Project ZU Victim Of The Week V2 (Round Three: Submission Phase)

[SBPC]

ZU Victim Of The Week
(Approval from 5gen and Xayah)


Like other metagames, ZeroUsed is constantly evolving to present us with new threats as others fall out of favor. As these new dominators arise, so do ways to efficiently handle them, and this thread is dedicated to presenting and showcasing them. Each week, I will post a set of a Pokemon and you participants will have a few days to submit a check, a counter, or both. After all submissions are done, the voting phase will begin and voters will pick what they find to be the best check and counter to the set, and points towards the assassin leaderboard will be awarded. But alas, to ensure that things don't get out of hand, we have some simple rules that need to be followed.

Rules

• Please be aware of the definitions of "Check" and "Counter." Directly quoting from Smog Issue 32; "Pokémon A checks Pokémon B if, when Pokémon A is given a free switch into Pokémon B, Pokémon A can win every time, even under the worst case scenario, without factoring in hax. Pokémon A counters Pokémon B if Pokémon A can manually switch into Pokémon B and still win every time, even under the worst case scenario, without factoring in hax." If I deem your submission to be incorrectly labeled, it will be moved to the correct labeling.
• Please only post Pokemon that are viable in the ZeroUsed metagame. Any pokemon that is ranked under B- on the Viability Rankings will need extremely solid reasoning, so for the most part only refer to above that point.
• When posting, please leave a 3 to 4 sentence description of your set. Additionally, calcs/replays are not required but can be used to deepen your post.
• Because of the nature that checks/counters bring, pokemon can sometimes check a pokemon in multiple ways. Due to this I will allow multiple posters to use the same pokemon, given your sets differ from the ones already posted. (I.e.: Poster A uses SD Shiftry while Poster B uses Mixed Life Orb Shiftry)
• You will be allowed to reserve sets, but only for 24 hours. After this time period, any set is fair game and may be used.
• Experimenting with pokemon is encouraged greatly, but making your set so specific that it invalidates other matchups or even just makes it deadweight outside of beating x pokemon will result in disqualification from the round.
(Refer to the Sample Sets found in Viability Rankings if you're having trouble)
• During the voting phase, all users will be alloted one vote for both the check and counter categories. Please do not vote for yourself.
• Criticism on other user's sets is allowed, but please be helpful and kind rather than slandering another participant.
• Have fun and enjoy the project!

Current Threat:

 

[SBPC]

Week 2: Combusken

The kickin' chicken has struck the stage! This round revolves around one of the tier's most solid examples of an offensive threat. This round will use it's Fight Z Special Attacker set.

Chicken Little

Combusken @ Fightinium Z
Ability: Speed Boost
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Fire Blast
- Focus Blast
- Hidden Power [Electric]
- Protect

Submission phase will end Tuesday, May 14th! Good luck!

Top Assassin Leaderboard

Ho3nConfirm3d: 1
Imkoolkidz: 1
Katy: 1
KellyKafka: 1

​

 

[SBPC]

Archive for thread

Version 1 VOTW

Round 1

Threat: Pinsir
Check:
LightPinkYoshi with Granbull
Counter:
ImKoolKidz with Gourgeist-Super

Other sets posted can be found starting here

Round 2

Threat: Crustle
Check:
85Percent with Gourgeist-Super
Counter:
Mirbro with Pyukumuku

Round 3

Check:
Silvally-Fighting by Oathkeepre
Counter:
Shiinotic by Katy

Round 4

Threat: Komala
Check:
Machoke by Broken Phobias
Counter:
Gourgeist Super by Oathkeepre

Version 2 VOTW

R1 Threat: Swanna

Check: Curse Lickilicki by Imkoolkidz
Counter: Cradily by Ho3nConfirm3d

R2 Threat: Combusken

Check: Oricorio-Balle by Kellykafka
Counter: Grumpig by Katy

 

[Dollainthewoods]

