Pokemon that disappointed you in-game despite looking good initially?

Plague von Karma

Banned deucer.
:rb/golbat:
Y'know this sprite really isn't that bad. Bring back the silly tongue.

So leaks have shown that the Golbat line was originally three-stage, with Golbat being the final one. Not gonna lie, that's fucking tragic.

With 21 moves - like 15 if you take off the "generic" moves they give every Pokemon - RBY Golbat is one of the worst things Game Freak ever made. It's so awful that you can hardly make a moveset for it; Screech + Hyper Beam is about the best it can achieve, and boy is it an underachiever. It has quite literally zero STAB outside of 35 BP Wing Attack, and its coverage doesn't fare much better when it's relying on Leech Life and Mega Drain...couple that with stats that would only make Lickitung jealous, and all you can utter is "what the fuck happened?".

I feel sorry for anyone who caught one of the billions of Zubats in Mt. Moon and thought that admittedly really cool looking bat was usable. I would say no Pokemon deserves an entrance like Golbat's, but I don't think I'd call it that...it feels more like a fart in the wind if you ask me. Golbat is a Gen 5 Pokemon, and I won't be taking questions from the Sinnoh lovers who have been gaslit by me saying that.

All I can come up with is that Golbat was re-balanced once the Zubat pre-evolution was removed, and when they removed half the Poison-type moves (which apparently happened?) they just forgot about it. Needless to say, anyone would have scrambled to make Crobat had they saw RBY Golbat. This did turn out to help in the end though, considering Golbat stonks skyrocketed when Eviolite dropped. Funny how that happens.
 

The Mind Electric

Calming if you look at it right.
:rb/golbat:
Y'know this sprite really isn't that bad. Bring back the silly tongue.

So leaks have shown that the Golbat line was originally three-stage, with Golbat being the final one. Not gonna lie, that's fucking tragic.

With 21 moves - like 15 if you take off the "generic" moves they give every Pokemon - RBY Golbat is one of the worst things Game Freak ever made. It's so awful that you can hardly make a moveset for it; Screech + Hyper Beam is about the best it can achieve, and boy is it an underachiever. It has quite literally zero STAB outside of 35 BP Wing Attack, and its coverage doesn't fare much better when it's relying on Leech Life and Mega Drain...couple that with stats that would only make Lickitung jealous, and all you can utter is "what the fuck happened?".

I feel sorry for anyone who caught one of the billions of Zubats in Mt. Moon and thought that admittedly really cool looking bat was usable. I would say no Pokemon deserves an entrance like Golbat's, but I don't think I'd call it that...it feels more like a fart in the wind if you ask me. Golbat is a Gen 5 Pokemon, and I won't be taking questions from the Sinnoh lovers who have been gaslit by me saying that.

All I can come up with is that Golbat was re-balanced once the Zubat pre-evolution was removed, and when they removed half the Poison-type moves (which apparently happened?) they just forgot about it. Needless to say, anyone would have scrambled to make Crobat had they saw RBY Golbat. This did turn out to help in the end though, considering Golbat stonks skyrocketed when Eviolite dropped. Funny how that happens.
Maybe that's the reason why Golbat's mouth is always open. It's constantly screaming in agony due to how much it sucks.

I find myself wondering about that scrapped Zubat pre-evolution. Is there any guarantee that Golbat had better stats/moves before the removal of the pre-evolution? What if the devs looked at Golbat and decided that it was only good enough to be a second-stage evolution? If that's the case, at least we got Crobat later.
 

Plague von Karma

Banned deucer.
What if the devs looked at Golbat and decided that it was only good enough to be a second-stage evolution?
They didn't just look at Golbat and decide that, they also decided that it didn't deserve rights and made it Poison/Flying with nothing to show for it. While a good decent typing nowadays, back then it was the equivalent of euthanasia...which is what Golbat really needed, to be honest.

There's no guarantee that it was better before release, but wishful thinking is all you can have with this poor bastard.
 
