Metagame NP: ZU Stage 1: Begin Again - Squawkabilly quickban #99

[Tuthur]

​

The ZU Council held a vote and Beartic and Vigoroth have been banned from SV ZU as a result.

Votes

	Corthius	Danny	Drud	OranBerryBlissey10	Tuthur
Beartic	ban	ban	ban	ban	ban
Scovilain	dnb	dnb	ban	dnb	dnb
Vigoroth	ban	ban	ban	ban	ban

At least 4 votes out of 5 were required to ban a Pokémon (at least 66.7%).

This one shouldnt surprise most people who follow this thread. Many community members have been very vocal about Beartic's negative impact on the metagame. Beartic is by far the most powerful offensive threat in the tier. With 130 Atk, access to Swords Dance, and insane coverage, Beartic can muscle through everything in the tier, without even needing terastalization. Close Combat and Earthquake easily round up perfectly Icicle Crash, targetting Ice resists like Mareanie, Flareon, Glalie, and Tera Steel users, as well as some of the bulkiest physical walls like Dunsparce and Sudowoodo. This already sets Beartic apart from most other wallbreakers like Gumshoos and Luxray, however what truelly pushes Beartic over the edge is its ability to take advantage of Snow. Under Snow, Beartic's main weakness in Speed is mitigated, turning it from one of the slowest Pokemon in the tier to a wallbreaker able to outspeed the most common Choice Scarf users like Scovillain and Gastly. Snow also boosts its Defense, which makes Beartic even bulkier and let it easily setup a Swords Dance against most physical attackers that can't hit it for super effective damage. Snow isnt even hard to setup as Snover proved to be bulky enough to set it up multiple times throughout a game. The counterplay to Beartic is too lacking, with the best defensive answers in tera Ghost Dunsparce and Hippopotas, still struggling to beat it and the most reliable offensive answer being using their own Beartic and winning the duel.

Vigoroth's Bulk Up sets were considered unhealthy. With its excellent 90 Speed tiers letting it outspeed the strongest wallbreakers like Luxray and Scovillain, coupled with its gargantuan Eviolite-boosted bulk, Vigoroth is very hard to take out. Vigoroth is incredibly versatile and can easily pick its checks and counters, with Substitute it can circumvent Trick, Knock Off, and Clear Smog, with Taunt it beats defensive setup sweepers and (p)hazing, it can justify forgoing these moves for coverage as well with Shadow Claw to hit Ghost-types and Earthquake/ Drain Punch for Steel- and Rock-types, Body Slam is also a great STAB move able to paralyse faster attackers like Jumpluff and Lumineon that would try to Encore it into Bulk Up. Vigoroth can viably run multiple Tera types; Ghost, Steel, Poison, ans Fairy being the most common ones. All these options make it a nightmare to play against Vigoroth, as it is almost impossible to account for all its variants and guessing its set wrong can often cost you the game. While each of its sets has common checks, it is unreasonnable to have one for all its sets.

Tagging Kris and Marty to ban Beartic and Vigoroth from SV ZU.

 

[iLiekMudkipz_]

​

The ZU Council held a vote and Beartic and Vigoroth have been banned from SV ZU as a result.

Votes

	Corthius	Danny	Drud	OranBerryBlissey10	Tuthur
Beartic	ban	ban	ban	ban	ban
Scovilain	dnb	dnb	ban	dnb	dnb
Vigoroth	ban	ban	ban	ban	ban

At least 4 votes out of 5 were required to ban a Pokémon (at least 66.7%).

This one shouldnt surprise most people who follow this thread. Many community members have been very vocal about Beartic's negative impact on the metagame. Beartic is by far the most powerful offensive threat in the tier. With 130 Atk, access to Swords Dance, and insane coverage, Beartic can muscle through everything in the tier, without even needing terastalization. Close Combat and Earthquake easily round up perfectly Icicle Crash, targetting Ice resists like Mareanie, Flareon, Glalie, and Tera Steel users, as well as some of the bulkiest physical walls like Dunsparce and Sudowoodo. This already sets Beartic apart from most other wallbreakers like Gumshoos and Luxray, however what truelly pushes Beartic over the edge is its ability to take advantage of Snow. Under Snow, Beartic's main weakness in Speed is mitigated, turning it from one of the slowest Pokemon in the tier to a wallbreaker able to outspeed the most common Choice Scarf users like Scovillain and Gastly. Snow also boosts its Defense, which makes Beartic even bulkier and let it easily setup a Swords Dance against most physical attackers that can't hit it for super effective damage. Snow isnt even hard to setup as Snover proved to be bulky enough to set it up multiple times throughout a game. The counterplay to Beartic is too lacking, with the best defensive answers in tera Ghost Dunsparce and Hippopotas, still struggling to beat it and the most reliable offensive answer being using their own Beartic and winning the duel.

Vigoroth's Bulk Up sets were considered unhealthy. With its excellent 90 Speed tiers letting it outspeed the strongest wallbreakers like Luxray and Scovillain, coupled with its gargantuan Eviolite-boosted bulk, Vigoroth is very hard to take out. Vigoroth is incredibly versatile and can easily pick its checks and counters, with Substitute it can circumvent Trick, Knock Off, and Clear Smog, with Taunt it beats defensive setup sweepers and (p)hazing, it can justify forgoing these moves for coverage as well with Shadow Claw to hit Ghost-types and Earthquake/ Drain Punch for Steel- and Rock-types, Body Slam is also a great STAB move able to paralyse faster attackers like Jumpluff and Lumineon that would try to Encore it into Bulk Up. Vigoroth can viably run multiple Tera types; Ghost, Steel, Poison, ans Fairy being the most common ones. All these options make it a nightmare to play against Vigoroth, as it is almost impossible to account for all its variants and guessing its set wrong can often cost you the game. While each of its sets has common checks, it is unreasonnable to have one for all its sets.

Tagging Kris and Marty to ban Beartic and Vigoroth from SV ZU.

Never got the Vigoroth thing. Really. Beartic however really should be unanimous, I havent seen anyone who supported this thing staying. Also unironically, try Houndour. It's literally just ZU's Chi-Yu but it has coverage. Not saying its broken, just saying it so this isnt a one-liner.

Chi-Yu Jr (Houndour) @ Life Orb
Ability: Flash Fire
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Shadow Ball
- Flamethrower
- Sludge Bomb
- Dark Pulse

 

[JMan1008]

Seeing Vigoroth leave the tier is amazing (and also hilarious that Vigoroth is banned while Slaking is a super niche choice band user) and Beartic being banned is great too. Bulk-up Vigoroth was something I thought was too bad in NFE when I still played that tier earlier in the generation, and maybe Misdreavus being a terror there (before it was recently banned thank god) had to do with that, but playing this tier has completely changed my mind on that. Vigoroth is way too tanky, fast and strong for the tier and I am so glad I don't have to worry about getting wrecked by it anymore (I am bad at the game tho). I don't feel as strongly for the Beartic ban though, but it was also a very justified ban.

Looking back through the messages here tho, I know plenty of people consider Scovillain another broken threat, and while I haven't had much trouble with it myself, I do think the loss of Beartic could cause more sun teams to pop up and Scovillain is the undisputed king of sun right now. I dunno about considering it for a suspect or quickban, but it's something to keep our eyes on. As for other thoughts on the metagame, I really like the state of the tier right now, but I would like to make an impassioned plea about Dunsparce. I love the little dingus, but it's just slow Vigoroth that slows down games intead of simply boosting up nearly uncontested and sweeping. I think it should be considered for getting axed but I won't lose sleep if it stays in the tier.

 

[JdRDMS]

Now that Vigoroth has left the tier, I'd like to discuss a mon that I find even more broken than it: Dunsparce.

For the most part: the two mons are pretty similar. They are NFE (and by extension, Eviolite-holding) Normal-types that use a set-up move to boost their Attack and Defense before nuking everything in sight, healing when necessary. However, there a few things unique to Dunsparce that I find problematic. First is its better special bulk. As this will never be boosted (depending on the set, not to mention it wasn't one of Vigoroth's strong points already; 80/55 isn't great), being higher grants Dunsparce some extra peace of mind, plus 100/65 is far from bad by ZU standards.

My main problem with this thing, however, is the dreaded combo of Body Slam + Serene Grace. A strong move with a 60% chance to paralyze is not what I'd consider the most healthy thing in the world, and it can really really hinder even things that check it if they can't one-shot the little guy. Dunsparce is obviously not the first mon to have Serene Grace, and SG on its own does not make the mon broken, but it does push it over the edge imo.

One more thing Dunsparce has over Vigoroth is set variance. Where as Vig almost always runs Bulk Up from my experience, Dunsparce can run either Coil or Calm Mind. While these sets aim to do the same thing, they are very different sets with very different checks, so Dunsparce can be quite unpredictable on top of everything else.

 

[TomatoZause]

Dunsparce ​

Because Vigoroth has left the tier, some have hopped on the Dunsparce bandwagon, mainly due to its setup sets and Serene Grace. However, I believe Dunsparce should not be banned for several reasons. It's a key defensive anchor in the tier, a great glue Pokemon, and can be handled more easily than Vigoroth.

In terms of the direct comparison between Vigoroth and Dunsparce, there are a few things that should be mentioned. One is that while Vigo only had its Bulk Up set, the variety within it was arguably more than Dunsparce's. It could run tera Ghost, Poison, Fairy and more. It also had plenty of set variety from Sub with Slack Off to Taunt without Slack Off. While Dunsparce has the Calm Mind set, it's uncommon because of the opportunity cost of running Coil with Body Slam or the standard Stealth Rock set. It also lacks Taunt and the speed that Vigoroth had, which were the unhealthiest factors about Vigoroth in my opinion. Taunt prevented (p)hazing and status effects, which is the easiest way to cripple or force Dunsparce out. Also Dunsparce is passive before setting up, which makes guessing its set correctly less important than it was for Vigoroth. I think these factors between the two are a major reason why Vigoroth was an extremely unhealthy presence, and Dunsparce is not.

