icy wind lowers both opponent's speed as well.
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Pokémon HeartGold & SoulSilver - The Offical Competitive Discussion Thread
- Thread starter RBG
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I don't think Icy Wind guarentees the drop though.
yes it does. It has a 5% chance of missing though
Hyper Voice Rayquaza is pro.
Eh, Normal is terrible coverage. Not much.
I wouldn't really want to drop Overheat or Earthquake, and I think Extremespeed still works better.
Rayquaza doesn't even want Air Slash, as Draco Meteor has superior coverage alongside Fire Blast anyways. Really, the weather trio didn't receive a single boost.
Actually, HS Aggron only does 1.30 times the damage that Stone Edge Tyranitar would. When you factor in the higher critical hit rate it becomes 1.23 times that damage.
Also, Aggron shouldn't be used in OU without Sandstorm support, so you really should just go with Tyranitar and use something else in the open slot.
I don't see it becoming OU, but it will be top 10 or top 5 UU
I got a HS aggron, would you like me to test anything?
I got it eved as a RP sweeper and a CBer so far.
I got it eved as a RP sweeper and a CBer so far.
SR resist, electric immunity, U-turn and STAB earthquake beg to differ on that one.
Didn't Flygon become OU after Garchomp was banned to Uber?
Flygon was OU before, but it started getting used more when chomp was banned.
Thank you. I was about to get into detail about it, but you summed it up.
I see where you're coming from with the greater number of resistances, although you glaringly forgot Rhyperior's Electric immunity. But IMO resistances by themselves aren't the important thing, but how well you can apply those resistances to the metagame. On tha note, I had a sudden interest in examining their usefulness in this regard head to head. Here is the top 30 according to last month's statistics (tl;dr warning):
Scizor - I’d say Aggron, due to the fact that Scizor is often hit-and-run with CB U-turn, and Aggron’s resistance helps in that regard. Takes less from Bullet Punch too. But also dies 1 on 1 to Superpower and is more vulnerable to trapping after U-turn, but those are more situational so I’ll give it the benefit of the doubt here.
Salamence - I’d say Rhyperior edges this, just because it is capable of switching in on the Dragon Dance variant and beating it. Almost all Salamence carry Earthquake, so that rules out Aggron as a good match-up right there. Aggron does revenge-kill it better when stuck on Outrage, but there are better Pokemon for that (^^^) that are already on just about any OU team anyway.
Heatran - Rhyperior easily.
Gyarados - Neither like facing it, but Aggron wins for the fact that it takes Waterfall better, which will always be used where Earthquake may not (such as on ResTalk or Taunt sets). Always dies to Earthquake variants, but Rhyperior never fares any better.
Rotom-A - Rhyperior wins here. Being immune to Thunderbolt is much more important than resisting the weaker Shadow Ball. Also takes Overheat better, which is much more common than Leaf Storm versions. Neither like WoW, so that’s a moot point.
Latias - I’ll give this to Aggron, as it can take Dragon Pulses and Draco Meteors a little better than Rhyperior, and therefore edges it. Both hate Surf.
Tyranitar - Rhyperior. Although Aggron resists both STABs, it is obliterated by boosted Earthquakes whereas Rhyperior can take the odd hit, and both hate Aqua Tail. Rhyperior also fares better against Dragon Dance variants and the occasional Boah.
Metagross - despite the Steel weakness, I say Rhyperior wins here. Rhyperior has even bulk to take any hit and KO back with Earthquake, whereas Aggron is KO’d by Earthquake (Meta’s most common move) and can’t come close to KOing back.
Lucario - Rhyperior again, because it can take an unboosted Close Combat whilst Aggron obviously can’t. The Rock Polish variant is also far less prne to revenge-kills from Vacuum Wave.
Infernape - Both are easily KO’d by most Infernape, but as with Lucario, Rhyperior edges it for being less prone to revenge-kills as a Rock Polisher.
Jirachi - Aggron wins here, despite lacking a STAB move to hit it effectively. Takes less from Iron Head, so less prone to being flinched to death, and takes Psychics and Grass Knots better from special variants.
Gengar - Rhyperior wins here despite not resisting Ghost. Focus Blast will annihilate Aggron, but Rhyperior can comfortably take a hit or two with suitable investment. Energy Ball is much rarer, and doesn’t OHKO anyway.
Swampert - neither like taking it on, but Rhyperior fares better because of STAB Earthquake that does much more damage, and can 2HKO with Choice Band.
Blissey - depends on the set and which status is most crippling. Aggron is immune to Toxic, whilst Rhyperior is immune to Thunder Wave. So I suppose that Rhyperior is better for Rock Polish, whilst Aggron is better for slow hard-hitting sets. Rhyperior can make 101 HP Subs as well, but that’s a negligible difference. Not calling this one.
Azelf - Aggron wins this comfortably with Psychic resistance and neutrality to Grass Knot.
Starmie - both win and lose equally for just about all sets and situations. Only differences are that Aggron can outrun with a neutral nature after Rock Polish, whilst Rhyperior has the more reliable KOing move. Another stalemate.
Gliscor - Rhyperior easily. Aggron can’t take a STAB Earthquake, whilst Rhyperior can.
Vaporeon - both lose in equal measure for the most part, but Aggron edges it as Head Smash can OHKO with SR and Sandstorm damage.
Magnezone - Rhyperior, no need to explain why. Flash Cannon is not a factor here.
Zapdos - Yawn, Rhyperior.
Machamp - Rhyperior. Not OHKO’d by Dynamicpunch, and has STAB Earthquake.
Kingdra - Aggron can OHKO most variants with LO Head Smash, so wins this.
Breloom - Rhyperior. Both fare badly, but Rhyperior can hit it much harder, and has an easier time against those that lack Seed Bomb. Also less prone to revenge-kills for what it’s worth.
Skarmory - CB Aggron has an easier time outrunning and 2HKOing with superior speed, as some run enough to outpace Adamant Rhyperior but not base 50s. For non-choiced slow builds, Rhyperior can hit harder on Roosting turns with Earthquake, but I still think Aggron fares better here.
Bronzong - Aggron can 3HKO with Head Smash, but Rhyperior can 2HKO with Fire Punch, or even with Megahorn against less physically bulky spreads. Also much less prone to Earthquake, so Rhyperior wins here.
Celebi - easy win for Aggron.
Flygon - Rhyperior. See Salamence.
Suicune - Aggron’s Head Smash hits harder, so it edges this one.
Jolteon - Rhyperior of course.
Empoleon - Rhyperior wins for being able to OHKO any variant with Earthquake, although Aggron is slightly less prone to a revenge-kill from Aqua Jet. Only slightly though, as both can take it quite comfortably for the most part.
Rhyperior wins 18-10, with 2 ties, but this is just my opinion. I would do the next 20 in more detail too if I had the time, but on quick inspection I get the following results (not counting Rotom-c of course) in order:
Rhyperior, Rhyperior, Rhyperior, Rhyperior, Rhyperior, Rhyperior, Rhyperior, Rhyperior, stalemate, Aggron, stalemate, Rhyperior, Rhyperior, Aggron, Rhyperior, Rhyperior, Rhyperior, Rhyperior, Rhyperior, Aggron.
So Rhyperior wins 15-3 here, with two ties, though they obviously carry less weight than the top 30 when comparing their usefulness. I’m sure some of these will be controversial too, especially Weavile and Porygon-Z, but there you go.
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