Metagame Metagame Discussion

[wesh papillon]

Geniune question: if ppl want to ban tera as a whole, would it be possible to simply ban the move tera blast instead? I feel like it would keep and interesting side to the tier without enabling the thing ppl hate.

(note: I personally think tera and tera blast are perfectly fine but im aware of the fact that I have weird taste in general)

heres a team so I get more likes so it looks like more ppl agree with me than actually do: https://pokepast.es/4667990069b0e31e

 

[Colin]

Geniune question: if ppl want to ban tera as a whole, would it be possible to simply ban the move tera blast instead? I feel like it would keep and interesting side to the tier without enabling the thing ppl hate.

(note: I personally think tera and tera blast are perfectly fine but im aware of the fact that I have weird taste in general)

heres a team so I get more likes so it looks like more ppl agree with me than actually do: https://pokepast.es/a4a6d1db74f67d98

The only thing I'm 100% sure of is that Missy should get the boot, and then we should start looking at tera and not the other way around. Missy can still wisp to beat Pawniard, and hits everything else hard enough and is bulky/fast enough to be broken. apart from that, I generally support terablast being looked at bc it is the aspect that breaks Flittle specifically, and is also the least competitive aspect of tera in my eyes due to it being the main "surprise you're dead" move that almost anything can use to beat Pawniard. I have no idea if that alone would be enough, but if Flittle gets the hammer why not this instead, bc it doesn't contribute much honest gameplay. Some people consider Flittle potentially broken w/o terablast, but I think that it should at least be tested without it.

There is one specific part of tera that I think contributes in a mostly competitive and honest way, and that is having the option to tera your defensive Pokemon to be able to have counterplay vs rain, Rufflet, and more. Granted, this often manifests itself into a "surprise, I lived your hit and you died" moment, but many of those are easier to scout to prevent the reversal since you have momentum then something such as Misdreavus with momentum that threatens setup, as well as the fact that sometimes you can identify that something needs to be able to tera to check your threat for your opponent to be able to win on preview. My main hope is that this can be preserved w/o an overall worse meta, and my judgement isn't terrible like it sometimes is.

My last potential issues on terastalization is something I take a short term wait and see after banning Missy stance on, and that is offensive Pokemon using tera to have a better typing vs speed control, and Tera to boost stab. I predict that the first issue will be easier to deal with by having multiple speed control/priority/things to take a hit and status options when the main threats are less bulky than Missy, thanks to the fact we have Pawniard, fast trapping, and a good number of viable scarf as well as things such as Toedscool but it might not be enough. The second issue is case by case, as Rufflet forces either multiple resists on a team, or a defensive tera to beat it, or getting lucky vs scarf set while other threats such as rain might get gimped by the fact we're not sure is Berry Juice is even in the game, and lastly I don't know how to predict Diglett using tera stab. I don't know how or if these potential issues become broken, I just hope its not too bad.

 

[Fiend]

The LC council has unanimously banned Misdreavus. With Tera-Fighting or Electric, Nasty Plot, and incredible stats, Misdreavus has few downsides and many appealing options. Though running the same set every time is more than enough for Misdreavus to be widely considered the best Pokemon in the tier. With boons like limited Knock Off, Pursuit being removed entirely, and being immune to Arena Trap, Misdreavus is positioned well against the metagame even before Tera is considered. With Tera, there is no question on Misdreavus being too much for the tier.

Other Pokemon (and moves and items, too) remain on the radar, as does Tera at large.

As mechanics have become better understood, legalities change to reflect this. Genderless and Male Pokemon still cannot breed level-up moves down. However, egg moves can be passed down with picnics. As a result of learning these mechanics, Tandemaus cannot use Population Bomb at level 5, and thus it has been unbanned from LC. Additionally, Berry Juice is currently unobtainable in Gen 9 and thus cannot be held by Pokemon.

Kris from implementing (thank you) Misdreavus ban, Tandemaus unban, and Berry Juice made illegal/unavailable

 

[chimp]

Which Taco Bell Menu Item is Your Favorite LC Pokemon?
Find out below! (with tier list yay)​

The Big Four; I had trouble deciding who the fourth of the Big 4 should be; I guess I could've kept it at the Big 3 but for some reason "Big Four" just rolls off the tongue better? Just like all the delicious meals you can get at Taco Bell!

Anyway, I had Diglett over Rufflet originally- and even considered Flittle- but ultimately I had to go with Rufflet. Regardless, these four are unquestionably the best in the metagame right now, no questions asked.

Misdreavus is the Crunchwrap Supreme. It has virtually everything you can ever want; and it'll give you heartburn. I think there is still a ton of experimenting that can be done with Missy since its so unquestionably good at pretty much everything it does. The Nasty Plot sets are obviously really good, though I'm really starting to prefer the WoW sets; the dearth of clerics and wide range of physical attackers really makes WoW really worth it whenever you can click it. It's funny how this thing can go 1v1 against most standard Pawniards, presuming you land the WoW.

Also I need someone to tell me if this set is any good:

Misdreavus @ Eviolite
Ability: Levitate
Level: 5
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 196 Def / 76 SpA / 236 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Draining Kiss
- Calm Mind
- Will-O-Wisp
- Substitute

I've heard from multiple sources that it's probably bad but I haven't tried it soooooooooooo maybe its heat? Someone play a bunch of games with it and tell me thanks.

Girafarig is the Black Bean Crunchwrap Supreme. It's like Misdreavus but with little something that makes it less good. For real though I actually debated putting Girafarig at the #1 spot, because Girafarig is just so damn versatile, with so many dope sets, and by the time you figure out what it's running it might be too late. NP, Physical attacker, Screens; really dope Pokemon all around. I think I rate Missy higher because of it's slightly better standard typing and it's immunity to Spikes/Webs, but Girafarig definitely a threat and I have lost so many games due to underestimating how quickly it can sweep.

Pawniard is the Mountain Dew Baja Blast. With its lack of Knock Off, something certainly feels off about Pawniard, and that makes it reminsicent of the Baja Blast, with its vaguely soapy taste. But you just *gotta have it.* It's like a staple, ya know? Pawniard's Sucker Punch keeps things in check, Defiant is always nice (I've lost way more game's than I care to admit due to a poorly timed Liquidation Defense drop or Shadow Ball Sp.D drop) and it's a very capable Stealth Rocker. I don't need to say more; you all know what Pawniard does.

Rufflet is the Mexican Pizza; It's presence is immediately felt, but it's not always a hit. Virtually impossible to switch in to unless you're lucky. Merritt had that dope Agility + Bulk Up set that is incredible, Scarf is incredible... ya it's just a good mon.

Tried my best to whittle down the most common Pokemon you'll see on the ladder. Most team structures or cores will revolve around them + the Big Four.

Flittle is the Nacho Cheese Doritos Locos Tacos. Straight forward but it's all it needs to be. My go to item. Sweeping with this thing is so fun. I prefer to not run Protect because I don't think Flittle *needs* the free turn of a speed boost, but it's good for blocking Nymble. However, with Protect you're basically forced into choosing between Terablast coverage for Pawniard or Roost, and I think the instant healing goes a long way.

Diglett is the Cheesy Rollup, because Diglett kind of looks like a Cheesy Rollup.

