Lele does not get Mystical Fire
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DLC2 Crown Tundra Speculation Thread [SPOILERS]
- Thread starter Finchinator
- Start date
- Status
Aight imma just toss my bs theorycrafting into the ring while its hot
I think naganadel is going to be a massive threat even without the use of z-moves to help bolster its ability pop off with beastboost and sweep
Naga has still got it checkmate coverage of stab dragon+poison with fire moves to deal with steel types
With the addition of spikes to its moveset it can pressure typical switch-ins and chip mons into ko range to help it pop off with beast boost
This is the set im going to put forward as being likely to abuse these traits best
Naganadel @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dragon Pulse
- Sludge Wave
- Flamethrower
- Spikes
Your standard coverage for naganadel to force mixups for what your opponent switchs into the thing. Mainly naganadel wants to spam its stab dragon moves because the two types that would switch into its dragon moves being fairy and steel get bopped by its stab poison and fire coverage moves respectively
Genrally once there are no resists for either dragon or poison on the other team you can start blowing through the other team with whatever uncontested stab you have while being aided by beast boost to boost spatk to help ko'ing bulkier unchipped mons and scarf to give naganadel the speed to outrun the majority of ou bar other scarf users.
Spikes help naganadel wear down switch-ins and bring mons into range for ko's and helping naganadel work as a whole to revenge kill or sweep.
Notably spikes also chip heatran who would otherwise blank the set. If heatran is running heavy duty boots it will be immune to spikes but prone to chip from switching into dragon pulse or just taking hits from naganadels teammates due to it lacking passive recovery from leftovers.
Basically this set works like a weird hybrid of scarf kart while using spikes similar to ash gren in the previous gen.
Blissy with heavy duty boots is basically the only hard counter to this set because other checks end up being prone to chip damage over time.
I hope this can be of value to anyone
-salt
I think naganadel is going to be a massive threat even without the use of z-moves to help bolster its ability pop off with beastboost and sweep
Naga has still got it checkmate coverage of stab dragon+poison with fire moves to deal with steel types
With the addition of spikes to its moveset it can pressure typical switch-ins and chip mons into ko range to help it pop off with beast boost
This is the set im going to put forward as being likely to abuse these traits best
Naganadel @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dragon Pulse
- Sludge Wave
- Flamethrower
- Spikes
Your standard coverage for naganadel to force mixups for what your opponent switchs into the thing. Mainly naganadel wants to spam its stab dragon moves because the two types that would switch into its dragon moves being fairy and steel get bopped by its stab poison and fire coverage moves respectively
Genrally once there are no resists for either dragon or poison on the other team you can start blowing through the other team with whatever uncontested stab you have while being aided by beast boost to boost spatk to help ko'ing bulkier unchipped mons and scarf to give naganadel the speed to outrun the majority of ou bar other scarf users.
Spikes help naganadel wear down switch-ins and bring mons into range for ko's and helping naganadel work as a whole to revenge kill or sweep.
Notably spikes also chip heatran who would otherwise blank the set. If heatran is running heavy duty boots it will be immune to spikes but prone to chip from switching into dragon pulse or just taking hits from naganadels teammates due to it lacking passive recovery from leftovers.
Basically this set works like a weird hybrid of scarf kart while using spikes similar to ash gren in the previous gen.
Blissy with heavy duty boots is basically the only hard counter to this set because other checks end up being prone to chip damage over time.
I hope this can be of value to anyone
-salt
hmm colour me mistaken on both account, not sure why I thought that. Been a while since i checked out their entire moveset i'll chop it down to that lol,
Might it be wiser to do tier shifts on CT launch day instead? Then the first shift after CT be in a month from then or 1st of December.
Or do we want the very large, chaotic tier shift in November?
Or do we want the very large, chaotic tier shift in November?
I say the large chaotic tier shift because otherwise you're gonna have stuff like Sceptile, Jynx, Walrein, Audino and more stuck in OU for a couple months. Or even stuff like Entei and Articuno which while useful in the lower tiers suck in the powercrept OU and would hate being there for an extra amount of time.
Speculation thread? Bring it on!
THE TAPUS
: As a Natdex and USUM player, this is the Pokemon I am most excited about. It can attack on both sides! No longer does it have to be outclassed by Dragapult or Rillaboom as a pivot. Tapu Koko finally got the Play Rough it wanted for so long, as well as Close Combat. This means it can finally utilize its higher attack stat with Wild Charge, Play Rough, Close Combat, U-Turn, and Roost (because Wild Charge recoil is quite nasty). On the other hand, Koko gets Rising Voltage in Electric Terrain, which hits for absolutely ridiculous power. I can't even imagine how hard this thing hits under Specs. And of course, there is always its old standby Volt Switch. I think it will be absolutely great, if not just quickbanned. Looking forward to using it in National Dex (and trash every Dragapult that it meets on the way)!
: Remember Specs Lele in USUM OU? It's back, but with Expanding Force! This thing will stupidly powerful with Specs and Psychic Terrain. Quickban for sure.
: Bulu managed to get Grassy Glide and can now compete with Rillaboom. On the one hand, Bulu is stronger, have better bulk and recovery in Horn Leech, and Grassy Glide is still great priority (and now it gets Close Combat --- not to mention Play Rough ---, so it doesn't have to rely on Superpower). On the other hand, Rillaboom is slightly faster and gets U-Turn. I feel that Rillaboom will be slightly better, but Bulu will still be great, and Grassy Terrain-boosted Wood Hammer off a base 130 Attack will still hit hard (meaning it will be the better wallbreaker). Choice Band Tapu Bulu is back in buisness, baby!
: Tapu Fini. I feel like it is the odd one out of the bunch (although it certainly look less odd than the other ones. I mean, Koko's got a mohawk, Bulu gets a bull sombero and a bell for a tail, and Lele is basically a head stuck out of a basket). While the other three boasts offensive prowess, Tapu Fini is more defensively oriented (not to mention its terrain doesn't give any offensive bonus but weakens a certain type). I feel like while it is relatively the "worst" of the Tapus, it won't be bad. It provides valuable support to the team with Defog, Taunt/Knock Off, Nature's Madness, and Misty Terrain. Water/Fairy is also arguably the best typing out of the four. I think that Fini will be great with its old set from USUM.
THE NEW POKEMON
Ok, so we have three birbs, two regis, and Galarian Slowking. Let's get to it.
Galarian Articuno: I think a lot of people underestimated Competative on Galarian Articuno. It might seem trashy until you realize that the main stat-lowering move is Defog, which happens to be everywhere. Sure, Psychic/Flying is a trashy typing, and it's signature move isn't exactly great, but I think this might have potential to be a breaker that can take advantage of Defog. I mean, look at this thing. Does it look like it might get Nasty Plot? It have a evil look, dark color palette, the whole package. I'm betting that it gets either NP or CM to complement Competative. Now I'm just hoping that they give it a good SpA stat (and some decent speed). Sure, it won't be the best (probably UU or lower), but it will find its niches, especially with so many moves having a secondary effect that lowers a stat. (Also it's main competition in Tapu Lele is gonna get banned)
Galarian Zapdos: Physical Galarian Articuno (with defiant) with a much, much better typing. I think it's gonna be good. Thunderous Kick seems nice for wallbreaking, and it's really likely that it gets Swords Dance. Probably is gonna get a good Atk stat. I think it's gonna be good for offensive teams. Let's just hope that it gets good speed.
Galarian Moltres: Really, really looking forward this. This just look like it plot nasty things in its spare time, which complements Berserk quite nicely, as after a NP nothing will want to hit it unless they can KO or is named Chansey/Blissey. It will also probably get a good SpA, and it can probably cope with a lower speed in order to wallbreak. I think it will be a good wallbreaker, though idk if it will be OU or lower.
Regiekeli: Alright, lets get real: there's no way they are giving one of them 200 Atk or SpA. So I'm expecting something like 80/75/75/150/100/100 or 80/75/75/150/75/125 for this (just a guess). Thunder Cage is basically an Electric-type Magma Storm, which can definately be useful. It's either going to get a great offensive stat or a great speed. Predicting UU or OU depending on the stat spread (though if it gets the stat spread I guessed and Transistor is actually useful, OU or BL for sure, because it's got great power and good speed but have to compete with Koko in OU). Also I'm pretty excited to find out what it's signature ability does.
