Announcement np: BDSP OU Suspect Process, Round 1 - Mr. Blue Sky

[Lalaya]

but I feel like it is largely this way due to the stronghold Latios has on the metagame itself.

plenty of other viable checks. tran, rachi, spdef mew.

you know, other than whatever my colleagues above said - this is literally indirectly proving Finch right

 

[QuickBH]

Those Pokemon are hard to justify even with Latios around or don't even handle it well! Finchinator is right in his analysis: if you run something defensive you have to run Blissey, Scizor, or Specially Defensive Clefable. If you use offense, you're running Ice Shard + a Steel + a revenge killer. You can think this is not so restrictive (what I disagree with), but no way you can say there are other options and mention craps like the one you mentioned.

No point in writing an essay but you're going to be running the latter two for AT LEAST Zam and D-Nite. (Gengar and Latias is mostly the same but you also handle them slightly differently) Also Ice Shard isn't a requirement at all and you just explained a normal offensive team outside of that.

 

[gaobear]

First Jirachi is a mediocre Pokemon. I've been using it a ton and it just invites everything in; Gliscor, Garchomp, Scizor, Heatran, Skarmory, Feraligatr, Manaphy... It is one of the most mediocre Stealth Rock user in the tier because it loses to every hazard remover, even if Starmie doesn't enjoy U-turn that much. Jirachi is indeed able to come on most Latios sets (LO Earthquake is dealing quite a lot), however it is a liability for a lot of balance team to have such a Pokemon that invites in every offensive threat and is just a U-turn machine.

Then Heatran. Recover Latios doesn't care at all about Heatran, especially if it has Calm Mind. Also you probably never have switched your Heatran into Surf or Earthquake Latios, this Pokemon ain't kidding.
4 Atk Life Orb Latios Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Heatran: 328-390 (84.9 - 101%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
252 SpA Choice Specs Latios Surf vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Heatran: 204-240 (52.8 - 62.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

I have no experience playing or facing Specially Defensive Mew, so I can't talk much about it. It may be an hidden gem that no one is using currently, but I would tend to say it is just a niche Pokemon at best.

Slowking is also getting owned by Recover variants of Latios due to Slowking being unable to do anything to Latios but statusing it with Thunder Wave / Yawn. While this can work, if Latios gets burned switching into your Scald or just switches out as you click Yawn, it doesn't work. Unless you run Nasty Plot or Calm Mind with Ice Beam (does anyone run that?), you're not going to threaten back Latios (0 SpA Slowking Ice Beam vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Latios: 120-142 (39.8 - 47.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO). While in return Latios does more than Regenerator heals with Thunderbolt and Draco Meteor, and can even setup on you with Calm Mind.

Those Pokemon are hard to justify even with Latios around or don't even handle it well! Finchinator is right in his analysis: if you run something defensive you have to run Blissey, Scizor, or Specially Defensive Clefable. If you use offense, you're running Ice Shard + a Steel + a revenge killer. You can think this is not so restrictive (what I disagree with), but no way you can say there are other options and mention craps like the one you mentioned.

forgot we're only allowed one team in the builder. brilliant gotcha.

As for your real points, I agree that these are all support/utility sets that don't win 1v1 against most latios variations. But I'm talking checks not counters. Point isn't to 1v1 the set. it is to take a hit, scout the set, and pivot to an answer. if you play anything besides stall i'm not sure why i have to make this point even.

if slow u-turning on a latios is bad, maybe the real 'crap' isn't rachi but the rest of the team. and we have different definitions of crap mons.

EDIT:
'check' isn't accurate and would not describe most of these--thanks finch. but do still think they give plenty of room to work with on balance/bo

 

[Finchinator]

forgot we're only allowed one team in the builder. brilliant gotcha.

As for your real points, I agree that these are all support/utility sets that don't win 1v1 against most latios variations. But I'm talking checks not counters. Point isn't to 1v1 the set. it is to take a hit, scout the set, and pivot to an answer. if you play anything besides stall i'm not sure why i have to make this point even.

if slow u-turning on a latios is bad, maybe the real 'crap' isn't rachi but the rest of the team. and we have different definitions of crap mons.

I implore you to reconsider your personal definition of check, which vastly differs from the actual definition.

 

[Eve]

Voting on Latios has begun! We'll announce the outcome as soon as a verdict is reached.

 

[Eve]

Latios remains unbanned in BDSP OU.