Ubers Dialga

ckw

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QC: Nayrz / Fireburn/ zf
GP: The Dutch Plumberjack


[OVERVIEW]

* Dialga's overall great natural bulk and defensive typing make it difficult to take down in one hit, making it a rather annoying Pokemon to face in Ubers.
* It also has access to a plethora of support moves as well as coverage moves, which, in combination with its aforementioned great natural bulk, especially makes it a good Stealth Rock user, as it can drive off common anti-entry hazard Pokemon such as Arceus-Water, Mega Sableye, and Giratina-O.
* Ground-type attacks, which are common as coverage move for physical threats in the tier, deal super effective damage to Dialga, which somewhat hurts its viability.
* It faces competition from other entry hazard setters such as Excadrill and Cloyster, while both Pokemon can also provide entry hazard control too.


[SET]
name: Offensive Stealth Rock
move 1: Stealth Rock
move 2: Draco Meteor
move 3: Fire Blast
move 4: Toxic / Roar / Flash Cannon
item: Shuca Berry
ability: Pressure
nature: Modest
evs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========
* Dialga can set up Stealth Rock and it works well against offensive teams while also sparing Primal Groudon from the role of entry hazard setter, making room for it to run different sets.
* Draco Meteor is Dialga's main STAB move, which inflicts heavy damage to Pokemon that don't resist or aren't immune to it such as Magearna, Klefki, Xerneas, and Solgaleo.
* Fire Blast as a coverage move on Dialga is highly recommended, since it lets Dialga deal heavy damage to common Pokemon such as Magearna, Ferrothorn, and Klefki, which would otherwise wall it.
* Toxic lets Dialga cripple common Defog users such as Arceus-Water and bulky Pokemon such as Lugia, setting them on a timer.
* Roar prevent setup sweepers such as Primal Groudon, Arceus, Arceus-Ground, Arceus-Ghost, Mega Lucario, and Mega Salamence from setting up after Dialga KOes something with Draco Meteor, phazing them. It can also prevent Geomancy Xerneas from setting up in front of a -2 Dialga.
* Thunder can also be run to let Dialga 2HKO offensive Primal Kyogre, Arceus-Water, Ho-Oh, and Lugia.
* Flash Cannon may be run to check Pokemon such as Xerneas and Clefable, which would otherwise wall Dialga.


Set Details
========

* Maximum investment in Special Attack with a Modest Nature is used so that Dialga can hit as hard as it can with its STAB and coverage moves.
* Maximum investment in HP allows Dialga to avoid being easily whittled down by Defog users and other Pokemon in general and helps it check Pokemon such as Mega Salamence better.
* Shuca Berry negates Dialga's Ground weakness once. This gives it a niche of acting as an offensive check to Mega Salamence while also doing surprise damage to Ground-type Pokemon such as Primal Groudon.

Usage Tips
========

* Dialga's great type combination makes a Stealth Rock user, as it can easily switch in against support Pokemon such as Arceus-Water, Lugia, and Celesteela predicting Toxic or moves such as Ice Beam and Judgment, which Dialga can easily take, and set up entry hazards.
* It can also switch in against offensive Pokemon such as Mega Salamence, Solgaleo, Shaymin, physical variants of Rayquaza, and Ho-Oh Choice-locked into Brave Bird and retaliate with STAB Draco Meteor or set up entry hazards.
* While Dialga can act as a lead entry hazard setter facing teams with lead Pokemon such as Deoxys-S, Shuckle, and Cloyster, it's recommended to avoid taking unnecessary damage since most of the time, Dialga will be its team's primary offensive check to sweepers such as Mega Salamence, Zygarde-C, Primal Groudon and such.
* When facing Defog users that carry recovery, it's best to inflict them with Toxic rather than damaging them with Draco Meteor, since it will lose you momentum with a -2 Dialga on the field.


Team Options
========

* Dialga fits well on offensive teams that appreciate Stealth Rock support as well as an offensive check to Mega Salamence with the help of its Shuca Berry.
* Primal Groudon is a good partner, since Dialga relieves it from the role of the Stealth Rock setter, enabling it to run different sets. It can function as a setup sweeper with Swords Dance and Rock Polish while also checking Xerneas, which can set up on Dialga if it does not carry Roar or Flash Cannon.
* Ho-Oh pairs well with Dialga, as it can check Fighting-types such as Mega Lucario and Blaziken without Stone Edge and Xerneas without Hidden Power Rock or Thunder.
* Strong physically based wallbreakers such as Mega Salamence, Arceus-Ghost, and Extreme Killer Arceus team up well with Dialga, as it can provide Stealth Rock support as well as check certain physically defensive Pokemon such as Zygarde-C, Arceus-Water, Giratina, and Buzzwole.


