Metagame PU Community Surveys

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Chloe

is a Community Contributoris a Top Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Dedicated Tournament Hostis a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
NUPL Champion
Gm, it's about time we hop on this train. Most of you should know the drill, as every other tier has done these and they've done a fantastic job at collecting data from their communities to make their tiers better. I've felt like we've done a good job without them, however we can always improve and this seems like a great time to start.

Here is our first survey.

We will be collecting data for about a week, so expect the results to be posted around September 1st. It should be obvious, but please don't respond if you don't play this tier or have very little knowledge of it. Keep in mind you don't have to respond to everything and please don't feel the need to respond to something if you don't feel you have enough to say. We want the data to be as reliable and as accurate as possible. Thanks for reading, and we're looking forward to your responses! This is our first survey, so if there are mistakes or w/e feel free to pm me or 2xTheTap here or on Discord.
 

Specs

Getting in your own way
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UUPL Champion
Gm and hlelo, I have the results here! Will show all of the numbered results and discuss them, and also discuss some trends I saw in the written results.

How much do you enjoy the meta.jpg

I was expecting a bit more 3's but I'm not complaining, this is great to see! This meta game isn't perfect however people seem to be enjoying it.

Some of the written responses talked about how good the variety is, it feels honest (no incredibly broken mons or playstyles, nothing is impossible to deal with), the amount of tools we have is good. There was talk about how there are lots of threats to prep for but a majority of people said it didn't affect their enjoyment when actually playing.

how competitive the metagame is.jpg

This was no surprise to me, I've talked about this before with the council and in talks in the discord. The meta game is very competitive and games are almost always interesting to play and watch. As much as the meta game should be fun, this is probably the statistic I take into account the most.

A majority of the written responses were positive here too. People appreciated there not being a ton of cheese strats (no kings rock, quick claw, ect to be found here). I won't be quoting too many responses here but this one I really loved: "The meta is decently balanced, not perfectly as matchup issues are somewhat of a thing but not moreso than I am used to. Aforementioned balance-heavy nature of the meta leads to good games wherever matchup issues don't play an outsized role." Some others talked about how the better player wins a decent majority of the time. There are still some issues of a crazy amount of threats but I'm glad it's not seeping into peoples opinion of the tier competitively.

how much do you enjoy building.jpg

The numbers make sense here. Imo theres still plenty to play around with but if your whole goal in mind is to prep for as much as possible while also having the tools to play the game, it can be quite restricting. Which means how much you enjoy the process is lowered.

The written responses had a lot to say here. There are too many threats to reliably check in 6 slots, checking Zard while not opening your team up for other threats is difficult, you're able to be creative but there are lots of roles that need to be on a team so in practice you're limited anyways. I feel this frustration people are talking about so this all checks out.

guno.jpg

These numbers surprised me a bit, though building more and more in this meta I'm actually on the surveys side. It got a lot of hype coming into the tier but has slowed down over time. The mon doesn't suck and it's definitely a threat, especially paired with breakers that love Future Sight support, but we've adapted to it really well. It also hasn't absolutely popped off in high level games.

Scrafty.jpg

I'm with the majority here too. A lot of what is being put on builds checks Scrafty anyways (Fairy is a top type here and Fighting types are great) so it rarely auto wins games. Our amazing fairy types do have to watch out though, most notably Whimscott, because of a lack of reliable recovery. DD sets while not being ran much also only need one or two sequences to start threatening them really hard. It's a big threat that isn't really ruining the tier but has a big presence that is most definitely felt.

passimian.jpg

So clearly not a lot of people felt like Passimian is broken or unhealthy. It has a tougher time getting around checks because of wanting to be scarfed 99% of the time, and it's more of a cleaner than anything. The rise of Weezing helps builds check it long term. Glad to see that tons of people feel it's in a good spot!

charizard.jpg

Charizard has the most 4's out of all of these. Being able to outlast checks with the Toxic set, and if you don't resist Fire Blast and Hurricane it has a ton of offensive pressure. It has a lot of defensive utility too, but slightly struggles to get in thanks to Knock Off being pretty much the best move in he meta game with a ton of users. This has been the mon the community has talked about the most when talking about potentially problematic mons, so this all checks out.

Tsareena.jpg

Tsareena has a ton of offensive pressure whenever it is in and finds its way in a good bit too, having good bulk especially with bulkier spreads being on the come up. I find it so interesting how spread out these votes are. I'm somewhere in the middle where I understand how big of a threat it is, while also knowing there are decent options that stop it throughout most of the game. I'm for sure going to start thinking about its place in the tier more.

drampa.jpg

Drampa has the most spread out votes for a single mon. It is no doubt a top breaker and has good defensive utility thanks to the typing and good bulk. Really the only thing stopping it is the speed tier, where it really doesn't out speed much but it is able to come in on the things it does out speed. That doesn't stop you though, it is able to take neutral and harder hitting resisted hits to take trades for your team. It needs to click the right buttons because of how Fairy types are on every team, but it eats teams alive if the Drampa user gets those turns right. Another mon I'm going to have to evaluate more.