Regidrago: Same thing here, there's no way it's gonna get a 200 Atk. Expecting something like a 80/150/100/75/100/75 or 80/75/100/150/100/75 stat spread for this thing. Dragon Energy + Choice Scarf is just plain scary (as long as it hits off a decent attack stat!), and mono-Dragon isn't the worst typing in the world. I'm guessing OU if Dragon Energy hits off a decent attack stat (unless Dragon's Maw turns out to be very trashy).
Galarian Slowking: Definately guessing a stat spread of 95/100/70/100/95/30 (mirroring Galarian Slowbro's). Curious Medicine seens like a wonderful ability, as it is basically a Haze on switchin. It can completely nullify setup sweepers like Kommo-o and Volcarona just by switching in. I feel like that it will be very, very annoying to play against if you are using setup sweepers. It also probably have Toxic and maybe some hazards. On the other hand, Galarian Slowbro's stats are a bit underwelming, and I think Galarian Slowking will be the same. Still, I think it's gonna make my list of "top 5 most annoying Pokemon to play against", and since Chansey, Toxapex, and Mega Sableye are on that list...
THE TAPUS
THE NEW POKEMON
Ok, so we have three birbs, two regis, and Galarian Slowking. Let's get to it.
Galarian Articuno: I think a lot of people underestimated Competative on Galarian Articuno. It might seem trashy until you realize that the main stat-lowering move is Defog, which happens to be everywhere. Sure, Psychic/Flying is a trashy typing, and it's signature move isn't exactly great, but I think this might have potential to be a breaker that can take advantage of Defog. I mean, look at this thing. Does it look like it might get Nasty Plot? It have a evil look, dark color palette, the whole package. I'm betting that it gets either NP or CM to complement Competative. Now I'm just hoping that they give it a good SpA stat (and some decent speed). Sure, it won't be the best (probably UU or lower), but it will find its niches, especially with so many moves having a secondary effect that lowers a stat. (Also it's main competition in Tapu Lele is gonna get banned)
Galarian Zapdos: Physical Galarian Articuno (with defiant) with a much, much better typing. I think it's gonna be good. Thunderous Kick seems nice for wallbreaking, and it's really likely that it gets Swords Dance. Probably is gonna get a good Atk stat. I think it's gonna be good for offensive teams. Let's just hope that it gets good speed.
Galarian Moltres: Really, really looking forward this. This just look like it plot nasty things in its spare time, which complements Berserk quite nicely, as after a NP nothing will want to hit it unless they can KO or is named Chansey/Blissey. It will also probably get a good SpA, and it can probably cope with a lower speed in order to wallbreak. I think it will be a good wallbreaker, though idk if it will be OU or lower.
Regiekeli: Alright, lets get real: there's no way they are giving one of them 200 Atk or SpA. So I'm expecting something like 80/75/75/150/100/100 or 80/75/75/150/75/125 for this (just a guess). Thunder Cage is basically an Electric-type Magma Storm, which can definately be useful. It's either going to get a great offensive stat or a great speed. Predicting UU or OU depending on the stat spread (though if it gets the stat spread I guessed and Transistor is actually useful, OU or BL for sure, because it's got great power and good speed but have to compete with Koko in OU). Also I'm pretty excited to find out what it's signature ability does.
Regidrago: Same thing here, there's no way it's gonna get a 200 Atk. Expecting something like a 80/150/100/75/100/75 or 80/75/100/150/100/75 stat spread for this thing. Dragon Energy + Choice Scarf is just plain scary (as long as it hits off a decent attack stat!), and mono-Dragon isn't the worst typing in the world. I'm guessing OU if Dragon Energy hits off a decent attack stat (unless Dragon's Maw turns out to be very trashy).
Galarian Slowking: Definately guessing a stat spread of 95/100/70/100/95/30 (mirroring Galarian Slowbro's). Curious Medicine seens like a wonderful ability, as it is basically a Haze on switchin. It can completely nullify setup sweepers like Kommo-o and Volcarona just by switching in. I feel like that it will be very, very annoying to play against if you are using setup sweepers. It also probably have Toxic and maybe some hazards. On the other hand, Galarian Slowbro's stats are a bit underwelming, and I think Galarian Slowking will be the same. Still, I think it's gonna make my list of "top 5 most annoying Pokemon to play against", and since Chansey, Toxapex, and Mega Sableye are on that list...
View attachment 283195
My Predictions
My Predictions
- Stall is taking over once the metagame starts to develop to deal with all the broken tapus and Ultra Beasts
- AV mag is going to have 70% usage for the volt swicth momentum and the ability to check every special attacker
- Blaziken will be managable along with Cinderace, unsure about other past ubers (please quickban Vish)
NOOOOOOOOO
I'm going back to my hole in USUM Ubers with sledgehammers like Kyogre to smash stall.
EDIT: Sorry to stall players. Stall is just a pain to play against.
My analysis on Bulu vs Boom:
Advantages of rillaboom: U-Turn, Slightly higher attack, Knock off for all of the inevitable hdb spam, acrobatics for amoongus and tangrowth. IF bulu doesnt get hh for heatran, rillaboom has hh over it.
Advantages of Bulu: Better fighting move, fairy stab, horn leech for longevity, better special bulk.
Rillaboom will likely be a choice/setup mon, while bulu will take probably advantage of its bulk and horn leech to run assault vest
Advantages of rillaboom: U-Turn, Slightly higher attack, Knock off for all of the inevitable hdb spam, acrobatics for amoongus and tangrowth. IF bulu doesnt get hh for heatran, rillaboom has hh over it.
Advantages of Bulu: Better fighting move, fairy stab, horn leech for longevity, better special bulk.
Rillaboom will likely be a choice/setup mon, while bulu will take probably advantage of its bulk and horn leech to run assault vest
So now that we know the horses are Ice and Ghost types respectively and we can safely assume the calryex forms are either ice/Psychic + Ghost/psychic Or grass/Ice + grass/ghost .
How do you think they’ll shake out competitively
How do you think they’ll shake out competitively
Hard to say based on stat spreads, we can expect the horses to be fast but considering Mudsdale is a horse and slow af I’m unsure. We don’t know their abilities, stats, or move pools and have nothing to go off of unlike the Regis and galar birds which are bound to have similar stats to others like them. All I can say is that mono ice seems pretty bad for one of the horses, ghost has been a good type this gen so maybe the ghost horse will find success, we will have to wait until we find out more
What horses?
-Bulu have base 130 Atk while Rillaboom have base 125
-Last I checked Bulu indeed does not have hh so there's that
-They both have Close Combat (so idk what fighting move you are talking about here)
-Yea I think Rilla will still be the setup mon of choice because it is slightly faster but I think Bulu will perform better as a band breaker because it is slightly stronger (and it have megahorn for Tang)
Rillaboom doesn't have Close Combat - it only has Superpower, which is less spammable because it drops attack.
Personally, I think you have it the wrong way round - Bulu's extra longevity will most likely make it very good at setting up and breaking, whereas Rillaboom's access to highly spammable moves Knock Off and U-Turn will probably make Band a better option for it.
Ah, didn't know that. I assumed it had close combat because of those gorilla arms. Probably shouldn't do this again.
Yeah, you make a good point. Personally I'm just happy that Bulu + Heatran is back.
IBM
Banned deucer.
-Heatran is a great stall breaker, not a stall mon itself.
-Mag used calm mind draining kiss when it was legal to destroy stall.
