Resource SS RU Viability Rankings (Crown Tundra)

gorex

penguin council
is a Site Content Manageris a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
LCPL Champion
VR Update (Dated 30/9/2021)

Rises:

A -> A+
A- -> A
A- -> A
B+ -> A-
B+ -> A-
B+ -> A-
B -> B+
B- -> A-
B- -> B
Mow Rotom
C+ -> B+
C+ -> B-
C+ -> B-
C+ -> B-
C -> C+
Drops:
A+ -> A
A+ -> A
A+ -> A
A+ -> A
A -> A-
A- -> B+
A- -> B+
A- -> B+
B+ -> B
B+ -> B
B -> B-
Rain (
1626509790640.png
1626509794689.png
1626509801925.png
1626509817746.png
) B -> B-
Sun (
1626510289547.png
1626510294146.png
1626510302181.png
1626510306258.png
) B -> B-
Hail (
1626509570452.png
) B -> C-
B- -> C+
B- -> C+
B- -> C+
B- -> C+
B- -> C
C+ -> C
C+ -> C
C+ -> C
C -> C-
C -> C-
Additions:
UR -> A
UR -> C+
UR -> C
Removals:
C+ -> UR
C- -> UR
C- -> UR
C- -> UR
 
Last edited:
:ss/Vanilluxe:

I nominate Vanilluxe to C. As the generally best hail setter in the tier with its excellent breaking power of either specs or taunt sets, it deserves a mention as an amazing partner for arctovish to both threaten out its checks and set hail for it to get a speed boost. While its lackluster speed and bulk can hurt it in many situations, its ability to outspeed and threaten large swaths of the water, flying types, and grass types of the tier (and some physically defensive pokemon) such as gastrodon, milotic, celebi, crobat, (defensive) togekiss, nidoqueen, g-weezing, etc. gives it a strong niche as an ice-type wallbreaker. Furthermore, the steel and fire types typically used to sponge its attacks lack reliable recovery, meaning they are often susceptible to crumpling to its attacks with minimal chip. The only pokemon that are able to withstand its assault in the long run are registeel, porygon-2, and umbreon due to their ability to shrug off blizzard and heal in the later two's case (which doesn't even work vs the occasional taunt set). All three of them are vulnerable to chip from hazards and hail damage, making them shaky checks in the long run if not played carefully.

Additionally, arctovish bears mention, as it is relevant to this nomination. The choice band or life orb sets with fishious rend, icicle crash, stone edge, and freeze dry are able to 2hko everything in the tier after hail and stealth rock, with the exception of vaporeon and milotic. The only other pokemon that is not 2hkoed outright is fully specially defensive leftovers gastrodon. All three pokemon let vanilluxe come in virtually for free to allow it to use its stab moves, forcing damage onto the opponent's team, especially with hazards down.

While the combination of these two essentially mandates robust hazard support, there are multiple options available in the tier to make that feasible such as flygon, starmie, xatu, togekiss, etc.

Overall, both Arctovish and Vanilluxe deserve a ranking of C at the least.
 

GoldCat

BOSSARU CUP WINNER
is a Site Content Manageris a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a defending SCL Champion
:bw/tornadus: B- to B+
I was actually surprised to not see Tornadus rise with this VR update. Knock Off + U-turn is all it needs and its 4th move is super flexible, as you can run all sorts of moves like Heat Wave, Superpower, Tailwind, Nasty Plot, or even Air Slash for an accurate Flying STAB. Like come on, Tornadus is just like Thundurus but balanced! I adore this 'mon and would vote it to rise to A- but I don't think it has the usage yet to justify it.

B to B+
Both Obstagoon and Pangoro are currently great wallbreakers and have enjoyed a good amount of usage in SCL so far. Their Dark typing also contributes to the team defensively, so they aren't hard to fit with how prominate Reuniclus is. Nothing can safely switch into either of them with Pangoro's brain dead STABs in Knock and Scrappy CC and Obstagoon cripples its switch-ins with Knock of tricking its Flame Orb with Switcheroo. Also, Obstagoon will almost always get Leftovers after tricking so it can no longer get worn down with its own burn and only has to worry about hazards, which isn't the biggest problem with how good Flygon and Crobat are. Could easily see both or just one of them rise to A- rank.

:bw/escavalier: C+ to B- / B
I have been using Escavalier and have found in tests that it can be surprisingly annoying for a lot of teams to handle. It's a great CM Reuniclus check and it's not 2HKOed by Timid Nidoqueen's Earth Power, which is always nice. Escavalier being a Steel-type with its 4x weakness to Fire will always hold it back and it'll probably never be ranked above the B rank.

:bw/quagsire: B- to C+
As we all know, Quagsire only fits on stall teams and as seen last week of SCL stall teams can do just as fine without it. I don't see why a stall-specific Pokemon should be ranked that high when it's not even a mandatory pick.
 

KaenSoul

Shared:Power Little Knight
is a Community Leaderis a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a member of the Battle Simulator Staff
Community Leader
A+ to S
I think Flygon may be the best Pokémon in the tier (after Reuniclus, but he is leaving), is an excelent offensive pivot, a defogger that actually scare most sr users and the DD set is a great wincon. It has few checks than dont relly on switching into the right stab on Gardevoir, Levi Geezing, Bronzong and Togekiss. But they cant switch into U-turn all the day and only toge has recovery, but then you u-turn into Raikou/Xurki and he is forced to leave without healing first, volturn is really strong right now because how hard to punish the core is. The DD set doesnt need much support to work, if togekiss takes just a bit of damage it gets into stone edge/thunder punch range, Garde takes 70-82% from +1 SE (is ohko if you run LO and SR are on the field), and thats leaves Levi Geezing and Bronzong who are pretty easy to take advantage and dont fit on most teams.
 

aVocado

@ Everstone
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Top Contributor Alumnus
:toxicroak:
Toxicroak @ Life Orb
Ability: Dry Skin
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Gunk Shot
- Sucker Punch
- Drain Punch

Toxicroak is good insurance against water types and has too many easy setup opportunities to be ignored and left in B+. Seems like a lot of teams have a water-type and croak is very good against them, a +2 croak is a very scary one that is hard to revenge kill:


+2 252 Atk Life Orb Toxicroak Sucker Punch vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Gardevoir: 244-289 (88 - 104.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252 Atk Life Orb Toxicroak Sucker Punch vs. 172 HP / 0 Def Flygon: 207-244 (60.1 - 70.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery


i personally like to run adamant but its preference and can be tailored to specific builds. adamant only needs a lil bit of chip to kill flygon (like 20%) and gardevoir is dead either way after rocks, it also sits at a comfortable speed where its faster than togekiss, regidrago, and a bunch of other threats, but u probably need jolly if that's what ur aiming for

its biggest problem is probably crobat

just overall a good mon to have that always provides value while fitting into a lot of builds, and that should be reflected by a bump to A- !
 

Denial

formerly Lunala
is a Past WCoP Champion
With Reuniclus not getting banned, at the end of Smogon Champions League we are going to have a vote and update the VR. For that reason, we would like to get some activity in the thread with the use of the Tier List Maker!

Here's mine as an example:
ru vr.png


Feel free to also add description for some of your "heat" takes. You're also free to add more nominations to the thread, i'll give some right now as a sort of "discussion points":

UR -> B-
Pretty great Pokemon honestly, dark types are really nice in this meta and Dragon Tail + Heavy Slam are really annoying for most Dark resists. Knock + DTail also pair really nicely. Also best Chandelure and Polteageist check you can ask for.