The final question was another written one: Are there any issues in the PU meta that you think need to be addressed (ex. sand, stall, something else)? If so, what potential solution(s) would you like to see implemented to solve said problem?

Some were surprised Steel-Vally wasn't mentioned, or some other Silvallys. I think thats fair, I had initially though of putting them on but they don't feel like the root cause of anything, if that makes sense. It would help the meta a bit if one or two of them were gone but would it change much? idk

Some stall mentions and yeah it can be annoying to prep for while also prepping for the mons listed here.

A couple Sand mentions, Sandslash has definitely been on the rise. Knock EQ Edge is tough to check all at once, especially with Palo dropping in usage and Grass's taking a good chunk esp at +2.

Kee Berry Mes actually got a mention here, it's able to rip apart more passive teams and has seen higher level usage

I'm going to link our council members answers here, just with numbers and not pics since this post is long as is.
tlenit:
How enjoyable do you find the current metagame?
4/5
How competitive do you find the metagame?
4/5
How enjoyable is building specifically in the current metagame?
3/5
What are your thoughts on Articuno-Galar (Guno) in the current metagame?
2/5
What are your thoughts on Scrafty in the current metagame?
1/5
What are your thoughts on Passimian in the current metagame?
1/5
What are your thoughts on Charizard in the current metagame?
1/5
What are your thoughts on Tsareena in the current metagame?
1/5
What are your thoughts on Drampa in the current metagame?
2/5
How enjoyable do you find the current metagame?
4/5
How competitive do you find the metagame?
4/5
How enjoyable is building specifically in the current metagame?
3/5
What are your thoughts on Articuno-Galar (Guno) in the current metagame?
3/5
What are your thoughts on Scrafty in the current metagame?
2/5
What are your thoughts on Passimian in the current metagame?
2/5
What are your thoughts on Charizard in the current metagame?
4/5
What are your thoughts on Tsareena in the current metagame?
4/5
What are your thoughts on Drampa in the current metagame?
1/5
How enjoyable do you find the current metagame?
4/5
How competitive do you find the metagame?
4/5
How enjoyable is building specifically in the current metagame?
4/5
What are your thoughts on Articuno-Galar (Guno) in the current metagame?
2/5
What are your thoughts on Scrafty in the current metagame?
2/5
What are your thoughts on Passimian in the current metagame?
1/5
What are your thoughts on Charizard in the current metagame?
2/5
What are your thoughts on Tsareena in the current metagame?
2/5
What are your thoughts on Drampa in the current metagame?
2/5
How enjoyable do you find the current metagame?
4/5
How competitive do you find the metagame?
4/5
How enjoyable is building specifically in the current metagame?
3/5
What are your thoughts on Articuno-Galar (Guno) in the current metagame?
3/5
What are your thoughts on Scrafty in the current metagame?
3/5
What are your thoughts on Passimian in the current metagame?
2/5
What are your thoughts on Charizard in the current metagame?
2/5
What are your thoughts on Tsareena in the current metagame?
2/5
What are your thoughts on Drampa in the current metagame?
4/5
How enjoyable do you find the current metagame?
4/5
How competitive do you find the metagame?
4/5
How enjoyable is building specifically in the current metagame?
3/5
What are your thoughts on Articuno-Galar (Guno) in the current metagame?
3/5
What are your thoughts on Scrafty in the current metagame?
3/5
What are your thoughts on Passimian in the current metagame?
2/5
What are your thoughts on Charizard in the current metagame?
4/5
What are your thoughts on Tsareena in the current metagame?
4/5
What are your thoughts on Drampa in the current metagame?
3/5
Hjad is still on leave so none from him, but will update if we do get something out of him in the near future.

I want to seriously thank everyone who took the time out of their lives to do this. I went through every single response and read everything, your opinions matter! Don't expect change immediately because by the numbers people are quite torn on what would need to change (if anything.) Thankfully there is no rush, PU has its biggest tournament starting next week so we will see it in action on our biggest stage. As a heads up I'll leave this open for anyone who wants to put in their answers but didn't know about this survey when it was posted. This post will not be updated with results moving forward, but I'll be looking at the results a bit so you aren't typing to a wall kek. Again thanks and take care everyone
 
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Chloe

is a Community Contributoris a Top Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Dedicated Tournament Hostis a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
NUPL Champion
Hey! I've got the results to the recent survey so I'm going to post them and discuss them briefly. First off, thank you to everyone who took the time to respond to this survey. We got an amazing 98 responses, after getting 41 last time. It really helps us out see how the community is feeling about the metagame. I plan to keep these surveys up at a steady pace from here on out. That being said, here are the results.

