(Little) Things that annoy you in Pokémon

[QuentinQuonce]

I blow hot and cold on the notion of mythical Pokemon being directly given to the player rather than captured by them - sometimes certain species suit having a different OT and ID number, like Genesect having "Plasma" as its OT or Marshadow having "Mt. Tensei" as its OT as a nod to that one movie and as a way of representing a location that doesn't exist in the games.*

If I am forced to have a certain Pokemon under a fixed OT though, the least I ask is that it be a cool name and not something lame like OCT2014 or MYTHICAL22. Even if it's something relatively simple like "JUNGLE" for Zarude or something a bit more abstract, like "ALAMOS" for that one Darkrai. Even regular names are better than nothing (ex: Diancie being given out with the OT "Hope", Hoopa being given out with the OTs "Manesh", "Harry", and Alexander", and Volcanion being given out with the OT "Helen"**).

It just makes these already low-effort distributions feel even more uninspired when the OT is so blandly descriptive; the only legal way to have a shiny Zygarde in Gen VII was to have one with the extremely crap OT "2018 Legends", as opposed to Xerneas/Yveltal's very-slightly-more-imaginative "XY&Z". I know it ties together a bunch of unrelated Pokemon released under the same banner but come on GF, be a bit more interesting about it. It's not that hard. Some Pokemon distributed to commemorate the 10th anniversary had the OT 10ANNIV (or "10 ANIV") which, while also not terribly inventive, I'm rather fond of because it's a slightly playful way of working with the shorter character limit in earlier gens and matches the ID number 00010 some of them had.




*There's actually a fun extra dimension to this I hadn't really considered until a while ago: because most of the catchable mythicals (Deoxys, Celebi, Mew, Shaymin, Darkrai et al) are so rarely distributed in shiny form, nine times out of ten a shiny one is self-caught. Adds an extra incentive to having the option to catch these species yourself, which is something I appreciate

**are the latter two names references to something? I haven't seen those movies

 

[R_N]

I think Diancie's "Hope" is not meant as a name, but the concept (I think it was thematic to the movie) but also wouldn't be surprised if it was because it was a Diamond. Hope's Diamond.

I'd also not seen the Hoopa & Volcanion movies but I kind of assumed those were people/places from them but....searching around bulbapedia it doesn't seem like it at all? Nebel Volcanion is, the Nebel Plataeu was where it lived in the movie but doesn't seem the other names linked up with anything?

 

[MoonlightRose]

Liepard learns Nasty Plot by level. Liepard does not learn any special moves by level.

 

[AztecCroc]

I blow hot and cold on the notion of mythical Pokemon being directly given to the player rather than captured by them - sometimes certain species suit having a different OT and ID number, like Genesect having "Plasma" as its OT or Marshadow having "Mt. Tensei" as its OT as a nod to that one movie and as a way of representing a location that doesn't exist in the games.*

If I am forced to have a certain Pokemon under a fixed OT though, the least I ask is that it be a cool name and not something lame like OCT2014 or MYTHICAL22. Even if it's something relatively simple like "JUNGLE" for Zarude or something a bit more abstract, like "ALAMOS" for that one Darkrai. Even regular names are better than nothing (ex: Diancie being given out with the OT "Hope", Hoopa being given out with the OTs "Manesh", "Harry", and Alexander", and Volcanion being given out with the OT "Helen"**).

It just makes these already low-effort distributions feel even more uninspired when the OT is so blandly descriptive; the only legal way to have a shiny Zygarde in Gen VII was to have one with the extremely crap OT "2018 Legends", as opposed to Xerneas/Yveltal's very-slightly-more-imaginative "XY&Z". I know it ties together a bunch of unrelated Pokemon released under the same banner but come on GF, be a bit more interesting about it. It's not that hard. Some Pokemon distributed to commemorate the 10th anniversary had the OT 10ANNIV (or "10 ANIV") which, while also not terribly inventive, I'm rather fond of because it's a slightly playful way of working with the shorter character limit in earlier gens and matches the ID number 00010 some of them had.




*There's actually a fun extra dimension to this I hadn't really considered until a while ago: because most of the catchable mythicals (Deoxys, Celebi, Mew, Shaymin, Darkrai et al) are so rarely distributed in shiny form, nine times out of ten a shiny one is self-caught. Adds an extra incentive to having the option to catch these species yourself, which is something I appreciate

**are the latter two names references to something? I haven't seen those movies

Helen might be a reference to Mt. St. Helens?

