Maybe……..
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Metagame SV OU Metagame Discussion v4 [Volcarona Banned]
- Thread starter TPP
- Start date
So a Tournament Arc?
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ou-2024984052
Charm pon. I know that team I was facing was unorthodox, but the power to reduce attack by two stages is heavily underrated.
Charm pon. I know that team I was facing was unorthodox, but the power to reduce attack by two stages is heavily underrated.
Gouging Fire is the Gohan of the tier IMO, this thing just has so much potential. I've been thinking it over and I think building around Tera Ground GF could be very effective. It's typing is great at baseline, but Tera Ground will turn it into physical Arceus-Ground who still has Dragon/Fire STAB and a more flexible item slot. Cool to be able to dodge wisp/t-wave on 1 set as well. Also a pretty good Tera when staring down an Iron Boulder.
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What niche does excadrill have in OU?
Considering that tyranitar is not in OU anymore it is hard for me to imagine what role it has got.
Considering that tyranitar is not in OU anymore it is hard for me to imagine what role it has got.
Excadrill lacks any significant bulk but has a useful defensive typing for a lot of teams right now and can set-up and spin with good offensive stats. I've been using Balloon Excadrill Iron Head/EQ/Swords Dance/Spin. I like to use a double ground core on my team and Exca gives me an extra Fairy resist, a ground that isnt technically weak to ice, and spinner I didn't have before. Pretty nice switch-in to Raging Bolt. Ive messed with Tera Fire Tera Blast sets but like the regular regular degular better. Iron Treads is better for utility, but I like The Power of Excadrill. It's also got mold breaker to rock into Hatterene if you're using it as a rocker.
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if Deoxys S is balanced how is Regieleki banworthy, especially since we banned it before the nerf to its Transistor Ability was known?
the two have nothing to do with each other
regieleki has perfect coverage with two moves and gets STAB on both with tera, making it much much stronger
i do not think this comparison is apt
transistor boosting its sp.atk + boltbeam coverage w/ tera ice was one helluva drug
well, it's a spinner that matches up well into ghold, which is a free ticket onto the viability rankings at minimum. anything it does outside of that is bonus points
I’ve been running B to C grade teams featuring Weavile recently. It’s not quite on the level of what it used to be, and doesn’t have meowscarada utility.
Although that said, now that there’s 3 excellent ice types in OU that we are all talking about (Meowscarada, Kyurem, and Weavile). Here’s something for people to try.
Suggested standard Weavile set:
Weavile @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Pressure
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Knock Off
- Triple Axel
- Swords Dance
- Ice Shard
On the topic of chilly reception, it’s finally possible to revitalise a somewhat reasonable imitation of the “ice skates bundle” set. Kyurem and Meowscarada are the most logical substitues for that super fun set, but Meowscarada can’t use blizzard. Unfortunately Kyurem is lacking a pivot move, but it’s still okay. The set for Meowscarada is obvious, and for Kyurem, here’sthe set:
Kyurem @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Pressure
Tera Type: Ice
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Draco Meteor
- Blizzard
- Freeze-Dry
- Earth Power
——-
Edit, the meowscarada set isn’t so obvious, here’s a sample:
Meowscarada @ Heavy-Duty Boots / Choice band / protective pads / choice scarf
Ability: Protean
Tera Type: Fire / Electric / Ghost / Fighting
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Triple Axel
- U-turn
- Flower Trick / Low kick
- Knock Off
the variety for Meowscarada is mostly in the item choice and Tera choice. Fire resists burns and eases matchups with some switchins. Electric is good vs the non existent zapdos and paralysis, ghost allows you to perform better against body press. Fighting is good with low kick, and can surprise end game Tera dondozo, kingambit and mid game ting Lu, archaludon and heatran.
Tera grass or dark can also be used for the adaptability boost or to restore original STAB, which might be good in some critical situations.
Although that said, now that there’s 3 excellent ice types in OU that we are all talking about (Meowscarada, Kyurem, and Weavile). Here’s something for people to try.
Suggested standard Weavile set:
Weavile @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Pressure
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Knock Off
- Triple Axel
- Swords Dance
- Ice Shard
- You don’t need low kick as desperately in the current meta due to kingambit being possible to pressure throughout the game with other methods. Kingambit has also changed from being on 2-3 in every 5 teams, to 2-3 in every 10 teams, almost half its ATH usage.
