Salandit, Salazzle Discussion

Valmanway

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What I like about Salazzle is that, while it would normally get walled by Heatran, Tentacruel, and a certain pin cushion that I'm certain I'll hate once the games release, it can just throw out Toxic and completely mess them up, so that could be a huge niche all on its own. But the thing is Salazzle looks pretty solid even without an ability, since base 117 Speed is really high (faster than Starmie) and base 111 Special Attack is nice, and Fire Blast + Sludge Wave makes for solid STAB coverage, hitting Clefable, Ferrothorn, and Skarmory hard. Nasty Plot could possibly work, especially with the pressure that Toxic can apply to walls, and Encore could also possibly help it put walls it can't crack in a bad spot. Taunt and Will-O-Wisp are nice moves, but there are better users of those moves, so they might not be worth using here. Its defensive typing is also great, since it gives it immunity to burn and poison (except for opposing Salizzle of course), as well as resistances to Fire, Ice, Fairy, Fighting, Bug, Grass, Steel, and Poison... that's a lot of resistances for something so offensive!

It's lacking real coverage though, with Dragon Pulse and Hidden Power being its best coverage moves, and it gets walled pretty hard by Rock-types and a lot of Ground-types without said coverage, most notably by Tyranitar and Garchomp. All its other stats are in the 60's, meaning it's pretty frail, and it's weak to Rock, Water, and Ground, which kinda stinks.

But overall, I'd say Salazzle has a good deal of potential here, maybe as a Life Orb sweeper with a few tricks up its sleeve, or maybe a Choice Specs revenge killer. Possibly a Substitute + Nasty Plot sweeper?
 
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This thing can be huge, Toxic actually has a good use because if we take into account that the most common things that wall this like Heatran or Chansey get screwed by Toxic it is by no means bad, its speed is godlike, solid sp attack, countering Fairies for days, and one of the coolest new mons IMO.
 

Inspirited

There is usually higher ground.
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Sr weakness is pretty nasty considering just how badly Salazzle wants Life Orb. Gigalith will only make matters worse if Salazzle happens find itself in the same meta as that sand setting rock monster. We have buffed Defog and more spinners of course, but if DP has taught me anything, its that LO + SR weak + Sand is rather difficult to work with. A couple mons have made it work in the past (Dragonite, Gyara etc), but its still something that will need to thought about when we attempt to use it. Overall, I like the design though.
 
This thing is the second fastest Fire-type in the game behind the newly-PU Talonflame. It's also the second fastest non-mega Poison-type (behind Crobat). Definitely carves itself a niche there. Toxic is also great to screw over counters like Heatran. Nasty Plot also gives it awesome late-game sweeping potential.

Yeah, I'm definitely using this thing in OU.
 
It kinda lacks the coverage for a specs set, Dragon Pulse and HP Ground/Fighting being the only real options, I think an LO set has more merit, something like this:

252 SpA/252+ Spe
Sludge Wave/Venoshock
Fire Blast/Flamethrower
Toxic
Knock Off/Will-O-Wisp/Venoshock
 

toshimelonhead

Honey Badger don't care.
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It definitely has the speed, and Fire Blast + Sludge Wave have big base powers that make the 111 SpA go far. I mean, this is probably no OU staple, but it's pretty hilarious that it can tag Heatran with a Toxic and then Taunt it to death
It can check Genesect. There has to be a niche somewhere for that.
 

AccidentalGreed

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Literally Fire-type Gengar, with now parallel Ground-weaknesses!

This one looks pretty solid imo, excluding coverage issues outside of Fire, Poison, and Dragon (and who uses Dragon moves on non-Dragons?). 117 Speed is certainly enough to get it by against a majority of offensive Pokemon, and 111 Special Attack off Life Orb and powerful options like Sludge Bomb and Fire Blast is just pretty darned good.