 

[QuentinQuonce]

Helen might be a reference to Mt. St. Helens?

Oh that's a good point; I did wonder about "Harry" being a possible Houdini reference too.

I think Diancie's "Hope" is not meant as a name, but the concept (I think it was thematic to the movie) but also wouldn't be surprised if it was because it was a Diamond. Hope's Diamond.

I'd also not seen the Hoopa & Volcanion movies but I kind of assumed those were people/places from them but....searching around bulbapedia it doesn't seem like it at all? Nebel Volcanion is, the Nebel Plataeu was where it lived in the movie but doesn't seem the other names linked up with anything?

Oh no I know that one's not a name name. But still, it's a name (as opposed to, say, Jungle)

Liepard learns Nasty Plot by level. Liepard does not learn any special moves by level.

*cries in Gen III Volbeat*

 

[VividBunnie]

I think Diancie's "Hope" is not meant as a name, but the concept (I think it was thematic to the movie) but also wouldn't be surprised if it was because it was a Diamond. Hope's Diamond.

I assumed Hope was a reference to the allegedly cursed Hope Diamond back then given it has had ties to several French royals and that it was just them making their fun cultural references.

Since I was going to complain about something before getting caught up in reading posts, I was in middle of cleaning out my boxes for space in Violet and stumbled upon the Mew they distributed in the lead up to the Mewtwo Tera Raid and saw that despite it being given the same ID as the player, we cannot nickname it. They have done a bit with allowing us to give a nickname to a foreign mon, but only if it isn't an event distribution or having its foreign species name and honestly it seems rather silly to still impose that even with Mythicals who are coded with your Trainer ID. Even if the justification was to make them special, it comes off to me as an artifact from the past.

 

[Just A Shroom God]

I don't love "group" abilities of Ultra Beasts and Paradoxes, for a couple reasons:

A: Both Protodrive and Beast Boost are inherently offensively focused abilities. I think this is because it's incredibly hard to create an original and actually useful ability that is equally applicable to both offense and defense, and a defensively focused ability would be practically useless in-game and probably less useful in VGC, the official format.

B: They're just straight stat multipliers, without any cool gimmicks. While, yes, both abilities have some sort of precondition to the stat boost, both are rather simple preconditions and feel rather arbitrary. Neither of them really make sense design wise, either (protodrive are connected to the box legends but honestly the concept of Sun and Eterrain representing past and future is arbitrary anyway). And both feel a bit like overkill abilities: like, of course you're going to try and get KOs, and terrain/weather felt plenty strong enough without gaining a stat boost on them. I think this feeling exacerbates the feeling of power creep of a new generation, similarly to Hadron Engine, Prism Armor and Intrepid Sword.

C: They deprive these pokemon of cool, fitting abilities because of the obligation to make each set the same. This is especially frustrating because all these pokemon look so cool and unique design-wise, and I can't help but imagine cooler abilities. Like, can you imagine if Iron Hands got Iron Fist, Buzzwole got Guts, or Pheromosa got Dazzling? It would be so neat! Right now it's like if the starters were all constrained to their type abilities: Sure, they'd be functional, but they'd have way less of an identity. I can differentiate Blaziken from Infernape because one was a crazy sweeper that frequently does more to kill itself than the enemy team and one is more reliable right off the bat and has better coverage thanks to elemental punches. Similarly, I routinely forget iron thorns exists because he's just ttar but worse!

 

[Hugin]

The Eviolite and the Everstone being different items. In-game, keeping a mon NFE is annoying, with the text+cutscene after every level-up. And the Everstone stops that. Except the Everstone competes for the item slot with the Eviolite, which is the main reason to keep a mon from evolving in the first place. Just combine them and save us some trouble.

 

[Ironmage]

I don't love "group" abilities of Ultra Beasts and Paradoxes, for a couple reasons:

A: Both Protodrive and Beast Boost are inherently offensively focused abilities. I think this is because it's incredibly hard to create an original and actually useful ability that is equally applicable to both offense and defense, and a defensively focused ability would be practically useless in-game and probably less useful in VGC, the official format.

