorlax. This damned Snorlax. It's something that permanently soured my opinion of having Kanto in Gold/Silver.

Never does the game explain that the Poké Flute is not present per se. Never does the game explain that you need to have obtained the Radio in Goldenrod City (IIRC, in HGSS it's mandatory to challenge Whitney - one of the few things the remakes did fix, but they still fail to tell you the next step). Never does the game explain you then have to go to the Radio Tower in Lavender to get the Expansion Card. And never does the game tell you the frequency for the Poké Flute.

It's probably intended to be some sort of "Eureka!" moment, but all it gave me is a feeling of "Are you KIDDING me?"

I was stuck for days, almost ready to give up, until I was told the solution.

 

[MoonlightRose]

Flygon makes much more sense as the name of Bagon's final evolution then Salamence

 

[misterdarvus]

It bugs me that and signature moves are arbitrarily, overwrites Iron Head instead of being standalone moves.
Guess what, it's actually alright that has its Iron Head replaced by Behemoth Bash, both are bashing anyway.
But I'm not okay with overwrites its Behemoth Blade over Iron Head, it should overwrites Smart Strike instead!
What? cannot learn Smart Strike? Smart Strike is stabbing instead slashing? And I haven't checked that new Sharpness ability, does it affect Smart Strike? I don't care, its so dumb.

 

[Pikachu315111]

Flygon makes much more sense as the name of Bagon's final evolution then Salamence

That's more an English language issue thing, specifically the translation team trying to keep the names similar to the Japanese names:

• Tatsubay ("Tatsu" (Jp for "Dragon" + Baby) = Bagon (Baby + Dragon)
• Komoruu ("Komoru" (Jp word meaning "to seclude oneself") + "Ryu" (Jp for "Dragon")) = Shelgon (Shell + Dragon)
• Bohmander ("Bo" (Jp for "Violent" + Salamander) = Salamence (Salamander + Menace/Vengeance/Violence)
  
  
• Nuckrar (Nutcracker) = Trapinch (Trap + Pinch)
• Vibrava (Vibrate + Larva)
• Flygon (Fly + Dragon)

The Japanese names for the Bagon familt always used a different word that meant "dragon" ("tatsu" and "ryu" are both generic terms for dragons). With Salamence more looking like a typcial European Dragon they decided to use the name of the mythical creature in alchemy which represented the element of Fire, the Salamander. In English, a "dragon" is a "dragon" so we used that word twice. I guess the translator either didn't understand the naming scheme or maybe thought fans who would go diving for the naming reference would get the more symbolic use of "salamander" here and decided not to touch it.

Trapinch family is more funny. They kept Vibrava and Flygon the same cause they were already English words put together fine, just Trapinch's name I could see them tilting their head and going "nutcracker?" and them deciding on the new name.

But I'm not okay with overwrites its Behemoth Blade over Iron Head, it should overwrites Smart Strike instead!
What? cannot learn Smart Strike? Smart Strike is stabbing instead slashing? And I haven't checked that new Sharpness ability, does it affect Smart Strike? I don't care, its so dumb.

Actually it's odd in general that the Steel-type doesn't have a Slash equivalent. How many Pokemon are there that have blades, sometimes replacing their hands, and often described as being metallic or at least as hard as metal? Closest we have is Metal Claw which is fine for some but it's not an increased Critical Hit move.

 

[Ironmage]

Actually it's odd in general that the Steel-type doesn't have a Slash equivalent. How many Pokemon are there that have blades, sometimes replacing their hands, and often described as being metallic or at least as hard as metal? Closest we have is Metal Claw which is fine for some but it's not an increased Critical Hit move.

Kartana even has to make do with a stabbing move instead. Yep, those points on the samurai helmet are clearly the most dangerous part of that mon...

 

[Millky95]

I'll see your complaint and raise it:

View attachment 466542

This Snorlax. This damned Snorlax. It's something that permanently soured my opinion of having Kanto in Gold/Silver.