- Tera ghost can help you deal with skarmory when you’re ready. It also gives you an insurance policy against dragonite sweeps and a way to 1v1 some zamazenta, depending on if you get a free turn and whether it has the def boost. Tera ice has limited utility in the current meta, but with it you can preserve the snow boost and OHKO a few more threats at +2
- Jolly > adamant in the current meta. There’s too many Pokémon’s between 349 and 383 speed
- Matches up decently vs top threats and the ice def boost allows it to survive a range of hits, this makes it a good partner to chilly reception glowking. But Weavile does need quite a bit of pivot support to flourish.
On the topic of chilly reception, it’s finally possible to revitalise a somewhat reasonable imitation of the “ice skates bundle” set. Kyurem and Meowscarada are the most logical substitues for that super fun set, but Meowscarada can’t use blizzard. Unfortunately Kyurem is lacking a pivot move, but it’s still okay. The set for Meowscarada is obvious, and for Kyurem, here’sthe set:
Kyurem @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Pressure
Tera Type: Ice
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Draco Meteor
- Blizzard
- Freeze-Dry
- Earth Power
- lack of pivoting move means it’s not as hit and run as the traditional ice skates sets. Kyurem also lacks the speed of other skaters, so can’t force out as many offensive pokemon. It makes up for that with its strong bulk in the snow, as some pokemon won’t want to trade hits with it.
- Blizzard is very fun in the snow, a little better than NMI + ice beam.
——-
Edit, the meowscarada set isn’t so obvious, here’s a sample:
Meowscarada @ Heavy-Duty Boots / Choice band / protective pads / choice scarf
Ability: Protean
Tera Type: Fire / Electric / Ghost / Fighting
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Triple Axel
- U-turn
- Flower Trick / Low kick
- Knock Off
the variety for Meowscarada is mostly in the item choice and Tera choice. Fire resists burns and eases matchups with some switchins. Electric is good vs the non existent zapdos and paralysis, ghost allows you to perform better against body press. Fighting is good with low kick, and can surprise end game Tera dondozo, kingambit and mid game ting Lu, archaludon and heatran.
Tera grass or dark can also be used for the adaptability boost or to restore original STAB, which might be good in some critical situations.
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Regieleki being far more powerful for one. It having Transistor as an ability means all electric attacks get a x1.3 bonus.
252 SpA Transistor Regieleki Thunderbolt vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Tera Fairy Mew: 160-189 (39.6 - 46.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Deoxys-Speed Psycho Boost vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Tera Fairy Mew: 186-219 (46 - 54.2%) -- 4.7% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Thunderbolt doing about just 8 less % damage compare to Deoxys-S’s Psycho Boost is huge. You get that power consistently as opposed to just 1 time use. Electric is also surprisingly spammable despite what the type chart shows. Most things that resist electric are weak to Ice, which is what was keeping Regieleki in check back in gen 8, or rather lack there of. It’s much harder to switch into Regieleki when if has Ice or Grass or Water to beat your Ground types.
Also should be mentioned but Regieleki would also be able to naturally outspeed Iron Valiant even after Booster Energy.
I prefer life orb with low kick over swords dance because although it is half its usage, it still has 28%. Plus it helps against stuff like darkrai, hamurott, archaludon and smacks kyurem harder. I agree with tera ghost is the best option though I have found I haven't been tera'ing weavile that often. I think it is a heavily underrated mon as it hits harder and is faster than meow.
Life Orb is bad on a mon as frail as Weavile and weak to SR, especially within this metagame. The extra power isn’t necessary anyways since Knock + T-Axel on Boots still forces progress with Spikes.
The neat thing about Tera Ice is that it lets you 2HKO Skarm unboosted.
252 Atk Tera Ice Weavile Triple Axel (40 BP) (3 hits) vs. 252 HP / 160+ Def Skarmory: 156-186 (46.7 - 55.6%) -- approx. 64.8% chance to 2HKO
With rocks its guaranteed.
Also btw, has anyone experimented with Boots Knock Rai? Dpulse/Sludge/Ice Beam threatens every common Knock absorber while removing boots from its checks like Bliss, Clod, and Pex can let it mow past them with Spikes.
