Metagame Force of the Fallen

[Iknowup]

Did we forgot to unban Regieleki with the ban of Tera? Was looking for fast Pokémon and noticed this

 

[SentSawTooMuch]

NOOOOOOOOOO

FUCK man if this happened you could explosion, use Sandsear as the fourth move, and give Shocks and like. CM Florges that and probably and end up fucking about everything in sight

 

[KaenSoul]

Did we forgot to unban Regieleki with the ban of Tera? Was looking for fast Pokémon and noticed this

It doesn't need Tera when it can receive Ice Beam.

 

[ANinjaDude]

Made a team that's based around setting rocks, then just keeping up offensive pressure until I get an endgame where either Valiant or Sneasler has all the coverage they need to wreck entire teams, and it's done fairly well.


Sneasler @ Normal Gem
Ability: Unburden
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Close Combat
- Acrobatics
- Fake Out
- Dire Claw


Quaquaval @ Assault Vest
Ability: Moxie
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpD / 4 Spe
Careful Nature
- Aqua Step
- Close Combat
- Rapid Spin
- Ice Spinner


Iron Valiant @ Life Orb
Ability: Quark Drive
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Moonblast
- Close Combat
- Thunderbolt
- Knock Off


Ceruledge @ Life Orb
Ability: Flash Fire
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
- Shadow Claw
- Shadow Sneak
- Close Combat
- Bitter Blade


Great Tusk @ Leftovers
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Ground
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Close Combat
- Rapid Spin
- Bulk Up
- Headlong Rush


Azelf @ Focus Sash
Ability: Levitate
Tera Type: Psychic
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Zen Headbutt
- Stealth Rock
- Explosion
- Thunder Punch

 

[Clefable]

It doesn't need Tera when it can receive Ice Beam.

There’s quite a big difference between committing a slot on your team to donating Ice Beam versus having Tera Ice to begin with. I believe it’s usually best to donate utility moves or setup moves, so having a mon which partners well with donated coverage moves could be an interesting addition to the metagame.

 

[YubelVT]

behold, the single worst FOTF team ever conceived https://pokepast.es/fc2831b03b5e4f1e
The idea was to have an end game of a Thundurus-Therian behind a sub and screens with perfect coverage. Realistically that's not ever happening but I got my one replay and that's what matters (even if I only did click moves thundy already had but that's besides the point). Wugtrio is here because it is a pokemon that learns Memento and Ice Beam

 

[YubelVT]

There’s quite a big difference between committing a slot on your team to donating Ice Beam versus having Tera Ice to begin with. I believe it’s usually best to donate utility moves or setup moves, so having a mon which partners well with donated coverage moves could be an interesting addition to the metagame.

regieleki is the fastest pokemon in the game you can afford to slap memento wugtrio to give it ice beam

 

[prunyy]

Falinks and Sneasler are banned! Transform is unrestricted!​

	prunyy	DosDogs	Dark Koopatrol	KaenSoul	RESULT
Transform	Unrestrict	Abstain	Unrestrict	Do not unrestrict	Unrestrict
Falinks	Ban	Abstain	Ban	Ban	Ban
Sneasler	Ban	Abstain	Ban	Ban	Ban

DosDogs was not able to participate in this vote.

We decided to see what happens if we free Transform in this meta. It forces you to use Ditto and Mew, which each come with their own pros and cons in a team. Due to the baton-pass-like nature of this meta, Transform is a good way to keep stat boost spamming in check, as carrying a Choice Scarf will help outspeed or Eviolite Chansey will help it tank and take a revenge kill. Transform takes a turn to work and most Pokemon with high HP are relatively slow, making them take a hit before transforming. Taunt is really good as a passing move in this meta, which can easily disable the use of Transform and/or Imprison Transform strategies. Whirlwind or Haze are also options to try to get rid of or weaken the opponent's transformed Pokemon.

Strategies with Jaw Lock No Retreat are becoming overwhelming, especially with the combination with Power Trip or Stored Power. Only Falinks has No Retreat, so it is banned instead of No Retreat being restricted.

Dire Claw is absolutely insane. With a 50% chance of disabling your opponent, it is too strong to pass to other Pokemon. Sneasler will be banned instead of restricting Dire Claw as per the same logic as Falinks.

Tagging Kris to implement. Thanks!

 

[Clefable]

Thank you for unrestricting Transform! I can't wait to try it out :D

Dire Claw was insane -- but part of me thinks that ladder hasn't caught onto how awesome an item Covert Cloak is. Immunity to Dire Claw and Salt Cure's secondary effects is game-changing versus fat and tauntable teams. I run it on zamazenta: https://pokepast.es/81fc56c030051851

 

[YubelVT]

Falinks and Sneasler are banned! Transform is unrestricted!​

	prunyy	DosDogs	Dark Koopatrol	KaenSoul	RESULT
Transform	Unrestrict	Abstain	Unrestrict	Do not unrestrict	Unrestrict
Falinks	Ban	Abstain	Ban	Ban	Ban
Sneasler	Ban	Abstain	Ban	Ban	Ban

DosDogs was not able to participate in this vote.