A main argument for Dunsparce's ban is that nasty Serene Grace + Body Slam combination. While I do not think this is particularly healthy, Dunsparce itself is for several reasons. Dunsparce is a superb glue Pokemon. It can function as a wall on both the Physical and Special side, being a check or counter to threats such as Guts Luxray and Flareon, Sneasel without Reversal and Sudowoodo. Bulky Stealth Rocks, which I find to be its best set, adds status support, rocks and reliable recovery to a team. I think the last point is huge because while there are other Pokemon that can take hits from the aforementioned Pokemon such as Sudowoodo, they lack reliable recovery and are thus prone to being worn down over a match. If Dunsparce were to be banned, it would cause more harm than good and only make the current flaws in the metagame worse.

I think some good points have been brought up on the topic to ban Dunsparce, but I do not think the tier can afford to ban it or should ban it because it is slow, vulnerable to status and weak before setting up.

 

[breakaway08]

Never got the Vigoroth thing. Really. Beartic however really should be unanimous, I havent seen anyone who supported this thing staying. Also unironically, try Houndour. It's literally just ZU's Chi-Yu but it has coverage. Not saying its broken, just saying it so this isnt a one-liner.

Chi-Yu Jr (Houndour) @ Life Orb
Ability: Flash Fire
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Shadow Ball
- Flamethrower
- Sludge Bomb
- Dark Pulse

I've been running Quilava for a similar purpose. It's moveset is much less flexible/varied, but it has a higher base speed than Houndour with the same base SpA. Also, I wasn't sure what to run in the fourth slot because most moves seem useless or redundant. I decided that some possible utility with Will-O-Wisp would be an okay addition.

Quilava @ Choice Specs
Ability: Flash Fire
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Eruption
- Flamethrower
- Tera Blast
- Will-O-Wisp

 

[R-G-E]

ZU Self defense 101 (Zu defensive cores)
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The conversation about defensive cores is always interesting as defensive cores act as the backbone of team compositions and truly enable the other members of the team to shine while providing a safety net should things not go in the favour of the wallbreaker.

​

-> : This core is going to kick off the conversation for this topic. Mareanie + Hippo have an interesting dynamic. Mareanie is a really versatile wall that can do a lot of things for a team. In this case, it is acting as a spdef wall and it is able to do so because of Hippo's enormous physical bulk. Mareanie provides a team with both a tspikes absorber and a safety net against extremely threatening while also having enough natural bulk to pivot into special attacks and shrug them off with Regenerator. Hippo is also extremely good at what it does. It is a blanket physical wall that provides a ton of utility with stealth rock and roar and has longevity through slack off. This core of course, is not flawless, and has some issues though. Firstly, it is passive. Secondly, it is weak to knock off, and finally, Psychic types generally prove to be problematic to deal with.

-> : Eiscue is a very underrated mon. It acts as a near insurmountable wall against most physical attackers and tends to completely shut them down. It's speed tier is also relevant as with it's no ice form, it is able to outspeed Jolly max speed at +1 speed. This means that it is effectively able to switch in infinitely on physical attackers as long as it's ice head is active. Mareanie of course, is the pairing here, as they cover each other quite nicely. Ground types that Mareanie do not like, get bullied by Eiscue and the fire types that cause Eiscue issues are unable to fully threaten Mareanie. Together they form a very strong defensive backbone to fall back on. Of course, this core isn't flawless either. Eiscue can be chipped down easily by hazards and Mareanie can be a sitting duck at times which could cause some passive gameplay.

-> : This core is very interesting. It has longevity problems but it is very difficult to break through. These 3 mons create a solid core as Eiscue shuts down the physical attackers, Swalot can deal w/ tspikes while providing extra support through it's moves and also acts as a really good answer to Dunsparce, and Flareon rounds off the core by giving longevity to the former 2, while also spreading burns, which makes breaking through even harder. They synergise well with each other and are capable of covering each other's weaknesses. The weakness to this core would be it's lack of removal.


Final thoughts: These are just the cores that I thought may be useful to newer folk that may want to be part of our tier. It is just some really basic cores to mess around with and is not representative of how diverse the defensive options in our tier is, but I did think that these are the ones that are definitely worth sharing at this point in time. Either way, RGE, out.

​

 

[5Dots]

Going to bring up some interesting Pokemon that deserve a second look:

Sub + SD

Leafeon @ Leftovers
Ability: Chlorophyll
Tera Type: Poison
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Substitute
- Leaf Blade
- Double-Edge

While potent, I believe it's underused because of its reliance on Terastalization to give it coverage, as without it, it's limited to Double-Edge and the unimpressive X-Scissor for coverage. Swalot can take in two, likely three, Double-Edges, giving it valuable time to set up Toxic Spikes or threaten it out with Toxic. So why not run Tera Poison Leafeon to flip the matchup? Swalot doesn't 2HKO it with Earthquake with Tera Poison - and Earthquake isn't necessarily the easiest move to fit on it, as it has to struggle with keeping Toxic, Toxic Spikes, a Poison STAB, Body Press, Encore, and even Protect as a wall. Admittedly, offensive Swalot sets usually run Earthquake, but it's not a common set given defensive sets' superiority. Outside the Swalot matchup, Leafeon functions as an even harder counter to Mareanie and eases up the Sneasel matchup. Like other Terastalization sets, it makes for an excellent Toedscool check and can beat bulky Vigoroth and Dunsparce sets.

Future Sight + Protect

Oranguru @ Leftovers
Ability: Inner Focus
Tera Type: Ghost / Fighting
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Future Sight
- Calm Mind
- Protect
- Shadow Ball / Focus Blast

While nothing has changed with Oranguru as a Future Sight user, having to resort to other Fighting-type Pokemon or phasers may make team building for it a bit harder. In BW ZU, Grumpig did well with CM + two attacks + Protect, meshing its roles as a Slaking answer and offensive/defensive sweeper. This Oranguru combines the role of a physical wall, a Future Sight user, and a bulky wincon all in one Pokemon. I threw in Protect as a way to gain extra Leftovers recovery, a scout against Choice users like Gastly, Scovillain, and Stantler. For my last move, I'd usually go Tera Ghost + Shadow Ball to give it an easier way of beating opposing Psychic-types like Gothitelle and Hypno. Admittedly, Shadow Ball isn't a strong move, but the additional power from Tera Ghost gives it a way to beat them, lest it gets turn to setup fodder. Tera Ghost also has utility in fighting back against other Tera Ghost Pokemon, like Vigoroth and Dunsparce, though the latter being inclined to spam Glare makes this shaky. Tera Fighting + Focus Blast could be nice against the aforementioned Normals who haven't Terastalized yet, but it's extremely prediction-reliant and needs several boosts to OHKO them, not to mention the threat of paralysis from either Body Slam or Glare. Nevertheless, I believe this set may be worth trying out.

Terrain Setter + Abuser

Pincurchin @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Electric Surge
Tera Type: Flying
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpD / 4 Spe
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Spikes
- Recover
- Discharge
- Hydro Pump

Jumpluff @ Electric Seed
Ability: Chlorophyll
Tera Type: Ground
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Acrobatics
- Strength Sap
- Tera Blast

Electric Terrain playstyles have never been too popular, especially with the lack of good Unburden or speedy offensive setup Pokemon that can abuse it. In addition, Sleep Powder flat-out fails under Electric Terrain, making this synergy even more questionable. However, I believe Pincurchin + Jumpluff does have merits. After activating Electric Seed, Jumpluff not only gets a defense boost, but also synergies with Acrobatics! This makes Jumpluff an effective cleaner and makes it an arguably scarier sweeper than without the boost on non-terrain teams. Pincurchin, in turn, helps wear down foes with Spikes damage and paralysis spreading with Discharge. With Beartic leaving the tier, Jumpluff has one less obstacle in terms of offensive counterplay, and still beats down Sun teams with Chlorophyll! Lastly, a move that I haven't seen been discussed is Strength Sap. Sap makes Jumpluff very annoying to deal with, enabling it to hinder physical attackers like non-Sap Sipper Stantler and Leafeon.
While Pokemon like Slaking and Gumshoos can defeat it with their sheer power alone, these two Pokemon aren't always easy to fit on teams, not to mention that they can be quickly worn down by residual damage without Wish support.

 

[diegoyuhhi]

PSYCHIC TYPES IN SV ZU

PART 1: THE BIG 3

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without any doubt, the best of the 3. it has some insane set variety between nasty plot, bulky calm mind, fast calm mind, specs, and scarf, all of them having a slightly different niche while still being completely viable. goth has the highest special attack out of the 3, and is the second fastest slightly behind hypno, making it undoubtedly the most offensive present one, though its bulk should not be underestimated, even when uninvested. its coverage is also pretty expanded, from psychic to shadow ball and dark pulse to its newly gotten focus blast, making it able to hit dark and steel types better than ever, and some other random options like tbolt or energy ball. trick on choice sets allows it to cripple walls making them easier to wear down, and calm mind set could also run rest for more longevity and to prevent status. its main ability competitive is also something to note: getting random boosts from intimidates/defogs/secondary effect drops is always nice and can make this mon even more of a threat than what it already is. i'm not even gonna touch on how much tera makes this mon even stronger, both helping its mediocre defensive typing and powering up its coverage moves at the same time. undoubtedly one of the best mons in the tier rn imo.

oranguru trades some of gothitelle's raw power, speed and physical defense for more sheer bulk in the form of a bigger hp stat, making it tankier than the former, and a ghost immunity. this mon unlike its emo colleague doesn't run offensive set that much, and focuses more on support sets with moves such as future sight, encore, yawn, foul play and more. its inner focus ability, while not as good as goth's competitive, makes it have a slight edge against persian, expecially after terastalizing into a type that resist u-turn like fairy. this mon can be a great special wall on certain builds, or a nice ghost immune-calm mind wincon on others, giving it a great niche alongside gothitelle and not just being a worse version of it. also wanted to mention the av set with charge beam i met on ladder that almost swept me lmao, idt it's any good but i thought it was cool nevertheless.

hypno is... weird, to say the least. it has the poorest special attack of the three by a mile, and worse bulk than oranguru, in exchange for a bigger attack stat (which you're probably not using anyway, unless some weird mixed set), a slight increase in spdef, and a speed tier that's only marginally better. so why am i putting this mon here in the big 3? well, it has a really expanded movepool with many moves over the other two psychics, and while many of these are just physical coverage options, one move stands up above the rest: draining kiss. this move alone makes this mon have a niche over the other two imo, making its subplot sets insanely hard to take down thanks to the huge amount of recovery it can get from this move and its decent sheer bulk. it also gets boosted to 60bp (+ stab boost) if you tera fairy, which is also a great defensive typing. it's also the only one of the 3 with access to fairy coverage (it also has dazzling gleam) which i think is pretty funny. it might be the worse of the "big 3", but imo it's absolutely viable.