Never does the game explain that the Poké Flute is not present per se. Never does the game explain that you need to have obtained the Radio in Goldenrod City (IIRC, in HGSS it's mandatory to challenge Whitney - one of the few things the remakes did fix, but they still fail to tell you the next step). Never does the game explain you then have to go to the Radio Tower in Lavender to get the Expansion Card. And never does the game tell you the frequency for the Poké Flute.

It's probably intended to be some sort of "Eureka!" moment, but all it gave me is a feeling of "Are you KIDDING me?"

I was stuck for days, almost ready to give up, until I was told the solution.

So Silver was the first ever Pokemon I finished when I was a kid. I was stuck on this Snorlax for actual months. I had the radio card but was stuck trying to get the Radio Tower to work cause I never picked up the machine part in Cerulean Gym.

But what I did have was a copy of Blue and Pokemon Stadium 2. So I re-played Blue until I got the Poke Flute and tried to transfer it to Silver since I couldn't find the dammed flute in the game. Alas it didn't work.

Then my best mate at the time's older brother told me how to fix it and from there we finished the game

 

[Pikachu315111]

Started playing Violet yesterday and the start of the game has already brought up some common complaints (and some new ones). No spoilers for those concerned (if anything they're warnings).

Before I get started I do want to say I'm liking the game so far. The beginning is fine, can't comment any further on that without spoilers (and I think I'm also missing some context of stuff). But still, there was one moment in the beginning where I hit a snag, and if I told you it was around getting the Starter I imagine many of you know what I'm already going to say even without having played the game. So let's begin in order:

• Waiting To Run: So, at the very beginning of the game you can't run, only slowly walk. Fine on first playthroughs as you'd want to take your time and interact with everything (and they did a nice job giving interaction observations to most things in your home), though when I got outside and exploring out there did it start getting annoying. Little did I know, halfway through the first path in the game, all of the sudden the game will just let you run. No major prompt, no transition, just suddenly you go from walking to running and, aside from setting specific scenes, you're running for the rest of the game. This is a very odd design choice, especially how past recent gens I felt had a pretty good default pace (somewhere between a walk and run). I get it for a few moments in the game which is essentially an intractable cutscene they want you to do a slow walk, but very start of the game doesn't feel necessary.
  
  
• Auto-Save: Especially when you have to restart your game and rush through the beginning again because you forgot to turn off autosave and locks you into a Nature you don't want your Starter having. Auto-Save is fine in general, but COME ON GF, you know for this scenario you shouldn't have autosave, well, autosave. Might as well get right to things then:
  
  
• Starter's Nature: GF, it's been NINE generations, and you're STILL giving the Starter a random Nature!? Spent almost an hour resetting (first time completing deleting what I done so far cause of the autosave) for the Nature I wanted. GF, just give the Starter a Nature which would best suit it. Don't leave it up to chance whether the player may get a Starter with a bad Nature. Come on now.
  
  
• Long Cutscene After: And if you're not going to do this at the very least don't add a lengthy cutscene after we make our choice! You did good giving us a chance to save before choosing the Starter (autosave not withstanding), but we also need a short break AFTER choosing to check the Nature is right! Give us the cutscene introducing the Starters, gameplay break segement (to save), picking our Starter, gameplay break segment (check Starter's stats), and then the next cutscene. Reason took so long to get the right Starter nature is mostly cause there's a minute cutscene I'm mashing through.
  
  
• Can't Skip Cutscene: "Hey, there's a new cutscene skipping option in the menu, turn that on". I did. IT DOESN'T SKIP THE INTRODUCTORY CUTSCENES. At least not the ones surrounding getting your Starter. GF, seriously, do you implement these ideas you clearly get from fans without actually listening to what we want from these features being implemented?

