SS OU DEFY THE LIMITS (2,000th Post)

Astra

talk to me nice
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:primarina: :salazzle: :ferrothorn: :clefable: :hippowdon: :hydreigon:

Introduction
For those who know me, the RMT forums are probably the least likely place to find me on Smogon, which may or may not be because nothing here needs to be grammar checked. Little do they know that I've made a couple of RMTs back in the day, but I don't like to talk about it. Anyways, to make my 2,000th post special, I've decided to make one of these posts again, except I'm pretty confident that this team won't be as bad as the others. I also wanted to make this RMT themed around what's currently my favorite game at the moment, VALORANT. Cheesy, sure, but hopefully I'll make up for it with the tunes I provide. No promises, though.

Team Building Process
:primarina:
In all honestly, the main reason I decided to start building a team beginning with Primarina was because curiosity answered with it when I asked what OU Pokemon that should be used more often should I build around. It was definitely a good choice, though, as Primarina is definitely an underrated threat in OU at the moment, taking care of a good majority of the metagame. But what about the ones that it can't? Hmm...
:primarina: :salazzle:
As a Pokemon on the rise in OU, Salazzle was also a Pokemon I wanted to experiment with. Surely enough, I find it pairing well with Primarina, not only taking care of Pokemon it can't alone like Ferrothorn but also inflicting Toxic on them. I'd like to also add that inflicting Toxic on Toxapex and Corviknight is the best feeling in the entire world, right after closing all of your tabs you had opened after finishing a school assignment. And sex, I think.
:primarina: :salazzle: :ferrothorn:
For the defensive backbones of my team, I began with Ferrothorn, as I believe its ability to wear down so many Pokemon with Spikes, Leech Seed, Iron Barbs, Rock Helmet, and just attacking in general are appreciated by both Primarina and Salazzle. You can say that for just about any Pokemon, honestly, but the fact that both of them love taking advantage of foes under a lot of pressure make Ferrothorn a stellar pick
:primarina: :salazzle: :ferrothorn: :clefable:
I would love to throw Clefable into a meat grinder for how annoying it is to face, but I chose to put it on my team due to how valuable the Wish support is for Primarina and Salazzle. It's safe, for now.
:primarina: :salazzle: :ferrothorn: :clefable: :hippowdon:
Choosing the last two Pokemon for this team was incredibly hard, considering that I still needed to fill in a good amount of roles I didn't have yet, specifically a solid Zeraora check. I chose Hippowdon for not only doing that, but also providing even more chip damage to help the team out with Stealth Rock, Whirlwind, and Sand Stream.
:primarina: :salazzle: :ferrothorn: :clefable: :hippowdon: :hydreigon:
The last slot of my team still needed to both give me a form of hazard removal and a way to circumvent the slowness of my team, not to mention a Ground-type immunity. Thanks to Rekeri, I found out that Hydreigon can cover all of these for my team. It can be hard to Defog when you're running Choice Scarf, though it can be simple when you bluffing another set.

If I told you that I made this team in one go, it would probably would be the worst lie you've ever heard. Just because of how hard it was to fill in the last two slots, I've probably made close to 10 variations of this team, all of which had different variations of the last two slots. Some highlights are Hippowdon / Excadrill making my team too weak to Ground-types, Seismitoad / Corviknight for being too passive, and Hippowdon / Galarian Weezing because Galarian Weezing unfortunately was having trouble doing its job efficiently. Ah well.

The Team in Depth
(click on their sprite or name for some tunes you may or may not like)


Jett (Primarina) (F) @

Ability: Torrent
EVs: 248 HP / 80 Def / 44 SpD / 136 Spe
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
Substitute
Calm Mind
Scald
Moonblast

"Wind, show me where to go"

Primarina easily takes advantage of passive Pokemon like that can't break its Substitute in one shot. Seismitoad is a big example of this, as Primarina can come in on a predicted Stealth Rock, which grants me a free Substitute, as it will either try to use Toxic on it or attack it, not even breaking its Substitute. Afterwards, Primarina can absolutely destroy teams when setting up with Calm Mind, KOing a huge amount of the metagame after even a couple of boosts. The EV spread and the whole set in general was provided by Ruft (good user) in this post I read, but just to sum up what he said, 136 Speed EVs is enough to always outspeed Conkeldurr, and 44 Special Defense EVs makes it so Primarina's Substitute isn't one-shot by Clefable's Moonblast. Additionally, though, I found out that 80 Defense EVs allows Primarina to live at least one Fishious Rend from Dracovish from full. Situational? Yeah, but it has definitely helped me in some battles.