=

And because Diglett just rolls up and does what Diglett does. I kind of hate Diglett actually because I'll be trying to build with some shitty fuck of a Pokemon only to be like "wait this thing just dies to Diglett" and then I trash it. But, either way, Diglett is probably at an all-time-low because of Tera, but forcing some shitty fuck like Fuecoco to become Grass usually is probably a good thing to be quite honest. I prefer to run this with Sub for the Sucker Punch mindgames but it can be an OK rocker or manual Sun setter in a pinch.

Toedscool is the Spicy Double Steak Grilled Cheese Burrito because it's gotta be the most disgusting looking and sounding thing of all time, but it's actually pretty good. Great Sp.D helps it be a way to stop Misdreavus and NP Girafarig, and Spore is just always really fuckin nice. Being one of the few Knock Offers it's really good, too. My go-to set has been

Toedscuel (Toedscool) @ Eviolite
Ability: Mycelium Might
Level: 5
Tera Type: Grass
EVs: 116 HP / 236 Def / 116 SpD / 36 Spe
Bold Nature
- Knock Off
- Giga Drain
- Spikes
- Spore

But all the options are really good for this thing. Earth Power over Giga Drain is probably better for not being walled by Pawniard- but I like how Giga Drain gives you a better match-up against opposing Toedscools. I think I prefer it with max Physical Defense since it's Sp.D is naturally so high and the Defense can help with some random things like Quaxly's Brave Bird. This thing reminds me a lot of like Timburr back in the day, in the sense that games can be decided if you let it get too much damage too quickly. I like it more than I ever liked Foongus. FUCK Foongus.

Glimmet is the Cinnamon Twists because I am running out of Taco Bell analogies boy this idea ran out of steam quick. Ya Glimmet is Glimmet IDK. A real pain in the dink because getting up hazards is just so easy with it. I have seen some cool tech with Mud Shot in order to beat other Glimmets which is very neat. The 105 Special Attack is so tempting, though. I think with Tera this thing could be a really good attacker,

Glimmet @ Life Orb
Ability: Toxic Debris
Level: 5
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 236 SpA / 36 SpD / 196 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dazzling Gleam
- Power Gem
- Sludge Wave
- Rock Polish

Shroodle is the Power Menu Bowl- filled with a little bit of everything. I had this thing a tad higher but I dropped it a spot or two after it started to seem like Berry Juice isn't actually in the game. Either way, Shroodle is really good; kind of the backbone of Rain teams with it's Prankster support. Not being able to be trapped by Diglett thanks to Parting Shot is really nice, and Knock Off is of course very good. I really enjoyed the SD + Unburden sets and hope that they aren't too shite if Berry Juice is indeed gone from the metagame. Problem is that it's also a Tera hog which sucks because if it can't tera then it basically can't beat Pawniard.

Impidimp sets up screens. That's it. It's the Chips and Nacho Cheese Sauce: it's nothing special by itself but it enables so much (flittle, girafarig, nachos)

Quaxly is the Premium Hot Coffee. If you're buying coffee at Taco Bell it's likely that you are in a low place. That is the entire LC metagame right now that we are using Quaxly. Look; I love Quaxly. But this thing really just gives off "HELP ME PLEASE" vibes. Like all the teams that I have that have Quaxly on them have Quaxly against my will; it's just that Quaxly does what it does and it does what it does well enough and what it does is quite useful; but I have had so many games with Quaxly dittos that I think *I* need to go stop by my local Taco Bell and get a steamy cup of joe. Rapid Spin + Moxie is cool though and it can sneak up on you.

Jokes aside though I've been seeing some experimentation with Aqua Jet and Low Kick and I've tried Scarf (in theory it's good... right?) but it's never reaaaallly stood out to me. Quaxly is truly the working class hero so maybe I'm wrong and we should throw the duck some goddamn respect; just like all the hard working men and women across the country that rely on their local Taco Bells for their morning cup of coffee.

Psyduck and Buizel are Cinnabon Delights because they really shouldn't be good and yet here we are. I am really more partial to this set for Psyduck:

Duckman (Psyduck) @ Eviolite
Ability: Swift Swim
Level: 5
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Electric
EVs: 36 HP / 236 SpA / 236 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Nasty Plot
- Surf
- Ice Beam
- Tera Blast

Water + Ice + Electric is just crazy coverage that really prevents anything from pulling off a defensive Tera check, and being an Electric just gives you better synergy with Buizel or Arrocuda or whatever. Psychic is still good, though, for Croagunk. I think Rain is in a good spot right now and it can be really tough to check.

Larvesta is the Cheesy Fiesta Potato because that is exactly what it is. I have really enjoyed using Larvesta. As mentioned before, spreading burns is super nice and it's nice to have something to make Pawniard's think twice before coming in. Terastalizing gives this a lot more defensive potential, too; it's really funny to have a Steel-type with Flame Body, for example.

Nymble is the fucking goat, I don't care what anyone has to say. It is hitting way harder than it has any right to be, and that is why it's gotta be the Breakfast Crunchwarp Sausage. I encountered one of these things with Agility and it totally swept my ass so that is something it can do too.

Gastly and Drifloon are the..... *vague radio buzzing* hold on folks.....

.

.

.

It would appear that while I was in the middle of writing this stupid ass Taco Bell post, Misdreavus has just been banned.

The LC council has unanimously banned Misdreavus. With Tera-Fighting or Electric, Nasty Plot, and incredible stats, Misdreavus has few downsides and many appealing options. Though running the same set every time is more than enough for Misdreavus to be widely considered the best Pokemon in the tier. With boons like limited Knock Off, Pursuit being removed entirely, and being immune to Arena Trap, Misdreavus is positioned well against the metagame even before Tera is considered. With Tera, there is no question on Misdreavus being too much for the tier.

Other Pokemon (and moves and items, too) remain on the radar, as does Tera at large.

As mechanics have become better understood, legalities change to reflect this. Genderless and Male Pokemon still cannot breed level-up moves down. However, egg moves can be passed down with picnics. As a result of learning these mechanics, Tandemaus cannot use Population Bomb at level 5, and thus it has been unbanned from LC. Additionally, Berry Juice is currently unobtainable in Gen 9 and thus cannot be held by Pokemon.

Kris from implementing (thank you) Misdreavus ban, Tandemaus unban, and Berry Juice made illegal/unavailable

Aight well. Seems we got a whole new metagame to compare to shitty fast food items. RIP Misdreavus and RIP to the bowels if you actually eat any of the slop mentioned here (of course I do).

Bye.

 

[Neohorizon]

Comedic timing like this rarely happens when planned.

 

[smixx]

Which Taco Bell Menu Item is Your Favorite LC Pokemon?
Find out below! (with tier list yay)​

View attachment 469744
The Big Four; I had trouble deciding who the fourth of the Big 4 should be; I guess I could've kept it at the Big 3 but for some reason "Big Four" just rolls off the tongue better? Just like all the delicious meals you can get at Taco Bell!

Anyway, I had Diglett over Rufflet originally- and even considered Flittle- but ultimately I had to go with Rufflet. Regardless, these four are unquestionably the best in the metagame right now, no questions asked.

