Pokemon that were more prominent in a generation besides their own

[QuentinQuonce]

Retaining Normal-type won’t mean anything so long it retained a poor BST and as a result, poor overall stats aside of HP. Plus Moon Stone tend to be obtained later than early, especially with how weak Jigglypuff and especially Igglybuff are. At most Wigglytuff serves best as a boss-type early NPC Pokémon.

Good lord I didn't think anyone would genuinely take that to mean I was implying Wigglytuff became some fearsome gamebreaker because it's Normal as well as Fairy. Literally all I said was it had a niche when compared to Clefable. "Some form of a niche" in fact were my actual words.

It's almost like that was a flippant throwaway post that didn't warrant serious analysis!

 

[mertyville]

Beedrill was honestly terrible in Generation 1. Both in-game as well as competitive.

It has seen some niche in Gen 4 thanks to Toxic Spikes, but the main games that made it worth using is Generation 6 and 7 simply because of it's mega evolution.

Venomoth is probably the most overlooked example. Generation 1 is a terrible gen for bug types, but since Gen 4 Venomoth became better and better because of broken Baton Pass mechanics.
But even if we ignore that, there is still Quiver Dance since Gen 5. There is also Tinted Lens because Wonder Skin is not appealing without Baton Pass.
As for in-game, I have never used Venomoth in-game. Of the top of my head, I don't even know where you can catch it outside of Generation 1. Probably in the bug catching contest in Generation 2... Now I think about it, I am pretty certain and I usually made sure I got a Scyther or Pinsir because of that Sun Stone I needed. Oh, and the remakes.
I should probably use a the one I recently breed in my next Diamond run to see if it performs better than E-Vire.

 

[Samtendo09]

Good lord I didn't think anyone would genuinely take that to mean I was implying Wigglytuff became some fearsome gamebreaker because it's Normal as well as Fairy. Literally all I said was it had a niche when compared to Clefable. "Some form of a niche" in fact were my actual words.

It's almost like that was a flippant throwaway post that didn't warrant serious analysis!

It's really just comparison, not saying Wigglytuff is completely useless, just something I wouldn't expect to be useful at late-game unlike Clefable, who got access to powerful Abilities to compensate average stats. Ghost-type immunity would come in handy against Ghost specialists, so there is that.

Sorry if this comes off as harsh, but do keep in mind that the niche itself can only get one so far before it falls flat. The Jigglypuff line as a whole is also a victim of power creep over time. They are decent in Gen 1, but fall flat quickly since Gen 2, especially with how little the BST difference is between Igglybuff and Jigglypuff - a mere 60 BST raise! - and that play a part of why Igglybuff became one of the most disliked Baby Pokémon, if not the most disliked, period.

Now, about the Normal / Fairy it gets, that sure will make the Guildmaster much tougher in the possible remake of Explorers of Time / Darkness / Sky. You want some good Steel-type / Poison-type coverage to defeat the Master of All Things Bad as well!

 

[Chadlad50]

Venomoth is probably the most overlooked example. Generation 1 is a terrible gen for bug types, but since Gen 4 Venomoth became better and better because of broken Baton Pass mechanics.
But even if we ignore that, there is still Quiver Dance since Gen 5. There is also Tinted Lens because Wonder Skin is not appealing without Baton Pass.
As for in-game, I have never used Venomoth in-game. Of the top of my head, I don't even know where you can catch it outside of Generation 1. Probably in the bug catching contest in Generation 2... Now I think about it, I am pretty certain and I usually made sure I got a Scyther or Pinsir because of that Sun Stone I needed. Oh, and the remakes.
I should probably use a the one I recently breed in my next Diamond run to see if it performs better than E-Vire.