[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

* Dragonium Z over Shuca Berry drastically increases the power of Draco Meteor, making it possible to score surprise KOs on Pokemon such as Yveltal and, after Stealth Rock damage, an OHKO on Ho-Oh, as well as an OHKO on offensive Primal Groudon from full; however, Dialga loses the ability to check Pokemon like +1 Mega Salamence.
* Psychium Z with Heal Block is another set Dialga could run, as Z-Heal Block gives it a +2 Special Attack boost, raising its already high Special Attack to another level. However, it can only be used once, since Dialga's strong Dragon STAB attack drops Special Attack, while a Steel STAB is not such a spammable option, which makes it rather difficult to sweep with. Overall, Palkia can do the same thing but better.
* A Life Orb set with three attacking moves and Stealth Rock is also an option. This set provides more power for Dialga to use in exchange for not being able to check +2 Speed Primal Groudon. Unfortunately, Dialga's two STAB types are resisted by Steel-type Pokemon such as Magearna and Klefki while Arceus formes with their overall great bulk can eat up a Draco Meteor and Recover up the damage. Palkia often ends up doing the job way better than Dialga.
* A Trick Room with three attacks is an option similar to the aforementioned Life Orb set. Since Dialga has great bulk, it can set up Trick Room with ease and deal heavy damage to the opposing team with its STAB moves. However, just like with the previously mentioned set, bulky Arceus formes such as Arceus-Ground and Arceus-Dark can easily stall the Trick Room out and proceed to KO Dialga with STAB Judgment.


Checks and Counters
===================

**Arceus-Ground**: Arceus-Ground is one of the best counters to Dialga, as it can easily switch in and remove any entry hazards with Defog while also hitting back with a super effective Ground-type move. However, Dialga can cripple Arceus-Ground by using Toxic while taking a Ground move of reduced damage due to its Shuca Berry.

**Ho-OH**: Because of Regenerator, Ho-Oh can switch in against Dialga with ease and recover any inflicted damage by switching out or Roost. Unless Dialga carries Thunder, which can 2HKO Ho-Oh, it does not have much to hit it with, since Toxic damage can be easily healed back by switching as well.

**Primal Groudon**: Specially defensive Primal Groudon sets can switch in against Dialga can set up Stealth Rock of their own. However, the situation is not so simple, because Dialga usually holds Shuca Berry, which lets it survive a Precipice Blades and retaliate with a Draco Meteor, weakening Primal Groudon for other Pokemon in the team to sweep.

**Primal Kyogre**: With its sky-high Special Defense, Primal Kyorgre is able to check all variants of Dialga, as it can easily take a Draco Meteor while Thunder is not even a 2HKO on defensive variants and offensive Calm Mind sets can tank a Draco Meteor can set up on Dialga.

**Special Walls**: Pokemon such as Blissey can easily take hits from Dialga and slowly whittle it down. Additionally, Blissey usually carries Heal Bell, and also has the ability Natural Cure to remove status whenever it switches.

**Faster Pokemon**: Since Dialga's Speed is somewhat average, faster Pokemon such as Lunala, Yveltal, Mewtwo, Deoxys-A, and Mega Gengar can effectively take out Dialga with their respective STAB or super effective coverage moves.

**Fighting-types**: Pokemon such as Mega Lucario, Pheromosa, and Life Orb Blaziken can easily check Dialga with their STAB Fighting-type moves.
 
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On the C&C section, maybe you should note that Lugia and Blissey are only good for scouting Draco Meteor, as their rely on Toxic to damage the foe which Dialga is immune to, while they can wall Dialga, often times they can't do anything back either.
 
[SET]
name: Offensive Stealth Rock
move 1: Stealth Rock
move 2: Draco Meteor
move 3: Fire Blast
move 4: Toxic / Roar / Flash Cannon
item: Shuca Berry
ability: Pressure
nature: Modest
evs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA

Fire Blast is core with all these Steels running around, and max Speed is ultimately not necessary to Dialga's role as a SR setter. It should be able to avoid being easily whittled by Defog users and other mons in general as that's what Dialga is best at - being very difficult to take down unscratched. HP does that job better than attempting to outspeed stuff. Flash Cannon is rather useless in all honesty - its only a real consideration for teams where Xern is getting too much room against it. If QC would rather this is in Moves I'm not against it.

