BH Balanced Hackmons

[Deleted User 91486]

Although there are so, so many recovery moves, I find Shore Up (and in some cases Roost) are the most useful. I run Shore Up on every last one of my Pokemon, because in the case that Sandstorm approaches (Here's lookin' at you, Tyranitar) my Pokemon can also benefit from it. It's crazy, but it really does work. (sometimes)

that's true, but I encountered some imprison/transform stuff on the ladder against which it was really useful to have a different recovery move for each mon.

Yes, Pecha Berry may be better than Lum, I haven't thought about it. As I wrote, I'm running scarf myself and have only gotten some Lum Berries when tricking the scarf away, which I then used against poison healers.
yes, you're right, but most of the time I used Registeel against Regigigas, I either dbonded them, tricked them the scarf or they boosted up to +6 to avoid the dbond and got killed by blissey, so I had success with registeel against Regigigas.

 

[Rumors]

Sand teams are quite rare, so with everyone spamming Shore Up, you're probably safer using other recovery moves since you're probably more likely to get Shore Up randomly Imprisoned than you are to benefit from an opposing Sand Stream user.

 

[Dioo]

Though Shore Up is the best recovery, Rumors is saying the true. Sand Teams are much rare.

 

[Champion Leon]

You could also use Floral Healing for Grassy Terrain situations (according to Serebii you heal 100% when Grassy Terrain is up) and it has higher PP than Synthesis/Morning Sun/Moonlight Sunny Day exploits (like when facing Desolate Land Primal-Groudon).

 

[drampa's grandpa]

You could also use Floral Healing for Grassy Terrain situations (according to Serebii you heal 100% when Grassy Terrain is up) and it has higher PP than Synthesis/Morning Sun/Moonlight Sunny Day exploits (like when facing Desolate Land Primal-Groudon).

Floral Healing is like Heal Pulse, not Recover. I would avoid using it.

Also I would avoid the sunbased healing moves unless the mon itself summons sun. PP is too important on healing moves.

On the other hand a set like this seems cool.

Groudon-Primal @ Leftovers / Safety Goggles
Ability: Desolate Land
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Thousand Arrows
- Substitute / Sacred Fire
- Shift Gear / Coil
- Morning Sun

 

[Dioo]

Floral Healing only for Doubles lel.

idk if this sets already exist but i used this so much on gen 6:
Venusaur-Mega @ Black Sludge
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Parting Shot
- Spore
- Trick
- Destiny Bond

 

[Kadabrium]

Alternate use of gengar to deal with pivot spam. Best suited for teams otherwise not weak against ghost.
@ Focus Sash/Safety Goggles/Spooky Plate
- Entrainment
- Thousand Waves
- Perish Song
- Disable/Taunt/Judgment

 

[E4 Flint]

Guys, don't use this thread as a place to just dump your sets.

Anyway, it's finally here; the best OM has its tour starting!!

Join the OMGS II BH OPEN!!
http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/the-balanced-hackmons-open-sign-ups.3599667/

 

[Poor Exeggcution]

I'm new to the tier, (as in a couple days) and maybe this is just a post- maxEV/no Wonderguard environment, but I'm shocked as to how largely irrelevant types seem to be in this meta. I'm having a respectable time with an all-bug team, for example.

One thing I am really surprised about, though, is the lack of Leech Seed. I began running a Liquid Ooze pokemon to counter the Triage spam I had first expected when entering the tier, but I'm discovering that it makes for a decent Magic Bounce counter.

If you have a hearty Liquid Ooze pokemon with recovery, being Leech Seeded means you have a steady, non-counterable DoT against any pokemon you face. I'm having fun with it, Sky Drop and Magma Storm.

....I might have a slight vendetta against Megearna.

