What's wrong with the metagame?

[Agent Gibbs]

Please enlighten me about these 'incredibly bulky walls' that SD Terrakion is 'hard pressed to break through'?

No I'm not picking on you, but last time I ran a damage calc, after SD this pokemon happened to 2HKO everything usable in OU (emphasis: yes, usable NOT viable) not named Golurk to whom it happens to 49.47% Damage at MINIMUM.

I'd say the same for Landorus but a few select pokemon like Celebi and Cresselia can actually wall it (provided it doesn't run horrible Coverage like sludge wave; so I'll give you that)

So please answer me.

If you reread his post, you'd see that he said "rather than" SD Terrakion. He said that the common Scarf Keldeo and RP Landorus are the ones that have trouble with the bulky walls, unlike Pokemon like SD Terrakion, and the fact that there are fewer SD Terrakion running around makes it that much easier for stall teams.

 

[Meru]

I feel like stall is better than ever (within the generation) at this point.

With all of the scarf keldeos and speed boosting landorus and such running around rather than swords dance terrakions, teams are hard pressed to break through the incredibly bulky walls.

This is pretty much the only reason stall works, and why it works way more often on the ladder than it does in tournaments. The only reason stall is able to function is because a lot of times, these changes are worse against the hyper offensive meta we have right now. For example, switching your Landorus-T to Taunt/SD Gliscor can allow you to 6-0 certain stall teams under the right conditions. However, you end up paying the price against a lot of offensive threats that are able to muscle past you much more easier due to how good Intimidate is and how much more immediately threatening Landorus-T is as a counter. Switching Latios to Hydreigon can let you blast past that pesky Jirachi, but falls flat when you try to check Keldeo or revenge kill a weakened Terrakion.

Really, there are many cases in many offensive teams where switching to a similar pokemon, or even just changing 1-2 move slots, can be the difference between a pathetic victory and a clean 6-0. I feel like these changes happen much more often at a tournament level, as it is much easier to plan around potential stall teams there than it is on the ladder. Ironically, it can be much harder to say the same for stall teams, as they're much more metagame-dependant, hence why you see a lot of teams on the ladder that are weak to Reuniclus but still do well.

 

[Soul Fly]

If you reread his post, you'd see that he said "rather than" SD Terrakion. He said that the common Scarf Keldeo and RP Landorus are the ones that have trouble with the bulky walls, unlike Pokemon like SD Terrakion, and the fact that there are fewer SD Terrakion running around makes it that much easier for stall teams.

Oh, my bad. The wording at first felt like he was grouping an incredible pokemon-slayer like SD-Terrak with the cheap stuff like Scarf Keldeo and party. Found that really surprising.

Still, that apart, I feel the high amount of offensive pressure and coverage makes it hard for stall. The offensive player could literally alter one moveslot for a single pokemon and 6-0 the said stall team, as displayed by the EB Keldeo-HP bug saga during OST and RP Lando running Sludge Wave to screw 'counters' which switch in, and all the pressure to predict this stuff lies with the guy running stall and not the guy being offensive.

 

[Nyara]

This topic wasn't about the problem as a concept and not about specific issues? Because I think it's more than obvious than after a lot of previous bans people still doesn't completely enjoy the meta (well, most of them), so, it seems that it's a problem of the game itself and/or the personal concept of each person of how a meta should be. This thread is to discusse the lastest two if I rebember OK. Why I'm saying it? Because I'm kinda bored of mindless debates of arguing of excesive specific circunstance with a game that does have 300+ fully evolved Pokémon, so, let's be less specific this time, I think it will work more than just name exact things that will come to nothing.

As about my opinion comes, I said it before, I think the combination of powered up buffs + item buffs + powered moves without consequences + moves making problems to other Pokémon to switch + offensive Pokémon are stronger + deffensive Pokémon are better, it actually happened always, but BW upgraded the buffs even more, now with a simple 2-3+ (or 1+ 1+ 1+) you can almost autowin a game, so, the Meta did come a lot about who can get the buff before. Ah, and about stall, it's literally just dependant of the match ups, it's actually a highly effective style of play considering you can stall the 90%+ of OU with excesive simple cores and people will just use those few OU Pokémon, and, of course, if your opponents gets a buff and you allow him to... you lose.

 

[Aldaron]

This is a retarded thread and approaches the issue from so many skewed biases.

I'm honestly embarrassed the moderators allowed this to remain open and I'm especially annoyed that certain idiots believe team preview, a function that increases information provided thereby increasing the merit potential of decisions, could possibly reduce skill.

You guys are shameful.