Usage tips needs more ideas in there. Dialga is not a lead SR setter as implied. The second line contradicts the first - if its the offensive check then why lead with it to set SR? Leading Dialga is usually fine but not in the way mentioned here. Cover what to switch into, what to set SR on.

* Mega Gengar also pairs well as it can trap Dialga's checks such as Lugia, Solgaleo, Magearna, and Klefki.
None of these are Dialga checks. This seems like a brain lapse because they don't see much in the Checks and Counters section, but fix it anyway. Why else is Groudon a good partner?

What surprise KOs does Dragonium Z get Dialga? When you mention something without elaboration you are assuming the reader should know this in advance... but why would they be reading this if that was the case? Elaborate on your points.

Give this another look over and edit to suit the concerns and we'll see where we are.
 
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ckw

Tired
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[SET]
name: Offensive Stealth Rock
move 1: Stealth Rock
move 2: Draco Meteor
move 3: Fire Blast
move 4: Toxic / Roar / Flash Cannon
item: Shuca Berry
ability: Pressure
nature: Modest
evs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA

Fire Blast is core with all these Steels running around, and max Speed is ultimately not necessary to Dialga's role as a SR setter. It should be able to avoid being easily whittled by Defog users and other mons in general as that's what Dialga is best at - being very difficult to take down unscratched. HP does that job better than attempting to outspeed stuff. Flash Cannon is rather useless in all honesty - its only a real consideration for teams where Xern is getting too much room against it. If QC would rather this is in Moves I'm not against it.

Usage tips needs more ideas in there. Dialga is not a lead SR setter as implied. The second line contradicts the first - if its the offensive check then why lead with it to set SR? Leading Dialga is usually fine but not in the way mentioned here. Cover what to switch into, what to set SR on.


None of these are Dialga checks. This seems like a brain lapse because they don't see much in the Checks and Counters section, but fix it anyway. Why else is Groudon a good partner?

What surprise KOs does Dragonium Z get Dialga? When you mention something without elaboration you are assuming the reader should know this in advance... but why would they be reading this if that was the case? Elaborate on your points.

Give this another look over and edit to suit the concerns and we'll see where we are.
Implemented these changes (indeed it was a brain lapse :[ )
 

Freeroamer

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I dont really like the C&C section labelled bulky Arceus formes, out of the Arceus formes that do go bulky often in this tier (Ground, Water, Dragon, Fairy, Dark and Normal I guessss) only Ground can be considered a beneficial matchup. The rest at worst get hit by Toxic and don't immediately threaten, and in some cases run the risk of getting mauled by one of Dialga's attacking moves. You actually mention how good Dialga is at threatening anti hazard Pokémon in the overview and if anything this is another extension of that, where passive support Pokémon don't really switch into Dialga for free. Refresh would be a valid point but what Arceus is actually running it? Only Rock and Dark could maybe find space, Rock doesn't switch into an unscouted Dialga and had 0 mentions of Refresh in its analysis, while Dark usually forgoes it for other utility options or attacks in my experience.

Lugia and Ferrothorn being listed as checks is also just plain wrong.
 
Last edited:

ckw

Tired
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I dont really like the C&C section labelled bulky Arceus formes, out of the Arceus formes that do go bulky often in this tier (Ground, Water, Dragon, Fairy, Dark and Normal I guessss) only Ground can be considered a beneficial matchup. The rest at worst get hit by Toxic and don't immediately threaten, and in some cases run the risk of getting mauled by one of Dialga's attacking moves. You actually mention how good Dialga is at threatening anti hazard Pokémon in the overview and if anything this is another extension of that, where passive support Pokémon don't really switch into Dialga for free. Refresh would be a valid point but what Arceus is actually running it? Only Rock and Dark could maybe find space, Rock doesn't switch into an unscouted Dialga and had 0 mentions of Refresh in its analysis, while Dark usually forgoes it for other utility options or attacks in my experience.

Lugia and Ferrothorn being listed as checks is also just plain wrong.
Your right, I completely forgot to remove that after some of my convos with QC. Thanks for spotting that out man. This should be fixed in a bit
Ferrothorn and Celesteela were initially mentioned when Fire Blast was yet to be made standard (and no slashes) and it kinda skipped my mind while re-reading the thread.
 