 

[Matthewchu]

I wanted to share a set for Mawile, that I thought of, and ran house in a game I played. It was based off a Medicham set with the same idea, but I was frustrated that I couldn't beat Zygod, Chansey, and Sturdinja. Then I thought of other Huge/Pure Power Pokemon and thought of Mawile. So here it is:

Mawile @ Mawilite
Ability: Simple
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Shift Gear
- Sunsteel Strike
- Icicle Crash / Thousand Arrows
- Imprison

The idea is to get one or 2 Simple Shift Gears up, an Imprison if there is a Chansey, Mega Evolve to get the Huge Power, and just sweep with Sunsteel Strike. The Icicle Crash is for Zygod. Karrows is for bulky steel types, such as Registeel or Solgaleo that can live and then Spectral Theif. Any feedback would be greatly appreciated!

 

[Rumors]

I wanted to share a set for Mawile, that I thought of, and ran house in a game I played. It was based off a Medicham set with the same idea, but I was frustrated that I couldn't beat Zygod, Chansey, and Sturdinja. Then I thought of other Huge/Pure Power Pokemon and thought of Mawile. So here it is:
View attachment 80138
Mawile @ Mawilite
Ability: Simple
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Shift Gear
- Sunsteel Strike
- Icicle Crash
- Imprison

The idea is to get one or 2 Simple Shift Gears up, an Imprison if there is a Chansey, Mega Evolve to get the Huge Power, and just sweep with Sunsteel Strike. The Icicle Crash is for Zygod. Any feedback would be greatly appreciated!

Main problem is...

+4 252+ Atk Huge Power Mawile-Mega Sunsteel Strike vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Registeel: 273-322 (75 - 88.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

It can't switch in, but Registeel can take a hit and either remove or steal your boosts. And being one of the most common defensive Pokemon, this is a cause for concern. Worst case scenario, it steals your boosts and then Baton Passes them to something like Primal Don. Also, speaking of, Mawile isn't particularly bulky. It's not terrible, but you pretty much have to find weak attackers or a wall to set-up in front of. It's also quite vulnerable to status.

 

[cityscapes]

speaking of pdon

+2 252+ Atk Huge Power Mawile-Mega Icicle Crash vs. 248 HP / 252 Def Groudon-Primal: 198-233 (49.1 - 57.8%) -- 96.9% chance to 2HKO

it can switch in and then just sorta wins unless you flinch it. even if you can catch it on the switch, you're forced to either give up vanilla maw's setup potential or do approximately 0 damage if you choose not to mega. pdon is a jerk.

also as Rumors said, your set is walled by steels. to fix this, I recommend running karrows over icicle crash because zyc is actually pretty rare from my experience (ice coverage on everything makes it a pretty inconsistent check to stuff even tho it can eat ice moves sometimes) and besides, they definitely won't want to come in on a fairy like maw.

+2 252+ Atk Huge Power Mawile-Mega Thousand Arrows vs. 248 HP / 252 Def Groudon-Primal: 418-492 (103.7 - 122%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Huge Power Mawile-Mega Thousand Arrows vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Registeel: 400-472 (109.8 - 129.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Huge Power Mawile-Mega Thousand Arrows vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Solgaleo: 558-658 (116.7 - 137.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO actually maw looks pretty solid

this thing looks very hard to imposter proof once it gets going, but if you can pull it off then maybe you can run play rough or something over imprison!

 

[Matthewchu]

Main problem is...

+4 252+ Atk Huge Power Mawile-Mega Sunsteel Strike vs. 252 HP / 252 Def Registeel: 273-322 (75 - 88.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

It can't switch in, but Registeel can take a hit and either remove or steal your boosts. And being one of the most common defensive Pokemon, this is a cause for concern. Worst case scenario, it steals your boosts and then Baton Passes them to something like Primal Don. Also, speaking of, Mawile isn't particularly bulky. It's not terrible, but you pretty much have to find weak attackers or a wall to set-up in front of. It's also quite vulnerable to status.

Thanks for the feedback!

