that attack is really funny because i just...never encountered it. Like I was showin a friend the fight and then saw it pull out this move and went "huh, never saw that"
-
Welcome to Smogon! Take a moment to read the Introduction to Smogon for a run-down on everything Smogon, and make sure you take some time to read the global rules.
-
Congrats to the winners of the 2023 Smog Awards!
SPOILERS! Legends: Arceus Playthrough Discussion
- Thread starter DHR-107
- Start date
???
Arceus is supposed to be hard, and what you're describing sounds like a misunderstanding of battle mechanics.
- Judgment. This is likely the first attack you will see. Arceus rapidly fires a cluster of homing shots. He will discharge this attack 6 times per cycle. Simply listen for the audio cue and dodge to the side. Do not bother trying to throw balms in this time.
- Draco Meteor. This is the attack Arceus will use most frequently. He drops a meteor on the trainer's current position (telegraphed by a circle as in the Dialga/Palkia battle) and simultaneously releases a fast radial shockwave from his own position. The trainer must dodge through the shockwave to avoid taking damage. The trainer can then slip 1-3 balms before He calls the next meteor.
- Telefrag. Arceus will use the same telefrag attack as Dialga/Palkia if the trainer runs too far away at the start of the fight. It's easy to miss that this attack even exists, and it's not something to worry about unless you're trying to balm Him from half court.
- The floor is lava. This attack doesn't map directly to any known move, but you'll know it's coming the first time Arceus turns red and vanishes from sight. Immediately backtrack to the center of the arena. He will be standing at the opposite end with a nimbus of safe floor around Himself as the rest of the battlefield turns pink. Once the trainer is safe, it's 4-5 free balms. If you keep your distance and stand at the edge of the nimbus, you can get another free cycle on Him as He repeats the attack a second time. If you get close, He disappears into shadow.
- Shadow Force. Immediately after canceling the previous attack, Arceus will disappear into shadow. The drums will fall silent. Look behind you when you hear the tinkle of glass and you'll see fractures hanging in the air. Arceus will come charging out of the shattered air at a high speed. He will aim for the trainer directly, meaning it's useless to try running around the breach. His hitbox also covers a deceptively wide area in this attack. The best thing to do is back away towards the wall for some extra distance and then dodge through Him.
- Roar of Time. This is the attack that Steel With It speaks of, and it is definitely the most confusing item on the list. It usually comes not long after Shadow Force. It's very similar to "the floor is lava," except the floor will turn blue instead of magenta. In addition, there will be three
Arceus gathering energy around the map, only one of which has a safety halo. Although the two attacks look similar, they should be handled differently.- Whereas "the floor is lava" affords the trainer little time to reach safety, Roar of Time takes a long time to charge.
- If the trainer gets too close to any of the three clones, it will disappear. The safety halo will change position to a different Arceus.
- Because the halo can change position, trying to chase "the real Arceus" will just give Him time to finish charging. It may even be intended as a red herring. Unlike "the floor is lava," here the goal is not to make a dive for safety.
- Instead, the trainer should be throwing balms. All three Arceus clones seem to be valid targets. Once the trainer hits any Arceus with 4 balms (signaled by the four blue orbs around its head), He will be stunned. The trainer can then send out a Pokémon to initiate a battle.
- Full disclosure: I have seen this attack executed only once. It's far more convenient to stun Arceus than play keepaway.
- Spacial Rend. This move functions similarly to Roar of Time inasmuch as it's a heavily damaging attack with a long charge time that leaves Arceus vulnerable. The difference is that, instead of teasing you with clones and halos, Arceus will simply try to repel you by generating slow-moving shockwaves (much slower than in Draco Meteor). The trainer can simply land 4 balms in this time to stun Him and initiate a Pokémon battle. Be warned: you can still be hit by the shockwave even when Arceus is stunned.
- If Arceus fully charges Spacial Rend, it will hit the trainer anywhere in the whole arena. The only escape is to stun Him.
- Arceus seems to favor Spacial Rend over Roar of Time when His bar is low.
If Roar of Time really was bugged for you, that's unfortunate. However, (1) Arceus is prone to reposition the AoE halo, and (2) balms can interrupt the charging phase anyway. It is not necessary to tank a hit from the final boss's strongest attack, even if its hit pattern is wonky in some manner.
Last edited:
I've had the chance to play through this game for a while now, and while it's probably one of the better Pokémon experiences we've seen on the Nintendo Switch system, I'm going to say something that, in a sense, I honestly hope people get mad about me saying this. You can all have your opinions, that's completely fine, but from what I've played through so far and have seen from other players...
This game really isn't the holy grail of production you all want to act like it is, and in some ways I'd argue it's actually worse than Sword & Shield.
There was a time when I thought that last part would never come out of my mouth, but here we are now. For what it's worth, I'm not saying Legends is an inherently bad video game. It's just not the game for me is all, and the reason I said I want you guys to get mad (I don't actually want to get in arguments with you guys, y'all are a great group) wasn't because of the game itself. The issue here is that I'm sick and tired of Pokémon fans bowing down before newly released products. I had said I want you to get mad because the consumer base deserves better after 25+ years of declining efforts one generation at a time. We're in 2022 now, and most of us are grown up. Despite this, we're still seeing all of the following since the franchise went international back in 1998 (in no particular order):
-Content only available for a limited time
-Uninspired Pokémon designs based off of ideas that already exist for the most part
-Games released and rushed out on a semi-yearly schedule instead of delayed and perfected
-Under-developed character and story narratives almost never seen in other jRPGs
-Exploitable level curves
-A lack of options as to how the player wants to enjoy their game
That last one is the one I honestly care about the most as far as my Legends playthrough is concerned. What if you're not that interested in catching several Pokémon for the PokéDex, or what if Shiny hunting isn't an interest of yours? If the Pokémon I.P. was being developed to its full potential, we could start to set our own goals. Recent games like Sun & Moon changing up the formula is great and all, but a Pokémon game that appeals to everyone would grant us more options. Am I just not supposed to play Pokémon games if something like a Gym challenge doesn't interest me? Legends gives the player practically nothing to do outside of what the game's been having the player do the entire time anyway, making for an experience that isn't very adaptive and full of bumpy moments at times.
