Jirachi Discussion

[Flashstorm1]

Jirachi is often an overlooked Pokémon in Ubers, but testing shows it can fill some nice niches in the metagame.

Anyways, this discussion will serve to create and test sets for Jirachi that work in the Ubers metagame.

For reference, please check this analysis (albeit a bit outdated): http://www.smogon.com/forums/showthread.php?t=59263

Here are some notable moves in Jirachi's movepool for use in ubers:

- Wish
- Gravity
- Healing Wish
- Doom Desire
- Reflect / Light Screen
- Thunder Wave
- Stealth Rock
- Grass Knot
- U-turn
- Flash Cannon
- Trick Room
- Fire Punch
- Ice Punch
- Iron Head
- Signal Beam
- Draco Meteor

Anyways, share your thoughts.

 

[tripe]

Scarf Jirachi, very effective Rayquaza check, which to most teams is extremely valuable. Other than the scarf set, I don't see much else that Jirachi can do, besides wish support. His steel typing does help take dragon attacks though, but only 100/100/100 defenses, he can't take them all day, especially since he has no "instant" recovery, and no, wish doesn't count, since it takes a turn to activate.

 

[IcyMan28]

Jirachi can definitely function outside of Scarf. I used a lead set that went something like this, and to great effect, though I can't remember exactly what it was:

Jirachi@Chesto Berry
Careful; 252 HP / 40 Def / 216 SpD

Iron Head
Stealth Rock
Toxic / Wish / Screen
Body Slam / Thunder Wave

Those were the EVs iirc: they allow Jirachi to survive Modest Kyogre's maximum powered Water Spout 100% of the time, and thus weaker attacks such as Deoxys-A's Shadow Ball and Darkrai's Dark Pulse. It also survives Adamant Rayquaza's unboosted LO Earthquake 100% of the time, should it come in unharmed.

Speaking of Darkrai, this set deals well with it, as well as Deoxys-S. The Chesto Berry allows it to absorb sleep and cripple back with Thunder Wave or Body Slam (the latter of which has a 60% chance to paralyze thanks to Serene Grace). Body Slam has the added benefit of overriding Taunt, disabling Deoxys-S and quite possibly flinching it to death.

Stealth Rock is a nice move to have, so Jirachi I felt was an ideal choice to do it given its bulk.

The third slot is up for debate. Toxic will cripple incoming support Groudon, Wish can bring in the next pokemon nicely, and Screen support (typically Light Screen) never hurts.

The set may be a bit outdated, but it does, at the least, show that Jirachi can be EVed to be incredibly bulky even in Ubers.

 

[Colonel M]

Draco Meter | Iron Head | Grass Knot | U-turn (or Trick) Scarf Jirachi sounds awesome, especially when it's perhaps "the" Rayquaza check. One thing that sucks is, like a lot of Pokemon in Ubers, it's walled by Ho-oh. Aside from that, Jirachi sounds like an awesome revenge killer since Ubers is highly populated with Dragons.

 

[locopoke]

Scarf Jirachi just allows something like SD/RP Groudon to come in and set up since he takes very little from all of its attacks and I doubt you're going to be locked into Grass knot. The only set I would honestly use (which I have in the past) is the wish passing set (toxic/wish/u-turn/protect). It supports Ho-oh and Rayquaza especially well and it can also damage Groudon unlike the Scarf set because of Toxic.

 

[bojangles]

This is a Jirachi set that Jibaku and I came up with a while back (note: somebody very well could have come up with a similar set, but we engineered this particular one). We used it on our Giratina-O team and I found that it worked spectacularly.

Jirachi @ Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 HP/76 Spd/180 SDef
Careful nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
- Wish
- Body Slam
- Fire Punch / Ice Punch
- Iron Head

Jirachi's purpose here is mainly to spread paralysis via Body Slam, but also to provide Wish healing. On the team we also had a Paradancer Groudon to spread Thunder Wave. However, Jirachi supplemented it by spreading paralysis to Pokémon like Garchomp and Groudon, and well as really any Pokémon in general (obviously not Giratina). This made it so much easier for Giratina-O to sweep because it really has a sub par Speed stat. Wish is also just a handy move to have, and it especially helps Giratina-O because it has absolutely no way of healing itself (outside of Rest). After paralyzing something, it was really easy to Iron Head it into oblivion, making Jirachi able to even beat some Pokémon who seemed to be able to clobber it (eg Garchomp). The last slot was for an elemental Punch. Ice Punch lets you revenge kill Rayquaza stuck in Outrage or Garchomp in outrage. Fire Punch handles Forretress pretty well. The EVs are actually pretty simple; enough Speed EVs to outrun Giratina-O, with the rest poured into SpD and HP to keep Jirachi bulky. I actually really loved this set (more often than not it outshined giratina-o IMO), and I would recommend it to anybody.