PART 2: OTHER (viable?) OPTIONS

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ok i think we can all agree this mon cannot be compared to any of the previous psychic types, being mostly used for its fighting type as a strong but frail physical wallbreaker. nonetheless the secondary psychic stab could be useful for hitting mons like mareanie or swalot, which otherwise can wall other fightings. i've never actually been able to build a successful team around this mon but i can defo see its merits.

uhhhh why are ppl using this. steel/psychic is a pretty decent defensive typing, expecially paired with its not bad bulk, but this mon is just so passive, its damage output is abysmal and not having any recovery outside of rest really sucks. i've seen ppl experiment with id+cm sets but ugh those just seem so situational. if it at least had like body press or toxic it could be ok-ish but in this state it's just nah. not worth using imo.

i've seen this mon on some hyper offense builds and it's fine ig, it does what it's supposed to, being pressure your opponent in not clicking hazards, and bouncing them off if they do. its damage output is really low and the bulk is pretty bad too so just run ebutton with like psychic/nuzzle/hwish/filler or smth. can see why it can have a niche but not a mon i'd use often at all.

saved the most controversial for last. i've seen ppl sweep with this and ppl getting swept by this, but personally i haven't been having any kind of problems with it. some ppl say it's broken, some ppl say it's ass; imo it's not a bad mon by any means, it's actually pretty decent, and sooner or later i will get swept too probably. i just think that it's kinda fishy and that it's hard to make it work, but if you can and you sweep with it, then good job, cause it's not as straightforward as ou's espathra protect-sub spam and you'd actually need to circumvent quite a few issues to get it to work, like (p)hazing, expecially when paired with defensive tera. i can see the hype around it tho.




aaaand that was all, hope you liked this post which was absolutely not an excuse to procrastinate my spanish homework noooo

 

[Corthius]

moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU
moved from NU to ZU

Happy building everyone!​

 

[iLiekMudkipz_]

moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU

Happy building everyone!​

Wugtrio would unironically be broken if it werent for the fact it has negative coverage.

Wugtrio @ Life Orb
Ability: Rattled
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Triple Dive
- Tera Blast
- Throat Chop
- Stomping Tantrum

Tera Steel is moreso a defensive tera, since Electrode would murder it otherwise. Triple Dive is barely better than Liquidation as STAB, and Tera Blast is only for coverage. Throat Chop and Tantrum are filler coverage, since I don't know what else it should run.

 

[Melons-N-Soda]

PU was quite generous with drops, a pleasant surprise. I think all of the mons will have some place in the tier.

gives us a 2nd viable Ghost-type after Gastly, what's notable about Banette is its access to Swords Dance and Shadow Sneak for priority, but as well it also has Sucker Punch and Knock Off it could use on such sets. Band could theoretically do things too with Trick or going AoA, but Banette's main problem is that Shadow Claw is rather pathetic as your main STAB option, even factoring in the power level of this tier. Regardless I think this could be a neat addition.

is probably one of the more defining mons of the shift, as I think it will shift the Speed tier quite dramatically. The fastest mons in the tier previously were Sneasel and Persian, with some slightly below that. Electrode outspeeds all of these and in addition several Scarfers that were popular in the last month (though things like Stantler still outspeed). Its able to quite freely Volt Switch around, with Tera coverage helping it against the main Ground-types in the tier like Toedscool. Its still relatively weak, and has no coverage outside of Tera, but considering the tiers power level its more respectable. Another thing it can do is set up Rain Dance, main perks being access to a non-blockable Taunt and Explosion to generate momentum. Good mon overall.

was actually a decent mon in PU so I was surprised to see it dropped, but nevertheless, here's another wrench in the Psychic wars. Its most notable advantages are Thick Fat and faster Speed tier. Base 80 has the advantage of outspeeding things like Stonjourner (who I'll talk about later) and unboosted Luxray, and having a more offensive switch-in to Scovillain, Raboot (who I'll also get to), and Sun teams in general is quite nice. (No Beartic would still shit on this don't start with the coping) I don't think Pig will make any of the previous Psychics obsolete (they still have their niches, Goth with Competitive, Hypno with greater all around bulk and Draining Kiss, and Oranguru with the Ghost immunity), but IMO I still think it'll be the best one in the tier. As for what it'll run, Calm Mind and Nasty Plot seem best to me. (And this thing's coverage is quite nutty even with missing out on T-Bolt)

is quite a simple mon really. Click Flare Blitz or click HJK on the Rocks, and U-turn out if need be. Another strong Fire-type is nice, and notably over Guts Flareon is the much better Speed tier unboosted. (You outspeed Lumineon most notably) The main difference when it comes to Raboot sets is item, Boots or Choiced, as I think its a bit too frail to try SD sets.

meta is here. Once a king in SS ZU its come back again this gen. The main sets I see are an offensive set with Rocks, or a set with Iron Defense + Body Press (either a sweeper set or a more bulky one). Strong and with great physical bulk, and a surprisingly okay speed tier (outspeeds the base 65s notably), its mainly let down by dying to even the weakest Special Attacker in the tier.

On another note, don't count Sudowoodo out just yet, as Woodo has better abilities, and better all-around coverage than Stonjourner, but Journer's better Speed tier and physical bulk give it an edge. Helpful as a Rocker on more offensive teams, for instance.

is quite one-dimensional in that it clicks Liquidation or Triple Dive and goes wild. The main problem is that its coverage is paltry, and you have to Tera against Grass-types (of which there are plenty of in this tier, Leafeon eats this thing for breakfast) which really sucks, but a mon that hits hard with a good speed tier will never not be appreciated.

 

[5Dots]

moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU

Happy building everyone!​

From the drops we got, I expect Raboot, Stonjourner, and Grumpig to all be top picks:

All-Out Attacker

Raboot @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Libero
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- U-turn
- Flare Blitz
- High Jump Kick
- Sucker Punch

Unlike other Pokemon, Raboot sort of already has Terastalization with Libero. Though nerfed and not as potent as SS, it's still an elite pivot courtesy of its great Speed tier, outpacing Lumineon and Stantler, two already great attackers. The variety of coverage with Flare Blitz and High Jump Kick, priority with Sucker Punch and Quick Attack, and the pivoting with U-turn make it very annoying to switch into. The Fire typing and lack of bulk makes it difficult to switch into, mandating good hazard removal or Boots to fully make use of its offensive prowess. Swords Dance sets can be useful to get rid of the Fire-typing and replacing it with an equally powerful normal STAB with Double-Edge, though it comes with the opportunity cost of a potentially worse STAB. still though, an excellent offensive addition!

Sets

Offensive Calm Mind
Grumpig @ Leftovers
Ability: Thick Fat
Tera Type: Fighting / Ground
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Psyshock / Psychic
- Earth Power
- Focus Blast

Bulky Calm Mind
Grumpig @ Leftovers
Ability: Thick Fat
Tera Type: Fighting / Ground
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Psyshock / Psychic
- Earth Power
- Focus Blast

Choice
Grumpig @ Choice Scarf / Choice Specs
Ability: Thick Fat
Tera Type: Fighting / Ground
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Trick
- Psyshock / Psychic
- Focus Blast / Calm Mind
- Earth Power / Calm Mind

I'm confident Grumpig will be a top pick here, especially with the tier's currently low power level. Thick Fat and a bountiful offensive movepool makes it a dangerous Calm Mind sweeper, especially with picks like Scovillain, itself, and Electrode being top special attackers. Girafarig was already a prominent pick, but Grumpig definitely is the better pick with its better movepool and ability, and also one of the best special attackers. Choice sets makes it a good dedicated wallbreaker/revenge killer and further amp up its set unpredictability. Future Sight + Whirlwind shenanigans makes it good as a phazer, especially with Fighting-types and other VoltTurn Pokemon like Raboot and Electrode. Do not sleep on this pig (unlike Oinklogne). As I am writing this post, Grumpig has already gotten some popularity on the ladder and I anticipate it will see a lot of use in ZU Open if it doesn't get banned.

Sets

Physical Wall
Stonjourner @ Rocky Helmet / Leftovers / Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Power Spot
Tera Type: Fighting / Steel / Ghost
EVs: 120 HP / 252 Def / 136 Spe
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Iron Defense
- Body Press
- Stone Edge

Double Dance
Stonjourner @ Rocky Helmet / Leftovers / Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Power Spot
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 Def / 252 Spe
Tera Type: Fighting / Steel / Ghost
Jolly Nature
- Rock Polish
- Iron Defense
- Body Press
- Stone Edge

Sudowoodo will still have niches with Wood Hammer and Ice Punch, but Stonjourner is definitely better courtesy of its much higher physical bulk and Speed. Physically defensive sets are great for taking on threats like Jumpluff and racking up chip against pretty much every physical attacker possible. Double Dance sets might find use as a decent late-game sweeper. A bit less versatile and comedically low SpD hold it back, but otherwise a great addition as a Stealth Rock setter.


Electrode I admit is something I don't prepare for enough since terastalizing to Ice makes this very annoying to deal with. Only Scarfers like Scovillain or priority is able to hinder it. Electric + Ice (and maybe grass) coverage is very potent considering Toedscool is a linear switch in and Grumpig is merely a temporary check. Very annoying late- and early-game. Banette is cool for Knock Off and a much more reliable spinblocker, especially with Insomnia. Swords Dance sets are cool to set up on Toedscool, though the lack of a strong STAB is a bit worrying. Wugtrio is more or less a decent breaker and one of our few viable Waters, but is definitely the worst of the six new drops and has opportunity cost over other physical attackers.