 

[HDF0]

I'm new, and today I decided to make a "serious" team. But how the heck did my Giratina stall?
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7balancedhackmons-556925757

 

[ElMustacho]

I'm new, and today I decided to make a "serious" team. But how the heck did my Giratina stall?
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7balancedhackmons-556925757

Hi HDF0! Welcome to the BH world! The reason behind your victory are the following:

• Your opponent was trying to imprison trap you. But that doesn't work on a ghost type.
• Your opponent had 0 "Plan B" skill. He/She had other 5 Pokemon and gave up when its Zygarde didn't worked.

I hope you find your BH experience entertaining!

Speaking of something else, Sniper Mega Mewtwo Y!

Mewtwo-Mega-Y @ Scope Lens
Ability: Sniper
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Psycho Boost
- Focus Energy / Leaf Storm
- Fleur Cannon
- Overheat / Moongeist Beam / Eruption

This set has incredible power on a 1 turn set up, hitting harder than Shell Smash while not caring about stats drop (you also pratically ignore parting shot). Psycho Boost OHKOes up to non AV M-Audino and that's a lot. Focus Energy is required to set up, but it can be baton passed and that gives you another moveslot (also improving imposterproofness). Leaf Storm OHKOes non AV Kyogre and below.
Fleur Cannon hits stuff immune to Psycho Boost and OHKOes non AV Zygod.
Overheat is for Steel Types and even AV Registeel risks the OHKO (Solgaleo just dies to that). Moongeist nails Shedinja and bypass a theoretical Battle Armor. Eruption OHKOes every Steel type if at full health.
You can run whatever coverage but the lower your stats the better you are at beating the imposter.
If you are afraid of imposter, run Focus Energy on something else and baton pass it, as it isn't copied by the imposter. If you are really afraid run Modest and use Normalize Gengar to shut it down, but switch in safely. On most situation the imposter is stuck with -2/4/6 spa and that means it tickles your team, but if it crits it's gonna hurt a lot.

EDIT!! Other analysis!
Update! Leaf Storm is not required, Psycho Boost OHKOes Pogre 100% of times with SR (31.3% otherwise)
The previous examples were referred to 252 HP / 252+ SpD on everything.
Unlike Shell Smash or Sheer Force, it's hard to play this thing against you, as it lacks the chance of critting! Shell Smash has the stats stolen, Sheer Force is only without the Life Orb. Also unlike Shell Smash you can't wall it with Unaware as it doesn't stop crits from happening.
Other calcs.
This thing is 2HKOing Eviolite Chansey on its special side!! WTF?!?
252 SpA Sniper Mewtwo-Mega-Y Psycho Boost vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Chansey on a critical hit: 355-420 (50.4 - 59.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO (chansey runs +def nature).

Want to wall it with a Flash Fire Steel type? You can't!
252 SpA Sniper Mewtwo-Mega-Y Psycho Boost vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Registeel on a critical hit: 189-222 (51.9 - 60.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Giratina is specially bulkier than Zygarde, right?!?
252 SpA Sniper Mewtwo-Mega-Y Fleur Cannon vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Giratina on a critical hit: 549-648 (108.9 - 128.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO
NO IT ISN'T!

The imposter can handle it, right?
(original at -2) 252 SpA Sniper Mewtwo-Mega-Y Moongeist Beam vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Mewtwo-Mega-Y on a critical hit: 312-369 (44.3 - 52.4%) -- 17.6% chance to 2HKO (SR makes this a clear 2HKO)
(imposter at -2) -2 252 SpA Mewtwo-Mega-Y Moongeist Beam vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Mewtwo-Mega-Y: 104-124 (25 - 29.8%) -- guaranteed 4HKO

Ok but maybe you are not running Moongeist so what are they doing in that case?
Overheat converges on this on the imposter: -6 252 SpA Mewtwo-Mega-Y Overheat vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Mewtwo-Mega-Y: 34-40 (8.1 - 9.6%) -- possibly the worst move ever
The original however still has a 4HKO (3HKO with SR): 252 SpA Sniper Mewtwo-Mega-Y Overheat vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Mewtwo-Mega-Y on a critical hit: 202-238 (28.6 - 33.8%) -- 0.7% chance to 3HKO

