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Finals Official Smogon Tournament XI - Finals [Won by WhiteQueen]
- Thread starter McMeghan
- Start date
- Status
I actually have something interesting to say. I was trying to help McMeghan after I read his post in the Smogon Tour thread: http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/smogon-tour-19.3531099/page-10#post-6204530. People didn't give much attention to BP (until very recently) because it wasn't used in relevant tournaments at all (it was merely considered a cancerous strat from the ladder or something like that). I had to abuse this play style in Smogon Tour so people could realize how broken BP can be even in the tournament scene, and I'm quite pleased that I was such an inspiration for Whitequeen that she brought it to an OST finals.
So yeah I suggested McMeghan to modify the current OU Baton Pass clause into this one:
"A pokemon cannot use the move Baton Pass if its speed stat is higher than +0 (excluding choice scarf)".
This Baton Pass Clause could also be applied to BW and DPP. As you know, the widely considered "broken" Baton Pass strategies are Full Baton Pass chains, Smash Pass (BW, ORAS), Gliscor Pass (DPP), Scolipass (ORAS) and GeoPass (ORAS). If there is any similarity between all these different teams is that all of them rely in passing speed boosts. Full Baton Pass chains are broken because they rely on Speed boosts and defensive boosts, so attacking moves aren't (most of the time) enough to break through the opposing team setting up strategy, since the Baton Pass player moves first (most of the time), you can't check/counter determined member of the chain since it can just switch out into a different one prepared to deal with whatever threat you had out. Quick Passing teams are hard to deal with because, due to screens support (and/or Memento-Tailwind support), it is quite easy to set up and pass a single, decisive boost into a potent sweeper. What makes dealing with the sweeper an impossible task depending on matchup? The fact that on top of receiving a boost to its already powerful offense it will be faster than anything barring priority.
And hey Blunder, it was McM fault for not dealing with the BP issue earlier, sorry about that lol
So yeah I suggested McMeghan to modify the current OU Baton Pass clause into this one:
"A pokemon cannot use the move Baton Pass if its speed stat is higher than +0 (excluding choice scarf)".
This Baton Pass Clause could also be applied to BW and DPP. As you know, the widely considered "broken" Baton Pass strategies are Full Baton Pass chains, Smash Pass (BW, ORAS), Gliscor Pass (DPP), Scolipass (ORAS) and GeoPass (ORAS). If there is any similarity between all these different teams is that all of them rely in passing speed boosts. Full Baton Pass chains are broken because they rely on Speed boosts and defensive boosts, so attacking moves aren't (most of the time) enough to break through the opposing team setting up strategy, since the Baton Pass player moves first (most of the time), you can't check/counter determined member of the chain since it can just switch out into a different one prepared to deal with whatever threat you had out. Quick Passing teams are hard to deal with because, due to screens support (and/or Memento-Tailwind support), it is quite easy to set up and pass a single, decisive boost into a potent sweeper. What makes dealing with the sweeper an impossible task depending on matchup? The fact that on top of receiving a boost to its already powerful offense it will be faster than anything barring priority.
And hey Blunder, it was McM fault for not dealing with the BP issue earlier, sorry about that lol
Hahah... When it comes down to it I asked myself who do I want to win more.. A charismatic definitely ethnic in some sense YouTube personality with sick ass plays, a cult following, insightful commentary and kind words for any newcomers asking for advice or a guy whose main claim to fame is an overwrought ranking of ppl in an online team of folks playing in an insanely constrived tournament for the worlds premier Japanese children's monster collecting role playing game and a confusing gender profile and I thought to myself hmmmm it's definitely the latter, that's the zher that should take this premier trophy of the niche website that I've decided to resume obsessively posting on literally eight years afters I've registered lol....
Haha jk congrats wq
Haha jk congrats wq
It seems you are all forgetting the unsung hero of this tournament: me.
Had I not slew the causer of the OST commotion, Style, and restored peace, prosperity, and hope to all of Smogon, this tournament may never have been completed. You're welcome WhiteQueen .
I'm totally kidding xD Congrats to WhiteQueen and Blunder on their amazing performances throughout the tournament! =]
Had I not slew the causer of the OST commotion, Style, and restored peace, prosperity, and hope to all of Smogon, this tournament may never have been completed. You're welcome WhiteQueen .