Venomoth honestly never lets me down in Random battles, a pretty nice moth, although setup sweepers tend to be a lot stronger in Randbats

 

[Chadlad50]

Venomoth honestly never lets me down in Random battles, a pretty nice moth, although setup sweepers tend to be a lot stronger in Randbats

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7randombattle-1394712103-a88juyca9ibroad7bb8sv5bar9ot6txpw

Case in point

 

[khlaylav]

Beedrill was honestly terrible in Generation 1. Both in-game as well as competitive.

It has seen some niche in Gen 4 thanks to Toxic Spikes, but the main games that made it worth using is Generation 6 and 7 simply because of it's mega evolution.

Venomoth is probably the most overlooked example. Generation 1 is a terrible gen for bug types, but since Gen 4 Venomoth became better and better because of broken Baton Pass mechanics.
But even if we ignore that, there is still Quiver Dance since Gen 5. There is also Tinted Lens because Wonder Skin is not appealing without Baton Pass.
As for in-game, I have never used Venomoth in-game. Of the top of my head, I don't even know where you can catch it outside of Generation 1. Probably in the bug catching contest in Generation 2... Now I think about it, I am pretty certain and I usually made sure I got a Scyther or Pinsir because of that Sun Stone I needed. Oh, and the remakes.
I should probably use a the one I recently breed in my next Diamond run to see if it performs better than E-Vire.

I watch a lot of Hardcore Nuzlockes on YouTube, and it's funny how a good chunk of the strategy for places like the E4 for certain ones have been "Give Venomoth Choice Specs and get out of the way." It just seems to outperform its stats and I'm going to use one in HeartGold soon.

 

[mertyville]

I won't argue in-game since i never used Koofing-line ingame, but in terms of competitive I think we can all agree that Gen 3 and perhaps Gen 4 Weezing was good while Gen 1 was disappointing.
Levitate really helped. It was only weak to Psychic, spread Will-O-Wisp and cold stopped some prominent physical Attackers. Also offensively you got some neat options which include Fire Blast, Thunderbolt and Sludge Bomb. Obviously Explosion before Gen 5 was always a thing. But at least this time you could get it off.
I don't play Gen 8 so I can't speak for it, but to me Gen 3 was the peak of Weezing from my experience.

 

[Celever]

Yeah, Dunsparce. There aren't many 1% encounters in Johto, but Dunsparce gets the disrespect of being one, in an optional area at that. And it is never used by a notable trainer (or... any trainer? I don't remember it once) so you could play the entirety of Johto without seeing one, and actually most players would. It's not in Hoenn or XD either, but is a Shadow Pokémon in Colosseum at least. It's shunned in Sinnoh too, and is postgame in BW. But from there, things change for the little guy.

Its best showing is in B2W2, in my opinion. It's a 10% encounter in Rustling Grass so it's a little obscure, but not only is it available in the 2nd and 3rd areas you come across in the game, but it's also used on the second route by a trainer, and an arbitrarily difficult trainer at that with Defense Curl and Rollout as a combo. Plus, Cheren is hard, and going to one of those routes to Audino train is reasonable, meaning it's probable that you'll suddenly encounter a Dunsparce while doing so. It's also available in a bunch of other routes. I kind of think Cheren using an Audino and a Dunsparce at a lower level would've been awesome, but hey he's fine as is.

It gets similar treatment in XY as a Route 3 encounter, and in USUM as a Route 2 encounter, too. It's only ever really been available in the earlygame, but it's been much more accessible with the removal of 1% encounters and these being compulsory routes.

 

[R_N]

Yeah, Dunsparce. There aren't many 1% encounters in Johto, but Dunsparce gets the disrespect of being one, in an optional area at that. And it is never used by a notable trainer (or... any trainer? I don't remember it once) so you could play the entirety of Johto without seeing one, and actually most players would. It's not in Hoenn or XD either, but is a Shadow Pokémon in Colosseum at least. It's shunned in Sinnoh too, and is postgame in BW. But from there, things change for the little guy.