This.
has four important things over Deo-S:A: Faster than
at a base 200 speed, rather than Deo-S' base 180.B: Stronger than
- its Special Attack is slightly higher, at 100 to Deoxys-S' Base 95 and it only needed two moves to threaten literally everything- Tera Blast Ice and Thunderbolt (or Thunder Cage, if you're feeling spicy- also helps to chip down those Electric Resists).C: Its ability is far better than
's ability. Deo-S can't really make the most of Pressure due to its poor bulk. Transistor, on the other hand, effectively gives a free Life Orb boost to all of Eleki's already strong Electric-type attacks.D: Better typing. Pure Electric is actually far better than Pure Psychic, especially in a metagame with
and 
running around.In this metagame, Eleki wouldn't quite be as obscenely broken (there are a few Electric resists that AREN'T weak to ice, but nothing that resists both) but it still would be plenty ridiculous due to the fact that it would absolutely restrict teambuilding by forcing literally every single team to run 'mons like
to not risk immediately being bowled over by it. (And even then, you'd have to play very conservatively with your Gouging Fire so as to ensure it doesn't get put into Tera Blast range).
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Survey results were just posted, and I think a lot of people beg to differ. Timelines still being discussed, but nothing had close to strong support or a consensus throughout the community.
i think it's still a bit too soon to move on anything. the meta's still young, and opinions are still subject to change. we just had a survey and nothing looks immediately actionable, so i think the plan is to just give it time for now. and even if those three are broken (which i strongly suspect they all are), we should at least wait until sunday before banning any of those three so i can post this on r/stunfisk
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I do think a mistake coming into DLC 2 is that we didn't drop 
A lot of people felt that
was better when they were both allowed, and it turned out wasn't even that overbearing.
DLC 2 would have been a great time to retest him
has tools to deal with meta mons like 
, and 
that doesn't and would lose to probably
Either way, that time has passed and we probably won't see him in OU this generation
A lot of people felt that
was better when they were both allowed, and it turned out wasn't even that overbearing.DLC 2 would have been a great time to retest him
has tools to deal with meta mons like , and that doesn't and would lose to probablyEither way, that time has passed and we probably won't see him in OU this generation
I'm just going to put this out there, but:
Fun and competitive ratings are good, both for the generation as a whole, and for coming out soon after DLC, but neither are amazing. There's a lot of mons that received ratings in the "Keep an eye on this" range, but none in the "Time to suspect" band, nor did Kokoloko have support to act en masse. The tier is fairly diverse except in very high ladder, where fat balance is king.
If we're ever going to reopen discussion on terastalization, now's the time. Everything's pretty much OK, there's no immediate action that needs to be handled first, and between a full discussion and the time for a suspect, any potential action could land immediately after SLC, so it's even well matched to the tourney scene.
Fun and competitive ratings are good, both for the generation as a whole, and for coming out soon after DLC, but neither are amazing. There's a lot of mons that received ratings in the "Keep an eye on this" range, but none in the "Time to suspect" band, nor did Kokoloko have support to act en masse. The tier is fairly diverse except in very high ladder, where fat balance is king.
If we're ever going to reopen discussion on terastalization, now's the time. Everything's pretty much OK, there's no immediate action that needs to be handled first, and between a full discussion and the time for a suspect, any potential action could land immediately after SLC, so it's even well matched to the tourney scene.
nothing seemed broken in the first few weeks. everyone was trying out random sets and their favourite returning pokemon. For half a minute there iron boulder looked crazy broken but that was incorrect. I dont think anything is at quickban level but surely SOME kind of suspect is legitimate.
Yeah, I figure now is probably the time to think about tiering action against Tera? We've not got any threats that are obscenely broken, as it stands, so I figure now's as good a time as any to take a good, long look at Terastalization.
I've been saying it since the survey, now is def the time to retest tera once and for all.
I do wonder what the impact of no tera right now would be. I'm all for banning it if the metagame would become better, but as you said the metagame is pretty good right now so potentially shaking it up for something that might only work would not be in our best interests. Again, if someone can say what the metagame might look like without tera right now, both good and bad things that would appear, then I might lean more towards tera action.
Having a tera suspect when the metagame is still developing is stupid let the metagame evolve more (and let more mons get banned because of this shitty mechanic) and then we can discuss tera, not when there are tons of "borderline" mons in the tier that have not even a lick of substance yet.