Last edited:

Lumari

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remove
add / fix (comments); (AC=add comma; RC=remove comma; SC=semicolon)
GP 1/1
[OVERVIEW]

* Dialga's overall great natural bulk and defensive typing combination makes make it difficult to take down in one hit, making it a rather annoying Pokemon to face in Ubers.
* It also has access to a plethora of support moves as well as coverage moves, (AC) which, in combination with its aforementioned great natural bulk, makes it an overall threat in the metagame. (filler) especially makes it a good Stealth Rock user, as it can drive off common anti-entry hazard Pokemon such as Arceus-Water, Mega Sableye, and Giratina-O.
* It's great coverage and support movepool makes it a good Stealth Rock user as it can drive off common anti-entry hazard Pokemon such as Arceus-Water, Mega Sableye, and Giratina-O which, makes it an ideal Stealth Rock user.(merged into previous bullet)
* Ground-type attacks, which are common as coverage move for physical treats in the tier, deal super effective damage to Dialga, (AC) and which somewhat hurts its viability.
* It faces competition from other entry hazard setters such as Excadrill and Cloyster, (AC) while (RC) both Pokemon can also function provide as entry hazard control too.


[SET]
name: Offensive Stealth Rock
move 1: Stealth Rock
move 2: Draco Meteor
move 3: Fire Blast
move 4: Toxic / Roar / Flash Cannon
item: Shuca Berry
ability: Pressure
nature: Modest
evs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========
* Dialga can easily set up Stealth Rock, (AC) can be easily set up and it works well against offensive teams while (RC) also sparing Primal Groudon from the role of entry hazard setter, making room for it to run different sets.
* Draco Meteor is Dialga's main STAB move, (AC) which (RC) inflicts heavy damage to Pokemon other than its resists and immunities that don't resist or aren't immune to it such as Magearna, Klefki, Xerneas, and Solgaleo.
* Fire Blast as a coverage move on Dialga is highly recommended, (AC) since the metagame has now shifted to favor Steel-types and having the Fire coverage it lets Dialga deal heavy damage to common (or w/e, just to convey the point of the meta being favorable to Steel-types here) Pokemon such as Magearna, Ferrothorn, and Klefki, (AC) which (RC) would otherwise wall Dialga it.
* Toxic lets Dialga cripple common Defog users such as Arceus-Water and also bulky Pokemon such as Lugia, setting them on a timer.
* Roar prevent set up setup sweepers such as Primal Groudon, Arceus, Arceus-Ground, Arceus-Ghost, Mega Lucario, and Mega Salamence from setting up after Dialga KOes something with Draco Meteor and receives -2 Special Attack drop, phazing them out. It can also prevent Geomancy Xerneas from setting up in front of a -2 Dialga at -2 Special Attack.
* Thunder can also be run that lets to let Dialga 2HKO offensive Primal Kyogre, Arceus-Water, Ho-Oh, and Lugia.
* Flash Cannon may be run to check Pokemon such as Xerneas and Clefable, (AC) which (RC) would otherwise wall Dialga.


Set Details
========

* Maximum investment in Special Attack with a Modest nature is used so that Dialga can hit as hard as it can with its STAB and coverage moves.
* Maximum investment in HP allows Dialga to avoid being easily whittled own by Defog users and other Pokemon in general and also helps it check Pokemon such as Mega Salamence better.
* Shuca Berry reduce the Ground weakness of negates Dialga's Ground weakness once. This gives it a niche of acting as an offensive check to Mega Salamence while also doing surprise damage to Ground-type Pokemon such as Primal Groudon.

Usage Tips
========

* Dialga's great type combination makes it reliable as a reliable Stealth Rock user, (AC) as it can easily switch in against support Pokemon such as Arceus-Water, Lugia, and Celesteela predicting Toxic or moves such as Ice Beam and Judgement Judgment, (AC) which (RC) Dialga can easily take, (AC) and set up entry hazards.
* It can also switch in against offensive Pokemon such as Mega Salamence, Solgaleo, Shaymin, physical variants of Rayquaza, and Ho-Oh Choice-locked into Brave Bird and retaliate back with STAB Draco Meteor or set up entry hazard hazards.
* While Dialga can act as a lead entry hazard setter facing teams with lead Pokemon such as Deoxys-S, Shuckle, and Cloyster, it's recommended to avoid taking unnecessary damage since most of the time, Dialga will be its team's primary offensive check to sweepers such as Mega Salamence, Zygarde-C, Primal Groudon and such.
* When facing Defog users that carry recovery, it's best to inflict them with Toxic rather than damaging them with Draco Meteor, (AC) since it will lose you momentum with a -2 Special Attack Dialga on the field.