-Every ultra beast destroys stall, Kart, sub blace, phero, naga
-Cinderace
-Vish
-Tapus with broken new terrain moves
I really don’t see how you say that mons coming back that delete stall would make stall more popular
It doesnt have u-turn, which isnt good for band. Imo it should use hornleech+glide defensive sets to take advantage of the niche of being bulkier with horn leech
And on my previous note, I guess I'll do a pre-release tier list as well. A few notes:
Blatantly Broken:
Broken:
Probably Broken:
Possibly Broken:
Great:
Good:
Decent:
Mediocre:
Bleh:
Bad:
Unviable:
This thing is frankly insane. Even though it lost out on Fire-type coverage and Z moves, it still gained a 120 BP terrain-boosted STAB move with no drawback other than relying on a terrain that it summons in a format where none of the available terrain changers can switch in on Tapu Lele and can now use an unpunishable Trick. Just to put how completely absurd this Pokemon is into context, Choice Specs Expanding Force does almost 50% to Blissey (a Pokemon that hates Trick and is 2HKOed by Psyshock) and 2HKOs physically defensive Celesteela and Corviknight, and to top it off its secondary STAB just shuts down Dark-types like Mandibuzz that'd otherwise be able to keep it in check. This feels like a super cut-and-dry case really—it was already a stupid, broken Pokemon last gen, just that everything else was also stupid and broken alongside it. Hell, even if we're all wrong and it doesn't end up getting Expanding Force it only drops down one tier to "probably broken" so lol.
While, yes, Pheromosa lost access to Z moves, it gains access to Close Combat (so no more HJK trolls) and Heavy Duty Boots, and because of how min-maxed its base stats are (combined with Ice Beam to shut down Landorus-T and Zapdos, which are the main roadblocks for frail, physical Bug-types) there is virtually no risk attached to just spamming U-turn for days—it's like Genesect that trades coverage for speed. Of course, we now have Heavy Duty Boots Moltres as a potential check, but I really don't think one extra check is enough to change how absurd this set already is. And this is all before addressing its Quiver Dance sets. While, sure, it can no longer use Z-Hyper Beam to just score a free KO vs anything and everything, need I remind you all of the absurdity of Life Orb and Focus Sash sets back at the beginning of Sun and Moon? I remember my favorite team near the beginning of the generation was that triple Sash spam team that had Sash+QD Phero, Sash Excadrill, and something else I've forgotten. My favourite (paraphrased) line from the builder was this: "Focus Sash is basically a free Choice Scarf when rocks aren't up"—I agree with this, and I think it's particularly applicable with something as explosive as Pheromosa. Nothing can revenge kill Pheromosa at +1. This is just a fact. Either you tank the hit or you lose, and not a whole lot can tank the hit.
Even without Devistating Drake to give it a free Beast Boost, need I remind you that Naganadel is still just a Hydreigon that trades Roost and (lol) Taunt for a better secondary STAB (giving it perfect coverage with its STABs + Fire Blast/Flamethrower), 121 base Speed, and Beast Boost. I just can't in good faith say that this Pokemon isn't beyond insane. One of the main drawbacks of Hydreigon is that its sub-100 speed tier means it often needs to play games between setting up and directly attacking the switch-in, and while we do have Dragapult to force Naganadel out if it gets in before Beast Boost brings Naga up to +1, the mindgame is much more weighted in its favour and it just feels like there aren't whole lot of answers beyond pivoting through Blissey, which isn't ideal for obvious reasons.
This Pokemon should've been banned last gen, and it is totally unchanged minus the lack of Z moves. There is also a Grassy Terrain setter that can use U-turn and Knock Off now, so double grass with Kartana just got better, and the way that Kartana just limits defensive options between its excellent Speed stat and nutso firepower is just not healthy at all in my opinion. Choice Band is still stupid, Swords Dance is still stupid (it just runs Rose Incense, Focus Sash, or something else instead of a Z-crystal) Not as clear cut as the stuff above it but man am I still salty about last gen.
Latios is really vastly improved over past iterations. It gained access to Mysical Fire and Aura Sphere, there are no more megas or Z users to switch into and block its Tricks, and it is still just an absurdly potent wallbreaker thanks to its bottomless coverage and high stats+base power moves. Choice Specs variants no longer need to choose two of HP Fire, Surf, and Trick—it can just go Draco+Psychic+Aura Sphere+Trick instead—and other sets just have more versatile options available to them. Hell, you could run Future Sight if you really wanted to—it gets that now for some reason. Latias gained pretty much all the same buffs as Latios (and also gained Dragon Dance, thus narrowing down the movepool differences further), but it can probably put Mystical Fire's secondary effect to better use than Latios thanks to its superior bulk/range of utility. I can imagine something like Scarf+Trick+Healing Wish+Draco Meteor/Psychic+Mysical Fire/Psychic being a pretty big deal in this format, although really you can run anything from CM to LO to resist berry on it to good effect.
Tornadus is an absurdly good Pokemon on its own, just that it's overshadowed by Tornadus-T, hence why I put it so high. These Pokemon gained access to Nasty Plot and Heavy Duty Boots, which is about as big of a buff as a Pokemon like this can get. Torn-T just sounds really oppressive—I think it's more likely to get banned than Latios—and Torn-I is noticably stronger on both sides of the attacking spectrum despite its lower speed/bulk. Torn-T will probably be better 95% of the time, but if you're looking for breaking power Torn-I will definitely pull its weight no matter what.
This Pokemon gets Hurricane, Weather Ball, and Heavy Duty Boots now. I really don't need to say anything else lol. ThunderCane in rain sounds ridiculous, Volt Switch and U-turn all of a sudden sound much more appealing without the threat of SR chipping you every time you use them, and it still has everything it used to outside of Hidden Power. I can see everything from Rain Attacker to offensive/defensive pivot to Defog to SubRoost to Roost+3 attaks to AoA and Agility being viable on this thing.
Heavy Duty Boots is the best thing that's ever happened to Dragonite. Imagine not worrying about SR breaking your Multiscale. Crazy, right? It just opens up so many options both offensively and defensively. DD sets now have an easier time setting up, ParaShuffler sets now have better defensive utility, Defog sets… still sound pretty shit honestly but it's a Fogger that resists Fire I guess???? This mon just sounds really fucking good lol.
Put your pitchforks away please, there's a reason I have this so high. While, yes, Raikou lost access to Hidden Power, it gained access to Scald (meaning it can still pressure Garchomp and Lando-T and can also now pressure Tyranitar, Rotom-H, Excadrill, Tapu Bulu, Rillaboom, Amoonguss, Tangrowth, and Rhyperior a little better), and the nature lock on Aura Sphere and Weather Ball is now gone, allowing it to hammer Tyranitar and Kyurem, both of which were unwinnable matchups before, and giving it a way to hit Blissey for super effective damage. This, combined with Pressure+CM and a little more item flexibility alongside Volt Switch than Zapdos and Thundurus, means that I think it could be an excellent middle-ground pick between Koko and [slower Electric]—I expect Sub+CM+TBolt+Scald to be the best set, though I could see Specs being good too—and I think Scald on its own probably makes it the most high-pressure option versus traditional Electric-type responses. Only time will tell though.
Welcome back my sweet, sweet babies.
Finally, a Scarfer that isn't a fucking useless, garbage, piece-of-shit Pokemon that's complete dead-weight-beyond-clicking-Trick two thirds of the time. Daily reminder that Choice Scarf is a fucking atrocious item that only a tiny handful of Pokemon can actually put to good use for anything other than Trick/Switcheroo due to how much of a liability it turns its holder into.
This is a cool Pokemon. A Defogger that beats Heatran is a rare treat in general, and it can also help to keep Volcarona in check and has a good matchup versus Skarmory, Ferrothorn, and non-Stone Edge Landorus-T. Probably the biggest drawback to using it as a Defogger is that it really dislikes Knock Off (both Ferrothorn and Lando-T carry this), but it can still get a little cheese off versus them if it carries Flame Body and PP stalls non-Toxic/Stone Edge/Ancient Power Heatran for days which is nice.
Thundurus is still Thundurus even with other Electric-types around. Prankster T-wave and insane coverage+NP means that it feels the pains of the loss of Hidden Power less than other Electric-types do. That said, it is the only available Electric-type that doesn't have a move to pressure Landorus-T before a boost, and if past generations have shown us anything it is that a Pokemon being unable to pressure Landorus-T can be really deal-breaking. I expect the main set to be something like Nasty Plot+Thunderbolt+Psychic+Grass Knot, as Psychic allows it to better pressure Amoonguss while 2HKOing defensive Lando-T at +2, but something bulkier with T-wave+Knock might also see use as it's probably the only Prank Waver that isn't total dead weight off of HO, allowing it to act as unique speed control versus Dragapult. Unsure if Thundy or Thundy-T will be better so I've just grouped them together.