We decided to see what happens if we free Transform in this meta. It forces you to use Ditto and Mew, which each come with their own pros and cons in a team. Due to the baton-pass-like nature of this meta, Transform is a good way to keep stat boost spamming in check, as carrying a Choice Scarf will help outspeed or Eviolite Chansey will help it tank and take a revenge kill. Transform takes a turn to work and most Pokemon with high HP are relatively slow, making them take a hit before transforming. Taunt is really good as a passing move in this meta, which can easily disable the use of Transform and/or Imprison Transform strategies. Whirlwind or Haze are also options to try to get rid of or weaken the opponent's transformed Pokemon.

Strategies with Jaw Lock No Retreat are becoming overwhelming, especially with the combination with Power Trip or Stored Power. Only Falinks has No Retreat, so it is banned instead of No Retreat being restricted.

Dire Claw is absolutely insane. With a 50% chance of disabling your opponent, it is too strong to pass to other Pokemon. Sneasler will be banned instead of restricting Dire Claw as per the same logic as Falinks.

Tagging Kris to implement. Thanks!

FOTF banning sneasler (albeit for a different reason) before OU ever considered it is one of the timelines of all time

 

[Ctann]

Tried this meta for a bit and it’s fun.

not so fun when decision makers are applying OU tiering concepts to a meta that’s inherently different.

I don’t see anything complex about banning a single move when theres only one Pokémon that has it, in a metagame where a lot of other moves are getting banned…

referring to the recent dire claw / sneasler ban..

this isn’t OU where simple tiering process is the default. “Complexity” is already the default in this meta, lol.

also, banning lilligant outright instead of 4th move victory dance was strange too.

 

[YubelVT]

Tried this meta for a bit and it’s fun.

not so fun when decision makers are applying OU tiering concepts to a meta that’s inherently different.

I don’t see anything complex about banning a single move when theres only one Pokémon that has it, in a metagame where a lot of other moves are getting banned…

referring to the recent dire claw / sneasler ban..

this isn’t OU where simple tiering process is the default. “Complexity” is already the default in this meta, lol.

also, banning lilligant outright instead of 4th move victory dance was strange too.

sneasler deserves to go probably but lilligant definitely shouldn't have been banned over V dance

 

[KaenSoul]

Tried this meta for a bit and it’s fun.

not so fun when decision makers are applying OU tiering concepts to a meta that’s inherently different.

I don’t see anything complex about banning a single move when theres only one Pokémon that has it, in a metagame where a lot of other moves are getting banned…

referring to the recent dire claw / sneasler ban..

this isn’t OU where simple tiering process is the default. “Complexity” is already the default in this meta, lol.

also, banning lilligant outright instead of 4th move victory dance was strange too.

We don't make the rules, just follow them, while some stuff can be adapted to the format, we can't ignore general OM policy.

 

[Clefable]

We don't make the rules, just follow them, while some stuff can be adapted to the format, we can't ignore general OM policy.

Restricted Moves (These moves cannot be used in the fourth moveslot): Belly Drum, Extreme Speed, Population Bomb, Quiver Dance, Revival Blessing, Shell Smash, Transform)

Seems like you could just add Dire Claw/Victory Dance/No Retreat to the restricted move list if you wanted to keep Sneasler/Lilligant? That would be consistent with how Population Bomb was handled

 

[KaenSoul]

Seems like you could just add Dire Claw/Victory Dance/No Retreat to the restricted move list if you wanted to keep Sneasler/Lilligant? That would be consistent with how Population Bomb was handled

Population Bomb can be passed by two different Pokémon, Maushold and Tandemaus.

 

[bbg]

Happy to report that I've finally made a fun and good team for this OM, built around what I consider to be the best (balanced) moves in the format in Transform and Encore. I'm 1400 with this right now but wanted to post before the meta gets too old.



In particular the role compression that Azu provides with encore passing and strong priority is surprisingly great, and it has more immediate power and nicer resistances compared to Dragonite. Everything is invested pretty heavily in HP to make transform more powerful. Zama has enough attack to 2hko offensive Gholdengo and max HP Dragapult with Crunch since it rarely transforms.

Base form Mew is pretty mid but scarf transform can still save your life sometimes. Psychic fangs is probably worse than psychic but it makes me feel better versus screens and lets me justify using Jolly so that u-turn can ohko Hoopa-U. There's no hazard removal but there's a lot you can do to prevent multiple layers from going up, and amoonguss removes T spike really easily which this team would hate otherwise. Still I would probably lose to a diligent ceaseless edge/whirlwind user.