Its best showing is in B2W2, in my opinion. It's a 10% encounter in Rustling Grass so it's a little obscure, but not only is it available in the 2nd and 3rd areas you come across in the game, but it's also used on the second route by a trainer, and an arbitrarily difficult trainer at that with Defense Curl and Rollout as a combo. Plus, Cheren is hard, and going to one of those routes to Audino train is reasonable, meaning it's probable that you'll suddenly encounter a Dunsparce while doing so. It's also available in a bunch of other routes. I kind of think Cheren using an Audino and a Dunsparce at a lower level would've been awesome, but hey he's fine as is.

It gets similar treatment in XY as a Route 3 encounter, and in USUM as a Route 2 encounter, too. It's only ever really been available in the earlygame, but it's been much more accessible with the removal of 1% encounters and these being compulsory routes.

iirc the hiker who uses the Dunsparce and basically acts as a another boss battle is one you have to fight to continue to the next routes and won't fight you until you beat cheren. So it's a surprising amount of pomp & circumstance for a rando trainer, which gives it some extra notability which is nice.


Though, I do not believe you can encounter Audino or Dunsparce until beating Cheren: shaking grass is disabled until the first badge in both BW1 & 2 iirc. In that sense I think the hiker's dunsparce kind of forces you to keep an eye out for shaking grass if you want one.

 

[Yung Dramps]

Pokemon Presents spoilers just in case

powergo1 already touched upon this in the other thread, but good lord man. It's not even just about Stantler getting an evolution at all, if that was the case every Pokemon that got an evo in Gen 2 or 4 could qualify for this thread, but moreso how Wyrdeer has been essentially positioned as one of the posterchildren of Pokemon's big foray into open world design by
-Being a rideable Pokemon
-Being revered and respected by the people of Hisui
-Having a metric shitton of shots of it gracefully prancing through this ancient, vibrant world, a harbinger of a whole new era for this franchise

Lemme tell ya, after being buried in the Johto dex, condemned to mediocrity in its home generation and further sentenced to 22 years of neglect, it is downright surreal to see shots like this being used to present an evolutionary relative, especially one which is quite similar-looking for cross-gen evo standards.

 

[Samtendo09]

Moar Pokémon Present Spoilerz

There isn’t just the one mentioned in previous post though, there’s also… this fish and its blue-striped variant.


Remember Basculin? A “generic fish” that GF forced it into Unova whose gimmick is having two nearly-interchangeable variants?

Despite being in Sword and Shield, they are not getting better among the servicable if ultimately mediocre and forgettable single-stage Pokémon. And yet, that doesn’t means Generation 8 as a whole isn‘t kind to it.

Meet Basculegion, Water / Ghost evolution of Basculin found in Hisui. This creature is metal, being possessed by his fallen comrades of the upstream rivers! It is also the featured “surf” replacement in Legends: Arceus second trailer. This creature got more visits on its Serebii page than Wyrdeer to boot, and received a lot praise from dark backstory and design, too!

Whether or not this is a traditional evolution only found in Hisui or if Basculin in Hisui is a regional variant, one thing is for sure; even the most forgettable Pokémon can become beloved with the right tools.

Clearly, it, Wyrdeer and almost all Regional Evolutions from Galar (Perrserker is more a mixed reception) tells that Game Freak learned their lessons from the Gen 4 initial severely polarizing reception towards most Gen 4 cross-gen evos. And regional or not, I’m all for discovering more evolutions of overshadowed, forgotten or forgettable Pokémon!

 

[bdt2002]

Didn't think I'd be back here so early. Here's some more Pokemon that I'd consider for this list.