I'm totally kidding xD Congrats to WhiteQueen and Blunder on their amazing performances throughout the tournament! =]
Congratulations !
Congrats Whitequeen!
Also ROFL @ people complaining about baton pass. You really can't call 1 baton passer per team full baton pass.
Scald in game 1 proved itself to be a lot gayer imo.
WQ shouldve won anyway in game2 if it wasn't for that Leaf Storm miss. Also that complex ban Deniss is suggesting is just dumb.
Also ROFL @ people complaining about baton pass. You really can't call 1 baton passer per team full baton pass.
Scald in game 1 proved itself to be a lot gayer imo.
WQ shouldve won anyway in game2 if it wasn't for that Leaf Storm miss. Also that complex ban Deniss is suggesting is just dumb.
What a hero, I hope they'll save you a spot at the Pantheon right next to SIU.
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'grats Whitequeen! But a "good job" to Blunder, too.
Tele
a quality human being
I really like this suggestion especially because stuff like Baton Pass Celebi, Baton Pass Lopunny or Baton Pass Sylveon would still be allowed (and those aren't broken for sure).
That's too much complex to be done
I think that bpass + boosting move is a better idea because it cuts off every sneaky stuff like smashpass, quickpass, geopass, quiverpass, tgpass and every other subpar strat. SD/CM/plot pass can be sacrificed for the good's sake (I consider np pass on diancie as awful as quickpass but w/e) while ur innocent Celebi/sylveon are safe in this way (banning bpass as whole would be better but people want it so..)
Anyway grats whitequeen :^)
I think that bpass + boosting move is a better idea because it cuts off every sneaky stuff like smashpass, quickpass, geopass, quiverpass, tgpass and every other subpar strat. SD/CM/plot pass can be sacrificed for the good's sake (I consider np pass on diancie as awful as quickpass but w/e) while ur innocent Celebi/sylveon are safe in this way (banning bpass as whole would be better but people want it so..)
Anyway grats whitequeen :^)
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Great job, my queen.
Good showing, Blunder.
Good showing, Blunder.
Some of yall make it sound like my double Magic Bounce team is an auto-win or something. Try using it on the ladder; I can assure you your win rate would be about 50/50, as it is extremely matchup dependent. Matter of factly, my win rate with it was about 80%. I can use the most random team and still win that much, however. I just ladder well.
Forgot to give my love, Philip7086 a shoutout. Here it is:
WhiteQueen vs All of IDM = WhiteQueen 2-1.
Raikou @ Assault Vest
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Volt Switch
- Thunderbolt
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Shadow Ball
Scolipede @ Leftovers
Ability: Speed Boost
EVs: 248 HP / 20 Def / 240 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Protect
- Substitute
- Iron Defense
- Baton Pass
Diancie (Diancie-Mega) @ Diancite
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Protect
- Moonblast
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Diamond Storm
go dEnIsIsSs (Espeon) @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 200 HP / 224 Def / 84 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Stored Power
- Dazzling Gleam
- Morning Sun
Breloom @ Focus Sash
Ability: Technician
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Spore
- Swords Dance
- Bullet Seed
- Mach Punch
Landorus-Therian (M) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 240 Def / 12 SpD / 8 Spe
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- U-turn
- Earthquake
- Explosion
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Volt Switch
- Thunderbolt
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Shadow Ball
Scolipede @ Leftovers
Ability: Speed Boost
EVs: 248 HP / 20 Def / 240 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Protect
- Substitute
- Iron Defense
- Baton Pass
Diancie (Diancie-Mega) @ Diancite
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Protect
- Moonblast
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Diamond Storm
go dEnIsIsSs (Espeon) @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 200 HP / 224 Def / 84 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Stored Power
- Dazzling Gleam
- Morning Sun
Breloom @ Focus Sash
Ability: Technician
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Spore
- Swords Dance
- Bullet Seed
- Mach Punch
Landorus-Therian (M) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 240 Def / 12 SpD / 8 Spe
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- U-turn
- Earthquake
- Explosion
Forgot to give my love, Philip7086 a shoutout. Here it is:
WhiteQueen vs All of IDM = WhiteQueen 2-1.
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All drama and kidding aside, here are some real words of advice for newcomers who want to do well in smogon tournaments.