Golem @ Custap Berry
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 52 Atk / 204 Def
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Explosion
- Stone Edge
- Earthquake
A good check to pinsir would be golem, who's defensive bulk, hp stat, and typing give it an incredible advantage against pinsir. In this particular set, I made sure that golem would almost always ohko pinsir with stone edge while being able to tank a plus 2 earthquake from mold breaker pinsir. Sturdy on this set also allows it to beat me first pinsir if it's z me first and has already killed 2 or 3 pokemon, but it wouldn't need sturdy if it was at +1 or +2. If stealth rocks are also on the field and you have no other choice, you can just explode too, just to make sure pinsir is dead, and custap berry makes sure golem will go first after it's down to 25% meaning that if it doesn't kill pinsir that it can just kill it next turn, or use it to explode on the next mon. If pinsir is z me first make sure to come in on it after it's killed one mon
Calcs:
+2 252+ Atk Mold Breaker Pinsir Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 204+ Def Golem: 288-340 (79.1 - 93.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
52 Atk Golem Stone Edge vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Pinsir: 264-312 (97.4 - 115.1%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO
52 Atk Golem Explosion vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Pinsir: 220-259 (81.1 - 95.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Mold Breaker Pinsir Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 204+ Def Golem: 146-172 (40.1 - 47.2%) -- 1.2% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
+1 252+ Atk Pinsir Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 204+ Def Golem: 216-256 (59.3 - 70.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Mold Breaker Pinsir Savage Spin-Out (160 BP) vs. 252 HP / 204+ Def Golem: 174-205 (47.8 - 56.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

 

[LPY]

Granbull @ Choice Band
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Close Combat
- Earthquake
- Play Rough
- Fire Punch / Stone Edge

To list a more offensive in nature check, here's CB granbull. Intimidate + Fairy typing allows it switch into Pinsir on a set up turn and threaten it back.

+1 252 Atk Mold Breaker Pinsir Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Granbull: 200-236 (62.3 - 73.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and 1 layer of Spikes

Above is the relevant calc for coming in on an SD set up turn and eating pinsir's strongest hit before threatening back with Play Rough/Fire Punch/Stone Edge depending on what move you'd like to be locked into and how much HP Pinsir is at. Stone Edge is the only move from bandbull that guarantees an OHKO barring a miss due to Pinsir's naturally high defense, but Fire punch is a roll in your favor to OHKO

252+ Atk Choice Band Granbull Fire Punch vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Pinsir: 254-300 (93.7 - 110.7%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO

and Play Rough will KO as well if Pinsir is not at full which it often is not due to taking a turn to set up/rocks weakness though that isn't indicative of a worst case scenario.

252+ Atk Choice Band Granbull Play Rough vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Pinsir: 228-268 (84.1 - 98.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

In the event that Granbull is attacked on the switch in, even with rocks up it will live 2 hits from either set and attack back.

-1 252 Atk Mold Breaker Pinsir Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Granbull: 90-106 (28 - 33%) -- 93% chance to 3HKO after Stealth Rock
-1 252+ Atk Pinsir Inferno Overdrive (140 BP) vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Granbull: 137-162 (42.6 - 50.4%) -- 95.7% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
= Max damage of 83 + 12.5 from rocks = 95.5%

Be aware that if you come into an EQ/Stone Edge from Z-me first when they have rocks up and click Play rough or Stone Edge, you run the risk of being KOed, but neither will be able to KO you if they do not have rocks up.

-1 252+ Atk Pinsir Twinkle Tackle (175 BP) vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Granbull: 171-202 (53.2 - 62.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
-1 252+ Atk Pinsir Continental Crush (180 BP) vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Granbull: 176-208 (54.8 - 64.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

Granbull cannot freely come in on a +2 SD pinsir, and will also lose if the SD pinsir happens to be running Ground/Rock Z over Bug Z and sets up a Swords Dance on the turn Granbull switches in.

Lastly, Granbull needs to be at full health in all scenarios which is difficult because it tends to take damage whenever it comes in due to its slow speed tier and how easy it is to pivot on.

