Project Undiscovered NFEs [REPLAYS REQUIRED]

Here's an interesting NFE I've been using lately.

Snubbull
Item: Eviolite
Ability: Intimidate
Nature: Impish
EVs: 252 HP, 252 Def, 4 Atk

I have two sets I've tried. This is the first one I ran:
-Play Rough
-Roar/Toxic
-Rest
-Sleep Talk
This set is entirely dedicated to taking physical hits. It has Intimidate to help in this as well. Rest is its only form of recovery, and serves it well.

A different set, same EVs, Nature and item:
-Bulk Up
-Play Rough
-Earthquake/Sleep Talk
-Rest
This set is meant to be a bulky setup attacker. Bulk Up is the preferred stat-up move because it also boosts its Defense, and helps to better take hits. Play Rough is a great physical STAB, and Earthquake helps to hit Poison-Types that try to swap in. Like before, Rest is a recovery move that also helps to eliminate status and helps boost longevity. However, if running Sleep Talk, you will have to give up Earthquake coverage, and won't have anything to punish steel and poison types on the swap.
Like Maro already said, physically defensive Snubbull has already been covered... Also, CroBull would rather use a specially defensive spread, since it should boost its defense with Intimidate and Bulk Up... A Specially defensive spread can help Snubb to start setup on a few special attackers like Scarf Rotom, Zebby and Floatzel:

252 SpA Rotom-F Blizzard vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Eviolite Snubbull: 126-148 (38.8 - 45.6%) -- 17.6% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock

252 SpA Life Orb Floatzel Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Eviolite Snubbull: 142-168 (43.8 - 51.8%) -- 9.8% chance to 2HKO

252 SpA Life Orb Zebstrika Thunderbolt vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Eviolite Snubbull: 110-133 (33.9 - 41%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

Yep, it's still dangerous... Especially with hazards up, but it can be a decent thing like crobink thanks to a STAB without immunities and decent bulk with eviolite...
 

5gen

jumper
is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Staff Alumnus
Skrelp bodying people

Skrelp is a really awesome poke with it's Water/Poison typing and Adaptability making it a strong offensive threat. It's ability to nail a large portion of the PU metagame strongly with mixed dual stabs is really it's main selling point. For example, Audino can take your special hits but Gunk Shot is a 2HKO. I've been toying with this Skrelp set on TR:

Skrelp @ Life Orb
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Gunk Shot
- Hydro Pump
- Scald
- Thunderbolt/Toxic Spikes

Max investment into both offensive stats really give Skrelp that kick along with it's ability. With it's low base 30 speed, Skrelp can really only make good use of it under Trick Room, where it outpaces most other pokemon. 60/60 atk/Satk isn't the best but Adaptability and Life Orb make up for it giving Skrelp some surprising power. Hydro and Scald get that x2 boost and any water switch in eats a Gunk Shot or Tbolt. Water/Poison typing also compliments it in that priority Aqua Jet or Mach Punch are resisted.

Calcs
  • 252+ SpA Life Orb Adaptability Skrelp Hydro Pump vs. 248 HP / 120 SpD Eviolite Machoke: 177-211 (48.7 - 58.1%) -- 96.1% chance to 2HKO
  • 252 Atk Life Orb Adaptability Skrelp Gunk Shot vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Audino: 234-278 (57 - 67.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
  • 252+ SpA Life Orb Adaptability Skrelp Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Gourgeist-Super: 133-156 (35.5 - 41.7%) -- 82.3% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
  • 252+ SpA Life Orb Adaptability Skrelp Scald vs. 80 HP / 0 SpD Grumpig: 143-169 (44.5 - 52.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
  • 252+ SpA Life Orb Skrelp Thunderbolt vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Eviolite Prinplup: 143-169 (43.2 - 51%) -- 96.9% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
Skrelp @ Life Orb
Ability: Adaptability
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Gunk Shot
- Hydro Pump
- Scald
- Thunderbolt

Carbink @ Custap Berry
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 SpA
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Stealth Rock
- Trick Room
- Moonblast
- Explosion

Beheeyem @ Life Orb
Ability: Analytic
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Trick Room
- Psyshock
- Signal Beam
- Thunderbolt

Ursaring @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Guts
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Swords Dance
- Facade
- Close Combat
- Crunch

Heatmor @ Expert Belt
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Fire Blast
- Superpower
- Knock Off
- Giga Drain

Gourgeist-Super @ Leftovers
Ability: Frisk
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Def
Adamant Nature
IVs: 14 Spe
- Trick Room
- Will-O-Wisp
- Explosion
- Bullet Seed/Seed Bomb
 
Skrelp bodying people

Skrelp is a really awesome poke with it's Water/Poison typing and Adaptability making it a strong offensive threat. It's ability to nail a large portion of the PU metagame strongly with mixed dual stabs is really it's main selling point. For example, Audino can take your special hits but Gunk Shot is a 2HKO. I've been toying with this Skrelp set on TR:

Skrelp @ Life Orb
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Gunk Shot
- Hydro Pump
- Scald
- Thunderbolt/Toxic Spikes

Max investment into both offensive stats really give Skrelp that kick along with it's ability. With it's low base 30 speed, Skrelp can really only make good use of it under Trick Room, where it outpaces most other pokemon. 60/60 atk/Satk isn't the best but Adaptability and Life Orb make up for it giving Skrelp some surprising power. Hydro and Scald get that x2 boost and any water switch in eats a Gunk Shot or Tbolt. Water/Poison typing also compliments it in that priority Aqua Jet or Mach Punch are resisted.

Calcs
  • 252+ SpA Life Orb Adaptability Skrelp Hydro Pump vs. 248 HP / 120 SpD Eviolite Machoke: 177-211 (48.7 - 58.1%) -- 96.1% chance to 2HKO
  • 252 Atk Life Orb Adaptability Skrelp Gunk Shot vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Audino: 234-278 (57 - 67.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
  • 252+ SpA Life Orb Adaptability Skrelp Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Gourgeist-Super: 133-156 (35.5 - 41.7%) -- 82.3% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
  • 252+ SpA Life Orb Adaptability Skrelp Scald vs. 80 HP / 0 SpD Grumpig: 143-169 (44.5 - 52.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
  • 252+ SpA Life Orb Skrelp Thunderbolt vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Eviolite Prinplup: 143-169 (43.2 - 51%) -- 96.9% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
Skrelp @ Life Orb
Ability: Adaptability
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Gunk Shot
- Hydro Pump
- Scald
- Thunderbolt

Carbink @ Custap Berry
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 SpA
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Stealth Rock
- Trick Room
- Moonblast
- Explosion

Beheeyem @ Life Orb
Ability: Analytic
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Trick Room
- Psyshock
- Signal Beam
- Thunderbolt

Ursaring @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Guts
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Swords Dance
- Facade
- Close Combat
- Crunch

Heatmor @ Expert Belt
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Fire Blast
- Superpower
- Knock Off
- Giga Drain

Gourgeist-Super @ Leftovers
Ability: Frisk
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Def
Adamant Nature
IVs: 14 Spe
- Trick Room
- Will-O-Wisp
- Explosion
- Bullet Seed/Seed Bomb

Nice post dude... But an Adptability user that can go under TR is a really small niche IMO, since you can just go with mixed Basculin and get the same KOs without needing TR at all... Sure, the Poison STAB is nice against a few things both offensively and defensively but again, non STAB LO Ice Beam does more than enough to keep a few things at bay, like Gourgeist and Tangela...

4 SpA Life Orb Basculin Ice Beam vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Gourgeist-Super: 177-211 (47.3 - 56.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

252 Atk Life Orb Adaptability Basculin Waterfall vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Grumpig: 169-200 (46.4 - 54.9%) -- 99.6% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

252 Atk Life Orb Adaptability Basculin Waterfall vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Audino: 203-239 (49.5 - 58.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

Sure, a few of those will get a little bit iffy, like Machoke and Prinplup, but isn't as significant as the amount of team support that could require Skrelp to work...

See ya!
 

Onix @ Custap Berry
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Taunt
- Explosion
- Toxic / Roar

I know Onix isn't really undiscovered since it was used on Sun teams but i have never seen this set and it worked decently well for me. Onix is, except Sudowoodo and Nosepass lol, the only Pokemon in the tier with access to Stealth Rock, Taunt, and Explosion. It also has Sturdy and hits 262 Speed Maxed which are cool as hell to guarantee a positive lead matchup against many other hazards setters. You can also use Mental Herb, it's cool.
 
Corphish @ Eviolite / Life Orb
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 56 HP / 252 Atk / 12 Def / 32 SpD / 156 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Crabhammer
- Aqua Jet
- Knock Off

Ive thought a bit about using Corpish for while and started to test it and here is the Result :]
Even though it faces competition from Basculin and Pokemon like Huntail it has some Niche that they miss. For example Basculin hasnt got Sword Dance to break through bulkier Teams with Pokemon like Avalugg and Huntails only priority Attack is Sucker Punch Which isnt that difficult to play around with and it has to trade its natural defensive abilities to get its Power and after the drops its easy to revengekill . If it uses hite Herb to negate that it misses some Koes for example on Floatzel with Sucker Punch .