Forms response chart. Question title: How much do you enjoy SS PU right now, with 1 being minimal enjoyment and 10 being maximum enjoyment?. Number of responses: 98 responses.

This seems like a good thing! A fair majority (76%) voted a 7 or above in terms of how much they enjoyed the meta. Not a perfect meta, as many people outlined with the coming questions, but generally fairly enjoyable. I'm glad to see this :) hopefully with however the meta trends and is handled in the coming months the remaining 24% can be won over >:3

Forms response chart. Question title: How competitive do you find SS PU right now, with 1 being minimal competitiveness and 10 being maximum competitiveness?. Number of responses: 98 responses.

A similar case here, the vast majority are located in the upper half which is again great to see. Some of the lower results may have been impacted by our tournament schedule not containing any SS PU prior to Open this year, which is a fair reason. Definitely hoping the average increases as the rest of the generation goes on however.

A notable omission here, that was present on the previous survey was a question on how people found teambuilding, which is definitely one I'd prefer to have on future iterations. Definitely something I should have included given some people's attitudes towards teambuilding at the moment in the metagame, which will be elaborated on later.

Forms response chart. Question title: Would you support any tiering action against Jellicent right now?. Number of responses: 97 responses.

40% of respondants voted Jellicent as a suspect-worthy threat. I think this is definitely fair to a degree as there is a very valid argument about how its defensive set warps teambuilding and invalidates the spinners we have in a tier with little removal. It's also important to note its Choice Specs set and how it has a noticeable lack of defensive counterplay. That being said, the majority of the voters are against action on Jellicent, and believe its place in this metagame is healthy.

Forms response chart. Question title: Would you support any tiering action against Gallade right now?. Number of responses: 97 responses.

Even less of the playerbase agrees that Gallade is problematic. While it's definitely a strong wallbreaker, well built teams are usually able to deal with it well enough, without much hassle. It's definitely one of those Pokemon that can be a menace if given the right opportunities but as it stands it seems that almost 70% of people just don't think it's unhealthy in the current metagame.

Forms response chart. Question title: Would you support any tiering action against Charizard right now?. Number of responses: 96 responses.

The lowest voted Pokemon on the poll, Charizard, was included because of its influence on teambuilding and how it forces the same few Pokemon to be on every team. In addition to this, common checks like Gigalith or Regirock can get whittled down over the course of a game. These Pokemon are generally decent already without considering Charizard. I think many people acknowledge the strain it has on teambuilding, while accepting its a necessary evil due to the aforementioned points in addition to its utility in Defog.

Forms response chart. Question title: Would you support any tiering action against Articuno-Galar right now?. Number of responses: 97 responses.

With Espeon leaving, Galarian Articuno (Guno) has returned to its spot as the premier offensive special psychic in the tier and for good reason. Prior to Espeon's addition to the tier, many people found Galarian Articuno to be borderline problematic, with its Choice Specs set having little counterplay especially after considering how frequently the move Freezing Glare was effective in disabling Togedemaru or Aggron. That being said in this current meta, the lack of viable removal proves a problem for actually getting this Pokemon in. Several common defensive staples you'd want to bring Guno in on, such as Sandaconda, will set Stealth Rock and prevent Guno from coming in easily a second time. The lack of removal actually helps keep this bird in check a lot of the time. 40.2% is a quite large amount though, so it is definitely a Pokemon worth keeping an eye on as the meta continues.

Forms response chart. Question title: Would you support any tiering action against Scrafty right now?. Number of responses: 98 responses.

Peoples' problems with Scrafty mostly seem to revolve around teambuilding. In practice, Scrafty rarely proves to be a broken Pokemon due to the prevalence of Quagsire, Ribombee, Whimsicott, Comfey & Taunt Weezing; but the fact that these Pokemon are in fact seeing so much usage is due to Scrafty's overbearing presence in the teambuilder, is a reason to be worried. It's similar to Charizard in the way that, without a dedicated answer to this Pokemon, you will struggle immensely and potentially lose on matchup. Not to mention a lot of Scrafty's prevalent defensive counterplay such as Ribombee or Whimsicott is removed easily via Iron Head on certain sets. At the moment, the majority of people don't see Scrafty as an issue, but who's to say that won't change in the future.

Forms response chart. Question title: Would you support any tiering action against Stored Power Mesprit & Uxie right now?. Number of responses: 96 responses.