1) believe that you can win. You can't win a tournament if you don't believe in yourself. I hate sounding corny, but that's the truth
2) join the farm league once it opens. Players there are trying their hardest to prove themselves, so they'll give you quality games. I started playing ORAS OU seriously last SPL and look how far it got me
3) once you learn the game, there's no such thing as being outplayed, so don't let any overrated players lead you into believing otherwise. Yes, there's obvious choke and that happens. But for the most part, when two players know what they're doing and both have functional brains in their heads, it just comes down to who packs the bigger balls and wins the most 50/50 'predictions'
4) steal quality teams in the RMT forum. Ladder with them and make adjustments to fit your style. Everyone develops a style of play, and more often than not, using your own team gives you the most comfort when it's game time
1) believe that you can win. You can't win a tournament if you don't believe in yourself. I hate sounding corny, but that's the truth
2) join the farm league once it opens. Players there are trying their hardest to prove themselves, so they'll give you quality games. I started playing ORAS OU seriously last SPL and look how far it got me
3) once you learn the game, there's no such thing as being outplayed, so don't let any overrated players lead you into believing otherwise. Yes, there's obvious choke and that happens. But for the most part, when two players know what they're doing and both have functional brains in their heads, it just comes down to who packs the bigger balls and wins the most 50/50 'predictions'
4) steal quality teams in the RMT forum. Ladder with them and make adjustments to fit your style. Everyone develops a style of play, and more often than not, using your own team gives you the most comfort when it's game time
Idk friend, this world is just completely fucked up, finding out kg had my teams and now this in a span of two days just make me realize I was meant to quit
GJ tho WQ, maybe I can't 6-0 you these days anymore.
You lack grits, Bluewind. When the hell did you ever 6-0 me though? Did you mean to say 69?
Also, another advice:
5) Pokemon is a luck based game. You can't go far, no matter how well you play, without luck on your side from time to time. So keep at it and don't let it get you down. Getting mad destroys brain cells
Also, another advice:
5) Pokemon is a luck based game. You can't go far, no matter how well you play, without luck on your side from time to time. So keep at it and don't let it get you down. Getting mad destroys brain cells
Turn 18
The opposing Scolipede used Iron Defense!
The opposing Scolipede's Defense sharply rose!
Excadrill used Iron Head!
The substitute took damage for the opposing Scolipede!
The opposing Scolipede restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
The opposing Scolipede's Speed Boost raised its Speed!
Turn 19
The opposing Scolipede used Baton Pass!
But it failed!
Baton Pass Clause mod activated.
Excadrill used Iron Head!
The substitute took damage for the opposing Scolipede!
The opposing Scolipede restored a little HP using its Leftovers!
This doesn't look complex imo
Gratz WhiteQueen!!!!
Great run whitequeen and blunder, congrats for Trophy Queen.
(ban Batonpass on Scolipede and Smeargle/ban stored power+magicbounce cuz thals whats actually broken)
also congrats to wq for the trophy and blunder for getting that far. I think wq kinda deserved to win this anyway, as leaf storm miss decided g2 (I think, correct me if I am wrong) but I am happy g3 happened, because that might get this broken bs banned, and thanks to wq for bringing that, I dont think any post or what ever could get this stuff banned. (I still wanted blunder to win tbh :x)
(ban Batonpass on Scolipede and Smeargle/ban stored power+magicbounce cuz thals whats actually broken)
Its not, baton pass is broken as hell (if used by the right team), but the problem is there is no uncomplex way to ban it, because stuff like nasty pass is not broken, because of being easier to shut down than a Espeon with like 1000 defense, enough speed to outspeed anything, and being able to setup cm on almost anything in this meta, because it cant be Statused in a relevant way, nor can u roar it out. dennis idea is great I think, because what makes defense+speed passing so broken, is the fact that you cant outspeed and kill espeon, before it starts calm minding, till it can kill everything. there is also no real counter, you would have to run a team consisting of like 6 mons that scolipede AND Smeargle cannot setup on, with like memento, taunt, tailwind support. I dont think thats possible.
also congrats to wq for the trophy and blunder for getting that far. I think wq kinda deserved to win this anyway, as leaf storm miss decided g2 (I think, correct me if I am wrong) but I am happy g3 happened, because that might get this broken bs banned, and thanks to wq for bringing that, I dont think any post or what ever could get this stuff banned. (I still wanted blunder to win tbh :x)
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