Bluzuk
Omot

So this Pokemon wasn't meant to be caught in DP, but I decided to try out my good iv for Gen 4 Standards Venonat in my playthrough fully EV trained. And uh... it's a pain to use this thing. It gets OHKOed by Bonsy and Confusion nor Psybeam do enough on non-Super Effective Targets.
After it evolved and didn't do shit since I beat the 6th gym, I decided to return it to Platinum.
The main intention for me to use it in Diamond was mainly because I want to grind some Pokemon but it is a pain just leveling in the same locations. And since I want some of that sweet Stealth Rock TMs, I decided to use it there.
Right now I replaced it with Mamoswine and that thing does massive work because of EQ and Ice Shard Coverage. But to be fair, I could have taught Venonat Psychic and Sludge Bomb from the start and things could work out differently.

That reminds me on another Pokemon that I have a better experience now because of Egg moves, but was awful when I used it with the things it had naturally
Skuntank

So Night Slash always missed on the KOes and Flamethrower non-STAB just doesn't get the job done. But the one I use with Crunch alone puts more work (probably because that is EV trained for Attack and has 252 in Atk as well)
 
Pointless

Having little or no sense, use, or purpose.



Gen 4's my favorite generation and, frankly, I love pretty much every Pokemon introduced in this generation. Magmortar's cool with the big fuck-off arm cannons and being a mixed attacker with a specialization in Special moves, Staraptor and Garchomp's designs are slick and useful mons in any run of DPP, the Starters are all interesting and unique in their own right, and Rhyperior's a giant nuke...until you use Surf but don't sink my dreams and my poor big rock kaiju...
But take a stroll into the nice port city of Canalave and a hop on your mighty Gyarados, regal Empoleon or your poor poor Rhydon, you'll notice something odd in the water...

It's this fucking thing...
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Finneon. Alright, well, it's quite adorable plus it learns decent to great moves like Water Pulse and Ice Beam but the rest of it's moves aren't exactly good...what stats does it have?
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Oh...well, I'm not a stranger to raising Pokemon with bad stats. I mean, Duskull's aren't great either and it becomes a pretty alright tank (despite it's awful HP...) once fully evolved or the legendary Magikarp which becomes a monster only rivalled by Garchomp. Surely you shall be rewarded by Junuichi Masuda-san himself with a great Pokemon. I mean, Feebas from the generation prior to this becomes Milotic, a spectacular physically and specially defensive wall.

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Ok, Lumineon? It's got a very nice design. So far so good. What is it's Learnset?
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Ahh. Well, maybe it has good coverage through TM?
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Err...Stats it is...?
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...O-oh...Why the fuck does this thing exist? Just...why?
Even better question, why is it not available earlier?! You can catch it at Route 205 which wouldn't be bad(?) If you NEEDED a Water type but there's two issues with that. For one, you need the Good Rod which you get it at Hearthome and, secondly, you can get 2 even BETTER Water types right there! Buizel and Shellos are available right there if you didn't pick Piplup. Hell, even Magikarp is a better choice because it at least evolves to Gyarados. Anything is a much better choice. Every single Water type in the Platinum Sinnohdex does whatever job you could give it so so much better.
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Floatzel, Seaking, and Gyarados are your picks for Physical Attackers. I don't know what else to say here. They're pretty solid for a playthrough.


Want a Utility Pokemon?

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Quagsire is surprisingly decent with Yawn, Rain Dance, Toxic, and (as average as it's stats are) it's typing is fantastic plus it has Water Absorb which allows it to switch in safely if, say, you're doing a Ground Mono.

Walls?
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Tentacruel, Milotic, Empoleon are very solid choices as they specialize in Special Defense and have some good movepools plus Tent and Emp have great defensive typings so they may serve you well.
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Pelipper could do good by you as a Physically Defensive mon. With a surprising 100 base Defense, decent 85 Special Attack and 70 Special Defense and moves like Surf, Hydro Pump, Tailwind, and even Roost by level up and by TM Shock Wave, U-Turn, Ice Beam, Blizzard and, of course, Toxic.