This was an interesting one. Stored Power sets seem to be popping up again as the meta has ensued, and can definitely just have their way against a lot of the common teams in the metagame. The defensive counterplay that saw itself popping up around SCL and PUWC such as Roar Aggron, Haze Quagsire and Mystical Fire Charizard have all fallen off for one reason or another, and the current meta is giving opportunities for these sets to shine yet again. They haven't completely come back to the fold though, and I'd definitely be interested to see how opinions surrounding these Pokemon change in the coming months.

Is there anything not mentioned above you would like looked into by the council?
This was an interesting question. There weren't too too many Pokemon listed here but some showed up a few times. The main one that returned and returned was Quagsire. Not something on the radar exactly but I can see a point to be made about how it invalidates common set up sweepers and makes the metagame a lot more focused on hazard control, rather than a traditional set-up sweeper win condition. I've heard this take a fair bit, and it's not the most outlandish thing ever. Stall was another thing that saw a few responses; however, I wouldn't say stall is too prominent at the moment, it isn't centralising and certain breakers seem to just have a field day versus it. Until people are building better stall teams I can't say it's something we'd consider looking into at all.

Silvally-Ghost was the only other Pokemon that got multiple mentions which was interesting. I don't think it's too strong in this metagame, but it's a reasonable take. Quagsire, Sandaconda, Regirock, Scrafty, etc being common at the moment surely doesn't help its case but I think the main thing holding it back is how careful you have to be with positioning it, in a hazard heavy metagame like this one. Due to this, it's kind of hard to build with it reliably due to its inability to hold HDB, its overreliance on removal and even then after that it just struggles to break through a lot of common teams. I do see where these people are coming from though, as given the right circumstances, it can be a menace to deal with.

Forms response chart. Question title: Is there any Pokemon that you believe the council should look into re-suspecting from PUBL?. Number of responses: 95 responses.

The responses for Pokemon we should unban was a doozy to say the least. It was interesting to see the amount of different unique takes on what we should unban from PUBL, and how large the amount of people was that think we should unban a Pokemon. Next time I make a survey however, I think I'm going to have to include a request in this section for people to explain their reasoning for this. Seeing multiple people voting for Duraludon, Kingdra and Omastar, after they were genuinely some of the most broken Pokemon we've ever seen in SS PU, makes me really want some sort of explanation. Shoutouts to the few people who misunderstood the assignment and said we should unban Gigalith or Perrserker from PUBL. I will make sure to do that, thank you.



:kingler:
Here is the breakdown of the voting for this section. After Heracross2.0's recent post detailing why he believes Kingler would be healthy in current PU, several other people seemingly agreed with him. I think it would definitely be one of the more balanced PUBL Pokemon but I'd definitely need some convincing on whether it'd be remotely healthy for the tier. Considering the lack of switchins to offensive Water-types currently like Choice Specs Jellicent, I'd be a little scared on allowing an offensive powerhouse like Kingler, that has the necessary coverage to bop almost anything, into the tier.

:espeon:
Several people were unhappy about the Espeon ban. This is something I think is completely fair to a degree as it wasn't overwhelmingly broken like other Pokemon on this list. It'd also help a lot with the current amount of hazard spam, with defensive sets being able to pick up some slack and having a bit more utility over something like Hattrem, which is our current bouncer of choice. Offensive sets would of course still be as potent as before, but yea, I guess most of this is to be expected after our recent suspect that came down so close to the wire.

:virizion:
Virizion is interesting and I think has come to fruition due to the recent drop of Garbodor, which would definitely help with it; however, it would still necessitate Poison-type usage on every team. People are already complaining about what you're forced to run in the teambuilder currently to deal with Scrafty and Charizard. Virizion seems like this on steroids really. Not only that but Garbodor and Weezing lack reliable recovery, they're hit by potential Psychic-type coverage from Virizion, and even without it can only come in very few times. In terms of positives however, it could help alleviate the pressure of Jellicent, potentially open the door for a Water-type from PUBL to be balanced if it saw enough usage. This is all theoretical however, and as it stands, it'd be very difficult Pokemon to account for in the current metagame.

:raichu-alola::sceptile:
Super fast Pokemon that KO every mon after a single turn of setup. I'm not sold sorry. Rising Voltage Raichu-Alola in Electric Terrain is insane and unless you're running Levitate Weezing, Sceptile is just going to run amuck through your team. I do think the bans for these Pokemon were initially rushed as I've said in the past, but they are very likely too much for the tier and there'd need to be solid arguments for their inclusion for a resuspect to be considered.