UR -> C-
No Ninetales-Alola means we have to rank this bad boy in if we keep Hail. I still think Arctovish can be kinda nice in some matchups but its nothing more than C-.

New -> B+
Prefered to not include it in the tier list cause i'd prefer to hear people talking about him instead of randomly ranking it, but i think B+ is fitting. Offensive sets are really nice and can break teams very easily, but its also slow and doesn't have much bulk. The typing is crazy good tho.

Thank you for reading :heart:
 

Expulso

Morse code, if I'm talking I'm clicking
is a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Social Media Contributor Alumnus
my-image (1).png


Cool idea Lunala here's mine

some hot takes / differences:
:noivern: noivern in A; we've had it at a+ pretty much ever since it got to the tier but I think it's at an all-time low right now. its passiveness as a pivot isn't great in a boost-heavy meta and fitting taunt is awkward, so it's bait for the bulky psychics that kinda run the tier. in return, it's overwhelmed pretty well by the stuff it wants to check, taking a knock from golisopod, tons of damage from volcanion, and so on. it also can be hard to switch into draco+flame on paper for some teams but even when that is true i find that noivern doesn't force out too much. its offense matchup is quite good but that isn't enough to fully make up for its mediocre-ness in the balance/bo matchups, so I think A is fitting.

:raikou: raikou in B+; i honestly just dont think hes good in many matchups, ground+grass is really common to handle xurk and other walls like umbreon and gastrodon are a nightmare for it. the lack of recovery and overhwleming power really hurts it; i find that it doesn't come in on too much (only Togekiss, really) and doesn't threaten to make progress versus many teams. it has just 2 uses in all of SCL (less than it's used in UU rofl) which speaks to how unreliably it makes progress

:sharpedo: sharpedo in A, it's a really solid wincon that threatens pretty much all playstyles. in my experience it usually requires very good play to handle due to its lack of on-paper counters. Sharpedo + Mimikyu is the heart of HO at the moment, and the core also finds its way onto some bulky offenses -- two very very scary mons

in general, I rated breakers that threaten Reuniclus higher than those that dont, lol, since the omnipresent blob is one of the most important mons to maintain offensive presence against. this explains why I have Chandelure in A-, Goon in A, Pangoro in B+, and Escav/Golurk in B; all got a slight lift from where I would've put them a few months ago
 

atomicllamas

but then what's left of me?
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Senior Staff Member Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Top Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus
RU VR list 11-5-21.png

I also made one, within each tier it is roughly ordered as well. Generally I rate things mostly higher than other people? But I guess my hottest take is Umbreon in A rank, along with Obstagoon, and the reality is RU ghost resists are kind of rare and every ghost in this tier is pretty capable of shredding through teams. I also think Incineroar is very overrated because it has literally no recovery and knock + pivoting is cool, but it also is kind of hard to fit on a team without it being your best knock off switch in which just leaves it kind of meh.

Dividing the S rank was hard for me, I think you could argue for Togekiss and Necrozma to be in S, or solely Reuniclus, Necrozma and Togekiss don't really have any S rank sets but they can both do so many things they are very hard to account for in the team builder (Necrozma is basically impossible).

My B+ rank ended up being like bottom of the barrel but still usable balance mons that check some big threats and then the mons that make up the webs / screens teams you see on the ladder. B rank also contains some of those + more off meta balance choices like Zong / Vaporeon / P2. My B- is mostly weather (and linoone, which is for sure worse than slurpuff on most HOs).
 

Beraldo

is a Site Content Manageris a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributor
RUPL Champion
1636177281852.png

It is my first time posting on this thread, then I don't know exactly what I should say, but I don't have too much to say about my VR at all, besides of the only thing I believe it is my "hot" take, which is Necrozma as S. That thing has a lot of sets to cover on, such as defensive/offensive cm, autotomize meteor beam, and dragon dance. All of these can put in work if it is in the right matchup, and it is way worse when you need to guess correctly what set it is or otherwise you are just fucked, which makes this thing just stupid.

Also, one more thing I wanted to point out is Sun as B. I think it is a really valid archetype right now, with both CB Darm/Entei being a lot hard to handle, and Shiftry is a pretty solid wincon which can easily win a lot of games once the birds got chipped a bit by rocks after they got its boots knocked out.

Now, talking a bit about of noms, I want to nom 2 things that are not included on Lunala's VR:

UR -> C+ / B-

Unfortunately, Swords Dance with HDB is unviable; however, CB Sneasel is pretty cool. The combo of Knock + Triple Axel makes this pretty hard to play around if it has a good opportunity of coming for the field via pivot. Also, it has Ice Shard, which have a small potential of late game clean, and a cool coverage on Low Kick. There are some calcs:

252 Atk Choice Band Sneasel Triple Axel (40 BP) (3 hits) vs. 248 HP / 204+ Def Togekiss: 366-438 (98.1 - 117.4%) -- approx. 93.8% chance to OHKO}
252 Atk Choice Band Sneasel Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Metagross: 306-362 (84 - 99.4%) -- 37.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
252 Atk Choice Band Sneasel Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gastrodon: 175-207 (41 - 48.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 Atk Choice Band Sneasel Triple Axel (40 BP) (3 hits) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gastrodon: 219-261 (51.4 - 61.2%) -- approx. 2HKO
252 Atk Choice Band Sneasel Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 208+ Def Milotic: 168-198 (42.6 - 50.2%) -- 93.4% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252 Atk Choice Band Sneasel Low Kick (120 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Registeel: 222-262 (60.9 - 71.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Choice Band Sneasel Low Kick (120 BP) vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Cobalion: 252-298 (78 - 92.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252 Atk Choice Band Sneasel Low Kick (120 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Stakataka: 328-388 (100.6 - 119%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Choice Band Sneasel Ice Shard vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Flygon: 384-456 (127.5 - 151.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Choice Band Sneasel Ice Shard vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Noivern: 384-456 (123.4 - 146.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO

However, it still is not the stronger wallbreaker you could ask for, and also is useless defensively, but just for its STABs and speed, Sneasel is a valid mon for C+ and, perhaps, B-.

UR -> C+ / B-

I believe there are 2 movesets that could be viable, being Choice Scarf and Choice Specs, but the real good one, imo, is Specs. Tri Attack boosted with Adaptability and porygon z's 135 base special attack makes it strong as fuck. It is stopped by some Steel-types, such as Registeel and Bronzong, but the first one can get weaken little by little with hazards, Specs Tri Attack and PZ's partners, and if its not enough, you can just lock it with trick; and Bronzong, on other hand, don't want to switch into a specs shadow ball. There are some calcs:

252 SpA Choice Specs Porygon-Z Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Bronzong: 176-208 (52 - 61.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Porygon-Z Tri Attack vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Cobalion: 176-208 (54.4 - 64.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252 SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Porygon-Z Tri Attack vs. 248 HP / 236 SpD Assault Vest Reuniclus: 160-190 (37.8 - 44.9%) -- 5.9% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252 SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Porygon-Z Tri Attack vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Togekiss: 238-282 (63.8 - 75.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Adaptability Porygon-Z Tri Attack vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Steelix: 127-150 (35.8 - 42.3%) -- 99.5% chance to 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

Having that said, I agree with all Lunala's noms. I would write something about Grimmsnarl, but I still haven't used it that much, and B+ looks fair enough for it imo. Anyway, I'll try to participate on this a bit more, so hopefully I'll make another post when VR got updated.
 