Viper (Salazzle) @

Ability: Corrosion
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
Toxic
Sludge Wave

Flamethrower
Nasty Plot


"No one can hold their breath forever"

Salazzle, again, felt like a really good partner for Primarina, as it can take care of the Pokemon Primarina can't set up on so easily, such as Ferrothorn. In fact, Salazzle can very easily just switch in on Ferrothorn and do whatever I want. Usually the safest play is to just use Toxic, since Corrosion makes it free almost a majority of the time. Being able to just Toxic whatever I want is just so good for this team, since a prominent theme of it is to do as much chip damage as possible. Most notably, getting Toxic on the common Toxapex switch-in also helps Primarina a lot, especially if it's running Haze. I opted for Nasty Plot over Knock Off because oftentimes, when I force a switch with Salazzle, a Nasty Plot boost can occasionally confirm the win for me as long as Salazzle's still faster than everything and the opponent doesn't have anything that resists Sludge Wave and Flamethrower. Either way, they're also risking getting inflicted by Toxic.


Cypher (Ferrothorn) (M) @

Ability: Iron Barbs
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Impish Nature
Spikes
Body Press
Knock Off
Leech Seed


"Nothing stays hidden from me...nothing"

Ferrothorn is overall a great defensive backbone to have, and the utility it provides supports Primarina and Salazzle so much. Specifically, Spikes discourages switching a lot, which is definitely what must opponents will need to do versus the offensive duo on this team. While the Rocky Helmet isn't as great as Leftovers, it helps a lot versus Dracovish, chipping it down fast while Ferrothorn can potentially cripple it with Knock Off. Knock Off alongside Leech Seed is just great support for Primarina and Salazzle, crippling a lot of a Pokemon to make their job easier while still pressuring the opponent to switch for free chip via Spikes.


Sage (Clefable) (F) @

Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
Teleport
Moonblast
Wish
Protect


"I am not just your healer"

Clefable is a pretty self explanatory pick for this team. Primarina and Salazzle can suffer some chip consistently pressuring and forcing the opponent to switch, so Wish support is extremely helpful. Ferrothorn also appreciates the Wish support more than it would normally, considering it's giving up passive recovery via Leftovers. Clefable is also great to help either of them in safely with Teleport, avoiding potentially getting inflicted by status or taking too much damage, especially in Salazzle's case, considering how frail it is.


Breach (Hippowdon) (M) @

Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Impish Nature
Earthquake
Slack Off
Stealth Rock
Whirlwind


"If you're not getting shot at, you're doing something wrong"

Hippowdon I feel takes care of what Ferrothorn and Clefable can't. Specifically, Hippowdon is really helpful when facing Bisharp and Zeraora, though Grass Knot Zeraora can be trouble some at times. Once again, chip damage is always appreciated by Primarina and Salazzle, and Hippowdon can provide that with Stealth Rock and Whirlwind alongside Sand Stream. I suppose Seismitoad might also be able to take up this spot instead of Hippowdon in order to give me a better matchup versus Rotom-H, but for now I feel like I really need something for Bisharp and a better matchup versus Zeraora. I do need to dance around Rotom-H a lot, though.


Omen (Hydreigon) (M) @

Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
Dark Pulse
Draco Meteor
U-turn
Defog


"Watch them run"

Running your hazard removal on your Choice Scarf user can sometimes be very constraining, but oftentimes, Hydreigon can scare off whatever's on the field when it comes in, granting me a free Defog while still concealing the fact that it has Choice Scarf. It overall helps the team a lot being Choice Scarf anyways, putting pressure on Pokemon that can outspeed the rest of the team, such as Zeraora and Dragapult. The problem with hazards isn't even really that big of a deal, besides maybe the one situation where Primarina can take a hit from Dracovish from full, but otherwise Hydreigon is mostly used to deter fast Pokemon from taking advantage of the team.

Threats

While it can be worked around, Togekiss is probably the biggest threat to the team. Its Choice Scarf set outspeeds my entire team but Hydreigon, which can't even dent it anyways, and Air Slash flinches usually block me from my win condition. Its Nasty Plot is just as annoying, since I usually need to sacrifice a Pokemon just to break its Substitute, and it'll probably just switch out and do it all over again when it has the chance.


While Rotom-H doesn't absolutely destroy my team outright, it can definitely be an annoyance all game. Even then, it could easily secure my opponent's win if I play it even slightly incorrectly. My most reliable way to catch it is to KO it with Hydreigon, but I would just reveal that it's running Choice Scarf. Of course, Seismitoad can easily solve this problem, but I feel like Hippowdon is just as important to cover the bigger weakness in Bisharp.


Grass Knot Zeraora is pretty annoying for the team. If it is running the move, then I feel more pressured to keep switching out and rely on chip damage to wear it down. Regardless, the amount of resources I usually put into KOing it can leave me pretty weak for the opponent to clean up.