 

[Garganator]

Well... I'm trying wall-breaking Jirachi, but I think I would love to work on EVs to be honest. Still working on set.

Jirachi @ Expert Belt
82 Atk / 252 SpA / 176 Spe Hasty/Naive
~ Iron Head
~ Body Slam / HP Fire
~ Grass Knot
~ HP Fire / Draco Meteor

EVs are quite specific, but they're solid. You may use this Jirachi to bluff Choice Scarf or Supporting Body Slam set (however Body Slam isn't neccesary). 176 Speed outspeeds Posivite 90's. 82 Attack and 252 SpA guarrantees that Jirachi... beats supporting 252 HP/ 60 SpD Groudon in two hits with Stealth Rock and one set of spikes (if it's on full health). Iron Head deals 22-25% on switch and 68%-76% by Grass Knot. HP Fire is for Scizor, Skarmory, Lucario and Forry that think they can set-up on Jirachi. Unfortunately under rain those OHKOes turns to 2OHKO on less bulky variants. Metagross under Rain is pain in the ass. Draco Meteor is here for those dragons, which think that they set-up on Grass Knot or Iron Head. However the main problem is speed - Jirachi would love to run max, but I'm not sure how to change EVs to make it work under max or at least enough to outspeed Jolly SDQuaza, as in some situations lack of speed was troblesome. Combination of Iron Head + Body Slam takes care of Wobbufett and Blissey (well, to some extent, Blissey may always switch out to cure paralyses). This set may lack power, but it should be used as a nice surprise in mid-game or late-game like it's a bit similar OU Wall-breaking set. Any comments, ideas ?

 

[YTP]

This is a Jirachi set that Jibaku and I came up with a while back (note: somebody very well could have come up with a similar set, but we engineered this particular one). We used it on our Giratina-O team and I found that it worked spectacularly.

Jirachi @ Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 HP/76 Spd/180 SDef
Careful nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
- Wish
- Body Slam
- Fire Punch / Ice Punch
- Iron Head

Jirachi's purpose here is mainly to spread paralysis via Body Slam, but also to provide Wish healing. On the team we also had a Paradancer Groudon to spread Thunder Wave. However, Jirachi supplemented it by spreading paralysis to Pokémon like Garchomp and Groudon, and well as really any Pokémon in general (obviously not Giratina). This made it so much easier for Giratina-O to sweep because it really has a sub par Speed stat. Wish is also just a handy move to have, and it especially helps Giratina-O because it has absolutely no way of healing itself (outside of Rest). After paralyzing something, it was really easy to Iron Head it into oblivion, making Jirachi able to even beat some Pokémon who seemed to be able to clobber it (eg Garchomp). The last slot was for an elemental Punch. Ice Punch lets you revenge kill Rayquaza stuck in Outrage or Garchomp in outrage. Fire Punch handles Forretress pretty well. The EVs are actually pretty simple; enough Speed EVs to outrun Giratina-O, with the rest poured into SpD and HP to keep Jirachi bulky. I actually really loved this set (more often than not it outshined giratina-o IMO), and I would recommend it to anybody.

I can attest to the success of this set, as I have used it a bit myself. It catches many people off guard and is tough as a nail :).

 

[Quaily]

Thunder might be worth using over body slam on bulky variants. It has a much higher base power while still keeping the 60% paralyze rate. You would need kyogre around, but that's not asking a whole lot. Especially since you can hit opposing kyogres with a SE thunder which would probably be very unexpected. Loses against groudon and garchomp of course, but you can still ice punch them and they are already threatening jirachi with stab earthquakes.

 

[Ancien Régime]

except base power is utterly irrelevant for that jirachi...it's not supposed to actually *kill* anything...

and then in exchange you lose the ability to para the aformentioned chomp and groudon

don't make suggestions just to make suggestions

 

[tripe]

Thunder might be worth using over body slam on bulky variants. It has a much higher base power while still keeping the 60% paralyze rate. You would need kyogre around, but that's not asking a whole lot. Especially since you can hit opposing kyogres with a SE thunder which would probably be very unexpected. Loses against groudon and garchomp of course, but you can still ice punch them and they are already threatening jirachi with stab earthquakes.

This Jirachi is meant to support if anything else. The moves are there, so that Jirachi doesn't become absolute set up fodder.