:drampa:
The remainder are just too powerful of breakers (or sweepers in Omastar's case). The only one you could remotely make an argument for, in my eyes, is Drampa, which actually comes with defensive utility in Defog and Roost, and acts as a defensive check for Pokemon like Silvally-Ghost and Jellicent. But we all remember how powerful Drampa was in the previous meta. The meta of SCL of last year, where Drampa ran rampant, is not something I really want to return to, especially considering we don't have many new tools to deal with it. Even though some of these PUBL unbans don't appear to be the strongest in my eyes, I do appreciate all the answers regardless. The most interesting part of this survey, after realising the majority of people just want the meta to remain the same, was looking at this single question and considering the impact of each of them on the metagame.

Any other comments, suggestions or concerns?
As always thank you for leaving your feedback. A few notable things to come from this field were mainly people saying they love the current meta and asking us to keep the meta the same, which is the current intention after receiving this feedback. As always you are free to argue your case for anything here in the NP thread, and I'd love to see it! Someone asked us to unban Drizzle & Drought, which unfortunately we cannot do as it's an NU ban that carries down to here, but even so both would be horrendously broken :blobsad: also I got rickrolled once which in my opinion was NOT very funny :( Other than that, just a lot of positive feedback that was really great to see. As I said earlier, we intend to host these surveys more often, and the huge turnout for this one really sparks me with joy. Thank you to everyone for contributing!

Lastly, I've been asked to show separate results for only voters who have notable records in tournaments to see how the results differ.
To count as a qualified voter, you must fall into one of the following categories:
  1. Played PU in SCL I (2021)
  2. Qualified for PU Circuit Playoffs (2021)
  3. Are a current member of the PU Council
People who qualify: TJ, Vulpix03, chlo, termi, mushamu, SOMALIA, zoowi, xavgb, 2xTheTap

How much do you enjoy SS PU right now, with 1 being minimal enjoyment and 10 being maximum enjoyment?
6 6 7 7 7 7 7 8 8
How competitive do you find SS PU right now, with 1 being minimal competitiveness and 10 being maximum competitiveness?
5 6 6 7 7 7 7 8 8
Would you support any tiering action against Jellicent right now?
4 Yes, 5 No
Would you support any tiering action against Gallade right now?
3 Yes, 6 No
Would you support any tiering action against Charizard right now?
1 Yes, 8 No
Would you support any tiering action against Articuno-Galar right now?
3 Yes, 6 No
Would you support any tiering action against Scrafty right now?
0 Yes, 9 No
Would you support any tiering action against Stored Power Mesprit & Uxie right now?
1 Yes, 8 No
Finally, some general forum updates while I'm here. We plan to vote on the Viability Rankings thread within the next week, so make sure to get in any last minute nominations! Additionally, the sample teams are getting quite old; I'll be making an announcement also within the next week in the hopes of updating them but you are free to post any teams you believe are solid to the sample teams thread at any time. If you have any questions about any of this post, feel free to write a message on my Smogon wall or shoot me a PM on Discord (Chloe#0001). Thank you for reading!
 

Chloe

is a Community Contributoris a Top Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Dedicated Tournament Hostis a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
NUPL Champion
Hi! I'm here to announce the results from July's survey. We had 90 respondents this time, which is around the same as last time, and an amazing amount that I'm really happy to have! Thank you to EVERY SINGLE PERSON who responded to this survey!! These really help us gauge what the community thinks about the metagame and allows us to make positive decisions about the metagame moving forward.

Every section will display the general results from the survey, in addition to what the "qualified voters" think about certain aspects of the metagame. This isn't intended to separate users and prioritise certain users over others but it is definitely beneficial to see what tournament players think of the metagame in comparison to the regular playerbase. Qualified voters include PU Council members, anyone who reached top 8 of PU Open, anyone who obtained a 6-1 record or greater in PU Swiss, and anyone who has gotten a win in the first three weeks of PUPL in a slot that includes SS PU. This includes 27 voters all up.

A lot of interesting results overall, and some I'd definitely like to outline in detail throughout this post. There are again, improvements that could be made for next survey, and if you have any ideas in terms of questions we should ask, or different way we should format parts of the survey, then please feel free to come to me with your suggestions! Without further ado, let's see what people think about the current SS PU metagame!

Overall Metagame
Forms response chart. Question title: How much do you enjoy SS PU right now?. Number of responses: 90 responses.

Overall, fairly decent spread of enjoyment. I'm glad to see the majority of people around the 7-8/10 mark. I can't really ask for any more here for the most part. Majority of players like the meta = that is good.


Most agreed with the general consensus that the meta is enjoyable other than a select few. Nothing of note here.


Forms response chart. Question title: How competitive do you find SS PU right now?. Number of responses: 90 responses.