Its ability may or may not be useful (Keldeo's Justified, anybody?) depending on what you choose to run. OBVIOUSLY, you shouldn't constantly click Toxic like a damned imbecile, but this gal already gets by with its main options that I think sometimes you won't even need to waste a moveslot on it depending on the team. If Heatran's a concern, you could patch it up with Hidden Power Ground (+0 HP Ground = 75.3 - 88.8% against 252/0 variants) but that doesn't really cover much else outside of random rock-types.

So, overall, two slots should be guaranteed for Fire Blast and Sludge Bomb, and the other two slots are mixing and matching shit depending on what you wanna do.

Salazzle @ Life Orb
Ability: Corrosion / Oblivious (depending on if you're using Toxic or not)
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Fire Blast
- Sludge Bomb / Sludge Wave
- Encore / Taunt / Substitute / Hidden Power Ice / Hidden Power Ground
- Nasty Plot / Toxic

STAB Fire Blast is great, you should always use Sludge Bomb for that extra Poison chance unless Bulletproof Kommo-o actually becomes a thing. Nasty Plot + any of the moves in the third slot go pretty well. HP Ice is for Garchomp and Zygarde in particular because being walled and set up by either of them is just terrible.

If you ABSOLUTELY feel the need to use Corrosion Toxic (which don't get me wrong is great but christ that bulk), it goes well with Encore, Taunt, or Substitute for breaking down foes and guaranteed poison against multiple switch ins.
 
Looking at the bright side... only Knock Off is remotely useful of those Egg Moves. Maybe you can work around that problem with Bottle Caps, and forget about breeding altogether.
But dude...

Belch.

I all seriousness, though, it does have a couple worthwhile Egg Moves. I've had some success running Snatch in the past, and it could serve it well on a speedy support set with Toxic, as you could steal bulky Mons' recovery moves, or a cleric's Heal Bell/Aromatherapy. And as has been mentioned before, Fake Out makes this salacious salamander a shoo-in for VGC.
 
A solid UU. Very fast and quite powerful. I think its ability is largely a waste since most Steel and Poison types are going to OHKOed anyway. Specs and NP are going to be the main sets. Choice scarf may be viable as well with HP ice to Lure and KO Landorous and Garchomp. Its very frail and prone to revenge killing however.
 
I think a lot of people are underestimating it's ability tbh. Yes, with how frail it is, running Toxic doesn't do too much. But with dual STAB like this, it WILL force switches, and considering it can spam toxic without fear of failing, you can literally Toxic anything that switches in on it, and then switch out for a better match up to whatever is on the field. There is literally no safe switch-in to a toxic from Salazzle, and that I think, is where it's ability truly shines.
 
There is literally no safe switch-in to a toxic from Salazzle, and that I think, is where it's ability truly shines.


Also those Pokemon with Immunity that is basically Gligar and Snorlax (who may not even run Immunity) if Salazzle fails to make the cut to OU.

Still, it's an impressive three switch-ins to Toxic.

And there's also random poisoning of Poison-types through Sludge Bomb (I'd use that over Sludge Wave, to take advantage of the whole "poison anything" perk, and with the burn nerf, it can be as annoying as Scald in terms of passive damage rack-up).
 


Also those Pokemon with Immunity that is basically Gligar and Snorlax (who may not even run Immunity) if Salazzle fails to make the cut to OU.

Still, it's an impressive three switch-ins to Toxic.

And there's also random poisoning of Poison-types through Sludge Bomb (I'd use that over Sludge Wave, to take advantage of the whole "poison anything" perk, and with the burn nerf, it can be as annoying as Scald in terms of passive damage rack-up).
Do we know if Immunity actually blocks this ability?

Yeah I think Sludge bomb would be better then Sludge wave. A bit more power, a chance to poison a poison type on switch in, and you only lose double hitting, which may or may not care for you.
 


Also those Pokemon with Immunity that is basically Gligar and Snorlax (who may not even run Immunity) if Salazzle fails to make the cut to OU.

Still, it's an impressive three switch-ins to Toxic.

