Well what exactly does take a mence outrage easily? Swampert is merely a Mence check, hopefully SR is up early then you force it to Outrage and usually live to Ice Beam it or if you die you make it easy pickings for your revenge killer. That's pretty much the only way to handle mence anyway.Add a life orb and you have a good chance of OHKO (86.03% - 101.25%) with SR on the field. I believe he just wanted to say that Swampert isn't a good switch into Salamece.
Not necessarily a good chance to OHKO after SR I think- assuming Swampert is the one that switches to Mence during the DD turn, Lefties will heal the SR damage by the end of the turn, and Mence's chance of OHKOing becomes much less.Add a life orb and you have a good chance of OHKO (86.03% - 101.25%) with SR on the field
Yeah, obviously only few steels can survive a DD life orb'd Outrage, my point was that you can't define "counter" a pokemon which risks an ohko when switching into the threat it's supposed to counter.Well what exactly does take a mence outrage easily? Swampert is merely a Mence check, hopefully SR is up early then you force it to Outrage and usually live to Ice Beam it or if you die you make it easy pickings for your revenge killer. That's pretty much the only way to handle mence anyway.
I don't think anyone mentioned Swampert as a "counter" to Salamence, just a check. But other than that, your point is correct.Yeah, obviously only few steels can survive a DD life orb'd Outrage, my point was that you can't define "counter" a pokemon which risks an ohko when switching into the threat it's supposed to counter.
That isn't countering for 1 It did its job by taking out a Poke(?)mon and 2 it was just a tribute to Salamence not a "counter" so why don't you just send in some Lucario that failed to sweep?frotress is the mon for aking an outrage on demand and it can blow in mences face afterwards, skmory come close to wirlwind away that d d boost but won't be hurting mence anytime soon. Best bet would be to revenge kill mence with something like weavile or mamoswine, out rage is powerful but it dose prevent mence from switching out.
It isn't even a "check" because 3/4 Sets (Fatmence, Specsmence, DDMence, and 4/252 Naive mixmence) can OHKO or 2HKO before it can attack.I don't think anyone mentioned Swampert as a "counter" to Salamence, just a check. But other than that, your point is correct.
Every steel in OU, barring Lucario, can take one. Yes i'm including 12/12 Empoleon.Yeah, obviously only few steels can survive a DD life orb'd Outrage
It does 100.00% - 118.18%Empoleon can take a 1+ EQ
Aren't you the guy that bashed on Swampert? Fatmence can be dealt with the common Roar that Swampert holds. If it doesn't hold Roar, you should have at least another thing to deal with FatMence. SpecsMence isnt that common these days which makes it a surprise for alot of Phy. Walls. Mixmence is harder to switch in as it is a wallbreaker set after all. MixMence 2ohkos Swampert with Draco Meteor at about the same damage as DD LO Outrage. If you can get Swampert in with about 82% HP, your pretty safe to survive a Draco Meteor and OHKO it with Ice Beam. I would call that a check at some point wouldn't you? Also the talk was about DD Mence, not other sets. Sbc said this perfectly that Swampert is a check:It isn't even a "check" because 3/4 Sets (Fatmence, Specsmence, DDMence, and 4/252 Naive mixmence) can OHKO or 2HKO before it can attack.
Well what exactly does take a mence outrage easily? Swampert is merely a Mence check, hopefully SR is up early then you force it to Outrage and usually live to Ice Beam it or if you die you make it easy pickings for your revenge killer. That's pretty much the only way to handle mence anyway.
What do you mean by 'sr weak'? I know that you're going for a metaphor, but I don't get it.also stop running max hp on scizor aaa 1/4 of scizors are 'sr weak'
Yeah, I meant that so much of the metagame centralizes around Kyogre as the OU one does around Scizor (I mean, how many Azelfs, Gengars, and Weaviles do you see any more? Scizor turned things bulky), but it is way even worse in Ubers if stuff like Quagsire is getting a fair hearing.As for the "cb scizor of ubers": much worse then that actually, as over 50% of teams run kyogre!
I can only speak for Wifi, really, but your examples are strange to me. Azelf is a common suicide lead with its fast Taunt, Stealth Rock, and Explosion. Gengar, though outclassed by Rotom-A, still has his uses on Wifi, as does Dusknoir due to the lack of said Rotom. Weavile. . .well, you've beaten me there. I don't see a whole lot of those. Scizor, though very much OU, does not quite reach Kyogre levels (over 50% of teams?!).Yeah, I meant that so much of the metagame centralizes around Kyogre as the OU one does around Scizor (I mean, how many Azelfs, Gengars, and Weaviles do you see any more? Scizor turned things bulky), but it is way even worse in Ubers if stuff like Quagsire is getting a fair hearing.
Rotom-a has its own uses and is very good overall. However, you can't say gengar has disappeared (or has been outclassed by rotom) while it is still sitting at spot #12, although as I understand this was a dramatic decrease.Rotom-A was used 56,118 times, which puts him 15th, behind Gengar.
Rats, my earlier post shows you what I know for being a Wifi "purist". . .Gengar is not at all outclassed by rotom-a.
Gengar still has a monstrous special attack stat and possesses blistering speed (both stats equivalent to that of latios).
Rotom-a has its own uses and is very good overall. However, you can't say gengar has disappeared (or has been outclassed by rotom) while it is still sitting at spot #12, although as I understand this was a dramatic decrease.
Rotom primarilly outclassed all of the bulky ghosts; if you want an offensive sweeper most people still (as the stats prove) turn to gengar and it's 24 greater base speed and 25 greater base special attack.
| 22 | Breloom | 36018 | 8.33 | <- February
| 18 | Breloom | 44903 | 9.18 | <- March
| 36 | Heracross | 23659 | 5.47 | <- February
| 41 | Heracross | 24449 | 5.00 | <- March
Tangrowth is where it's really at.Thorns said:The advance trio are ruling Ubers again. What a shame. 71 usages of Exeggutor? That's lower than Luxray! Let's boost that a bit. And guys, don't run Solarbeam, Grass Knot is better.
That's actually what I meant to say: that Weavile and Tyranitar couldn't have imagined switching into Gengar and trapping it with impunity like Scizor could.A lot of the Subs are specifically for Scizor, not Tyranitar or Weavile (Tyranitar is slow, Weavile is rare). If you predict wrong you either die to Pursuit or Bullet Punch, and sub eases that and makes Gengar a lot more useful. HP-Fire is also for dealing with Scizor quickly, though usually if it's choiced you can hit it with Thunderbolt/Focus Blast while it Pursuits or BPs, then you either finish it or switch from there based on what it does.