This game really isn't the holy grail of production you all want to act like it is, and in some ways I'd argue it's actually worse than Sword & Shield.
There was a time when I thought that last part would never come out of my mouth, but here we are now. For what it's worth, I'm not saying Legends is an inherently bad video game. It's just not the game for me is all, and the reason I said I want you guys to get mad (I don't actually want to get in arguments with you guys, y'all are a great group) wasn't because of the game itself. The issue here is that I'm sick and tired of Pokémon fans bowing down before newly released products. I had said I want you to get mad because the consumer base deserves better after 25+ years of declining efforts one generation at a time. We're in 2022 now, and most of us are grown up. Despite this, we're still seeing all of the following since the franchise went international back in 1998 (in no particular order):
-Content only available for a limited time
-Uninspired Pokémon designs based off of ideas that already exist for the most part
-Games released and rushed out on a semi-yearly schedule instead of delayed and perfected
-Under-developed character and story narratives almost never seen in other jRPGs
-Exploitable level curves
-A lack of options as to how the player wants to enjoy their game
That last one is the one I honestly care about the most as far as my Legends playthrough is concerned. What if you're not that interested in catching several Pokémon for the PokéDex, or what if Shiny hunting isn't an interest of yours? If the Pokémon I.P. was being developed to its full potential, we could start to set our own goals. Recent games like Sun & Moon changing up the formula is great and all, but a Pokémon game that appeals to everyone would grant us more options. Am I just not supposed to play Pokémon games if something like a Gym challenge doesn't interest me? Legends gives the player practically nothing to do outside of what the game's been having the player do the entire time anyway, making for an experience that isn't very adaptive and full of bumpy moments at times.
I got the game yesterday and I already beaten 3 lords. I'm having a blast with the game, constantly changing my teams according to what I find and the upcoming bosses. Speaking of which they're pretty well designed:
Kleavor: Standard 1st boss, with attacks very easy to avoid, to give you an idea of how Lord Pokemon fights are.
Lilligant: Also a few attacks but it focuses on teaching dodge roll to the player. The field is small and one of her attacks is unavoidable unless you roll at the right time.
Arcanine: An even more awkward field and fire spins that restrict even more your movement, so the dodge roll is essential, as well as having to know how to throw balm from a distance while Arcanine is charging his unavoidable attack. Best boss so far, both gameplay and storywise.
Kleavor: Standard 1st boss, with attacks very easy to avoid, to give you an idea of how Lord Pokemon fights are.
Lilligant: Also a few attacks but it focuses on teaching dodge roll to the player. The field is small and one of her attacks is unavoidable unless you roll at the right time.
Arcanine: An even more awkward field and fire spins that restrict even more your movement, so the dodge roll is essential, as well as having to know how to throw balm from a distance while Arcanine is charging his unavoidable attack. Best boss so far, both gameplay and storywise.
Considering that's what the series flagship entries have been doing for 25 years... yeah?
I don't really understand what you mean by "setting your own goals" in a Pokémon game, or any video game, really, because every game has its own set of goals or objectives you are intended to work toward. There might be sidequests or achievements to do, too, but those have to be within the framework of options already presented by the game. Pokémon's main goal has always been to clear the 8 (or 7, in the case of Sun and Moon) challenges scattered across the region so you can fight the 5 strongest trainers the region has to offer (presented differently in Gens 5 and 8, but the idea is similar). You get what amounts to an achievement for doing this in gens 3 and 4 by gaining a star on your trainer card (and probably 5 and up; I admit to not actually paying attention to this in recent games). Those games have other "achievements" you can get by finishing other objectives the game presents to you (completing the Pokédex, beating contests, etc). They're not the main objective, but you can use the creatures you've been going around collecting to do them as well.
I see you have an avatar of one of the Ranger series main characters. As a possible example of adding options of how a player would want to enjoy their game, are you suggesting the main games integrate playing as a Ranger into their main gameplay options? I haven't played any of the Ranger series (and don't really know much about the gameplay except "you draw circles around the Pokémon to... capture/calm them?"), so I don't know how much work would have to go into implementing that, but if it was included, the devs would have to also create what would amount to an entirely different story and set of gameplay objectives to beat the game. Another idea I've seen thrown around for an option for our main character to play as would be a Coordinator. Setting aside the fact that participating in contests is something you can do anyway at your leisure (in the games that include them, of course), how are you supposed to implement this without also making your character battle to possibly evolve your Pokémon, let them get new moves, or even travel?