 

[BP]

Set

Garstella (Mareanie) @ Eviolite
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Recover
- Toxic Spikes / Toxic
- Haze

This Mareanie set is the really the only set that checks every Pinsir set off the top of my head. Haze is used to remove Z-Me First Speed boost that Pinsir receives. The 252+ Defense Investment ensures Mareanie can tank an Earthquake from fully invested Pinsir. Furthermore, it can simply Haze away Pinsir's stat changes and threaten Pinsir with a burn from Scald. I'd say Mareanie is a pretty mediocre check just because Pinsir usually runs Earthquake.

252+ Atk Pinsir Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Mareanie: 150-178 (49.3 - 58.5%) -- 98.8% chance to 2HKO
252+ Atk Pinsir Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Mareanie: 73-87 (24 - 28.6%) -- 97.7% chance to 4HKO

 

[Rav3]

Whilst better known as the tiers premier knock off absorber, and also an exceptional defogger and Shiftry check, Fightvally also has the potential to be a solid check to Z-Me First Pinsir which is arguably the more successful and prevalent Pinsir set at the moment.



The key to using Fightvally against Pinsir is to get it in without conceding an attack boost via moxie. This means either making the hard switch into Fightvally or pivoting out if you are quicker in an unfavourable matchup.



Silvally @ Fighting Memory

Ability: RKS System

EVs: 252 HP / 32 Atk / 144 Def / 0 SpA / 0 SpD / 80 Spe

Jolly Nature

- Defog

- Multi-Attack

- Rock Slide

- U-turn



The above set from Fightvally outspeeds Adamant, max speed, unboosted Pinsir, and 2hkos back after rocks with rock slide whilst avoiding the 2hko back also after rocks from stab x-scissor.



32 Atk Silvally Rock Slide vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Pinsir: 108-128 (39.8 - 47.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock



252+ Atk Pinsir X-Scissor vs. 252 HP / 144 Def Silvally: 127-150 (32.2 - 38%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock



If Pinsir is Mold breaker, the scenario is a similar result but played out differently. If Fightvally is kept healthy it can switch in on the swords dance then 2hko with Rock Slide whilst outspeeding and avoiding the 2hko. The only way for Pinsir to win this matchup is to use Buginium Z.



Overall this set needs to be kept healthy to check Pinsir and does so less reliably against Mold Breaker, though it is a lot more easily revenged then Z-me first, which Fightvally more reliably checks and dispatches.

 

[Graceclaw]

Set

Gabite @ Eviolite
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Toxic
- Protect / Dragon Claw

While nothing reliably counters both sets, my personal favorite Z-Me First counter is Gabite. This little sharky-dragon boy completely devours unboosted attacks, and even eats* 2 hits at +1 if you accidentally let Pinsir get a Moxie boost.

Me First Calcs

252+ Atk Pinsir X-Scissor vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Gabite: 88-105 (25.8 - 30.8%)
+1 252+ Atk Pinsir X-Scissor vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Gabite: 132-156 (38.8 - 45.8%)

0 Atk Gabite Dragon Claw vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Pinsir: 79-94 (29.1 - 34.6%)

This means Gabite is able to wear down Pinsir with a combination of Rocks, Rough Skin and Toxic/Protect stalling. If you choose to run Dragon Claw, you can speed Pinsir's demise by a bit.

As with basically any defensive mon, the best Gabite can do vs Pinsir is put it on a timer with Toxic/Tect and do additional chip with Rough Skin. It lives one, but not two hits at +2, like every other PhysDef set in the tier. Added bonus: It lives +4.

SD Calc

+2 252 Atk Pinsir X-Scissor vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Gabite: 160-189 (47 - 55.5%)
+4 252 Atk Pinsir X-Scissor vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Gabite: 240-283 (70.5 - 83.2%)

Gabite is useful outside of checking Pinsir in that it switches comfortably into Golem and Komala, provides an electric immunity to prevent free Electivire pivots (beware Ice Punch, obviously) and provides Toxic + SR for the team. If you're careful with it, it is not hard to keep it healthy enough to effectively counter Z-Me First.