B: They're just straight stat multipliers, without any cool gimmicks. While, yes, both abilities have some sort of precondition to the stat boost, both are rather simple preconditions and feel rather arbitrary. Neither of them really make sense design wise, either (protodrive are connected to the box legends but honestly the concept of Sun and Eterrain representing past and future is arbitrary anyway). And both feel a bit like overkill abilities: like, of course you're going to try and get KOs, and terrain/weather felt plenty strong enough without gaining a stat boost on them. I think this feeling exacerbates the feeling of power creep of a new generation, similarly to Hadron Engine, Prism Armor and Intrepid Sword.

C: They deprive these pokemon of cool, fitting abilities because of the obligation to make each set the same. This is especially frustrating because all these pokemon look so cool and unique design-wise, and I can't help but imagine cooler abilities. Like, can you imagine if Iron Hands got Iron Fist, Buzzwole got Guts, or Pheromosa got Dazzling? It would be so neat! Right now it's like if the starters were all constrained to their type abilities: Sure, they'd be functional, but they'd have way less of an identity. I can differentiate Blaziken from Infernape because one was a crazy sweeper that frequently does more to kill itself than the enemy team and one is more reliable right off the bat and has better coverage thanks to elemental punches. Similarly, I routinely forget iron thorns exists because he's just ttar but worse!

We could do with more Legendary and Legendary-adjacent HAs, that's for sure. Miraidon could probably do with only getting one of Quark Drive and Electric Surge, Eternatus is stuck with the really generic Pressure, and of course there's the UBs and generic Paradoxes wanting to do something on their own. Though I will say I consider having dedicated Abilities a requirement for teams to fully commit to a weather/terrain, so Electric Terrain really needed something more than just Raichu-Alola.

 

[R_N]

Eternatus only having Pressure is so weird; or rather than its ability is Pressure at all. Of all the Pokemon to not give a new ability... Eternatus? Really?

 

[pika pal]

I find the Ultra Beasts more bizarre with a unified ability than I do the Paradoxes in that sense. Thematically I get Quark Drive with the Robot theming and I guess Sun is the most "generic" Primordial condition for them, and to an extent my skepticism is that if they gave them HA's, it'd be to throw wood on the fire of their relation to existing mons by similarity or differences (i.e. Roaring Moon doesn't benefit from Aerilate but if it doesn't have it does that speak to its Mega Salamence distance/resemblance?).

Beast Boost in terms of the lore/theme seems to relate to the Ultra Beasts being infused with energy from Ultra Space or the Wormholes, or Necrozma as was the source of things like Z-Crystals in USUM. While this makes sense for them coming out of the Wormholes into Alola... why couldn't they have different abilities in USUM where you can encounter them in the Ultra Warp Ride locations to their evidently Native Worlds? It would give a new little incentive to hunt them again in USUM, like imagine Kartana getting Hyper Cutter (relevant to VGC with Intimidate abound) or Xurkitree with Volt Absorb/Lightning Rod as examples. It'd also be a neat bit of flavor/gameplay integration since several Pokedex entries reference the idea the Ultra Beasts are common/Mundane Pokemon for their home dimension (I assume on the level of like strong-wilds like Pseudo Legendaries or at least strong 1-2 Stages like Heracross in Johto), so have more recognizable abilities would feed into that (since the Ultra Recon members give the impression Ultra Space's inhabitants are more "Blue/Green Skinned Human" type aliens than "completely non-Human builds and biology" takes, suggesting the Pokemon aren't that far removed from Earth ones either).

 

[Red violet blue]

Thing that annoys me: Chatot is missing in gen 8 and gen 9. This mon is bad competetively but soooo funny.
Here is a list of all the mons who are neither in gen 8, nor in gen 9.

 

[Ironmage]

I find the Ultra Beasts more bizarre with a unified ability than I do the Paradoxes in that sense. Thematically I get Quark Drive with the Robot theming and I guess Sun is the most "generic" Primordial condition for them, and to an extent my skepticism is that if they gave them HA's, it'd be to throw wood on the fire of their relation to existing mons by similarity or differences (i.e. Roaring Moon doesn't benefit from Aerilate but if it doesn't have it does that speak to its Mega Salamence distance/resemblance?).