Corpish has his disadvantages too, its sometimes not that easy to find a way to set up and its walled by Tangela even with Knock Off and X-Scissor its most likely that Tangela defeats Corpish 1 v 1 as long you arent +2 and Tangela hasnt got any prior damage , If you want it expressed more generell it has Problems with defeating Bulky Grass Types and faster Attackers which resist Aqua Jet most likely live a Hit and revenge kill afterwoods so its important that you play smart around them and lay hazards but who am I telling this^^ After the short Time if tested it I guess Roselia is a good Partner, its able to Cover his Weaknesses offensivly and defensivly and provide nice Spikes Support for it.
Use Life Orb to have the maximum Power or use Eviolite to find more opportunities to set up relativly safe .

Here are some Damage Calcs (I havent had 12 def Evs then) :
without hazards :
+2 252+ Atk Adaptability Corphish Aqua Jet vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Raichu: 224-264 (85.8 - 101.1%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Corphish Aqua Jet vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Raichu: 291-343 (111.4 - 131.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
0 Atk Avalugg Earthquake vs. 56 HP / 0 Def Corphish: 117-138 (48.5 - 57.2%) -- 93.4% chance to 2HKO
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Corphish Crabhammer vs. 248 HP / 8 Def Avalugg: 263-309 (66.9 - 78.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
+2 252+ Atk Adaptability Corphish Crabhammer vs. 248 HP / 8 Def Avalugg: 202-238 (51.3 - 60.5%) -- 90.6% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
0 Atk Avalugg Earthquake vs. 56 HP / 0 Def Eviolite Corphish: 79-93 (32.7 - 38.5%) -- 98.5% chance to 3HKO
0 Atk Audino Double-Edge vs. 56 HP / 0 Def Eviolite Corphish: 82-97 (34 - 40.2%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
+2 252+ Atk Adaptability Corphish Crabhammer vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Audino: 390-460 (95.1 - 112.1%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Corphish Crabhammer vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Audino: 507-598 (123.6 - 145.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
0 Atk Audino Double-Edge vs. 56 HP / 0 Def Corphish: 121-144 (50.2 - 59.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Corphish Crabhammer vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Clefairy: 330-390 (95.9 - 113.3%) -- 75% chance to OHKO
0 SpA Clefairy Moonblast vs. 56 HP / 32 SpD Corphish: 141-166 (58.5 - 68.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+2 252+ Atk Adaptability Corphish Crabhammer vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Clefairy: 254-300 (73.8 - 87.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
0 SpA Clefairy Moonblast vs. 56 HP / 32 SpD Eviolite Corphish: 93-111 (38.5 - 46%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Corphish Aqua Jet vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Dodrio: 239-283 (91.5 - 108.4%) -- 50% chance to OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Adaptability Corphish Aqua Jet vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Dodrio: 184-218 (70.4 - 83.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO


With Rocks :
+2 252+ Atk Corphish Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 32 Def Eviolite Roselia: 197-232 (64.8 - 76.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Corphish Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 32 Def Eviolite Roselia: 256-302 (84.2 - 99.3%) -- 75% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Corphish Aqua Jet vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Zebstrika: 263-309 (90.3 - 106.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252+ Atk Adaptability Corphish Aqua Jet vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Zebstrika: 202-238 (69.4 - 81.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252+ Atk Life Orb Adaptability Corphish Crabhammer vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Vullaby: 260-307 (75.8 - 89.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252+ Atk Adaptability Corphish Crabhammer vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Vullaby: 200-236 (58.3 - 68.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
.....
 
Hello, from now on we will enforce posting replays when posting a set as they promote discussion and really help supporting your point stopping everybody from simply ignoring the case you make for a specific set/Pokemon since you will need evidence to support your claims
Thank you for the cooperation
 
I've been trying some Fighting types besides Machoke (since IT WILL be Banned), and they are actually decent...

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/pususpecttest-397715031
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/pususpecttest-397773843
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/pususpecttest-397778064
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/pususpecttest-397965246
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/pususpecttest-397970964
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/pususpecttest-397975976
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/pususpecttest-397986011
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/pususpecttest-398093181
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/pususpecttest-398335869 (Machop Haxing, Meditite doing some damage)
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/pususpecttest-398402906

* Machop while of course not as bulky as Machoke, it can still get some Hax, and it's bulky enough to handle a few neutral hits with the same spread as Machoke... (252+ Atk Choice Band Stoutland Return vs. 248 HP / 140+ Def Machop: 306-361 (89.2 - 105.2%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO)
* Mienfoo is nice, while isn't speedy, it does have some not so shabby defenses, so it can get a few fake outs, Knock Offs and HJKs. OFC isn't as bulky as Machop.
* Pignite can afford to heavily invest in attack and HP and still be pretty bulky thanks to a "decent" defensive typing and 90 Base HP, which is MUCH better than a lot of NFEs.
* Meditite might feel a little bit Gimmicky but with a Scarf it is moderately fast (Only outspeed by Float, Zebby, Jask and Trode) and actually 358 aren't that bad, it can revenge a few things, sadly it is hard to get it safely on the field.
* Scraggy is IMO the best one... it can go BU, DD and even just defensive and it will probably do well... as long as DG Dabra and Mime aren't in the opponent team...