 

[JdRDMS]

Silvally-Fire (as a check)

Set

Silvally-Fire @ Fire Memory
Ability: RKS System
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Flamethrower
- Thunderbolt
- Parting Shot
- Surf

This was my boi for a brief bit for those who don't know. Anyway, my reasoning is pretty simple. I know this is only C on the VR, but I still think this is a pretty good check. It outspeeds and OHKOs Pinsir with Flamethrower, and a slow pivot such as Komala or Vibrava allows it to get it in fairly easily. It also survives an unboosted Earthquake or Stone Edge, and it even has a chance to survive after rocks. Again I know this is only C on the VR, but I still think it's a good check for Swords Dance. As for Z-Me First, it is outsped at +2 (obviously) but again, it survives Earthquake and Stone Edge, so I don't think it's that bad.

 

[ImKoolKidz]

Gourgeist-Super as a Counter

Set

Gourgeist-Super @ Colbur Berry
Ability: Frisk
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Impish Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Will-O-Wisp
- Synthesis
- Foul Play
- Leech Seed

Gourgeist-Super is a phenomenal tank in this meta, currently an A+ mon. With its fantasic 85/122 base stats in HP and Defense, respectively, and access to a reliable source of recovery, it is a great mon that can check both Z-Me First and Z-Bug Pinsir extremely well. With Frisk, Gourgeist-Super can check to see which Pinsir variant it is, and can play sacks correctly, if it is the Z-Bug variant. Gourgeist-Super can also check Pinsir with its Will-O-Wisp attack, crippling Pinsir's attack stat by 1/2. Gourgeist-Super can also hit Pinsir in return with Foul Play, so it isn't just something that Pinsir can set-up on. Lastly, Gourgeist should be played defensively, but aggressively at the same time, in case your opponent gets greedy and tries to go for multiple Swords Dance's.

Calcs

+2 252 Atk Mold Breaker Pinsir Savage Spin-Out (160 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gourgeist-Super: 318-375 (85 - 100.2%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO
Z-Bug has a very small chance to OHKO Gourgeist, but after Stealth Rocks chip and other sort of damage, it can be OHKO'd, which is why you will want to double on the turn you think Pinsir will use its Z.
+2 252 Atk Mold Breaker Pinsir X-Scissor vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gourgeist-Super: 160-189 (42.7 - 50.5%) -- 1.2% chance to 2HKO
Even after a Swords Dance, Pinsir's X Scissor attack still has a very little chance to 2OHKO Gourgeist, while Gourgeist can easily Wil-O-Wisp Pinsir in return or use Foul Play against it.
+1 252+ Atk Pinsir X-Scissor vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gourgeist-Super: 132-156 (35.2 - 41.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Z-Me First Pinsir still cannot do massive damage against Gourgeist-Super, even after +1, along with 252 EVs and an Adamant nature.
0 Atk Gourgeist-Super Foul Play vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Pinsir: 202-238 (74.5 - 87.8%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
After Pinsir sets up a Swords Dance, it has a very high chance to be OHKO'd via Foul Play after Stealth Rocks damage.
0 Atk Gourgeist-Super Foul Play vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Pinsir: 166-196 (61.2 - 72.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
After one Moxie boost, Pinsir is guaranteed to be a 2OHKO for Gourgeist.

 

[Oathkeeper]

PU main here but I love these threads so I'll give it a go...