Beast Boost in terms of the lore/theme seems to relate to the Ultra Beasts being infused with energy from Ultra Space or the Wormholes, or Necrozma as was the source of things like Z-Crystals in USUM. While this makes sense for them coming out of the Wormholes into Alola... why couldn't they have different abilities in USUM where you can encounter them in the Ultra Warp Ride locations to their evidently Native Worlds? It would give a new little incentive to hunt them again in USUM, like imagine Kartana getting Hyper Cutter (relevant to VGC with Intimidate abound) or Xurkitree with Volt Absorb/Lightning Rod as examples. It'd also be a neat bit of flavor/gameplay integration since several Pokedex entries reference the idea the Ultra Beasts are common/Mundane Pokemon for their home dimension (I assume on the level of like strong-wilds like Pseudo Legendaries or at least strong 1-2 Stages like Heracross in Johto), so have more recognizable abilities would feed into that (since the Ultra Recon members give the impression Ultra Space's inhabitants are more "Blue/Green Skinned Human" type aliens than "completely non-Human builds and biology" takes, suggesting the Pokemon aren't that far removed from Earth ones either).

If I remember right, both Ultra Forest and Ultra Ruin also had humanoid inhabitants, though I think the latter is also probably an exception to the UBs being encountered in their home dimensions.

 

[Sonikku A]

Despite the Ruin pokemon being a quad group, it seems the devs had some bias...

Here are the stat spread (post 1.0.1 update)

Wo Chien (Lowers Attack of others)

Chien Pao (Lowers Def of Others)

Ting Lu (Lowers Sp. Atk of others)

Chi Yu (Lowers Sp. Def of others)

The level of minmaxing varies. Wo Chien is the least minmaxxed, having no other stat over 100 outside Sp. Def, and ended up being the worst performing Ruin mon in singles given how its speed was preyed on in this power crept meta, despite ability buffing it's ok defense. Chi Yu's ability made its already insane 135 (145 pre update) base Sp Atk stronger, lending its already ok speed to sweep in Ubers. Chien Pao similarly is super fast and super strong, with the ability similarly atomizing defense. Ting Lu while not as minmaxed has physical bulk and good attack allowing it to threaten many

It's weird how seemingly unbalanced this Quad group is. Wo Chien absolutely can get bullied by Chien Pao and Chi Yu's stab and superior speed (unless using Body Press on Chien), and Ting Lu despite having good Stab against Chi Yu still loses 1v1 if Chi Yu's in sun due to outspeeding. Tera brings another can of worms in how weaknesses for Chien and Chi Yu can disappear, further disadvantaging the other Ruin mons

 

[Bakugames]

I think they didn't min max wo chien because its already a premier doubles stallmon. if it had any higher defenses itd be too viable for what they want compt to be

 

[Tan the man]

Something that bothers me is the Pokemon unite community there was a heated argument with swearing from both sides about a move and one guy told them to rot in hell all over an opinion that community is toxic

 

[pika pal]

Wo-Chien's problem is mostly its typing not being synergistic with the Dark-shared between the Quartet. The weakness to U-Turn sucks, but Grass is also a Defensive typing that HEAVILY depends on pairing with something synergistic since it introduces big weaknesses to Fire/Flying/Ice that Dark doesn't help balance out. Ting-Lu's types lack overlap as well but the Electric Immunity and Rock Resistance let it put in a lot of work defensively, as Ubers and OU have shown.

Not helping Wo-Chien there is the fact it doesn't do a great deal with its defensive build. Ting-Lu has some higher power moves or options like Ruination so the intent seems to be barreling through the opponent until it keels over due to lacking ways to get its health back. In theory Wo-Chien is supposed to be long-lived with things like Leech Seed and Grassy Terrain to gets its health back while disrupting with Knock Off and statuses until it picks the opponent apart, but since it lacks any straight recovery move the weaknesses above cause it to go down too fast to play that style. Doesn't help that its offenses are in that awkward spot of "high enough to not be a dump stat but not quite enough to be noteworthy," since it doesn't have high BP moves or coverage to compensate its only-okay stats the way some stuff like Greninja or Dragapult would (albeit they're speedy rather than tanky).

I'm not gonna knock the defenses too much because I get the sense Ting-Lu and Wo-Chien were meant to compensate their lower defenses alongside supporting a partner, the former to avoid an Achilles' Heel situation like Blissey or Kartana who die to almost any moderate attack on their bad side. Chien-Pao and Chi-Yu being offensive mean their non-benefitted offense is basically worthless to them, so Offense benefits from min-maxing more than defense does from balancing.