1. Rowlet, Cyndaquil, & Oshawott



These three shouldn't be too hard to explain. I am of course referring to Pokémon Legends Arceus here and how these three were chosen as the starter Pokémon. Interestingly, I think there's more reason these three specifically were chosen on top of their evolutions representing medieval Japan. Notice the regions they're from: Johto, Unova, and Alola. Those are three of the regions whose starters aren't supported in the base game of Sword & Shield, although Alola's starters did get added in the DLC eventually. Those three regions are also the second ones of their respective hardware. Johto was the second GB/GBC region, Unova was the second DS region, and Alola was the second 3DS region. Between them, they probably mixed and matched the most popular of each type into a fresh trio.

2. Aerodactyl



This is another case of a Pokémon added in a previous generation that got a lot of love over time. Aerodactyl was part of the original 151 from Kanto, but didn't see any sort of spotlight outside of its signature Old Amber and a spot on Lance's Elite Four team. But as time went on, Aerodactyl got more and more representation.

Gen 2: Lance is the Champion now, and Aero as a whole was buffed. It's also one of two revived prehistoric mons seen in the Lati@s movie.
Gen 3: Aerodactyl became top tier in this generation through a large list of indirect buffs (Choice Band, Sand Stream T-Tar, etc.)
Gen 4: The physical-special split gave it some awesome coverage moves
Gen 6: Aerodactyl got itself a Mega Evolution
Gen 7: The Mega Evolution speed mechanic changes benefitted Aero, and it was also obtainable as a gift for the first time not requiring a fossil

 

[Nokocchi]

Gen 7: The Mega Evolution speed mechanic changes benefitted Aero, and it was also obtainable as a gift for the first time not requiring a fossil

In Gen II there was an in-game trade to get an Aerodactyl named Aeroy in return for a Chansey. No fossil needed, and it was the only fossil obtainable in Gen II without trading with Gen I.

For some reason, said in-game trade was not present in HGSS, despite all of the others from Crystal version being in them(the Gold and Silver exclusive Trade mons, Don the Rhydon and Runny the Rapidash, were replaced with the ones from Crystal, Doris the Dodrio and Maggie the Magneton)

 

[bdt2002]

In Gen II there was an in-game trade to get an Aerodactyl named Aeroy in return for a Chansey. No fossil needed, and it was the only fossil obtainable in Gen II without trading with Gen I.

For some reason, said in-game trade was not present in HGSS, despite all of the others from Crystal version being in them(the Gold and Silver exclusive Trade mons, Don the Rhydon and Runny the Rapidash, were replaced with the ones from Crystal, Doris the Dodrio and Maggie the Magneton)

Huh. I actually didn’t know that. Neat!

 

[Pikachu315111]

In Gen II there was an in-game trade to get an Aerodactyl named Aeroy in return for a Chansey. No fossil needed, and it was the only fossil obtainable in Gen II without trading with Gen I.

For some reason, said in-game trade was not present in HGSS, despite all of the others from Crystal version being in them

Probably because you can get Old Ambers in HGSS by smashing the rocks in the Ruins of Alph.

 

[Nokocchi]

Probably because you can get Old Ambers in HGSS by smashing the rocks in the Ruins of Alph.

I don't see how that should be a good enough reason, looking at some of the other in-game trades in the game.

 

[Aduro]

Marill and Togepi were both huge in Gen I because they were teasers for Gen II. Togepi had quite a big role in the Orange League anime, and there were absolutely tons of theories about 'pikablu'.

 

[bdt2002]

Hey there, everyone. In the off chance this thread sees a sudden increase in popularity, I can help explain the reason why. Basically, I wanted to make my own thread about a very similar topic, but only just realized after it went live that I probably should have just posted here instead. The full details can be found on my own thread, but for now I'll just get back to actually posting.



There's a lot of Pokémon on that list, but they actually all have something in common. Can you guess what it is? If you guessed that they all had locations named after or inspired by them, you were right. A select few of these, moreso in earlier Generations, are actually from spin-off games as a matter of fact. For the purpose of this specific thread, I'd like to primarily focus on four of those 10 Pokémon, being Bellsprout, Slowpoke, Zubat, and Alolan Diglett.