Legends Arceus is the first time Game Freak has made a Pokémon game that actively tries to do something at least a little different with its gameplay structure and story progression (yeah, you still have to clear 5 "challenges" across the subregions in Hisui, but at least from a worldbuilding perspective it wasn't what your character was originally going to do, and it's certainly not something that other Wielders do). It's the first time your character has shown any sort of physical ability aside from ungodly stamina for walking/running/bike riding (not much, but they gotta have their overworld progression roadblocks somehow). It's the first time the main character can actually engage with a Pokémon in a combat situation without Pokémon of their own (unless I'm missing something). It's the first time that battles clearly take place in the actual location you start them in, rather than in a simplified background representing the current area. It's the first mainline game where interacting with Pokémon on the overworld is more than just "run into them and battle them"; I was personally thrilled when I figured out that some Pokémon "play" with you instead of just going aggro/running away, and how you can give them food. The system still needs work (can I please just gently set my food items down instead of pitching them), but I found it to be a substantial breath of fresh air, and it helped to make the world feel real.
I didn't keep up on a lot of promotional materials for the game, so I don't know if the game's catching focus was apparent before release. But the game itself very quickly demonstrates that the bulk of the game is supposed to be you going around the region catching and interacting with the Pokémon you find. I can agree that, beyond that, there isn't necessarily a whole lot to do (sidequests exist, I guess), so if you don't enjoy that, the game won't hold you for very long. But not every game is for every person, and that's okay!
So I finished the game by catching Arceus, and I figured that I'd finally stop lurking this place, since I definitely have Very Important Thoughts about this game
I'll start with the pros, since overall I'm much more happy with the game than I am critical of it, and its good points deserve to be highlighted.
* Sinnoh was translated quite well to a different style of game entirely. Admittedly there were some moments where I was baffled by the geography of something things - I don't know why Stark Island is tiny, for instance - but generally speaking, the region felt recognizable despite having been transposed from a flat 2D grid to a 3D, more open environment. The environments are memorable, but are also cohesive enough with both itself and the Sinnoh of Gen 4 that I never questioned if this was really the Sinnoh I knew (except, again, for Stark Island - why is it so small?!).
* The return of cross-gen evos is a joy to see. Having finally prevailed in the 10-year-long War of the Eviolite, it's good to see that GF is willing to concede that retcons sometimes happen in a series like this and finally return to such a great method of breathing new life into old lines. This isn't to say things like Megas or regional forms are bad by any stretch, but rather that something like Wyrdeer stands out more than, say, a Galarian Stantler with no evolution would have. While I question the choice of giving Ursaring of all 'mons an evolution, otherwise I quite like Kleavor, Wyrdeer, Basculegion, Sneasler, and Overqwil (even if I dislike that the latter two only evolve through Hisuian forms - regular Scyther evolves into Kleavor, so what's the issue with Sneasler and Overqwil?)
* The Pokedex is a much more compelling system in this game than in the past, and I'd welcome its concepts being implemented in the main series, albeit with less in the way of repeating tasks given how there's a greater disconnect between movement and captures in mainline. Everyone loves this, and GF would be remiss not to build on it in the future given how otherwise-stagnant the Pokedex has been in the series. This game's greater emphasis on catching than battling was admittedly very jarring at first, but once you adapt to the new gameplay flow, it's quite fun to fill out your Dex and climb in the ranks.
* Grit is an excellent replacement for EVs and IVs in the context of the main-game, and I'd be glad to see a similar mechanic in the main series.
* Was Volo a predictable antagonist? Yes. Do I still love him? Absolutely yes! I had him pegged as an antagonist the moment he was revealed, but he was an enjoyable character all the way through, and having the final battle be against Cynthia's ancestor (with a fittingly sinister theme) was a joy. Cogita was also quite a nice surprise, and was definitely a highlight of the lategame - just enough mystery to be compelling, yet we get enough of a insight into her as a person that interactions with her never felt lacking. As a side-note, Adaman and Irida were also quite likable, as were Palina and Iscan, even if I don't consider them highlights in the same way as I do Volo and Cogita.
* Noble battles were a lot of fun! I wish they took some more cues from the Totems of Alola with helper 'mons, especially given that 1v2 and 1v3 battles already exist in this game's context, and the infinite supply of balms gets a little silly after a while, but they were all enjoyable in their own right. I also appreciated how the difficulty (except for Arceus) was essentially alterable at your own whims - thanks to the resume feature letting you choose between starting at the HP threshold you last met or starting over, you could opt to just stand still, throw balms and resume your progress until you won, or commit to overcoming the fight. Avalugg in particular was a nice surprise for these fights - wasn't expecting him to be Dynamaxed in all but name (and smoke)! Who said Ice types couldn't be good final bosses?
Now for negatives. While none of these things are game-ruining by any stretch, I think they're pretty glaring issues, and I'd like to see them ironed out for future Legends games (and mainline, should they choose to implement elements of Legends there).
* The graphics are bad. Everyone and their grandmother has discussed this to death, so I can't add anything new to this conversation, but I will say that crunch culture strikes me as a more likely culprit than GF being bad devs - but at the same time, seeing a powerpoint Crobat in the background makes me question why GF can't hire even a few more employees.
* Crafting is a system mindlessly imported from BOTW without considering why it works in BOTW. Smashing rocks or trees every few seconds to stock up on resources isn't engaging, it's a chore - and at a point, I was just buying crafting materials rather than gathering them, which is a much more efficient use of my time. There's also just too much stuff to craft, and not enough incentive to craft them; there's never really a reason to make any of the better lures or stun items when Oran berries and spoiled apricorns work 9 times out of 10, especially in tandem with smoke bombs. Combine that with obscenely limited bag space with a hefty price tag to increase, and I would be glad to see this gone entirely. Shops are a perfectly fine economy for games, and Pokemon should be the main draw of this game's environment anyhow.