Last edited:

Ampha

"They don’t call me Greed for nothing!"
is a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributor
my-image (2).png


Being honest, flygon not being S rank yet is a crime for me, this thing is so versatile and I believe it def deserves its place on the highest rank

i was doing my ranks and I actually agree w some ppls "hot" takes and did it on mine as well, apart from that, some of my hot takes were:

:klefki: B+ Keys is a underrated mon on my personal view, its a p decent mon on its own, its spiking prowess in HOs is something I did value a lot on some matches plus it still has the potential to bring that CM + Idef set someone used on SCL, its typing is also just so good as well

:sylveon: throwing off my honest opinion, this thing is just plain garbage for RU, it does not accomplish anything that another mon cant do and to add to the fact that its bad, it's only W on SCL was a game where it did not even touch the field ?_?

there's prob more but I believe those 2 were the ones that deserved a shoutout
==
some noms out as well, idk for rankings but they def have potential
:Silvally: (ghost)
Im just gonna explain Silv ghost usage w one quote from Llamas
and the reality is RU ghost resists are kind of rare and every ghost in this tier is pretty capable of shredding through teams.
that replay kinda resumes how Silv ghost works, it basically almost won the game there for me after shark died on a tragic way( :( ) plus whenever Ghostvally feels uncomfy w something, it can just blow up when needed ( works for Umb, Incine, etc)

:zoroark:
Being honest, while I was playing w (baby) shark, something I realized was how the tier was poor on Special dark resists, and zoro actually prays on that, Dark + Fire is a difficult combo to switch in to, then add the bonus of having focus blast for the few who do not take much such as umb and such, and you have a deadly breaker, ye its defs are lackluster, but I believe it deserves a shot due to how its Speed tier is good on a meta who's kinda Mid term speed as now, plus I did calc, and Specs dark pulse actually does a 46 on max roll to Coba like wtf '-'
 

Mac3

im reminded theres no finer place to kiss
is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnus
my-image-2.png

Metagross is so good, it has so many sets that are all amazing, I think it definitely should be S rank. Demongross is definitely meta-defining and Metagross can also run a standard rocks set, toxtect, cb, scarf, etc. I also think Reuniclus is definitely S rank, while I'd rather have Flygon at S- rank if anything, I just don't think its as good as Reuniclus or Metagross. Tornadus is amazing, should def be in A-ranks, Vaporeon is also great, wishturn is super good vs stuff without a water absorber which is becoming more and more common. Toxtricity is good too, if it gets the right click once it kinda wins, also is good on screens which are broken. I think Incineroar sucks tbh, either B or B-, esp now that reuni is staying. Tsareena is fun too, B- fits it I think. Unrank froslass bewear and arctovish please. However, do rank sneasel and guzzlord, maybe zoro too, unsure about that last one.
 

C0nfiden1 0yster

ヽ(o`皿′o)ノ
is a Pre-Contributor
RUPL Champion
This looked like fun and I was already planning to do a VR post once the Reun results came out.
F720E098-C62B-46D9-A316-AF78E127C9C0.jpeg


Hot takes
:Golisopod: Im going to go more in detail on why I dropped it from A -> A- in a SCL discussion post, but the main point is that the meta has adapted to spikes, so it has lost one of its greatest aspects. The rise of Crobat in general as been an issue for it. I'll link my long explanation to this later tho

Edit: https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/scl-i-ru-discussion-and-replays.3691361/post-9024206

:Rotom-Mow: I'm kinda surprised no one so far has nominated a rise for this poke when I think it is quite clearly the best electric-type in the tier for me. It pivots easier than Xurkitree does atm and can also trick scarf.

:Xatu: Xatu has been doing rly well in SCL and I think the possibilities it opens up for offensive teams is underrated. It has Future Sight and teleport which is great itself, but also has magic bounce. With the decline of Diancie and Rhyperior and the incline of Bronzong and Registeel, it has been able to block rocks more consistently.

Also, apologies for crappy quality on the picture
 
Last edited:

GoldCat

BOSSARU CUP WINNER
is a Site Content Manageris a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a defending SCL Champion
SS RU Viability Ranking.png

No hot takes, just facts so I'll go over some nominations.

UR to B- / B
Choice Specs Goodra is an underexplored wallbreaker but I've found it to be very potent. None of the Dragon resists enjoy switching into one of its coverage moves and if you go Modest (which I recommend even if you lose out on a valuable Speed tier) even Umbreon (especially if it opt to EV to outrun Adamant Golurk) and AV Reuniclus doesn't like switching into Draco Meteor. Its bulk + Dragon typing also means Goodra has plenty of opportunities to get it onto the field and it's not too difficult to fit it on your team.

Replay: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen8ru-586984

UR to B-
I've been a fan of Jellicent since when Durant was still around. Its unique typing lends some crucial role compression with Jellicent being a hard-counter to DemonGross and solid check to both CM Reuniclus and Nidoqueen. It's also a bulky Water that doesn't die to a +2 CC from Lucario, which is pretty huge for fatter teams. It also has rightfully seen a good amount of usage in SCL.

UR to B
Another 'mon which has seen a rise in SCL. Guzzlord is just a solid pick rn for the reasons luna went over but I definitely think it's even deserving of a B rank rather than just B-.

Although, I probably should go over why I've no S rank. A quick glance over the previous posts will tell you that people have varied opinions over what Pokemon (Flygon, Necrozma, Metagross) should be in S rank alongside Reuniclus. If multiple people can reasonably come to different conclusions over what Pokemon is equally worthy of the S rank as Reuniclus, then it's clear to me that none of the Pokemon is truly warranted to be S ranked not even Reuniclus which most agrees to be S rank. When you rank another Pokemon with Reuniclus in S, then you think that Pokemon is in some way on par with Reuniclus. People concluding that one of Flygon, Necrozma, Metagross, etc. is on par with Reuniclus, tell me more so that Reuniclus is A+ with the rest rather than all of them or some of them being S rank.
 
Last edited:
my-image.png


:flygon: this mon is better than everything in A+ but not as good as reuni so I had to put it in S-. Scarf alone does everything you could ever want for, and it's one of the very few good scarfers in the tier. Good damage with eq and it cleans nicely, and it hits most of the ground resists (flyings) with sedge, + u-turn for momentum and compact defog in a tier where removal is very scarce. Then you even have wincon sets with dd or defensive sets with leftovers. Over-all an amazing mon that just fits on every team unsupported.

:umbreon: I think this mon is extremely good, the biggest problem with most defensive mons like most steels, incin etc or even offensive mons that strive for longevity like volcanion or xurkitree is their lack of recovery, which puts you in situations where the slightest chip can put you in an 100% losing position, making every game a race at who can tear holes through the opposing team the faster. Wish pass enables you to do so much more and risk so much less while always having the possibility to heal from chip, it's an extremely invaluable resource and its even more so on a fat as fuck mon like Umbreon. Other than that you get heal bell support in a tier where every defensive mon runs toxic and half the offensive mons do too, and moreover umbreon's dark type + foul play is great against the ghosts and psychics of the tier that are very difficult to check defensively.

:registeel: this mon is also very good especially given how it's the absolute fattest of the steels which gives it way more longevity. One of the cool sets I've been liking is full physdef with body press (and even ID), it can borderline win you the game.

:togekiss: this mon borderline S-, bitch doesn't die. NP kiss just wins

:dhelmise: very good and somehow versatile, also rapid spin in a tier with very little removal and the recovery is especially great. I rly like the band set, it catches unsuspecting incin or togekiss with eq and anchor shot; generally it just doesnt have any switch-ins.

