I think this has the problem backwards. The issue with hazards in SV OU is that removing them is way, way harder than getting them up. Aside from The Greatest Tusks Of Them All and sometimes Corviknight, hazard removal almost feels like you need to run a team slot solely for that purpose, rather than having options for hazard removal that also do other things and fill more roles in the team. Samurott just exaggerates that by making the only way to block its hazards rolling above a 90 on an RNG check.
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Metagame SV OU Metagame Discussion v2 [Update on Post #5186]
- Thread starter TPP
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A fast volt switch/u turn into a helmet mon stops the spike but it has to be strong enough to put Samurott in range of helmet and isn't consistent if Samurrot is scarf.
common stall L
Speaking of hazard removal, has anyone tried Quaquaval in this meta?
In addition to spin, it’s got a good movepool consisting of U-turn, Roost, Taunt, Swords Dance, Bulk Up, and solid stabs.
Also resists both of Gambit and Sam-H’s stabs.
I haven’t tried it recently, but I feel like it could be a reasonable defensive pivots that removes hazards and checks stuff like gambit. Leftovers, HDB, rocky helmet seem viable and you could probably tailor it to be Ghold.
I found defensive quaquaval good when using this team during the pao suspect pre-home
In addition to spin, it’s got a good movepool consisting of U-turn, Roost, Taunt, Swords Dance, Bulk Up, and solid stabs.
Also resists both of Gambit and Sam-H’s stabs.
I haven’t tried it recently, but I feel like it could be a reasonable defensive pivots that removes hazards and checks stuff like gambit. Leftovers, HDB, rocky helmet seem viable and you could probably tailor it to be Ghold.
I found defensive quaquaval good when using this team during the pao suspect pre-home
Hisui-Goodra should have gotten Rapid Spin, just saying...
Edit:
Goodra-Hisui @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Sap Sipper
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
- Rapid Spin
- Earthquake
- Heavy Slam
- Draco Meteor
I'm c*mming.
Edit:
Goodra-Hisui @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Sap Sipper
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
- Rapid Spin
- Earthquake
- Heavy Slam
- Draco Meteor
I'm c*mming.
Cheryl.
Celesteela is Life
I feel like if this thread tried playing a meta like Black and White NU they would immediately combust from a real hazards-dominated meta 
I've been lowkey meaning to try a Spinner Quaquaval set out, the typing is extremely nice for Gambit and Samurott like you said and it has reliable recovery unlike the vast majority of hazard removal (outside of the other underrated goat Defog Decidueye-Hisui, use that mon!). Really the big problem is figuring out what the last two slots would be. Probably just dual STABs or Fighting STAB + U-turn?
its bad, loses to most common walls, requires 100000 turns of set up, cannot touch gholdengo, outclassed as a fighting type by all the fighting types in OU, outclassed as a water type by most stuff, there are better things that check gambit, there is absolute no reason to use this dogshit mon
Not gonna elaborate too much on the hazard discussion (I do think spikes should go but that's for another day), but I've seen this argument a couple of times and I feel like it misses the point.I feel like if this thread tried playing a meta like Black and White NU they would immediately combust from a real hazards-dominated meta
Yes, this isn't the worst ever removal we've had in a metagame or anything, between Tusk, Hatt and Ace, and we definetly have ways to deal with them even if they stay up with Boots. This doesn't mean that it should stop Spikes from being looked into or that it can't be broken in this metagame. The removal decrease would be fine if not for the huge uptick of Spikes setters, especially viable ones. Great mons like Ting-Lu, Clod, Chomp, Glimm and Meow get the move while HRott gets a insanely busted version of it. Also, it's weird to not consider the huge increase of power we've had since the last metagame where removal was this dire, between Tera and power creep in general, and how a huge part of enabling those threats is Spikes.
since when?
Gen 9, it says that there.
Weird though… cant you just transfer a Hoopa from Gen 6 with both moves to Gen 9?
Home resets the moveset of the mons that get transfered and makes them only have the moves they would have in SV.
personally I find Tusk to be inadequate hazard removal, and I think that is what honestly makes discussions around hazards annoying rn.
no, tusks is not adequate hazard removal against most hazard stack teams, aka HO. I'm seeing teams with 1-2 Ghost types (usually Gholdengo and Dragapult) because they can both accomplish big jobs on the same team, and even if you predict Defensive Tusks doesn't even OHKO most variants of both Pokemon, (and is the type of Tusk you'd want on most teams that rely on hazard removal)
0 Atk Great Tusk Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Gholdengo: 184-218 (58.4 - 69.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
let alone bulky, which I have seen
0 Atk Great Tusk Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Dragapult: 224-264 (58.9 - 69.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
0 Atk Great Tusk Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Dragapult: 224-264 (70.6 - 83.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Gholdengo is especially a problem for this because it can often run Recover on Trick Scarf sets, and while it cannot immediately do so, if it finds an opportunity you have to restart the cycle of getting an opportunity to click Knock Off or Rapid Spin, getting the turns right, etc. etc.
Personally what makes this so much worse as well is the rise of Tera Ghost Ting-Lu, which is almost impossible for Tusks to get Spin off on, is bulky as shit in general, super viable, and can run Spikes itself.
Ok, you got the kill on the Ghost-Type. Now the HO team has momentum and sends out one of its crazy good Spatkers and you have to switch out. Keep dealing with the hazards, but next time you get Tusk in, you can spin. Got it. Awesome.