But after that little roadbump it's been fine for me mostly. I'm having fun just running around the big open fields going to places I don't think the game quite wants me to go to just yet but TOO BAD! You gave me an open field filled with Pokemon, items & trainers, I'm going to explore it.

 

[KalosianPorygon]

Oh shoot, you're right. I got evasion mixed up with Accuracy since I wasn't reading this site correctly. I think I looked at the Accuracy table by mistake.

In that case. maybe the Evasion mechanics are fine relatively speaking.

Nah, it's still a problem because evasion increases can be used alongside defense increases.
And because there are base Defense and Sp. Defense stats, but no base Evasion, that means increased Def or SpD is even better on bulky Pokémon like for example Chansey.

 

[Coronis]

Screwing up my finances and having to wait til next week for Violet. Almost impossible for me to be on general sites like Youtube etc. right now and stay unspoiled. Extremely angry at myself.

 

[Nitro Indigo]

Starter's Nature: GF, it's been NINE generations, and you're STILL giving the Starter a random Nature!? Spent almost an hour resetting (first time completing deleting what I done so far cause of the autosave) for the Nature I wanted. GF, just give the Starter a Nature which would best suit it. Don't leave it up to chance whether the player may get a Starter with a bad Nature. Come on now.

Eh, what counts as a good nature for a Pokémon is subjective. Game Freak can't read the minds of every competitive player.

 

[R_N]

Eh, what counts as a good nature for a Pokémon is subjective. Game Freak can't read the minds of every competitive player.

I also cannot fathom caring about natures in 90% of instances in a main game play through.

 

[ScraftyIsTheBest]

I also cannot fathom caring about natures in 90% of instances in a main game play through.

I do, but not to the extent that I would in competitive.

The only concern for me in terms of natures and IVs when it comes to in game for me nowadays is that I only care that they don't hinder the Pokemon's best stats, aka the ones that are vital to the mon's function. Like I wouldn't want a -Attack or -Speed nature on a Garchomp for instance, or close to 0 IVs on either of those stats. Otherwise I settle with anything else. Neutral natures I am very happy with for in-game runs and 15-20 IVs is functionally good enough for in game.

I am otherwise very not nitpicky with natures and IVs in game but that's the specific extent with which I do care about them for in game runs.

 

[Arkm]

Scarlet and Violet. This gen is so shit

 

[Pikachu315111]

Eh, what counts as a good nature for a Pokémon is subjective. Game Freak can't read the minds of every competitive player.

We'll use past Starters as examples:

GEN I:
Bulbasaur: Leans Special: Modest/Calm
Charmander: Speedy Special Attacker: Modest/Timid
Squirtle: Defense Focus, Leans Special: Bold/Calm

GEN II:
Chikorita: Defense Focus, Leans Special: Bold/Calm
Cyndaquil: Speedy Special Attacker: Modest/Timid
Totodile: Leans Physical: Adamant/Impish

GEN III:
Treecko: Speedy Special Attacker: Modest/Timid
Torchic: Better Attack: Adamant
Mudkip: Better Attack: Adamant

GEN IV:
Turtwig: Leans Physical: Adamant/Impish
Chimchar: Speedy Mixed Attacker: Modest/Adamant/Timid/Jolly
Piplup: Leans Special: Modest/Calm

GEN V:
Snivy: Speedy Defense Focus: Timid/Jolly
Tepig: Better Attack: Adamant
Oshawott: Mixed Attacker: Modest/Adamant

GEN VI:
Chespin: Leans Physical: Adamant/Impish
Fennekin: Speedy, Leans Special: Modest/Calm/Timid
Froakie: Speedy Special Attacker: Modest/Timid

GEN VII:
Rowlet: Mixed Attacker: Modest/Adamant
Litten: Better Attack: Adamant
Popplio: Leans Special: Modest/Calm

GEN VIII:
Grookey: Better Attack: Adamant
Scorbunny: Speedy Attacker: Adamant/Jolly
Sobble: Speedy Special Attacker: Modest/Timid

"You often listed two or more Natures, which is it"? Well, I was thinking, in addition to narrowing down to a couple of specific Natures, that also getting the player's input to mold the experience to their liking. Like, after choosing the Starter, a quick text pops-up asking something like "What do you think of your new partner?" which it then provides a few answers which leans toward a certain nature: "It's a strong fighter" (Atk/SpA), "It can withstand attacks" (Def/SpD), "It'll outspeed its opponents" (Spe), "It has strong muscles" (Atk/Def), "It gives off special power" (SpA/SpD), etc..