Weather is really difficult to work around in general. It pressures me to switch into Hippowdon to change the weather, but my opponent can easily take advantage. Common rain and sun sweepers, specifically Dracovish and Venusaur, respectively, put so much pressure on my team under weather and can easily overwhelm it by doing more than it can handle, especially in Dracovish's case.

Importables
Click here to get a PokePaste of the showcased team. Since I did talk about how Hippowdon could potentially be alternated with Seismitoad, click here to get one with Seismitoad instead. If you're really interested in the previous versions of this team, feel free to ask, and I'll be more than happy to share.

Shoutouts
Can't be a milestone RMT post without shoutouts I suppose. It'll be relatively short, since my Smogon circle is relatively small.
Jordy lyd maroon Panther-T Splash Jho Decem Stoward curiosity Rabia Diophantine
Straight up HOMIES. Always enjoy talking to y'all. Special shoutout to Diophantine for keeping it together when you tutored me in USUM OU way back when. It certainly helped keep my spark for competitive Pokemon alive.

GP Team
The GP homies are dope as hell, and while I only pop into the Discord to chat casually, it's always really enjoyable to chat with them. Special shoutout to lotiasite and martha for tutoring me to make better amchecks and eventually work my way up to becoming an official one. I definitely would've slowly lost interest if you two didn't help me do better.

There's so many other people that I've interacted on Smogon, but the list would be simply too long. To wrap it all though, I'd just like to thank those people for making Smogon a very enjoyable community. To those that have never even interacted with me, I still thank you for all you do on Smogon.
Conclusion
So yeah, that was pretty much the whole RMT. I'd love suggestions that anyone can make that would help make this team better, since I definitely won't call myself the best teambuilder. Anyways, I hope you all enjoyed my RMT! I hope I'll have enough sanity to make it to 3,000 posts.​
 
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I LOVE the way you wrote this post. Btw, seems more a fun team than a competitive one. I don't really like the idea of a defogger Hydregon, you have two hazard setters, isn't better using a rapid spinner? But I enjoy underrated mons like Primarina and Salazzle. I'll probably try your team and adapt it to my playstyle, and if you like I can share my opinions!
 

Astra

talk to me nice
is a Site Content Manageris a Top Social Media Contributoris a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Top Contributoris a Top Smogon Media Contributoris a Community Leader Alumnus
I LOVE the way you wrote this post. Btw, seems more a fun team than a competitive one. I don't really like the idea of a defogger Hydregon, you have two hazard setters, isn't better using a rapid spinner? But I enjoy underrated mons like Primarina and Salazzle. I'll probably try your team and adapt it to my playstyle, and if you like I can share my opinions!
I would be happy to hear the results. I will admit I tried to prioritize the team being fun a bit more than usual, but it has definitely made it much more enjoyable to play. And yeah, Defog Hydreigon is kind of weird, but it has helped me relieve some pressure from switching a lot late-game.
Brother moment :blobnom: (am I doing it right?)
I'll give it to ya.
 
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I would consider replace defog with something more useful on hydriegon. The reason why is that your team isn't all that weak to hazards, and I believe in 90% of situations you would rather stack spikes and keep your own rocks up than remove hazards as your team has a strong matchup vs bulkier or stallish teams between primarina and salazzle, with wishport support. This team also is inherrently quite resistant to hazards in general-- you have salazzle and clef who ignore hazard damage altogether, with salazzle also absorbing t-spikes, while hippowdon and ferro resist stealth rock, thus another reason why I believe 90% your better off trying to keep your own hazards up rather than removing your opponent's. Your team is also pretty much unaffected by (rare) sticky webs too. Against more offensive teams, it is, of course, very risky to use defog for obvious reasons since you dont want to lose momentum against a team full of dangerous wallbreakers.

For the replacement of defog, I would consider either thunder wave. Thunder wave allows you to at least cripple togekiss and fast stuff in general, which helps improves primarina's usefulness against offense.

I would also consider power whip somewhere onto ferrothorn, as it will improve your matchup vs rain since it allows ferrothorn to offensively threaten many rain team mons, plus it also you from getting stomped by an opposing sub-CM primarina. Power whip also allows improves the matchup vs non-bulk up zeraora significantly as power whip is a guaranteed 2HKO and puts it into range of being revenge-killed by a dark pulse. This is quite nice since almost no zeraora runs both bulk-up and grass knot on the same set. However, I must admit that forgoing either knock off or body press aren't really favorable, since forgoing knock off leaves you with no way to remove items, while skipping on body press worsens ferro's ability to pressure hazard removers. If I were to chose 1, it would probably be body press, since you aren't reliant on ferrothorn to beat bisharp and excadrill since you have hippowdon.
 
I've been trying to build around the Primarina+Salazzle core and it's really hard to cover everything when these two (especially Salazzle) don't have great difensive presence. They aren't exceptionally fast and Salazzle's STABs and power aren't amazing in dealing with most of the things she outspeeds, like Terrakion, Gengar, etc. Primarina has some resemblance of a defensive presence, though it's not something a subcm set should focus on. Also they cannot possibly carry the whole offense of the team due to them lacking immediate power or speed control.

There are however a couple alternatives. Corviknight is a decent candidate in the Hippowdon slot because it provides an actual ground immunity and a safer answer to Excadrill, which might seem easy to deal with between hippo and ferro, but it clicks mold breaker earthquake kinda brainlessly or at the very least force hippo/ferro in every single time.

Excadrill himself instead of hydreigon is extremely useful both with and without Hippowdon, because you can either go air balloon sand rush to beat every other drill on 1v1 and also beat any togekiss and zeraora, or go scarf mold breaker to beat those two + rotom-h. You may even go 4-attacks with rock slide on air balloon sand rush if you are desperate against rotom-h. You could also go a little bit more gimmicky with chople/shuca berry mold breaker, but scarf is inarguably more consistent as a tool for speed control and as a surprise for zeraora/drill. you would lose on a ghost resist, however.

If you go Corviknight, Seismitoad > Ferro also might improve your rotom-h matchup if you carry either toxic or knock off, while also providing stealth rocks, dracovish switch-in and rain match-up. I know toad+corv+clef is extremely boring but it proves to be one of if not the best 3-mon defensive core in OU, also packing both stealth rocks and defog.

EDIT: added minor changes to the team in order to improve some match-ups. sr on ferro so you can go toxic on hippo to surprise rotoms and water types like toad and pelippers. powerwhip + knock off is the best combo for ferro in this team because of hippo tanking for bisharps and drills, and for rain matchups (sswim toad and barraskewda). air balloon drill for speed control vs zeraora and scarf togekiss and surprise ground immunity against drills. draws in and chips rotom-h alongside sandstorm. sd appreciates rotom-h itself being put on a timer by toxic hippo or knock off ferro. if you want spikes+srock, consider rock slide>sd as i said before to hit rotom-h that would otherwise feast on every other pokèmon.

Primarina @ Leftovers
Ability: Torrent
EVs: 248 HP / 80 SpA / 44 SpD / 136 Spe
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Moonblast
- Calm Mind
- Substitute

Salazzle (F) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Corrosion
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Flamethrower
- Sludge Wave
- Nasty Plot
- Toxic

Ferrothorn @ Leftovers
Ability: Iron Barbs
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Impish Nature
- Power Whip
- Knock Off
- Leech Seed
- Stealth Rock

Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 7 Spe
- Moonblast
- Wish
- Protect
- Teleport

Hippowdon @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Sand Stream
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Impish Nature
- Earthquake
- Slack Off
- Whirlwind
- Toxic

Excadrill @ Air Balloon
Ability: Sand Rush
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Iron Head
- Rapid Spin
- Swords Dance
 
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spatula

I LOVE CHIPFLAVOUR
is a Tiering Contributor
Hi, I built a team with these same 6 and arrived at pretty much the exact same sets - scarf fog hydreigon last too. I think this speaks to how effective cm primarina and salazzle are - it seems like a lot of people are trying to build with either or both of these mons as they perform pretty well vs a lot of common defensive cores.

One pokemon you mentioned being an issue was rotom-h - a tech I chose to use on my ferrothorn is Toxic > Leech Seed, as this can cripple a rotom switching in on it. I found it useful in helping put rotom on a timer, although they may fear knock off anyway as an initial switch. Having hydreigon get weakened attempting to switch into rotom can be really bad vs some teams. I also think with wish support the lack of leech recovery is not so bad.

You also might consider running 8 attack EVs on Hippowdon to always OHKO excadrill with EQ, as with an SD it only needs some chip to kill ferro.

Overall, great team!
 
yo! I love the starting duo behind this team so much! That's an awesome combo :D

I took the set and ran with it... trying to make it more of my own. I turned it from more of a setup-balanced team to an aggro-balanced team

:cinderace: :primarina: :salazzle: :togekiss: :hippowdon: :hydreigon:

https://pokepast.es/ba1fbc112eefc743

seeing that it was named after Valorant Characters I renamed my team after my own Valorant 5 stack LOL

and in case you are worried about scared Dracovish I recommend using this set where you just add a choice scarf to Hydreigon as well
https://pokepast.es/8e22e646686f40db

btw max speed invested :Togekiss: defeats a lot of your teams weaknesses
:Dracovish: :Togekiss: :torkoal: :pelipper: :Venusaur:
with the exception of scarfed Dracovish, Rotom-H and Zeraora

but :Hippowdon: defeats Zeraora and Rotom-H
 
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