Also if anyone wants to tell me how to make the pokepaste show up with little sprites i would dance around the room (edit: thanks Clefable )

 

[Clefable]

Also if anyone wants to tell me how to make the pokepaste show up with little sprites i would dance around the room

Here's a cool and original team I made myself!

<-- click

How to insert link over little sprites

 

[bbg]

Here's a cool and original team I made myself!

<-- click

Wowwwwww thank u so much <3<3<3

 

[Ahpel the applin water]

Here's a cool and original team I made myself!

<-- click

How to insert link over little sprites

View attachment 534913

me, resisting the urge to say "MF THATS A FOONGUS CHANGE THAT G4IJENRK"
also, is there a vr of moves/mons here? im really trying to learn the meta

 

[prunyy]

me, resisting the urge to say "MF THATS A FOONGUS CHANGE THAT G4IJENRK"
also, is there a vr of moves/mons here? im really trying to learn the meta

At the moment, no. The meta is relatively still new and there isn't like a solid "meta" yet.

You can grab one of the samples until you see what is good on ladder, and maybe take inspiration from that. You can also just mess around in teambuilder until you find something you like. Maybe a weather oriented team, or some kind of Toxic + Salt Cure stall team, etc.

 

[KaenSoul]

We have been working on a VR:

S

S-

A+

A

A-

B+

B

B-

C+

C

C-

 

[lookingsharpe]

Here is an eruption/water shuriken spam team that I have been using and doing pretty well with (high 1300s on ladder). I worried that dedicated special walls and hazards would be rough since I have effectively no physical power and no removal, but between 1 levitate, 2 HDB users, and a mostly suicide lead, hazards don't end up being too bad, and I haven't seen people using things like Goodra-H or Blissey much, so that hasn't been a problem either.


Torkoal @ Heat Rock
Ability: Drought
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Stealth Rock
- Earth Power
- Lava Plume
- Eruption

Mostly used as a lead to set stealth rock and sun, then pass eruption. Can occasionally snag a burn on something trying to set up, which is nice.


Greninja @ Choice Specs
Ability: Protean
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Switcheroo
- Ice Beam
- U-turn
- Water Shuriken

Really appreciates protean + eruption + sun + specs, can hit anything that isn't immune or specially bulky and resistant extremely hard. Passes water shuriken, which everyone else below appreciates


Skeledirge @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Unaware
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Torch Song
- Earth Power
- Shadow Ball
- Slack Off

Not sure about the pokemon or the move passed here, but slack off makes eruption more viable, and unaware is helpful, and in general its been doing ok.


Walking Wake @ Life Orb
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Agility
- Flamethrower
- Draco Meteor
- Hydro Steam

Really benefits from teammates here. Eruption and Sun does massive damage and I normally send it out fairly early, but later in the game it can benefit from recovery and water shuriken to do good damage.


Volcarona @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Flame Body
Tera Type: Bug
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Quiver Dance
- Fiery Dance
- Bug Buzz
- Giga Drain

Appreciates eruption, hydro steam, and shuriken, can win late game with those if you get a QD off. Giga drain is good coverage for the rest of the team and makes eruption more viable. Can sometimes save a game with flame body by burning a fast sweeper.


Rotom-Wash @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
Tera Type: Electric
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Volt Switch
- Discharge
- Will-O-Wisp
- Nasty Plot

Not sure about the moves here, sometimes nasty plot is nice but I don't end up using it much. Mostly end up using will-o-wisp and water shuriken later in the game.

 

[prunyy]

DLC 1 Ban Changes
DLC came out with a bunch of interesting Pokemon. Most of the new Pokemon don't seem too threatening but there are some old ones that still need attention.

Kommo-o and Shaymin Sky are banned!

Kommo-o has Clangorous Soul. Very funny move. Everyone has the chance to get recovery as well which makes this omni-boosting move even stronger.

Shaymin Sky can hax through most of its "checks" with Seed Flare and Air Slash as well as gaining tools from its teammates.

Other Pokemon we've looked at are Darkrai , Bloodmoon Ursaluna pretend and Tail Glow. These will be watchlisted and monitored.

Samples are VR will be updated hopefully soon as well.

Taggins Kris for implement. Thanks!

 

[prunyy]

So we forgot about Razor Fang...

Razor Fang is now banned from Force of the Fallen!

Tagging Kris to implement. Thanks! oops

 

[prunyy]

Hi again,

Tail Glow is now restricted form Force of the Fallen!

Tail Glow enables special attackers to boost +3 in a single turn, not allowing many possible switch-ins, and forces a sack to bring a revenge killer out.

In other news, we tiered the other mons that came out in DLC. Their best fourth moves should be added soon™.
Ursaluna-Bloodmoon is really good with more moves and coverage to work with. The Ogerpons also hit really hard with the 1.2x multiplier and appreciate more moves as well. Ninetales-Alola can set screens for HO, which is one of the best playstyles in this meta, and it has some good moves to pass.