Rest of the tier list is kinda standard just a few off-put mons based on my perception of them but nothing too wild. I think heracross and chandy have amazing potential, boots sd hera can be explored with and chandy doesnt have any switch-ins tbh. Regidrago in a metagame where there's barely any fairies could potentially strive more, as well.
 
my-image (7).png


Considered putting :Togekiss: in S- too but I have to stand by what Youwelcomethanku corrected me on the last post, Raikou and Xurk pretty much hard counter it in every way and it gets crippled by all the toxics flying around. Still its definitely A+ considering how fat it is and how easily a team can be helpless against it.

:Sharpedo: Is a menace and a half. It bowls over teams with little effort once it hits the field. Though, getting it in, is admittedly, very difficult so I think I can be at A and not A+. Still, this is a menace against whom hoping Togekiss is healthy enough to take hits is the only counterplay. A- is too low for this imo

:Tornadus: is such a pain to deal with. Its great speed tier, access to Nasty plot and high powered dangerous STAB combo of Hurricane and Focus Blast makes it a pain to deal with. Still, the low accuracy of both moves as well as competition with another Nasty plot using flying type named Togekiss who I just mentioned.

:Doublade: This mon seems soo much better on paper than on practise. Gets worn down ridiculously quickly, Knock offs everywhere, no reliable recovery, etc. C+ tier seems fine
 
Last edited:
my-image (28).png


Usually I won't bother making statements if I don't have adequate evidence but not today.

:Flygon: I think Flygon is the best Pokemon in the metagame in large part due to its Dragon Dance set, after a DD it outspeeds every common scarfer except itself and it straight up OHKOes or 2HKOes the vast majority of the metagame. of what does reliably check it you have, Milotic, Gastrodon, Bronzong, Golisopod, Quagisre, Levitate Galarian Weezing Sylveon, Suicune and Mimikyu. Asides levitate Gweezing a lot of Flygon's checks aren't insurmountable bulky waters tend to tasked with checking a lot of other things, SpD Bronzong takes a notable chunk from boosted Dclaw and doesn't threaten Flygon a lot in return. What's a Sylveon? DD Flygon almost always makes progress or sweeps. Flygon of course has many other sets like scarf, band, LO 3 attacks/toxic, and Defog, but for me a large reason behind justifying it in S is Dragon Dance.

:Metagross: After Flygon I think the best Pokemon are Reuniclus and Metagross. I don't have much to say here that Mac3 hasn't, it good.

Thoughts on an S- tier. I am not super opposed to an S- tier as it seems some people think of Flygon as the clear second best Pokemon.

:Umbreon: Heal Bell and Wish are phenomenal support moves and Umbreon is able to check/counter sooo many of the metagames threats some especially notable ones are Volcanion, Polteageist, and Xurkitree.

:Vaporeon: Vaporeon isn't much worse than the other bulky water-type Pokemon, Wish and Heal Bell give it an irreplaceable niche. I made a more detailed post on Vaporeon in the SCL discussion thread

:Chandelure: haven't been a big fan of Chandelure for a while, the good sets rn are choiced sets and in large part due to the maintenance of choiced sets I think it should be ranked lower.

:Toxtricity: I still think Shift Gear Toxtricity is good on offense, its a special wallbreaker that takes advantage of Registeel with its Toxic immunity and boosted Drain Punch. Its defensive profile also lets it set up on a few other things like Raikou, Roserade, Galarian Weezing, and Cobalion.

:Tyrantrum: & :Aerodactyl: Putting these here together because they are similar. I really don't think that these Pokemon should be in the C ranks. Tyranturm with Choice Scarf can be quite threatening to offensive teams and hey the metagame right now is quite offensive. Specifically LO 3 attacks roost Aerodactyl is a pretty good revenge killer and lategame cleaner with EdgeQuake and Dual Wingbeat hitting nearly the whole metagame. Both of these Pokemon also have good but niche defensive usefulness versus Togekiss. Aerodactyl and Tyrantrum are admittedly not easy fits for teams so I have them ranked lowly.

:Charizard: I ranked Charizard lower than the other sun Pokemon because Entei is much better overall. Entei has better bulk naturally and it also has more longevity with its less bad SR weakness and lack of solar Power. Entei also has an invaluable tool that Charizard does not Extreme Speed, this lets it revenge kill stuff like weakened DD Flygon and Sharpedo. Is Charizard stronger? yes, however even in the wallbreaking department Entei isn't too far behind as a sun boosted Flare Blitz nearly 2HKOes Gastrodon and Milotic forcing a recover could let another teammate like Shiftry come in.
252 Atk Choice Band Entei Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gastrodon in Sun: 185-218 (43.4 - 51.1%) -- 5.9% chance to 2HKO
252 Atk Choice Band Entei Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 208+ Def Milotic in Sun: 177-209 (44.9 - 53%) -- 0.4% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

:Toxicroak: "Oh boy I hope there is a Milotic or Suicune on the other team or I am mostly worse than the other fighters of the tier."

Other nominations I agree with
:Sneasel: Beraldinho's post to B-
:Guzzlord:GoldCat's post to B
 
Last edited:
my-image (4).png


Nothing too out of the blue, but I'll briefly talk about some of the weirder rankings.

- B+
I really think the duck is a great mon in the tier at the moment. It sponges like any hit from special attackers, such as Volcanion, Necrozma, Nidoqueen etc, and can either status or teleport out. Now, I will admit, in order for p2 to check these Pokemon you do need to recover a lot which is a huge momentum sap especially with a lot of Pokemon in the tier that can abuse p2 like Cobalion, Pangoro, Metagross etc. However, none of those pokemon like being hit by Thunder Wave which p2 can easily click instead of recovering. Overall, I think p2 definitely has its flaws but I believe it's a great sponge and it's access to teleport+twave can give strong wallbreakers so many opportunities to claim kills.

- B+
As Expulso explained earlier, I really think Raikou has heavily fallen off since its introduction into the tier. Generally, when looking for an electric-type pivot, Xurkitree fulfills it's role so much better as it's much stronger and it breaks down it's checks much easier. Also, while Raikou's CM sets aren't bad they definitely aren't threatening with Pokemon like Flygon, AV Reun, and all different kinds of grasses flooding the tier. However, Raikou is faster and much more bulkier compared to Xurkitree which definitely gives it a strong enough niche.

- A+
I just think Golisopod is a really good mon. Priority, solid check to so many Pokemon, and Spikes all in one slot make it extremely versatile and it always puts in a good amount of work.
 