This led me to the conclusion that Sniper MMY has 1 safe switchin (its imposter if it has Eviolite, and it's not that safe), as long as you hit the target for damage.
Team options: Psychic Terrain for no priority and gigantic firepower, Gravity for 100% precision, SR for breaking sashes and relevant cases explained up there, Knock Off for removing AV and ensuring OHKOs on regenerators, Sticky Web for Pheromosa and Deo-s.
Check and Counters
Imposter: It's not that easy! Lucky Punch imposter is probably the best answer as it has 50% of critting and turning your tactic against you, but you can manage it with Knock Off before using MMY. You can see it coming on the switch as it takes more damage than it should.
Knock Off: it removes your item and you can't crit for sure after that!
Faster Stuff: Aerodactyl outspeeds without suffering for Sticky Webs and probably can damage it, unless Gravity is also in play. Other stuff with Contrary might like Sticky Web but it really needs to immediately kill MMY.
Priority: Yes but you can face it under Psychic Terrain and then it wouldn't work.
Destiny Bond: Congratulations, you killed it but you lost your Destiny Bond user and whatever died to let it switch in without dying on the switch. Have fun on your 4-5 match, remember that the opponent can run Sniper twice.

 

[willdbeast]

I wanted to share a set for Mawile, that I thought of, and ran house in a game I played. It was based off a Medicham set with the same idea, but I was frustrated that I couldn't beat Zygod, Chansey, and Sturdinja. Then I thought of other Huge/Pure Power Pokemon and thought of Mawile. So here it is:
View attachment 80138
Mawile @ Mawilite
Ability: Simple
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Shift Gear
- Sunsteel Strike
- Icicle Crash / Thousand Arrows
- Imprison

The idea is to get one or 2 Simple Shift Gears up, an Imprison if there is a Chansey, Mega Evolve to get the Huge Power, and just sweep with Sunsteel Strike. The Icicle Crash is for Zygod. Karrows is for bulky steel types, such as Registeel or Solgaleo that can live and then Spectral Theif. Any feedback would be greatly appreciated!

Something I just read reminded me of this; it's probably a bad set but I'll post regardless.

Try illusion mega maw and disguise yourself as something that forces lots of switches, then you'll have a free turn to setup (maybe shell smash if you really want +2 attack) and then afterwards there's still a good chance that they'll have to switch again depending on what you were disguised as.

This way when you mega evolve the illusion can't be broken which frees up a moveslot so you can run t-arrows and double stab or something since you'll be imposterproof without imprison.

Edit: you'd have to run a +speed nature to beat mmy at +2 though.

 

[Deleted User 91486]

What do you think about this?

Steelix-Mega @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Impish Nature
- Anchor Shot
- Toxic / Perish Song
- Core Enforcer
- Milk Drink

As I always had problems with PH users and relied on Destiny Bond to kill them (or tried to burn them/knock their Toxic Orbs on the switchin off), I searched for a check against both Regigas and Kyogre and found this. It is the bulkiest Facade resist that isn't a ghost and isn't hit super-effective by knock off/spectral thief. Thanks to water absorb it is also immune to Kyogre's Scald and thanks to its typing, it is also immune to Volt Switch, Kyogre's most common pivot move. It traps the PH mon with Anchor shot and then core-enforces it - thanks to its low speed, it is always slower - to remove PH and let the opponent die on its self-induced poisoning.
Toxic or Perish Song are to remove other trapped mons. I prefer toxic, because it also hits soundproff mons and cripples the target for the rest of the match, if it manages to escape.

 

[SuperSkylake]

I'd suggest running safety goggles on that set to stop regigigas from hitting you with spore, which a lot of them run since they don't have to fear being bounced back after their toxic orb is activated. other than that that's an interesting set, though somewhat niche. You arguably don't even need perish song if you're aiming to trap PH mons, toxic is just better since it puts them on a timer and it also works to hit ghost types that would avoid your anchor shot, wearing them down anyway.