 

[plznostep]

moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU

Happy building everyone!​

MY TAKES ON DROPS TIME!


On first impressions, this thing looks pretty damn good. Knock Off is rare nowadays, and Banette's access to this move makes all the difference in annoying eviolite Pokemon such as Dunsparce. Furthermore, it is an excellent spinblocker to Toedscool, with Insomnia completely ignoring Spore, even from Mycelium Might. It's also quite dangerous with its excellent attack stat and its priority in Shadow Sneak threatens Psychic-types such as Hypno and Grumpig and while Oranguru is immune to it, It already outspeeds and can just hit it hard with Knock Off instead. Utility sets have been popping up as well thanks to its amazing movepool. Overall, very good from what we've seen so far.


Oh boy. I didn't think much of Electrode when i saw it drop but when using it, its been incredibly strong. Tera Ice is incredibly strong, it absolutely destroys Ground-types, which means it can pivot to its hearts content except versus one Pokemon, Pincurchin, who is not very common in the tier anyways. It's 150 speed tier also makes it outspeed 80 base scarfers such as Gastly, Scovillain, and Grumpig. Furthermore, Static is an absolutely amazing ability it turns out for Electrode because your actually able to punish Pokemon like Persian for even trying to get chip on you with priority. This makes Electrode excellent and chipping down teams overtime and facilitating it to clean up lategame. I've been having fun with Charge Beam so I have the chance to get a boost and potientally clean up the opposing team because of it. Overall, I'm conflicted on whether its presence here is healthy or not, so we'll see how it goes.


I can already tell this is going to be an S rank Pokemon. It's really good, great special bulk and coverage, its basically impossible to wall this Pokemon and its great speed tier allows it to run Specs or Scarf with ease. Nasty Plot sets are also good since Grumpig has some great resistances to get a Nasty Plot off and when it does, it's incredibly threatening. It also has Calm Mind on defensive sets, you could try trailblaze to boost its speed and etc. You really just cannot go wrong with this mon at all.


Another great addition to this tier. 94 is a good speed tier (even if it just barely misses out on Leafeon) and its attack is pretty solid as well, especially when combined with its great ability in Libero, making it have STAB on all moves used (unless the ability has already activated). This means it can get STAB on U-turn, Gunk Shot, High Jump Kick, Sucker Punch and etc, increasing its power to some pretty great heights. I think HDB is a great option for this Pokemon, as it likes to pivot around a lot, but I could see Scarf potientially working well and Banded would make sense as well. It does struggle with some Pokemon such as Mareanie but I feel it will fit in well here.


While i think that Sudowoodo still is better on defensive sets, this Pokemon's offensive potiential is amazing with it having an actual speed stat, meaning it can pull off Rock Polish a lot better then Sudowoodo ever would. Iron Press is a great option, although you will struggle with Grounds if you try that set, and you need to make it fully offensive because this Pokemon has laughable SpDef, so its just better to make sure it never has to take a hit on the special side by investing into its speed. Scarf and Banded has also been discussed, and I think they are fine options too, although you still have to worry about Grounds when using it.


This is another great drop, It has an amazing Speed + Attack stat, with its unique move in Triple Dive bypassing some annoying defensive Pokemon such as Eiscue and stopping Focus Sash users such as Kricketune and Delibird from setting up Hazards. Its coverage is pretty shallow, but thankfully they did at least give it Stomping Tantrum for Mareanie, so you can Tera Ice to hit Grasses while still having some kind of option for Water-types at least. Lumineon and Dewott will stonewall you sadly but other than that, you should be fine, making Wugtrio a wonderful option imo for this tier.​

 

[TwentyTwan]

I've always wanted to write some posts on here, so without further ado, lets get cracking

Hisuian Zorua
Hisuian Zorua, Zorua hereafter, is a weird mon. It's weaker and slower than Gastly, but it being immune to ghost gives it a few more good switching. So far the best success I have had is as a scarfer, sort of in the same vein as Gastly, but with u-turn turning it in a better slightly weaker pivot. 3 immunities, 2 of which tend to hard wall most Dunsparce sets, are pretty good. Plus with the right teammate, getting it in for free isnt all that big of a hassle. I honestly think it might find a niche in the tier, but will be the least prevelent of all the 7 drops this shift.

Grumpig
Considering what has already been said for Grumpig, there isn't much I'd add other than this, it has access to encore and while base 80 speed isn't absolutely bonkers, it does generally outspeed most rockers and spikers, whilst also crucially out speeding Dunsparce even whilst paralyzed allowing it to cripple setup attempts or locking it into roost. Being 4 speed slower than Fletchinder, which is arguably the most popular defogger, is also quite a benefit, as you can lock it into defog forcing a hard switch rather than taking good damage from the U-turn it would click. All these free turns allow for a lot of free calm minds, nasty plots, future sights, and leftover recovery. Which I think is worth noting.


Honestly the biggest addition these drops, an offensive knock off abuser, and a damn good one at that. Base 115 attack is really high by ZU standards and with Tera getting stab on knock off is a piece of cake. Whilst normally changing that fighting immunity into a weakness might turn into a double edge sword, ZU does not have a single decent fighting type at the moment, whereas strong ghost and and psychic moves are floating around a lot. Its only issue after tera dark is arguably Dedenne, but that seems like a good payoff. On top of this, you get sucker punch or shadow sneak for good priority. SV has also granted a weird option to consider, Trailblaze. After a single boost, it outspeeds every nonscarfed mon with the exception of electrode and 115 attack + life orb might turn into quite a deadly attacker.


Well, Electrode has 1 thing it's really good at, speeeed. It's blazing fast, outspeeding base 80 scarfers and considering it gets bolt beam coverage with tera ice, it also hits everything decently hard. So far really only boost has seemed like worth running, with specs being too hampered by hazards. Fast taunt is also worth something, and considering its abysmal move pool, taunt seems like the best 4th move slot. It can fit explosion, but its base attack really lets it down there. Another take that has had some success for me is not running max speed Electrode, but rather just enough to outspeed Wugtrio. Which is the 2nd fastest mon in the tier, allowing Electrode for some bulk, crucially trading 2 sucker punches from non-tera dark Jolly Banette, or having a decent chance at surviving a Tera Dark Knock off.

252 Atk Life Orb Banette Sucker Punch vs. 108 HP / 0 Def Electrode: 122-144 (42.3 - 50%) -- 0.4% chance to 2HKO
252 Atk Life Orb Tera Dark Banette Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 108 HP / 0 Def Electrode: 253-300 (87.8 - 104.1%) -- 25% chance to OHKO

In turn it does 2HKO Banette. There might be more benefits from this bulk, but so far this is the biggest I have seen. And while sure, you give up on outspeeding base 80 scarfers, it's a trade worthwhile of consideration.


Stonjourner is like a more offensive Sudowoodo, base 70 speed allows it to outspeed mons such as Banette, Oranguru, and Flareon. Base 70 speed also allows for Rock Polish to be actually viable instead of just a niche option. While Sudowoodo packs some decorum of special defense, Stonjourner instead HP, Attack, and Defense, turning it into a bigger physical wall and threat. Whereas Sudowoodo gets access to spikes and rocks, Stonjourner only gets Rocks. Once again making it a more offensive mon. I do think you can consider Iron Press as a moveset considering it can Tera into flying to avoid the grounds.


Honestly, no clue about this mon could completely warp the meta, or it could just do nothing and die. Its complete lack of coverage really hurts this glass canon of a mon. I do think it has great potential as an anti-lead, considering it gets Stomping Tantrum as one of the few coverage moves. This allows it to hit Swalot and most rockers for super effective, coming from a 100 base attack, generally boosted by a band or life orb, It could cause some havoc. What holds it back for me is that, unlike Electrode, it does get outspeed by common scarfers such as Gastly, Scovillian, and Grumpig and that base 35 HP ain't gonna help it take a hit to not just die.


Yet another very good pivot, be it scarf or HDB, either could work, Libero is an amazing ability turning it's U-turn into stab move before buggering off. I do think that as a pivot it gets outclassed by Electrode, but it seems like a very good teammate for it, barring the overlapping ground weakness.


Well, thats it for me, I hope my insights prove to be of any use to anyone out there!

P.S any feedback is more than welcome!​

 

[AstilCodex]

Late to the party to talk about the new drops, I like how every single one is at worst relevant, and at best directly meta changing but not broken (imo). If I repeat with my fellas my bad but I'll try to give different approaches and winners/losers which I haven't seen yet. Also multiple sets for each one of them. Let's go.

Banette is a fantastic addition to the tier as if performs the role that no other mon (unless tera'd) could have done before. Banette is a lot more consistent spinblocker that makes direct progress with Knock Off while also being good offensively. It has access to priority in Sucker and Sneak, utility in Will-O-Wisp and gain new tools in SV with access to SD and Encore. Insomnia is also really cool cuz it wins the interaction against Toedscool. I think Banette can find its place in many archetypes and by the current tier's power creep its a great addition.

Spooky sets ;o

Offensive SD (Banette) @ Heavy-Duty Boots / Life Orb
Ability: Insomnia
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Knock Off
- Sucker Punch / Shadow Sneak
- Shadow Claw

Utility (Banette) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Insomnia
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 200 HP / 252 Atk / 56 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Knock Off
- Will-O-Wisp
- Shadow Sneak
- Encore

Resttalk (Banette) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Insomnia Cursed Body
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 252 HP / 200 SpD / 56 Spe or 252 HP / 200 Def / 56 Spe
Careful / Impish Nature
- Knock Off
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Will-O-Wisp

Oh boi, Electrode fastest speed tier and its very relevant. Electrode would be close to unviable if it wasn't because we are in the future. And mons can Tera Blast indeed. This mon is insane as Tera Ice makes your Electric Inmunity, specially Toed, very shaky. And even resists can just get volted on. Electrode lacks of sheer power makes it wanting of Specs, but also Boots is great as this mon will come repeatedly on the field and preventing hazards from hindering your turns is also great. Excellent, solid mon.
P.S: It also makes pretty much any Scarfer below 85 Speed kinda bad and suboptimal unless Modest which opens up more.
P.S 2: Niche abilities but aftermath may be the most useful when used as a sack.