Tanks?
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Whiscash and Vaporeon are pretty good. Massive HP stats on both but with some differences. Whiscash will be more on the Physical side (110 base HP with the rest being around the 70s with the exception of Speed at 60) and Vaporeon solidly on the Special side with it's 110 base Spec. Attack and 95 base Special Defense. Whiscash can learn Earthquake, Amnesia, Rest, Snore and Aqua Tail through level up with Stone Edge being the only move of note outside of the usual song and dance of "Surf and Waterfall). Vaporeon? You're not getting Hydro Pump nor Muddy Water lmao. Both are at level 71 and 78 respectively. Welcome to Gen 4. But don't worry, TMs are pretty good on Vaporeon as it can get Shadow Ball, Surf,

Want oddballs to use? Well, we have four!
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Azumarill's pretty unique. it has a 100 base HP stat while having awful offensive stats (both at 50) and both defensive stats are, imo, mediocre (both 80) with Huge Power and Thick Fat as possible abilities, a unique Normal/Water typing and learns some neat TM moves like Iron Tail, Focus Punch, and Brick Break. Not to mention, it can learn Ice Punch through the Route 212 move tutor.
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Mantine is another interesting pick as it is somewhat similar to Skarmory except it's biggest defensive stat is Special Defense at 140, a Water /Flying typing, and 80 base Special Attack. It can learn Psybeam, Confuse Ray, Signal Beam, and Hydro Pump at (Lv. 49, no less) through level up while the TM side of things aren't too great...but hey. It can learn Surf and Ice Beam at least.
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Golduck is, probably, my favorite of the three as it's stats are well-rounded but it has more of a specialization (pun not intended) in Special moves with Hydro Pump, Zen Headbutt and Aqua Jet being it's most notable moves through level up. TMs? Well, I'd say it's...quite good actually. Calm Mind, Ice Beam, Blizzard, Surf, Psychic, Brick Break, Iron Tail, Shadow Claw and some other moves. Pretty good coverage overall, imo.
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Octillery has great attack stats (105 on both) and 75 on everything defensive including HP with an awful speed at base 45. It learns some good moves on level up alone: Gunk Shot, Ice Beam, Signal Beam and Hydro Pump. Octazooka is kinda good with it's 50% to lower Accuracy. You have better options for stabs but it's an option for some utility. TMs is where it truly shines with Flamethrower, Psychic, Energy Ball, Sludge Bomb, Charge Beam, Flash Cannon, along with the usual Ice Beam and Surf.


The only thing comparable in uselessness in battle is probably Bibarel...however, this is Sinnoh we're talking about.
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The place that lives and breathes HMs so hard that GameFreak realized "We fucked up" and made HMs more bearable in HGSS and put them on the way side in the next generations. Bibarel learns Cut, Surf, Waterfall, Strength, Rock Smash, and Rock Climb but not Fly and Defog which brings us to 6 out of the 8 HMs. Lumineon pales in comparison with, as you may have noticed, only Surf, Waterfall and Defog.
Even then, you get Bidoof since the very start of your journey just in the tall grass near Twinleaf Town waiting for you and it evolves at level 15 with pretty decent stats for the early game and it learns Rollout (Lv. 13, even as a Bidoof), Headbutt (Lv. 18) and Hyper Fang (Lv. 23) through level up.

Finneon and Lumineon are just pointless and it's hard for me to say this without it sounding like I'm exaggerating. If Finneon/Lumineon were to be a Fighting Game character, the closest comparison I can make is probably Dan Hibiki from the Street Fighter series...before Street Fighter 4 but even Dan has a reason to exist unlike Lumineon. It really really sucks because I genuinely like it's design but it's just so useless and doesn't really have anything unique to it.
 

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Oh shoot, we've topped 20 pages, let's talk about the scourge of BW1. The Unova mon I personally hate the most.

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Yep, that's right, it's Cottonee! Exclusive to Black version (but not really because of the trade in White), if you go for Eli here you get something worse than useless.

"Oh come on, it can't be that bad, can it? It's got some unique support moves!"

Buddy, I got some bad news for you. Man these stats are awful:

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Cottonee has literallty the worst earlygame offense you can get on a Unova Pokemon (based off their relevant attacking stat). I mean for Trubbish's sake Snivy hits harder. Patrat hits almost as hard with its Special Attack (literally 35 base, not kidding). There is accepting defeat and then there is accepting Cottonee, both of which are inevitable (so you can trade it for Petilil in Black version).

"But it's got good bulk!"

Yeah, you know what's got better bulk? The Pokemon literally weak to more things than my self-esteem:


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Yeah. Even Sewaddle with like five billion weaknesses has better bulk than this thing AND hits harder with special attacks. The movepool is about as bad as making the big brain play of using a Poison type in Generation 1.

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Leech Seed is literally the only thing you want this mon for. I can't believe I'm saying this, but even SERPERIOR is better at support than this. Heck, let's compare the other Grass types:

-Snivy: Both screens (Whimsicott doesn't get Reflect, only Light Screen), almost as fast, superior defenses, Coil access
-Pansage: Better mixed offenses, wide movepool, evolves two lightyears ahead of Cottonee.
-Sewaddle: dies if something blinks at it the wrong way, but has Swords Dance (and is cuter)
-Petilil: Outclasses Cottonee no matter what at offense, Quiver Dance AND gets Leech Seed too if you really wanna use it for that.
-Foongus: Better type, better ability for in-game, sure you'll never get Spore but at least you'll stay alive for more than 2 turns after being sent out
-Deerling: Crazy type coverage, physical Giga Drain in Horn Leech, great Attack and Speed alternative to Leavanny, also S tier cute
-Maractus: You know you're bad when you're outclassed by this thing. Actually usable 106 Special Attack (only 4 points off Lilligant!), also gets Petal Dance and Giga Drain.
-Ferroseed: Absolutely craps on Cottonee's bland type, way better defensive stats, and is slower than me getting out of bed in the morning.
-Virizion: Legendary stats, nice offensive type, better bulk and Swords Dance.
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Now let's talk about that pointless Speed stat of 116 Whimsicott has. It's the fastest Grass in Unova...but they gave it Prankster so what is the POINT of giving it overkill Speed??? Oh great, I can outspeed and Giga Drain something to leave the opponent at 93% HP. Fantastic! Cotton Guard also isn't worth waiting for: Marshal crits past with Storm Throw and Stone Edge, Grimsley has Bisharp, and the other two E4 are special.

It's defensive stats are mediocre at best too. Cofagrigus aside from 2 points in HP has straight-up better bulk, Jellicent is also a better mixed wall with Will-O-Wisp, good Special Defense and an HP stat higher than a hippie on an airplane, like I would even call Alomomola a better wall just because it has the Water typing and, oh yeah, defensive stats that aren't made of paper tossed around in a Hurricane. That's right this thing is friggin' more threatening:

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Above: FEAR IT!

But seriously, don't use Cottonee. Not now, not ever. Please. If there was one thing I could change about the Pokemon Black and White In-Game Tier List today, it would be throwing this thing in E where it belonged with Trubbish, and yes I mean it.
 
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ScraftyIsTheBest

On to new Horizons!
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Cottonee is still worth catching in Black imo if only because of the in-game trade. Petilil is already very good on virtue of evolving into an absolutely amazing Pokemon in Lilligant (who is both strong and pretty which is all the better) and getting the traded one in Black is even better because it has a pre-set Modest nature, reasonably good IVs across the board, and gets boosted EXP on virtue of being a traded mon.

Granted, I haven't actually used Whimsicott itself in-game so I cannot testify to Whimsicott's own in-game performance, but if there's one very good use you can get out of Cottonee, it's getting a traded Petilil that because of the pre-set conditions is even better than a Petilil that you have to catch in White.
 

The Mind Electric

Calming if you look at it right.
Cottonee is still worth catching in Black imo if only because of the in-game trade. Petilil is already very good on virtue of evolving into an absolutely amazing Pokemon in Lilligant (who is both strong and pretty which is all the better) and getting the traded one in Black is even better because it has a pre-set Modest nature, reasonably good IVs across the board, and gets boosted EXP on virtue of being a traded mon.

Granted, I haven't actually used Whimsicott itself in-game so I cannot testify to Whimsicott's own in-game performance, but if there's one very good use you can get out of Cottonee, it's getting a traded Petilil that because of the pre-set conditions is even better than a Petilil that you have to catch in White.
Still, if the best thing that can be said about a Pokémon is that you can trade it for a vastly superior Pokémon, that's pretty dire. Also means there's even less reason to catch one in the games where this trade is unavailable.
 
I used Cottonee/Whimsicott in an ORAS hard mode hack (their stats weren't changed though).... it hit like a wet noodle. Especially Cottonee. I can affirm that they're not that good.
 
Finneon and Lumineon are just pointless and it's hard for me to say this without it sounding like I'm exaggerating. If Finneon/Lumineon were to be a Fighting Game character, the closest comparison I can make is probably Dan Hibiki from the Street Fighter series...before Street Fighter 4 but even Dan has a reason to exist unlike Lumineon. It really really sucks because I genuinely like it's design but it's just so useless and doesn't really have anything unique to it.
Something Finneon and Lumineon could really use is Quiver Dance. Finneon’s Dex entries all talk about how it’s tail moves like a butterfly, so I’d have expected them to get it by now... really severe neglect on GF’s part. Hopefully that’s rectified in BDSP.
 
A few months ago I did a playthrough of FireRed and I was surprised at how atrocious Rapidash is. In FRLG it appears quite late into the game, only during the first Sevii Islands, after the 7th Gym, making it, for Kanto standards, one of the very last Pokémon you're able to obtain.

And even when you do obtain one for your team, all you get is a generic Fire-Type with pretty mediocre stats aside from Speed. You have pretty much no reason to use it over Arcanine, Ninetales or even Flareon honestly, but the worst part is just how useless it is by that point of the game.

If you did beat all pre-Blaine Gyms, all you have left is Giovanni, which Rapidash is obviously terrible against. If you didn't, you still have to deal with Kanto's late-game water routes. Even after all that, the Victory Road is full of wild Rock-Types, so you're not encouraged to leave Rapidash in the front of the party, and the Elite 4 just destroys the poor thing, with Bruno's Rock coverage, Blue's Water-Types and Rhydon, Lance's Fire-resistant Dragons and Lorelei's everything.

At least most other Fire-Types (aside from Magmar) are found around the mid-game, so they can be used for Erika and Kanto's mid-game trainers, a lot of which having Grass and Bug-Types. But Rapidash is found so late that by that point it's complete dead weight.
 
SwSh gave us the absolute nonsense of HA Alolan Starters for literally dodging things in the IoA and finding Diglett. Naturally, I tried one out.

And lo and behold, what do I get? Liquid Voice Popplio. Sounds really cool on paper, but why?

Surf is one of the most annoying TRs to get early-game (I swear, these dens only give me Waterfall for some reason.) Hyper Voice on the other hand? Very easy. Hits both targets in Doubles and there's quite a bit of them because of Team Yell. Icy Wind to alleviate the speed issues naturally too.

So what's the catch?

Brionne isn't actually a Fairy-type. Definitely wasn't expecting that. It also doesn't really learn a lot of Fairy moves. But the real problem is Speed.

It's very, very bad in that regard, if you think something will outspeed it, odds are that it will. If you don't think it will, boy, do I have a surprise for you.

It's really demoralizing to have the likes of Kabu's Centiskorch outspeed and whack it with Max Flutterby. (therefore nuking your SpA.)

Hyper Voice is also not that cool when Dynamaxed, so to add insult to injury, you'll need a strong Water move anyway.

More often than not, this is my reaction to Liquid Voice instead of "Man, this ability is really useful!" Also, you lose Torrent in clutch situations.

Strongly considering dropping that tbh. Would've done it already if Single-Strike Urshifu wasn't cooler.
 
Pikachu in MD Explorers
Despite having the great utility in Agility and Discharge, both of those are learned fairly late (mid to late 30s). And while its stats are fine, the electric typing is a massive disservice. Especially in Amp Plains where Lightningrod Shinx/Electrike eats your stab
The only 2 area it's good in are Waterfall Pond (which has the aggravating quick attack Surskit), Brine Cave, and where you get the Manaphy egg. Otherwise, it mostly doesn't have a type advantage, and late game dungeons have a lot of enemies with Earth Power (which is a room ranged move)

At the very least it's not Eevee and Phanpy. Latter especially is hot garbage
 
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Something Finneon and Lumineon could really use is Quiver Dance. Finneon’s Dex entries all talk about how it’s tail moves like a butterfly, so I’d have expected them to get it by now... really severe neglect on GF’s part. Hopefully that’s rectified in BDSP.
And Lumineon has fins that are shaped like a butterfly's wings.
You two are putting too much faith in GameFreak, imo. If it took Dusknoir 4 generations to get an actually good STAB move in Poltergeist, I highly doubt they'll touch Lumineon until 4 gens from now at the very least. I really doubt Lumineon will get anything at all, I can hardly see it happening
 
You two are putting too much faith in GameFreak, imo. If it took Dusknoir 4 generations to get an actually good STAB move in Poltergeist, I highly doubt they'll touch Lumineon until 4 gens from now at the very least. I really doubt Lumineon will get anything at all, I can hardly see it happening
That's not really a Dusknoir thing, though? Every single physical Ghost-type without a signature move didn't have an "actually good STAB move" until Poltergeist.
 
Well, in that case the move didn't exist, but Quiver Dance has existed since Gen 5...
True, true. Even then, in that case, I wonder why they never touched it...although BDSP would be the perfect time for it and, who knows? Maybe my pessimism is unfounded.

That's not really a Dusknoir thing, though? Every single physical Ghost-type without a signature move didn't have an "actually good STAB move" until Poltergeist.
Tbh, it was the only Physical Ghost-type off the top of my head. Even then, other Physical Ghosts like Golurk have a 2nd typing that they could get STAB from or mons like Banette that could get Shadow Claw or, once Gen 6(?) came around, Phantom Force.
Meanwhile, Dusknoir only had Shadow Sneak (40 BP) and Shadow Punch (60 BP) for a long time for some reason.
 
for some reason
The reason why is pretty obvious, so I'm not sure why you're being so vague about it. Here's a list of every single physical Ghost move:

Astonish
Lick
Phantom Force
Poltergeist
Shadow Bone
Shadow Claw
Shadow Force
Shadow Punch
Shadow Sneak
Spectral Thief
Spirit Shackle

If we remove all the signature moves, this is what we're left with:

Astonish
Lick
Phantom Force
Poltergeist
Shadow Claw
Shadow Punch
Shadow Sneak

A very tiny list. I can't explain the lack of Phantom Force, but given its two-turn nature, it's hardly what I would call an "actually good STAB move". The best physical Ghost moves that any Pokemon could learn were Shadow Punch and Shadow Claw, and well, Dusknoir doesn't have claws. It and Dusclops's fingers are quite prominently squared off, basically the opposite of claws.

In any case, this isn't the movepool oddity thread, so it's best if this Dusknoir discussion ends now.
 
The reason why is pretty obvious, so I'm not sure why you're being so vague about it. Here's a list of every single physical Ghost move:

Astonish
Lick
Phantom Force
Poltergeist
Shadow Bone
Shadow Claw
Shadow Force
Shadow Punch
Shadow Sneak
Spectral Thief
Spirit Shackle

If we remove all the signature moves, this is what we're left with:

Astonish
Lick
Phantom Force
Poltergeist
Shadow Claw
Shadow Punch
Shadow Sneak

A very tiny list. I can't explain the lack of Phantom Force, but given its two-turn nature, it's hardly what I would call an "actually good STAB move". The best physical Ghost moves that any Pokemon could learn were Shadow Punch and Shadow Claw, and well, Dusknoir doesn't have claws. It and Dusclops's fingers are quite prominently squared off, basically the opposite of claws.

In any case, this isn't the movepool oddity thread, so it's best if this Dusknoir discussion ends now.
Oh definetly, it's more so just cause it's confusing why it can't learn Phantom Force because, from a Casual perspective, it'd at least have a strong move outside of just defaulting to Sneak.

But yeah, it's best if so.
 
Magmar

Speaking of awful fire types in-game, let's talk about Magmar in Blue.
That's it. Honestly there is nothing about Magmar worth using for. I used it simply because it was cool as a rival to Charizard in the anime.
It comes like with three moves: Ember, Confuse Ray and Leer.
You grind it up to lv43 to teach it Fire Punch... thinking about it, doesn't Vulpix learn Flamethrower at lv35 and can evolve immediately with Fire Stone in the same game?
You see, Magmar is the Fire Type that can learn the TM Psychic. So you can get rid of mean Poison Type Elite 4 member...
Fire types are just awful in Gen 1. They can be useful to get rid of bugs early on and stupid weeds, but post game you are fighting seels, dragons and giant rocks. Fire Types struggle against those or are mediocer at best.
At least Gen 2 gave him Thunderpunch and you can get him early on.

I guess that's something anyone who has 2 Gameboys can try. Teach Magmar ThunderPunch and trade it back to Pokemon Blue. Tell me how good it performs against the Elite 4.
 
Glaceon in Sword.

I know I've shilled it in another thread, so what went wrong?

Early Ice-type with legit stats, Icy Wind to patch up Speed, low HP but high defenses are great for D-Max...

So what could've gone wrong?

Let's take a look at the Gyms past Milo.

Nessa: Neutral (Bad vs Drednaw)
Kabu: Bad.
Bea: Bad.
Opal: Neutral (but not really, I'll get back into that.)
Gordie: Bad.

By the time you get to Circhester, you have the usual late-game Ice types, so it's not like it's still special at that point.

As for Opal, it's a bit of a roulette. A trainer has a Mystical Fire Gardevoir. Instant L. Opal herself has a Mawile. Quiz can make anything go either way tho.

Nessa puts you on the bad side of neutral since she can use her STAB moves, but you can't, Drednaw is straight up a no go.

For all the hype about a super-early strong Ice-type, it really doesn't pan out like you'd expect because of these matchups.

Btw, Nessa and Bea come back for Champion Cup. Yayyyyyy.
 
Magmar

Speaking of awful fire types in-game, let's talk about Magmar in Blue.
That's it. Honestly there is nothing about Magmar worth using for. I used it simply because it was cool as a rival to Charizard in the anime.
It comes like with three moves: Ember, Confuse Ray and Leer.
You grind it up to lv43 to teach it Fire Punch... thinking about it, doesn't Vulpix learn Flamethrower at lv35 and can evolve immediately with Fire Stone in the same game?
You see, Magmar is the Fire Type that can learn the TM Psychic. So you can get rid of mean Poison Type Elite 4 member...
Fire types are just awful in Gen 1. They can be useful to get rid of bugs early on and stupid weeds, but post game you are fighting seels, dragons and giant rocks. Fire Types struggle against those or are mediocer at best.
At least Gen 2 gave him Thunderpunch and you can get him early on.

I guess that's something anyone who has 2 Gameboys can try. Teach Magmar ThunderPunch and trade it back to Pokemon Blue. Tell me how good it performs against the Elite 4.
Tbf Magmar hit the lottery in Gold and Silver. Fantastic mon there!

I don’t think we’ve ever had an E jump to an A tier between games in our tier lists like Magmar did.
 

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