Obviously my replays aren't particularly high on ladder, or really specific, but I guess they can basically illustrate my points a little bit...
P.D.. I'll put a few more, later... I'm really sleepy right now...
 
Last edited:

5gen

jumper
is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Staff Alumnus
With Choke gone I've been experimenting with this set:

Scraggy @ Eviolite
Ability: Moxie
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Knock Off
- Drain Punch
- High Jump Kick/Iron Tail

The main reason Scraggy is ranked on the VR is because of it's Bulk Up set, but I decided to try put DD seeing as it gets Moxie is relatively bulky even with 0 bulk investment. Offensively speaking, 75 atk and 48 spe look rather mediocre in paper, but DDance and Moxie quickly make up for it. For example, +1 Jolly reaches 321 speed (outpacing base 95's and under). Knock Off and Drain Punch are great STABs, allowing Scraggy to DD up, attack and recover. High Jump Kick or Iron Tail in the last slot mainly for more power/coverage for Clef (I like HJK for the power). Keep in mind that it's able to comfortably set up due to Evio boosted bulk and recovery in Drain Punch.


Why use it over other Dragon Dancers?
vs
Fraxure is obviously the greater offensive threat because of it's greater attack, speed and physical bulk. However Scraggy has the better STABs and movepool imo. Outrage isn't a spammable move since you risk being locked, Superpower/Low Kick<HJK/Drain Punch, and they share the same coverage moves (Poison Jab, Iron Tail). I think what differentiates it the most from Fraxure is it's access to recovery, Moxie (means less turns for set up) and
how it's unexpected (most people expect BU).

vs
Altaria is definitely the more defensive DD user due to the bulk it has, Natural Cure and Cotton Guard/Roost. Again, Scraggy has the superior STABs and Moxie which means it's much more difficult to wall than DD Alt imo. However, Altaria's combo of higher speed, good natural bulk and reliable recovery/Natural Cure make it similar to Scraggy in the sense that they can both set up without much difficulty.

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/pu-400342307
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/pu-400344948
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/pu-400346745
I used it with webs support to mitigate the low base speed.
 

Meditite @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Pure Power
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- High Jump Kick
- Fire Punch
- Ice Punch / Thunder Punch
- Zen Headbutt / Trick

Upsides: Starting with this Set, Meditite is really good Scarfed, Considering it goes up to being a Max Speed Base 114, and leaving few things to outspeed it. Then with a Base 260 Fighting Move in HJK, and great coverage, and if you pair it with the right bulky Pokemon, it is a great Pivot to just Kill things and get out.

Downsides: Now, just like Carvanha, Meditite is EXTREMELY Frail, but tends to Live a Non-Stab weak hit. And when your Strongest Move has a Tedency to miss, that's another things that can go wrong too.

Summary: Meditite is a Glass Cannon that PU has over looked for a while. If you Add some Hazard Stack, Meditite can OHKO entire teams, watch out for Webs & T-Wave, as those erase the point of Scarfing Meditite, Gourgeist is a scary mon for Meditite. Meditite is a Great Pokemon, It is a OHKO Machine, and can tend to just Break through some of the tiers best walls.

252 Atk Huge Power Meditite Ice Punch vs. 248 HP / 164+ Def Altaria: 272-324 (77 - 91.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
252 Atk Huge Power Meditite Zen Headbutt vs. 252 HP / 32 Def Eviolite Roselia: 306-362 (100.6 - 119%) -- guaranteed OHKO


Marshtomp @ Eviolite
Ability: Torrent
EVs: 232 HP / 13 Atk / 13 SpA / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
- Scald
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock
- Toxic / Seismic Toss / Ice Punch

Upsides: Marshtomp is a Great Monferno Counter, Even if it's Grass Knot, as you'll see. And a Decent Special Wall, and can contend with a lot of things that want to try & Set Up on the Special side. It runs sets similar to other Water/Ground Types, being the one showed above. And it can Tedn to be a Great Special wall when paired with a Pokemon that Deals with Physical Grass Types.

Downsides: Once again, Marshtomp can't handle physical Grass types, such as Sawsbuck, Carnivine, and Gogoat. But everything else is somewhat free game when it comes to Non-Boosted Grass Moves.

Summary: Marshtomp is a Decent Special Wall, and a Physical if you feel like it. But it's just really good at Putting Damage on thing, Getting Rocks up, and annoying your Opponent with his/her bulk.

