CAP 4 CAP 4 - Part 3 (Secondary Typing Poll 1)

[darkjjak]

Dragon gets my first vote. I think we could do a lot with it, plus after looking at what it could resist, there's a lot of good types that it can resist. Ice weak hurts, but to resist Water and Fire, in addition to Fighting and Bug makes up for it.

It has potential for great art work. I think KoA's true Cockatrice idea for Pyroak would be perfect for Poison/Dragon.


After thinking about this one, my second vote goes to Dark. While Drapion is one of my favorites of D/P, the type combination is pretty darn good in and of its own. One weakness, which can be worked with. Plus there's always the option of creating a Psychic/Dark/Ghost-typed Magnet Rise move for this Pokemon.

I personally wanted to vote for Flying if nothing for the good 4x resists that it would have, but the main point of it being able to absorb Toxic Spikes would be lost on a Flyer. If NO secondary type won, I won't mind. I think it'd be great to have another Weezing type Pokemon in OU.

Ground gets honorable mention for the resistances/immunities it gets above all else. I never thought of how cool it would be (is for the Nido's) to be immune to Sandstorm; absorb Toxic Spikes; AND resist Stealth Rock. I think that would be my choice among Rock, Ground, and Steel if I had to choose.

 

[DougJustDoug]

This has been mentioned a lot, so I went into the Shoddy code and verified it...

Poison/Steel will NOT absorb Toxic Spikes.

When a pokemon is switched in, the code does three tests to determine if the Toxic Spikes will affect them.

1. The pokemon type is currently immune to Ground. This normally means it is Flying, but Gravity can change that.
2. The pokemon has the active ability Levitate. Gravity changes that too.
3. The pokemon is Steel.

If any of those are true, the Toxic Spikes are completely ignored and the code "exits".

If all of those are false, the code goes on to test if the pokemon is Poison. In which case, the Toxic Spikes are absorbed.

That's why Pokemon like Crobat and Gengar do not absorb TSpikes. They are immune to TSpikes. So is Steel.

 

[Elevator Music]

Interesting test. Too bad it's kinda late to effect the voting in this topic in any way.

But maybe next topic....

 

[Gothic Togekiss]

How is it too late? It's a bold poll, you have the ability to change your vote before time is up, beside Sunday didn't say when this thread would end actually.

 

[Elevator Music]

Do you really think most people will?

And even then, I'd still prefer Poison/Steel over the others (besides Dragon). We're giving it Rapid Spin anyways...

 

[Deucalion2]

Thanks for that, Doug. (Please ignore my broken Enter button and pretend this is a paragraph break) Now that I know that, I'mma vote for: Ground, which allows for access to Stealth Rock, Sandstorm immunity, only adds 2 weaknesses, one of which isn't often seen in OU, etc. Second vote is for: Electric, because it gives no new weaknesses, useful resist, and adds plenty of Utility options.

 

[sanjay120]

Ty Doug, hopefully people will read this.

Sunday, added Fighting as a second type on my vote on the first page.

 

[Gothic Togekiss]

Do you really think most people will?

Well that depends on what kind of people you're referring to. If you're talking those whom vote and run then no, they won't care enough to go back and change their vote. If you're referring to people who actually care then yes, they would change their vote. You(in general) have to think that some didn't really cared about Toxic Spikes enough to worry about things like Poison/Steel not being able to suck up TS.

And even then, I'd still prefer Poison/Steel over the others (besides Dragon). We're giving it Rapid Spin anyways...

Let's not count our chickens before they hatch. We're not sure if it even get's Rapid Spin or not.

 

[Elevator Music]

Well that depends on what kind of people you're referring to. If you're talking those whom vote and run then no, they won't care enough to go back and change their vote. If you're referring to people who actually care then yes, they would change their vote. You(in general) have to think that some didn't really cared about Toxic Spikes enough to worry about things like Poison/Steel not being able to suck up TS.

Let's not count our chickens before they hatch. We're not sure if it even get's Rapid Spin or not.

I'm lazy and don't care about the project, so I won't change my vote. XP It's not that black and white, but yeah, you are pretty accurate in your statement.

Personally, I don't think a lot of people will change their vote. Poison/Steel will still probably make it to the next poll (however, I doubt it will get a lot of votes there).

I guess it's complicated to say the least, since the decision process itself was already tough (it was for me). The three reasons I didn't want Levitate on this guy were a)It's common enough as is, b)It's fanboyish, and c)It doesn't allow you to remove Toxic Spikes, which was apparently the seller for Poison in the first place and makes us hypocritical.

So a lot of the people who originally voted Poison would change their vote, except we're forgetting something. Not many of the people who voted Poison voted Poison/Steel (/assumption). I'm assuming this (which means I'm probably wrong) because another selling point for Poison was the Fighting resistance, which Steel doesn't give us anyways. Why not go the whole 10 yards and not allow it to suck up TS anyways? My logic is so flawed...

But you brought up something. When WILL this poll end?

 

[Pimplup]

Thanks for verifying Doug, that helps my vote.

1. Steel

Just because it won't absorb Toxic Spikes, doesn't mean anything. It's immune so it doesn't matter. It has a plethora of resistances, probably the most on the list. It would be the best Choice for Pure Utility IMO.

2. Ground

Has many resistances and immunity to Thunder Wave, as well as absorbing Toxic Spikes, quite a list there. The only reason it is my 2nd choice is because Steel has got it beat in the resistance department. But a bonus is STAB'ed EQ, very smexy coming off a wall:naughty:.

Well, I'm very torn between the 2 options. Couldn't decide which to put as main option. IDK, I hope one of them wins...

 

[Dane]

Ground - Stealth Rock resistance, doesn't remove fighting resistance, Thunder Wave immunity.

Dragon - Stealth Rock resistance, a lot of resistances. Don't really care about this one as much, but I'd rather have it than nothing.


Deleted last post in light of the Steel vs Poison coding for Toxic Spikes

 

[Majesano]

1.DarK

for the lack of weaknesses and because dark type may allow the support moves to fit more easily.

2.Dragon

Definitely good to have a support dragon and the resists are amazingly helpful too. Hopefully the sprite will make this one look like it can rapid spin haha.

 

[tennisace]

Even though Nidoking/queen exist with this typing, they're not cut it for OU use.

If they didn't exist i would have voted for this type combo. However, Nidoking and Nidoqueen work fine in OU. Crushking sweeps the unprepared, and Nidoqueen is an amazing spiker. Also, thats interesting that Poison/Steel doesn't absorb the spikes, but in the back of my mind it made sense.

 

[Time Mage]

1) Ground
2) No Secondary

Ground offers good additional resistances, and Poison alone is good enough, too.

 

[jagged_angel]

Oh my god, Pimplip and Dane you both just said some ridiculous stuff!

Dane, Dragon/Poison has no Rock resist.

Pimplup - Steel pokemon are Immune to all forms of poison, so it's going to ignore Toxic Spikes, not be crippled by them!

I might as well add, to G_T - if you think this Pure Utility poke might not get Rapid Spin, I'd like to see an explanation because that to me is one of the top 3 team supporting moves.

If there's any useful Utility move this might not get, it would be Gravity, since most of the type combos for this poke are 2x or 4x weak to Ground.

 

[Gothic Togekiss]

I might as well add, to G_T - if you think this Pure Utility poke might not get Rapid Spin, I'd like to see an explanation because that to me is one of the top 3 team supporting moves.

Maybe it has to do with expecting the unexpected and to not put all your hopes into one idea. There's also that "Design =/= move flavour" thing.

If they didn't exist i would have voted for this type combo. However, Nidoking and Nidoqueen work fine in OU. Crushking sweeps the unprepared, and Nidoqueen is an amazing spiker.

Okay..I'm not going to argue because I slightly don't care about Nidoking/Queen, beside I had a hell of a time trying to decided on which type combo to support.

 

[Pimplup]

Oh my god, Pimplip and Dane you both just said some ridiculous stuff!

Dane, Dragon/Poison has no Rock resist.

Pimplup - Steel pokemon are Immune to all forms of poison, so it's going to ignore Toxic Spikes, not be crippled by them!

I might as well add, to G_T - if you think this Pure Utility poke might not get Rapid Spin, I'd like to see an explanation because that to me is one of the top 3 team supporting moves.

If there's any useful Utility move this might not get, it would be Gravity, since most of the type combos for this poke are 2x or 4x weak to Ground.

Oh, wow, thanks for explaining, I know where I got confused. Your PM is about the same thing isn't it?? So, if it was Poison/Dragon, it would gain HP from Toxic Spikes but because it is Steel Type the code automatically exits like Doug said. I see now thanks:).

 

[Captain]

1. Electric

As if there hasn't said enough about this in the previous thread so if I say anything I'll probably just end up repeating things. This type does not add any weakness, 4x ground weak is not much worse than 2x ground weak when facing an EQ. You're going to have to look out for it either way. Despite not adding any new weaknesses it still adds three resistances, the most important of which is flying thanks to all the Togekiss spam. Electric is an excellent STAB, the only thing resisting it is Grass, which isn't used much and Ground.

2. Ground

Resisting Rock is very useful as is having Ground STAB. Being immune to T-wave is small bonus as well.

And whatever you choose please don't pick steel, it takes away the fighting resist and the toxic absorption the two major reasons poison was picked in the first place.

 

[Elevator Music]

And whatever you choose please don't pick steel, it takes away the fighting resist and the toxic absorption the two major reasons poison was picked in the first place.

If you're going to argue this, then don't leave it at Poison/Steel. The following type combos also wouldn't fit:

- Poison/Flying
- Poison/Dark
- Poison/Rock
- Poison/Ice
- Poison/Normal
- Levitate in general

What if I don't mind being neutral to Fighting but do want TS removed? We don't all want TS absorption + Fighting resist, and since most of us didn't even vote Poison anyways, why limit ourselves with that criteria? Shouldn't we just use both of thos characteristics as (dis/)advantages for the typing we want?

 

[darkie]

Ground - Stealth Rock resistance, doesn't remove fighting resistance, Thunder Wave immunity.

Dragon - Stealth Rock resistance, a lot of resistances. Don't really care about this one as much, but I'd rather have it than nothing.


Deleted last post in light of the Steel vs Poison coding for Toxic Spikes

Dragon doesn't resist Rock.

 

[cyberzero]

Electric

The 4x ground weakness will keep it from being broken, and it ends up with a whole lot of resistances, always useful for a utility Pokemon.

Dragon

Always interesting, many resistances as well.

 

[AJC]

Dragon

Like i said in the first typing poll i really want to see a a true supporting dragon than a attacking one because all the ones currently existing (and legal for OU) are ment for attacking and Altara while having supporter like stats it lacks a true supporting movepool.

Ground

Is my choice for a secondary typing because rock resists are aways fun with T-tar being everywere stab Earthquake and T-wave immune are just nice side bonuses.

 

[Instinctive]

STEEL-lots of resistances, and only 2 weaks...I forsee levitate as a possible ability, but only with an alternate option for those who want TS absorbtion/

DARK-only one weak, lots of resists, and STAB against ghosts. I like it, I like it, I like it.


The main bonus here is that if we give it gravity, it doesn't hurt it because its already really weak to EQ anyway.

 

[Aldaron]

Hitit4three, Poison / Steel will not absorb Toxic Spikes, as Doug's post will tell you if you scroll up.

 

[phalanx]

i see all these resists and wonder why infernape isn't used as often as it should, anyway we have to be careful with the typing pyroak is a pain to counter, have a few hard to counter pokes the game becomes a slog, I say take flying/poison then it wont be broken in the same team as pyroak, we have to consider other factors, steel resists rock, this sounds theoymonish and I know we are making a new pokemon, but we are forgetting other factors it is a team of 6, pyroak has barely any counters having this in the same team as it, could in fact break the metagame.
perhaps this post might seem a little off topic but its a factor to consider at the early voting stage and has a relevance, I play the server the 3 we have currently are hard to beat together but not impossible throw a heavy resist pokemon in, we might get problems.