 

[motherlove]

Perish song also means you lose to imposter which is diapers.

 

[Deleted User 91486]

Yes, that's why I prefer toxic ^^

I also tested Shadow Tag Gengar and feels so broken. I just use tinted lens PDon (or another really strong mon) to do damage, then switch to Gengar, encore the foe into his recovery move and kill it with Perish Song. There seems to be really no counterplay, because if he doesn't heal, he will die to Groudon's next attack... And the problem with being stuck with regular Gengar can easily be solved when leading with the regular Gegar disguised per illusion and mega-evolving with protect/king's shield.

 

[AbuseroftheBroken]

Yes, that's why I prefer toxic ^^

I also tested Shadow Tag Gengar and feels so broken. I just use tinted lens PDon (or another really strong mon) to do damage, then switch to Gengar, encore the foe into his recovery move and kill it with Perish Song. There seems to be really no counterplay, because if he doesn't heal, he will die to Groudon's next attack... And the problem with being stuck with regular Gengar can easily be solved when leading with the regular Gegar disguised per illusion and mega-evolving with protect/king's shield.

Semako, you should post these comments in the Ban and Suspect Threads. E4 Flint already moved our conversation over once, and I don't think he would be happy to do it again. :/

 

[GmU pokeboss9]

Im thinking where is the borderline between good and potenial broken set ?!

I guess he thinks getting something banned is gaining ultimative respect,
as in his mind it was his set or atleast he thought about it.

Thus when the ban happens he screams: "I always knew it, Im a pokemon Master"
75% of the community is like that.

 

[Deleted User 91486]

This is another, quite unusual set, which can be very useful:
Killer Whale (Kyogre-Primal) @ Earth Plate
Ability: Fur Coat
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Judgment
- Roost
- Quiver Dance
- Ice Beam

I opted for Earth Plate Judgement over a water STAB, because ground and ice have great neutral and especially super-effective coverage, since there are so many steels and dragons around in BH. Judgment with earth plate is the strongest special ground move (besides Z-Earth Power) and OHKOes Gengar, and is an easy 2HKO against those RegenVest steels that like to switch in against it. I run Fur Coat as the ability to be able to switch safely into any Primal Groudon and destroy it with Judgment, and it also helps against priority users.

 

[ciredan]

I've been meaning to share this set for a while now:

Audino-Mega @ Power Herb
Ability: Simple
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 SpA / 252 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Stored Power
- Geomancy
- Cotton Guard
- Milk Drink

It's impossibly bulky (>1400 defence after 1 Cotton Guard and >1000 special defence after one Geomancy). Not to mention that using both moves only once puts stored power at 380 base power (using Geomancy again puts it's base power at 500 [+6 252+ SpA Audino-Mega Stored Power (500 BP) vs. +6 252 HP / 252+ SpD Registeel: 116-137 (31.8 - 37.6%) -- 91.2% chance to 3HKO]). It's also immune to Spectral Thief. Normal power, yo.

+4 252+ SpA Audino-Mega Stored Power (380 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mewtwo-Mega-Y: 419-493 (118.6 - 139.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+6 252+ Atk Mewtwo-Mega-Y V-create vs. +6 252 HP / 252 Def Audino-Mega: 161-190 (39.2 - 46.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
audino heal up more damage than mewtwo put out. audino ohko mewtwo. audino win every time.

Did I mention it has 597 speed after one Geomancy, which is higher than a Deoxys-Speed with fully invested speed stats (504)?

(A major problem is that a single Dark type mon renders it completely useless but I usually just make sure that any Dark types are dealt with before sending it in lmao. I tested it with Power Trip instead of Stored Power to see if it was just as effective but it just sucks on Audino lol.)

( i also recently managed a turnaround with this thing in a stall war that won me the game if youre interested (they forfeited but just take that as proof of the fear that mega audino inspires in its opponents > http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7balancedhackmons-559685884 [50 turn battle woops lmao] )

 

[motherlove]

Finally a wall to belly drum mmy. Bless you kind child.