Misdreavus is the Crunchwrap Supreme. It has virtually everything you can ever want; and it'll give you heartburn. I think there is still a ton of experimenting that can be done with Missy since its so unquestionably good at pretty much everything it does. The Nasty Plot sets are obviously really good, though I'm really starting to prefer the WoW sets; the dearth of clerics and wide range of physical attackers really makes WoW really worth it whenever you can click it. It's funny how this thing can go 1v1 against most standard Pawniards, presuming you land the WoW.

Also I need someone to tell me if this set is any good:

Misdreavus @ Eviolite
Ability: Levitate
Level: 5
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 196 Def / 76 SpA / 236 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Draining Kiss
- Calm Mind
- Will-O-Wisp
- Substitute

I've heard from multiple sources that it's probably bad but I haven't tried it soooooooooooo maybe its heat? Someone play a bunch of games with it and tell me thanks.

Girafarig is the Black Bean Crunchwrap Supreme. It's like Misdreavus but with little something that makes it less good. For real though I actually debated putting Girafarig at the #1 spot, because Girafarig is just so damn versatile, with so many dope sets, and by the time you figure out what it's running it might be too late. NP, Physical attacker, Screens; really dope Pokemon all around. I think I rate Missy higher because of it's slightly better standard typing and it's immunity to Spikes/Webs, but Girafarig definitely a threat and I have lost so many games due to underestimating how quickly it can sweep.

Pawniard is the Mountain Dew Baja Blast. With its lack of Knock Off, something certainly feels off about Pawniard, and that makes it reminsicent of the Baja Blast, with its vaguely soapy taste. But you just *gotta have it.* It's like a staple, ya know? Pawniard's Sucker Punch keeps things in check, Defiant is always nice (I've lost way more game's than I care to admit due to a poorly timed Liquidation Defense drop or Shadow Ball Sp.D drop) and it's a very capable Stealth Rocker. I don't need to say more; you all know what Pawniard does.

Rufflet is the Mexican Pizza; It's presence is immediately felt, but it's not always a hit. Virtually impossible to switch in to unless you're lucky. Merritt had that dope Agility + Bulk Up set that is incredible, Scarf is incredible... ya it's just a good mon.

View attachment 469725
Tried my best to whittle down the most common Pokemon you'll see on the ladder. Most team structures or cores will revolve around them + the Big Four.

Flittle is the Nacho Cheese Doritos Locos Tacos. Straight forward but it's all it needs to be. My go to item. Sweeping with this thing is so fun. I prefer to not run Protect because I don't think Flittle *needs* the free turn of a speed boost, but it's good for blocking Nymble. However, with Protect you're basically forced into choosing between Terablast coverage for Pawniard or Roost, and I think the instant healing goes a long way.

Diglett is the Cheesy Rollup, because Diglett kind of looks like a Cheesy Rollup.
View attachment 469726 = View attachment 469727
And because Diglett just rolls up and does what Diglett does. I kind of hate Diglett actually because I'll be trying to build with some shitty fuck of a Pokemon only to be like "wait this thing just dies to Diglett" and then I trash it. But, either way, Diglett is probably at an all-time-low because of Tera, but forcing some shitty fuck like Fuecoco to become Grass usually is probably a good thing to be quite honest. I prefer to run this with Sub for the Sucker Punch mindgames but it can be an OK rocker or manual Sun setter in a pinch.

Toedscool is the Spicy Double Steak Grilled Cheese Burrito because it's gotta be the most disgusting looking and sounding thing of all time, but it's actually pretty good. Great Sp.D helps it be a way to stop Misdreavus and NP Girafarig, and Spore is just always really fuckin nice. Being one of the few Knock Offers it's really good, too. My go-to set has been

Toedscuel (Toedscool) @ Eviolite
Ability: Mycelium Might
Level: 5
Tera Type: Grass
EVs: 116 HP / 236 Def / 116 SpD / 36 Spe
Bold Nature
- Knock Off
- Giga Drain
- Spikes
- Spore

But all the options are really good for this thing. Earth Power over Giga Drain is probably better for not being walled by Pawniard- but I like how Giga Drain gives you a better match-up against opposing Toedscools. I think I prefer it with max Physical Defense since it's Sp.D is naturally so high and the Defense can help with some random things like Quaxly's Brave Bird. This thing reminds me a lot of like Timburr back in the day, in the sense that games can be decided if you let it get too much damage too quickly. I like it more than I ever liked Foongus. FUCK Foongus.

Glimmet is the Cinnamon Twists because I am running out of Taco Bell analogies boy this idea ran out of steam quick. Ya Glimmet is Glimmet IDK. A real pain in the dink because getting up hazards is just so easy with it. I have seen some cool tech with Mud Shot in order to beat other Glimmets which is very neat. The 105 Special Attack is so tempting, though. I think with Tera this thing could be a really good attacker,

Glimmet @ Life Orb
Ability: Toxic Debris
Level: 5
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 236 SpA / 36 SpD / 196 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dazzling Gleam
- Power Gem
- Sludge Wave
- Rock Polish

Shroodle is the Power Menu Bowl- filled with a little bit of everything. I had this thing a tad higher but I dropped it a spot or two after it started to seem like Berry Juice isn't actually in the game. Either way, Shroodle is really good; kind of the backbone of Rain teams with it's Prankster support. Not being able to be trapped by Diglett thanks to Parting Shot is really nice, and Knock Off is of course very good. I really enjoyed the SD + Unburden sets and hope that they aren't too shite if Berry Juice is indeed gone from the metagame. Problem is that it's also a Tera hog which sucks because if it can't tera then it basically can't beat Pawniard.

Impidimp sets up screens. That's it. It's the Chips and Nacho Cheese Sauce: it's nothing special by itself but it enables so much (flittle, girafarig, nachos)

Quaxly is the Premium Hot Coffee. If you're buying coffee at Taco Bell it's likely that you are in a low place. That is the entire LC metagame right now that we are using Quaxly. Look; I love Quaxly. But this thing really just gives off "HELP ME PLEASE" vibes. Like all the teams that I have that have Quaxly on them have Quaxly against my will; it's just that Quaxly does what it does and it does what it does well enough and what it does is quite useful; but I have had so many games with Quaxly dittos that I think *I* need to go stop by my local Taco Bell and get a steamy cup of joe. Rapid Spin + Moxie is cool though and it can sneak up on you.

Jokes aside though I've been seeing some experimentation with Aqua Jet and Low Kick and I've tried Scarf (in theory it's good... right?) but it's never reaaaallly stood out to me. Quaxly is truly the working class hero so maybe I'm wrong and we should throw the duck some goddamn respect; just like all the hard working men and women across the country that rely on their local Taco Bells for their morning cup of coffee.

Psyduck and Buizel are Cinnabon Delights because they really shouldn't be good and yet here we are. I am really more partial to this set for Psyduck:

Duckman (Psyduck) @ Eviolite
Ability: Swift Swim
Level: 5
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Electric
EVs: 36 HP / 236 SpA / 236 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Nasty Plot
- Surf
- Ice Beam
- Tera Blast

Water + Ice + Electric is just crazy coverage that really prevents anything from pulling off a defensive Tera check, and being an Electric just gives you better synergy with Buizel or Arrocuda or whatever. Psychic is still good, though, for Croagunk. I think Rain is in a good spot right now and it can be really tough to check.