Oricorio-Pom-Pom @ Flyinium Z
Ability: Dancer
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 Spe
- Hurricane
- Roost
- Calm Mind
- Revelation Dance / Defog / Taunt

Check. Pom Pom can OHKO either Pinsir setup with a guaranteed Z-Hurricane or just a flat out Hurricane. Pom Pom does need to be wary of Stone Edge though since it OHKOs Pom Pom also. But if Pom Pom gets in safely on the SD variant or before the Z-Me First variant uses just that, it wins!​

 

[Mirbro]

Furfrou @ Leftovers
Impish Nature
Ability: Fur Coat
EVs: 252 HP / 34 Def / 224 Spe
- Cotton Guard
- Return
- Rest
- Toxic​

Furfrou is both a counter and a check of Pinsir. For the Z-Me First Fufrou can come in and outspeed it. With Cotton Guard it can boost its physical defense and stop Pinsir easily doing a 35-ish% with Return or Toxic-ing. However, Z-Buginium SD Pinsir can OHKO Furfrou but before it can get a Return or a Toxic. Thus, it will be in a countdown clock.

Furfrou vs Pinsir Calcs!

0 Atk Furfrou Return vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Pinsir: 91-108 (33.5 - 39.8%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

Pinsir vs Furfrou Calcs!

+2 252 Atk Life Orb Mold Breaker Pinsir Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 34+ Def Furfrou: 360-425 (101.6 - 120%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Furfrou is a very underrated Pokémon. However, it has a small niche as kay has been demonstrating recently in many of his stall teams.

 

[Tuthur]

Misdreavus as a Counter

Misdreavus @ Eviolite
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Will-O-Wisp
- Taunt
- Pain Split
- Hex

Misdreavus resists Pinsir's STAB and is faster than Pinsir allowing it to burn it. A burned Pinsir can't do much to Misdreavus and Hex does high damage to Pinsir. Even if Z-Me First can hit Misdreavus before getting burned, it avoid the 2HKO after SR from Stone Edge and can therefore burn Pinsir and win the 1v1.

 

[Greenheroes]

There's an iceberg to stop the titanic threat pinsir aka:

Avalugg @ Leftovers
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Impish Nature
- Avalanche
- Roar
- Recover
- Rapid Spin

calcs:

+2 252 Atk Mold Breaker Pinsir Stone Edge vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Avalugg: 196-232 (49.7 - 58.8%) -- 74.2% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
need to hard on it's swords dance turn but live after rock

and moxie can't break it.

 

[Aaronboyer]

Silvally-Ghost @ Ghost Memory
Ability: RKS System
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Shadow Ball
- Ice Beam
- Defog
- Parting Shot

Silvally-Ghost is a check to Pinsir by resisting X-Scissor and taking advantage of Pinsir's pathetic 65/70 special bulk. However, Silvally-Ghost is not a counter, as Silvally-Ghost can become easily overwhelmed by attacks and residual damage through the match prior to attempting to check Pinsir. Furthermore, its lack of reliable recovery, even the lack of Leftovers, can make it hard for Silvally-Ghost to sustain enough health to check Pinsir when the time comes.

 

[SBPC]

I'd like to make a quick apology for not posting the date in which the VotW submission phase ended.

I planned to call the phase to an end on Thursday, Feburary 28th and still do.

I will update the thread's info section to have this data. Happy posting!

 

[SBPC]

Alright! That's gonna be an end to the submission phase here!

And with that over, the voting phase will immediately begin!

Users will now be asked to vote for who they think is the best Check and Counter to Pinsir.

Reminder: you may vote once for both a check and a counter.

Voting Phase will last 4 days, ending on Monday, March 4th.

Happy Posting!​

 

[Graceclaw]

Check:
Granbull

Counter:
Misdreavus, though I would argue that Gourgeist is a Counter to the two sets in question rather than a check. If it were re-classified, my vote would be for
Gourgeist.

 

[Tuthur]

Check: Pompom
Counter: Avalugg

 

[CrazyStevy]

Check: Granbull

Counter: Gourgeist

 

[BloodAce]

Check: Granbull

Counter: Misdreavus

 

[Hylia Aria]

Check: Gourgeist
Counter: Furfrou

 

[ImKoolKidz]

Check: Silvally-Fighting
Counter: Fufrou

 

[Quagg]

check: granbull
counter: gourgeist

 

[z3ll1 [old]]

Check: Gourgeist-Super
Counter: Gabite