+2 252+ SpA Gorebyss Hydro Pump vs. 232 HP / 252+ SpD Eviolite Marshtomp: 216-255 (63.7 - 75.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Articuno Freeze-Dry vs. 232 HP / 252+ SpD Eviolite Marshtomp: 228-268 (67.2 - 79%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ SpA Monferno Grass Knot (60 BP) vs. 232 HP / 252+ SpD Eviolite Marshtomp: 124-148 (36.5 - 43.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO


Shelmet @ Eviolite
Ability: Overcoat
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Toxic / Baton Pass
- Infestation
- Spikes / Substitute
- Recover

Upsides: Shelmet is a Great Physical Wall, and maybe the best Physically Defensive Spike Setter in the Tier. It's great for Counter-Stalling Gourgeist, Audino, Regigigas, and etc. And Contributes to any Late game Sweepers you use. Also a Stallbreaker by just Toxicstation, but Shelmet doesn't like Magic Guard Clefairy, as it doesn't Take Toxic Damage or Infestation Damage (Last time I check.) And you're definitely not gonna be trying to do massive damage, as this is a STRAIGHT Wall.

Downsides: Special Fire Types Scare the Absolute crap out of Shelmet, And it really doesn't like Stone Edge if it hits, everything else can be free game. Considering it's Dismal Speed, it's not getting off a Recover Before you get hit.

Summary: Shelmet is a Physical Wall that tends to Out-stall, or Stall Out serious Physical, Clerical, Setting up Threats. Sadly it doesn't get Knock Off, so it's no more dangerous than what I've lined out. It's usable with just common snse, no predictions need for this wall, other than Recover plays.

252+ Atk Iron Fist Monferno Fire Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Shelmet: 122-146 (40.1 - 48%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252+ Atk Golem Stone Edge vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Shelmet: 182-216 (59.8 - 71%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Life Orb Adaptability Basculin Waterfall vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Shelmet: 99-117 (32.5 - 38.4%) -- 97.6% chance to 3HKO

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/pu-406458781 - Late Game Meditite Sweep
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/pu-406489445 - Shelmet > Regigigas, Late Game Meditite Sweep
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/pu-406520697 - Late Game Meditite Sweep
 

2xTheTap

YuGiOh main
is a Community Leader Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Top Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Staff Alumnus

History

Let me preface this by saying I've been using Frillish a lot over the course of XY and ORAS PU, on and off, but I've never really posted about it due to stigma related to using various unranked Pokemon, no matter how useful they might be from a teambuilding perspective. Such was the case with Teddeh's Chinchou, but it seems like the community has relaxed a bit to the point that I feel comfortable enough in presenting Frillish to you finally (the meta may be at its end already, but it's still better late than never). There are some other people like Freestylerking who have also posted that it's fairly underrated (his post in the LTPL dump thread here talks about it a little bit).

Believe it or not, this had a place on my very first PU team as early as mid-2014. It was a strange Webs team with Ursaring and Specs Camel where I used Taunt Frillish to spinblock during a time when Avalugg, Wartortle, and even Torkoal were commonly used for spinning away entry hazards, as well as to take on Poliwrath for both Ursaring and Camerupt:

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/pu-178736853 (see date stamp)
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/pu-178711709

Overview

My opinion of Frillish has not changed much over the past 2-3 years - I still believe this should be ranked, given that it's a perfect answer for standard Monferno / Combusken / Floatzel / Basculin / Chatot sets and is actually pretty nice for building more defensively oriented teams, akin to how other Eviolite users with reliable recovery work in blanket-checking large portions of the meta (ex. SpDef Clefairy, Vullaby).

Let's first talk about how Frillish addresses Monferno and Combusken; there are already standard defensive answers to Monferno that fit on a wide variety of teams, like Altaria, Grumpig, Pelipper, and to a lesser extent, Swanna and Stunfisk, but a lot of people ignore the rest of these options simply because they don't look good on paper. For example, Lampent, Slowpoke, and Tentacool are all usable and can counter or at least check Monferno via typing, but they're mostly reserved for 'heat' or squad dump style teams. Frillish is the same, and can only be beaten by the rare SD Thunder Punch variant of Monferno, which let's be honest, no one really uses anymore because Pelipper and Swanna are less common in building due to Altaria being more popular for its ability to also take on potent threats like Leafeon and Pawniard (at the same time). As far as Combusken is concerned, that is completely walled, and while Frillish may be slow, it can stop Combusken from passing more than +1 Speed with Taunt, if you choose to run that.

Floatzel is also hard countered by Frillish, with only HP Electric + Taunt sets barely being able to trade with it, because from full HP, LO HP Elec is still a 4HKO with the EV spread I've provided below. As I said earlier, HP Electric targets are less important with Pelipper and Swanna being less common than they once were, so Floatzel users will often opt out for Fighting (Focus Blast, Power-Up Punch) or Normal coverage (Frustration / Return) for breaking down Water resists. This meta trend basically allows Frillish to hard-wall Floatzel by being immune to Water / Normal / Fighting type moves and missing the 5- and 8HKO from Ice Punch and Beam, respectively (lol). This handles Basculin in the exact same way.