Same case here! An improvement since last time. Zero 1's or 2's, and the vast majority around an eight. We definitely benefit from having more tournaments than at the time we hosted the last survey. We've had Swiss and PUPL since the last survey and it's definitely contributed towards a positive outcome here. Overall, PUPL games seem to be at a high level and people are generally finding the tier competitive. Yay!


Overall great to see! Again, nothing of real note.


Forms response chart. Question title: How enjoyable is building specifically in the current metagame?. Number of responses: 87 responses.

This one is a bit more concerning. We didn't have this question last time but I imagine we would've had a similar-ish result then. Many people in their survey response attributed teambuilding pain to the presence of Charizard and Scrafty, and having to sacrifice an entire moveslot every time to these Pokemon or risk getting 6-0d. Scrafty continually came up as THE problematic element in this regard which I definitely see. At least with Charizard, the Pokemon that check it are otherwise really good e.g. Regirock, Gigalith, Wishiwashi, etc. With Scrafty, you're required to run a dedicated check the vast majority of the time. Some people have mentioned that there's overall a lack of teambuilding freedom when you're required to run dedicated teamslots for Charizard and Scrafty, and how there's little room for creativity after this. Definitely something to keep in mind as we move forward. All this being said, the majority of responses being in the upper half is good, but this is definitely something we should be striving to improve.


Similar to the total vote tally.


Problematic Pokemon
1 = Healthy, 5 = Unhealthy
Forms response chart. Question title: How do you feel about Doublade in the current metagame?. Number of responses: 89 responses.

Doublade was a Pokemon we wanted to include on the survey, just to gauge what people thought of both the recent drops, despite nobody on council considering it problematic. This generally seems to be the consensus. The metagame seems equiped to deal with Doublade, with the abundance of Ground-types, current prevalence of Guzzlord and Charizard, and its overall lacking in terms of longevity. Very little votes towards the higher end, 90% of voters believing it's at most a 3. This is nothing to worry about at the current moment.


Even more determined that Doublade is healthy. Only a single qualified voter gave it a five.


Forms response chart. Question title: How do you feel about Gallade in the current metagame?. Number of responses: 89 responses.

Gallade had slightly a bit more votes in the higher half but follows a similar story. There's been several mentions as of late that Doublade's existence hinders Gallade extensively, and that its breaking power, already regarded as balanced by most, is yet again impaired. 84% of voters gave it a 1-3, and there's recently been a miniscule amount of prominent examples where Gallade has been unhealthily applied in a match. Again, another Pokemon considered a non-issue by the majority of voters.


Even less of the qualified voterbase deemed Gallade a problem. The vast majority believe its very healthy in the current metagame.


Forms response chart. Question title: How do you feel about Guzzlord in the current metagame?. Number of responses: 89 responses.

Guzzlord's data is substantially more concerning. Much more skewed towards the upper numbers, and over double the amount of users considering it a problematic element. This is definitely a Pokemon I believe we should keep a close eye on as a tier. With a complete lack of coherent switchins considering its potency on all Band / Specs / Mixed sets, in tandem with its impressive raw power and coverage, it's no secret that this Pokemon is gaining a lot of attention as of late. Out of all the Pokemon we surveyed this was by far the one that people want action on the most.


This is finally an absolutely notable one. Guzzlord was deemed much more problematic by this pool of voters. Definitely representative of how oppressive it has been in the earliest rounds of PUPL in comparison to how it fairs against the abundance of random offenses you can find on ladder. Definitely more of a sign that we should be weary and vigilant if it continues to be an oppressive force in the coming weeks.


Forms response chart. Question title: How do you feel about Scyther in the current metagame?. Number of responses: 89 responses.

Interestingly enough Scyther is considered completely healthy by the majority of voters. While its offensive prowess is outstanding at times, it hasn't pushed itself over the edge in the vast majority of voters minds. Should be interesting to see how opinions on Scyther change in the coming months but for now, it's a pretty unanimous healthy vote.


There's a much more even split, but doesn't really paint a different story to the overall playerbase poll.


Forms response chart. Question title: How do you feel about Vanilluxe / Snow Warning in the current metagame?. Number of responses: 89 responses.

An outstanding breaker at the moment, Vanilluxe has tipped itself over the edge in several voters minds. While only really gaining attention recently, its ability to break through Steel-type "checks" with relative ease has been particularly notable, as Gigalith remains one of the only reliable switch-ins. While the second most "unhealthy voted" Pokemon here, there seems to have been struck a balance generally of most voters thinking it is okay. People noted that if we were going to take action on either, that Vanilluxe would be the sensible target and not Snow Warning. I tend to agree really, as while Abomasnow can accomplish somewhat similar things on paper, it has no showings that really push it over the edge. Definitely not the priority, but something we should keep a close eye on for sure.


More skewed towards the latter end than the regular poll. Qualified voters have more issue with Vanilluxe than the remainder of the playerbase.