Let's start with Bellsprout and Slowpoke and then go in order for the others. These two each have their own little place in the Johto region, being the Sprout Tower and the Slowpoke Well respectively. Despite both being Kanto-native Pokémon, each of them was more prominently featured in various elements of the games. Bellsprout was notably no longer a version exclusive Pokémon like it was in RBY and not only appeared earlier in the game than its old counterpart Oddish (which had since gone off to do its own thing with its new evolution into Bellossom) but was also used by many more NPCs than the Oddish family was from what I can remember. The Sprout Tower actually becomes a required area to visit iun HeartGold & SoulSilver, and to top this list off, even Erika's still repping that Victreebel of hers in the Kanto-based postgame of GSC and the remakes, even going as far as to make Bellossom her ace in those specific Gym battles instead of Vileplume. Slowpoke is also not a version exclusive anymore in GSC, and got a brand new split evolution of its own in the form of Slowking. Alongside the new, obscure "SlowpokeTail" item available exclusively in the Generation 2 games, the new Elite 4 member Will also uses a Slowbro on his team which in my opinion he should have had Slowking instead since it was new or maybe both of the same team but whatever. Finally, the Slowpoke family is also used by more NPCs in GSC/HGSS than it was in RBY/FRLG, again from what I'm able to remember.

Next up on the list is Zubat, specifically in Generation 6 and Kalos. The area that comes to mind isn't quite as obvious as some of the others I'll be going over. The "Connecting Cave" nearby Route 8 in the Kalos region is also referred to as the "Zubat Roost", believe it or not. Admittedly, since Zubat is featured so much in almost every game outside of Black & White 1 and Sword & Shield's base game (that is, no DLC packs), there isn't too much standing out for Zubat to do in Kalos. For what it's worth though, Zubat did get a new psuedo-clone this Generation in the form of Noibat, and the Poison/Flying type combination did receive some pretty excellent buffs in Gen 6, including a positive matchup against the new Fairy-Types, the buff to Defog helping with Stealth Rock, and actually being available in the first place unlike in the base games of the previous Generation. There's also just as many NPCs who like to spam this Pokémon as in other games, just to be safe.

Finally, we have Diglett in Generation 7 and Alola. This one is pretty self explanatory given Diglett's Alolan form and the two regions that are featured in Generation 7 games, being- you guessed it- Alola and Kanto. The Diglett's Tunnel in Alola is essentially just Diglett's Cave 2.0, and Gen 7 Alola was also the Generation where Diglett's evolution line received more buffs for the first time since the last Kanto games at the time, being FireRed & LeafGreen. This section is pretty short just like Diglett's height because I'd rather not state the obvious over and over again.

 

[MrHands]

Mawile. Holy shit. Went from unused / rule 34 bait to one of the most powerful Pokemon in the game once it got a Mega. Banned in gen 6, overwhelming presence in gen 7. Completely forgotten gens 3-5 other than some minor Baton Pass niche. Ignored in gen 8 again.

Bring back Megas Gamefreak you cowards.

 

[DrPumpkinz]

rule 34 bait

I'm sorry what the fuck

 

[Pikachu315111]

Finally, we have Diglett in Generation 7 and Alola.

Forget Alolan Diglett in Gen 7, I think the prominent Alolan Diglett experience is Gen 8 on the Isle of Armor... that freakin' desert...

Mawile. Holy shit. Went from unused / rule 34 bait

I'm sorry what the fuck

Gotta agree, what? Most people's initial experience with Mawile is this:

I wouldn't be surprised if some people didn't realize they were looking Mawile from behind and just thought it was this weird yellow & black venus flytrap with hands and eyes (you know people don't read the Pokedex) that was for some reason pure Steel. Many probably wouldn't know it was just a small humanoid creature with a jaw-like horn until likely the anime episode it was featured in or the Colosseum games.