Wo-Chien probably would have done better if it shared Lokix's Bug/Dark typing (assuming no more abstract options like Poison/Dark), cutting its weakness count from 7 to 5 (along with losing a 4x one) and some Resistance Synergy in a Fighting Type Neutrality. Subjectively the idea of a bunch of Bugs living in the Vegetation on the Tablets also sounds suitably scary (brings to mind the Scarabs from The Mummy) while letting it retain some Grass Utility moves.

 

[ScraftyIsTheBest]

Despite the Ruin pokemon being a quad group, it seems the devs had some bias...

Here are the stat spread (post 1.0.1 update)

Wo Chien (Lowers Attack of others)
View attachment 590922

Chien Pao (Lowers Def of Others)
View attachment 590923

Ting Lu (Lowers Sp. Atk of others)
View attachment 590925
Chi Yu (Lowers Sp. Def of others)
View attachment 590924

The level of minmaxing varies. Wo Chien is the least minmaxxed, having no other stat over 100 outside Sp. Def, and ended up being the worst performing Ruin mon in singles given how its speed was preyed on in this power crept meta, despite ability buffing it's ok defense. Chi Yu's ability made its already insane 135 (145 pre update) base Sp Atk stronger, lending its already ok speed to sweep in Ubers. Chien Pao similarly is super fast and super strong, with the ability similarly atomizing defense. Ting Lu while not as minmaxed has physical bulk and good attack allowing it to threaten many

It's weird how seemingly unbalanced this Quad group is. Wo Chien absolutely can get bullied by Chien Pao and Chi Yu's stab and superior speed (unless using Body Press on Chien), and Ting Lu despite having good Stab against Chi Yu still loses 1v1 if Chi Yu's in sun due to outspeeding. Tera brings another can of worms in how weaknesses for Chien and Chi Yu can disappear, further disadvantaging the other Ruin mons

As I always say, flavor and a throughline are what matters to them.

You also have to consider that the design ethos is very distinct, like with other legendary groups and their themes. Chien Pao and Chi Yu are intentionally offensively oriented, while Wo Chien and Ting Lu are intentionally defensively oriented.

Chien Pao and Chi Yu are min-maxed offensively and have their Ruin abilities enhance their already best offensive stat because they are designed as offensive nukes, and when it comes to offense, hitting as hard as possible from one side is the best way to be a hard hitter.

Wo Chien and Ting Lu are defensively oriented and have a naturally high defensive stat and a decent other one which their abilities enhance to help their weaker defensive stat, because defensively, being able to take hits from both sides is a premium. Wo-Chien has naturally high Special Defense while its ability helps weaken physical attacks so it can take physical hits as well, Ting Lu is the reverse where it has naturally high physical Defense but has an ability that weakens special attacks. And both have defensively oriented skillsets accordingly.

Pao and Yu are broken because the metagame heavily favors offense over defense, while it's much rarer for a defensively oriented mon to be overpowered because they are passive, but there's a clear design throughline between the four that they clearly put a lot of thought into from a flavor gameplay combination standpoint.

 

[DaRotomMachine]

(Little) things that annoy you in pokemon: F2P pokemon masters edition (It still counts, right?)

1. The scouts take up so many gems and if you're F2P each scout goes by with you clicking the button once or twice and getting complete garbage sync pairs.
2. The chances of getting the featured sync pairs are really low. The fact that you spend 3,000 gems (around 19.99 dollars in real money) and get sync pairs that are absolutely not worth it can infuriate anybody who had just spent a lot of time grinding for those gems
3. The amount of scout points you need to get any sync pair is stupid. You need to spend 40,000 gems to fully max it out, and the cost of that is at least $326.50.

Those are just the main things.

 

[Axiemeister]

wo-chien suffers from its typing a lot more than from its stat distribution. a defensive mon 4x weak to u-turn?! also in singles, wo-chien lacks a clear niche to make up for its lack of instant recovery - it only gets unrealiable powders for status conditions (and no sleep), it can't set up entry hazards, it can't p-haze or even actual haze, it can't pivot, it can't boost its stats, it can set up screens but it's not fast so it has to eat an unscreened hit... it has knock off, leech seed, and that's basically it. i really think it should have gotten instant recovery

(and all of this got ninja'd while i was typing but yes i agree with the posts above mine)

 

[Worldie]

Something that bothers me is the Pokemon unite community there was a heated argument with swearing from both sides about a move and one guy told them to rot in hell all over an opinion that community is toxic

Welcome to MOBAs and online pvp in general, enjoy your stay in the shitshow these communities are.
(Have you ever been in the competitive side of this board? It's not much different.)

 

[AztecCroc]

Wo-Chien's problem is mostly its typing not being synergistic with the Dark-shared between the Quartet. The weakness to U-Turn sucks, but Grass is also a Defensive typing that HEAVILY depends on pairing with something synergistic since it introduces big weaknesses to Fire/Flying/Ice that Dark doesn't help balance out. Ting-Lu's types lack overlap as well but the Electric Immunity and Rock Resistance let it put in a lot of work defensively, as Ubers and OU have shown.

Not helping Wo-Chien there is the fact it doesn't do a great deal with its defensive build. Ting-Lu has some higher power moves or options like Ruination so the intent seems to be barreling through the opponent until it keels over due to lacking ways to get its health back. In theory Wo-Chien is supposed to be long-lived with things like Leech Seed and Grassy Terrain to gets its health back while disrupting with Knock Off and statuses until it picks the opponent apart, but since it lacks any straight recovery move the weaknesses above cause it to go down too fast to play that style. Doesn't help that its offenses are in that awkward spot of "high enough to not be a dump stat but not quite enough to be noteworthy," since it doesn't have high BP moves or coverage to compensate its only-okay stats the way some stuff like Greninja or Dragapult would (albeit they're speedy rather than tanky).

I'm not gonna knock the defenses too much because I get the sense Ting-Lu and Wo-Chien were meant to compensate their lower defenses alongside supporting a partner, the former to avoid an Achilles' Heel situation like Blissey or Kartana who die to almost any moderate attack on their bad side. Chien-Pao and Chi-Yu being offensive mean their non-benefitted offense is basically worthless to them, so Offense benefits from min-maxing more than defense does from balancing.

Wo-Chien probably would have done better if it shared Lokix's Bug/Dark typing (assuming no more abstract options like Poison/Dark), cutting its weakness count from 7 to 5 (along with losing a 4x one) and some Resistance Synergy in a Fighting Type Neutrality. Subjectively the idea of a bunch of Bugs living in the Vegetation on the Tablets also sounds suitably scary (brings to mind the Scarabs from The Mummy) while letting it retain some Grass Utility moves.

So basically Wo-Chien's main issue is the lack of Synthesis or Strength Sap.

 

[pika pal]

So basically Wo-Chien's main issue is the lack of Synthesis or Strength Sap.

I don't know about VGC standing now or in this hypothetical, but it'd catapult up to high UU/UUBL if it had either of those. Strength Sap especially is a phenomenal move with intentionally limited distribution because weakening the opponent while healing not only denies progress but makes them fodder for you to do so yourself with another set-up tool.

That's the biggest issue: Wo-Chien has the defensive Weaknesses and also very mediocre options to contribute to the match-ups it does well in compared to its compatriots.

 

[R_N]

(Little) things that annoy you in pokemon: F2P pokemon masters edition (It still counts, right?)

1. The scouts take up so many gems and if you're F2P each scout goes by with you clicking the button once or twice and getting complete garbage sync pairs.
2. The chances of getting the featured sync pairs are really low. The fact that you spend 3,000 gems (around 19.99 dollars in real money) and get sync pairs that are absolutely not worth it can infuriate anybody who had just spent a lot of time grinding for those gems
3. The amount of scout points you need to get any sync pair is stupid. You need to spend 40,000 gems to fully max it out, and the cost of that is at least $326.50.

Those are just the main things.

I dropped Masters ages ago, i think within a month, but seeing it in the background I always think of how it seems you guys also barely get any gems relative to the pulls it expects on top of this.

Also the differentiation between free and premium currency, and the pulls and guarantees associated with the latter exclusively, never sat right with me. It's not unique to it but it still feels like an extra layer of gross.

 

[Bakugames]

wo chien is already a plague with leech seed it does not need more recovery good lord