 

[DrPumpkinz]

SV starter ability spoilers

Why does Sprigatito get Protean? I don't care if it's nerfed, this is the third generation in a row that they've given a starter Protean. And it doesn't even make flavor sense. Protean doesn't seem to have a hard-set flavor, but between its previous two users being a chameleon and a ninja frog, it seemed to have a loose "cold-blooded skin-changing camouflage" sort of flavor to it. It was apparently enough of a flavor barrier that Cinderace got a Protean clone instead of regular Protean. Sprigatito has nothing in common with Kecleon or Greninja. The final form has some sneaky tricks but that hardly seems like a defining factor.

SV starter type spoilers

Also, this is the second generation in a row where the starters have Ghost/Dark/Fighting as their secondary types, after Legends Arceus. And if you skip over Galar's monotype starters, the two generations before it had 2/3s of that type trio, with Alola having Ghost/Dark/Fairy and Kalos having Psychic/Dark/Fighting.

 

[LonelyGaruga]

Starter Abilities

Protean means capable of frequent/easily changing, the JP name is an idiomatic expression essentially meaning the same thing. That fits a stage magician very well, a soccer player not so much.

 

[Hugin]

SV starter type spoilers

Also, this is the second generation in a row where the starters have Ghost/Dark/Fighting as their secondary types, after Legends Arceus. And if you skip over Galar's monotype starters, the two generations before it had 2/3s of that type trio, with Alola having Ghost/Dark/Fairy and Kalos having Psychic/Dark/Fighting.

Hide

I think they decided they don't want to pick types that have interactions with Fire/Water/Grass, presumably after complaints about Sinnoh's Ground/Fighting/Steel triangle. And the list of types available with that restriction is:
Normal, Fighting, Ghost, Psychic, Dark.
Now, there's plenty of other options they could do if they wanted to be balanced. Dragon on all 3 of them would be funny as heck. Fairy/Flying/Poison all have relatively limited interactions that would be easy to balance. Or they could just accept that the starter final forms won't have perfect interactions with each other, and just balance the final Rival team with that in mind.

The real issue is that it's hard to do any sort of doubled or inverse triangle, since the only good types for "Beats Fire" are Ground and Rock, which have extensive and similar interactions with Water and Grass. Sinnoh tried, and a lot of people saw the flaws with that. As long as they're concerned with the final type interactions being balanced, they really can't do anything but variants on the type charts we've seen recently.

 

[Local Dog]

Starter spoilers

Whilst we are talking about starters, I feel like starters have become so much less interesting

They were always the special poster children of a gen and as such had very marketable designs, but I feel like the last few gens have sterilized them down so much. Becoming much more humanoid, much more like fan faves like Lucario or Gardevoir and it's reflected in the secondary typings too. Who cares if the triangle is broken at the final stage? You and your rival(s) have full teams at that point anyway. GF wanting to keep this up leads to the many repeats we've had so far

Similarily the thing with Protean. Oh our poster child of gen 6 was played a ton and got exposure through it? Gotta do that again twice! The fact that Incineroar received intimidate and never got nerfed because it appears so often in VGC aligns with that sadly

I don't think the gen 9 starters are that bad, but I miss when the starters had unique design directions from one another, interesting typings and incorporated their animal resemblance naturally. Gen 3 and 4 did it best I would say