View attachment 469737

Larvesta is the Cheesy Fiesta Potato because that is exactly what it is. I have really enjoyed using Larvesta. As mentioned before, spreading burns is super nice and it's nice to have something to make Pawniard's think twice before coming in. Terastalizing gives this a lot more defensive potential, too; it's really funny to have a Steel-type with Flame Body, for example.

Nymble is the fucking goat, I don't care what anyone has to say. It is hitting way harder than it has any right to be, and that is why it's gotta be the Breakfast Crunchwarp Sausage. I encountered one of these things with Agility and it totally swept my ass so that is something it can do too.

Gastly and Drifloon are the..... *vague radio buzzing* hold on folks.....

.

.

.

View attachment 469741

It would appear that while I was in the middle of writing this stupid ass Taco Bell post, Misdreavus has just been banned.



Aight well. Seems we got a whole new metagame to compare to shitty fast food items. RIP Misdreavus and RIP to the bowels if you actually eat any of the slop mentioned here (of course I do).

Bye.

this was an interesting first impression of the LC metagame

 

[Brammi]

For my 2c on the tera debate. I am a firm believer that Tera is strong af, BUT that it will settle. It will become telegraphed as the metagame develops and settles. Like look how early it is.

This is Z-moves all over again, another surprise mechanic that also gave some of the best moments and sets of the generation. Aqua Tail Scolipede comes to mind to break stall. I think that Tera makes things viable and very strong, I think Flittle is fine. People are sleeping on counters and checks, Dratini, Fuecoco, Stunky, Shroodle are all able to either switch and check or revenge from big ranges in various situations, and that is without defensive teras as well. This gen is going to see more balance teams that the gen 8 LC community is used to, and if you trade a defensive tera to beat an offensive terra then you may have just won the tera war. People just don't want to stop playing HO.

Calling for tera ban is WAY too early.

 

[The_Dori]

Hi, first time posting on Smogon forums. I always felt intimidated and not knowledgeable/experienced enough to participate. I still am not, but this doesn't stop me from asking questions.

Since Misdreavus has been banned from LC, a lot of teams fall short of a crucial team member with this much utility. What Pokémon would work as replacement for all these teams that now lack a member ?

 

[Drifting]

Hi, first time posting on Smogon forums. I always felt intimidated and not knowledgeable/experienced enough to participate. I still am not, but this doesn't stop me from asking questions.

Since Misdreavus has been banned from LC, a lot of teams fall short of a crucial team member with this much utility. What Pokémon would work as replacement for all these teams that now lack a member ?

Obviously there is no one-size-fits-all solution for every team, but I personally have been replacing my Missy's with other Ghost-types, because one of the best things I got out of Misdreavus was spinblocking and ghost coverage.

Obviously Gastly stands out as a strong option, being a similarly fast, strong Ghost with Levitate, but it of course lacks the defensive profile that makes missy so useful to come in on staff like Quaxly. If you want a more defensive option, you could try Drifloon, which I haven't tried much but seems decent.

Gastly Set I've Been Using

Gastly @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
Level: 5
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 36 Def / 196 SpA / 76 SpD / 196 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Substitute
- Shadow Ball
- Sludge Bomb
- Tera Blast

As for Drifloon sets... I don't really know? You could try Oran Unburden CM, WoW-Hex, Mental Herb Acro or a utility set with Defog maybe? Really hard to say especially with Juice being gone.

Of course, it doesn't have to be a ghost type, especially if you aren't relying on hazard strategies like Surskit and Glimmet. Just putting on more "always useful" pokemon like Pawniard, Rufflet, Giraffe, Diglett or Quax/Toed will be a suitable replacement for just about anything.

If you have any more questions the Simple Q&A Thread is probably an easier place to ask.

 

[The_Dori]

Obviously there is no one-size-fits-all solution for every team, but I personally have been replacing my Missy's with other Ghost-types, because one of the best things I got out of Misdreavus was spinblocking and ghost coverage.

Obviously Gastly stands out as a strong option, being a similarly fast, strong Ghost with Levitate, but it of course lacks the defensive profile that makes missy so useful to come in on staff like Quaxly. If you want a more defensive option, you could try Drifloon, which I haven't tried much but seems decent.

Gastly Set I've Been Using

Gastly @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
Level: 5
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 36 Def / 196 SpA / 76 SpD / 196 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Substitute
- Shadow Ball
- Sludge Bomb
- Tera Blast

As for Drifloon sets... I don't really know? You could try Oran Unburden CM, WoW-Hex, Mental Herb Acro or a utility set with Defog maybe? Really hard to say especially with Juice being gone.

Of course, it doesn't have to be a ghost type, especially if you aren't relying on hazard strategies like Surskit and Glimmet. Just putting on more "always useful" pokemon like Pawniard, Rufflet, Giraffe, Diglett or Quax/Toed will be a suitable replacement for just about anything.

Thank you ! I'll be trying out this Gastly set. I might try Drifloon but the BJ removal really hurt it, sadly.

 

[p4rk]

I'm not much of a team builder, so there's definitely MUCH BETTER ways to run this, but I present...

THE RAIN STOPPER

Cacnea @ Eviolite
Ability: Water Absorb
Level: 5
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 200 Atk / 36 Def / 36 SpD / 236 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Tera Blast
- Seed Bomb
- Sucker Punch
- Swords Dance

Tera fire combined with water absorb leaves rain teams shaking. Water moves become completely obsolete, and ice moves are resisted. He retains grass type stab with seed bomb to kill basically any water threat.

Mainly, I just love this mon and I'm glad I found a little niche for him.

 

[Colin]

I made a Sticky Web team work.



Nasty Plot tera electric Misdreavus was a broken set, but the threat got banned. I tried to replicate it through Giraffe, because the Ghosts were not bulky or fast enough. Since Giraffe does not levitate, I used webs to slow down Diglett. Electric Giraffe helps webs by beating Rufflet, and this set doesn't terribly mind Defiant boosted Pawniard thanks to Substitute usage in conjunction with +2 tera tbolt killing. the rest of the team is the obligatory Diglett to immediately threaten Pawniard, and defensive pieces to give my team a backbone and help protect webs, which my team does a passable although not amazing job keeping up.

I somehow failed to identify that it is not just terablast sniping defensive pieces being problematic, but also just boosting already existing coverage after setup. A day's laddering cured me of that. its more predictable, but its hard/impossible to safely scout many boosted threats. I support action on tera, but I don't want it completely gone as I enjoy playing around it when the risk reward isn't so drastically favored in the tera user's favor when you try to scout it. maybe show tera types on preview or when a threat enters, as well as terablast being banned? Idk what would work and what wouldn't when it comes to tiering.

Webs are clearly better without Misdreavus hovering over them, but they are hard to protect. Do you think they are good, or would you rather try something else / stick with already proven archetypes such as vanilla balance, rain, and screens?

 

[Qaos-System]

‖ː‖`After Girafarig 'n' Flittle inevitably get looked at for potential bans, I think that it might be worth taking a look at Light Clay, since Screens have proven to be extremely powerful so far.`‖ː‖

 

[ZeStinky]

Which Taco Bell Menu Item is Your Favorite LC Pokemon?
Find out below! (with tier list yay)​

View attachment 469744
The Big Four; I had trouble deciding who the fourth of the Big 4 should be; I guess I could've kept it at the Big 3 but for some reason "Big Four" just rolls off the tongue better? Just like all the delicious meals you can get at Taco Bell!

