Pokémon Cinderace

[Crotenis]

I've been running an anti-lead set with HDB, U-turn, Pyro Ball, Taunt, and Court Change to some great success.
With taunt he cripples a wide-variety of defensive mons and can freely pivot out with u-turn to a more favorable matchup, and if the opponent manages to gets hazards up he can switch in and court change.
This works specially well paired with Rotom-W as a voltturn core and Dugtrio to trap stuff like Ttar or Toxapex. It also helps a ton that Cinderace threatens some very prominent mons like Ferrothorn and Corviknight a STAB 120 fire move and a great attack stat.

 

[Suppletangerine]

Just from the first page, is 252 HP better than 252 Attack for the Court Change set? I wanna make this in game since it’s probably the only set worth using until Libero comes out.

 

[TrueArchery]

This thing is pretty neat, but I think I'll run Flareblitz...
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8ou-1022232464

 

[zferolie]

Would having both COurt change and a rapid spinner on a team be too much?

 

[Finchinator]

Would having both COurt change and a rapid spinner on a team be too much?

Not necessarily, but it depends on the team structure and how many hazard vulnerable Pokemon you happen to have.

Just from the first page, is 252 HP better than 252 Attack for the Court Change set? I wanna make this in game since it’s probably the only set worth using until Libero comes out.

I only see Atk invested sets. It is more of an offensive pivot and it needs the damage output on Pyro Ball, HJK, and even U-turn. It does not play particularly bulky.

This thing is pretty neat, but I think I'll run Flareblitz...
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8ou-1022232464

I'd definitely run Pyro Ball. Flare Blitz offers very little over it and the recoil is a huge drawback comparatively.

 

[zferolie]

Not necessarily, but it depends on the team structure and how many hazard vulnerable Pokemon you happen to have.

My cinderace team is CInderace, Eldegoss, Jellycent, Obstagoon, Toxcicity, and Rapidash, so i guess hazards aren't a huge issue. only cinder is weak to stealth rock.

So change court would be better then rapid spin, but not sure what I would replace that with on Eldegoss...

 

[FrenchNomi23]

Add Court-Change to your Cinderace, zferolie. It's very necessarily for your team.

 

[avensis18]

I agree it could be very necessarily for your team.

https://shareit.onl/ https://mxplayer.pro/

 

[BolTingBlazie]

I think this mon could be very hard to deal with especially in swsh ou as soon as libero comes out, because even if you can burn it if it is running libero, it can just stab u-turn out.

If an opponent somehow locks you in, just u-turn and bypass that.

If an intimidate user like gyarados comes out, stab u-turn and let another pokemon deal with it.

And then you can let cinderace run over the opposing team.

U-turn may be what makes cinderace bannable in swsh metagame and actually viable in the national dex meta.

Libero may give it an extra weakness of being intimidate or burn vulnerable, but u-turn pretty much invalidates all of that with libero.

This pokemon was already solid in swsh ou, but it is gonna be bonkers with Hidden Ability.

 

[Pichuiscool]

greninja:I am the champion
Cinderace: I'm about to end this mans whole career

but also best cinderace set

Cinderace @ Focus Sash
Ability: Libero
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Court Change
- Pyro Ball
- Reversal
- Gunk Shot/U Turn

 

[Ast0rga]

I am a very paranoid guy that only uses moves with 100 accuracy if it's possible, with the only exceptions being Draco Meteor (let's face it, Dragon pulse is bad) and a couple others. There is no Stone Edge or Hydro Pump on my teambuilding.
With that said and after missing a couple Pyro balls and High jump kicks yesterday, here's what I'm running now:

Cinderace @ Choice Band
Ability: Libero
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- U-Turn
- Flare Blitz
- Iron Head
- Sucker Punch

Easy to spam u turn with solid damage, just have some hazard control

Cinderace @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Libero
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Acrobatics
- Flare Blitz
- Iron Head
- Bulk Up

This is a fun one, Flare Blitz/Bulk up until your sitrus is consumed then spam "STAB" Acrobatics. You can also use Acrobatics for fun block Earthquake mindgames.

