UU Nominations (Round 7)

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I thought we weren't supposed to refute other people's posts <.<

Anyway, this metagame's banlist is pretty similar to that of the Yanmega metagame, which was my personal favourite metagame. The biggest threats were basically "Salamence-grade" (yeah I know Salamence is Suspect right now), and those that are still around due to not having Specs Tinted Lens or Brave Bird or w/e still fulfill that role, which isn't a bad thing at all. I might be biased because of that one day that ruined my upper req chances, so I'll just say that I don't know what else to think of this metagame other than that no Pokémon seems to stick out as BROKEN to me. Everything has multiple viable hard counters. No suspects
 

Bad Ass

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helo i would like 2 nominat cherrim caus jaba told me cherim can swep a groundon

I'd like to nominate Venusaur this round under the support characteristic.
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Venusaur fits the bill for support characteristic perfectly. It can come in on a multitude of threats, force them out, and hit the switch in hard with a STAB Grass or Poison attack, or boost and take out or weaken some key defensive pokemon in the opponent's team.

Possibly the largest threats in UU are the bulky waters-Slowking, Slowbro, Milotic, Blastoise, and Azumarill. Venusaur can come in on each of these repeatedly (bar CB Azumarill) and force them out. On the switch out, Venusaur can boost or fire off a STAB attack, or force the opponent to sacrifice a pokemon to sleep. Not much enjoys coming in on a Mix Venusaur either. It also boasts sleep, along with the ability to lure in and kill Grass types usual nemeses in Fire types with STAB Sludge Bomb with SR down. Many times you have to make a sacrifice to kill Venusaur, possibly allowing another sweeper to capitalize on the hole. Venusaur will be causing a lot of havoc once in.

Venusaur is no laughing matter defensively. 80/83/100 is a really nice stat set, combined with his beautiful typing that includes resistances to Grass, Fighting, Water, and Electric, combined with the beautiful ability to not be able to be Poisoned. Defensively isn't the only place where his typing shines, though. Poison / Grass gets fantastic coverage, only missing out on pure Steels. 100 base special defense means that a bulky water's Ice Beam isn't doing enough to scare off Venusaur. Venusaur also carries fairly reliable healing in Synthesis. You can't just wear it down with hitting and going to Registeel; it can heal on the switch and cause grief for the rest of the match. Venusaur is also nigh-impossible to spin on. All of the common spinners are forced out by it.

Venusaur has a ton of opportunities to come in-all the water types it threatens, the bulky fighting types that plague UU, as well as weaker attacks (Spiritomb Shadow Sneak, Chansey Seismic Toss, Clefable Façade, etc). After a boost, he is doing a lot of damage to defensive pokemon-certainly enough for, say, Toxicroak to come in and sweep after Venusaur knocked the opponent's Spiritomb into low health levels. Unlike, say, Houndoom who might be able to fit the SC if he had bulk and healing, Venusaur has all of these things. Not to mention the unpredictability; do I go to Chansey to sponge Leaf Storm, or is the risk of Power Whip too much? Can I go to Moltres to handle an Earthquake, or will it OHKO me with LO Sludge Bomb? Is he going to attack straight up, or sleep my first switch in? This can force mistakes, again, opening up holes.
 

Eo Ut Mortus

Elodin Smells
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Nominating Venusaur under the Support Characteristic.

Venusaur has the ability to run many sets, most of which fall under one of three categories: specially-based (special Grass move / Sludge Bomb), physical-based (Swords Dance / Power Whip / Earthquake), and mixed (Power Whip / Sludge Bomb). There are definitive counters to each variant; however, many are set-specific. Tangrowth and Leafeon wall fully physical variants, but they die to those that carry Sludge Bomb. Registeel walls most special and mixed versions, but it falls to a Swords Dance boosted Earthquake and gets outstalled by Venusaur with Leech Seed. Chansey and Clefable wall special variants, but can't handle physical Venusaur or Leech Seed, in Chansey's case. One can really never be entirely certain of a Venusaur's full moveset until it has revealed all of its attacks, as Venusaur can and does commonly use many different combinations of moves to great effect.