Anyway, I had Diglett over Rufflet originally- and even considered Flittle- but ultimately I had to go with Rufflet. Regardless, these four are unquestionably the best in the metagame right now, no questions asked.

Misdreavus is the Crunchwrap Supreme. It has virtually everything you can ever want; and it'll give you heartburn. I think there is still a ton of experimenting that can be done with Missy since its so unquestionably good at pretty much everything it does. The Nasty Plot sets are obviously really good, though I'm really starting to prefer the WoW sets; the dearth of clerics and wide range of physical attackers really makes WoW really worth it whenever you can click it. It's funny how this thing can go 1v1 against most standard Pawniards, presuming you land the WoW.

Also I need someone to tell me if this set is any good:

Misdreavus @ Eviolite
Ability: Levitate
Level: 5
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 196 Def / 76 SpA / 236 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Draining Kiss
- Calm Mind
- Will-O-Wisp
- Substitute

I've heard from multiple sources that it's probably bad but I haven't tried it soooooooooooo maybe its heat? Someone play a bunch of games with it and tell me thanks.

Girafarig is the Black Bean Crunchwrap Supreme. It's like Misdreavus but with little something that makes it less good. For real though I actually debated putting Girafarig at the #1 spot, because Girafarig is just so damn versatile, with so many dope sets, and by the time you figure out what it's running it might be too late. NP, Physical attacker, Screens; really dope Pokemon all around. I think I rate Missy higher because of it's slightly better standard typing and it's immunity to Spikes/Webs, but Girafarig definitely a threat and I have lost so many games due to underestimating how quickly it can sweep.

Pawniard is the Mountain Dew Baja Blast. With its lack of Knock Off, something certainly feels off about Pawniard, and that makes it reminsicent of the Baja Blast, with its vaguely soapy taste. But you just *gotta have it.* It's like a staple, ya know? Pawniard's Sucker Punch keeps things in check, Defiant is always nice (I've lost way more game's than I care to admit due to a poorly timed Liquidation Defense drop or Shadow Ball Sp.D drop) and it's a very capable Stealth Rocker. I don't need to say more; you all know what Pawniard does.

Rufflet is the Mexican Pizza; It's presence is immediately felt, but it's not always a hit. Virtually impossible to switch in to unless you're lucky. Merritt had that dope Agility + Bulk Up set that is incredible, Scarf is incredible... ya it's just a good mon.

View attachment 469725
Tried my best to whittle down the most common Pokemon you'll see on the ladder. Most team structures or cores will revolve around them + the Big Four.

Flittle is the Nacho Cheese Doritos Locos Tacos. Straight forward but it's all it needs to be. My go to item. Sweeping with this thing is so fun. I prefer to not run Protect because I don't think Flittle *needs* the free turn of a speed boost, but it's good for blocking Nymble. However, with Protect you're basically forced into choosing between Terablast coverage for Pawniard or Roost, and I think the instant healing goes a long way.

Diglett is the Cheesy Rollup, because Diglett kind of looks like a Cheesy Rollup.
View attachment 469726 = View attachment 469727
And because Diglett just rolls up and does what Diglett does. I kind of hate Diglett actually because I'll be trying to build with some shitty fuck of a Pokemon only to be like "wait this thing just dies to Diglett" and then I trash it. But, either way, Diglett is probably at an all-time-low because of Tera, but forcing some shitty fuck like Fuecoco to become Grass usually is probably a good thing to be quite honest. I prefer to run this with Sub for the Sucker Punch mindgames but it can be an OK rocker or manual Sun setter in a pinch.

Toedscool is the Spicy Double Steak Grilled Cheese Burrito because it's gotta be the most disgusting looking and sounding thing of all time, but it's actually pretty good. Great Sp.D helps it be a way to stop Misdreavus and NP Girafarig, and Spore is just always really fuckin nice. Being one of the few Knock Offers it's really good, too. My go-to set has been

Toedscuel (Toedscool) @ Eviolite
Ability: Mycelium Might
Level: 5
Tera Type: Grass
EVs: 116 HP / 236 Def / 116 SpD / 36 Spe
Bold Nature
- Knock Off
- Giga Drain
- Spikes
- Spore

But all the options are really good for this thing. Earth Power over Giga Drain is probably better for not being walled by Pawniard- but I like how Giga Drain gives you a better match-up against opposing Toedscools. I think I prefer it with max Physical Defense since it's Sp.D is naturally so high and the Defense can help with some random things like Quaxly's Brave Bird. This thing reminds me a lot of like Timburr back in the day, in the sense that games can be decided if you let it get too much damage too quickly. I like it more than I ever liked Foongus. FUCK Foongus.

Glimmet is the Cinnamon Twists because I am running out of Taco Bell analogies boy this idea ran out of steam quick. Ya Glimmet is Glimmet IDK. A real pain in the dink because getting up hazards is just so easy with it. I have seen some cool tech with Mud Shot in order to beat other Glimmets which is very neat. The 105 Special Attack is so tempting, though. I think with Tera this thing could be a really good attacker,

Glimmet @ Life Orb
Ability: Toxic Debris
Level: 5
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 236 SpA / 36 SpD / 196 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dazzling Gleam
- Power Gem
- Sludge Wave
- Rock Polish

Shroodle is the Power Menu Bowl- filled with a little bit of everything. I had this thing a tad higher but I dropped it a spot or two after it started to seem like Berry Juice isn't actually in the game. Either way, Shroodle is really good; kind of the backbone of Rain teams with it's Prankster support. Not being able to be trapped by Diglett thanks to Parting Shot is really nice, and Knock Off is of course very good. I really enjoyed the SD + Unburden sets and hope that they aren't too shite if Berry Juice is indeed gone from the metagame. Problem is that it's also a Tera hog which sucks because if it can't tera then it basically can't beat Pawniard.

Impidimp sets up screens. That's it. It's the Chips and Nacho Cheese Sauce: it's nothing special by itself but it enables so much (flittle, girafarig, nachos)

Quaxly is the Premium Hot Coffee. If you're buying coffee at Taco Bell it's likely that you are in a low place. That is the entire LC metagame right now that we are using Quaxly. Look; I love Quaxly. But this thing really just gives off "HELP ME PLEASE" vibes. Like all the teams that I have that have Quaxly on them have Quaxly against my will; it's just that Quaxly does what it does and it does what it does well enough and what it does is quite useful; but I have had so many games with Quaxly dittos that I think *I* need to go stop by my local Taco Bell and get a steamy cup of joe. Rapid Spin + Moxie is cool though and it can sneak up on you.

Jokes aside though I've been seeing some experimentation with Aqua Jet and Low Kick and I've tried Scarf (in theory it's good... right?) but it's never reaaaallly stood out to me. Quaxly is truly the working class hero so maybe I'm wrong and we should throw the duck some goddamn respect; just like all the hard working men and women across the country that rely on their local Taco Bells for their morning cup of coffee.