Last edited:

Voyager

He didn't notice that the lights had changed
Create a RU Viability Rankings Tier List - TierMaker - Google Chrome 07_11_2021 18_27_21.png


my vr and a disorganised jumble of my thoughts on the meta that is probably both needlessly long and lacking in detail

if you want my letter rankings, 'very good / threatening' and 'good / threatening' are both A rank and go down from there.
i used the system i did as i think it allows me to show what i think of the meta better

flygon
==========
best mon in the tier.
ground typing is invaluable and flygon is easily the least flawed of the grounds
scarf is great, probably the most slappable mon in the tier. amazing speed tier
dd is great, very threatening
band/lo are good but not on the same level
bulky defog is so easy to slap on team, great glue

reuniclus
==========
av is fucking incredible and reun's best set. fsight is insane, the defensive utility is excellent. works in tandem w flygon to have great counterplay to electrics
cm is good, i think lo thunder is its best set because haze milo is so good atm.
knock off on mguard reun (usually w out cm) is very cool and allows it to use its outlasting potential to the fullest. great on spikes builds

necrozma
==========
ban it. its like bw sceptile on steroids. guess the set wrong or lose.
many set up opportunities thanks to good bulk and prism armour
milo helps w checking but cant switch in w much ease. another mon milo checks better w out flame orb Nohtori
each set is good. cm, dd, automise, pherb rocks are the best. sd and tr are cool. dd iron defence is heat and good

crobat
==========
its so fucking good. max attack is the way to go on crobat. its so good at getting momentum and brave bird stings alot and it uturns on what it doesnt
heavily contributes to grass types sucking, even gets u turn chip on electrics, great enabler, great hazard control
super fang is good when paired w something to take advantage of what it chips
i wanted to put this in s as its so meta defining imo but the 3 mons above it are just better and far more versatile

meta
==========
ridiculusly high scl winrate, however winrate is a flawed statistic
cosmic power is the most threatening individual set in the tier
rocks sets are great w toxic or bullet punch last.
you could probably forgo eq for both moves on the right team. shuca is an option to really mess w certain checks

milo
==========
best bulky water in the tier
haze is the best set tho refresh ib is cool as a volc check that still does bulky water stuff nvm refresh is dead
being able to check most reun, cp meta, nido and help w alot of necros is invaluable
flame orb is a matchup fish hoping for very specific hos and doesnt allow u to do what milo is so good at / does it worse

nidoqueen
==========
best rocker in the tier, tho it is closely followed by meta and regi
mandates av reun on alot of builds and those that dont are often forced to make predictions just to stay in the game
4 attacks is very threatening and
sub is good for trading
great pseudo stop to xurk. if ur team has some offence / doesnt make games go too long it is fine as a counter measure

volcanion
==========
incredible mon that heavily abuses the decline in gastro and exploits bulky waters very well
defog is nice on offensive teams tho subtox
fire spin is a decent tool to reliably remove / force heavy damage onto stuff like gastro tho it relies too much on matchup for my liking

togekiss
==========
very good and takes advantage of decrease in raikou and increase in mowtom but to me its just not the most threatening sweeper. still a great mon but not a+ imo

mimikyu
==========
disguise makes this mon incredibly reliable
sd, dual ghost, drain punch is far and away the best coverage
power whip is cool for bulky waters / fucking quag
mimishark is a great combo and provides great defensive utility for offence (more utility than defense)

golisopod
==========
i disagree w C0nfiden1 0yster (evil name) about the rise of crobat hurting it. its main spiking competition roserade hates bat more and pod can threaten it w knock off and liquidation
spikes are good but need fairly specific structures built around them
w ant leaving less stuff runs protect so this can click first impression quite freely
great vs teams that use flygon> a flyer teams that have been picking up in scl

starmie
==========
good volcanion check and spinner
offensive is also good

mowtom
==========
my highest ranked grass type on this list. rather than hating being in on crobat, this mon just volt switches out
trick+grass coverage makes its volt switch v hard to block
covers holes in ur team very nicely

suicune
==========
good. use it
i prefer sub sets but rest is good aswell

roserade
==========
gives crobat incredibly free entry, for easy momentum. rise of crobat hurts this mon. very hard for it to keep up its spikes
stun spore best last move
grass types suck. straight up losing momentum if they ever get crobat in on u is terrible.

toxicroak
==========
milo is great so croak should in theory be good but it gets hampered by crobat p badly
alot of 'crobat cripplers' like stun spore rose also abuse bulky waters so it kinda has role overlap.
knock off pod is an exception to the above rule and probably the best partner

diancie
==========
diamond storm pp is too low and doesnt hit very hard and flyings can often stall it out
not great as a rocker w flygon hitting it hard
feels like an A rank mon when diamond storm gets raises

dhelmise
==========
great vs more defensive teams but requires too precise plays vs offence for my liking
incredible role compression, its so easy to slap on teams but often doesnt pull its weight
pair w a cleric to be able to throw into scalds more easily

chande
==========
walls cp meta
choise sets best
high maintenance but actually very good if u can trick a hdb from their umb/incin

celebi
==========
cringe

gweezing
==========
still good on stall, which as a playstyle apreciates mons that 6-0 it like np bi being p rare
spatack investment is good to actually kinda pressure reun into recovering w sludge bomb on the switch
levitate is good because flygon is great

porygon2
==========
seems like it could be good. needs more exploration. sensei put it high so im inclined to agree w him

rain
==========
got worse w skewda leaving and i think its back to being cheese.
hurricane noivern is actually a big threat in rain


:bw/ferroseed:
--> B-
grass type that doesnt hate being in on crobat
spikes and has twave to punish bat
decent defensive utility
had decent scl usage

:bw/gigalith:
--> C
sort of fills the shoes of rhyperior

rank guzzlord and ban necro. ty for reading :blobthumbsup:
 
Last edited:
ssruprvr3.JPG
Not something that I can qualify as a hot take tbh . But I think some rankings need more details so :


:Necrozma: A -> A+ Not that surprising but I rate Necrozma as the best A+rn . Its extremely wide movepool and great stats in both offenses and defenses make it a top offensif threat do to how versatile it can be et how each of its sets is effective on a lot of situation. Calm mind , DD , SD and autotomise depending of the MU and the situation are very lethal , The offensive SR set on Hyper Offense put huge pressure on any team lacking umbreon or something that wall the Psy+rock+heat wave/Epower combination depending of what you run on the last slot and at the same time supporting its team via rocks. Finally less represented but pretty good tho the more bulky SR variant which trade the offensive power to exploit its very good bulk and great utility via rocks , Knock off , recovery and the ability to check a lot of things. All this make it extremely diffucult to prepare against all of its sets and make Necro and a good choice for a lot of teams .

:Obstagoon: B -> A Obsta is one of the tier's most deadly breakers , Guts+ stab façade and knock off are lethal and combined with switcheroo it can cripple its only true counter in cobalion with a burn or do the same thing for other bulkier mons and receiving leftovers or boots most of the time which is extremely valuable. Its speed tier is also good for a breaker with that level of pure power and being able to scare non-Colbur CM reuni , the N1 mon rn and one of RU's most terrifying threats and other psychics like necrozma is also extremely nice to have. It suffers from its lacks longevity and it is in competition from heracross but it is a very rewarding pick that can seem a bit risky . Maybe A- is better for this pokemon but It has his place in A rank imo .

:Milotic: B+ -> A Milo is imo the most defining and best pure bulky water rn. Great overall bulk , good typing and usefull tools like flip turn and haze are incredibely valuable. It can check a lot of the things like Flygon , metagross , CM reuni if it carries haze , Sharpedo and a lot of other mons . It can also run toxic to make itself less passive and check standart variants of volcanion.It has some exploitable flaws but for what it brings to the table it should be at least A- but i think A is fine but more questionnable.

:Bronzong: B+ -> A-: Zong is a interesting pick as a steel type do to how valuable its ability to roll compress so much roles in one team slot is . It is at the same time the steel , ground immunity and rocker slot . The ground Immunity specially separate itself from its competiton as countering flygon and non-fire blast nidoqueen which is basically 90pourcent of them is so nice to have. A great pick for Buky offenses or Balanced Squads that needs its unique profile for the tier and should definitely rise imo.

:Suicune: B -> A- This dog is a interesting pick rn. Vincune is more potent than before as some of its main issues being less good and saw a drop in usage , SubCM with ice beam is also good to bait the grasses. Crocune is a bit less good than the 2other option I think but it still a good choice as it abuse more than them Suicune's Huge overall bulk which can be a real pain for some teams to take down.

:Tornadus: B- -> A- Underrated pick imo even if basically all the posts argue that it should rise to at least B+ , and this ins't without a reason. Knock off and uturn are such great utility tools and progress makers in all situations especially combined with its solid offensive stats ,speed tier and boots. All of its answers relies on leftovers to being effective long term which Torn exploit with Koff and make him and its teamates more painfull to deal with . Its last slot is quite flexible as heat wave/Tailwind or even superpower are great options. Like we saw on SCL a fully physical set without item running acrobatics superpower knock and Uturn/ Bulk up can be great in some situations. Its only flaws are a lack of defensive utility ouside of ground immune or being able to take a fighting move at full once and the fact that hurri is a double edge sword that can decrease its consistency.

:Noivern: A+ -> A Still a solid pick but less splashable and good than the other A+ ranks rn , Will not explain this much as Expulso did it before on this thread

:Raikou: A -> A- Struggles against the 2 best pokemons in the tier and will often be on a situation when it didn't accomplish much less than xurk is tasked to do which is kinda sad for him. For sure CM sets can be potent if you get the right MU and its speed tier make it a better pick than xurk but being A rank isn't worth for Raikou in this metagame.
:Stakataka: A- -> B+ Tougher Steel type competition with Metagross and Registeel being so much used and the new rise of Bronzong .Also even if it still a good pick on some teams it is less justifiable than before Imo.

:Roserade: A -> B+ Struggles to make consistent progress with spikes with how crobat is incredibly common and here to clear its spikes away without punishement much of the time as its very difficult to justifie sleep powder or stun spore over synthesis in like 85pourcent of the time imo.

Also agree with:
:Jellicent: UR -> B-
:Guzzlord: UR -> B
:Grimmsnarl: UR -> B
:Sneasel: UR -> C+

Thanks for reading and sry if my english sounds bad:bloblul:
 
Last edited:

EviGaro

is a Member of Senior Staffis a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Battle Simulator Staff Alumnus
RU Leader
so did too:



Trying to explain my ranking here kek:

- S rank is self explanatory, and imo those three mons are the best of the best in this tier. Reuniclus is the easiest to spam of all the big psychics, though a bit harder to flatout win with it consistently, but it does so much with so much utility that it deserves the highest rank. I still think Togekiss is up there, imo it's not just that every team has to hard prep for it otherwise they struggle big time - which still happens - but it's also that it really doesn't much coverage to be dumb. NP also doubles as one of the best clerics in the tier, while still sporting immense utility due to typing and stats. That alone puts it there for me, then you add some versatility like we have successfully seen in scl and yeah. Flygon is epic and everywhere, amazing utility, versatility, top tier pivot with pretty much all the moves it needs on any set, it's good. I'd even say it's the best Flygon has looked as a mon in all its time in RU.

- A+ are a bit less relevant, but just, because all those mons can win games pretty much by themselves. Crobat is really stupid good with just stab and uturn, it's amazing how many teams are not prepared to handle it just getting out freely all the time. Knock is generally an amazing move in this tier, but honestly Crobat is by far the most important target. Necrozma is stupid, Chandelure might have to lock sometimes but it has ridiculously strong moves and ease to click them a lot. Xurkitree still demands a ton of respect and so does Cobalion

- Less consistent mons in A, but you can make a case that all of those can win a matchup on their own, except maybe Noivern but the utility this provides is also excellent. Tried to restraint myself to mostly hard hitters there ig, but you can argue all of those have a set that's like S tier in the meta rn, just not sure it will be consistently true. A- is a fairly similar category, but those mons are a bit more flawed imo. Umbreon and Registeel are probably the two best pure defensive mons in this tier, but I have a hard time ranking them higher due to how stupid good most offensive stuff is in hitting and also providing defensive utility like a lot of them do. Starmie is the best spinner and also an underrated offensive threat, but it's kinda hard to do either really.

- Through the B ranks... B+ gets a bit more niche, but I think all those offensive mons are super rewarding in the right matchup as well, in ways that few others can be. Bulky waters are still decent and all, but I think you get a bit less of those generally. B ranks follows the same logic with now having the more niche defensive steels, but again all of those can be very useful. I think Tsareena is super underrated in general too. It still has some 4mss, but whip spin knock axel is generally very solid, and if you really want you can add some recovery / cleric / pivoting but it's a bit harder to justify. B- ranks is uh... pretty much all the top weather sweepers and the even more odd setup mons that can still very easily own a matchup. It might be a bit odd to rank the sweepers ahead of the setters rofl, but in general in this tier I just think the weakness of weather teams is precisely those setters; The sweepers themselves are almost all super good in the right conditions but it gets them less because of the flawed setters. so those go down a bit.

- C+ is where I stacked my niche defensive mons, not because they can't be useful, but because in terms of building, I think you get less consistently of those. I really don't like G-Weezing in this tier defensively, while it does beat most Flygons very well, it's such a sitter mon that can do nothing vs way too much all the time. But it does beat some useful major threats. Same with Quag, and even Plume can do similar things there. C is basically all my favourite mons that just kinda such but I still hold on the fact that they might not some day.

Might edit this with the noms at some point!
 

bruno

is a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Past SPL Championis a Past WCoP Champion
World Defender


Not gonna comment on everything just gonna point some things that may differ from ppl

-Flygon only S: Borderline broken, should be on almost every team, can do anything for a team from fat fog/cb/scarf/dd/orb, beats every check with the right thing, access to strong priority with cb, and again just basically no real reason to not be everywhere.

-Cobalion 2nd: Unique speed tier with viriz that is faster than almost everything, can break really well with cb/specs/sd, reversal salac is extremely good at times, can just do anything really and any berry u toss at it can help your team glue up vs threats to it. Should be on like 75% of teams imo

-Milotic A+: I used sassy with 29 speed ivs flip turn haze tox recover almost every scl week and i personally think its the best set by far but it could def get punished sometimes, regardless it just sponges like everything and is an incredible momentum grabber with flip for BO which is imo the only truly viable style in this tier that isnt cheese

-Incineroar: Incineroars fucking incredible and idk why it isnt used more than it is. Somehow this tier lacks in knock off mons, intimidates amazing, typings amazing when ghosts are broken, u-turn etc

-Cresselia B: Really good mon, good nido check, lunar dance is broken when the metas pretty offensively inclined

-Dhelmise/Doublade High: Both are imo just very anti-meta and really strong when the metagame is so physical-inclined, the best dhelmise set by far is the one franklin used with id body press colbur/itemless and it 1v1s so much and is amazing. Best doublade is jolly for umb, really good mon in general tbh just didnt get to use it once

Rotom-C High: Typings just rly good in this tier, really like NP tect volt leaf with lefties but scarf is always good

Glastrier B: The literal dark horse of the tier imo. Again same logic of the tier being physically oriented. Also really love this set:
Glastrier @ Leftovers
Ability: Chilling Neigh
EVs: 252 HP / 80 Atk / 176 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Icicle Crash
- Bulldoze
- Substitute
- Swords Dance

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8ru-1439280014-dl39fmnx9nlxg9t4612q2508phmbf90pw

Torkoal/Zard/Shiftry: Shiftry sun is really strong, growth/heat wave/rock slide/solar blade shiftry 1v1s one shots like the entire tier if it gets a growth except staka

