Metagame SV OU Metagame Discussion v3

[FuecocoBoi]

since you mentioned brambleghast, i'd like to ask if anyone else is having success with the mon now that it has access to poltergeist. what moves are y'all running on it besides dual stab? i'm running power whip + poltergeist + rapid spin + strength sap, but i'm wondering if i should put in leech seed or spikes somewhere. i've also been toying with the idea of a curse/spikes suicide lead set, since it's the only ghost-type with access to them both, but i wouldn't know what sort of a team to build around that (plus there are a million better spikes users that don't even have to die to make progress, and some that can't die even if you want them to, but let's ignore that for now)

I like tb as a way to snowball, but power whip is there too

 

[DaddyBuzzwole]

I like tb as a way to snowball, but power whip is there too

why trailblaze when you already have rapid spin? seems kind of redundant to have two low-power speed boost moves

also, should i go for infiltrator or stick with wind rider? veil teams are a thing right now, which would normally make infiltrator a gimme, but wind rider lets brambleghast hard-wall zapdos and switch into a predicted ting-lu whirlwind and threaten an ohko with +1 power whip

 

[StupidFlandrs48]

why trailblaze when you already have rapid spin? seems kind of redundant to have two low-power speed boost moves

also, should i go for infiltrator or stick with wind rider? veil teams are a thing right now, which would normally make infiltrator a gimme, but wind rider lets brambleghast hard-wall zapdos and switch into a predicted ting-lu whirlwind and threaten an ohko with +1 power whip

Depends on the rest of your team probably. WR would be preferred but infil would be nice if you don't have defog/aggressive taunt/stalling tactics to deal with screens

 

[FuecocoBoi]

why trailblaze when you already have rapid spin? seems kind of redundant to have two low-power speed boost moves

also, should i go for infiltrator or stick with wind rider? veil teams are a thing right now, which would normally make infiltrator a gimme, but wind rider lets brambleghast hard-wall zapdos and switch into a predicted ting-lu whirlwind and threaten an ohko with +1 power whip

right right le stupid

 

[Soiramio3000]

I have taken to calling this Garchomp Syndrome: a mon can do a bunch of things well, but it faces competition in every role it can fill, so the viability ranking is much higher than the usage ranking.

nice name, but I think that mew is a better example than garchomp.
despite the competition garchomp has still managed to make it to OU.

mew will need some drastic buff in order to make it in OU.
it is useless now that it lost recovery options.

it can theoretically do a ton of different sets but it is either outclassed by something else or it not that good.
(the transform+imprison set is an unviable gimmick and I doubt if anyone has ever used it unironically).

 

[SnakeNet]

since you mentioned brambleghast, i'd like to ask if anyone else is having success with the mon now that it has access to poltergeist. what moves are y'all running on it besides dual stab? i'm running power whip + poltergeist + rapid spin + strength sap, but i'm wondering if i should put in leech seed or spikes somewhere. i've also been toying with the idea of a curse/spikes suicide lead set, since it's the only ghost-type with access to them both, but i wouldn't know what sort of a team to build around that (plus there are a million better spikes users that don't even have to die to make progress, and some that can't die even if you want them to, but let's ignore that for now)

Brambleghast @ Leftovers
Ability: Infiltrator
Tera Type: Grass
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Poltergeist
- Strength Sap
- Power Whip
- Leech Seed
what i've been running, with veil being a thing i pref infiltrator over wind rider
i like seed to get some chip in and know it most likely will faint to what is staying in on, and don't plan to switch it back in or save it
polt works good on the mon, but i've been having some difficulties using the mon on any team. i feel like i have to swap another, most likely better mon to a mon that complements brambleghast otherwise it feels like a dead slot
it is a shame, SS is an amazing move and it sucks that brambleghast doesn't get to use it to its full potential (and poltergeist... i guess /j)

 

[658Greninja]

I don’t know if people know about this but thanks to Poltergeist

252 Atk Brambleghast Poltergeist vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Gholdengo: 344-408 (91 - 107.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO after 1 layer of Spikes

Its a spinner that outspeeds and OHKOs Ghold.