This might be a hot take but… I'm not all that sold on this mon. Yes, it gained Close Combat, Play Rough, and probably Rising Voltage, but it lost out on all of Twinkle Tackle, HP Ice, and HP Fire. It can no longer touch mixed defensive Ferrothorn (no, Close Combat doesn't help it—unlike, Zera, it can't justify Attack investment), it is forced to lock itself into Twinkle Tackle if it wants to stand a chance at just 2HKOing Landorus-T, meaning that sets like Shuca or CM are just not open to it anymore, and Wild Charge is such a piss-poor attack that it's gonna be really hard to justify over Zeraora in the role of physical Electric despite its higher firepower. It just feels like the nerfs outweigh the buffs they're paired with—the only set I can see being useful is Choice Specs, and choiced Electric-types are just so exploitable it's genuinely absurd. The one good thing about it is that it forces Amoonguss to run specially defensive instead of mixed defensive if it wants to tank two Specs Rising Voltages which is… yay, I guess? Let's just pretend that Tapu Bulu and Rillaboom don't gimp its firepower while we're at it as well. And to add insult to injury it's also slower than Dragapult, so it can't even put its Fairy STAB to use as a Pult RKer! It's honestly pathetic lol. I have it in good as opposed to decent because it feels wrong putting it on the level of some of those Pokemon, but MAN this thing is SUCH a BUMMER on paper.
Blacephalon loses out on Hidden Power which kinda sucks, but in return it received two buffs, one direct and the other indirect. The indirect buff is the loss of Pursuit, which means it's no longer a complete liability in any game versus Tyranitar (it's still walled, but at least it can switch out against it now) and thus allows it to put its absurdly strong Ghost-type moves to better use, whether it runs Specs, Heavy Duty Boots, or whatever else. It also gained access to Solar Beam, which while nothing interesting at a glance actually opens up a lure set that can bypass bulky Water-types like Tapu Fini after a CM. Probably not that big of a deal but it sounds pretty decent. Still really sucks that it can't break TTar though.
I've put these in the same rank as each other because I don't wanna speculate about meta trends too much (these two's relative viability is historically very meta trend dependent) and I know that one will end up being about this high but don't know which (though if I had to lean one way or the other I'd lean towards King). Nidoqueen is a bulky Ground-type that doesn't fear Grass Knot and has access to strong coverage options to pressure typical Ground-type responses like Landorus-T, Zapdos, Tangrowth, Rillaboom, and Tapu Bulu. It can punish Rotom-H for using Overheat when it's healthy, resists Fairy, does a good job of shutting down Thundurus in the short term, is yet another Pokemon that invalidates Tapu Koko (which will be useful early on—before people realise just how gimped it is without Hidden Power), and has access to both Stealth Rock and Toxic Spikes (assuming the latter doesn't continue to be awful like it is right now). As for Nidoking, I think we all know what it does. Funny wallbreaker with bottomless Sheer Force-boosted coverage goes brrrr.
I think a lot of people forget how potent Omastar is under rain. While yes, it's sorta gimped by its base 55 Speed, it has the highest Special Attack stat out of all Swift Swim users, being able to do absurd shit like this under rain:
It also no longer faces competition from Ash Greninja, which is an extra plus. Will it be OU? No. Will it be standard on rain. No. Is it a good pokemon regardless? Yes.
I talked about this above, but Entei received a buff this gen: Inner Focus now ignores Intimidate. This means that it can now 2HKO physically defensive Lando-T without having to lock itself into Flare Blitz, which is a big deal considering how nothing other than Rotom, Heatran, or Moltres actually wants to switch in on Sacred Fire. The buff is pretty minor, as Lando didn't enjoy Sacred Fire anyway, but it just makes it that little bit better at pressuring stuff.
Buzzwole does exactly one thing in this format: it counters Urshifu. If Urshifu gets banned this drops off of the face of the earth, but until then it'll be a nice pick for balance teams that don't want to be pigoenholed into certain very tight team structures.
Nothing particularly special about this 'mon, but it really likes Heavy Duty Boots. The combination of this and base 130 Speed and utility moves like Taunt, U-turn, Toxic, Defog, and Super Fang mean it's not total dogshit anymore at least.
This is a stall Steel that uses Body Press and has absurd mixed defenses. It's like a Steelix that trades an Electric-type immunity and some firepower on its Body Press for collossal Special bulk. SR+Iron Defense+Body Press+Toxic is what I'm feeling. Something like Clefable+Registeel semistall sounds really dope, although it pretty much mandates Wish support, which is a kinda big deal given the range of potentially viable options (Blobs, Clefable, Latias, Rachi (redundant with Regi), Vaporeon (?)). It really sucks that Alomomola isn't available, bc RegiMola is one of the dopest stall cores in the game lol.
Losing Pursuit really gimps this thing. It's big draw in the past was that it can trap Psychic-types with Pursuit, but losing out on that just kinda criples it. It still has good coverage, a strong STAB move in Meteor Mash, and access to Trick, but I can't see it being used much, if at all.
Fringe useful with Heavy Duty Boots thanks to its movepool+pretty solid stats. Probably won't see use but Heal Bell+Defog+Roost+Freeze Dry may be a thing?
It gained Play Rough and Mystical Fire. Play Rough in particular has good synergy with Diamond Storm, which could be pretty OK on a utility set (Play Rough+Diamond Storm+Heal Bell+Stealth Rock or something similar?) Overall though its stats are pretty horrible for something with its typing+no recovery beyond Rest—Rock just kinda bites it in the arse by removing its Fighting resistance and doubling down on its Steel weakness, which is pretty exploitable.
This isn't actually ranked outside of Unviable because of Trick Room sets. In fact, I think TR Stakataka is totally gimped by the loss of Continental Crush (despite gaining Heat Crash) and will not be a viable pick on TR teams because of it. No, the reason why I have this so high is because of Body Press, allowing it to do the same thing as Steelix while trading an Electric-type immunity and gaining a quad weakness to CC/EQ/Focus Blast for much better special bulk (deespite the HP drop), a very slightly stronger Body Press, and Beast Boost, allowing it to snowball on a Body Press sweep even if you only get to +2. I could see something like Stealth Rock+Iron Defense+Body Press+Toxic being a thing on semistall builds for this reason. With that said, it faces stiff competition from both Steelix and Registeel here, being the middle ground pick between Steelix's raw firepower and Registeel's mixed bulk. Just with a few more potentially crippling weaknesses.
Thank you for attending my TED Talk. I could be totally wrong about some of these placements, but just know that even if I end up eating my words and Tapu Koko somehow ends up not being totally gimpied and ends up in the A ranks, please know that my placement is still correct regardless because I screamed really loud and as such must be right according to Twitter.
- The tier list uses descriptive labels rather than numeric/alphabetic ones. SABC and 1234 are fucking useless even when the list doesn't feature Pokemon at different levels of brokenness, let alone when it does.
- Rating primarily based on power level rather than relative viability. Viability is taken into account for certain, very blatant cases, but trying to guess meta trends ahead of time is a fool's errand and it'd feel wrong to put something like Tornadus-I, Latias, etc. low down on the basis of Tornadus-T/Latios existing—an "outclassed" godmon is still a godmon at the end of the day.
- As such, Tornadus-I/Latias are ranked on the assumption that Tornadus-T/Latios get banned, although Latias would be high regardless. In cases where I think the chance of the outclasser being banned is zero (read: Salamence in a Dragonite+Hydreigon meta) I have ranked under the reverse assumption.
- Daily reminder that viability ≠ quality.
- Ranks are ordered by dex number. Do not read into orders within ranks.
- I'm not ranking NFEs. Fuck that shit.
- The tiermaker link doesn't include alternative formes, so I'm using minisprites instead.
- Please read the more detailed definitions before judging a placement. I've tried to make the labels as self-explanatory as possible, but especially for some near the top there is a little nuance that I can't rlly catch with a label alone.
- This is obviously just my opinion and is subject to change once I have a chance to actually piss around with this stuff. This includes the stuff with… uh… very adamant and provocative justification (*cough* *cough*).
Blatantly Broken: Ban on sight
Broken: Expected quickbans
Probably Broken: I can't imagine a world where I don't want this suspected or banned down the line
Possibly Broken: I wouldn't be surprised to see these suspect tested down the line
Great: Excellent picks that will almost always pull their weight in a given match
Good: Excellent picks that will pull their weight in most matches; typically carry more drawbacks than "great" Pokemon
Decent: Good Pokemon that won't necessarily pull their weight all the time. Off-meta, anti-meta, or archetype-specific picks.