(I'm scarcely even going to talk about how the free opportunities for Tusk to freely get in are decreasing btw, as Kingambit is more and more seldom used until endgame, a lot of the current phys attackers don't mind it that much, and the setup Dragon Dancer sweepers don't really care alongside a bajillion new Spatkers dropping into the tier)
So now you are getting into the middle/endgame, and you finally got hazards off the field, hopefully, if that free momentum they obtained did not destroy your core.
either way they just kept hazards on the field for most of the game, and are also free to set them up once more. woo!
"okay so just run 4+ HDB lol!" and now the problem is actually thrown back in your face. tusks. Because this piece of shit is going to run Knock Off, meaning that even if you play against an opposing BO/Balance, now you must mutually suffer anyways, Splendid.
So, let's get the facts straight, There is no actually good hazard removal in the tier. Tusks as a removal is very flawed and exploitable. Hatterene gets worn down with no real recovery, and has a type that on a slow Pokemon is rife with weaknesses. Every HO worth its salt has an anti Corviknight plan, and Tusks if anything makes dealing with hazards harder.
It's no wonder that, frankly, teambuilding for anything but HO is a pain in the fucking ass. Everything in the tier is screaming at you to play with hazards up that mostly hurt you, and not the HO that rocks should, in practice, help to combat.
Run hazard stack HO and profit or run anything else and accept having to deal with them, which I'll also just say: is not fun.
i have zero solution btw, dont ban hazards thats dumb, im just sick of people acting like even Tusks is enough hazard removal for most teams lol
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ou-1888827776-dcba5aklpp1qu5r3gz5rl3tt37i23dfpw
This was one of the most heartbreaking losses I ever experienced. I'm genuinely curious on how I could played this better and won.( besides knocking it off :< ) Like I'm so perplexed, how did I loose!!?? If would greatly appreciate a reply to this comment on any outs I had vs CM Cress.
This isn't just me being salty, I wanna be prepared next time I face it as It seems to be a great set with increasing popularity.
This was one of the most heartbreaking losses I ever experienced. I'm genuinely curious on how I could played this better and won.( besides knocking it off :< ) Like I'm so perplexed, how did I loose!!?? If would greatly appreciate a reply to this comment on any outs I had vs CM Cress.
This isn't just me being salty, I wanna be prepared next time I face it as It seems to be a great set with increasing popularity.
Turn 13 you needed to Whirlwind immediately and not let it set up or get Ting-Lu chipped. You also didnt really need to Tera there, keeping Ting-Lu its original typing stops it from Store Power spamming. That turn changes the entire game granted the team itself doesnt look like it has much for Cress anyways, because you're running an Enam set that gives it a free turn entirely. That Cress set requires Kingambit to be off the field to not autolose anyways so you can slot Gambit somewhere. I think Ace doesnt serve much on your team so slotting a breaker there will help to beat fat set up mons.
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https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ou-1888891039-3bi33sjc5jo5wtj3jggw9npwwd2jwn5pw
kingambit is a super broken Pokémon…
casually playing another game, match in my favour except have my eye on a runaway cress or gambit.. all good, I’m leading. Lucky burn on the cress matters a lot for the reliable 3HKO with ace
gambit: exists
..literally a list of checks to deal with it, but because of the stupid 50/50s it kept getting right, combined with just 1 crit, it just completely dunked the game on its head.
it didn’t even need to get every 50/50 right lol. The only one that mattered was that Hydreigon would EP rather than uturn/dark pulse
usually this doesn’t matter for almost every Pokémon. But gambit gets stronger as the game goes on, and with each 50/50 it gets right…
“why didn’t cinderace come out with the wisp earlier” - this is because it’s the only thing on the team that can deal with the cresselia, so I couldn’t risk sacking it. It’s a team super weak to the popular cress set.
edit: I’m an idiot, the cress couldn’t Tera anymore so hydreigon would have dealt with it. Point still stands kingambit is ridiculous.
kingambit is a super broken Pokémon…
casually playing another game, match in my favour except have my eye on a runaway cress or gambit.. all good, I’m leading. Lucky burn on the cress matters a lot for the reliable 3HKO with ace
gambit: exists
..literally a list of checks to deal with it, but because of the stupid 50/50s it kept getting right, combined with just 1 crit, it just completely dunked the game on its head.
it didn’t even need to get every 50/50 right lol. The only one that mattered was that Hydreigon would EP rather than uturn/dark pulse
usually this doesn’t matter for almost every Pokémon. But gambit gets stronger as the game goes on, and with each 50/50 it gets right…
“why didn’t cinderace come out with the wisp earlier” - this is because it’s the only thing on the team that can deal with the cresselia, so I couldn’t risk sacking it. It’s a team super weak to the popular cress set.
edit: I’m an idiot, the cress couldn’t Tera anymore so hydreigon would have dealt with it. Point still stands kingambit is ridiculous.
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+2 252+ Atk Supreme Overlord 3 allies fainted Kingambit Kowtow Cleave vs. +6 252 HP / 252 Def Tera Ghost Zamazenta: 150-176 (38.6 - 45.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
The crit didn't matter bro, Gambit is just that strong. Tera ghost in Zama is a weird choice since it loses to Gambit and Pult which is its main check.
that specific team has ghost to counter the mirror matchup zamazenta
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LOL
Now try prevent Samurott from making progress. Just don't let him on the field bro.
Yeah, not much to do against tera electric Zama otherwise or if you used your tera in something else with that team. Not sure about Hydreigon on that team, that guy was one of the biggest losers with Home so I would run the bulky Gholdengo instead, with two ground inmunities in the team is not that crazy while punishes Zama's rest sets.
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