 

[yomaalt]

252 Atk Great Tusk Ice Spinner vs. 244 HP / 0 Def Gliscor: 292-344 (82.9 - 97.7%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
252 Atk Great Tusk Ice Spinner vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gliscor: 220-260 (62.1 - 73.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Poison Heal

Offensive Tusk stays winning, favorable roll to OHKO the standard bulky sets with rocks, and guaranteed 2HKO on a 252/252+ physical wall. Defensive Tusk has poor matchups in general right now, so the offensive set is preferred.

Me omw to protect, tox, then just switch between like, gambit + gliscor and prot stall you:

Offensive tusk works but bro is not him....

 

[DaddyBuzzwole]

Gen 7 is not a bad meta although it could have used a few more bans in Kartana (crazy broken with Z-Giga Impact), Mega Mawile, and Tapu Lele. ABR's conservative tiering approach prevented Gen 7 from reaching its full potential, but it was far from being unplayable or anything like that.

i'd also add magearna to that list, as well as at least a suspect for ash-greninja and an unban of regular blaziken because it's total bullshit that it wasn't at least retested after the bp fuckery was over and done with. i think gen 7 was playable, i just don't think it was good

 

[YubelVT]

Gen 7 is not a bad meta although it could have used a few more bans in Kartana (crazy broken with Z-Giga Impact), Mega Mawile, and Tapu Lele. ABR's conservative tiering approach prevented Gen 7 from reaching its full potential, but it was far from being unplayable or anything like that.

lele wasn't banworthy, mega mawile is restricted to BO, and Kartana is probably worth banning. a lot of the modern banning noise today tho is about manaphy because it makes stall unable to beat rain (which is a GOOD THING)

 

[YubelVT]

nice name, but I think that mew is a better example than garchomp.
despite the competition garchomp has still managed to make it to OU.

mew will need some drastic buff in order to make it in OU.
it is useless now that it lost recovery options.

it can theoretically do a ton of different sets but it is either outclassed by something else or it not that good.
(the transform+imprison set is an unviable gimmick and I doubt if anyone has ever used it unironically).

I think it's funny that mew's entire gimmick for the past 8 generations was learning basically every move and then they neutered its movepool

 

[DaddyBuzzwole]

I think it's funny that mew's entire gimmick for the past 8 generations was learning basically every move and then they neutered its movepool

it's wild that they stripped roost of its tm status. …although, thinking about it, current-gen gliscor with roost would be worth taking a look at

 

[Blaze_101392]

it's wild that they stripped roost of its tm status. …although, thinking about it, current-gen gliscor with roost would be worth taking a look at

This isn't the first time they've done that to Roost. It lost TM status in Gen 5 and was made a tutor move. Given Knock Off, Scald, and Toxic returned it seems probable that the other tutor moves and TMs will come back with DLC 2.

 

[Avira]

This isn't the first time they've done that to Roost. It lost TM status in Gen 5 and was made a tutor move. Given Knock Off, Scald, and Toxic returned it seems probable that the other tutor moves and TMs will come back with DLC 2.

Gamefreak listened to the 1000-1200 ladder players who complained about the mythical Big Stall, so I don't think Roost is coming back as a TM. Something like Gliscor would be broken this gen if it got Roost 'cause of Spikes, so I'm glad it can't learn Roost for once.