Team Options
========

* Dialga fits well on offensive teams that appreciate Stealth Rock support as well as an offensive check to Mega Salamence with the help of its Shuca Berry.
* Primal Groudon is a good partner, (AC) since Dialga relieves it from the role of the Stealth Rocks Rock setter, creating options for enabling it to run different sets to be run. It can function as a setup sweeper with Swords Dance and Rock Polish while (RC) also checking Xerneas, (AC) which (RC) can set up on Dialga if it does not carry Roar or Flash Cannon.
* Ho-Oh pairs well with Dialga, (AC) as it can check Fighting-types such as Mega Lucario and Blazkien Blaziken without Stone Edge (RC) and Xerneas without Hidden Power Rock. (and Thunder?)
* Strong physically based wall breakers wallbreakers such as Mega Salamence, Arceus-Ghost, and Extreme Killer Arceus team up well with Dialga, (AC) who as it can provide Stealth Rock support as well as check certain physically defensive Pokemon such as Zygarde-C, Arceus-Water, Giratina, and Buzzwole.


[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

* Dragonium Z over Shuca Berry drastically increases the power of Draco Meteor, making it possible to score surprise KOs on Pokemon such as <...> and an OHKO on offensive Primal Groudon; however, Dialga loses the ability to check Pokemon like +1 Mega Salamence at +1.
* Psychium Z with Heal Block is another set Dialga could run, (comma) as Z-Heal (AH) Block gives it a +2 Special Attack boost, raising its already high Special Attack to another level. However, it is a one-time use move, (AC; also this is really vague and not really your point from what I can tell; do you mean something like "the boost cannot really allow Dialga to sweep"?) since Dialga's strong Dragon STAB attack drops Special Attack, while a Steel STAB attack is not such a spamable spammable option. Overall, Palkia can do the same thing but even better at it.
* A Life Orb set with three attacks attacking moves and Stealth Rock is also a set Dialga can run an option with Stealth Rock as the fourth four. This set provides more power for Dialga to use in exchange for not being able to check Primal Groudon at +2 Speed Primal Groudon. Unfortunately, Dialga's two STAB types are resisted by Steel-type Pokemon such as Magearna or and Klefki while Arceus formes with their overall great bulk can eat up a Draco Meteor and Recover up the damage. Palkia often ends up doing the job way better than Dialga.
* A Trick Room set with three attacks is a set an option similar to the aforementioned Life Orb three attacks set. Since Dialga has great bulk, it can set up Trick Room with ease and deal heavy damage to the opposing team with its STAB moves. However, just like with the previously mentioned set, bulky Arceus formes such as Arceus-Ground and Arceus-Dark can easily stall the Trick Room out and proceed to KO Dialga with STAB Judgment.


Checks and Counters
===================

**Arceus-Ground**: Arceus-Ground is one of the best counters to Dialga, (AC) as it can easily switch in and remove any entry hazards with Defog while (RC) also hitting back with a super effective Ground-type move. However, Dialga can cripple Arceus-Ground by using Toxic while taking a Ground move of reduced damage due to its Shuca Berry.

**Ho-OH**: Because of Regenerator, Ho-Oh can switch in against Dialga with ease and recover any inflicted damage by switching out or Roost. Unless Dialga carries Thunder, which can 2HKO Ho-Oh, it does not have much to hit it with, (AC) since Toxic damage can be easily healed back by switching as well.

**Primal Groudon**: Specially defensive Primal Groudon sets can switch in against Dialga can set up Stealth Rocks Rock of its their own. However, the situation is not so simple, (AC) because Dialga usually holds the Shuca Berry, (AC) which lets it survive a Precipice Blades and retaliate back with a Draco Meteor, weakening it Primal Groudon for other Pokemon in the team to sweep.

**Primal Kyogre**: With its sky-high Special Defense, Primal Kyorgre is able to check all variants of Dialga, (AC) as it can easily take a Draco Meteor while (RC) Thunder is not even 2HKO on defensive variants and offensive Calm Mind sets can tank a Draco Meteor can set up on Dialga.

**Special Walls**: Pokemon such as Blissey can easily take hits from Dialga and slowly widdle whittle it down. It Additionally, Blissey usually carries Heal Bell, while also having and has the ability Natural Cure that provides to remove status immunity whenever it switches.

**Faster Pokemon**: Since Dialga's Speed is somewhat average, faster Pokemon such as Lunala, Yveltal, Landorus, (isn't this one considered unviable?) Mewtwo, Deoxys-A, and Mega Gengar can effectively take out Dialga with their respective STAB or super effective coverage moves.

**Fighting-types**: Pokemon such as Mega Lucario, Pheromosa, and Life Orb Blaziken can easily check Dialga with their STAB Fighting-type moves.
 
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