Mediocre: Mostly underwhelming but may have team-specific utility or good/decent Pokemon that are difficult to justify. Alternatively, archetype-specific in an archetype that mostly sucks (e.g. Trick Room).
Bleh: If I can't decide between mediocre and bad it goes here.
Bad: Bad or underwhelming Pokemon that may have some team-specific utility. 95/100 times you're better off fixing the rest of your team rather than using them to fill a hole. May have some tournament counter-pick utility.
Unviable: Do not touch
Broken: Expected quickbans
Probably Broken: I can't imagine a world where I don't want this suspected or banned down the line
Possibly Broken: I wouldn't be surprised to see these suspect tested down the line
Great: Excellent picks that will almost always pull their weight in a given match
Good: Excellent picks that will pull their weight in most matches; typically carry more drawbacks than "great" Pokemon
Decent: Good Pokemon that won't necessarily pull their weight all the time. Off-meta, anti-meta, or archetype-specific picks.
Mediocre: Mostly underwhelming but may have team-specific utility or good/decent Pokemon that are difficult to justify. Alternatively, archetype-specific in an archetype that mostly sucks (e.g. Trick Room).
Bleh: If I can't decide between mediocre and bad it goes here.
Bad: Bad or underwhelming Pokemon that may have some team-specific utility. 95/100 times you're better off fixing the rest of your team rather than using them to fill a hole. May have some tournament counter-pick utility.
Unviable: Do not touch
Blatantly Broken:
Broken:
Probably Broken:
Possibly Broken:
Great:
Good:
Decent:
Mediocre:
Bleh:
Bad:
Unviable:
This thing is frankly insane. Even though it lost out on Fire-type coverage and Z moves, it still gained a 120 BP terrain-boosted STAB move with no drawback other than relying on a terrain that it summons in a format where none of the available terrain changers can switch in on Tapu Lele and can now use an unpunishable Trick. Just to put how completely absurd this Pokemon is into context, Choice Specs Expanding Force does almost 50% to Blissey (a Pokemon that hates Trick and is 2HKOed by Psyshock) and 2HKOs physically defensive Celesteela and Corviknight, and to top it off its secondary STAB just shuts down Dark-types like Mandibuzz that'd otherwise be able to keep it in check. This feels like a super cut-and-dry case really—it was already a stupid, broken Pokemon last gen, just that everything else was also stupid and broken alongside it. Hell, even if we're all wrong and it doesn't end up getting Expanding Force it only drops down one tier to "probably broken" so lol. While, yes, Pheromosa lost access to Z moves, it gains access to Close Combat (so no more HJK trolls) and Heavy Duty Boots, and because of how min-maxed its base stats are (combined with Ice Beam to shut down Landorus-T and Zapdos, which are the main roadblocks for frail, physical Bug-types) there is virtually no risk attached to just spamming U-turn for days—it's like Genesect that trades coverage for speed. Of course, we now have Heavy Duty Boots Moltres as a potential check, but I really don't think one extra check is enough to change how absurd this set already is. And this is all before addressing its Quiver Dance sets. While, sure, it can no longer use Z-Hyper Beam to just score a free KO vs anything and everything, need I remind you all of the absurdity of Life Orb and Focus Sash sets back at the beginning of Sun and Moon? I remember my favorite team near the beginning of the generation was that triple Sash spam team that had Sash+QD Phero, Sash Excadrill, and something else I've forgotten. My favourite (paraphrased) line from the builder was this: "Focus Sash is basically a free Choice Scarf when rocks aren't up"—I agree with this, and I think it's particularly applicable with something as explosive as Pheromosa. Nothing can revenge kill Pheromosa at +1. This is just a fact. Either you tank the hit or you lose, and not a whole lot can tank the hit. Even without Devistating Drake to give it a free Beast Boost, need I remind you that Naganadel is still just a Hydreigon that trades Roost and (lol) Taunt for a better secondary STAB (giving it perfect coverage with its STABs + Fire Blast/Flamethrower), 121 base Speed, and Beast Boost. I just can't in good faith say that this Pokemon isn't beyond insane. One of the main drawbacks of Hydreigon is that its sub-100 speed tier means it often needs to play games between setting up and directly attacking the switch-in, and while we do have Dragapult to force Naganadel out if it gets in before Beast Boost brings Naga up to +1, the mindgame is much more weighted in its favour and it just feels like there aren't whole lot of answers beyond pivoting through Blissey, which isn't ideal for obvious reasons. This Pokemon should've been banned last gen, and it is totally unchanged minus the lack of Z moves. There is also a Grassy Terrain setter that can use U-turn and Knock Off now, so double grass with Kartana just got better, and the way that Kartana just limits defensive options between its excellent Speed stat and nutso firepower is just not healthy at all in my opinion. Choice Band is still stupid, Swords Dance is still stupid (it just runs Rose Incense, Focus Sash, or something else instead of a Z-crystal) Not as clear cut as the stuff above it but man am I still salty about last gen. Latios is really vastly improved over past iterations. It gained access to Mysical Fire and Aura Sphere, there are no more megas or Z users to switch into and block its Tricks, and it is still just an absurdly potent wallbreaker thanks to its bottomless coverage and high stats+base power moves. Choice Specs variants no longer need to choose two of HP Fire, Surf, and Trick—it can just go Draco+Psychic+Aura Sphere+Trick instead—and other sets just have more versatile options available to them. Hell, you could run Future Sight if you really wanted to—it gets that now for some reason. Latias gained pretty much all the same buffs as Latios (and also gained Dragon Dance, thus narrowing down the movepool differences further), but it can probably put Mystical Fire's secondary effect to better use than Latios thanks to its superior bulk/range of utility. I can imagine something like Scarf+Trick+Healing Wish+Draco Meteor/Psychic+Mysical Fire/Psychic being a pretty big deal in this format, although really you can run anything from CM to LO to resist berry on it to good effect. Tornadus is an absurdly good Pokemon on its own, just that it's overshadowed by Tornadus-T, hence why I put it so high. These Pokemon gained access to Nasty Plot and Heavy Duty Boots, which is about as big of a buff as a Pokemon like this can get. Torn-T just sounds really oppressive—I think it's more likely to get banned than Latios—and Torn-I is noticably stronger on both sides of the attacking spectrum despite its lower speed/bulk. Torn-T will probably be better 95% of the time, but if you're looking for breaking power Torn-I will definitely pull its weight no matter what. This Pokemon gets Hurricane, Weather Ball, and Heavy Duty Boots now. I really don't need to say anything else lol. ThunderCane in rain sounds ridiculous, Volt Switch and U-turn all of a sudden sound much more appealing without the threat of SR chipping you every time you use them, and it still has everything it used to outside of Hidden Power. I can see everything from Rain Attacker to offensive/defensive pivot to Defog to SubRoost to Roost+3 attaks to AoA and Agility being viable on this thing. Heavy Duty Boots is the best thing that's ever happened to Dragonite. Imagine not worrying about SR breaking your Multiscale. Crazy, right? It just opens up so many options both offensively and defensively. DD sets now have an easier time setting up, ParaShuffler sets now have better defensive utility, Defog sets… still sound pretty shit honestly but it's a Fogger that resists Fire I guess???? This mon just sounds really fucking good lol. Put your pitchforks away please, there's a reason I have this so high. While, yes, Raikou lost access to Hidden Power, it gained access to Scald (meaning it can still pressure Garchomp and Lando-T and can also now pressure Tyranitar, Rotom-H, Excadrill, Tapu Bulu, Rillaboom, Amoonguss, Tangrowth, and Rhyperior a little better), and the nature lock on Aura Sphere and Weather Ball is now gone, allowing it to hammer Tyranitar and Kyurem, both of which were unwinnable matchups before, and giving it a way to hit Blissey for super effective damage. This, combined with Pressure+CM and a little more item flexibility alongside Volt Switch than Zapdos and Thundurus, means that I think it could be an excellent middle-ground pick between Koko and [slower Electric]—I expect Sub+CM+TBolt+Scald to be the best set, though I could see Specs being good too—and I think Scald on its own probably makes it the most high-pressure option versus traditional Electric-type responses. Only time will tell though. Welcome back my sweet, sweet babies. Finally, a Scarfer that isn't a fucking useless, garbage, piece-of-shit Pokemon that's complete dead-weight-beyond-clicking-Trick two thirds of the time. Daily reminder that Choice Scarf is a fucking atrocious item that only a tiny handful of Pokemon can actually put to good use for anything other than Trick/Switcheroo due to