* The regional forms were for the most part, in my opinion, pretty weak. Hopefully they get new abilities when Home compatibility hits, because otherwise they all feel very uninspired. For the most part, it was just the same Pokemon, but with a new type and more details stapled on. Arcanine gets a Rock typing with a rock coating, Electrode gets Grass and gets a wood polish, so on and so forth. They even mostly keep the same statlines! The exceptions were Hisuian Zoroark and Braviary, both of which I find to be great designs and sufficiently distinct from their original forms.
* I found that except for Wyrdeer, all of the ride pokemon felt really bad to use. Ursaluna has an awkward gait and is much too slow for my liking, Basculegion's speed was never quite right and made catching water 'mons grueling, Braviary is just a glorified glider despite being a bird, and worst of all, Sneasler is latching on and off ledges every 5 seconds and has an incredibly awkward control scheme. There was never an instance where I felt like the gameplay was genuinely *improved* by the addition of these, and it's a bad sign when I don't regard ride 'mons as useful tools, but as burdens thrust on me until I can get back on Wyrdeer or my own two feet.
* Having most characters be ancestors was kinda charming at first, but the more I dwell on it is an extremely cheap way to get people invested, and is used far too often. Like I said before, I think Volo and Cogita stand out on their own without simply being "Cynthia's ancestors", but for many side characters it was very blatant to me that the game was relying on your meta knowledge of who's ancestor this is to get you attached. Pokemon's characterization of its humans has never been a strong point for the most part, but I can't tell you anything meaningful about many of the characters besides "I guess they're ancestors of", and most of them are so paper-thin that any discussion about them just boils down to "well, they share some superficial traits with x or y character, so I guess they're the ancestor of them!" It's such a transparent way to get people attached without actually doing any writing that I'm surprised it's not a more common criticism. On the topic of characters...
* Commander Kamado is awful. Moreover, he's a realistic kind of awful; paranoia and shortsightedness are both all-too-common traits, and all of us know too well useless leaders who do nothing but sit at the top and let their employees take the fall for them - but I hate him, and I wish the game addressed him being a genuinely horrible leader more. He does nothing for the entire game but spit orders at you, and his reward to you for doing everything perfectly is to exile you and threaten to re-ignite the conflict that he allegedly solved. It's a wonder that no one in Jubilife seems to realize that he should have been removed from his post long ago.
* I hate the battle system in the context of trainer battles. Things hitting as hard as they do, and the Agile/Strong Style system, works fine for fights with Alpha and Noble 'mons since there's the inherent dichotomy of 6 v 1, but trainer battles devolve into revenge kills. With this in tandem with competent trainers being a non-existent breed in Hisui, this game's battles are its weakest link in terms of gempaly. Like the graphics, I think plenty of people have discussed this at length, so I don't see anything more I can add. As someone who loves battles, this was easily the most disappointing part of the game for me, except for...
My biggest gripe, above all others, is something ultimately very subjective, but something that bothered me throughout almost the entire experience, and it's this: when I play a game called Legends, I want to, you know, experience the Legends - not have them told to me once more. The decision to place this game in the ~1800s is something I don't like, even if I understand its real world basis in the colonization of Hokkaido. I think you could have incorporated that real-world element without making it a complete analogue in terms of historicity. Aside from Giratina (and Shaymin, actually - seeing Floaroma's origins was fantastic), I don't feel like I have any real new insight to the, well, legends of Sinnoh; sure, Dialga and Palkia got new forms, but what do they really tell me about their lore in any meaningful way? I'm not saying that we should know everything about these incomprehensible cosmic beings, as that takes the fun out of it - but conversely, I never felt like I was experiencing the legends, just its leftovers. The game puts you in this weird midpoint of Sinnoh's history where all of the notable events have already seemed to happen and everything else interesting will happen long after Kamado bites the dust (I'll be throwing the afterparty after his funeral btw, all of Hisui is invited). The game's catalyst for its mysteries is the spacetime portal above Mt. Coronet, but that doesn't strike me as interesting enough, and trying to center the game around no one knowing who Arceus is is odd when you know damn well who Arceus is.
Even though I typed much more about the flaws of this game than what I like about it, I should emphasize that I think this game was a great, albeit flawed experience, and that hopefully one day we can look back at this game as a first step into something even better - shaky in some ways, yes, but an important starting point that finds its footing as it goes, and with any luck we'll see this new formula improve over time. We're probably a few years off from it, but I have to say I'm already looking forward to Legends Kyurem - or whatever comes before that, I suppose!
I'll start with the pros, since overall I'm much more happy with the game than I am critical of it, and its good points deserve to be highlighted.
* Sinnoh was translated quite well to a different style of game entirely. Admittedly there were some moments where I was baffled by the geography of something things - I don't know why Stark Island is tiny, for instance - but generally speaking, the region felt recognizable despite having been transposed from a flat 2D grid to a 3D, more open environment. The environments are memorable, but are also cohesive enough with both itself and the Sinnoh of Gen 4 that I never questioned if this was really the Sinnoh I knew (except, again, for Stark Island - why is it so small?!).
* The return of cross-gen evos is a joy to see. Having finally prevailed in the 10-year-long War of the Eviolite, it's good to see that GF is willing to concede that retcons sometimes happen in a series like this and finally return to such a great method of breathing new life into old lines. This isn't to say things like Megas or regional forms are bad by any stretch, but rather that something like Wyrdeer stands out more than, say, a Galarian Stantler with no evolution would have. While I question the choice of giving Ursaring of all 'mons an evolution, otherwise I quite like Kleavor, Wyrdeer, Basculegion, Sneasler, and Overqwil (even if I dislike that the latter two only evolve through Hisuian forms - regular Scyther evolves into Kleavor, so what's the issue with Sneasler and Overqwil?)
