Pokémon Gardevoir

[Kurona]

why did I stop receiving alerts on my own thread .-.

And yeah, Shadow Ball is OO for a reason. It can't reliably check Metagross because of the bullet punch tho.

 

[boltsandbombers]

Bullet Punch isnt that common [mash / zen headbutt / hammer arm / gk is the most common and effective moveset], but assuming Metagross has mega evolved already it just outspeeds and OHKOs anyways. Shadow Ball also hits Jirachi, which otherwise is a full counter to Mega Gardevoir. Too lazy to calc but I think it can 2HKO after some prior damage.

 

[TMan87]

Mega Gardevoir seems to have a tough time with MegaGross coming back AND MZor rising in usage due to being the only real counter to it...
Should I pair her up with a physical wallbreaker like Victini or Kyu-B ?

 

[firehusky]

Will-o-Wisp is a great option on mgarde if you feel those two are threatening, if you catch them on the switch they're basically screwed. Pairing it up with something like Victini seems ideal, as it can counter mgross while also checking mzor.

 

[TMan87]

Will-o-Wisp is a great option on mgarde if you feel those two are threatening, if you catch them on the switch they're basically screwed. Pairing it up with something like Victini seems ideal, as it can counter mgross while also checking mzor.

Thanks for replying !
Victini sounds good indeed, I suppose the CB set could work well as a wallbreaker ?

 

[firehusky]

Yes, CB and Scarf are all great options on Victini, although it'd probably go with scarf to better check mega metagross, (Only has to take 1 hit on the switch instead of 2) while also being able to grab momentum with u-turn.

 

[Voltage]

In addition to Talonflame abd Victini, Heatran is probably one of THE BEST partners for M-Gardy. It can cone in on most steel types that already threaten Gardy, like Ferro, Sciz (since it almost never runs Superpower any more) and even other Heatrans (given its running Earth Power or Roar) and take plenty of hits. In addition, Hardy covers a lot of the crippling Fighting and Ground weaknesses Heartland faces on a regular basis. In short, it's really hard to go wrong with M-Gardy+Tran.

 

[TheBraveGallade]

I thought it was worth noting that Shadow Ball is really only effective if you catch it on the switch or if you're Mega'd and Metagross isn't. Not saying that Shadow Ball doesn't have uses, but just wanted to emphasize that it does require finesse since if Mega Metagross is mega'd and is relatively healthy, you have to predict the switch and hit it with Shadow Ball or it basically comes in for free.


It has 85 base attack. Why would you use Explosion even if you could? We could theorymon what-ifs about a special variant of explosion, but these threads really aren't for theorizing new attacks or move pools.

Umm talomflame has a lower attack stat than garde. Just saying. And explosion used to be used on everything before its nerf. Going kamikaze on a dnite would be nice Since hyper voice dies not ohko...

 

[Kurona]

Umm talomflame has a lower attack stat than garde. Just saying. And explosion used to be used on everything before its nerf. Going kamikaze on a dnite would be nice Since hyper voice dies not ohko...

It's still not capitalizing on Gardevoir's strengths and any physical attack from it will be very weak. Talonflame can just get away with it by compensating with a fantastic offensive typing with the right moves to complement that, priority, speed, and ease of boosting. If it didn't have Gale Wings it likely would not be anywhere near OU.

 

[TMan87]

Yes, CB and Scarf are all great options on Victini, although it'd probably go with scarf to better check mega metagross, (Only has to take 1 hit on the switch instead of 2) while also being able to grab momentum with u-turn.

Currently testing CB, and Victini has the bulk to come in on every attack MegaGross can use (bar EQ, that is) without a 2HKO, even with rocks up. Plus it wallbreaks like a boss.
I may give the scarf set a shot though, if I need to RK better.

 

[Machi]

Umm talomflame has a lower attack stat than garde. Just saying. And explosion used to be used on everything before its nerf. Going kamikaze on a dnite would be nice Since hyper voice dies not ohko...

Wouldn't you just be better off using Memento or Destiny Bond at this point? Since bear in mind Talonflame actually invests in attack, whereas MGarde does not and runs a negative nature, so that puts a damper on the damage output. Moreover, Memento and Destiny Bond are a better catch all move, or if you're really intent on fainting healing wish works out too.

 

[TheBraveGallade]

Wouldn't you just be better off using Memento or Destiny Bond at this point? Since bear in mind Talonflame actually invests in attack, whereas MGarde does not and runs a negative nature, so that puts a damper on the damage output. Moreover, Memento and Destiny Bond are a better catch all move, or if you're really intent on fainting healing wish works out too.

True. Healing wish is better.
funny that will o wisp cripples every garde check not named heatran.... to the point that focus blast kills scizor at 50% health

 

[TheBraveGallade]

I just found something important:
most bulky scizor run 84 or 92 atk adamant.
At this range bullet punch does 70% to 0 defence/hp invested garde.
another thing to note is you can swich into superpower roost 3 attacks scizor.

 

[Sanger Zonvolt]

I just found something important:
most bulky scizor run 84 or 92 atk adamant.
At this range bullet punch does 70% to 0 defence/hp invested garde.
another thing to note is you can swich into superpower roost 3 attacks scizor.