-

In terms of alternate Pokemon people had an issue with, Scrafty got 12 whole mentions. This is something I should have put as a votable option on the survey to begin with and I'd like to apologise for that. Most issues with Scrafty seem to do with its effect on the teambuilder rather than its potency in game. While Substitute 3 Attack sets have taken off as of late, they aren't for the most part overwhelming, or more overwhelming than other breakers we currently have. The general issue with Scrafty is just that dedicated team slot it requires to answer it. How most times you have to go out of your way to run a Fairy-type, just to check Bulk Up variants, and then when you do, these Fairy-types can be overcome with Poison Jab or Iron Head if its a different set. I definitely see the arguments here and would be interested to see more discussion about Scrafty's impact on the metagame going forward.

Otherwise, there were 4 votes for Charizard, which people have issue with for similar reasons to Scrafty. 3 Jellicent, 1 Articuno-Galar, 1 Ribombee, 1 Magmortar, 1 Archeops, 1 Quagsire, 1 Audino. Shoutouts to the one person who voted Guzzlord wasn't broken, but then listed Guzzlord as an option in the not mentioned slot. Amaz1ng read1ng c0mprehensi0n c0nfirm3d.


Nothing really comparatively of note.


Resuspect Options
Of 90 voters, (ignore the percentages)

Duraludon | 4
Clawitzer | 1

A very large amount of you thought the meta was fine and that we should resuspect a Pokemon as our next option going forward. While I tend to see the appeal in a few of these, our focus should definitely currently be on making sure the Pokemon in the meta currently are healthy, and then we can go ahead and look at these. Other than Sceptile and Raichu-Alola of the ones already in the poll, most of these have redeeming features in my eyes, and I'd definitely like to see a few of them looked at before the end of the generation. We have enough time. Duraludon and Clawitzer are definitely too much for our meta though, they're insane breakers with no guaranteed switch-ins.


Nothing really of note. 11/27 voted to resuspect nothing.


Comments & Concerns
There were a lot of general comments left here which was good to read. No real recurring messages here other than a couple people complaining about random Pokemon that were discussed above. There were a few that were unnecessarily abrasive which I definitely would've preferred to avoid :( I don't get paid to do this, so please don't cuss me out for letting stall exist!! Overall, the majority of comments were positive, and there were a few really nice messages left for me which I genuinely appreciated a lot and helped me get through reading all of these. Really makes doing this worth it, so thank you :>

Conclusion
Thank you so much to everyone that contributed this time around. As always, we're really grateful to see all your responses, and it definitely helps a lot in deciding what to do going forward. Nothing to announce for now, but that may change soon in accordance with the results here. Anyway, thank you for reading and I hope you have a lovely day!
 

Chloe

is a Community Contributoris a Top Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Dedicated Tournament Hostis a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
NUPL Champion
another month, another survey. i'm more than ever curious as to all of your opinions on the current metagame and would love if you could fill out this survey! it takes 2 minutes max and it helps us out a lot!!!

CLICK HERE!!!!

thank you as always, y'all are the best. i'll close this on saturday. if you have any questions, dm me here or on discord: Chloe#0001
 

Chloe

is a Community Contributoris a Top Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Dedicated Tournament Hostis a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
NUPL Champion
Our recent survey's results are in! As always, thank you to everyone who responded! We got 104 responses this time, which is exceeding any amount we've gotten before. It's super cool to have such a high amount of people sharing their input on the metagame. Same as last time, I'll be contrasting the entirety of the voter pool with the qualified voter pool (same requirements as last time, except any win in SS / Bo3 throughout the tournament counts). I don't want to waste any more of your time, so let's get right into what the results show!

I will not be writing as much this time because writing an excessive amount about the same topics every time can be incredibly draining but hopefully you understand. All the stats will still be here for your viewing pleasure.

General
I'll be using qualified voter responses later in this post to contrast for individual Pokemon opinions. For the general section, they are way too similar to be of any use to us.
Forms response chart. Question title: How much do you enjoy SS PU right now?. Number of responses: 104 responses.

I can't really comment much more than last time, it's a very similar distribution where the majority of people seem the enjoy the current metagame! That's great to see again :) The comments people had pertaining to the enjoyability of the metagame mainly consisted of it "being good and fun at the moment". Again, that's great! I love to hear it.

Forms response chart. Question title: How competitive do you find SS PU right now?. Number of responses: 104 responses.

Similar kind of distribution to last time! I can't really comment on this much, and nobody had nothing to really add specifically. Us having consistent tournaments at the moment, including PUPL, Grand Slam playoffs, PULT and the recent Swiss tournament definitely all add to this being high. Again great to see.