* The Pokedex is a much more compelling system in this game than in the past, and I'd welcome its concepts being implemented in the main series, albeit with less in the way of repeating tasks given how there's a greater disconnect between movement and captures in mainline. Everyone loves this, and GF would be remiss not to build on it in the future given how otherwise-stagnant the Pokedex has been in the series. This game's greater emphasis on catching than battling was admittedly very jarring at first, but once you adapt to the new gameplay flow, it's quite fun to fill out your Dex and climb in the ranks.
* Grit is an excellent replacement for EVs and IVs in the context of the main-game, and I'd be glad to see a similar mechanic in the main series.
* Was Volo a predictable antagonist? Yes. Do I still love him? Absolutely yes! I had him pegged as an antagonist the moment he was revealed, but he was an enjoyable character all the way through, and having the final battle be against Cynthia's ancestor (with a fittingly sinister theme) was a joy. Cogita was also quite a nice surprise, and was definitely a highlight of the lategame - just enough mystery to be compelling, yet we get enough of a insight into her as a person that interactions with her never felt lacking. As a side-note, Adaman and Irida were also quite likable, as were Palina and Iscan, even if I don't consider them highlights in the same way as I do Volo and Cogita.
* Noble battles were a lot of fun! I wish they took some more cues from the Totems of Alola with helper 'mons, especially given that 1v2 and 1v3 battles already exist in this game's context, and the infinite supply of balms gets a little silly after a while, but they were all enjoyable in their own right. I also appreciated how the difficulty (except for Arceus) was essentially alterable at your own whims - thanks to the resume feature letting you choose between starting at the HP threshold you last met or starting over, you could opt to just stand still, throw balms and resume your progress until you won, or commit to overcoming the fight. Avalugg in particular was a nice surprise for these fights - wasn't expecting him to be Dynamaxed in all but name (and smoke)! Who said Ice types couldn't be good final bosses?
Now for negatives. While none of these things are game-ruining by any stretch, I think they're pretty glaring issues, and I'd like to see them ironed out for future Legends games (and mainline, should they choose to implement elements of Legends there).
* The graphics are bad. Everyone and their grandmother has discussed this to death, so I can't add anything new to this conversation, but I will say that crunch culture strikes me as a more likely culprit than GF being bad devs - but at the same time, seeing a powerpoint Crobat in the background makes me question why GF can't hire even a few more employees.
* Crafting is a system mindlessly imported from BOTW without considering why it works in BOTW. Smashing rocks or trees every few seconds to stock up on resources isn't engaging, it's a chore - and at a point, I was just buying crafting materials rather than gathering them, which is a much more efficient use of my time. There's also just too much stuff to craft, and not enough incentive to craft them; there's never really a reason to make any of the better lures or stun items when Oran berries and spoiled apricorns work 9 times out of 10, especially in tandem with smoke bombs. Combine that with obscenely limited bag space with a hefty price tag to increase, and I would be glad to see this gone entirely. Shops are a perfectly fine economy for games, and Pokemon should be the main draw of this game's environment anyhow.
* The regional forms were for the most part, in my opinion, pretty weak. Hopefully they get new abilities when Home compatibility hits, because otherwise they all feel very uninspired. For the most part, it was just the same Pokemon, but with a new type and more details stapled on. Arcanine gets a Rock typing with a rock coating, Electrode gets Grass and gets a wood polish, so on and so forth. They even mostly keep the same statlines! The exceptions were Hisuian Zoroark and Braviary, both of which I find to be great designs and sufficiently distinct from their original forms.
* I found that except for Wyrdeer, all of the ride pokemon felt really bad to use. Ursaluna has an awkward gait and is much too slow for my liking, Basculegion's speed was never quite right and made catching water 'mons grueling, Braviary is just a glorified glider despite being a bird, and worst of all, Sneasler is latching on and off ledges every 5 seconds and has an incredibly awkward control scheme. There was never an instance where I felt like the gameplay was genuinely *improved* by the addition of these, and it's a bad sign when I don't regard ride 'mons as useful tools, but as burdens thrust on me until I can get back on Wyrdeer or my own two feet.
* Having most characters be ancestors was kinda charming at first, but the more I dwell on it is an extremely cheap way to get people invested, and is used far too often. Like I said before, I think Volo and Cogita stand out on their own without simply being "Cynthia's ancestors", but for many side characters it was very blatant to me that the game was relying on your meta knowledge of who's ancestor this is to get you attached. Pokemon's characterization of its humans has never been a strong point for the most part, but I can't tell you anything meaningful about many of the characters besides "I guess they're ancestors of", and most of them are so paper-thin that any discussion about them just boils down to "well, they share some superficial traits with x or y character, so I guess they're the ancestor of them!" It's such a transparent way to get people attached without actually doing any writing that I'm surprised it's not a more common criticism. On the topic of characters...
* Commander Kamado is awful. Moreover, he's a realistic kind of awful; paranoia and shortsightedness are both all-too-common traits, and all of us know too well useless leaders who do nothing but sit at the top and let their employees take the fall for them - but I hate him, and I wish the game addressed him being a genuinely horrible leader more. He does nothing for the entire game but spit orders at you, and his reward to you for doing everything perfectly is to exile you and threaten to re-ignite the conflict that he allegedly solved. It's a wonder that no one in Jubilife seems to realize that he should have been removed from his post long ago.