Therefore, unless one's willing to risk losing their Chansey to Power Whip, for instance, the first switch-in to Venusaur is generally a Pokemon that can handle all three of its common sets. Pokemon such as Moltres, Altaria, Arcanine fall under this category - and most happen to be weak to Stealth Rock. Those that aren't weak to Stealth Rock (Mesprit and Uxie for instance) lack reliable recovery and do not resists any of Venusaur's STABs, and therefore are temporary insurances at best.

Stealth Rock is key here. It's too easy to abuse Stealth Rock in conjunction with Venusaur. No UU Rapid Spinner can consistently switch into Venusaur - Donphan, Kabutops, and Cloyster are all weak to Grass-type attacks, and Hitmontop resists neither of Venusaur's STABs and can do nothing in return to it. As mentioned, many of its "catch-all" counters are weak to it. Finally, there's Venusaur's ability to easily force switches. Sleep Powder comes into play here. If you switch your Venusaur counter into Sleep Powder, you "lose"; if you switch your sleep absorber into an attack, you lose. If you predict right, you still end up racking up residual damage. If your sleep absorber happens to be your Venusaur counter, it's now unable to recover health, which is necessary due to Stealth Rock damage.

Furthermore, its immunity to Toxic plus its access to Synthesis means that walling it is not enough to beat Venusaur; one must rely on a combination of resistances and sufficient offensive power to beat it, which are easily exploitable by Stealth Rock and Venusaur's excellent offensive STABs.

In the end, Venusaur will end up putting one of its opponents to sleep, further damaging (an)other Pokemon through residual damage and/or one of its moderately powered STAB hits - at the very minimum. A well-played Venusaur has the potential to do that and much more - lure and KO or severely damage particular walls. Because of the ease at which it can do this, and the difficulty and cost of countering it, due to its versatility, I believe that Venusaur is BL under the Support Characteristic.
 
I vote No Suspects.
This is the most viable UU metagme I've seen in a while.
Nothing is notably too useful. Gah, Black and White are going to screw over the whole metagame..
 
No Suspects

I've played in every round of the new UU since its inception, and nothing stands out as broken like the other metagames. Milotic is no more a suspect than she was in the Yanmega metagame, which as capefeather mentioned is very similar to this one.
 

Nexus

Forever the Recusant
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No suspects. This round has been the most enjoyable and balanced round of UU I have played so far. The variety, new sets, and pokemon appearing in this metagame is great and I would like to keep things the way they are, and like most others have mentioned, nothing truly stands out as "broken" to be considered a suspect in my opinion.
 
No suspects.
This round has been very fun to play in, diverse, and balanced. No Pokemon stood out to me and dominated a specific characteristic. Yes, some Pokemon have become the "standard" but none of them aren't hard to prepare for and beat.
 
No suspects. All Pokemon in the current metagame have enough counters for none to become too overpowered.
 
I'm nominating Clefable as a suspect under Defensive Characteristic. Clefable is simply too overpowered to be used in UU. With magic guard, it is hard to break it from stalling you. Along with a good movepool and stats, it deserves to be BL. It is hard to OHKO without it completely preventing you or undoing anything you can do to try and stop it. Magic Guard is OP.
 

franky

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Venusaur under "Support"

Its been brought up before in the past by several players but I think its the right time now that the metagame is stabilized. The fact of the matter is Venusaur is a walking bag of versatility, equipped with a great typing, and an arsenal of viable sets. Venusaur is perhaps one of the most problematic Pokemon to switch into against slower teams. If we run down the list of sets Venusaur can run, we'll find that it actually has a few safe switch-ins -- Registeel being one of the most reliable ones thanks to its typing. Before we get into the other list of counters, I'd like to whip out a list of viable Venusaur sets:

- Swords Dance (SD, Sleep Powder, Power Whip, Earthquake/Edge)
- Mix Venusaur (Sleep Powder / Synthesis / Sludge Bomb / Power Whip)
- Special (Sleep Powder / Synthesis / Sludge Bomb / Leaf Storm)
- SubSeed (Substitute / Leech Seed / Sludge Bomb / Power Whip)
- Defensive (Roar / Power Whip / Synthesis / Sludge Bomb)
- Choice Scarf (Sleep Powder / Leaf Storm / Sludge Bomb / Earthquake)
- Bluff (Sleep Powder / Power Whip / Sludge Bomb / Swords Dance)

Each set has its own viable counters. For example, the Swords Dance set can easily be countered by Leafeon and Tangrowth but they are unfortunately OHKO'ed by Sludge Bomb, ultimately making another teammates sweep much easier. A special set is countered by Registeel and Chansey. Power Whip can easily spell doom on Chansey who thinks you're running a fully special set. A well-played Venusaur can use Sludge Bomb and switch out to make the opponent think you are running a fully-special set. Ultimately, if we look at Venusaur as an overall picture, it is one of the hardest initial switch-in to bring into for two reasons:

1) Versatility
2) Sleep Powder

I haven't touched on Sleep Powder yet but it is definitely a deciding factor to why I think Venusaur suspect worthy. It can easily neutralize its counters to sleep, rendering them useless. I'd like to bring out my point again that Venusaur is the hardest initial switch-in because of its versatility. With that said, people will often go to their Registeel to absorb their sleep. With Registeel perfectly lured in, I believe this can help your other teammates set up and sweep later in the match. Mismagius is a perfect example of someone who can take advantage of this. This is just one example to how Venusaur can support a Pokemon sweep.

Before moving to the next point, I'd like to say that going to a "Sleep-Talker" is certainly not going to work. With Venusaur's fantastic typing and stats, you practically need a Sleep-talking Fire-type. However, there aren't many viable defensive Fire-types and I find "defensive" and "Fire-type" to be oxymoron since Stealth Rock is so prevalent in the game. RestTalk Arcanine is the only thing that can counter it but Stealth Rock and Sludge Bomb can potentially harm it as well. Other popular RestTalkers like Rotom are easily disposed off by Power Whip or Leaf Storm.

Outside of Registeel, countering Venusaur -- actually switching in and forcing it out means that YOU have to run a Fire-type to check it. Its stats all-around is incredible meaning it can take a hit on its usual counter like Registeel. Fire-types are the safest counters thanks to their super effective hit on Venusaur. One has to consider that 1) Stealth Rock totally hampers most of the defensive Fire-types in the game (Moltres and Arcanine) 2) Sludge Bomb can totally nail them if predicted wrong 3) Sleep Powder can easily neutralize them if they haven't already. These three factors explain why Venusaur can easily lure in these Fire-types and possibly help out another Pokemon sweep.

People need to understand that Venusaur uses its versatility and Sleep Powder to give its team the momentum they need to help something sweep. It can either create a hole in your team by using Sludge Bomb to catch your Leafeon, Arcanine, Moltres, Tangrowth off-guard or the inverse by catching Chansey with Power Whip and/or use Sleep Powder to lure in Registeel. These are several factors to why Venusaur can support a teammate sweep.
 

B-Lulz

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Ok, I will be nominating Rhyperior under both the Support Characteristic, and Venusaur under the Support characteristic.

I believe that Rhyperior is broken under the support charactertistic because of the sheer power of the Choice Band set. With a monster 140 base attack, two great STAB attacking typings equipped with a Choice Band, nothing is going to switch in unscathed unless a flying/levitator predicts an EQ. Flying types have massive risks with switching into Rhyperior anyway due to Stone Edge and if mispredicted will automatically incapacitate them. The four most common levitators, Rotom, Uxie, Mesprit and Claydol, all are still dealt with in their own way by Rhyperior. If they mispredict and come in on a Stone Edge, Rotom and Mesprit are KO'd with their standard sets, and Uxie is left lingering with around 50% health. Claydol is probably the best counter to Rhyperior in UU currently, but even though it resists Stone Edge it still takes a LOT of damage from it, especially since it has no reliable recovery. Here are some calcs to show how deadly CB Rhyperior is. All calcs assume max attack evs.