Psyduck and Buizel are Cinnabon Delights because they really shouldn't be good and yet here we are. I am really more partial to this set for Psyduck:

Duckman (Psyduck) @ Eviolite
Ability: Swift Swim
Level: 5
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Electric
EVs: 36 HP / 236 SpA / 236 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Nasty Plot
- Surf
- Ice Beam
- Tera Blast

Water + Ice + Electric is just crazy coverage that really prevents anything from pulling off a defensive Tera check, and being an Electric just gives you better synergy with Buizel or Arrocuda or whatever. Psychic is still good, though, for Croagunk. I think Rain is in a good spot right now and it can be really tough to check.

View attachment 469737

Larvesta is the Cheesy Fiesta Potato because that is exactly what it is. I have really enjoyed using Larvesta. As mentioned before, spreading burns is super nice and it's nice to have something to make Pawniard's think twice before coming in. Terastalizing gives this a lot more defensive potential, too; it's really funny to have a Steel-type with Flame Body, for example.

Nymble is the fucking goat, I don't care what anyone has to say. It is hitting way harder than it has any right to be, and that is why it's gotta be the Breakfast Crunchwarp Sausage. I encountered one of these things with Agility and it totally swept my ass so that is something it can do too.

Gastly and Drifloon are the..... *vague radio buzzing* hold on folks.....

.

.

.

View attachment 469741

It would appear that while I was in the middle of writing this stupid ass Taco Bell post, Misdreavus has just been banned.



Aight well. Seems we got a whole new metagame to compare to shitty fast food items. RIP Misdreavus and RIP to the bowels if you actually eat any of the slop mentioned here (of course I do).

Bye.

very funny although
he forgot the gothita
its very good with competitive

 

[gali]

Gonna share a team I like and use it to talk about my thoughts on the meta at large. This is a balance team built around a core of Mareanie+Toedscool+Pawniard, with Girafarig an automatic addition and offensive pressure coming from Scarf Rufflet and LO Diglett. Berry Juice being snapped was a huge blow to offense in general outside of Sticky Web; shit like screens and rain is way worse now that BJ is gone. The team has done very well in the games I've played with it, so I'm sharing it with y'all. Here's the paste:

https://pokepast.es/c8c5dc27f138040e

I've been hyping up Mareanie over the last couple days; it's somehow become a super underrated mon. Losing knock and Scald definitely hurts it, but it's still a super versatile defensive Pokemon that does an excellent job handling threats like Pawniard and Quaxly. Its longevity is something that very few mons in this meta have, and it's won a bunch of games for me by just outlasting opponents. Haze is a super neat tool here to deny setup opportunities to shit like Flittle and make spinners way less annoying. Tera Water is also really good to drop your weaknesses to Ground and Psychic and let you go toe-to-toe with shit like physical Girafarig. You can slot Toxic Spikes or Iron Defense on here somewhere if you want, too. Definitely use this mon, it won't disappoint you.

Toedscool is a progress machine with Knock and an almost unblockable Spore. Probably the most annoying mon in the meta rn. It's not strong and it dies pretty quickly, but you get good value out of it every match. Protip, it's an excellent lead because getting their own Toed knocked immediately as it comes into block Spore is a super underrated tempo play. I'm still toying with spreads on this but I like this one; it gives you a stronger Knock Off and 14 Speed to capitalize on Rapid Spin while bolstering your physical bulk. I don't think 17 Speed is necessary on Toed at all.

Girafarig is this meta's Mienfoo in that it's a tier above everything else. It's got awesome stats across the board that give it all 3 of bulk, Speed, and power. I think physical sets are the best because of the excellent coverage that eq+Crunch+STAB gives and the flexibility you have with the last moveslot (I'm running Wish on this team, but there are a whole bunch of other options like Thunder Wave, Early Bird Rest, etc that are all good), but Nasty Plot sets are still hugely threatening. rn I think it's merely very good (not broken) but am open to arguments in favor of that position.

Rufflet on the other hand probably is broken. This mon is just way too strong; Tera Flying Brave Bird munches through even resists really easily, and if you predict the pawn switchin correctly even once it's basically gg. Strong priority like from Pawniard is important for handling this monster, but it's so good at punching holes (80% of the time at least lol). I would support banning this.

Pawn is the #3 mon in the meta behind giraffe and Rufflet imo. As always it's a super strong glue with that fantastic typing, Stealth Rock, and a super strong Sucker Punch. I strongly believe tera Flying is the best option for pawn to escape getting trapped and avoid random tera fights memeing on you. Otherwise it's the same mon that it's been since XY just with Night Slash over knock.

Lastly, tera Dark LO Diglett is really really scary. Dark STAB in the form of Tera Blast is super useful for trapping Girafarig while also making its Sucker Punch really strong. It also lets you live suckers from Pawn which is nice. Scary breaker and also my team's best way of dealing with Nymble (super underrated mon and a huge threat to this team) by trapping it on an rk and hoping Rock Blast doesn't miss.

Overall, this meta actually feels pretty fine right now? I think Rufflet is a problematic element, and I'm keeping an eye on Girafarig, but missy and Berry Juice being gone have settled the meta pretty quickly imo. Give this team a whirl and let me know what you think!

 

[PlayerPier2]

Dang, I was getting so used to Berry Juice...
Maybe common Berries could still be a viable replacement, couldn't they?

 

[TheShoddyStrawman]

Dang, I was getting so used to Berry Juice...
Maybe common Berries could still be a viable replacement, couldn't they?

Best you have is oran. When your HP stats are so low, 1/4 is less than 10 hp. It'll be alright, but juice was signficantly better.

 

[Fiend]

The LC council has quickbanned Flittle. To the uninitiated this may seem surprising, but combination of the ability Speed Boost and the move Stored Power is extremely strong. With Calm Mind to bolster this combination, Tera types to destroy Dark-types, and just enough bulk to Roost and passively boost its primary attack, Flittle is at best extremely centralizing and at worse extremely broken. While Flittle excelled with Screens support, it often is superfluous and Flittle remained extremely strong with minimal support.

Rufflet and Girafarig remain on the radar as likely suspects in the near future. We welcome your thoughts on these top threats, and I greatly appreciate those who have been writing posts and discussing in the LC discord.

Kris bothering you again for implementing a ban on Flittle - thank you so much

 

[Laprasrules12]

I mean with how Espathra is tearing through OU and UU right now with a very similar set, I'm not surprised abouts prevo

 

[PrincessGardevoir]

The LC council has quickbanned Flittle.

I can't believe you guys made a decision I agree with as much as banning Misdreavus so soon after doing just that, but holy hell you guys did it.

I will say that the meta definitely feels healthier than it did previously, but Rain is still really strong with next to no ways to consistently stop or wall it barring Shellos or Cacnea (Water Tera Buizel is still horrifying). I've been experimenting with funny tera type Girafarigs, and I've come to the agreement with myself and myself that Fire tera, for its ability to OHKO Pawniard and OHKO Toedscool after a Nasty Plot, is the most entertaining one by far. You autolose to Diglett, but if that is the price to pay for salvation, I will TAKE IT.

 

[Flou]

https://pokepast.es/87641d10785444cd

Since Charmander was recently allowed back into LC after the 7-Star Charizard in SV, I wanted to build Sun, even though it may not be amazing.

The Setters

Shroodle is the main sun setter of the team, with a respectable 18 speed and Prankster, it's hard to deny this little guy from setting up the sun with ease. Add on moves like Taunt, Knock Off, Parting Shot or U-Turn, it's a very effective mon.

Diglett is the back-up sun setter if Shroodle dies or doesn't have a favorable switch. While Diglett lacks Prankster, it's one of the fastest unboosted mons alongside Voltorb, so it's difficult to deny the sun from this one too.

The Abusers

Charmander sadly lost Weather Ball from Gen 8 to 9, leaving it to use other options, like Flamethrower, Fire Blast and Overheat, but STAB Solar Power moves in the Sun hit as hard as ever. Adding on a Fire Tera, and you've got an effective nuke on the team. Choice Scarf is mandatory on this mon for obvious reasons. Outspeeds popular scarfer in Ruflett, and many other unboosteds (also speedties +1 Toedscool if it's max speed as well.)

Numel, while likely more of a meme choice, is effective on Sun thanks to Simple + Growth in the Sun, allowing it to get a +4 in both attacking stats in 1 turn. Flame Charge/Trailblaze gives it a +2, making it extremely fast, even with a lacking base speed. Eviolite will often give it the opportunity to get the Growth off, and you can potentially score a kill with your speed boosting attack afterward, leaving more sun turns to boost your Fire moves.

The Back-Up

Toedscool is here for Rapid Spin and Spore support, which a Sun team desperately needs. Charmander hates the rocks, as it takes damage from simply existing under the Sun, so the lack of chip from switching into rocks is greatly appreciated. Also helps to switch in on Ground type moves, which the team fears.

Pretty much here just for the rocks, breaking focus sashes good.

This team is relatively unproven, but I went 7-1 with it on the ladder so maybe that's something (its not). I love the idea of Sun in SV LC, as it lost checks like Flash Fire Ponyta that don't care about the moves Sun teams could throw off. Please give us some good Chlorophyll mons GF.

 

[Altariel von Sweep]

Thank god Flittle is finally gone. Anyway:

This Pokémon is fun to use if you need to do some role compression. Wooper's defensive typing coupled with Water Absorb allows it to blanket check a plethora of metagame defining Pokemon such as Pawniard, Quaxly, Mareanie, non-Grass Tera Blast Magnemite and Glimmet, to name a few. Since SV gave it access to both Stealth Rock and Spikes, it can set them up against these threats with ease, and force them to switch out thanks to Yawn in order to either get a layer of Spikes or hit the incoming switch-in. However, the role compression it offers often pales because of the current metagame trends and its bulk is passable at best which means that it can easily get turned into a huge momentum sink if played incorrectly.

Rain or shine, this Pokemon is on every notable weather team. Shroodle having a great Speed tier to set either Rain or Sun, coupled to a plethora of utility options boosted by Prankster in Encore, Taunt, and Parting Shot help it to summon weather as fast as possible to enable its teammates and provide helpful support by taking Eviolites away or lowering stats so setup sweepers like Psyduck on Rain or Numel in Sun can start boosting up and let loose. However, this Pokemon is also a very annoying Tera user by being able to setup with Swords Dance (I have seen Swagger Mirror Herb to trigger Unburden, though I doubt about its success) and blast Pawniard with Fighting Tera Blast, while also being able to knock out anything that does not resist the double STAB combo + Knock Off, being forced to be revenge killed by Sash Diglett or Nymble.

On god this Pokémon is so ASS on everything else, but it is one of the prime revenge killers in the metagame thanks to Life Orb Tinted Lens First Impression, being able to defeat Pokemon like Scarf Rufflet, Glimmet and Pawniard after they get chipped away, as well as being able to revenge kill Diglett if its Sash is broken, and faster threats in weather teams such as Charmander, Psyduck and Chewtle if the latter does not run Protect. Not even switch-ins can take it properly as they risk to take a really big blow that may affect to their gameplan on the long run. I hate this Pokemon so much, but I am thankful it is so ass.

These three are the most prominent faces of Rain teams. Psyduck is a very scary wallbreaker in Rain, being able to reach a whopping 30 Speed thanks to Swift Swim and have enough bulk to set up with Nasty Plot, enabling it to OHKO anything that does not resist it with the coverage +2 Rain boosted Surf, Psychic and Ice Beam provides, even being able to 2HKO resists such as Quaxly after Stealth Rock with Surf. It is also a very decent Tera user thanks to Electric Tera Blast assuring the OHKO on Quaxly and bulkier Rufflet sets.

Chewtle is probably my personal favourite out of the three thanks to its access to Shell Smash as a failsafe against other Rain teams. The drawback in comparison with Psyduck is that it's a much frailer abuser and needs to pick the right momento to either dish out Rain boosted Liquidations, or setup with Shell Smash. It can also use Tera Dark typing to threaten Girafarig and ignore Prankster Taunt from Pokemon like Shroodle and Impidimp, and 2HKO resists with +2 STAB Crunch after Stealth Rock, but the drawback is that it is easy to revenge kill and Water + Dark is an already good offensive combo. In this case, Protect fits really well to either scout for Scarf Pokemon or avoid getting revenge killed.

Lastly, after it has been known Berry Juice is not usable, Buizel took a big hit in longevity as a Swift Swim wallbreaker, but it still does just fine with Oran Berry. Bulk Up sets allow it to go nuts and it can now run Brick Break to safely beat Pawniard and keep screens at check. Tera Water makes +1 Rain boosted Wave Crash able to OHKO anything that does not resist it, as well as 2HKO resists.

These Pokémon are very straightforward and their plan is to abuse Rain as much as possible to punch holes between their combined efforts. Pretty fun to use right now.

Oh golly, this Pokemon is so fun to use. After losing Weather Ball it has to make do with Flamethrower + Fire Blast + Overheat as abusable STABs in Sun teams, but in return Terastallizing gives Charmander a chance to make its STABs much more powerful. Under the right circumstances it can even 2HKO resists by using Solar Power Tera Fire Blast, and it OHKOes fast Pokémon such as Gastly, Scarf Rufflet and Girafarig thanks to Scarf allowing it to reach 25 Speed. A big drawback, however, is that Charmander is weak to Stealth Rock and it needs Pokemon like Pawniard trapped so it can live long enough to start firing off strong nukes, and even the weaker Pokemon can put it in a pinch with stray hits due to its horrible bulk.

This Pokemon is so incredibly fun. At first glance it looks horrible because of the lack of a proper Dragon-type STAB with only Outrage as the best STAB available to make use of its sweeping capabilities, but hear me out. This metagame has a worrying lack of usable Fairy-types with only Tinkatink existing (which is kinda terrible, btw), meaning Dratini can simply boost up with Dragon Dance and click Outrage to deal severe damage to non-resisting Pokémon. In a status inducing metagame, Shed Skin is an amazing ability as it gives the chance for Dratini to cure itself from Toxic Spikes spread by Glimmet and set up against it if it has no Mud Shot. And as it should be known, Dratini is the only Pokemon with access to Extreme Speed, being able to play mindgames with opposing priority that would severely threaten it such as Sucker Punch from the likes of Pawniard and Diglett, and defeat Nymble if it has boosted up. The drawback that puts it in trouble is the lack of decent bulk, which can be patched up throughout the use of Tera Typings.

Here I leave a set I have been trying.