* I hate the battle system in the context of trainer battles. Things hitting as hard as they do, and the Agile/Strong Style system, works fine for fights with Alpha and Noble 'mons since there's the inherent dichotomy of 6 v 1, but trainer battles devolve into revenge kills. With this in tandem with competent trainers being a non-existent breed in Hisui, this game's battles are its weakest link in terms of gempaly. Like the graphics, I think plenty of people have discussed this at length, so I don't see anything more I can add. As someone who loves battles, this was easily the most disappointing part of the game for me, except for...
My biggest gripe, above all others, is something ultimately very subjective, but something that bothered me throughout almost the entire experience, and it's this: when I play a game called Legends, I want to, you know, experience the Legends - not have them told to me once more. The decision to place this game in the ~1800s is something I don't like, even if I understand its real world basis in the colonization of Hokkaido. I think you could have incorporated that real-world element without making it a complete analogue in terms of historicity. Aside from Giratina (and Shaymin, actually - seeing Floaroma's origins was fantastic), I don't feel like I have any real new insight to the, well, legends of Sinnoh; sure, Dialga and Palkia got new forms, but what do they really tell me about their lore in any meaningful way? I'm not saying that we should know everything about these incomprehensible cosmic beings, as that takes the fun out of it - but conversely, I never felt like I was experiencing the legends, just its leftovers. The game puts you in this weird midpoint of Sinnoh's history where all of the notable events have already seemed to happen and everything else interesting will happen long after Kamado bites the dust (I'll be throwing the afterparty after his funeral btw, all of Hisui is invited). The game's catalyst for its mysteries is the spacetime portal above Mt. Coronet, but that doesn't strike me as interesting enough, and trying to center the game around no one knowing who Arceus is is odd when you know damn well who Arceus is.
Even though I typed much more about the flaws of this game than what I like about it, I should emphasize that I think this game was a great, albeit flawed experience, and that hopefully one day we can look back at this game as a first step into something even better - shaky in some ways, yes, but an important starting point that finds its footing as it goes, and with any luck we'll see this new formula improve over time. We're probably a few years off from it, but I have to say I'm already looking forward to Legends Kyurem - or whatever comes before that, I suppose!
Funny you should say this.
I was recently trying to brainstorm what the best candidates are for future Legends games. I won't go too deep into the list I made, because it seems kind of, well, wishlisty, except to say that I ranked Kyurem 2nd behind only Mewtwo.
But I actually think I'd be very interested someday in seeing a Legends-style game centred on a new legendary/mythical that we haven't seen before. I doubt they would ever make such a game, if only for marketing reasons, but it would solve the problem of the players already knowing so much before they start playing.
It really did feel like a missed opportunity to not...really...learn anything new about any of the legends. Like we kind of did, but very passively, and in the case of Giratina very very quickly at the 11th hour tucked between things we did already know about it.
Arceus in particular sure is at best a background element in its own game
Arceus in particular sure is at best a background element in its own game
personally i'd think Kalos would be #1 just because it'd give an opportunity to do anything with the lore of the region....
Anyone got screwed with Cresselia quest? I chose to not speak to the most disliked NPC in the game and caught Cress while I didn't know it softlocked the game.
Now I'm just waiting for GF to patch this instead restarting my 50hr playthrough
Now I'm just waiting for GF to patch this instead restarting my 50hr playthrough
I'm pretty sure they did in fact just patch this, so I'm surprised you ran into this issue
I finished the main game in 32 hours and the Arceus Fight in 72 hours ! I really love the game ! It's really a fresh start and I want this series to continue !!! I want a Legend : AZ war / Zygarde, or a Legend Celebi (Johto is tied to Sinnoh to having the biggest lore). Is it possible to have a Legend Series in a modern world ?
I couldn't list everything I love about this game (mechanics, new forms, new pokemon, characters ancestors, the village that grow up, the lore etc especially the legendary the battle and the capture is not hard, it's starting the fight which is difficult), I will just list some things that makes me ... uncomfortable
Commander Kamado ? I still don't understand his late behavior + the potato guy - ninja
Why other trainers/Pokemon can be 2 or 3 against me and I still only send one Pokemon
I will really like to complete ALL the tasks from the Pokedex, but that's impossible ... Less tasks thresholds and more diverse tasks ?
The tutorial was a bit long with SO many characters first then I liked all the characters, especially the NPC from the town
Arceus fight and the tornado from the Genies make my cried, but that that prevents the game being too easy
Is is possible to find all the Wisps + all the Unown without any help ?
Without Serebii, I found 93 wisps alone and only ... 3 unown. I've never understood that there was some hints in the Unown Pokedex hints ahaha
I couldn't list everything I love about this game (mechanics, new forms, new pokemon, characters ancestors, the village that grow up, the lore etc especially the legendary the battle and the capture is not hard, it's starting the fight which is difficult), I will just list some things that makes me ... uncomfortable
Commander Kamado ? I still don't understand his late behavior + the potato guy - ninja
Why other trainers/Pokemon can be 2 or 3 against me and I still only send one Pokemon
I will really like to complete ALL the tasks from the Pokedex, but that's impossible ... Less tasks thresholds and more diverse tasks ?
The tutorial was a bit long with SO many characters first then I liked all the characters, especially the NPC from the town
Arceus fight and the tornado from the Genies make my cried, but that that prevents the game being too easy
Is is possible to find all the Wisps + all the Unown without any help ?
