League of Legends: Let's Talk About uhhh??

[Jebus McAzn]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1eypNL1HOKQ

let's look at around 4:05

clearly it does reset autoattacks

that's not the important part though

the important part is that volibear is a melee disruptor who is meant to stay alive while dealing heavy damage. W means that you should already be building him tanky with high AA damage. E is for AoE crowd control, not damage. i don't see why you would ever build him AP when he has scaling on two of his skills which both have crappy cooldowns. the majority of his damage comes from his W and from autoattack spam. the majority of his strength in fights comes from his natural tankiness and his disruption. most of his damage is PHYSICAL. his W gets stronger the later in the fight it becomes. with that in mind, it ONLY MAKES SENSE to build him as a tanky metagolem DPS with the standard Wriggles/Atmog's/FoN or BV or Triforce or Randuin's.

 

[vonFiedler]

Hmm... the only google result I found on the matter said it didn't, usually riot is really loud about their auto-attack resets too.

Then again, the concept is pretty stale now.

 

[Wikey]

Oh god what did I do? I have had more dickweeds on my team and on the other team in the last three games than in the previous 100.

 

[masterful]

Don't worry Rodan, the meta at level 30 isn't any better...

picture

Yes, that really is a Jungle Ashe.

And a support Jarvan.

Support Jarban is not that bad. He does not need that much farm, he has 2 knockups and his ult has a lot of utility in itself. It's not that different than Leona support, which relies on CC and damage to support, and is very effective at it. While I do not condone it for every game, as I am paranoid about every lane needing to have sustain, it is certainly not unviable. Be openminded

 

[Thorns]

i pretty much always ignore what phreak does in the champion spotlight, but unfortunately everyone else who buys champions the moment they're released with rp will copy phreak exactly. i get the feeling the spotlight only had rylais so that the community wouldn't be up in flames over another 'metagolem' champion being released along the likes of jarvan, wukong, lee sin and friends. riot is perfectly aware of how volibear is supposed to be played, and i'm fairly sure they realise how powerful he is too...

there is zero sense in playing volibear with ap. his scaling is a call back to the kits of old, where amumu still has ratios on all four of his abilities (though you don't build ap on him past abyssal scepter), where ashe and tristana have ap scaling on their ultimates, where shen has three ratios, where fucking ezreal only has one ability that scales off ad despite being an ad carry.

honestly we've been caught up in the whole ad ratios thing thanks to renekton and friends, riven and graves being the worst offenders. did you know that riven has NO source of magic damage, let alone ap scaling? volibear is easily another fizz, someone who's supposed to be built tanky dps but thanks to the spotlight everyone plays him with ap items. i urge you to take a look at his kit for just one second and realise that ap makes zero sense on him.

 

[masterful]

I didn't even realize that the spotlight showe Ryali's as recommended. It is honestly one of the worst options for him to build
His roar, his only non-ult magic damage, already has a slow, and scales with a mighty .6 ratio. That and his ult possesses perhaps the greatest AP ratio of all time, 0.3 DAT RYLAI'S DAMAGE. Frozen Mallet is better in every way on him.

But Thorns, I'm sorry. AP Fizz is the best build. His scaling is actually good, and his W gives his autoattacks crazy damage even when built AP. (His E has a 1.5 ap ratio and his ult scales 1:1)

 

[Wikey]

I agree that AP Fizz is really good. Metagolem works on him because it works on any champ with a good kit. It's just retarded good on Volibear because his best skill scales on HP which is just lulzy.

On another note: Why did I ever stop playing Singed? I guess because people ban him so much in draft mode. He is just so good and so fun to play. I just went 10-5-23 with him in a 40 or so minute game. I went top with Olaf against Leona and Xin. Our Twitch gave first blood to Ashe+AD/AS Sona (who carried their team) but seconds later Olaf and I killed both Xin and Leona before level 2. I carried that advantage into a 4-0-4 start against top lane and then started roaming and feeding kills to my team. I pushed the hell out of the lanes with 257 minion kills which was like 150 more than anyone else on my team. It was a bit of a stomp with two of my teammates (Fizz and Twitch) getting 20+ kills but I attribute it 100% to me and Morgana carrying them to that. Twitch started 1-7 before Morg (also 20+ assists) started feeding him at mid because he was fleeing bot to get away from Sona. Fizz got fed by switching with Olaf and getting kills off of my Flings. Poor Olaf got stuck laning against Sona and so was a bit behind everyone else and so didn't do as much but was still a strong player.

So refreshing to end the night on a good game after the shit I dealt with earlier.

 

[Jebus McAzn]

AP Fizz is actually quite good. He gets some serious burst early and mid game, and you can transition into a tanky build late-game with Wit's End, etc.

Metagolem on Volibear, though, 100%.

 

[Mr.E]

there is zero sense in playing volibear with ap. his scaling is a call back to the kits of old, where amumu still has ratios on all four of his abilities (though you don't build ap on him past abyssal scepter), where ashe and tristana have ap scaling on their ultimates, where shen has three ratios, where fucking ezreal only has one ability that scales off ad despite being an ad carry.

honestly we've been caught up in the whole ad ratios thing thanks to renekton and friends, riven and graves being the worst offenders. did you know that riven has NO source of magic damage, let alone ap scaling? volibear is easily another fizz, someone who's supposed to be built tanky dps but thanks to the spotlight everyone plays him with ap items. i urge you to take a look at his kit for just one second and realise that ap makes zero sense on him.

Ezreal has two skills that scale off AD; Q and R scale off both offensive stats. ;[ And Talon deals zero magic damage, he's more along Riven's line of "big offenders of AD scaling" not that Graves is bad or anything.

Fizz is "supposed" to be tanky deeps? He can build that way, sure, but I'm not sure if you noticed the 1.1 AP ratio on his ultimate or not. (Protip: That's more than Volibear's entire kit.) His total AP ratios are so ridiculous that Rod of Ages should probably be your primary Health item even in a typical bruiser build and his kit provides him enough innate survivability (insane mobility and one of only two disjoints in the game) that he doesn't need to Metagolem for tankiness. AP is probably better but he's versatile and strong enough in either role to play it well.

I didn't even realize that the spotlight showe Ryali's as recommended. It is honestly one of the worst options for him to build
His roar, his only non-ult magic damage, already has a slow, and scales with a mighty .6 ratio. That and his ult possesses perhaps the greatest AP ratio of all time, 0.3 DAT RYLAI'S DAMAGE. Frozen Mallet is better in every way on him.

Rylai's adds more damage to Volibear's auto-attacks than Frozen Mallet does with his ult up... or equal if you count Atma's. -_- That doesn't even factor in that it's AoE damage and also scales his E, also AoE. Frozen Mallet slows a single target more but Rylai's AoE disruption is arguably better and it gives you hundreds more total damage output in a teamfight. The only reason Frozen Mallet is even an option is because it gives +200 HP but it doesn't come near closing the damage gap (on W) and that health is less significant to survivability when Warmog's already provides 1400 bonus HP. Mallet also costs 145g more.

Only AP item worth building on him, though. And Trinity Force is terrible on him, fuck off metagolem.

 

[Minwu]

http://i226.photobucket.com/albums/dd294/Minwu_2007/jannascore.png


Been playing Janna some more, I went duo bot with Wukong and won our lane pretty hard, helping Ashe go in a couple times for very brief gank kills with the knock up and AD steroids. It's also pretty good fun to E bait/CC from behind walls and brush. We were so organized in teamfights that we managed to shrug off an unlucky Baron steal with them all alive.




edit - Where do you guys think the best CV and ward spots are now with the jungle change? With the ganking and CV nerfs do you think supports might start using different summoner spells?

 

[pookar]

hmm thanks to minwu im now pondering the effectiveness of CV once again. i like warding enemy blue if i happen to gank bot but knowing where the jungler is doesnt seem extremely important anymore because.. well im not actually sure.. it seems less important though

 

[masterful]

Rylai's adds more damage to Volibear's auto-attacks than Frozen Mallet does with his ult up... or equal if you count Atma's. -_- That doesn't even factor in that it's AoE damage and also scales his E, also AoE. Frozen Mallet slows a single target more but Rylai's AoE disruption is arguably better and it gives you hundreds more total damage output in a teamfight. The only reason Frozen Mallet is even an option is because it gives +200 HP but it doesn't come near closing the damage gap (on W) and that health is less significant to survivability when Warmog's already provides 1400 bonus HP. Mallet also costs 145g more.

Only AP item worth building on him, though. And Trinity Force is terrible on him, fuck off metagolem.

Yes because everyone knows it is worth building an item on a champ where his only skill that benefits from it is his fucking 90-sec cooldown ult (unless you built it last). Yeah...you have fun with your AoE slow, and I'll use the AoE slow he already fucking has. Literally the entire time his ult is cooling, Rylai's is only worth the health it gives (hint:that hp is not worth 3105 gold, if you were wondering) therefore not worth it. Nobody should ever build Rylai's on him, and I don't quite understand how you can argue the opposite. Also, Mallet even gives him more hp, which scales with his W and his passive, and applies a slow to his minifling, which is very helpful, as forcing someone out of position and slowing them at the same time is obviously a good combination.

 

[mmmonal]

I know this new game, it's just fantastic :x

 

[Jebus McAzn]

i mean you don't even need mallet or rylai's on him. he has a movespeed buff, you can always use ghost, and you should be picking someone else that can slow enemies anyway. red buff is really good on him. no need to invest into a ton of health past atmog's.

 

[masterful]

i mean you don't even need mallet or rylai's on him. he has a movespeed buff, you can always use ghost, and you should be picking someone else that can slow enemies anyway. red buff is really good on him. no need to invest into a ton of health past atmog's.

He honestly scales best with health+other stat items, as it greatly boosts his W, imo his actual OP skill, and his passive, imo one of the most overpowered passives in the gam. Health just does too much for him to be ignored. Having Frozen mallet is great, as it scales perfectly on him and allows him to be red buff independent (Jebus, your AD carry should usually have red buff, not your top laner or jungle, honestly) and gives him enough damage to make focusing him in a fight worth it. He is a perfect tanky deeps, don't ignore the tanky part because you don't like building health items or whatever

 

[Thorns]

http://i226.photobucket.com/albums/dd294/Minwu_2007/jannascore.pngedit - Where do you guys think the best CV and ward spots are now with the jungle change? With the ganking and CV nerfs do you think supports might start using different summoner spells?

cv blue every time because jungle pathing has become less predictable and you still want to know if your jungler can invade red because red is easier to take and crippling if you manage to steal it. don't bother with other camps

if their blue is down just cv their red otherwise save it for something else

cv/heal is pretty good on every support bar alistar who needs his fqw combo, of course you have no flash which hurts so cv/flash is still viable on the supports that can heal, or even heal/flash if the enemy jungler isn't too good of a ganker (though i wouldn't worry about fiddles, warwick and amumu because they are very weak this patch)

 

[Jebus McAzn]

Red buff is fine on your ranged AD carry but in all honestly, I would usually much rather have it on my melee DPS. Red buff lets a melee DPS stick on a target and disrupt quite a lot - the ranged carry should be relying on positioning, movespeed from Phantom Dancer, and her teammates to prevent taking much damage. I prefer seeing red buff on a Skarner, Udyr, or Gangplank than on a Caitlyn, Vayne, or Kog'Maw.

 

[pookar]

i dont really get riot about this jungle sure "more ppl can jungle" but it nerfed those slow junglers like thorns said.. and just created an even bigger distance from "udyr nocturne lee sin trundle rammus" to second tier junglers just because of camp clear time

 

[Mr.E]

At the point in the game that you're even bother building a Rylai's/Mallet on Volibear, your ult should be up for every teamfight and so the cooldown is largely irrelevant. Hundreds of damage and more AoE disruption > 200 health.

"Just get red buff" is the new "I don't need CDR because lolbluebuff." :[

 

[masterful]

At the point in the game that you're even bother building a Rylai's/Mallet on Volibear, your ult should be up for every teamfight and so the cooldown is largely irrelevant. Hundreds of damage and more AoE disruption > 200 health.

"Just get red buff" is the new "I don't need CDR because lolbluebuff." :[

the advantages of Mallet are hardly 200 health, and you know that. Just accept that having a constant slow on your attacks, which you will always be applying, as you are melee. is better than an AoE slow on your ULT which isn't even that great (slowing 3 or 4 people is not that amazing when you can already do that easily with roar)

Jebus, to each his own. I much prefer having the melees be running their own form of gap closer, of which almost all have. It is hard to be a melee champ if you need red buff to stick on someone (why many tanky deeps have mobility moves to stick on people already), and applying true damage and slow to a large portion of their team from a distance is too good for me to ignore.

 

[Jebus McAzn]

Jebus, to each his own. I much prefer having the melees be running their own form of gap closer, of which almost all have. It is hard to be a melee champ if you need red buff to stick on someone (why many tanky deeps have mobility moves to stick on people already), and applying true damage and slow to a large portion of their team from a distance is too good for me to ignore.

regardless of any kind of gap closer you have, a slow is typically more useful for the melee DPS who is trying to deal as much damage as possible before dying, compared to the ranged DPS who wants to take potshots from a safe range without endangering his or her own life. all mobility problems aside, it's still possible to kite a melee DPS with a gap closer - but this becomes far harder if he/she has red buff.

 

[masterful]

regardless of any kind of gap closer you have, a slow is typically more useful for the melee DPS who is trying to deal as much damage as possible before dying, compared to the ranged DPS who wants to take potshots from a safe range without endangering his or her own life. all mobility problems aside, it's still possible to kite a melee DPS with a gap closer - but this becomes far harder if he/she has red buff.

AD champs do much more damage than the melees unless you are playing Tryndamere. For that reason alone I see little reason to give the true damage and slow to the one who is doing less damage

 

[connoisseur]

Jungle Poppy is terrific.

 

[LonelyNess]

AD champs do much more damage than the melees unless you are playing Tryndamere. For that reason alone I see little reason to give the true damage and slow to the one who is doing less damage

If you give the redbuff to the melee, then they are a larger threat, meaning that they are more likely to get targeted rather than walked right past for your squishy ass. You want as many people with "notable" damage as possible, to take pressure off the carries in the back.

 

[Yuggles]

If you give the redbuff to the melee, then they are a larger threat, meaning that they are more likely to get targeted rather than walked right past for your squishy ass. You want as many people with "notable" damage as possible, to take pressure off the carries in the back.

thats why they give red to hotshot chogath every time

you have to ignore him but you cant afford to