Lastly, another pertinent threat that it covers by itself is Chatot. Heat Wave does almost nothing to Frillish and it's immune to Boomburst, so the worst it's going to do is Encore you into Recover, or pivot on you into a Wisp or Water absorb (predicting this latter scenario, you can easily burn that Water Absorb switchin (ex. Cacturne) or hit it with Night Shade on the switch for some decent chip damage). Basically, building with this on balance means you no longer have to compulsively add Mr. Mime or Electrode to every team in order to avoid being weak to Chatot.

Moveset and EV Spread

In any case, let's get to the actual moveset:


Frillish @ Eviolite
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 248 HP / 192 Def / 20 SpD / 48 Spe
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Recover
- Scald
- Will-O-Wisp
- Night Shade

This has a considerably large movepool with options like Taunt, Trick Room, coverage for Grass-types in Sludge Wave and Ice Beam, etc., but I feel this set is best. The EVs are designed to maximize its largest stat (Special Defense) first, and 20 SpDef EVs with a Calm nature allow Frillish to avoid the 3HKO from Floatzel's LO HP Electric or Grass. Additionally, to give you a better idea of its bulk, this is fat enough to stay in on a Volt Switch from standard Zebstrika (Frillish takes 47-55% with the given spread).

48 Speed EVs allow it to outspeed and Scald on specially defensive Camerupt (this still exists, albeit it's a lot rarer than Specs variants are) and min Speed Golem. Even on a slow, defensive Pokemon like Frillish, this extra Speed can be useful because Taunt prevents a large portion of the defensive meta from healing itself (think Curse Muk, Bronzor, SpDef Clefairy, Trapinch, etc.) or setting up Stealth Rock. Taunt also prevents Combusken from Speedpassing more than +1 Speed, which is huge in neutralizing the threat of a boosted breaker sweeping through your team.

The rest of its EVs are used to maximize HP first and Defense second. Doing so allows Frillish to sponge supereffective moves to some extent; for example, assuming Frillish is at or above 85%, it can take Leafeon's unboosted Leaf Blade, Sawsbuck's Horn Leech and Pawniard's Knock Off, and then neutralize the threat with Will-O-Wisp when Frillish staying alive isn't critical to the matchup. Not only that, but this level of HP and Defense investment allows it to blanket check and Scald or Wisp on some of the meta's most common physical attackers, like Muk, Gabite, non-CB Golem, Charcoal Rapidash, Metang, Arbok, Bouffalant lacking Substitute, and many others.

Alternatively, you could use an offensive Frillish for pivoting into Floatzel / Monferno / Chatot primarily, and then firing off a strong Specs Water Spout afterward, but I really think that set is outclassed by Octillery. Frillish does have Trick and Trick Room, which could potentially allow OTR and Specs sets to be used, but I think its defensive sets are superior in most cases.
252 SpA Life Orb Floatzel Hidden Power Electric vs. 248 HP / 20+ SpD Eviolite Frillish: 88-104 (28.1 - 33.2%) -- guaranteed 4HKO

252 SpA Life Orb Combusken Hidden Power Electric vs. 248 HP / 20+ SpD Eviolite Frillish: 88-104 (27.4 - 32.3%) -- guaranteed 4HKO

252 SpA Life Orb Ninetales Energy Ball vs. 248 HP / 20+ SpD Eviolite Frillish: 127-151 (40.5 - 48.2%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

252 SpA Life Orb Zebstrika Volt Switch vs. 248 HP / 20+ SpD Eviolite Frillish: 148-174 (47.2 - 55.5%) -- 71.5% chance to 2HKO

---

+6 0 Atk Muk Poison Jab vs. 248 HP / 192 Def Eviolite Frillish: 153-180 (47.6 - 56%) -- 84% chance to 2HKO

252+ Atk Metang Earthquake vs. 248 HP / 192 Def Eviolite Frillish: 72-85 (23 - 27.1%) -- 51% chance to 4HKO

252 Atk Choice Band Ninjask Aerial Ace vs. 248 HP / 192 Def Eviolite Frillish: 99-117 (30.8 - 36.4%) -- 55.1% chance to 3HKO

252 Atk Gabite Earthquake vs. 248 HP / 192 Def Eviolite Frillish: 109-129 (34.8 - 41.2%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

+1 252+ Atk Arbok Earthquake vs. 248 HP / 192 Def Eviolite Frillish: 124-146 (39.6 - 46.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

+1 252+ Atk Altaria Dragon Claw vs. 248 HP / 192 Def Eviolite Frillish: 123-145 (39.2 - 46.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

252+ Atk Golem Earthquake vs. 248 HP / 192 Def Eviolite Frillish: 145-172 (46.3 - 54.9%) -- 66% chance to 2HKO