Without Serebii, I found 93 wisps alone and only ... 3 unown. I've never understood that there was some hints in the Unown Pokedex hints ahaha
I also take issue with some plot points leading up to the Dialga/Palkia encounters, but the characterization of Kamado is not one of them.
The man repeatedly says things to the effect of "You can't expect everyone to trust a stranger like you" and "Many villagers still find you dodgy," but literally nobody in the village expresses these misgivings. The only other person who comes close is his personal bootlicker Beni, who is mostly just overjoyed he can dust off his license to kill. It was pretty clear to me that it was Kamado alone who was anxious about the trainer's role in the spacetime rift, and he was projecting those anxieties onto the masses (from day one) in order to justify what he would do for his own peace of mind.
The only wrinkle is that you could argue GameFreak is so incompetent they just failed to show the other villagers Kamado was mentioning, but I'd prefer to think this was a rare flash of subtlety. There never were any paranoid villagers. There was only ever Kamado, speaking on his own behalf, because your existence terrified him.
I found all 28 Unown and exactly 106 Spiritomb wisps on my own. There was one wisp I was missing in the Crimson Mirelands at journey's end, and after spending four hours searching blindly in uncooperative weather I finally consulted Serebii's maps... It was located along the westernmost wall, in a valley, behind a tree. For the love of God, why did no one in the studio think to give the dedicated item-finder bear a wisp-finder function?
The villagers absolutely find us dodgy, by the way. Like I talked with them at several points, its only over the course of the game that most of them open up towards us. There's a lot of "putting on airs" type deals, where they put on a more polite facade as you approach or speak with them, but you can definitely tell they see us as dodgey and anxious.I also take issue with some plot points leading up to the Dialga/Palkia encounters, but the characterization of Kamado is not one of them.
The man repeatedly says things to the effect of "You can't expect everyone to trust a stranger like you" and "Many villagers still find you dodgy," but literally nobody in the village expresses these misgivings. The only other person who comes close is his personal bootlicker Beni, who is mostly just overjoyed he can dust off his license to kill. It was pretty clear to me that it was Kamado alone who was anxious about the trainer's role in the spacetime rift, and he was projecting those anxieties onto the masses (from day one) in order to justify what he would do for his own peace of mind.
The only wrinkle is that you could argue GameFreak is so incompetent they just failed to show the other villagers Kamado was mentioning, but I'd prefer to think this was a rare flash of subtlety. There never were any paranoid villagers. There was only ever Kamado, speaking on his own behalf, because your existence terrified him.
It gets less pronounced as the game progresses and I can believe that some would fall back on that unfair appraisal as the sky falls around them at the climax (though the game definitely underlines that Kamado's opinion is not necessarily the same as everyone else's during the climax).
Adding to this, as far as I remember a lot of Kamado's motivation is basically that he's afraid of Pokemon (which, as we're reminded a few times, are terrifying creatures). The Galaxy Team is gradually getting a handle on things by catching and studying ordinary Pokemon, but once the climax gets going, Kamado sees the frenzied legendary as a serious threat that needs to be swiftly crushed. I don't think Beni has much motivation beyond just being Kamado's loyal enforcer.
Edit: But once the player deals with Dialga/Palkia, Kamado recognizes his mistakes, and that's why he's not hostile for the rest of the game. I did think that part was maybe kind of sudden, but he was never really a "bad guy," so backing down from the conflict makes good enough sense.
Edit: But once the player deals with Dialga/Palkia, Kamado recognizes his mistakes, and that's why he's not hostile for the rest of the game. I did think that part was maybe kind of sudden, but he was never really a "bad guy," so backing down from the conflict makes good enough sense.
I understand why he feels suspicious about us, about agressive Pokemon, but it changed too much his personality without any good reason ...
Is Noble Hisiuan Avalugg Dynamaxed for you ? and Did it happen ? He was the only one not agressive to others
Is Noble Hisiuan Avalugg Dynamaxed for you ? and Did it happen ? He was the only one not agressive to others
I mean there is good reason: an apocalypse appeared to be happening and he's a high strung guy with a stressful pass in a stressful situation. I think his behavior tracks (his turn around on being defeated probably was too fast but such is pacing sometimes....)
Noble Avalugg is probably meant to just be very very large, not dynamaxed. There's no other indicators associated with it, and no other hints towards it.
And while it wasn't rampaging like the others, it was definitely aggressive: just getting near it had it go on a fairly fierce attack. Honestly if it had become as actively aggressive as the other nobles appeared to have it probably would've done mroe damage than just cause some avalanches.
I already beaten the main story with 25 hours of playtime, it's surprising how much time I spent catching alphas and doing sidequests and yet my level was still below Palkia's 65, so good job there. Here's my final team before the fight (later changed Garchomp for Palkia). I love this game, I'm going to talk about in more detail for other time.
Electrode: Chaos. PURE ABSOLUTE CHAOS. There's homing orbs, falling Voltorbs that explode and a giant radius explosion. Hopefully you mastered dodging at this point. Even the battle part is annoying, since it's well...Electrode. With an insane speed and almost always T waving in turn 1, I needed a lot of luck to beat it.
Avalugg: Not as chaotic as Electrode but still challenging to dodge, especially that Icicle Spear attack. Also don't get hit by that giant f you laser, worst mistake of my life.
Origin Dialga: Honestly pretty disappointing compared to the prev bosses. Its attacks are easy to avoid and pretty generic for a deity of time, giving you lots of chances to hit it safely and the HP bar goes down fast. I didn't even get the chance to battle it with my team smh...It's a shame because the leadup was great and that battle theme is S PLUS TIER.