 

[DaddyBuzzwole]

Gamefreak listened to the 1000-1200 ladder players who complained about the mythical Big Stall, so I don't think Roost is coming back as a TM. Something like Gliscor would be broken this gen if it got Roost 'cause of Spikes, so I'm glad it can't learn Roost for once.

yeah, everything that needs roost and makes sense to have the move this gen has it, except for:

• gliscor, which is one of the best mons in the meta without it
• the genies/therians, which never had it (largely because prankster roost would be very annoying, and if they only gave it to landorus and enamorus, the other two would complain to hr)
• the crown tundra birds, which also never had it for some incomprehensible reason (clown tundra moment)
• tropius, which just uses harvest instead
• honchkrow, probably because they knew how bullshit good murkrow was going to be in vgc and decided it didn't need the help
• charizard, which you'd really think game freak would have made an exception for but they shockingly didn't
• staraptor, which… wait, what the fuck? staraptor doesn't get roost this gen? since fucking when
• delibird, which is a meme-tier mon anyway
• mew, which, well, fuck mew i guess

 

[Schpoonman]

Hey, it only took GF 15 years to give Empoleon Roost, the Galar birds will get theirs in 2045 or something.

 

[veti]

Hey, it only took GF 15 years to give Empoleon Roost, the Galar birds will get theirs in 2045 or something.

17 years.

 

[Blaze_101392]

yeah, everything that needs roost and makes sense to have the move this gen has it, except for:

• gliscor, which is one of the best mons in the meta without it
• the genies/therians, which never had it (largely because prankster roost would be very annoying, and if they only gave it to landorus and enamorus, the other two would complain to hr)
• the crown tundra birds, which also never had it for some incomprehensible reason (clown tundra moment)
• tropius, which just uses harvest instead
• honchkrow, probably because they knew how bullshit good murkrow was going to be in vgc and decided it didn't need the help
• charizard, which you'd really think game freak would have made an exception for but they shockingly didn't
• staraptor, which… wait, what the fuck? staraptor doesn't get roost this gen? since fucking when
• delibird, which is a meme-tier mon anyway
• mew, which, well, fuck mew i guess

Scizor also misses access to it. If Togekiss is brought into Gen 9 it would also not have access to it unless it's added to it's learn set.

 

[DaddyBuzzwole]

Hey, it only took GF 15 years to give Empoleon Roost, the Galar birds will get theirs in 2045 or something.

the year is 2034 and gen 13 is about to release. most of the eastern hemisphere is a smoldering, irradiated crater and japan is completely underwater, but game freak somehow keeps cranking out new pokemon games every 3 years like clockwork. most of the cell towers and internet cables were knocked out during the war and what little remained was cannibalized by some roving group of bandits or other, but you can still get a weak internet connection through starlink, although all the datacenters are located in elon musk's palace on mars, so the speed-of-light delay makes the connection irritatingly slow. the whirring of the computer fans startles you, and you silently pray that the noise won't attract any of the harvester drones patrolling the area—not that prayer will do you any good, since the second coming happened last year and humanity is officially on its own now. pushing the thought from your mind, you log on to the smogon forums, one of the few sites standing from the days before hostile ai seized control over most of the web, only able to avoid infiltration because the ai's "accounts" are trained on data from regular people and stick out like a sore thumb on a competitive pokemon forum. you click on the spoiler thread for leaks about the new movesets in the upcoming game. the box legendaries have base 250 in both attacking stats and base 180 speed. "disappointing, but they might find a niche in nu," you think to yourself. then you scroll down a little further, to the "returning pokemon" section. something catches your eye. a decade-and-a-half-long mistake, finally resolved. you feel a popping in the back of your head as the rush of emotion overloads your neuralink chip. as your consciousness fades into oblivion, a single tear rolls down your cheek—not of sorrow, but of joy, joy born of satisfaction and fulfillment. in your final moments, you bask in the feeling that everything is now complete, for galarian articuno now gets roost

 

[MisogiKurakawa]

the year is 2034 and gen 13 is about to release. most of the eastern hemisphere is a smoldering, irradiated crater and japan is completely underwater, but game freak somehow keeps cranking out new pokemon games every 3 years like clockwork. most of the cell towers and internet cables were knocked out during the war and what little remained was cannibalized by some roving group of bandits or other, but you can still get a weak internet connection through starlink, although all the datacenters are located in elon musk's palace on mars, so the speed-of-light delay makes the connection irritatingly slow. the whirring of the computer fans startles you, and you silently pray that the noise won't attract any of the harvester drones patrolling the area—not that prayer will do you any good, since the second coming happened last year and humanity is officially on its own now. pushing the thought from your mind, you log on to the smogon forums, one of the few sites standing from the days before hostile ai seized control over most of the web, only able to avoid infiltration because the ai's "accounts" are trained on data from regular people and stick out like a sore thumb on a competitive pokemon forum. you click on the spoiler thread for leaks about the new movesets in the upcoming game. the box legendaries have base 250 in both attacking stats and base 180 speed. "disappointing, but they might find a niche in nu," you think to yourself. then you scroll down a little further, to the "returning pokemon" section. something catches your eye. a decade-and-a-half-long mistake, finally resolved. you feel a popping in the back of your head as the rush of emotion overloads your neuralink chip. as your consciousness fades into oblivion, a single tear rolls down your cheek—not of sorrow, but of joy, joy born of satisfaction and fulfillment. in your final moments, you bask in the feeling that everything is now complete, for galarian articuno now gets roost

I object to this because Elon Musk would never be able to get to Mars.

 

[That_Dwayneee]

yeah, everything that needs roost and makes sense to have the move this gen has it, except for:

• gliscor, which is one of the best mons in the meta without it
• the genies/therians, which never had it (largely because prankster roost would be very annoying, and if they only gave it to landorus and enamorus, the other two would complain to hr)
• the crown tundra birds, which also never had it for some incomprehensible reason (clown tundra moment)
• tropius, which just uses harvest instead
• honchkrow, probably because they knew how bullshit good murkrow was going to be in vgc and decided it didn't need the help
• charizard, which you'd really think game freak would have made an exception for but they shockingly didn't
• staraptor, which… wait, what the fuck? staraptor doesn't get roost this gen? since fucking when
• delibird, which is a meme-tier mon anyway
• mew, which, well, fuck mew i guess

You forgot hydreigon

 

[Pookacat2008]

The King Is Dead Long Live The King When Did This Happen

 

[Pookacat2008]

All hail the new god of Ubers

 

[Pookacat2008]

RIP little buddy we salute you

 

[YubelVT]

the year is 2034 and gen 13 is about to release. most of the eastern hemisphere is a smoldering, irradiated crater and japan is completely underwater, but game freak somehow keeps cranking out new pokemon games every 3 years like clockwork. most of the cell towers and internet cables were knocked out during the war and what little remained was cannibalized by some roving group of bandits or other, but you can still get a weak internet connection through starlink, although all the datacenters are located in elon musk's palace on mars, so the speed-of-light delay makes the connection irritatingly slow. the whirring of the computer fans startles you, and you silently pray that the noise won't attract any of the harvester drones patrolling the area—not that prayer will do you any good, since the second coming happened last year and humanity is officially on its own now. pushing the thought from your mind, you log on to the smogon forums, one of the few sites standing from the days before hostile ai seized control over most of the web, only able to avoid infiltration because the ai's "accounts" are trained on data from regular people and stick out like a sore thumb on a competitive pokemon forum. you click on the spoiler thread for leaks about the new movesets in the upcoming game. the box legendaries have base 250 in both attacking stats and base 180 speed. "disappointing, but they might find a niche in nu," you think to yourself. then you scroll down a little further, to the "returning pokemon" section. something catches your eye. a decade-and-a-half-long mistake, finally resolved. you feel a popping in the back of your head as the rush of emotion overloads your neuralink chip. as your consciousness fades into oblivion, a single tear rolls down your cheek—not of sorrow, but of joy, joy born of satisfaction and fulfillment. in your final moments, you bask in the feeling that everything is now complete, for galarian articuno now gets roost

"Genesect has once again been quick banned from OU "