Forms response chart. Question title: How enjoyable is building specifically in the current metagame?. Number of responses: 102 responses.

Not really sure how to read into this. Definitely improvements still to be made, and I definitely don't blame anyone for feeling negatively about the state of building currently. This is an improvement on last time's results barely, but yea still a ways to go before getting to a point in which we can be happy.

Pokemon
Forms response chart. Question title: How do you feel about Doublade in the current metagame?. Number of responses: 104 responses.

Incredibly even set of results. More people want to see tiering action on it than not though which means it might be something to look into. My personal stance is that I definitely think its impact on teambuilding is an overall negative but it doesn't seem like a Pokemon that's broken by traditional standards.

Qualified Voter Result:
Support: 10
Do Not Support: 4
No Strong Opinion: 5

Very strong showing for supporting tiering action, and definitely implies it's something we should be looking at soon!

Forms response chart. Question title: How do you feel about Scyther in the current metagame?. Number of responses: 104 responses.

This doesn't really surprise me. It really doesn't have the prominent showings on ladder, and most of its potent performances have been in tournament games where its prowess has been excessive. Against the unreliable hyper offenses people spam on ladder it is not going to have the same overwhelming presence it has in tournament play, that's just how it is.

Qualified Voter Result:
Support: 12
Do Not Support: 6
No Strong Opinion: 1

63% of the qualified voters want us to act on Scyther, and given its tour presence it's not hard to figure out why. Definitely something that should result in tiering action.

Forms response chart. Question title: How do you feel about Scrafty in the current metagame?. Number of responses: 104 responses.

Even right down the middle. Definitely a contentious issue amongst the general populace; however, clearly not our immediate priority given the results of other Pokemon here. Its effect on the teambuilder is pretty substantial however, and the rise of Poison Jab sets have definitely made it more difficult to defensively answer.

Qualified Voter Result:
Support: 7
Do Not Support: 10
No Strong Opinion: 2

Not as clear-cut as to whether it should see tiering action, but definitely something we should be keeping an eye on down the line.

Forms response chart. Question title: How do you feel about Charizard in the current metagame?. Number of responses: 104 responses.

Most people seem to think it's fine. While its effect on the teambuilder is obvious, most people seem to think it's not overbearing in that sense. In addition to this, most think it's fine in game even if it has the ability to wittle down its checks.

Qualified Voter Result:
Support: 4
Do Not Support: 15
No Strong Opinion: 0

Hard to justify acting on this at all. Most people think it's fine!

Forms response chart. Question title: How do you feel about Gallade in the current metagame?. Number of responses: 104 responses.

Pretty overwhelming result of "nah this mon is fine" and I definitely agree. It's just a Pokemon that's been brought up several times in the past and I was curious of what it would result in.

Qualified Voter Result:
Support: 1
Do Not Support: 15
No Strong Opinion: 3

Very clearly not seen as an issue by most people who play the tier, both in qualified and regular voterbases. No action will be taken on Gallade.

Anything Else?
The only Pokemon that got more than a single mention here was Gigalith. But only two mentions. This Pokemon isn't broken but I understand it can be kind of monotonous to have the option just to throw on the dumb bulky rock type when building. Other mentions that got a single response include Ribombee, Quagsire, Sandaconda, Glastrier, Centiskorch, Absol, Archeops and :emolga: None of the qualified voters contributed to this count.

What should we resuspect from PUBL?
The main repeated answer here was "reintroduce Guzzlord, Virizion, Espeon, etc in tandem" and while I see the appeal to a degree, it's theorycrafting a metagame we assume will work to solve a problem that can be solved through more conventional methods. I personally don't see the metagame being any more healthy if we just unban a few brokens that are theoretically supposed to keep each other in check. It's potentially something to consider going forward and perhaps a fun idea for a tournament to experiment with a metagame like this to test it out but otherwise I don't think it's absolutely an immediate solution we should attempt to emulate going into SCL. Might be something to discuss post-SCL if people who suggest this change still don't like the metagame.

Otherwise a bunch of single Espeon, Drampa, Guzzlord, Virizion, Raichu-Alola, and other Pokemon I've elaborated on in previous surveys. I think Drampa has the potential to be interesting to a degree, but I still think it's virtually as broken as it was the day we banned it. None of these Pokemon got notable numbers though, so they really shouldn't be our first priority.

Comments & Concerns
Thank you to everyone for your nice comments here, I really appreciate seeing them :) Most concerns that were left here have already been addressed ad nauseum, but I just want to make sure everyone knows I read through every single response to our surveys. It's really great to see what everyone thinks. Even if there are times I don't necessarily personally agree, I do value seeing how other people view the metagame. Thank you for contributing to making this tier better!!!!
 
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