252 Atk Rapidash Wild Charge vs. 248 HP / 192 Def Eviolite Frillish: 140-166 (44.7 - 53%) -- 25.4% chance to 2HKO

---

252+ Atk Life Orb Sheer Force Mawile Play Rough vs. 248 HP / 192 Def Eviolite Frillish: 175-208 (55.9 - 66.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252 Atk Leafeon Leaf Blade vs. 248 HP / 192 Def Eviolite Frillish: 224-266 (71.5 - 84.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252 Atk Sawsbuck Horn Leech vs. 248 HP / 192 Def Eviolite Frillish: 176-210 (56.2 - 67%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252+ Atk Pawniard Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 248 HP / 192 Def Eviolite Frillish: 224-266 (71.5 - 84.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Teambuilding Options

Now that the boring stuff is covered, let's talk about how you can build with Frillish.

Monferno is a great partner for Frillish - not only does it check Pawniard, Cacturne, and Leafeon for Frillish, but Frillish can switch into Floatzel and Basculin on Monferno's behalf. The latter scenario happens often if you use Swords Dance Monferno, given that your opponent is sometimes forced to check +2 Monferno with faster, supereffective priority, and there are really only two strong options for that. Frillish can use that scenario to activate Water Absorb, and then burn whatever comes in on the following turn. When you predict Knock Off, Monferno is an okay option to take that for Frillish too.

+
Frillish @ Eviolite
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 248 HP / 192 Def / 20 SpD / 48 Spe
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Recover
- Will-O-Wisp
- Night Shade

Monferno @ Eviolite
Ability: Iron Fist
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Mach Punch
- Close Combat
- Flare Blitz

Other cool options that have nearly perfect type synergy with Frillish are Bouffalant and Sawsbuck. They're immune to two of Frillish's weaknesses (via Sap Sipper and absorbing Ghost-type moves via typing), while in exchange, Frillish hard switches with ease into Monferno and Combusken and checks them both with Scald. Some Pokemon can switch into both Frillish and Sawsbuck (ex. Gourgeist forms), but that can be broken down to some extent with Frillish's Night Shade and/or Wisp for either sap-sipping Pokemon.

Given Frillish's access to TR, you can use a slow CB Sap Sipper Bouffalant + TR setting Frillish for the same kind of type synergy, but on a different playstyle (configuration 2 below).

+
/

Configuration 1:

Frillish @ Eviolite
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 248 HP / 192 Def / 20 SpD / 48 Spe
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Recover
- Will-O-Wisp
- Night Shade

Sawsbuck @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Sap Sipper
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Baton Pass / Toxic / Facade
- Horn Leech
- Jump Kick
- Double-Edge

or

Bouffalant (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Sap Sipper
Happiness: 0
EVs: 248 HP / 136 Atk / 124 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Substitute
- Swords Dance
- Frustration
- Earthquake

Configuration 2 (TR):

Bouffalant @ Choice Band
Ability: Sap Sipper
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Head Charge
- Facade
- Earthquake
- Megahorn

Frillish @ Eviolite
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Trick Room
- Recover
- Water Spout / Scald
- Ice Beam / Sludge Wave

Another solid option to pair with Frillish is Pawniard. It can switch into Dark-, Ghost-, and Grass-type moves on Frillish's behalf, while Frillish takes Fire- and Fighting-type moves for Pawniard. It counters Monferno perfectly, so the worst that will happen is Monferno gaining momentum on Frillish via U-Turn as you switch into a predicted Mach Punch. Additionally, Pawniard switches into Toxic for Frillish, which is a common way you'll lose Frillish during a match. Like Monferno, Pawniard can also stomach a Knock Off, which will allow Frillish to counter Monferno / Floatzel / Chatot for Pawniard and its teammates more reliably.

+

Pawniard @ Eviolite
Ability: Defiant
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Knock Off
- Swords Dance
- Sucker Punch
- Iron Head

Frillish @ Eviolite
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 248 HP / 192 Def / 20 SpD / 48 Spe
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Recover
- Will-O-Wisp
- Night Shade

There are many other team options for Frillish, but the main things to keep in mind are protecting it from status (Toxic namely), its weakness to Knock Off, and covering its basic type weaknesses by building with checks to Ghost-, Grass-, Dark-, and Electric-types. Here are some example teams below.