BOOM

HDB (Electrode) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Aftermath / Static
Tera Type: Ice / Ground
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid / Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Volt Switch
- Thunderbolt
- Tera Blast
- Taunt

Specs (Electrode) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Aftermath / Static
Tera Type: Ice / Ground
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Volt Switch
- Thunderbolt
- Tera Blast
- Sleep Talk

Sub ChargeBeam (Electrode) @ Leftovers / Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Static
Tera Type: Ice / Ground
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Substitute
- Charge Beam
- Tera Blast
- Thunderbolt

Rain Setter (Electrode) @ Damp Rock
Ability: Aftermath
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Timid / Jolly Nature
- Rain Dance
- Taunt
- Explosion / Thunder
- Volt Switch / Thunder

Grumpig is undeniably the best Psychic-type in the tier and may be the best mon tbh. It honestly feel most consistent than Girafarig but less broken at the same time. As it cannot cheese games and its a little more narrowed in alternatives. Thick fat is a phenomenal ability which in conjunction with Tera allows it to wall common Fire and Ice types like Raboot, Scovillain, Glalie and Sneasel (Tera Fairy). It has a great speed tier for Choiced and setup sets with CM or NP while also good enough bulk, coverage in Ghost Fairy Fighting and Ground, utility options in Encore, Yawn, Whirlwind, Future Sight... this mon is amazing.

the actual oink

NP (Grumpig) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Thick Fat
Tera Type: Fairy / Fighting
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Nasty Plot
- Psychic
- Focus Blast / Dazzling Gleam
- Shadow Ball

CM Encore (Grumpig) @ Leftovers
Ability: Thick Fat
Tera Type: Fairy / Ground
EVs: 252 HP / 80 Def / 176 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Psyshock
- Earth Power
- Encore

AoA (Grumpig) @ Twisted Spoon
Ability: Thick Fat
Tera Type: Fairy / Fighting
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Future Sight
- Psychic
- Shadow Ball
- Focus Blast / Dazzling Gleam

Choiced (Grumpig) @ Choice Scarf / Choice Specs
Ability: Thick Fat
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Psychic
- Earth Power
- Shadow Ball
- Trick

Offensive fire type role was narrowed to Scovillain and I guess Guts Flareon which is bad. So the arrival of Raboot makes is also, like every mon so far, a great addition to the tier. Raboot exceeds in Voltturn cores having stab on U-turn and good overall coverage with great BP moves such as HJK, flare blitz and Gunk, priority in Sucker. And a good speed tier. Another great presence for the tier.

bunny go brr

AoA (Raboot) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Libero
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- U-turn
- Flare Blitz
- High Jump Kick
- Sucker Punch

Scarf (Raboot) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Libero
Tera Type: Fire / Fighting
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- U-turn
- Flare Blitz
- High Jump Kick
- Gunk Shot

BU (Raboot) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Libero
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Bulk Up
- High Jump Kick
- Flare Blitz
- Sucker Punch

OMG MY BUDDY IS BACC. Early SS flashbacks, omg I love this mon. And Stonjourner now it comes with more tools to its disposal, thanks to some new moves and the option to Tera. Stonjourner has the natural physical defense and speed to perform multiple roles in a team with diff sets all viable and all menacing. Rocks + ID Press, Double Dance, RP 3 attacks, Band and Scarf I think all have exploration. We'll see how dominant this guy becomes just as it did in the past but in paper is def a top top Pokemon.

Early SS meta was GOLD

SR + ID Press (Stonjourner) @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Power Spot
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Iron Defense
- Body Press
- Stone Edge

Double Dance (Stonjourner) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Power Spot
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 252 Def / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Rock Polish
- Iron Defense
- Stone Edge
- Body Press

RP 3 atks (Stonjourner) @ Life Orb
Ability: Power Spot
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Stone Edge
- Earthquake
- Body Press
- Rock Polish

Choiced (Stonjourner) @ Choice Scarf / Choice Band
Ability: Power Spot
Tera Type: Rock
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Stone Edge
- Earthquake
- Body Press
- Stealth Rock

s/o to the most fun drop so far. Wugtrio is def the least determinant, but its def viable and I love we got more offensive threats with high speed tiers. 2nd fastest now is great and even if its rather one-dimensional. It performs quite well. I've been using it on webs for scarfers and Triple Dive everything, it gets Tantrum for Mareanie but unfortunately Lumineon and Leafeon/Jumpluff checks it quite well. As you may want CB for maximum damage. Decent priority options too. I like this mon a lot. Try it out ^^ (Also gooey can be pretty good for a sack for offensive teams)

GET WUGGED

CB (Wugtrio) @ Choice Band
Ability: Gooey
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Triple Dive
- Stomping Tantrum
- Aqua Jet
- Throat Chop

Copium for checks (Wugtrio) @ Life Orb
Ability: Gooey
Tera Type: Electric
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
IVs: 29 HP
- Triple Dive
- Stomping Tantrum
- Ice Beam
- Tera Blast

Finally, I tested this Pokemon as a meme and was honestly surprised. H-Zorua can pull up some funny mind games and has decent offensiveness, if your meta knowledge is decent you can disguise this rightfully to get a KO and have it later as it has some good Utility in Taunt, Trick and U-turn for pivot. Keep on check your hazards game tho, as that may reveal the disguise. You can pair this with a 2nd normal type to utilise the Illusion to its best. Tera Blast Normal is also good for initial STAB which I'd def turn into Fighiting for this tier. On the negative, its kinda slow, slower than Grumping kinda sucks and its extremely frail, idk yet if Eviolite is worth it. I dont think this will stay relevant but its far from unviable imo.

U are alr in my genjutsu

Choiced (Zorua-Hisui) @ Choice Specs / Choice Scarf
Ability: Illusion
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid /Modest Nature
- Shadow Ball
- Tera Blast
- U-turn
- Trick

NP (Zorua-Hisui) @ Eviolite
Ability: Illusion
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Nasty Plot
- Shadow Ball
- Tera Blast
- Taunt / Substitute

Winners! :D

Tspikes are good against all these guys and now Swalot has a good partner for spinblocking. You are more forced to tera but Banette Knock + Tspikes is very solid

Leafeon just has a natural good MU against the drops, switches on Stonj, Wug, faster than Grumpig and Raboot which is paper. 2hkos Banette and Mildly resists Electrode's attacks except Tera Ice. Leafeon is a problem for these new teams which will slap all this mon together which is honestly viable to do

Pincurchin is the best Electrode answer (thats why I suggested Tera Ground on the sets) and again, a great spinblocker companion. I think Pincurchin will rise in usage as it volt absorbtion stopping momentum vortex is greatly appreciated

Losers! :C (theres a lot more losers)

This is prob the biggest downside. Sudowoodo was prob an A+/S mon down to a B-/C+ just because the outclass of Stonjourner, even if Sudo has spikes and better spdef, some coverage that Stonj doesn't. The raw physical bulk, offensiveness and Speed tier of Stonj almost completely outclasses Sudo. Unfort

Its not that Gothitelle alone gets worse or anything, but Grumpig is objetivecly the best Psychic type. Thus, making all other psychic types, like Oranguru and Hypno outclassed too. Goth was the best psychic atm so its a representative. Still has a good niche in being a Defog deterrent.

Theres a lot more much faster mons that pressures Luxray offensively and Stonjourner can hard come in on Facade and pressures a lot more than Sudo did. Luxray its getting kinda slow for the standards of the tier now and easily revenge killed unless you get a Trailblaze/Agility which is mid.

The whole point of Persian was to get chip with Fake Out + U-turn and being the fastest speed tier with Sneasel, now it has the 3rd tied with Sneasel and also Stonjouner existing. tho I can see some mixed sets or straight special working for that. But overall its main function gets worse.

Electrode prob just outclasses Dedenne in most scenarios, not as big as Sudo w Ston but still. The speed tier and tera coverage on Electrode is so much more appealing. Tho Dedenne has some niches like U-turn to not get absorbed and Nuzzle. But its no more the dominant Volt Switcher.


Lastly, and because this thing has no 3d sprite, Toedscool gets a lot worse, Banette its a good partner but also a great answer for it as it can come repeteadly on it unlike Gastly, or get Spored like Sandygast. It invites Electrode to Tera Ice you, Raboot U-turns on you forever, even Wug isn't the best for it. This mon has to do too much in one game and usually gets hindered before in can do all it needs to.

That'd be all. I like the drops so far, they made this meta fun for me again. See ya ^^

 

[Corthius]

@ Eviolite
Ability: Mycelium Might
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Earth Power
- Knock Off
- Rapid Spin
- Foul Play
252 Atk Toedscool Foul Play vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Banette: 272-320 (101.1 - 118.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO​

I haven't seen anyone talk about this option, but it completely flips the matchup against Banette, which otherwise annoys Toed a lot by being immune to sleep, while also not taking much from Knock Off. I can see Colbur Berry being used more on Banette, but that only weakens its own longevity, as I have found that HDB Banette is an amazing set.
Anyway, really cool innovation if it finds its way onto Toeds moveset, although people will probably argue that "you don't have room for Foul Play", but I would say that's nonsense. Why wouldn't you have room for a move that almost surely invalidates the one big annoyer that recently has dropped to the tier?
I could see a set similar to this popping up in usage, but with physdef instead:

Spdef Resttalk (Banette) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Insomnia
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 252 HP / 200 SpD / 56 Spe
Careful Nature
- Knock Off
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Will-O-Wisp

0- Atk Toedscool Foul Play vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Banette: 130-154 (39.1 - 46.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
-> This is still not really a winning matchup, but Toed isn't necessary hard to wear down with other meassures, just think about Toxic Spikes being in the picture here, or your own Will-O-Wisp halving the BP of Foul Play.

 

[mrnoodleoctopus]

Hi y'all. If this isn't the most potent set up sweeper in the tier, I don't know what is.

Grumpig @ Salac Berry
Ability: Gluttony
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Nasty Plot
- Substitute
- Psychic
- Dazzling Gleam

Obviously we aren't hitting quite everything here, but I figure, might as well take advantage of the tier not having any fully evolved steels.

Burning your tera to turn fairy might be a necessary commitment versus banette builds but the juice is worth the squeeze in setting up to +2 +1 so effortlessly.

You're not going to be doing much versus opposing psychic types with neutral dazzling gleam, even at +2. As well, choice scarf raboot threatens and outspeeds with U-turn.

Overall super solid.

 

[MattC (Banned)]

I'm currently working on a ZU team and came to the conclusion for what i want to use


These 4 form a solid offensive defensive composition that i wanna build around. Breifly, I wanna go over some stuff such as sets and things I want answers to


Banette @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Insomnia
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Impish Nature
- Shadow Sneak
- Knock Off
- Will-O-Wisp
- Taunt

Standard Physically Defensive Banette. It's incredibly annoying to face and when wielded properly can be devastating.



Stonjourner @ Choice Band
Ability: Power Spot
Tera Type: ???
EVs: 112 HP / 16 Atk / 188 Def / 20 SpD / 172 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge / Rock Slide
- Giga Impact
- Stealth Rock

Stonjourner is fast and bulky. When equipped with a Choice Band, its power is threatening. It straight up lives a max spatk electrode thunderbolt from full and can OHKO back with Earthquake. It also lives Guts Flareon Superpower + Quick Attack from full and can also OHKO with Earthquake (same with Luxray). Giga Impact is a psuedo Explosion it can use to break past problematic pokemon or to get off as much neutral damage as it can before fainting.



Swalot @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Sticky Hold
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 56 Def / 144 SpD / 56 Spe
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sludge Bomb
- Giga Drain
- Destiny Bond / Shadow Ball
- Thunder Wave

I'm experimenting with different Swalot spreads. It has good bulk and Sticky Hold to allows it multiple switch-ins to Banette.



Persian @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Limber
Tera Type: ???
EVs: 224 HP / 4 Def / 64 SpD / 216 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Fake Out
- Taunt
- U-turn
- Body Slam

Fake Out, speedy Taunt and U-Turn. What's not to love about it?


THINGS I WANT ANSWERS FOR

It has much variety. I might swap Persian for Sneasel because of that. But its a pretty big might imo

The fastest thing in the tier. Electric + Ice is also good metagame coverage
/
Weather in general is also something I want to keep in mind. If unprepared for, it can sweep teams on the spot.


Do I know what I'm doing? No. Do I like 252/252/4 EV spreads? Also no. I'm just trying to figure out the meta. I'll post a complete team once I find out the final 2 pokemon for this team. With all that being said, goodbye.

 

[BaitWiz]

On The Radar

Heya, I'm back with my first big metagame post of the generation! The first month of SV ZU has been quite interesting with several Pokemon receiving the banhammer and newcomers having joined in the month of May. I'd like to just go ahead and take some time to talk about five mons that are some of the most noteworthy, some of which are new and some of which have been in the tier ever since initial speculation for the tier came out. I feel that all five of these mons have potential to be banworthy, but three stand out above the rest. Now, without further ado:

The Big Three

Speculation King Electrode is back with a menace. Its best switch ins either get VSwitched on or dominated by Tera (Tera Ice for Toedscool, Tera Ground for Pincurchin) and its speed is so ludicrously good that any scarfer under base 85 speed becomes difficult to justify. It puts immense pressure on the builder due to this speed as well as its flexibility after its typical combination of VSwitch and a Tera Blast of choice - Tera Blast hits incredibly well neutrally before Terastalization and augments its coverage further afterwards, while VSwitch is just a free momentum button at times due to how difficult it is to switch certain mons into an expected Tera type. While its bulk isn't superb, it lets it take a neutral hit or two as well if necessary, letting it do annoying things like setup screens, taunt just about everything, and even setup weather. Its special attack, while not terrible, sits at a respectable 80, dealing decent damage with investment while keeping momentum. Finally, it somewhat disincentivizes using U-Turn due to having Static. If there's any mon that should have an eye kept on it, it's Electrode - the clear number one drop in my honest opinion.

If you've played ZU, you've found out about Dunsparce either through using it or playing against it; it's ludicrously fat and Serene Grace allows it to do all sorts of borderline uncompetitive things; from grabbing 60% odds at paralysis off of body slam to spamming Ice Beam and Ancient Power for a 20% chance at causing profanity in the in-game chat, Dunsparce tends to stick around for a long time and be incredibly annoying. While it isn't necessarily banworthy off of its bulk alone, as it gets cut into pretty hard once hit with Knock Off or Trick, the sheer hax factor that Dunsparce has pushes it to being the second strongest Pokemon in the tier in my eyes. Its set is ridiculously customizable after the obligatory Roost and Body Slam, being able to fit Shadow Ball, Ice Beam, Earth Power, and Stealth Rock, just to name a few. Often times you have to scout out Dunsparce or risk one of the coverage options just obliterating you before you're able to start figuring out how to beat it, often meaning you get something hax'd by it before you can really setup proper counterplay. Dunsparce has two clear weaknesses that you can exploit from the builder - Toxic and removal of its item. The former sees rather limited distribution, and the latter even moreso; both get stuffed by Swalot, barring something like Gothitelle, who really doesn't enjoy trading away its item; neither are immune to getting paralyzed on switch in (outside of Banette which gets toasted by Shadow Ball). Dunsparce can also be worn down into kill range from an invested attack on its weak side, but that again requires some degree of scouting, which gives Dunsparce time to leverage the odds further against you. If there's one thing that's sure to be in this metagame, it's Dunsparce - as long as it's around, it'll be alive for an eternity, no matter how well you prep against it. Unless you bring...

"Oh boy, another Psychic type!" thought the ZU playerbase after banning Girafarig and witnessing Gothitelle, Oranguru, and Hypno fight for its place. Grumpig sits at a respectable base 80 speed, outspeeding most of the bulkier side of the metagame and catching base 70's and 65's like Luxray and Gothitelle, and has a respectable base 90 special attack, which is difficult to switch into when boosted by Choice Specs. Grumpig also has valuable resistances to Fire and Ice thanks to Thick Fat, an ability that also gives its gameplay additional depth with setup options existing. It has excellent coverage with Focus Blast, Shadow Ball, Energy Ball, Earth Power, and the universal Tera Blast, making it difficult to switch into consistently. It's worth noting that this does check Dunsparce if it manages to get in safely against it (good luck) since Specs Focus Blast does a minimum of 78% to even the most specially bulky of Dunsparces (if it hits) and Psychic finds 2hkos against most of them as well. Grumpig is a powerful addition to the tier, knocking the other three Psychics out of the water in comparison and stresses the builder due to its solid speed and power, as well as set potential.

Not Broken... Yet.

This is probably one of my favorite additions to the tier - it's a spinblocker that doesn't require Tera with some degree of bulk (not a lot, granted, but anything's bulkier than Gastly), has Knock to deal with pesky Eviolites (hi dunsparce and toedscool!), has three interesting abilities in Insomnia (turns Toedscool into setup fodder with SD), Frisk (pretty meh), and Cursed Body (this could be cool?), and has an incredibly solid base 115 attack stat. It also has great priority moves in Sucker Punch and Shadow Sneak, and can even be cheeky with something like Tera Fighting. However, it gets stuffed hard by Dark-types, of which there are a couple (especially with Tera in the equation), has lackluster bulk, and sits at the rather crowded base 65 speed tier. I think Banette is a wonderful addition to the tier and I'm excited to see where it goes. I hope it doesn't end up being too broken to stay, but it's possible it ends up going that way.

This Red Hot Chili Pepper has at least four viable sets, all of which have varying answers; it has the highest special attack in the tier at 108; and yet somehow hasn't started singlehandedly obliterating the entire metagame. Scarf, Specs, Growth, and SubSeed are all excellent at what they do and can have somewhat varied checks - Oinkologne stuffs most sets but gets dominated by SubSeed, for example. There isn't a lot to say about this mon as its attacks are limited to its STAB buttons, Stomping Tantrum, and Tera Blast, and it has pretty clear counterplay due to its somewhat middling speed and lackluster bulk but it really does feel like a Pokemon that's one ban or one set discovery away from crossing the line into banworthy territory.

Final Thoughts and Conclusion:

Status is incredibly strong in this metagame; the evaporation of Clerics from the metagame makes Paralysis and Toxic near permanent, Freeze a potential outright KO rather than just temporarily putting a mon out of commission, and Sleep stronger than ever. Hazards are also omnipresent; defoggers tend to be frail and abusable while spin is easier to block than ever before due to Tera and our new ghostly additions of Banette and H-Zorua (my beloved).

Overrated: Luxray, offensive Flareon, Persian, Hypno, Sneasel, Corvisquire
Underrated: Slaking (yes really), Rufflet, Gumshoos, Dewott, Sliggoo
Might have a niche: Pikachu (stronk with light ball and decently fast too), Wigglytuff (it's actually not horrible unlike in SS), Flittle (kinda an mu fish), Quilava (150bp stab move)

Metagame is overall decently fun but has a few problematic mons that make building a bit annoying. Thank god it's better than SS ZU Thanks for taking the time to read this post, and have a good time playing this metagame; it's quite the nice change of pace from anything we've seen before!

 

[sleid]

HOW DO I STOP THESE NEW THREATS?!?!
​

Hello all of my fellow ZU enjoyers. I have been seeing many questions in the chat rooms about how to handle some of these new drops we recently obtained. My goal here is to help answer those questions in one big post, that way you can have a one stop shop to figure out the Pokémon you may need to flush out your team. I will go over some common sets they can have, point out some of their weaknesses, then go into how to deal with them. Obviously, Tera is a big factor here in most cases and I can't cover every single crazy sets/scenario you may face, but I will do my best. I would like to keep this short and sweet, but no promises :)

Here are some common sets you might run into. These aren't necessarily EV'd to perfection, but most Electrode want to AT LEAST run a 427 speed stat to outrun scarf Gastly and be able to add a little more bulk for longevity.
Weaknesses - Umm, I will just refer back to BaitWiz on this one in the post above. Electrode is a problem. It is rarely out sped, has great coverage with Tera Blast Ice, and solid natural bulk. This makes for an issue when coming up with how to deal with this thing.
Answers - It seems like we have come to 4 different answers on killing this thing: Catch off guard with Tera Ground, out speed with Scarf/boosting moves, using priority moves when it gets crippled and Pincurchin. I have had decent success with shutting down this Pokemon by catching it off guard with Tera Ground from the likes of Stonjourner, Gumshoos, Wugtrio, etc. (basically any heavy hitter that it would feel safe using an Electric move on). You can outspeed it with the likes of Scarf Stantler, Raboot and Dedenne, but note they don't all necessarily OHKO. However, they can deal some big damage and finish it off, if it has already taken a hit or two. Priority moves such as a Aqua Jet, Sucker Punch, Shadow Sneak, etc., can share similar roles with those who can out speed Electrode in the sense that they may not OHKO, but can certainly pick it off, if it gets down to low enough HP. Finally, Special Defensive Pincurchin is probably the best and most reliable answer. Its the only Pokémon that has the ability to stop a Volt Switch, enough bulk to take Ice Tera Blasts, and the ability to recover the damage for longevity. Here is a common set for it.

Here are some common sets you might run into. Again, not EV'd to perfection, but you get the idea from these generic sets.
Weaknesses - Grumpig is showing to be one of the strongest threats in the meta right now. It has a great ability, solid offensive typing/coverage and terrifying stats. Its only weakness is its middling Physical Defensive stat.
Answers - Grumpig has a few solid answers offensively, but not many defensively. Due to how fast it is, offensive Pokémon who can deal with it need to come in safely if they don't out speed. Your best answers are heavy hitting Dark and Ghost type users, other Psychic types to stomach some hits and put pressure back and faster, physical attackers. As for the Dark and Ghost type hitters, we have the likes of Murkrow, Banette, Scarf Gastly, Scarf Krokorok and in some cases, Sneasel. These Pokémon have the typing or stats to either finesse their way in safely or take a hit when coming in. As for Psychic types, Gothitelle and Hypno can either cripple Grumpig with Trick shenanigans, carry boosting sets or hard-hitting Choice Spec sets to put on immediate pressure. They have the bulk to sustain a couple of hits from Grumpig. Oranguru is in a class of its own here because it isn't threatened with super effective moves from Grumpig unlike the other two. This has raised its stocks in the current meta. Lastly, physical attackers can threaten Grumpig as well. Don't get me wrong, this Pokemon can stomach some tough blows. However, most of these physical attackers can either OHKO it or pick it off after some damage has been previously dealt. You have pretty much any physical scarfer (Mankey, Stonjourner, Seviper). You have bulkier mons who can take a hit (Flareon, Luxray, Gumshoos, Oinks, Dewott). Finally, those who can hit hard but outspeed without the need for Scarf (Stantler, Raboot, Leafeon, Wugtrio, Slaking, Persian, Jumpluff, Fletchinder).
DO NOT GET IT TWISTED. It seems like Grumpig might have a lot of decent answers, but it can be very difficult to switch in on or stop when it starts setting up. A lot of these picks are situational and can work in a pinch, but you need at least one dedicated check to take down this monster or it will run over your entire team. I just wanted to make sure this was clear to everyone.

Here are some common sets you might run into. Speed EVs can be changed on some of these sets to be more optimal.
Weaknesses - Stonjourner has a glaring weakness, its Special Defense. Otherwise, it has an upside in every other stat over its rival, Sudowoodo. It is very hard to muscle past its physical defense, it can hit very hard and has decent speed that can catch some people off guard.
Answers - There are some great physically defensive and specially offensive Pokémon that can take care of this thing. When it comes to physical walls, you have the likes of Sandygast, Hippopotas, and Mudbray. Toedscool is worth mentioning because it can take a hit or two and return an OHKO Earth Power or Giga Drain. Just about any special attacker that can out speed comfortably can kill it such as Lumineon, Seviper, Gastly, Scovillain, and all of our Psychics. Stonjourner isn't as difficult to handle as the other two. Most teams will end up having something to take care of it without purposefully building to handle it.

Here are some common sets you might run into. This Pokémon is a lot more straightforward than the previous.
Weaknesses - Wugtrio is a straightforward heavy physical hitter. It has blazing fast speed and a great attack stat, but it is very frail and nothing to speak of on the special side offensively. It lacks strong coverage as well, making its counters pretty hard to work around.
Answers - Countering Wugtrio isn't necessarily a tough task, but if you don't bring one or lose it without taking Wugtrio down, then you're going to have a problem. Wugtrio struggles to break through water, grass and dragon types. Anything that can out speed it will also be able to easily take it out. Priority moves can also put in a ton of damage. The likes of Mareanie, Leafeon, Tropius and Zweilous can absolutely wall it. Lumineon can work well if switching in on any of its water moves. Electrode and Scarf users over Base 65 Speed can take it out with a strong enough nuetral move. It also struggles against any sort of priority, especially if it is STAB from the likes of Banette, Raboot, Persian, etc. Anything that can Tera Grass or Water can help in a pinch.

Here are some common sets you might run into. There are some more specified and niche sets running around, but these are the sets you need to best prepare for.
Weaknesses - Banette is a pretty solid Pokémon overall, so weaknesses can be hard to come by. It is on the slower side, but with its massive Attack and priority moves it can still cause problems for anything that out speeds it.
Answers - The best way to handle Banette is with physically defensive Pokemon that can take a hit or two with ease, or a Dark type that can resist a hit and kill back. When it comes to physically defensive Pokémon, the likes of Hippopotas, Sudowoodo, Stonjourner, Wigglytuff, and Zweilous can stomach hits and kill it with relative ease. When it comes to Dark types that can resist and hit back for a kill, then you're looking at using Pawniard, Krokorok, and Murkrow. Anything that can Tera Dark can also help in a pinch.

Here are some common sets you might run into. It is mostly used as a pivot or a quick physical hitter.
Weaknesses - Raboot has very middling bulk. It isn't really supposed to take hits, so when you use it, you are either pivoting out or finishing off a foe. Hazards can limit its longevity when running the Scarf set.
Answers - Raboot can be tricky if you don't know how to stop it. There are few Pokémon that can take its coverage hits with ease, so you will mostly be relying on outspeeding, hitting with priority of keeping hazards up if it runs the Scarf set. For taking hits, physical Mareanie, Swalot, Sandygast, Hippopotas and Mudbray can eat just about any move it chooses to use. The only Scarf user that can outrun Scarf Raboot is Dedenne, however it can only be helpful if Raboot has lost some health first. So, you will mostly have to rely on priority moves such as Aqua Jet, Sucker Punch, etc. Lastly, keeping hazards up is important to take down Scarf sets. The goal would be to block the spinner or punish a defogger that wants to help Raboot stay alive for more offensive oppurtunities. When it comes to the Boots set, your scarfers will have a much easier time taking this thing out.

I hope this can help people looking for quick answers during the team building process. I could have gone plenty more in depth, but didn't want this to be a TL;DR. All of the highlighted portions in the Answers portion are to help you find answers a bit quicker. If I missed anything (a common set, an answer, a weakness or what not) then please feel free to DM me so I can add it. These drops have been very interesting to learn, but I hope others are having fun with them! Thanks for coming to my TED Talk if you got this far <3

 

[JMan1008]

So I know everyone's hyped about the recent additions to the tier but I wanna take some time to talk about some goofy sets I've had fun with on ladder. The first is definitely my favorite in Life Orb Glalie.


Glalie @ Life Orb
Ability: Inner Focus
Tera Type: Ground
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Ice Shard
- Ice Spinner/Icicle Crash/Iron Head
- Earthquake
- Taunt

Instead of setting spikes and dying, I like to use it as a sort of anti-lead. It outspeeds every hazard-setter in the tier other than itself and hits for some pretty solid damage after getting the taunt off, 2HKO-ing nearly every one of the hazard setters depending on its second moveslot (This does notably exclude Stonjourner and Sudowoodo though who can score a clean OHKO on you with their STAB unless you tera). Glalie is also immune to fake out's and any random flinch cheese that come its way, and that 80/80/80 spread lets it take a decent amount of hits before fainting even with life orb damage. EQ clears Electrode before Tera, and Ice Shard can get the 2HKO on Tera Ground variants while Iron Head can bring Tera Ice variants in range for an Ice Shard to KO. It's definitely not the best attacker since 80 ATK is pretty alright for the tier, and Ice sucks defensively so you won't get many chances to switch in, but overall I think it's a solid choice to deter hazards and poke holes in teams with its coverage and power. You could also try and run a special variant of this set, but Glalie's special coverage isn't quite as strong as its physical coverage, and you do lose your priority move. It should also go without saying that relying on the BALL as your sole method of hazard removal is an awful idea. It can't do anything about them once hazards go up and it doesn't usually last very long in a game anyway since you have at most 10 attacks in you.


Floette @ Eviolite
Ability: Flower Veil
Tera Type: Grass / Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Energy Ball / Giga Drain / Psychic
- Psychic / Synthesis
- Draining Kiss / Moonblast
Floette is a bit less cut and dry than Glalie is and the set can vary a decent amount. The whole goal is becoming a nigh-unkillable late-game sweeper with Flower Veil and Tera Grass blocking status or with Tera Steel blocking Poison and providing resistances. Calm Mind is a necessity since Floette isn't very threatening without setup, and it allows you to invest in your Defense instead of Sp Atk. The rest of the moves are less set in stone though. Fairy STAB is a must, but the choice between Draining Kiss and Moonblast is entirely dependent on whether you want the recovery Draining Kiss can offer. As for the second slot, things are even more confusing. Tera Grass sets would prefer to have a Grass attack to make use of the STAB bonus, but it leaves you with far less coverage than Psychic provides. The choice between Giga Drain and Energy Ball boils down to the same issue as with your Fairy move too, and Psychic should always be picked if you aren't going Tera Grass as the coverage is much more useful than a Grass move could provide. The third move depends entirely on the rest of your options. If you have good enough recovery with Draining Kiss and/or Giga Drain, slot in Psychic to donk Poisons and hit Fire types unresisted. If you need recovery instead of more coverage, slot in Synthesis which would open you up to running the more powerful STAB options. As a fair warning for Tera Grass variants, you need to clear out all Poison and Fire types before trying to sweep. Poisons especially hit you super-effectively regardless of Tera. Tera Steel needs way less support before a sweep but still watch out for Fire-types.

And just to give general thoughts on the tier overall so this post isn't just the ramblings of a man with some very less-than-viable sets, I think Dunsparce is still a major issue in the tier with its insane bulk and set variety that leaves it difficult to check. I'm more and more open to banning it as the new additions to the tier really don't do much to Dunsparce other than Stonjourner who can't really threaten without setup, and that setup can't touch Tera Ghost anyway. It's definitely beatable with stuff like knock off and lots of offensive pressure or toxic but it drags games out on its own and is a general nuisance to the tier. I wouldn't mind a suspect or quickban for it.

Grumpig is also a pretty annoying mon in the tier right now with more special bulk than Gothitelle, a resistance to ice and fire, and more speed than any of the Psychics. It folds to physical threats, and hits very slightly lighter than Gothitelle, but it can still run holes through teams. Maybe not quickban worthy, at least to me, but I'd like to see it suspected at least. Especially since it basically killed the cool dynamic we had going with our three viable Psychic types. You can't really justify Oranguru or Hypno nearly as much as before and even Gothitelle, the one everyone said was the best of the bunch, took a hit with Grumpig dropping to the tier.

Electrode is so damn funny to me. It has a completely uncontested speed tier but a dogwater move pool that only works because of Tera. Tera sets are really difficult to predict as they both have very specific checks who get donked by the other set. It's incredibly Tera-reliant though as without Tera it can only hit with Electric and Normal moves (ignoring Foul Play), so if you use Tera on something else to check a threat or score a suprise KO, Electrode is a whole lot less threatening. It still is a super annoying mon to deal with since basically nothing will outspeed it, and even though it doesn't have the highest special attack in the world, it does have base 80, which hits hard enough. And since Electrode has virtually zero reason to consider scarf, you can toss a life orb or specs on it to buff that damage even more. Probably deserving of a quickban honestly.

The rest of the tier is pretty cool in my opinion and nothing really stands out as overtly broken like those three mons. Scovillain isn't really as great as I remember it being, Luxray isn't the best Electric type anymore, Wugtrio dies to a light breeze, Raboot is annoying but easy to KO, Banette is rad as hell and provides utility without being overcentralizing, and Stonjourner's crippling allergy to special moves prevent that from spiraling out of control. It does suck that Sudowoodo lost its spot as the de facto Rock-type in the tier, but Choice Band Head Smash hits numbers Stonjourner could only dream of and Grass and Ice coverage is always gonna be cooler than Fighting coverage, so it still has a niche here, albeit less of a staple than before the drops.

 

[Corthius]

Really cool post above, I have used offensive Glalie myself, but I sticked with a different set:
@ Choice Scarf
Ability: Inner Focus
Tera Type: Ground
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Icicle Crash
- Earthquake
- Spikes
- Switcheroo

It is basically the same idea, Glalie has a pretty potent offensive profile, which not a lot of people seem to be abusing, using it mostly as a suicide lead. Glalie can stick around for pretty long though if you play it right, and Ice/Ground is amazing coverage. Spikes are a given for me, it gives Glalie a clear edge as an offensive threat, while Switcheroo just thrives off of the metagame having basically no ways to counter it besides Sticky Hold Swalot. Inner Focus helps vs Intimidate pivoting and allows you to have a positive Persian matchup (Fake Out in general). I honestly forgot Glalie even had Switcheroo, but it is so nice to cripple potential switchins. Tera Ground not only baits in Electrode (yes you are slower than it, but a lot of players tend to lead off with their Electrode to either Taunt or break the usual Focus Sash with a Volt Switch), but also gives you a STAB Earthquake which is pretty devastating in the tier. I'm sure Life Orb is also fine. Cool set.

I LOVE Floette talk.
@ Eviolite
Ability: Flower Veil
Tera Type: Ground / Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 204 Def / 52 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Moonblast
- Tera Blast / Psychic
- Calm Mind
- Synthesis
I think it is a wonderful pokemon, with its fair weaknesses of course. I think tera Grass is a noob trap, despite how incredibly cool I found the interaction between the ability. Grass doesn't net you any useful resistance, nor does it really help you in beating anything offensively - also meaning I'd ditch Grass moves entirely.
My prefered tera types are Ground, because Fairy/Ground is really really good into the metagame, which does require you to run Tera Blast, or tera Steel, which just gains a lot of useful resistances, flipping your type chart pretty well. My prefered secondary attack here would be Psychic. Preferably, I would probaly use Floette similar to Apagogie 's lates Clefairy idea which was running Calm Mind in SS as a lategame wincon, while acting as a solid wall throughout the game. Even Moonblast CM Synth + Wish is fine as a supporter. Floette does require a lot of hazard support, as it is one of the many defensive Eviolite abuser, but I found with recent innovations like Foul Play Toedscool and an increase in Defog it isn't too bad. I like Toedscool + Fletchinder, because you give Linda the room to run Will-O-Wisp to criple Sudowoodo and Stonjourner, making it easier for Toedscool to remove hazards.
Don't put too much empathy on this btw. Hazard removal is still icredibly dire, and I have not found it to be worth using besides having to support a pokemon like Dunsparce.

 

[Tuthur]

The council decided to hold a quickban vote on Electrode and Grumpig following the multiple public requests for one in the forum, Discord server, and PS! room. Here are the results;

	Corthius	Danny	Drud	OranBerryBlissey10	Tuthur
Electrode	Ban	Ban	Ban	Ban	Ban
Grumpig	Ban	Do not ban	Do not ban	Do not ban	Do not ban

Electrode has been controversial since its introduction in the tier. Its great Speed tier allows it to outspeed the whole unboosted tier and even most Choice Scarf users that were popular before its drop like Gastly, Gothitelle, and Scovillain, that all have almost disappeared. Its Heavy-Duty Boots set has proved to be too much for the tier, with its extremely fast STAB Volt Switch it can easily force out most attackers in the tier, heavily chip the opposing team, and retain momentum. Terablast paired with tera ice lets it smack the most common Electric immunities like Toedscool and Sandygast, forcing players to resort to Pokemon like Pincurchin and Pachirisu, which aren't particularly great and can struggle against Taunt variants. Charge Beam also makes for a solid 4th move, giving Electrode enough power to clean in the late game. Electrode is just broken, forcing to use suboptimal Pokemon that Electrode can even play around due to their mediocrity and being just too good offensively with no reliable way to offensively pressure it.

Electrode has been banned from SV ZU. Tagging Kris and Marty to implement the ban.

 

[AstilCodex]

Let me be first! So first of all, this was necessary so, thanks. Now that we got the ball gone. Tier can become more stable again. I wanted to do a post of what I think this last days of ZU before shifts would be, and maybe it'll stay like this if next shifts aren't that crazy.

The most important are all the winners from Electrode ban, which can labelled in different groups:

Winners:
1. Every potential scarf user below 85 speed is viable now again. So w/e comes your mind. (Fastest unboosted is now Wugtrio)

2.

With Electrode out of the way, Dedenne comes back as the main electric Special Attacker, which was already a solid mon but got severely outclassed. Now it has the spot again, and Dedenne has some features like a useful Dark resist and access to Nuzzle for support and U-turn for avoiding Volt Absorbtion. Compared to Electrode they both have similar bulk but Dedenne is much slower, and Dazzling Gleam isn't the strongest even though it covers Dragons which aren't really relevant.

3.

The grass squad doesn't have to worry or be panic forced into tera in front of a Tera Blast Ice anymore. Meaning these 3 guys are less threatened. Even if Quilladin could take one and retaliate with Wood Hammer, its an issue it doesn't need to cover for anymore. Idk if we end up keeping Quilladin but still great to have it perform better. Same with ol Leaf and Jumpluff. Leafeon becoming even much better since it has a natural good MU against the other drops and dominant mons.

4.

bruh why we dont have toed 3d sprite yet Same situation with the grass squad, bulky grounds can perform their common role once again with more comfort than before. Checking mons like Stonj and Swalot. I'd say Sandygast got really underlooked with the drops but still solid good imo. Also it can wall Wugtrio as it would put you into +6 inmediately which is funny. And I'm sure Luxray will pop out again after Trode ban, at least a lil more.

5.

Obviously water-types take a huge advantage of Trode leaving. For Wugtrio this is huge since its now the fastest unboosted mon. Wugtrio still has to deal with its common checks which both got better (Leafeon and Lumineon) Lol. But its now not threaten offensively back except by a common scarfer or priority. Mareanie gets better even tho it sucks sry step i luv u and Lumineon would see more usage once again.

6.

Even tho they perform different roles, birds get better since now they also don't get threaten by an ohko and Fletchinder can Defog and check Grass-types like Scovillain better, whereas Murkrow still a solid special sweeper. Also you aren't force to tera ground your fletch to catch Trode off guard.

Ambivalent:

Technically, Ston top J gets better as Electrode made its scarf set useless and could RK it whenever no matter what set unless random tera ground. But if you see the other winners, every answer and check to Ston also got better, this mon still strong and top for sure, but I think the departure of Electrode would rather hinder its viability rather than boost it, in the long run.

Losers:

Self-explanatory. Little to no reason to run these guys even if Dedenne gets better again, its nowhere near as centralizing as Electrode was, therefore its viability of the absorbers should decrease once again.

----‐---------------------------------------------

On the other hand:
There's another topic I'd like to mention post-ban:

So, idk if im the only one to feel like this. Because I get why Grumpig wasn't banned but something that bothers me now, this mon is absolutely the best mon in the tier and no other comes even close to compete its place. There's no reason to not run Grumpig in any type of team. And imo, it is miles better than Goth. Speed tier, ability, access to EP and variety in support options makes this mon outclass every other Psychic-type except some wack strategies. And realistically, apart from some very specific answers that I've been testing, the way you usually handle Grumpig is with your own Grumpig, so if that isn't centralizing idk what it is.

See ya later, there's some hype matches in zu open now I wanna watch. And we'll see how shifts do us after! ^^