CB Stone Edge vs. 252/144 Claydol: 33.3% - 39.5% 3HKO
CB Stone Edge vs. 252/252 Uxie: 48.3% - 57.1% 2HKO after SR
CB Stone Edge vs. 252/0 Mesprit 75.2% - 88.7% Possible OHKO after SR
CB Stone Edge vs. 252/0 Poliwrath 38.6% - 45.4% 3HKO
CB Earthquake vs. 252/252 Hitmontop (at -1) 32.2% - 38.2%
CB Earthquake vs. 248/252 Milotic 60.3% - 71.2% 2HKO

Although these numbers may not seem like much, Solid Rock plays a huge factor in Rhyperiors broken-ness. Solid Rock reduces Super Effective (SE) hits from 2x SE to 1.33x SE, and 4x SE to 2.66x SE, meaning that it can take hits from such things like Hitmontop with ease. Here are some calcs to show what Rhyperior can take from its counters super effective hits, using the same sets in the above calcs. All calcs with be assuming Rhyperior is at full health of 426 (220 EVs).

252 Hitmontop Close Combat vs. Rhyperior: 48.6% - 57.3%
252 Poliwrath Waterfall vs. Rhyperior: 59.9% - 71.8%
114 Claydol Earth Power vs. Rhyperior: 47.4% - 56.3%
0 Uxie Psychic vs. Rhyperior: 26.1% - 31%
0 Milotic Surf vs. Rhyperior: 116.2% - 137.3%

Aside from Milotic, Rhyperior can take a hit from the switchin for the most part and, if possible at the time, KO back. Even though this shouldn't be the primary objective of CB Rhyperior, it can certainly be handy in a type spot.

In my opinion, CB Rhyperior should be used to soften up pokemon for a late game sweep. Swellow is a really hard pokemon to stop once Registeel, Aggron, Steelix, Regirock and Rhyperior are gone, and a CB Rhyperior can beat all of these Pokemon with ease or at least cripple them to withing Swellow KO range. Aside from this Rhyperior can sufficiently damage the Pokemon that aren't OHKO'd by Swellow outright, making a late game sweep that much easier. Swellow is not the only Pokemon you can do this with, as Rhyperior hits so many Pokemon so hard that it is pretty easy to sweep with a given Pokemon once Rhyperior has had its way with their team.

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Secondly, I am going to nominate Venusaur under the support characteristic.

Venusaur is kind of an odd choice in my opinion, because the fact it is so versatile and unpredictable is what makes it a suspect. Venusaur can run so many sets, and due to this simply has no hard counters because it can run so many sets. Although this doesn't make it suspect by itself, it means that nothing can switch in safely and any certain set can have the oppertunity to destroy a team.

The majority of the reason I think that makes Venusaur is Sleep Powder. Sleep Powder effectively nullifies one of its checks/counters and renders it useless. This means that to effectively counter Venusaur you need 2 Pokemon that can take a hit and deal with it. Compile this with the sheer versatility of the Pokemon and you will have a Pokemon that is extremely annoying and tough to break down, and in my opinion should be nominated to a BL vote.
 
No suspects. All Pokemon in the current metagame have enough counters for none to become too overpowered or be unbreakable
 

Flora

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No Suspects. This is one of the UU ladders that I've actually decided to deeply play in for being close to balance. I'd like it to stay.
 
No Suspects.

I've yet to find a Pokemon who meets any of the Suspect criteria. All team-styles are perfectly viable.
 
No Suspects

I will also be voting against any suspect presented. This round has been excellent. Everything that has been presented so far is by no means broken.
 
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