Sample Frillish Teams

Frillish OTR


Pawniard @ Eviolite
Ability: Defiant
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Def
Brave Nature
- Knock Off
- Swords Dance
- Sucker Punch
- Iron Head

Bouffalant @ Choice Band
Ability: Sap Sipper
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Head Charge
- Facade
- Earthquake
- Megahorn

Beheeyem @ Colbur Berry
Ability: Analytic
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Trick Room
- Signal Beam
- Recover
- Psychic

Frillish @ Eviolite
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Trick Room
- Recover
- Scald
- Ice Beam

Solrock @ Focus Sash
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Magic Coat
- Stealth Rock
- Explosion
- Trick Room

Camerupt @ Choice Specs
Ability: Solid Rock
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 Def
- Earth Power
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Fire Blast
- Eruption

This team is pretty straightforward - lead with Focus Sash Solrock, and click Magic Coat if you predict other leads like Smeargle or Leavanny to use Spore / Dark Void or Sticky Web, respectively. This reflects Taunt as well. Trick Room as your Sash is broken, and either explode or set SR on the following turn (based on the matchup - will Explosion do more damage, or will SR). As you attack with Beheeyem, Dark-types may come in, and most of them are KOed by Signal Beam on the switch, which helps preserve Frillish. Similarly, it can just stay in and Signal Beam while Colbur Berry eats the hit for Beheeyem. Just as I said above, Bouffalant and Pawniard will protect Frillish against Dark-, Ghost-, and Grass-type moves, as well as Knock Off and Toxic, while in return, Frillish protects both of them from Monferno, from being chipped by Floatzel and Chatot, and then it fires off a max SpA Scald (or Water Spout if that's your thing) or Ice Beam on the next turn. Camerupt acts as a Volt Switch for Frillish, while Frillish beats most Water-types one on one for Camerupt - you can easily change Frillish's offensive coverage to beat what you think the team is weakest to. Ice Beam is a cool option for beating Gabite / Vibrava / Altaria for Camerupt, but having something to hit bulky Waters is nice for the same reason. Camerupt can also take WoW for Pawniard and Bouffalant, if that becomes necessary. Lastly, Assault Vest Bouffalant is a solid option over CB, in case you feel the need to switch between Facade and its other moves, but usually breaking with CB is the better way to play TR bulky offense.

Frillish MukTrap


Muk @ Black Sludge
Ability: Sticky Hold
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 240 SpD / 12 Spe
Careful Nature
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Curse
- Poison Jab

Frillish @ Eviolite
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 248 HP / 192 Def / 20 SpD / 48 Spe
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Recover
- Scald
- Taunt
- Night Shade

Leafeon @ Leftovers
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Heal Bell
- Knock Off
- Swords Dance
- Leaf Blade

Trapinch @ Eviolite
Ability: Arena Trap
EVs: 248 HP / 28 Def / 232 SpD
Careful Nature
- Earthquake
- Toxic
- Rest
- Sleep Talk

Chatot @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Tangled Feet
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Boomburst
- Heat Wave
- U-turn
- Hidden Power [Ground]

Probopass @ Air Balloon
Ability: Magnet Pull
EVs: 112 HP / 252 SpA / 144 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Stealth Rock
- Volt Switch
- Power Gem / Smack Down
- Earth Power

The team's basic premise is to trap or check all Normal resists, so that either Muk sweeps through with Curse, or Chatot cleans with Boomburst. Trapinch keeps Soundproof Pokemon at bay for Chatot (i.e. Electrode and non-Psyshock Mr. Mime are both trapped), while Probopass and Trapinch beat Steel-types so that Muk wins. Leafeon is glue and a tertiary wincon and it can field most Ground-type moves for Muk. Leafeon's Heal Bell wakes both Trapinch and Muk up from Rest, which is quite helpful. It also cures its own burns, if it's forced to go head-to-head with stuff like Gourgeist-XL (or absorb Scald burns). Taunt on Frillish is cool here, as it prevents SpDef Clefairy, Stunfisk, min Speed Golem, Bronzor, and specially defensive Camerupt from setting SR, which is useful in preserving Chatot's HP. It also prevents stuff like Munchlax, Muk, Trapinch, Bronzor, and Clefairy from healing themselves. Taunt disallows Combusken from passing out more than +1 Speed, which means Scarf Chatot will be faster than your opponent in most cases. And finally, Taunt stops BU Ursaring and RestTalkSD Bouffalant from sweeping through your team. Frillish is protected from Toxic and Knock Off by Muk, as well as Frillish's natural enemies, like Jumpluff, Leafeon (although Muk does not take +2 Double-Edges well), Cacturne, Scarf Rotom-F, Zebstrika, and so on. Trapinch also beats some of the same Electric-types that Muk does, so Frillish should be staying around for the long haul and continuously beating threats like Chatot, Floatzel, Monferno, and Combusken for the team.

Replays

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/pu-570385006 - vs Broken Phobias
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/pu-570382191 - vs PokemonmasterTJ
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/pu-569041531 - vs Anonymousman using my sample
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/pu-582729050 - opponent doesn't have the best team, but it shows Frillish doing what it does best - pivoting into a resisted / an attack it's immune to, and burning the switch-in
 
Last edited:

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 1, Guests: 0)

Top