how much of a liability it turns its holder into. This is a cool Pokemon. A Defogger that beats Heatran is a rare treat in general, and it can also help to keep Volcarona in check and has a good matchup versus Skarmory, Ferrothorn, and non-Stone Edge Landorus-T. Probably the biggest drawback to using it as a Defogger is that it really dislikes Knock Off (both Ferrothorn and Lando-T carry this), but it can still get a little cheese off versus them if it carries Flame Body and PP stalls non-Toxic/Stone Edge/Ancient Power Heatran for days which is nice. Thundurus is still Thundurus even with other Electric-types around. Prankster T-wave and insane coverage+NP means that it feels the pains of the loss of Hidden Power less than other Electric-types do. That said, it is the only available Electric-type that doesn't have a move to pressure Landorus-T before a boost, and if past generations have shown us anything it is that a Pokemon being unable to pressure Landorus-T can be really deal-breaking. I expect the main set to be something like Nasty Plot+Thunderbolt+Psychic+Grass Knot, as Psychic allows it to better pressure Amoonguss while 2HKOing defensive Lando-T at +2, but something bulkier with T-wave+Knock might also see use as it's probably the only Prank Waver that isn't total dead weight off of HO, allowing it to act as unique speed control versus Dragapult. Unsure if Thundy or Thundy-T will be better so I've just grouped them together. This might be a hot take but… I'm not all that sold on this mon. Yes, it gained Close Combat, Play Rough, and probably Rising Voltage, but it lost out on all of Twinkle Tackle, HP Ice, and HP Fire. It can no longer touch mixed defensive Ferrothorn (no, Close Combat doesn't help it—unlike, Zera, it can't justify Attack investment), it is forced to lock itself into Twinkle Tackle if it wants to stand a chance at just 2HKOing Landorus-T, meaning that sets like Shuca or CM are just not open to it anymore, and Wild Charge is such a piss-poor attack that it's gonna be really hard to justify over Zeraora in the role of physical Electric despite its higher firepower. It just feels like the nerfs outweigh the buffs they're paired with—the only set I can see being useful is Choice Specs, and choiced Electric-types are just so exploitable it's genuinely absurd. The one good thing about it is that it forces Amoonguss to run specially defensive instead of mixed defensive if it wants to tank two Specs Rising Voltages which is… yay, I guess? Let's just pretend that Tapu Bulu and Rillaboom don't gimp its firepower while we're at it as well. And to add insult to injury it's also slower than Dragapult, so it can't even put its Fairy STAB to use as a Pult RKer! It's honestly pathetic lol. I have it in good as opposed to decent because it feels wrong putting it on the level of some of those Pokemon, but MAN this thing is SUCH a BUMMER on paper. Blacephalon loses out on Hidden Power which kinda sucks, but in return it received two buffs, one direct and the other indirect. The indirect buff is the loss of Pursuit, which means it's no longer a complete liability in any game versus Tyranitar (it's still walled, but at least it can switch out against it now) and thus allows it to put its absurdly strong Ghost-type moves to better use, whether it runs Specs, Heavy Duty Boots, or whatever else. It also gained access to Solar Beam, which while nothing interesting at a glance actually opens up a lure set that can bypass bulky Water-types like Tapu Fini after a CM. Probably not that big of a deal but it sounds pretty decent. Still really sucks that it can't break TTar though. I've put these in the same rank as each other because I don't wanna speculate about meta trends too much (these two's relative viability is historically very meta trend dependent) and I know that one will end up being about this high but don't know which (though if I had to lean one way or the other I'd lean towards King). Nidoqueen is a bulky Ground-type that doesn't fear Grass Knot and has access to strong coverage options to pressure typical Ground-type responses like Landorus-T, Zapdos, Tangrowth, Rillaboom, and Tapu Bulu. It can punish Rotom-H for using Overheat when it's healthy, resists Fairy, does a good job of shutting down Thundurus in the short term, is yet another Pokemon that invalidates Tapu Koko (which will be useful early on—before people realise just how gimped it is without Hidden Power), and has access to both Stealth Rock and Toxic Spikes (assuming the latter doesn't continue to be awful like it is right now). As for Nidoking, I think we all know what it does. Funny wallbreaker with bottomless Sheer Force-boosted coverage goes brrrr. I think a lot of people forget how potent Omastar is under rain. While yes, it's sorta gimped by its base 55 Speed, it has the highest Special Attack stat out of all Swift Swim users, being able to do absurd shit like this under rain:
252+ SpA Choice Specs Omastar Hydro Pump vs. 248 HP / 40+ SpD Tapu Fini in Rain: 143-168 (41.6 - 48.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock, 1 layer of Spikes, and Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Choice Specs Omastar Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Blissey in Rain: 313-369 (43.8 - 51.6%) -- 10.2% chance to 2HKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Omastar Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Ferrothorn in Rain: 178-210 (50.5 - 59.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock, 1 layer of Spikes, and Leftovers recovery
252+ SpA Choice Specs Omastar Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Blissey in Rain: 313-369 (43.8 - 51.6%) -- 10.2% chance to 2HKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Omastar Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Ferrothorn in Rain: 178-210 (50.5 - 59.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock, 1 layer of Spikes, and Leftovers recovery
I talked about this above, but Entei received a buff this gen: Inner Focus now ignores Intimidate. This means that it can now 2HKO physically defensive Lando-T without having to lock itself into Flare Blitz, which is a big deal considering how nothing other than Rotom, Heatran, or Moltres actually wants to switch in on Sacred Fire. The buff is pretty minor, as Lando didn't enjoy Sacred Fire anyway, but it just makes it that little bit better at pressuring stuff. Buzzwole does exactly one thing in this format: it counters Urshifu. If Urshifu gets banned this drops off of the face of the earth, but until then it'll be a nice pick for balance teams that don't want to be pigoenholed into certain very tight team structures. Nothing particularly special about this 'mon, but it really likes Heavy Duty Boots. The combination of this and base 130 Speed and utility moves like Taunt, U-turn, Toxic, Defog, and Super Fang mean it's not total dogshit anymore at least. This is a stall Steel that uses Body Press and has absurd mixed defenses. It's like a Steelix that trades an Electric-type immunity and some firepower on its Body Press for collossal Special bulk. SR+Iron Defense+Body Press+Toxic is what I'm feeling. Something like Clefable+Registeel semistall sounds really dope, although it pretty much mandates Wish support, which is a kinda big deal given the range of potentially viable options (Blobs, Clefable, Latias, Rachi (redundant with Regi), Vaporeon (?)). It really sucks that Alomomola isn't available, bc RegiMola is one of the dopest stall cores in the game lol. Losing Pursuit really gimps this thing. It's big draw in the past was that it can trap Psychic-types with Pursuit, but losing out on that just kinda criples it. It still has good coverage, a strong STAB move in Meteor Mash, and access to Trick, but I can't see it being used much, if at all. Fringe useful with Heavy Duty Boots thanks to its movepool+pretty solid stats. Probably won't see use but Heal Bell+Defog+Roost+Freeze Dry may be a thing? It gained Play Rough and Mystical Fire. Play Rough in particular has good synergy with Diamond Storm, which could be pretty OK on a utility set (Play Rough+Diamond Storm+Heal Bell+Stealth Rock or something similar?) Overall though its stats are pretty horrible for something with its typing+no recovery beyond Rest—Rock just kinda bites it in the arse by removing its Fighting resistance and doubling down on its Steel weakness, which is pretty exploitable. This isn't actually ranked outside of Unviable because of Trick Room sets. In fact, I think TR Stakataka is totally gimped by the loss of Continental Crush (despite gaining Heat Crash) and will not be a viable pick on TR teams because of it. No, the reason why I have this so high is because of Body Press, allowing it to do the same thing as Steelix while trading an Electric-type immunity and gaining a quad weakness to CC/EQ/Focus Blast for much better special bulk (deespite the HP drop), a very slightly stronger Body Press, and Beast Boost, allowing it to snowball on a Body Press sweep even if you only get to +2. I could see something like Stealth Rock+Iron Defense+Body Press+Toxic being a thing on semistall builds for this reason. With that said, it faces stiff competition from both Steelix and Registeel here, being the middle ground pick between Steelix's raw firepower and Registeel's mixed bulk. Just with a few more potentially crippling weaknesses.