 

[R_N]

It is a femine anime girl monster of course it had rule 34 weirdos about it, it only takes a small amount of certain people to get something like that going

I saw enough "normal" art that emphasized its cuteness to know exactly what that critter gets up to.

 

[ScraftyIsTheBest]

I wouldn't be surprised if some people didn't realize they were looking Mawile from behind and just thought it was this weird yellow & black venus flytrap with hands and eyes (you know people don't read the Pokedex) that was for some reason pure Steel. Many probably wouldn't know it was just a small humanoid creature with a jaw-like horn until likely the anime episode it was featured in or the Colosseum games.

This is basically my experience with Mawile as a Pokemon. I literally had no idea it was a small little gremlin with a cute face and when I first saw it I thought it was basically a pair of jaws and that that was its face, and that the jaws were attached to some yellow body. I didn't actually get to read a Pokedex for Mawile at all at first because the game I first saw it in was Sapphire, in which it is flat out unavailable as Sableye appears in the places it shows up in in Sapphire where Mawile would in Ruby. Even after I read the Pokedex entries I still didn't realize Mawile was a small little humanoid cute gremlin and it wasn't until I saw Mawile's back sprite (where you can see its face) and especially the anime showing it off that I finally realized what exactly Mawile was supposed to be.

For the record, I had similar confusion about Mawile's counterpart Sableye, albeit in a different manner. In that case, I didn't realize Sableye had a mouth because it looked like it had no mouth in its sprites, until the anime showed it with a spiky-toothed mouth and Sableye just looked a lot more expressive in the anime than in the games.

I was a pretty dumb and naive kid back in the day, haha. I will say that even back in the Gen 3-5 days Mawile and Sableye had quite a bit of a cult following among fans, even if they were horrible in battle.

 

[Celever]

If I may be so bold, I would honestly hypothesise that Mawile and Sableye were identified during development as having poor spritework and that's why they were made version exclusives. I feel that both are iconic designs in their own rights -- in particular because they're two of the most original Pokémon designs out there -- but I think the devs struggled to deliver the concept behind those designs on a GBA screen. Especially where both were so rare, especially Mawile where Aron existed in the same area as a much stronger Steel-Type choice, in a generation where they were rare.

It's a couple of few designs where I think the concept trumped the execution, and they ran with it anyway. We know from mining that there are a bunch of designs that get scrapped every generation, and I like that these were put in the games despite the lack of execution. That Mawile's focus is on its jaw, and that Sableye seems to not have a mouth or be particularly functional in any way, is a perception that hasn't existed in a decade, and I think that's wonderful and shows that it paid off.

Mawile and Sableye were both odd choices to get megas, some of the oddest choices out there. I honestly think this is something that has existed withing Game Freak for a while, and once megas were introduced as a concept there were designers that wanted a do-over and execute the concepts better than before. IMO it worked. But even beyond that, I think it's particularly interesting that in XD both Pokémon were introduced as options for the team via being Shadow Pokémon. This is a game that introduced many more Hoenn options than Colosseum did, but it still wasn't plentiful, and so it's notable that they were chosen as options.

I love both though; I have a Sableye plushy sitting in my kitchen over a hanging "Living the Dream" sign that one of my housemates bought. For me, they're some of the most unique and interesting Pokémon designs out there.

[This has absolutely nothing to do with the thread matter, I just think both are cool Pokémon and they're worth discussing in this way. Particularly since I don't think either have a place here regardless -- even in Gen VI where their megas were introduced, both were intensely unavailable in XY.]

 

[DrPumpkinz]

For the record, I had similar confusion about Mawile's counterpart Sableye, albeit in a different manner. In that case, I didn't realize Sableye had a mouth because it looked like it had no mouth in its sprites, until the anime showed it with a spiky-toothed mouth and Sableye just looked a lot more expressive in the anime than in the games.

Mawile is mistaken as a mouth without a face and Sableye is mistaken as a face without a mouth. It all makes sense now.