And there's also random poisoning of Poison-types through Sludge Bomb (I'd use that over Sludge Wave, to take advantage of the whole "poison anything" perk, and with the burn nerf, it can be as annoying as Scald in terms of passive damage rack-up).
Ok, completely forgot about those guys.

Virtually no safe switch-in
 
OK, I just finally looked at this thing's movepool. Corrosion isn't just for Toxic, it's for Poison Gas. It allows you to poison both opponents in doubles regardless of their type (90% accuracy). And that means it also gets to Venom Drench both targets, regardless of their type. It's the ultimate Venom Drench user.

Salazzle @ Air Balloon / Poisonium-Z
Ability: Corrosion
EVs: 132 HP / 124 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Fire Blast / Flamethrower
- Venoshock
- Poison Gas
- Venom Drench
 


Also those Pokemon with Immunity that is basically Gligar and Snorlax (who may not even run Immunity) if Salazzle fails to make the cut to OU.

Still, it's an impressive three switch-ins to Toxic.

And there's also random poisoning of Poison-types through Sludge Bomb (I'd use that over Sludge Wave, to take advantage of the whole "poison anything" perk, and with the burn nerf, it can be as annoying as Scald in terms of passive damage rack-up).
Except Salazzle would probably be better off firing STABs rather than Toxic most of the time. Too lazy to calc but how does SpD Gliscor do against LO Fire Blast? After a NP?

Either of Snorlax's abilities put a damper on Salazzle, though.
 
OK, I just finally looked at this thing's movepool. Corrosion isn't just for Toxic, it's for Poison Gas. It allows you to poison both opponents in doubles regardless of their type (90% accuracy). And that means it also gets to Venom Drench both targets, regardless of their type. It's the ultimate Venom Drench user.

Salazzle @ Air Balloon / Poisonium-Z
Ability: Corrosion
EVs: 132 HP / 124 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Fire Blast / Flamethrower
- Venoshock
- Poison Gas
- Venom Drench
Remind me what Poisonium Z does?

And I forgot about Venomdrench... thats actually a pretty damn good move for double battles. You can pretty much ruin 2 pokemon at once, though will you always be able to get off both moves before it dies?
 
And I forgot about Venomdrench... thats actually a pretty damn good move for double battles. You can pretty much ruin 2 pokemon at once, though will you always be able to get off both moves before it dies?
Due to how common Earthquake is in Doubles, it is best to give Salazzle an Air Balloon or Focus Sash if you want to try that Poison Gas and Venom Drench combo.
 

jas61292

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Do we know if Immunity actually blocks this ability?
While I don't know for sure, unless it was changed, Immunity Pokemon could already be poisoned by Pokemon with Mold Breaker. However, Immunity doesn't just make them immune, it also immediately cures them if they are somehow poisoned anyways (or if they were poisoned and then gain Immunity as an ability through Skill Swap or whatever).
 
Remind me what Poisonium Z does?

And I forgot about Venomdrench... thats actually a pretty damn good move for double battles. You can pretty much ruin 2 pokemon at once, though will you always be able to get off both moves before it dies?
Poisonium-Z would primarily be used to raise Salazzle's Defense by one level when it uses Poison Gas or Venom Drench. But I think Air Balloon is the better bet almost always. Like many doubles combos, this one really wants Fake Out support.
 
While I don't know for sure, unless it was changed, Immunity Pokemon could already be poisoned by Pokemon with Mold Breaker. However, Immunity doesn't just make them immune, it also immediately cures them if they are somehow poisoned anyways (or if they were poisoned and then gain Immunity as an ability through Skill Swap or whatever).
Ah ok, so it probably would cure them I assume

Poisonium-Z would primarily be used to raise Salazzle's Defense by one level when it uses Poison Gas or Venom Drench. But I think Air Balloon is the better bet almost always. Like many doubles combos, this one really wants Fake Out support.
If its just a defense boost then yeah air balloon would be better. Not sure if the team I have planned with her has access to fake out though...
 

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