 

[Uchiha]

jirachi cant learn draco meteor - at least in my team builder

 

[Ditto]

jirachi cant learn draco meteor - at least in my team builder

There was a Jirachi Wondercard event for Platinum which Jirachi had the special move of Draco Meteor.

 

[tripe]

jirachi cant learn draco meteor - at least in my team builder

I don't see much use for it competitively, since it's extremely weak compared to Dialga's draco meteor or the other dragons. I believe Jirachi's draco meteor is even weaker than Garchomp's, which is quite sad, and all dragons barring Dialga and Palkia are hit harder with ice punch.

 

[Jibaku]

Actually there is one more (well, two, three) Dragon(s) that are hit harder by Draco Meteor than Ice Punch. These are Giratina, Giratina-O, and Kingdra. The former two can come in on most Jirachi with relative ease, while knocking out Kingdra is a helpful bonus.

 

[tripe]

Actually there is one more (well, two, three) Dragon(s) that are hit harder by Draco Meteor than Ice Punch. These are Giratina, Giratina-O, and Kingdra. The former two can come in on most Jirachi with relative ease, while knocking out Kingdra is a helpful bonus.

Draco isn't going to dethrone Giratina-A or O, and Kingdra is quite rare.

 

[Jibaku]

Of course DM isn't going to dethrone both of them, but it'll at least do enough damage to deter them (Draco Meteor does like 66% to Giratina-O or something). And as I said, hitting Kingdra is just a helpful bonus

 

[blasphemy1]

Don't forget Jirachi has access to Thunder and Icy Wind. The former typically has 100% accuracy with rain everywhere, and 60% paralysis rate(Serene Grace). Icy Wind is nice to use in tandem with U-Turn, and it prevents Garchomp from switching in so easily and setting up.

 

[Uchiha]

Thunder Wave is often the superior option, even though Thunder has a 60% para chance.

 

[bojangles]

Thunder Wave is often the superior option, even though Thunder has a 60% para chance.

Body Slam is far superior in my opinion. Thunder Wave is a dime-a-dozen move; any supporting Pokémon out there can use it with some measure of success. However, Jirachi has this ability to paralyze even Ground-types, which is incredibly helpful, especially with Garchomp as one of the most popular revenge killers atm (and for good reason).

 

[blasphemy1]

I often enjoy Thunder over Body Slam or Thunder Wave.

Unlike Body Slam, Thunder hurts Kyogre a lot more and paralyzes Giratina as well.

Unlike Thunder Wave, Thunder deals damage, which means things like Taunt Mewtwo can't set up on you as easily.

I find that it is a compromise of the two, forgoing the ability to paralyze Groudon(#2) and Garchomp (#16) to hit Kyogre (#1) and Ho-oh (#13) harder, and paralyze Giratina (#12), while not leaving yourself vulnerable to Taunt. I run a set with Icy Wind / Thunder / U-Turn / Wish, so Garchomp/Groudon typically get neutered anyways as I often just spam Icy Wind to start.

 

[Zach]

I think that Jirachi might the be the best answer to wobburay or wobbuluke strategy.

Jirachi @ Expert Belt
EV's: needs work, but presumably enough to ko always ray with dm after sr and enough to take out luke after sr + spikes with hp fire while still outspeeding base 95's, if possible.
-Draco Meteor
-Hidden Power Fire
-U-turn
-Wish / Thunder / Filler

DM takes out Ray, HP Fire takes out Luke. Fire Punch isn't used because Jirachi's unimpressive offensive stats aren't helped much by being split. U-turn out of Wobbuffet who think you're a Scarfer. Last move is filler.

I haven't tested this, but it should be good in theory if its possible to EV jirachi such that it fits the ev description.

 

[Uchiha]

you should rather use ice punch and fire punch.

 

[Chii]

I like the 252 special defense/252 hp Jirachi with Toxic, Wish, Protect, U-turn
It will check any Lati@s without Refresh ( if they do have refresh uturn to a revenger like Garchomp or a proper counter) even hidden power fire won´t hurt to much max special attack Latias does 36.14% - 43.07% and Latios 44.55% - 52.97%.
Even a mixed Rayquaza won´t be able to ohko it with Fire Blast (73.76% - 87.13%)
And Sd quaza with Overheat will do laughable 58.91% - 69.80%.
To sum up, Jirachi is an excellent supporter in ubers and the perfect teammate for any dragon without recovery (gira-o, Palkia, Chomp..)

 

[Meow]

I think substitute may also be a notable move...