Mesprit: Same as cress but also gets rocks

Toxtricity D: I tried this mon a lot and it always felt like shit idrk why, felt too matchup based and would rather have a xurk almost every time, same with the web dudes

Duraludon/Alola Raichu/Heliolisk/Porygon-Z/Araquanid/Togedemaru/Mudsdale/Gigalith: All worth using in this tier imo. Duraludons an ok rocker on a fast paced team that can do a lot with its typing+rocks(i used draco/thunder/rocks/steel beam). Alolan Raichu is mainly to use as electric boots pivot mon with knock because again the tier kinda lacks in knock mons. Heliolisk being immune to ghost is great+it can help cover waters/milo. PZ is strong as fuck with adaptability specs+tricks really good, and it's speed tier is pretty good for this tier honestly. Araquanid i rly like infest/tox/rest/liquid. Toges steel+lightninrod, muds is a good phys check with rocks, gigalith is gigalith idk.

also i built a lot for SCL and idk where to actually put these but here they are, lot of weird shit: https://pastebin.com/raw/gmxXtnQy https://pokepast.es/ddc90e43ccb7ad0c https://pokepast.es/4dcc6c7b0d727776
 

gorex

penguin council
is a Site Content Manageris a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
LCPL Champion
VR Update (Dated 5/12/2021)

Rises:

A+ -> S
A -> A+
A -> A+
A -> A+
A -> A+
A- -> A
A- -> A
B+ -> A-
B -> A
B -> B+
B -> B+
B -> B+
B- -> B+
C+ -> B-
C -> B-
C -> C+
C -> C+
C- -> C+
C- -> C
Drops:
A+ -> A
A -> A-
A -> A-
A -> A-
A- -> B+
A- -> B+
B+ -> B
B+ -> B
B+ -> B
B+ -> B
B+ -> B
B -> B-
B -> B-
B -> B-
B -> B-
B -> B-
B -> B-
B- -> C+
B- -> C+
B- -> C+
B- -> C+
B- -> C+
B- -> C+
B- -> C
C+ -> C
Additions:
UR -> B
UR -> B
UR -> B
UR -> B-
UR -> C
UR -> C
UR -> C
UR -> C
UR -> C-
UR -> C-
Removals:
hey, we have decided to remove weather vrs as they were quite confusing to present properly. if anyone is still interested to see it and have suggestions as to how we can do it, feel free to pm me and we might be able to do it, who knows.

additionally, reasonings for some of the shifts might be posted in the next week if time allows.
 

LBN

is a Top Tiering Contributor Alumnus
UPL Champion
Aight, now that snake has finished for me i think its time for some VR talk, especially w the new mons returning from UU's constant thievery, we will welcome back Rhyperior My Beloved once again, and seismitoad too i guess. I got a decent amount of things so first ill start w the new mons, then do rises, then drops.

-> A
Rhyperior can do no wrong. It's just a great mon. Few pokemon really want to take its attacks and even less mons are trying to remove rocks in its face, even Starmie is getting rocked by megahorn, making it a fantastic rocker. That's not all it can do though, Choice band sets are still nice with it's mountain of coverage options, and can potentially be able to run something like Soft Sand Rock polish, although thats just a concept, idk if its actually good. It's also a great soft check for huge amounts of this tier, and is capable of trading with most of them, Obstagoon, Cobalion, Flygon, DD Necrozma, list goes on. Can also effectively scare out Reuniclus so by all means this is the goat.

-> B+/A-
Back with Rhyperior arrives the Gastrodon Sidegrade. Being another water/ground with a Water immunity gives it the same positives Gastrodon has to its name, premier Volcanion check, premier Raikou (lol) check, although with the uptick of Electrics who have grass options on the rise, i'm more confident in the B+ spot, although i wouldn't fight an A- position.

Now onto rises

-> A-
This mon is insanely good man, ladder pick up the pace bruh we got like 7 meta staples not in RU proper come on. It checks Reuniclus acceptably, beyond Obstagoon it's fairly obnoxious to switch into, counters Golisopod, checks Cobalion, Flygon, Nidoqueen, and breaks annoying fat cores insanely easily. To me it's just as good, if not better, than Milotic and i think it deserves a rise for sure.

-> A+
I don't think anyone disagreeing with this, mon is absolutely INSANE, half the reason you see cobalion on teams so often is like, mostly because of Obstagoon. It's ruthless and frankly checking this mon is a huge headache, slower mons simply get 2 tapped ridiculously easily, and most of them get 1 shotted instead, even bulky mons like Togekiss takes like 75% min from Facade with max HP. It's seen immense usage, and i'd call it the premier breaker this tier has, even moreso than Togekiss, it's just togekiss is better at everything beyond breaking and breaking is still one of its talents.

-> B
Bewear sits at a solid juncture in the meta right now, both new drops being victims to CC/D-Edge trucking huge swaths of the tier, with normal answers to fighting actually not being Normal resists, and normal resists all getting trucked by CC. Ghosts like Jellicent exists although Darkest Lariat is sending Jellicent packing faster than we can steal NU S tiers. It's bulk paired with fluffy is respectable, soft checking some Physical threats like Obstagoon, Metagross, and gets free entry on all the bulky steels. (Cobalion is not a bulky steel lets not lie to ourselves)

-> B+/A-
One of our few reliable Rhyperior switchins, Nidoqueen check, and more. Necrozma check, Togekiss soft check (this mon has no true checks) decent rocker, great Ironpress bot, Ground immune steels are so goated and this is our finest. It fits nicely on alot of teams. Also did i mention Roserade check, Flygon soft check, Celebi soft check, Noivern check? This mon is great and im honestly surprised it was only put at B rank. Personally i wanna call it A- but ik i'd put up with B+ for a short period of time till i nom it again.

-> B-

Seismitoad is back so rain is relevant again I don't think I need to elaborate at all.

-> A-
Wishpass cores with Obstagoon have been increasingly popular in tours recently and take a wild guess who passing those wishes. Much of its defensive resume is the same as Jellicent except add Chandelure and Incineroar to the list. While they are a bit different, and Milotic is the most similar, I consider them to be side grades of each other and should be ranked the same. Flip turn is a great asset for it, and can still lean on its cleric support if the team requires it.

-> S-

Necrozma is absolutely bonkers broken, as the premier suspect test candidate we have rn, and it's more than likely to get one with the support the idea got on the recent survey, its nabbed wins so easily in snake its wild, with a myriad of sets to pick from. Arguably just as dangerous as Reuniclus while somehow being more versatile and difficult to handle reliably and consistently. Togekiss on the other hand is also just as good as ever, people remembering Choice scarf is a thing made dealing with it way harder when you can just trick your checks! I know S- isn't a ranking right now but i think Togekiss is well above the other A+ mons and should be in a league of its own, alongside Necrozma, even if they arent nearly as good as Reuniclus and Thrift store Garchomp. (though i'd maybe argue Togekiss going back to S proper)

-> C+
This pokemon has done really well in snake, walling Nidoqueens all hour and laying up spikes reliably, and can be pretty annoying for alot of teams to kill surprisingly, walling all the non jellicent bulky waters with ease and using them as entry. Ain't really got much else to sayon this.

Now onto to ranking some UR mons.