84 Atk Technician Mega Scizor Bullet Punch vs. 0 HP / 24 Def Mega Gardevoir: 270-318 (97.4 - 114.8%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO

I think you forgot to use Mega Scizor. Besides, even if you switch in, what are going to do when it can 2HKO you with a priority move with almost no attack investment? You're dead in just about any situation.

EDIT @ Below:

Um i said come in on a SUPERPOWER.
and besides most people use regular scizor instead. just like ttar.

No, you said it can switch into Superpower Roost 3 Attacks Scizor. You didn't say a thing about which move it switches into. Also:
96+ Atk Mega Scizor Superpower vs. 0 HP / 24 Def Mega Gardevoir: 49-58 (17.6 - 20.9%) -- possible 5HKO
-1 96+ Atk Technician Mega Scizor Bullet Punch vs. 0 HP / 24 Def Mega Gardevoir: 200-236 (72.2 - 85.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

At best you'll get off a burn or a Focus Blast. I'd say more, but I think that Force Majeure and DarkNostalgia pretty much covered everything else.

 

[TheBraveGallade]

84 Atk Technician Mega Scizor Bullet Punch vs. 0 HP / 24 Def Mega Gardevoir: 270-318 (97.4 - 114.8%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO

I think you forgot to use Mega Scizor. Besides, even if you switch in, what are going to do when it can 2HKO you with a priority move with almost no attack investment? You're dead in just about any situation.

Um i said come in on a SUPERPOWER.
and besides most people use regular scizor instead. just like ttar.

 

[Force Majeure]

Um i said come in on a SUPERPOWER.
and besides most people use regular scizor instead. just like ttar.

252+ Atk Choice Band Scizor Superpower vs. 0 HP / 24 Def Mega Gardevoir: 73-87 (26.3 - 31.4%) -- guaranteed 4HKO

That's still quite a bit of damage for a resisted hit, and it adds up really quickly when you don't have Leftovers, especially considering that the user of the Scizor will switch next turn, guaranteed.

Aside from hitting it as it switches in with Will-o-Wisp, Mega Gardevoir has no business being around Scizor, Mega or no, unless it's Choice locked into Superpower and you're running a bulkier Wish variant. You're going to get mauled if it happens to be a Mega Scizor (which is really common right now) regardless so it's better to switch off to something that can handle the worst-case scenario (usually Mega Scizor getting a SD on the switch) rather than keep Gardevoir in to be horribly crippled at best. If you can switch Gardevoir in on a Superpower from a CB set that's great, but a good user of a CB set will mostly be using U-Turn until later in the game to gain momentum and soften targets for faster sweepers.

I'm building around Scarf Gardevoir right now to see how it fares, and it's not all that bad. Trace is a really nice ability to have for a scarfer, especially against Sand Rush Excadrill. The coverage of Psyshock, Moonblast, and Focus Blast is pretty comprehensive, and 125 SpA is barely enough to make it work. I haven't taken it above ~1400 on the ladder though, so I'm not sure if it really has legs although it does trip opponents up a little in Team Preview, especially if it's paired with something like Mega Gyarados that is also viable in its base form.

 

[DarkNostalgia]

That's not true, Mega Scizor is used more. Please use statistics next time before making pointless arguments.

Scizorite 54.713% | | Leftovers 17.630% | | Choice Band 16.605% | | Shed Shell 4.539% | | Life Orb 2.416% | | Other 4.097%

 

[Kurona]

Scarf Gardevoir is honestly one of those things I want to see more of because to me it's just really damn cool. The biggest problem imo is that it loses out on a pretty crucial speed tier just by one point -- Jolly Beedrillite and Timid Sceptilinite outspeed while +1 Mega Gyarados does the same thing; which is really important as it'd adore the chance to kill them.
However, I still think it has a lot of potential. As Force Majeure said it is really damn good at revenging weather sweepers, especially Excadrill.

 

[TheBraveGallade]

252+ Atk Choice Band Scizor Superpower vs. 0 HP / 24 Def Mega Gardevoir: 73-87 (26.3 - 31.4%) -- guaranteed 4HKO

That's still quite a bit of damage for a resisted hit, and it adds up really quickly when you don't have Leftovers, especially considering that the user of the Scizor will switch next turn, guaranteed.

Aside from hitting it as it switches in with Will-o-Wisp, Mega Gardevoir has no business being around Scizor, Mega or no, unless it's Choice locked into Superpower and you're running a bulkier Wish variant. You're going to get mauled if it happens to be a Mega Scizor (which is really common right now) regardless so it's better to switch off to something that can handle the worst-case scenario (usually Mega Scizor getting a SD on the switch) rather than keep Gardevoir in to be horribly crippled at best. If you can switch Gardevoir in on a Superpower from a CB set that's great, but a good user of a CB set will mostly be using U-Turn until later in the game to gain momentum and soften targets for faster sweepers.

I'm building around Scarf Gardevoir right now to see how it fares, and it's not all that bad. Trace is a really nice ability to have for a scarfer, especially against Sand Rush Excadrill. The coverage of Psyshock, Moonblast, and Focus Blast is pretty comprehensive, and 125 SpA is barely enough to make it work. I haven't taken it above ~1400 on the ladder though, so I'm not sure if it really has legs although it does trip opponents up a little in Team Preview, especially if it's paired with something like Mega Gyarados that is also viable in its base form.

Also lols for hp fire with traced technitian^^