Tera Steel Dratini

Dratini @ Life Orb
Ability: Shed Skin
Level: 5
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 244 Atk / 36 SpD / 196 Spe
Adamant Nature
IVs: 17 HP
- Dragon Dance
- Outrage
- Iron Head
- Extreme Speed

This set shines brightly after Steel-types such as Pawniard and Magnemite, and the rare Fuecoco are removed by Diglett, but it can truly shine if Impidimp provides screens to achieve more setup opportunities. Tera Steel provides Dratini with a good defensive typing being able to setup against Girafarig and Glimmet without Mud Shot, and it gives STAB to Iron Head, being the only good coverage it can run by OHKO bulkier threats such as physically defensive physically defensive Toedscool and CM Rest Girafarig after rocks, and 2HKO Bulk Up Rufflet variants after a Dragon Dance boost. Extreme Speed is very self-explanatory as it allows to pick up Scarf Rufflet if it has been chipped away, as well as hit switch-ins to Iron Head such as Quaxly very strong. Since Shed Skin allows it to heal from status induced by Pokemon such as Toedscool, Thunder Wave Girafarig and Deerling, and Flame Body Larvesta, Dratini is unbothered to land stray hits on those Pokemon to defeat them. If there are no restrains, Dratini can simply click Outrage and start cleaning the opposing team, with no Pokemon aside from Tinkatink being able to stop it if Stealth Rock are in game.

Funniest Pokémon I have ever tried in this metagame.

 

[MK007]

Yall are sleeping on Mudbray and the value it brings to pretty much every game its in.

 

[anguish]

Hi, first post, I want to preach about Bronzor a bit. This little guy has a great typing and 86/86 defenses which means they can go up to 18/18 raw, making them super tanky when boosted by eviolite. But I prefer to invest a bit into speed so that I can exploit trick scarf utility. Here's the set I use, and then I'll explain what I think Bronzor can add to a team:

Set

bottlecap brian (Bronzor) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Levitate
Level: 5
Tera Type: Normal
EVs: 4 Atk / 228 Def / 68 SpD / 172 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Trick
- Stealth Rock
- Iron Head
- Body Slam

Care has been taken to hit even numbers for defensive values (and speed, for scarf) because multipliers like Eviolite round down.

TRICK
This hits 12 speed, which means 18 when boosted by scarf. There aren't a lot of 19ers this gen and only a few 18 speed tier pokemon like Gastly and Shroodle. Additionally, there is a significant lack of scarf or life orb users, and significantly more setup sweepers. Having the chance to gimp a status mon or a setup sweeper with trick is extremely useful, especially when the enemy is usually ready to sack multiple mons into the setup opportunity (via Momento Diglett or Glimmet)
This has the added bonus of nicking an eviolite a good chunk of the time, which allows you to switch into full tanking mode thereafter.

ROCKS
Speaks for itself. Providing rocks utility is great, and Bronzor usually has a lot of opportunities to set these up because of how frequently it walls something out of play. If something is scarfed into a bad move and has to switch, you hit rocks. If you're facing down something that just doesn't have the coverage to hit you (a lot of Diglett sets), you rocks. If you reckon the opponent is just about to momento or parting shot or whatever, you rocks.

IRON HEAD
I picked Iron Head as primary stab, but you don't really click it a lot. You can flinch cheese a little if you still have your scarf, but most importantly this was intended to just stop Bronzor from being a sitting duck lategame. Regardless, here's some calcs that make Bronzor look cool and relevant

Calcs

These calcs aren't going to make you go "Wow, bronzor oneshots everything" but moreso to show that they can deal very respectable chunks to the more frail side of the metagame.

4 Atk Bronzor Iron Head vs. 212 HP / 100 Def Glimmet: 14-18 (58.3 - 75%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

4 Atk Bronzor Iron Head vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Gastly: 9-12 (47.3 - 63.1%) -- 96.5% chance to 2HKO

4 Atk Bronzor Iron Head vs. 36 HP / 0 Def Diglett: 9-12 (50 - 66.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

4 Atk Bronzor Iron Head vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Nymble: 7-10 (36.8 - 52.6%) -- 11.3% chance to 2HKO

BODY SLAM
This is the newest addition to the set; this slot was previously dedicated to Rest, but I found I never really had a reason or opportunity to spend time resting. I wanted to make Bronzor useful long after the rocks were set up and the scarf was tricked away; a "progress machine" similar to Toedscool that can threaten to do something whenever it comes out. I've settled for Body Slam, which gives Bronzor the ability to threaten anything with a Paralysis just by being on the field. This adds a ton of utility and chip throughout the game as it consistently gives Bronzor a purpose to switch in besides resisting an attack.

Edit: DEFENSIVE CALCS (Assuming Eviolite)
I realised after posting that if I'm selling a defensive mon I probably need some calcs beyond just telling you it tanks a lot.

Calcs

Here's how Bronzor stands up to some of the big boys of the tier. You don't want to be staring at some of these mons for too long, but you can at the very least pivot through a resisted hit or threaten with body slam.

196 SpA Girafarig Twin Beam (2 hits) vs. 0 HP / 68 SpD Eviolite Bronzor: 2-2 (9 - 9%) -- possibly the worst move ever
196 SpA Girafarig Shadow Ball vs. 0 HP / 68 SpD Eviolite Bronzor: 10-12 (45.4 - 54.5%) -- 12.1% chance to 2HKO

156 Atk Pawniard Iron Head vs. 0 HP / 228 Def Eviolite Bronzor: 3-4 (13.6 - 18.1%) -- possible 6HKO
156 Atk Pawniard Night Slash vs. 0 HP / 228 Def Eviolite Bronzor: 12-14 (54.5 - 63.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

12 Atk Hustle Rufflet Brave Bird vs. 0 HP / 228 Def Eviolite Bronzor: 5-6 (22.7 - 27.2%) -- 94.9% chance to 4HKO

228 Atk Life Orb Nymble First Impression vs. 0 HP / 228 Def Eviolite Bronzor: 8-9 (36.3 - 40.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

...And an infinite amount of earthquakes.

Tera-Type and Synergies
You don't really want to Tera Bronzor. Previously I've used Tera-Water, but now I think I prefer Tera-Normal for the surprise ghost immunity and a stronger Body Slam. If you need it, it's there!
As for synergies, I really like Bronzor and Pawniard. As Steels they have a lot of defensive merits between them, and your team likely has Pawniard anyway because it's a great structural cornerstone. Bronzor offers Levitate to back up Pawniard's ground weakness, while Pawniard can switch in on the Dark and Ghost moves that Bronzor doesn't want to see. On top of this, Bronzor takes the Rocks role away from Pawniard freeing up valuable move slots for things like Brick Break or Swords Dance depending on what your team might need.
Bronzor also gets access to screens and weather setting, which could potentially be useful for a variety of teams. I can see a long-living setup pivot being useful for that.


Please let me know what you think! When a mon isn't talked about, its usually because they suck. However, I think Bronzor could definitely be a viable pick for some teams, even if only a C-tier choice in the meta overall.

 

[wesh papillon]

Hello, this is my first draft, im not super confident for anything below a+ but I think in general I have a decent grasp of the tier, tho obv this is prob gonna a lot. In any case I hope this is a gonna be a helpful tool while we dont have an actual vr