 

[Mocha]

So I was looking at our current OU listed here and counted 32 OU Pokemon. I'm aware these will be subject to change with new Pokemon being released, Dracovish gone, etc - but I wanted to go ahead and see how the move coverage for Cinderace would affect OU and here's what I got:

Cinderace's move-type coverage in current OU

Fire (Flare Blitz, Pyro Ball, etc): 7
Bug (U-turn): 3
Steel (Iron Head): 10
Dark (Sucker Punch): 5
Flying (Acrobatics): 3
Poison (Gunk Shot): 6
Psychic (Zen Headbutt): 6
Fighting (High Jump Kick): 8

What can be deduced here is that Fire/Steel moves seem to give it the best coverage, only being resisted by other Cinderace, Rotom-H, Seismitoad, and Toxapex. For that, the rest of the moves are up to you.

Again, this is taking account for current OU, not yet where OU will shift to, UU, and so on. If I miscounted something or you see an error, let me know and I will edit. I made this because I wanted to see what would be the most optimal move coverage for Cinderace

*Edit* Updated High Jump Kick. Actually hits more OU mons effectively than I thought.

 

[FalcoRCM]

So I was looking at our current OU listed here and counted 32 OU Pokemon. I'm aware these will be subject to change with new Pokemon being released, Dracovish gone, etc - but I wanted to go ahead and see how the move coverage for Cinderace would affect OU and here's what I got:

Cinderace's move-type coverage in current OU

Fire (Flare Blitz, Pyro Ball, etc): 7
Bug (U-turn): 3
Steel (Iron Head): 10
Dark (Sucker Punch): 5
Flying (Acrobatics): 3
Poison (Gunk Shot): 6
Psychic (Zen Headbutt): 6

What can be deduced here is that Fire/Steel moves seem to give it the best coverage, only being resisted by other Cinderace, Rotom-H, Seismitoad, and Toxapex. For that, the rest of the moves are up to you.

Again, this is taking account for current OU, not yet where OU will shift to, UU, and so on. If I miscounted something or you see an error, let me know and I will edit. I made this because I wanted to see what would be the most optimal move coverage for Cinderace

The problem I have with the logic of this is that a lot of those steel super effectives don't really matter. If you dont run zen headbut you get walled by Pex and if you get walled by pex you're gonna have a bad time. Additionally, almost every mon that is weak to iron head in OU doesn't want to take a +1 pyro ball or zen headbutt anyway so it's just not necessary. Also you forgot high jump kick.

 

[Mocha]

The problem I have with the logic of this is that a lot of those steel super effectives don't really matter. If you dont run zen headbut you get walled by Pex and if you get walled by pex you're gonna have a bad time. Additionally, almost every mon that is weak to iron head in OU doesn't want to take a +1 pyro ball or zen headbutt anyway so it's just not necessary. Also you forgot high jump kick.

Iron Head hits Clefable, Grimmsnarl, Hatterene, Kyurem, Mimikyu, Ninetales-Alola, Shuckle, Terrakion, Togekiss, and Tyranitar all super effective with "stab" Libero. Sure, most of these won't enjoy getting smacked by Pyro Ball/Flare Blitz anyway, but at least you'll have the speed to outrun the non-scarf variants, and possibly get flinches in addition to 100% accuracy. Maybe I'm over hyping Iron Head, since it's not that strong in itself, but I think with a combination of Iron Head/Fire move/Zen Headbutt, you'll have most of current OU covered, including Toxapex.

Though it's not like Cinderace's move pool is that versatile to start with (so far), so it's mostly a shuffle between the moves mentioned, and Sucker Punch/U-Turn/etc. I guess if you're running the Bulk Up set, then you could remove any redundant coverage that would hit neutrally just as hard, if not close.

I did forget High Jump Kick. Going to edit. Thanks

 

[Lune Knight]

Theorymoning here, but I think an Endure set has the potential to be quite scary.

Cinderace @ Salac/Leichi Berry
Ability: Libero
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant/Jolly Nature
IVs: 0 HP / 0 Def / 0 SpD
- Endure
- Reversal
- Acrobatics/Pyro Ball
- Sucker Punch

Considering it gains STAB on both Reversal and Acrobatics, could end up to be quite devastating. Sucker Punch rounds out the set by helping against opposing priority. Can run Pyro Ball over Acrobatics if you're worried about Ferrothorn/Rocky Helmet. Obviously gets wrecked by hazards and sand, but with the right team support I think it could rip through unprepared teams pretty well.