Main Story bosses ranked (by me): Arcanine > Avalugg > Electrode > Origin Dialga > Lilligant > Kleavor
Continuing my little boss analysis...
Electrode: Chaos. PURE ABSOLUTE CHAOS. There's homing orbs, falling Voltorbs that explode and a giant radius explosion. Hopefully you mastered dodging at this point. Even the battle part is annoying, since it's well...Electrode. With an insane speed and almost always T waving in turn 1, I needed a lot of luck to beat it.
Avalugg: Not as chaotic as Electrode but still challenging to dodge, especially that Icicle Spear attack. Also don't get hit by that giant f you laser, worst mistake of my life.
Origin Dialga: Honestly pretty disappointing compared to the prev bosses. Its attacks are easy to avoid and pretty generic for a deity of time, giving you lots of chances to hit it safely and the HP bar goes down fast. I didn't even get the chance to battle it with my team smh...It's a shame because the leadup was great and that battle theme is S PLUS TIER.
Main Story bosses ranked (by me): Arcanine > Avalugg > Electrode > Origin Dialga > Lilligant > Kleavor
I love how Snorlax and Abomasnow are just sitting there sleepily while everyone else is actually looking at you.
Boy, you really went all-in with the shinies... and the blue. Out of curiosity, what is your Gliscor's moveset? Am I looking at Bulldoze or Spikes?
Edit: This was supposed to be a reply to Stellar, not Worldie.
I'll also use this a segue to post some group photos of my own that I was too tech-illiterate to share sooner.
Pasture Bridge—where Hisui's heroes hanker to hang out. | 
Floaro Main Street—sweet dreams for all (except one ever-waking Beautifly). |
Spring Path—tough pickle for Enamorus or firing range for Earth Power? | 
Pasture Bridge (again)—the overdeity of dragonkind likes it here too. |
At present, we are Lv. 94-95 on average and just short of rank 10... but hey, we did the Arceus rematch damageless. That gives us some clout, right?
Last edited:
Teampostin'? Teampostin'.
Post-game version; I already had the shiny Basculegion and Goodra, but took a short break between Palkia and Volo to go full shiny dream team (except for my starter Decidueye, since I like the autumn colours better).
Say what you will about Sneasler's dude-in-a-fursuit proportions and I'll probably agree, but it has a fucking fantastic shiny palette. =P
Post-game version; I already had the shiny Basculegion and Goodra, but took a short break between Palkia and Volo to go full shiny dream team (except for my starter Decidueye, since I like the autumn colours better).
Say what you will about Sneasler's dude-in-a-fursuit proportions and I'll probably agree, but it has a fucking fantastic shiny palette. =P
ive been busy w irl stuff but ive been playing this game here and there when i have time. like sometimes ill play after i get home from work in bed and ive really fallen in love with it when i do get the chance to grind. i really like the open world aspect of it and its easy to have a lot of fun just searching for what pokemon i can find. this is def my favorite pokemon game of all time-it hits different for me in a really good way
i was too lazy to "plan out" my team for this game which is probably for the better, so im currently just catching mons i feel like and adding it to my team. stantler originally wasnt a keeper but ive kinda fallen in love with wyrdeer after riding on it a ton and its my favorite new pokemon now because that design is just sick af. i really like the white coat and thats why i named mine snowy
. i have mixed feelings about hisuian goodra but goodra is my favorite mon in general so i wanna get it as well. so far what im keeping is scyther (i wanna evolve it into scizor bc kleavor is ugly af 
), samurott, goomy and wydeer. kirlia and eevee r just two mons im trying to level up in general and maybe keep eevee if i can manage to get glaceon.
THE SQUAD:
i just beat lilligant yesterday and im probably not gonna be playing until next week bc college but overall this game brought me back into pokemon games in general after not being too into sword and shield or bdsp so im happy to be having a lot of fun again :) im excited about filling the last 2 slots of my team since messing around and seeing what random mons i can catch is super enjoyable for me
also lmao i spent like 4 hours searching around the swamp area for goomy because goomy always lives in a swamp in the games, i even waited until it started raining because i thought it was a weather encounter or something but i finally gave up and searched it up online and went to the holm of trials to get it
i was too lazy to "plan out" my team for this game which is probably for the better, so im currently just catching mons i feel like and adding it to my team. stantler originally wasnt a keeper but ive kinda fallen in love with wyrdeer after riding on it a ton and its my favorite new pokemon now because that design is just sick af. i really like the white coat and thats why i named mine snowy
. i have mixed feelings about hisuian goodra but goodra is my favorite mon in general so i wanna get it as well. so far what im keeping is scyther (i wanna evolve it into scizor bc kleavor is ugly af ), samurott, goomy and wydeer. kirlia and eevee r just two mons im trying to level up in general and maybe keep eevee if i can manage to get glaceon.
THE SQUAD:
i just beat lilligant yesterday and im probably not gonna be playing until next week bc college but overall this game brought me back into pokemon games in general after not being too into sword and shield or bdsp so im happy to be having a lot of fun again :) im excited about filling the last 2 slots of my team since messing around and seeing what random mons i can catch is super enjoyable for me
also lmao i spent like 4 hours searching around the swamp area for goomy because goomy always lives in a swamp in the games, i even waited until it started raining because i thought it was a weather encounter or something but i finally gave up and searched it up online and went to the holm of trials to get it
Last edited:
