CAP 28 - Part 1 - Concept Submissions

[Sereg]

Name: - Can't Let You Do That

Description: - A Pokémon that denies the opponent move options.

Justification: This would be a mix of an Archetype and Actualisation concept.

The Archetype would be a Pokémon that causes the opposing Mon to be unable to use it's moves at will, and therefore crippling Mon that are overly reliant on such things, such as spammable attacks, blocking attempted setups or sweeps, or removing a wall's status moves. Many Mon use strategies such as these to some extent, such as using Taunt on a wall, but it would be different to have a Mon that specialises in such strategies. This would result in it playing as an unusual form of support Mon that plays differently from typical support Mons. This would be an unusual role that would be nice as an addition that supported a team in a new way while forcing the opponent to be more careful with certain plays that would previously be simply spammable.

In terms of Actualization, this would be a new option to provide unusual support, giving it a separate niche from previous support Mon, allowing new potential varieties of teams to flourish. It would also be a new variety of threat to prepare for, providing a new point of consideration when team building, as one might need to consider the possibility of a Mon losing access to a move. It would be interesting to see if a Mon can focus on such strategies as their main selling point and how this could be effective in the meta.

Questions to be answered:

• In which circumstances is it most useful to deny an opponent the opportunity to use specific moves?
• How can a Mon benefit from dedicating more than one moves lot to move denial over a Mon that just uses Taunt as its only move denial?
• How can types and abilities aid moves in move denial?
• Why is Taunt used more than other move denial moves and how can other forms of move denial moves be encouraged?
• What other moves can this Mon use while still maintaining a move denial focus?
• How can we use move denial without causing frustrating 50/50s that are unhealthy and frustrating to the meta?
• In what way does move denial distinguish itself from other forms of support?
• How does a move denial specialist make itself attractive enough to justify its role on a team?

Explanation: Having options is helpful. One can try to counter that by taking options away from your opponent. The idea is to end up with more options than your opponent, leaving them relatively helpless. Some games, such as Magic: The Gathering, refer to this strategy as control and it can be pretty powerful. I wanted to try making a Mon with a similar role and seeing how it works out in a Pokémon metagame.

Forms of control already exist in Pokémon metas, most infamously, trapping. Trapping can be very powerful and sometimes overbearing enough that forms of it are usually banned. I wanted to go in a different direction though to see if it would still be effective without being overbearing.

Move control moves are already used to some extent in Pokémon metas. Taunt specifically tends to be used. However, I wanted to focus on doing more than just throwing on Taunt onto a set. I wanted to see how much this strategy could be pushed and how other moves could help out with this strategy. Encore is probably the second most used of these moves. Sometimes it is used to trap a Mon in setup, or Wobuffet uses it to properly use it's other moves. Wobuffet is probably the closest example to what I envision, but it relies on trapping, specifically the banned Shadow Tag and tends to be either under or overwhelming depending on whether or not Shadow Tag is banned, with it being irritating either way. It is also a counterattack specialist. I was hoping for something more balanced that is more supportive and isn't a counter attacker.

Other examples of moves like this include Torment, Disable, Imprison, Spite, Grudge, and even Powder. Types with immunities, whether to specific moves, or whole other types, can also add to move denial. Certain abilities can do so to, such as providing an immunity to a type, such as Levitate, Water Absorb or Lightning Rod, to a set of moves, such as Bulletproof or Soundproof, or a Psuedo-immunity like Magic Bounce or Psychic Surge. They can also be something like Cursed Body or Pressure.

Walls and stallbreakers tend to use these tactics most often, but we don't have to lock ourselves into those rolls if we decide otherwise. Suicide Leads, with their tendency to set things up for the rest of the team have also used such tactics. Heatran has used Torment in addition to its type and ability providing immunities for such effects as well. Pyukumuku has a limited move pool but uses such tactics to be an effective wall and PP stall with block, spite and Unaware. Despite their greater options, Toxapex and Aegislash have used the same strategy in some sets.

Moves like Torment and Disable are especially effective against Choice locked Mon, and with the high prevalence of Choice users in the meta right now, this could be a good time for a Mon that would capitalise on that and help reign it in a bit.

 

[dex]

Name: - Can't Let You Do That

Description: - A Pokémon that denies the opponent move options.

Justification: This would be a mix of an Archetype and Actualisation concept.

The Archetype would be a Pokémon that causes the opposing Mon to be unable to use it's moves at will, and therefore crippling Mon that are overly reliant on such things, such as spammable attacks, blocking attempted setups or sweeps, or removing a wall's status moves. Many Mon use strategies such as these to some extent, such as using Taunt on a wall, but it would be different to have a Mon that specialises in such strategies. This would result in it playing as an unusual form of support Mon that plays differently from typical support Mons. This would be an unusual role that would be nice as an addition that supported a team in a new way while forcing the opponent to be more careful with certain plays that would previously be simply spammable.

In terms of Actualization, this would be a new option to provide unusual support, giving it a separate niche from previous support Mon, allowing new potential varieties of teams to flourish. It would also be a new variety of threat to prepare for, providing a new point of consideration when team building, as one might need to consider the possibility of a Mon losing access to a move. It would be interesting to see if a Mon can focus on such strategies as their main selling point and how this could be effective in the meta.

Questions to be answered:

• In which circumstances is it most useful to deny an opponent the opportunity to use specific moves?
• How can a Mon benefit from dedicating more than one moves lot to move denial over a Mon that just uses Taunt as its only move denial?
• How can types and abilities aid moves in move denial?
• Why is Taunt used more than other move denial moves and how can other forms of move denial moves be encouraged?
• What other moves can this Mon use while still maintaining a move denial focus?
• How can we use move denial without causing frustrating 50/50s that are unhealthy and frustrating to the meta?
• In what way does move denial distinguish itself from other forms of support?
• How does a move denial specialist make itself attractive enough to justify its role on a team?

Explanation: Having options is helpful. One can try to counter that by taking options away from your opponent. The idea is to end up with more options than your opponent, leaving them relatively helpless. Some games, such as Magic: The Gathering, refer to this strategy as control and it can be pretty powerful. I wanted to try making a Mon with a similar role and seeing how it works out in a Pokémon metagame.

Forms of control already exist in Pokémon metas, most infamously, trapping. Trapping can be very powerful and sometimes overbearing enough that forms of it are usually banned. I wanted to go in a different direction though to see if it would still be effective without being overbearing.

Move control moves are already used to some extent in Pokémon metas. Taunt specifically tends to be used. However, I wanted to focus on doing more than just throwing on Taunt onto a set. I wanted to see how much this strategy could be pushed and how other moves could help out with this strategy. Encore is probably the second most used of these moves. Sometimes it is used to trap a Mon in setup, or Wobuffet uses it to properly use it's other moves. Wobuffet is probably the closest example to what I envision, but it relies on trapping, specifically the banned Shadow Tag and tends to be either under or overwhelming depending on whether or not Shadow Tag is banned, with it being irritating either way. It is also a counterattack specialist. I was hoping for something more balanced that is more supportive and isn't a counter attacker.

I just wanna say this idea is super cool and there's a lot more than just Taunt and Encore to work with. I think that abilities like Pressure and Magic Bounce and moves like Embargo, Spite, and especially Torment, one of my favorite moves, are all cool options that fit under the concept for a Mon like this. Honestly really like this idea, just wanted it to be fully fleshed out.

 

[Rabia]

Name: - Can't Let You Do That

Description: - A Pokémon that denies the opponent move options.

Justification: This would be a mix of an Archetype and Actualisation concept.

The Archetype would be a Pokémon that causes the opposing Mon to be unable to use it's moves at will, and therefore crippling Mon that are overly reliant on such things, such as spammable attacks, blocking attempted setups or sweeps, or removing a wall's status moves. Many Mon use strategies such as these to some extent, such as using Taunt on a wall, but it would be different to have a Mon that specialises in such strategies. This would result in it playing as an unusual form of support Mon that plays differently from typical support Mons. This would be an unusual role that would be nice as an addition that supported a team in a new way while forcing the opponent to be more careful with certain plays that would previously be simply spammable.

In terms of Actualization, this would be a new option to provide unusual support, giving it a separate niche from previous support Mon, allowing new potential varieties of teams to flourish. It would also be a new variety of threat to prepare for, providing a new point of consideration when team building, as one might need to consider the possibility of a Mon losing access to a move. It would be interesting to see if a Mon can focus on such strategies as their main selling point and how this could be effective in the meta.

Questions to be answered:

• In which circumstances is it most useful to deny an opponent the opportunity to use specific moves?
• How can a Mon benefit from dedicating more than one moves lot to move denial over a Mon that just uses Taunt as its only move denial?
• How can types and abilities aid moves in move denial?
• Why is Taunt used more than other move denial moves and how can other forms of move denial moves be encouraged?
• What other moves can this Mon use while still maintaining a move denial focus?
• How can we use move denial without causing frustrating 50/50s that are unhealthy and frustrating to the meta?
• In what way does move denial distinguish itself from other forms of support?
• How does a move denial specialist make itself attractive enough to justify its role on a team?

Explanation: Having options is helpful. One can try to counter that by taking options away from your opponent. The idea is to end up with more options than your opponent, leaving them relatively helpless. Some games, such as Magic: The Gathering, refer to this strategy as control and it can be pretty powerful. I wanted to try making a Mon with a similar role and seeing how it works out in a Pokémon metagame.

Forms of control already exist in Pokémon metas, most infamously, trapping. Trapping can be very powerful and sometimes overbearing enough that forms of it are usually banned. I wanted to go in a different direction though to see if it would still be effective without being overbearing.

Move control moves are already used to some extent in Pokémon metas. Taunt specifically tends to be used. However, I wanted to focus on doing more than just throwing on Taunt onto a set. I wanted to see how much this strategy could be pushed and how other moves could help out with this strategy. Encore is probably the second most used of these moves. Sometimes it is used to trap a Mon in setup, or Wobuffet uses it to properly use it's other moves. Wobuffet is probably the closest example to what I envision, but it relies on trapping, specifically the banned Shadow Tag and tends to be either under or overwhelming depending on whether or not Shadow Tag is banned, with it being irritating either way. It is also a counterattack specialist. I was hoping for something more balanced that is more supportive and isn't a counter attacker.

cool idea that, like the above poster says, could probably use more fleshing out. I think in specific something that'd be of use is to address more than just Wobbuffet when you bring up examples, because there are a LOT of Pokemon that have employed such strategies, be it suicide leads, TormentTran, Block + Spite Toxapex/Pyukumuku/Aegislash, etc. going into these examples and talking about how the idea of move blocking complements their kit/why they're good employers of this strategy would help imo

 

[Wolf134]

Speed Control 101 (Wolf134): Speed Control is a very interesting topic, and I think there's a lot of very interesting ways in which this could go. I recommend you to read this old concept by Pip, which I think could help you to flesh out your submission a bit more.

Much appreciate the feedback as always. Thanks, Mx

 

[Gekokeso]

Decided to give feedback on my favourite concepts so far

• Name -Roadblock
  
  
• Description - A Pokemon that excels at slowing down, punishing or stopping the rampant pivoting strategies in the current metagame.

Very fleshed out concept, All of the things that felt unresolved such as answering the doubts of trying to block attacks that lack immunities such as U-turn have been put to question. If this concept doesn’t win I’d suggest to save it for later

WIP

Name - Knock It Off!

Description - This Pokemon aims to discourage the opponent from using the move Knock Off.

This concept looks very good, I’m always a fan of concepts that can answer problematic things in the metagame. It still needs way more depth tho, it needs more explanation as to why knock Off is so centralising in the metagame, which mons are already being used to absorb knock offs to some extent(such as Mandibuzz), which mons would benefit the most from having no fear of lowing their item or taking a massive hit (such as Marowak-A and slowbro), and which knock off users are the most problematic in the metagame.

Name: Abilities Some Consider to be Unnatural

Description: A Pokemon that manipulates an opposing Pokemon's ability, either by ignoring, suppressing or replacing it.

By far my favourite concept yet, not only is a very fleshed out concept, but the idea of manipulating the abilities of other mons can have serious effects on the metagame. While I can understand Mx concerns of some methods of Ability manipulation such as Neutralising gas might outclass other methods during discussion, I also feel that this is an extremely maleable concept, as the end result can be taken in many fun directions. Between a wall that cripples mons that rely heavily on their abilities such as Guts conk or Azu, or Stall breaker that can switch-in to regenerator mons and prevent their healing, the possibilities are endless.

WIP

Name -CAP Concept Makeover

Description- Take a previously unviable CAP concept in the current meta game and remake the concept.
Justification- I think this is an actualization concept, focused on breathing new life into old ideas.

I really also like the concept of atoning for past mistakes by redoing CAP mons that have fallen out of grace with time. While I can understand that not all CAPs will stay viable forever, it would really be sad to see so many projects in which so many talented people worked on to go to waste.

 

[Riguor]

To Mx, I replaced my old concept.

 

[The Crusade]

Final submittal

Name: "Pokémon is a Contact Sport"

Description: A Pokémon that incentivizes and maximizes the effectiveness of contact-based moves, even if its typing may afford it access to powerful non-contact options.

Justification: I would consider this concept an exercise in Actualization. Hitherto, the mechanics of Pokémon have punished the initiation of contact more often than they have rewarded it. Moves like Baneful Bunker, items like Rocky Helmet, and abilities like Static and Gooey—to name but a few—all make contact moves a disadvantage for attackers who might use them. The ability Long Reach was even developed with intention to offset these effects. On the flipside, mechanics that make contact advantageous are rare. Megas Aerodactyl, Metagross, and Charizard X have Tough Claws; however, the former learns no useful contact STAB moves, and the latter two learn only contact STAB on the physical side. Dusk Lycanroc is a much more interesting user of this ability, alternating between contact Accelerock and non-contact Stone Edge to great effect. It is the best offensive example of contact exploration we have yet seen, but it is nonexistent in OU. More recently, Urshifu debuted with Unseen Fist and illustrated that contact is fertile ground for analysis.

Questions To Be Answered:

• In what circumstances is a contact move preferable over an equivalent alternative?
• How common are those circumstances in a game that is unfriendly to contact?
• What tools do we have that can affect those circumstances and incentivize contact?
• How does a Pokémon move from mitigating the effects that punish contact to excelling truly as a contact-user?
• Are there ways to de-incentivize moves that do not make contact, either on our part or the opponent's? In the latter hypothetical, does this create a scenario where the opponent may find contact advantageous?

Explanation: Per the justification, there are abilities that free contact moves from their numerous risk factors (Long Reach), improve the effect of contact moves by damage output or secondary effect (Tough Claws, Poison Touch), or give them a unique advantage without comparison (Unseen Fist). The latter two categories are notable for their gross positive effect on initiating contact, even if other factors like Static may ultimately rain on their parade. I hold that examples of species that actually incentivize contact are rare or else nonexistent in the history of OU—the likes of Mega Metagross and Urshifu have no choice but to use contact STAB moves. Only the likes of Tough Claws Lycanroc and Poison Touch Muk actually come close to weighing the benefits of contact against the many risk factors. I argue that the time is right for CAP to unravel the means of exploiting contact when less punishable options are on the table.

 

[Mx]

Alright, now that we have some new concepts again, time for another round:

Can't let you do that: This is a very interesting idea, as many of these disruption moves would make for very interesting discussions and I think there should be a very healthy number of ways in which we could face this concept.

Pokemon is a contact sport (The Crusade): Contact moves are an interesting topic, as it is true that there are many more ways to dissuade them than to incentivize them; however that same issue also makes me think that there aren't many ways in which we could implement this idea currently. I think you should consider expanding this concept to also include the ways in which we could dissuade our opponent from using contact moves too, as that would open a lot of possibilities.

Going Critical (Riguor): I think this is a great improvement over your last submission, as critical hits are certainly something that I think is pretty unexplored. Unfortunately, I have the same issue that with the previous concept, as I'm not completely sure there are enough mechanics in game to make this concept really engaging and there might be a serious risk we'll be stuck into a very specific route early on. Finally, I'd strongly suggest you to be more neutral about Merciless. Everybody has their own preferences of how a concept should go, but you should never say them out loud, especially in the concept submission itself, as this only incentivizes railroading on later stages.

Finally, with this discussion already slowing down a bit, I think it's time we start wrapping things up. This is a 48 hours warning before the end of this thread. In case your haven't finished your concept yet, please do so before the deadline. If anyone needs an extension, feel free to contact me and I'll consider it.

 

[MrDollSteak]

My next round of feedback on some of the posted concepts!

Catch All

I like the concept in theory, because I think it raises some interesting questions about how to have sets that are optimised for certain threats, though I do agree with Mx that at this stage it strikes me as a bit too broad. I do realise that the point is perhaps to be able to cover any archetype of Pokemon, but I think it would still be helpful to consider which type of Pokemon is going to be the main subject of this proposal.

Going Critical

Critical hit mechanics are definitely interesting, but as you mention in your propsal, Urshifu does kind of do this, and is of course a very recent and powerful Pokemon which I think makes the timing of this project a little bit off. I think there are some productive discussions that can be had, but overall it feels like it might be a bit shallow as Mx says because Sniper and Super Luck would basically be mandatory.

Cheapskate

I really like this concept! I think as we've seen with Astrolotl, movepools can sometimes get bloated, and the sheer unpredictability of sets can sometimes be more annoying than it is beneficial. I like the comparisons to Landorus-T as well, as it suggests that multiple different sets can be run, although still using the core 'useful' moves.

A Stable Clefable

I think this is a very interesting concept that engages well with our recent history, and our history making first CAP-only ban, and encourages us to reflect on what exactly was the problem with it. That being said, I'm pretty sure that we're all aware that the main issue was WishPort, and subsequently don't think that CAP 28 will be able to mimic Clefable without it, which is at the very least, quite contentious.

Speed Control 101

I like this concept! Speed control is a fascinating part of the games because of how important Speed is generally, and think that this might be an ideal metagame to consider it due to the relatively little amount of priority in the metagame itself, allowing for Speed manipulation to be perhaps at its most viable.

Substitute Teacher

As others have mentioned, this is a really deep concept with a lot of room for exploration. Substitute is one of those cool moves that everyone gets but not everything can use effectively. I also think this is a good time to explore it considering that there is some potential counterplay this generation with Dragapult being a major Infiltrator user. Props for a very communicative name too!

Hidden Potential

I actually really like this concept too. A physical Hidden Power simulator at the cost of an item is actually a very interesting prospect, fair play for thinking of it! I think there's a lot of great depth to how this is used, having synergy with types that don't actually have particularly strong physical STAB, as well as of course the intended usage as strong coverage. I don't know if sacrificing an item will be viable in all honesty, especially in regards to Knock Off. If research shows that memories can't be knocked then this concept would also be the fabled Knock-Off punisher we've been looking for.

CAP Concept Makeover

I like the idea of redoing concepts in general, but I agree with Mx that at this stage it's a bit broad. I'd prefer it if you honed in on a specific concept there, so that concept assessment is more focused.

The Right Type for Me!

Considering this concept also takes advantage of some wacky mechanics, I'm all for it! Considering Protean/Libero and Color Change are banned however, this concept would ultimately only be taking advantage of Soak or Magic Powder which I worry may be too difficult to make work.

Hook, Line and Sinker

I think lures are really cool, however, as a few others have mentioned, a lure can only effectively act as a lure if it is a surprise. I wonder how it would be possible to create a 'main set' that is based around luring that isn't just having a lot of coverage and being unsure what it's going to click.

Dotty the Chip-monk

I'm not a fan of this unfortunately. Damage over time doesn't really work in Pokemon the same way as it does in other games, and as such don't actually agree that it 'hasn't been explored' much. Toxic and Will-O-Wisp are pretty defining statuses, Sandstorm provides some chip and is sometimes built around, or at the very least seen fairly regularly because of Hippo being viable.

Stick it to Em

Sticky Web is a cool move, however, as Mx suggested, I don't think it is one that is deep enough to base a whole concept around, in comparison to something like Substitute that has a range of different usages. Sticky Web is something that is ultimately just clicked once and then used by the team to sweep, which doesn't seem like something that will be hard to optimize.

Can't Let you Do That

I like this concept a lot (and not just because it seems like it would lead to an interesting 1v1 mon). I think moves like Torment, Encore, Disable and even Taunt to an extent are very under explored in the current meta game, and with such a large number of Choiced attackers running around, it seems like the ideal time to try out something like this.

Pokemon is a Contact Sport

Like Mx, I too worry that there might not be enough ways to actually encourage contact moves outside of just Tough Claws, and it may be more valuable to also consider implementing anti-contact strategies within the discussion too. I think it's possible that a Pokemon could be created that punishes opposing contact, while also using contact moves itself which would arguably have some cool flavour associated with it.

 

[The Crusade]

MrDollSteak Mx I'll have to brainstorm on it. The concept centers on exploring what rewards contact and whether the reward is even valuable, not multiplying the things that already punish it. Is there perhaps a way to de-incentivize the opposing team's non-contact moves? I suspect typing might be important towards that end, which is not something to discuss here, but the broader idea may be worth adding to the submittal. I'll work it out tomorrow.

 

[Wolf134]

Speed Control 101

I like this concept! Speed control is a fascinating part of the games because of how important Speed is generally, and think that this might be an ideal metagame to consider it due to the relatively little amount of priority in the metagame itself, allowing for Speed manipulation to be perhaps at its most viable.

Thanks, MrDollSteak, for your input.

 

[flying moose]

WIP

Name - Extreme Specialist
Description - A pokemon that truly excels at one particular task--unrivaled in its ability to perform this role--but at the expense of being mediocre or even terrible at other roles.
Justification- This is a Target project, as we will be striving to create a pokemon that is balanced by both exceptionalism and mediocrity. Additionally, we will be picking a function and designing a mon that is a master at it, making this an Actualization concept.
Questions To Be Answered -

• What roles are viable for, and would benefit from, specialization?
• What tools are needed to make a pokemon excel at a given function?
• Is such excellence derived from a limited but highly-tailored toolkit, or from access to multiple means to accomplish the same task?
• Good pokemon usually have diverse options. How does a pokemon with limited capabilities remain relevant?
• How do teams benefit from the inclusion of a specialist over a jack-of-all-trades?

Explanation - Many of the most successful pokemon are capable of performing multiple support roles or are unpredictable in their options. For example, Clefable can absorb status, set hazards, remove items, heal teammates, or even sweep with Calm Mind, while Excadrill can function as a wallbreaker, a sweeper, or offensive support (hazard removal and hazard setting). But can a pokemon make it to higher-level play by doing the opposite? By having one, recognizable task to accomplish, but completing it with such unrivaled capability that it transcends the pokemon's weaknesses? This concept will explore what it takes to excel as a specialist. We will discuss which tasks would warrant specialization, examine what it takes to be a master at that task, and determine the capability required for this guru to avoid being overshadowed by more flexible pokemon.

 

[Sereg]

Thanks for the feedback. I added some more to my explanation in response.

I will try to add some feedback for others tonight as well

Edit:

The Stat Bully: Like last time this was submitted, I am interested in this idea as it's an unusual strategy to get to work, mostly limited to Intimidate spam in VGC. But there are tools available for it that could be interesting to try.

Silicon: CAP tends to prefer offensive Mon to walls, but I am up for a wall, especially an unusual one. That said, I find "crippling weakness" a bit vague and would prefer a more defined goal.

Roadblock: I do like the idea of punishing a powerful strategy and pivot moves are among my favourite to try and punish as it can be a bit overly ubiquitous.

Regicide: I tend to dislike concepts depending on a specific other Mon. What happens when the meta shifts?

I've got you covered: I do like set versatility, but again, I dislike the dependence on specific Mon in designing which sets to counter. I prefer broad strategies to specific mon. Again, meta shifts can play havoc on such a concept.

Teaching an old dog new tricks: I love making a more niche strategy better. This kind of thing certainly appeals to me in that sense. Maybe this concept is a little broad at the moment as it leaves us to decide what we're bringing back later.

I'm no lazy weakling!: This feels a little too generically good to me. I get you are going for role compression, but that in itself feels generically good to me. I like CAP to go for ideas that are unusual, interesting and challenging as opposed to just good. Again, we're supposed to be learning and trying new things.

Practicing one kick 10000 times: I adored Dracovish, so I am all for this. Yes, this is obviously not going to be a Dracovish clone, but Mons like this have a very distinct and fun feel I would love to capitalise on.

Gun Fort: I normally dislike smashing two roles together as a concept as I indicated earlier. However, this does imply an interesting strategy I like. Something that starts as a wall and then sets up to become offensive is not entirely unique. It would feel a bit like early OU Corviknight with different mechanics. But it does seem like an unusual and fun strategy, so I like this a lot more than similar concepts.

Paste Eater: I feel like this is better in theory than practice as glue Mon vary a lot and so you either become generically good or counter specific Mon, which as I said earlier, I dislike in a concept.

Ahead of the Curve: I love exploring specific mechanics and priority has plenty to explore. It also provides an interesting restriction if we want a Mon so dependent upon priority that it can't use more powerful moves without it. I like this concept.

Form and Function: Again, while this would be fun, this could only really be done in a framework CAP which this isn't.

Not My Type: This is almost identical to a previous submission I made myself, so naturally I adore it.

Patience is the key: This is a very unusual strategy and I therefore love it. I think a phasing wallbreaker would probably do this best? Keen to find out.

Boxing Gloves: We tend to give CAPs great typings, so it would be nice to restrict that from us. This is a good chance for a monotype too, which is very rare in CAP. Overall, I like it.

You're Going Down With Me: I was extremely disappointed by Plasmanta, so I would love for this to redeem the concept.


43% Non-Toxic: Normal poison is explored less than most other statuses, so I am certainly up for fixing that.

Anti Stereo-Type: This reminds me of Stratagem. That is cool, and we could certainly do something similar again, but I feel like if we redid a CAP concept, there are more, shall we say, "urgent" ones.

Knock it off!: I feel similarly about this to Roadblock. It's a case where I support countering a strategy. I think countering Knock Off could be quite fun.

Abilities Some Consider To Be Unnatural: I love playing with abilities, so this catches my eye. I do agree that Neutralising Gas is a bit heavy handed and would prefer that we try something different though.

Onslaught: Encouraging spam is an interesting strategy that makes me like this, but I agree with the caution against partner concepts. They don't do well for a variety of reasons.

Hit, Run, Sack, and Repeat: Again, I love encouraging different strategies. This sounds really fun.

Catch All: Being compared to Landorus isn't going to encourage me. I disliked it's ubiquitousness. Also, basically, his is a Mon that easily beats most Mon one on one but is easily beaten two on one, right? I think I he what you're going for, but again, this comes across as generically good.

Going Critical!: As said, I love exploring mechanics, so I think exploring critical hits could be a lot of fun.

Cheapskate: I like challenging CAP with a restriction they don't usually observe, so this is something I can really get behind.

A Stable Clefable: I am torn. On the one hand, Clefable might not even stay banned for that long. On the other, this is a unique opportunity. I do not see myself supporting this over many other options, but the unusual opportunity does mean that if it wins I will be really interested in the result (though admittedly, I always am).

Speed Control 101: I do like the idea of dedicating a Mon to solve a specific team building problem. Speed control is a pretty interesting role in general, so I can see this as being pretty fun.

Substitute Teacher: I was surprised to realise how much I enjoy concepts revolving around a specific move. Though, I guess it's an extension of loving specific strategies and that is certainly clear with substitute. It's an important strategy that would be great to play with.

Hidden Potential: That love of move based concepts increases dramatically for moves with limited distribution and unusual mechanics. You can pull off some fascinating ideas with this concept.

CAP Concept Makeover: I agree with the consensus that this would be great, but you should really specify which CAP you want to redo

The Right Type for Me: Type changing is a fascinating mechanic that I would love to see explored more.

Hook, Line and Sinker: Like I said the last time there was a lure concept, lures are supposed to be surprised. Designing a Mon to be a lure inherently ruins the surprise.

Dotty The Chip Monk: I really like damage over time. It's an entertaining mechanic, though it could certainly use a boost. Here's where the concept comes in. Would love to pull this off.

Stick it to em: Sticky web is such a unique move and it has so few users compared to every other hazard (except stealth steel from G-Max Copperajah). A better sticky web user would be great.

Pokémon is contact sport: I see why you don't want to punish contact. You're trying to punish NON-contact. This isn't great idea, but I don't know if Game Freak has really given us the tools to do that yet.

Extreme Specialist: Honestly, this sounds like it can go in too many directions. We need to decide what it is we want to specialise in. In addition, being bad at something that isn't your job isn't much of a limitation if you never have to perform that task. A sweeper doesn't NEED to be an acceptable wall, for example. As such, this ends up almost as vague as "make a good Pokémon". Sorry.

 

[sneakyjeans]

Name: Leading the Charge

Description: A Pokemon designed to generate strong momentum at the start of a battle but has little use after the first few turns

Justification: This concept falls into the Archetype category. The intent is to create a Pokemon that maximizes your chances of victory as early as possible, and that means designing around the idea of a "lead" option. In older generations when your team was anonymous and your starting Pokemon was locked in, the concept of a lead was essential. We're in a flexible meta where you can choose what is best by analyzing the opponents team. This concept is about creating a Pokemon that simplifies that decision by being a reliable and powerful early choice. This concept has it's difficulties that will allow for interesting dialogue and key decision points, particularly around counters and threats. As CAP 28 rises to the front lines, teams designed to ensure they don't fall behind early will help us learn more about what it means to start a battle on the right foot.

Questions to be Answered:

• Is it possible to create an ideal lead when the opponent has visibility into the strategy up front?
• What strategies are the most effective to set a team up for success? Support or offence?
• If a counter prevents CAP 28 from fulfilling its function from the start of the battle, is it a wasted team slot?
• What are the most effective options for a Pokemon to lose their ability to contribute later on in a battle?

Explanation: I played competitively more in Gen 4 and Gen 5, and I have strong memories of building teams around the idea of Lead Azelf. At that time, when a lead was anonymous and locked in, how you started the battle was massively important. Not only did it initiate your first set of moves, but it told your opponent a hint about what you were hiding behind the curtain. I thought a concept that reintroduces the idea of core leads to teams and is designed around gaining as much early momentum as possible would be an interesting experiment in our current climate where team anonymity isn't a factor.

 

[jas61292]

Don't have a concept of my own this time, but I wanted to comment a bit on a few of my favorites.

Name: Gun Fort
Description: This pokemon fulfills a primarily defensive role on a team, such as a Tank or Wall, while utilizing purely offensive Setup Moves to also function as a setup sweeper or wallbreaker.

So first off, while I'm naturally inclined more towards offensive mons, I do love me some fat boosters, so this concept naturally appealed to me from the start for that reason. But what makes me really interested here is that this concept would explore the line between a mon that plays purely defensively, and one that utilizes its bulk but can then go on the offensive. Doing this concept would require walking a tightrope, as we need to make sure its not so good defensively that it would prefer to forgo boosting, but at the same time, we probably don't want something that would just overlook its bulk and go full offensive. This would be the biggest challenge of the concept, but it is also what makes it so intriguing as determining how far we need to go in each direction at each stage would make for good discussions.

Name: A Stable Clefable
Description: This Pokemon aims to fill some of the void left by the recent banning of Clefable from the CAP SS metagame, through emulating several of its roles in both teambuilding and battling.

In contrast to the previous concept, I do not have any real love for Clefable, so in that sense this concept didn't immediately grab me in the same way. However, when looking at it as far as what kind of process it would lead to, I think this concept is amazing. Breaking down a now banned Pokemon, and figuring out exactly what elements are key to its identity, which ones put it over the top, and what elements of the metagame itself caused it to be such an issue, would make for excellent discussions. And as you point out, this is very much an ideal time to dive into something like this, as this is the first time we have ever found ourselves in this situation. My only real concern here is, as you mention in your questions, is how far can we stray from Clefable while still keeping enough of its identity? Its a great question and one that would be interesting to explore, but if the answer turns out to be "not very far" it would definitely end up making the project less exciting in the long run. But I still think it would be worth taking the opportunity to find out.

Name - Substitute Teacher
Description - This Pokemon does its best work behind a Substitute.

As I have been in the past, I am still very interested in a submission revolving around substitute. And as you mention in the concept, Sub abuse is not nearly as explored in gen 8 as in the past. I think a mon like this would make for a very interesting process, as we have a ton of past knowledge to rely on, but not very many current examples. Don't have much else to say here. This is just a really good concept, and I would love to see what it would produce.

 

[Mx]

Time for one last round of feedback. Given that this is going to be our last day of concept submissions, this will probably be the last post I will dedicate to proving feedback to specific concepts. That said, don't be dissuaded from submitting or modifying your concepts, as I will be keeping a close eye on this thread!

Extreme Specialist (flying moose): A super specialized Pokemon seems like an interesting challenge to make, especially when compared to most of our past creations, which usually possess a pretty expansive movepool (at least in theory). Unfortunately, I'm not convinced this has enough direction to make for an interesting project.

Leading the Charge (The Metric System): Leads are a interesting topic, as they haven't been very relevant in the metagame since the introduction of team preview, barring a few exceptions. I also appreciate how this concept also expands on not only dedicated leads, but also early game strategies in general, which should expand the scope of the discussion. That said, even with this improvement, this still feels like a very narrow concept. I think you should try to expand other different routes this concept could go.

Finally, this post also doubles as a 24 hours warning before the end of Concept Submissions. Tagging all people that haven't finished their submissions. Remember, it's not required to mark it as Final Submission, just removing the WIP label is enough.

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[Kurobat]

Name – Warehouse

Description – A Pokemon whose strategy revolves around controlling held items.

Justification- This Cap will fall under the Archetype concept. Held items has been a vital point in the competitive scene ever since their introduction in GSC. This CAP aims to provide support to the team by messing around with an opponent’s held items or even completely suppressing their usage.

Questions To Be Answered –

1. How important is an item to teambuilding?
2. Is item-control a big enough reason to consider when teambuilding?
3. How could the loss of item affect players’ decision making when in-match?
4. What offensive/defensive presence can a technical Pokemon offer to the metagame?
5. How would Pokemon using one-use items (such as Berries/Seeds/Gems) be affected?

Explanation – (it's my first concept submission! AFTER YEARS OF LURKING SINCE KITSUNOH) There’s a lot of ways to control items. Knock Off is the most prominent move as of now as the ability to suppress an opposing Pokemon’s item for the rest of the match is golden. Other used moves are Trick and Switcheroo which has similar functions. Corrosive gas and Magic Room are also under-utilized moves that could have interesting effects on the metagame. While less used, abilities can also fall under this concept as Magician and Pickpocket also has almost similar descriptions. It would be pretty interesting to see these lesser used moves/abilities be utilized in a metagame. Also, items are central. That much is known. But how central? There are Pokemon that runs item-less sets for Acrobatics. There are others who revolve around eating berries. Unburden is also a thing. So, lack of (or losing) items is not necessarily a bad thing. The CAP should be able to address that through item control.

 

[Pikaman_Ultra]

Name- Open and Shut

Description- A Pokemon that has to regularily swap between walling and going on the offensive to remain a threat

Justification- This is an actualization concept as while walls and hyper offence are prevelent in the meta, there hasn't really been anything that forces players to mix and match tropes and punishes players for staying in their comfort zone.

Questions to be answered-

- How can CAP 28 punish players for sticking to one strategy?
- How will CAP 28 be both an offensive and defensive threat without becoming overpowered?
-What will CAP 28's relationship with common wall breakers be?
-Is a pokemon that punishes a lack of experience and heavily rewards knowledge too harsh to new players?
-Will CAP 28 add a new psychological aspect to the meta like it is intended to?

Explanation- Open and Shut would likely be a speedy and relatively weak pokemon that has to wall and deal chip/gradual damage in order to reliably kill, possibly having a limited variety of moves to wall with to force players out of their shell eventually (Substitute comes to mind as an excellent choice thanks to its trade off damage). It would also need to have an extremely large tool kit in order to fill the large variety of roles it needs to. The potential to add a lot of uncertainty to sets will also shake up the meta game and keep opponents on their toes, considering the fact that some players will struggle to keep up with the daunting amount of extremely adaptable strategies Open and Shut would possess.

 

[Gemini Taurus]

Name: Ball and Chain

Description: A Pokémon that can viably function on a team despite having a detrimental ability.

Justification: This is an actualization concept. Pokemon with detrimental abilities never see usage in high tiers of play. The creation pokemon will allow us to observe what strategies and counters would be effective to support or oppose a pokemon that can function with a detrimental ability.

Questions to be answered:

1. Why do existing pokemon with detrimental abilities fail to be effective?
2. How can detrimental abilities be used positively?
3. In what ways does a pokemon with a detrimental ability need support that is different from any other pokemon that would fill the same role?
4. What strategies are made more viable as a result of facing a pokemon with a detrimental ability?
5. Is it more effective to attempt to mitigate the effects of your detrimental ability, or find a strategy that works in spite of it? Are both possible?

Explanation: Since the addition of abilities to Pokemon back in Gen 3, most abilities were designed to help the pokemon in some way. However every few generations, some unfortunate pokemon are cursed with an ability that hinders them rather than helping. Truant being the most classic example, but Slow Start, Defeatist, Stall and some other abilities to a degree (Klutz, Normalize) all hinder their user in some way. Because of how they are built, none of the pokemon with these detrimental abilities have been able to find a niche to cling onto. I think it would be extremely interesting to see how CAP attempts to build a pokemon that can succeed with one of these abilities, when all of the existing pokemon with them struggle so greatly.

 

[Darek]

Hi Mx, just letting you know that I changed my concept.

 

[dex]

Name: Ball and Chain

Description: A Pokémon that can viably function on a team despite having a detrimental ability.

Justification: This is an actualization concept. Pokemon with detrimental abilities never see usage in high tiers of play. The creation pokemon will allow us to observe what strategies and counters would be effective to support or oppose a pokemon that can function with a detrimental ability.

Questions to be answered:

1. Why do existing pokemon with detrimental abilities fail to be effective?
2. How can detrimental abilities be used positively?
3. In what ways does a pokemon with a detrimental ability need support that is different from any other pokemon that would fill the same role?
4. What strategies are made more viable as a result of facing a pokemon with a detrimental ability?
5. Is it more effective to attempt to mitigate the effects of your detrimental ability, or find a strategy that works in spite of it? Are both possible?

Explanation: Since the addition of abilities to Pokemon back in Gen 3, most abilities were designed to help the pokemon in some way. However every few generations, some unfortunate pokemon are cursed with an ability that hinders them rather than helping. Truant being the most classic example, but Slow Start, Defeatist, Stall and some other abilities to a degree (Klutz, Normalize) all hinder their user in some way. Because of how they are built, none of the pokemon with these detrimental abilities have been able to find a niche to cling onto. I think it would be extremely interesting to see how CAP attempts to build a pokemon that can succeed with one of these abilities, when all of the existing pokemon with them struggle so greatly.

This could be a fun concept to work on if we include Entrainment as an option for it, though that kinda goes against the point of the submission. I don't really know how it would work but it'd be cool to give it a try.

 

[dex]

This is my first time really doing anything for the CAP process, but I thought I'd point out a few of my favorite ideas (besides my own of course) that I think stand out as exciting, unique, and, most importantly, doable.

• Name - Roadblock
  
  
• Description - A Pokemon that excels at slowing down, punishing or otherwise disrupting the opposing team's pivoting strategies.
  
  
• Justification - This is a Target concept, we are looking to shut down Teleport, U-turn, Volt Switch strategies in the meta, as well as targeting the abilities and items that enable them. Right now, Teleport has come to dominate the metagame, and the advent of Heavy Duty Boots and new Regen pivots has taken U-turn/TP on certain mons to a new high. Kril is also just as frustrating as before, spamming Volt Switch among others. Furthermore, pivoting goes beyond just moves- Toxapex, Tomohawk and Equilibra are well-known pivots that act as a mid-ground between 2 pokemon, usually scouting and sponging a hit before switching to something more appropriate.
  
  
• Questions To Be Answered -
  -In what way(s) does pivoting most commonly manifest in the CAP meta?
  -What typings, abilities and items allow specific mons to become the strongest pivots, and how can we target these?
  -What do our target Pokemon gain from pivoting? Are they focused more on scouting information, sponging attacks, or dealing damage?
  -Is it possible to dissuade or even block pivoting attacks like U-turn using reactionary methods?
  -What are the difference between the direct methods and indirect methods of preventing pivoting, and which is appropriate for each target?
  -Do offensive or defensive playstyles work best for preventing different styles of pivoting?
  -Is it better in the current to create a blanket check to pivots, or a more tailored response to a few key pivoting mons/strategies?
  
  
• Explanation -
  I think it always helps to do a meta-centric concept, and right now I think this concept targets what currently shapes the metagame. Pivoting feels very different than it did in previous generations, moving away from the scarf U-turners and the fear of Pursuit and into a new, strange, HDB Teleport era, and it would be good to explore that. I think Syclant, Toxapex, Tomohawk, Slowtwins/Regenspammers and pink blobs make up an incredibly diverse range of targets to pick and choose from, which should leave our concept feeling very multi-dimensional and create a lot of different avenues throughout the discussion.
  Whats also interesting about this concept is it has a wide range of possible scope. Its damn hard to stop a U-turn user from pressing a button and pivoting around, especially if its already on the field- however, creating a mon that shuts down the utility of Slowking and Toxapex would be a lot more achievable. Both are valid routes, and it would be great to see discussion for both and lay out a reasonable scope at the beginning.
  
  To give some unique examples of how this concept could go, Defiant Bisharp is a good example of an anti-pivot Pokemon as Tomohawk cant come in and Intimidate it. Metronome is an item that builds up damage if the opponent relies on midground Pokemon like Toxapex to scout the attacks. NGas Weezing-G stops the important Natural Cure aspect of Blissey when it tries to switch out, and Arghonaut can Circle Throw to stop mons like Cinder and Syclant from getting a switch into whatever they want. There are a ton of other options on top of these!

This is just a really solid idea. Voltturn can be hard to deal with without very specific teambuilding, and given the right available pokemon, can be a defining force in the metagame. This would ensure that CAP 28 stays relevant for generations to come.

Name - Teaching an Old Dog New Tricks

Description - A Pokemon that modernizes a popular set/niche of previous generations that has fallen out of viability.

Justification - This concept would fall into the Archetype and Target categories. This Pokemon should feel like playing a relic of the past, but in it's prime. Personally, one of my favourite things about playing older generation is seeing the sheer variety of viable sets that were used, most of which have fallen out of practice. Currently, the RestTalk sets are one of the few still used, albeit in lower tiers due to their general drain on momentum, with users like Throh or Type: Null being the main abusers of it.

Questions To Be Answered:

• Why did these certain sets fall by the wayside in the future generations?
  • In addition, what are they?
• What made these sets good in their original contexts?
• Is their any way to adapt, modernize or change these sets to make them viable in the current metagame?
• Are there any pokemon that still use some of these sets? What makes their usage of it viable over others?
• Some of these sets were used before Items, abilities and some typings were in the game. How will these added variables effect the builds of these modernized sets?

Explanation - Previous generation's metagames all have very specific feelings when playing them. Gen 3 was a much slower, more methodical game compared to the offense heavy Gen 7. I feel like this concept would let players feel like they are stepping into a different generation when using it. This Pokemon should exemplify these relic sets ( Explosion as a staple move in gens 1-3, the RestTalkers of Gen 2, Pinch berry sweepers, ect.) and modernize them for the current metagame.

I probably had my most fun competitively with XY and ORAS OU. Seeing some of the strats return from that gen, plus others like suicide leads from Gen 4 or Hazard stacking from Gen 2 would be really cool and it would create a great discussion about how to implement that given the forever power creep of Pokemon.

Final Submission

Name: Abilities Some Consider to be Unnatural

Description: A Pokemon that manipulates an opposing Pokemon's ability, either by ignoring, suppressing or replacing it.

Justification: This concept is an Actualization concept because it aims to create a Pokemon that can make use of one of the moves or abilities such as Mummy, Neutralizing Gas, Mold Breaker, Skill Swap and Worry Seed as part of its playstyle. In a sense, this is also a Target concept, as many of the strongest Pokemon in the metagame are reliant on their abilities such as Astrolotl, Cinderace, and Equilibra.

Questions to be answered:

What are the benefits of manipulating an opponent's ability in general? Are these best taken advantage of by offensive or defensive Pokemon?
Are there certain match ups where ability manipulation is more useful than others? Is it possible to ensure that ability manipulation gets value against any opposing Pokemon?
By targeting Pokemon that use their ability as a crutch, would Pokemon with lackluster abilities become more popular due to the presence of CAP 28?
Does CAP 28 need to benefit from manipulation an opponent's ability? Or will the manipulation of an opponent's ability be better taken advantage of by a team mate?
Why is ability manipulation for the most part a niche or unsuccessful strategy?
Is there a 'best' ability manipulation move or ability? Does it depend on the context?
How do ability manipulation moves compare against the ability manipulation abilities? Are there any inherent advantages or disadvantages and if so, what are they?
Could CAP 28 make use of multiple different ability manipulation methods? Do some ability manipulation methods favour certain strategies better than others? Would these lead to different sets that play differently from one another?
What synergies exist with the manipulation of an opponent's ability? Are there team strategies where ability manipulation will be more useful?


Explanation: Many of the most viable Pokemon in the current metagame are reliant upon their abilities for their success, and in some cases offer opponent's very little counterplay about how to deal with them. Following the release of Astrolotl and the DLC, Regenerator in particular is seeming to define the Isle of Armor metagame, where the sheer number of effective users of it have seen many balance teams building around or at the very least, including Regenerator cores.

Ability manipulation has for the most part been a fringe or niche mechanic, particularly when it comes to moves such as Worry Seed, Entrainment and Gastro Acid, and is something that CAP hasn't explored to a large extent. Pokemon such as Cofagrigus in BW OU and more recently Galarian Weezing in SS OU, show that there is often a niche for Pokemon designed solely around the idea of replacing or invalidating abilities in the OU or CAP metagames, while Pokemon such as Excadrill and Haxorus have long demonstrated the benefits of ignoring opponent's defensive abilities. In some OMs Skill Swap and Entrainment strategies have also been used to devastating effect when paired with typically unappealing abilities such as Normalize, Truant or Defeatist.

The sheer range of ability manipulation options and strategies means that there are a range of avenues that CAP 28 could go in and will hopefully lead to interesting discussions during various stages. This particular concept will likely work well with the recent 'Defining Moves' and 'Stage Order reassessment' PRC adjustment, as it will be imperative to decide on the particular methods of ability manipulation early on in the project as a means to inform future decisions.

This is a really cool concept that is kinda seen some use already in the form of Mold Breaker and and Teravolt but gives us a good chance to innovate on an already existing feature. Playing around with the effectiveness of abilities also gives some use to other abilities and moves that don't often see the light of day, like Trace, Entrainment, and Skill Swap.

WIP

Name -CAP Concept Makeover

Description- Take a previously unviable CAP concept in the current meta game and remake the concept.
Justification- I think this is an actualization concept, focused on breathing new life into old ideas.
Questions to be Awnsered-
Where in the original process lead the CAPmon to be unviable in the meta game?
How has our understanding of the CAP process changed since the original CAP concept was created?
How do we improve upon the original concept without completely changing the spirit of the original design?
Explanation- In Yugioh, certain cards become less effective over the years due to power creep. So later down the road, the cards gets a retrain or given extra support to try and make them viable again. Ex: BLS gets BLS Envoy of the Beginning and later BLS Super Solider as retrains of the orig concept. I want to take that idea and apply it to a previous CAP concept. For example, Voodooms concept of being a perfect partner for Togekiss doesn't exactly stand up because togekiss has changed drastically since Gen 4.

I know this sounds like a unoriginal idea and bad idea but I think this would be an interesting project to pursue.

I honestly hate it when I play CAP and someone just brings an OU team to the party. That being said, there are a number of submissions that I think could be improved upon, with that discussion probably being part of Part 2. Plasmanta, Malaconda, and Pyroak are all options that come to mind. That being said, I think it would be cool to give an evolution to whatever concept would be selected, to stay roughly in the same lane but see what we could do with new stat, typing, and ability options.

Name: - Can't Let You Do That

Description: - A Pokémon that denies the opponent move options.

Justification: This would be a mix of an Archetype and Actualisation concept.

The Archetype would be a Pokémon that causes the opposing Mon to be unable to use it's moves at will, and therefore crippling Mon that are overly reliant on such things, such as spammable attacks, blocking attempted setups or sweeps, or removing a wall's status moves. Many Mon use strategies such as these to some extent, such as using Taunt on a wall, but it would be different to have a Mon that specialises in such strategies. This would result in it playing as an unusual form of support Mon that plays differently from typical support Mons. This would be an unusual role that would be nice as an addition that supported a team in a new way while forcing the opponent to be more careful with certain plays that would previously be simply spammable.

In terms of Actualization, this would be a new option to provide unusual support, giving it a separate niche from previous support Mon, allowing new potential varieties of teams to flourish. It would also be a new variety of threat to prepare for, providing a new point of consideration when team building, as one might need to consider the possibility of a Mon losing access to a move. It would be interesting to see if a Mon can focus on such strategies as their main selling point and how this could be effective in the meta.

Questions to be answered:

• In which circumstances is it most useful to deny an opponent the opportunity to use specific moves?
• How can a Mon benefit from dedicating more than one moves lot to move denial over a Mon that just uses Taunt as its only move denial?
• How can types and abilities aid moves in move denial?
• Why is Taunt used more than other move denial moves and how can other forms of move denial moves be encouraged?
• What other moves can this Mon use while still maintaining a move denial focus?
• How can we use move denial without causing frustrating 50/50s that are unhealthy and frustrating to the meta?
• In what way does move denial distinguish itself from other forms of support?
• How does a move denial specialist make itself attractive enough to justify its role on a team?

Explanation: Having options is helpful. One can try to counter that by taking options away from your opponent. The idea is to end up with more options than your opponent, leaving them relatively helpless. Some games, such as Magic: The Gathering, refer to this strategy as control and it can be pretty powerful. I wanted to try making a Mon with a similar role and seeing how it works out in a Pokémon metagame.

Forms of control already exist in Pokémon metas, most infamously, trapping. Trapping can be very powerful and sometimes overbearing enough that forms of it are usually banned. I wanted to go in a different direction though to see if it would still be effective without being overbearing.

Move control moves are already used to some extent in Pokémon metas. Taunt specifically tends to be used. However, I wanted to focus on doing more than just throwing on Taunt onto a set. I wanted to see how much this strategy could be pushed and how other moves could help out with this strategy. Encore is probably the second most used of these moves. Sometimes it is used to trap a Mon in setup, or Wobuffet uses it to properly use it's other moves. Wobuffet is probably the closest example to what I envision, but it relies on trapping, specifically the banned Shadow Tag and tends to be either under or overwhelming depending on whether or not Shadow Tag is banned, with it being irritating either way. It is also a counterattack specialist. I was hoping for something more balanced that is more supportive and isn't a counter attacker.

Other examples of moves like this include Torment, Disable, Imprison, Spite, Grudge, and even Powder. Types with immunities, whether to specific moves, or whole other types, can also add to move denial. Certain abilities can do so to, such as providing an immunity to a type, such as Levitate, Water Absorb or Lightning Rod, to a set of moves, such as Bulletproof or Soundproof, or a Psuedo-immunity like Magic Bounce or Psychic Surge. They can also be something like Cursed Body or Pressure.

Walls and stallbreakers tend to use these tactics most often, but we don't have to lock ourselves into those rolls if we decide otherwise. Suicide Leads, with their tendency to set things up for the rest of the team have also used such tactics. Heatran has used Torment in addition to its type and ability providing immunities for such effects as well. Pyukumuku has a limited move pool but uses such tactics to be an effective wall and PP stall with block, spite and Unaware. Despite their greater options, Toxapex and Aegislash have used the same strategy in some sets.

Moves like Torment and Disable are especially effective against Choice locked Mon, and with the high prevalence of Choice users in the meta right now, this could be a good time for a Mon that would capitalise on that and help reign it in a bit.

I honestly love the idea of bringing lesser used moves or abilities into the spotlight (as you could tell from my submission) and this idea does just that. Playing around with move selection would be a very interesting way of trying to counter choice users, and this is an idea that more than any is so unique that it would be fun just trying to problem solve to get it to work. If my submission doesn't make it to the final batch, I hope this one more than any other does.

FINAL SUBMISSION

Name - "43% Non-Toxic"

Description - A Pokemon that can utilize the regular Poison status effect, be it by the moves it chooses or the abilities that it utilizes.

Justification - This is an Actualization concept, as we are looking into the untapped usage of the normal Poison status effect over using the Toxic effect.

Questions To Be Answered

• What are the benefits of running the regular Poisoned status effect over Toxic?
• How dependent on Poison should this Pokemon be?
• Will this Pokemon want to be able to be poisoned itself?

Explanation - A status condition often overlooked, Poisoning as a concept is most often thought of as using Toxic, but in all fairness, the only moves that can really Toxic the target are "Toxic" (self explanatory), Toxic Spikes (also self explanatory), and . . . Poison Fang. (50% Chance to Badly Poison). While the first two are very common picks when building a team around poison spreading, nobody really looks at the other useful moves and abilities that make use of poisoning.

Poison Touch was almost used last CAP with Astrolotl, granting a 30% chance to poison on contact, while Poison Point is the exact opposite, and there's also . . . a specific Ability and move that is often underlooked as the Pokemon who gets it quite often forgoes it. I am talking about the Merciless and Baneful Bunker combination. Merciless has the unique ability to have every one of the user's moves be a critical hit, as long as the target is poisoned. Baneful Bunker offers protection with the added benefit of poisoning any foe that tries to use a contact move.
Toxapex, however, forgoes the Merciless ability with Regenerator, which makes complete sense as a wall.

There are also some other interesting Poison-related moves and abilities, notable ones include Corrosion, which allows any mon to be poisoned regardless of immunity, Toxic Thread (note: Past Gens only, sorry guys.), which both Poisons the foe as well as lowers their speed. Venom Drench and Venoshock lower the opponents SpA, Atk, and Spe or do double damage respectively while poisoned, Shell Side Arm can be either Physical or Special, both having the same amount of chances to poison. Hex, despite not poisoning itself, also does double damage if the target is poisoned. It also doesn't have to be using Poison to hurt the other Pokemon directly. It could be a Poison + Guts combination, or a Poison Heal user. It can be anything. Whatever it may be . . .

Make it hurt.

Normal Poison is the most overlooked status, and with Gen 8's nerfs to other status's availability, now would be a good time to see if it's a viable way of playing. Poison also has the most ways of being applied of the statuses, meaning that this concept would have a lot of ways to be realized.

 

[Admiral_Stalfos19]

Hook, Line & Sinker (Admiral_Stalfos19): A dedicated lure concept sounds attractive in theory, but I don't think it's enough to feed a whole process. What makes a good lure work is that your opponent your opponent doesn't expect it, because the primary role of that Pokemon is something else. If we want to make this concept work, we would need to fill some other primary role before we can start talking about potential lure sets, and currently this concept doesn't provide any guidance for what this primary role could be, or even that it exist in the first place. I think that perhaps you could fix those issues to an extent by adding a question about what this primary role could be and adding a few examples in the explanation section of how this could play out should.

Edits have been made to my concept. Hopefully these answer the issues you've found in the original draft :]

 

[Mx]

Time's up everyone! Thanks everyone for all the fantastic submissions, it was really hard picking just a few of them, even after expanding the slate to be a slightly bigger than usual. Here's the final slate for the CAP 28 Concept Polls:

Boxing Gloves by Rabia
Cheapskate Estronic
Gun Fort by quziel
Knock It Off! by FierceDeity1
Roadblock by Pipotchi
Substitute Teacher by reachzero
Teaching an Old Dog New Tricks by SunMYSER

Additionally, I'd also like to present a brief explanation of why I chose each one of these:

Boxing Gloves: There has been a few previous CAPs designed around the idea of a "bad" typing, but I think that this concept is unique enough that it won't simply result in Crucibelle 2.0 and even after these previous projects, there should still be a lot of room to explore regarding unconventional typings and how to apply them.

Cheapskate: Trying to make a versatile Pokemon while keeping our movepool at minimum and trying to explore which moves are the most "efficient" to accomplish multiple roles are very fascinating ideas to explore, so I think this would be a great way to go for CAP 28.

Gun Fort: A very interesting concept that tries to carefully balance two very distinct roles into the same set. This is probably one of the more challenging submissions, but I believe that we should be able to succeed at it, and this challenge should make for very engaging debates.

Knock It Off!: A pretty relevant concept in the current metagame. I think Knock Off is very interesting move to target because it can be so hard to punish and trying do look for ways to dissuade it could teach us a lot about the metagame.

Substitute Teacher: While very simple on the surface, the sheer amount of versatility that Substitute provides means that this concept manages to be both very flexible and extremely deep, and therefore would make for excellent discussions through all of CAP 28.

Roadblock: Another great concept that relates a lot to the current metagame and from which I believe we could learn a lot. I've heard people worrying that this concept might devolve into trying to "fix" the metagame by countering all the best pivots, but I think this shouldn't be an issue as long as we maintain a reasonable scope.

Teaching an Old Dog New Tricks: Last but certainly not least, this concept offers us an interesting way to look back at past strategies, reflect on why they have fallen off over the years and think of ways they could be updated to work on the current metagame.