-> B+/B
I Know this is a massive jump for a pokemon not on the VR, but Heliolisk has been on the come up for a good bit now, and i definitely think it's better than trashass Raikou who i'll get to later, but Heliolisk is a good mon. Alongside it's gameplay which is similar to Raikou, it trades in being able to actually take a hit or two for blanking both Water and Ghost moves, which is solid defensive utility to have. It's also another Electric w Grass Coverage in Grass knot, as well as Surf for water coverage, and strong Normal Stab in Hyper voice hitting a good amount of mons fairly hard, such as Grasses like Roserade. Boots isn't all it can do though, it's a great mon on both Rain and Sun with its abilities and Weather Ball, as well as having item variation options like Scarf and Specs (and AV apparently in 1 replay) It's even got other unique coverage moves like Focus Blast, U-turn as a side option to Volt Switch.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen8ru-599703 Doesn't rlly do well but it shows it has more than a boots set worth using
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen8ru-598473 AV Heliolisk got like 4 kills with big set variety.
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen8ru-599002 Heliolisk doing Heliolisk things, good pivot, strong and good at killing things etc.

-> C
Sableye has actually seen a decent amount of use as an anti meta mon, checking some of the biggest mons in Reuniclus, Obstagoon, Cobalion, Necrozma, and Metagross. It's a fairly annoying mon to any setup threat thanks to encore, knock allows it to threaten things that really want their items and force progress, and prankster wisp is always annoying. It's also capable of being a secondary setter on Rain and Sun, although your probably better off using Klefki, Sableye isn't too bad at the job itself.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen8ru-599002 Sableye shutting down Obstagoon by recover stalling it, even while burned.
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen8ru-599703 Doesn't do alot here, but keeps Obstagoon down for a decent amount of time

Now for Drops, won't be as many probably.

-> B/B-
This mon gets stuffed so easily man, Gastrodon is already nearly a hard counter, Roserade and Celebi check it unless it runs randy Extrasensory/Shadow Ball (which it can never fit) Seismitoad just returned which is also really good at making Raikou miserable. It has huge 4MSS, wanting Aura Sphere, Tbolt, Volt, Toxic, Scald, Calm mind, Extrasensory, and Shadow Ball for different reasons. Worst part is many of these mons are used together making life even harder. It's only real standout trait is being able to switch into Togekiss well which might let it stand in B but imo every Electric is better than Raikou, even Toxtricity, because atleast Toxtricity is good on HO.

-> UR
What do you do. Why are you here. Very rarely sees use, very garbo.

-> B-
How you rose to B+ i have no idea but naw Vaporeon on the come up, and so is Jellicent back into the retirement home you go. Atleast Darm can U-turn on those or Trick them, you flail helplessly on them get outta here. Still good on sun but that ain't enough to be B+ of all things. Rhyperior and Seismitoad back too get em outta here LMAO

-> B
Obstagoon does Heracross's job better than Heracross by a long shot. Faster, better defensively typing thanks to it's immunities, good flex movepool with Obstruct, Switcheroo and Parting Shot, better STABs. It's weaker but really power aint everything as we all know or Porygon-Z wouldn't be hanging on a thread from UR.

-> B
Being a Ground not weak to Grass is nice, but honestly that's where my praise is ending. This mon never does jack, it's some off brand safety glue and while it has some qualities i do not think it's A- material atall, it's recovery is middling and relies of wishpass, which isn't incredibly hard to ask for with Vaporeon/Umbreon or even Togekiss, but it's annoying to HAVE to do that. It's role compression, that's all. But the Grass coverage Electrics are all beating it in time regardless, Xurkitree grass knot does like... 40, and Energy Ball does like 35, you're better off using Spdef Nidoqueen most of the time, atleast that mon isn't a passive blob.
 

C0nfiden1 0yster

ヽ(o`皿′o)ノ
is a Pre-Contributor
RUPL Champion
Hello all! Apparently, there is going to be an update soon and I wanted to get my thoughts in before then.

-> S-
I think Cobalion is worthy enough to create an S- rank. It serves as one of the few Obstagoon 'checks', Swords Dance sets are potent sweepers that threaten any given team, and it importantly has diversity within its sets. It received 30% usage in RUSD, proving how splashable it is. If/when UU takes Cobalion, I think this tier will dramatically change much more than we think.
-> S-
Everyone knows what Crobat does and I feel it is simply doing that better than before. I think it is a clear step above the rest of A+ and is worthy of S-. It also has ~70% winrate, which is a flawed statistic but for how much it was used it is impressive.
-> A+
Reuniclus has dropped off since SCL going from #2 in usage, to #10, only receiving half of Cobalion's usage. I still feel CM sets are good, but CM Necrozma and CP Metagross compete with it. AV sets I still think are average and easy to take advantage of due, but still have great offensive tools
-> A/A-
This thing got 20th in usage in RUSD. I don't think any A+ pokemon should receive usage as low as that. In practice, idt its that good either. I've never really seen a Volcanion tear through a team, and its defensive utility isn't as good as people make it out to be. Toxic Tect sets aren't really seen anymore, nor are sub sets. Defog is... ok, but not really in demand. There are so many good hazard removal options that I never find it necessary to run it. It also doesn't have the longevity that other water types have.
-> A
Nasty Plot sets are fantastic right now, and due to its coverage it can pretty much break past anything you really need it to. It is a huge pain to build with though, as its 4x U-turn weakness means you have to use pokemon that will maintain at least some of the momentum loss. Being a psychic type that is faster than Obstagoon is also a big deal
-> B+
I think Scarf and Specs sets are the only viable sets atm and I think those are average at best. Alot of recent trends also go against it like Obstagoon and Guzzlord. It also isn't something you can just throw on any given team either, which makes its usage on the lower side. Though with Cobalion usage being as high as it is, maybe Flame Body should be preferred to Flash Fire, that's just an idea though.
-> A
I think Milotic is overall the most consistent bulky water in the tier, and although it is more passive it checks some of the best Set-up sweepers in the tier with Haze, shutting down Reuniclus, Necrozma, and CP Metagross. You also have a bit of choice with the last slot as you could run Flip Turn or Toxic
->A-
Diancie has had a recent spike in usage, likely because of Obstagoon 'checks' being as scarce as they are. It also deals with the birds of the tier which is big. Despite it's rock typing, it can punish Flygon with Moonblast which is another positive. There's a lot going for it rn and I can't see that stopping any time soon.
-> A-
Bit of a hot take, but Suicune has proven to be a dangerous wincon, and although it doesn't quite have consistent recovery, its superior bulk negates that. I feel like you see it sweep or even just find a way past crucial pokemon in matchups. It forces the opponent to play really awkwardly. That same bulk is also useful for Obstagoon mu's, which are becoming more and more important.
-> A-
Garde just didn't look right in B+, and when used it proves to be excellent either in a sweeping role, or a support role (healing wish). I believe it is the third-best Scarfer behind Flygon and Togekiss.
-> B
Snorlax is really mu fishy but is still decent at what it does, kinda like Toxicroak which is also B.
->B
I think this was a nice experiment but I really don't think its that good. Its showings have been disappointing and in my own experience, its also disappointing. Its offers such little defensive utility, and I really don't think the offensive benefit makes it worth it.
-> A-
Pretty much what Luna said above I agree with
-> C
What does this thing even do lol

I think that wraps it up, keep in mind I wrote most of this before the announcement on Necrozma was made, though I doubt many of these nominations would change, granted I did initially have Guzzlord and Obstagoon rising up a subrank. Also I kept the explanations kinda brief, so if you have questions or would like more detail, feel free to contact me
 

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 1, Guests: 0)

Top