Gonna give my 2 cents on the returning 'mons as well because I feel like procrastinating on my linear algebra exam:
: Zapdos will probably be very good with boots and a perfect typing for the likes of Rillaboom and Kartana. Hurricane is also nice because it can actually do damage to stuff like Landorus-T and Garchomp without resorting to Hidden Power Ice. Looks like it'll be a good Defogger too, so that's a welcome addition.
: Heavy-Duty Boots is very useful for this guy as well, but honestly, I don't think it will be doing very much... It will really miss out on the power of Flynium Z and while Dragon Claw + Fire Punch / Earthquake + Extreme Speed is probably okay coverage, I still don't think it will be much of a problem for most teams to stomach a hit or two and KO it back. Maybe some Roost set will be good to set up on Corviknight / Skarmory, but I'm not sure if Dragonite can even afford to drop coverage for that... I hope Dragonite can prove me wrong, but I don't think it will have that big of an impact in this meta, sadly. Actually maybe some Roost 3 attack sets will be okay actually, I mean Multiscale is definitely a great ability when you have Heavy-Duty-Boots so, who knows?
: It's Suicune... There's no way it won't be good after the dust settles!
: No idea how this will go... I've never played OU with Blaziken. It literally could be the most broken stupid thing ever, or just sit there and like be okay in some teams, I guess I'll have to wait till Thursday...
: Arceus won't come back, but they found a much better replacement!
: Probably will be Dragonite but worse this gen...
: I think Latios might be too much this time, not gonna lie, it has coverage for literally everything now! I guess something like two of Heatran, Corviknight, and Blissey might be annoying to break, but once you predict one turn right, things will get problematic quick... I'm thinking Specs might be the best set, like the ORAS days, but Calm Mind Psyshock Aura Sphere Mystical Fire could be good too, I dunno. Definitely worth keeping an eye on this fella!
: I'm still bummed Garchomp didn't get DD, but SD Chomper will still be a menace, although maybe not as much so, given Landorus-T, Corviknight, and especially Skarmory are much harder to dispose of without Z-moves... Maybe mixed chomp will make a return? Something like Earthquake Stone Edge Fire Blast Draco Meteor with a Life Orb or something? No idea, really. I think it will still be used as its one of the few reliable checks to the Pokémon beneath it in this list.
: Teleport Blissey SUCKS for Heatran, but other than that, there aren't that many checks to it other than Garchomp, Zygarde, and Tapu Fini. I guess maybe Suicune too, if that thing sees good usage. I really don't know what to think of Heatran, but I think Zygarde and Blissey alone will keep it in check. Plus, without Z-moves it shouldn't be as strong as SM Heatran, right?
: Choice Band V-Create go brrrr! Jokes aside, I think some mixed boots sets could pop up more, actually! Scorching Sands makes this mon able to capitalize on Heatran much more! and Glaciate should help against Landorus-T and Garchomp (and do minor chip on Zygarde), anything else will just take a V-Create to the face! Lowkey looks like it could be a fun 'mon.
: This thing is gonna be insane... I can't think of much counterplay other than just praying to dodge Focus Blast, or using Zapdos, I guess?
: Prankster Thunder Wave is looking real nice in a metagame dominated by Genesect, Naganadel, and Pheromosa, but after the dust settles I'm not sure how much of a splash this fella will make.
: I guess we can give him another chance... But this thing will not be fun... Knock Off means Blissey and Mandibuzz get quite crippled, and yeah, that's about it for the checks, unless you want to try SpDef Latias, or, god forbid, Cresselia... Next!
: No Flyinum Z means Landorus-T will probably go back to its role of being the braindead BO rocker it always wanted to be, with the occasional Scarf set showing up to compress like three slots in one! It's the good ol' Landorus-T everyone loves to hate!
:
: This 'mon will be worse than in SM, I think. Losing Hidden Power Ice makes Zygarde way harder to touch, suddenly Tangrowth and Landorus-T become setup bait, and I really don't like how that sounds... This 'mon will be a pain, hopefully, we can rid ourselves of it soon!
: Tapu Koko is gonna be insane! I think mixed sets might be the way to go, with Play Rough for Zygarde and Garchomp, and Close Combat for Blissey, and maybe Brave Bird for Tangrowth? I dunno. Specs is also bonkers and can fuck up Blissey even, if you get enough chip.
: I think people are kinda overhyping Tapu Lele, in all honesty. Its Psychic stab will only get marginally stronger taking into account the terrain nerf, it lost fire coverage, and Psyshock is weaker, all in a metagame where Blissey will probably be pretty good still. Granted, we lost Magearna and Celesteela probably won't be seeing as much use this gen, but I still think SM Lele was actually more dangerous than SS Lele will be, especially at the start of the gen when we have shit like Genesect, Naganadel, and Pheromosa roaming around (hopefully not for long, though). Still, probably will be a great 'mon after the dust settles.
: I guess it has better coverage than Rillaboom, but U-turn is just so instrumental for a breaker like this... Especially considering Tapu Bulu doesn't have coverage for everything, so oftentimes it will be just sitting there as opposed to U-turning with Rillaboom, so yeah... I'm thinking Bulu will be overshadowed this time.
: Defog removing its terrain is an interesting mechanic, and something I'm sure Toxic Heatran really appreciates, overall, I think without Ash-Greninja around, Tapu Fini loses quite a bit of its niche, even though Flip Turn definitely is kind of nice!
:
: This thing will be interesting... I think people are overhyping it a tad, we have quite a good number of checks and no Z-move makes it a bit less scary, but it's still Kartana so yeah...
:
: Body Press on this monster is ridiculous. I don't think it will be particularly great or anything, but it will definitely be scary...
: Scorching Sands and Tyranitar losing Pursuit also makes the clown a lot scarier, I think this 'mon is slipping under a lot of people's radar and I think this might be its gen to shine. The main drawbacks are Blissey and Stealth Rock weakness, so maybe some Calm Mind boots set with Substitute could be a thing? Missing out on the immediate damage is kind of lame, but +1 Fire Blast or Scorching Sands from this thing will definitely hurt. Don't sleep on the clown...
And that wraps up my post, thanks for coming to my TED Talk on how to john a paper due tomorrow, have a nice day :)
: Zapdos will probably be very good with boots and a perfect typing for the likes of Rillaboom and Kartana. Hurricane is also nice because it can actually do damage to stuff like Landorus-T and Garchomp without resorting to Hidden Power Ice. Looks like it'll be a good Defogger too, so that's a welcome addition.: Heavy-Duty Boots is very useful for this guy as well, but honestly, I don't think it will be doing very much... It will really miss out on the power of Flynium Z and while Dragon Claw + Fire Punch / Earthquake + Extreme Speed is probably okay coverage, I still don't think it will be much of a problem for most teams to stomach a hit or two and KO it back. Maybe some Roost set will be good to set up on Corviknight / Skarmory, but I'm not sure if Dragonite can even afford to drop coverage for that... I hope Dragonite can prove me wrong, but I don't think it will have that big of an impact in this meta, sadly. Actually maybe some Roost 3 attack sets will be okay actually, I mean Multiscale is definitely a great ability when you have Heavy-Duty-Boots so, who knows?: It's Suicune... There's no way it won't be good after the dust settles!: No idea how this will go... I've never played OU with Blaziken. It literally could be the most broken stupid thing ever, or just sit there and like be okay in some teams, I guess I'll have to wait till Thursday...: Arceus won't come back, but they found a much better replacement!: Probably will be Dragonite but worse this gen... : I think Latios might be too much this time, not gonna lie, it has coverage for literally everything now! I guess something like two of Heatran, Corviknight, and Blissey might be annoying to break, but once you predict one turn right, things will get problematic quick... I'm thinking Specs might be the best set, like the ORAS days, but Calm Mind Psyshock Aura Sphere Mystical Fire could be good too, I dunno. Definitely worth keeping an eye on this fella!: I'm still bummed Garchomp didn't get DD, but SD Chomper will still be a menace, although maybe not as much so, given Landorus-T, Corviknight, and especially Skarmory are much harder to dispose of without Z-moves... Maybe mixed chomp will make a return? Something like Earthquake Stone Edge Fire Blast Draco Meteor with a Life Orb or something? No idea, really. I think it will still be used as its one of the few reliable checks to the Pokémon beneath it in this list.: Teleport Blissey SUCKS for Heatran, but other than that, there aren't that many checks to it other than Garchomp, Zygarde, and Tapu Fini. I guess maybe Suicune too, if that thing sees good usage. I really don't know what to think of Heatran, but I think Zygarde and Blissey alone will keep it in check. Plus, without Z-moves it shouldn't be as strong as SM Heatran, right?: Choice Band V-Create go brrrr! Jokes aside, I think some mixed boots sets could pop up more, actually! Scorching Sands makes this mon able to capitalize on Heatran much more! and Glaciate should help against Landorus-T and Garchomp (and do minor chip on Zygarde), anything else will just take a V-Create to the face! Lowkey looks like it could be a fun 'mon.: This thing is gonna be insane... I can't think of much counterplay other than just praying to dodge Focus Blast, or using Zapdos, I guess?: Prankster Thunder Wave is looking real nice in a metagame dominated by Genesect, Naganadel, and Pheromosa, but after the dust settles I'm not sure how much of a splash this fella will make.: I guess we can give him another chance... But this thing will not be fun... Knock Off means Blissey and Mandibuzz get quite crippled, and yeah, that's about it for the checks, unless you want to try SpDef Latias, or, god forbid, Cresselia... Next!: No Flyinum Z means Landorus-T will probably go back to its role of being the braindead BO rocker it always wanted to be, with the occasional Scarf set showing up to compress like three slots in one! It's the good ol' Landorus-T everyone loves to hate!:
: This 'mon will be worse than in SM, I think. Losing Hidden Power Ice makes Zygarde way harder to touch, suddenly Tangrowth and Landorus-T become setup bait, and I really don't like how that sounds... This 'mon will be a pain, hopefully, we can rid ourselves of it soon!: Tapu Koko is gonna be insane! I think mixed sets might be the way to go, with Play Rough for Zygarde and Garchomp, and Close Combat for Blissey, and maybe Brave Bird for Tangrowth? I dunno. Specs is also bonkers and can fuck up Blissey even, if you get enough chip. : I think people are kinda overhyping Tapu Lele, in all honesty. Its Psychic stab will only get marginally stronger taking into account the terrain nerf, it lost fire coverage, and Psyshock is weaker, all in a metagame where Blissey will probably be pretty good still. Granted, we lost Magearna and Celesteela probably won't be seeing as much use this gen, but I still think SM Lele was actually more dangerous than SS Lele will be, especially at the start of the gen when we have shit like Genesect, Naganadel, and Pheromosa roaming around (hopefully not for long, though). Still, probably will be a great 'mon after the dust settles.: I guess it has better coverage than Rillaboom, but U-turn is just so instrumental for a breaker like this... Especially considering Tapu Bulu doesn't have coverage for everything, so oftentimes it will be just sitting there as opposed to U-turning with Rillaboom, so yeah... I'm thinking Bulu will be overshadowed this time.: Defog removing its terrain is an interesting mechanic, and something I'm sure Toxic Heatran really appreciates, overall, I think without Ash-Greninja around, Tapu Fini loses quite a bit of its niche, even though Flip Turn definitely is kind of nice!:
: This thing will be interesting... I think people are overhyping it a tad, we have quite a good number of checks and no Z-move makes it a bit less scary, but it's still Kartana so yeah...:
: Body Press on this monster is ridiculous. I don't think it will be particularly great or anything, but it will definitely be scary...: Scorching Sands and Tyranitar losing Pursuit also makes the clown a lot scarier, I think this 'mon is slipping under a lot of people's radar and I think this might be its gen to shine. The main drawbacks are Blissey and Stealth Rock weakness, so maybe some Calm Mind boots set with Substitute could be a thing? Missing out on the immediate damage is kind of lame, but +1 Fire Blast or Scorching Sands from this thing will definitely hurt. Don't sleep on the clown...And that wraps up my post, thanks for coming to my TED Talk on how to john a paper due tomorrow, have a nice day :)
I'm only gonna talk about three specific pokemon in this rank since I don't really care about anything else (although raikou over tapu koko is the spiciest take I've read in a long time lol)Decent:
this thing now has boots to ignore its weakness to stealth rock and the removal of pursuit means that it can nuke things with banded v-creates and not have to worry about getting trapped by ttar. The presence of urshifu annoys it but its not like anything can switch into urshifu in the first place so this doesn't really matter. Overall i think victini will continue to be a great mon in ou speaking of urshifu, this is the the closest thing to an urshifu counter that we are going to get. It resists both of urshifus stabs and unless urshifu runs aerial ace (which it never will) it's never going to get past it. It's most viable option to hit buzzwole is Zen headbutt, which also hits g-weezing hard, but even that isn't enough:252 Atk Choice Band Urshifu Zen Headbutt vs. 252 HP / 144+ Def Buzzwole: 160-190 (38.2 - 45.4%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
In short, in a tier where urshifu is allowed, buzzwole will be pretty good
I think that this mon will be a great partner for urshifu, as it shuts down all the cores that are used to limit urshifu. It destroys clefpex cores with earth power and sludge wave, especially since both of them are more inclined to be physically defensive in order to urshifu, and also 2hkos buzzwole. Of course there is a reason that nidoking is more of a uu mon but I believe that it has a solid niche in ou.
I think Bulu is gonna mostly outclass Rillaboom just because of how important the fairy typing is when you consider how strong Dragon, Dark and Fighting types are in the metagame. Being a (probably) better check to Garchomp and Zygarde, as well as being able to switch on Urshifu's stabs and immediately threaten it makes a huge difference. Bulu has the steel weakness tho, but Rillaboom didn't really like coming in on Drill's iron head either way. I think you'd mostly prefer Rillaboom over Bulu if you want to use the Terrain Extender with for example SD Grassy Glide Kartana, but otherwise the teambuilding compression that Bulu offers. Even when forgetting the defensive advantage of the fairy typing, Banded Bulu looks much better than Rillaboom, because while having U-Turn is certainly a plus, the main goal of a choice band breaker is to deal big damage. Bulu's coverage makes it much harder to switch into, as it is able to threaten Flying Types like Zapdos, Moltres or Tornadus with Stone Edge, Corviknight with Close Combat (252+ Atk Choice Band Tapu Bulu Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 28 Def Corviknight: 201-237 (50.2 - 59.2%) -- 78.5% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery), whereas Rillaboom struggles a lot versus those. It also has a secondary Stab, which helps a lot when trying to find a move that it can lock iself easily into. Bulu even has options like Zen Headbutt and Megahorn to surprise grass types.
Honestly clicking Knock Off is safer 90% of the time than clicking a coverage move and in some cases (like physically defensive Steel birds) it might even be more rewarding. Especially if the opponent has a core like Tornadus+Melmetal (assuming Melmetal is unbanned, but most Steel types work for this example) choosing the right coverage move can be an absolute gamble, while Rillaboom gets out of this by having Knock Off (and U-turn) which enable it to make the right play 99% of the time. The only real deterrents here are Static and Flame Body.
I think Swords Dance Bulu is a better stallbreaker but Rillaboom is still the better offensive pivot even if it can't absorb Garchomp's Scale Shot. Honestly Bulu is nothing to write home about as an Urshifu check because it's so easy to read the switch and click Poison Jab.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe both of these mons get dual wingbeat, which is a good neutral hit vs fairy types. +1/+2 earthquake from either of these guys can often miss KOs, which will stop their sweeps, but having an effective secondary stab is really good. I don't know if they'll be good or not, but one of the things that hindered these mons in previous generations was their reliance on coverage to hit anything that resists/is immune to dragon, so having a secondary stab is pretty big.
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