Metagame Effective Creative, and Underrated Sets

[Graceclaw]

Ferroseed already loses to Sub SD Alolaslash and Miltank can be broken by SD (although yeah Fightinium helps with tank so ig that's at least one thing it does). I'm not the one who invented sub and it's a completely standard move on Alolaslash at this point entirely because it beats Ferroseed without needing to resort to things like Fightinium. Can't say I see the merit in either SDless or EQless Alolaslash but ultimately it's the kind of mon which is always gonna do some work even if it's not the most optimal set so w/e

The idea is that you don't need SD to be threatening to those switch-ins. Not having to use a turn every time you want to be threatening is really valuable when you're on a timer.

 

[SergioRules]

Stunfisk @ Leftovers
Ability: Static
EVs: 248 HP / 188 Def / 44 SpD / 28 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Earth Power
- Discharge
- Stealth Rock
- Toxic

Hi so I originally started with Stunfisk for the budget tour (hence why the replay I'm posting has Stunfisk on a not-so-great team) and it actually preformed pretty well in testing. Granted, while Stunfisk generally shouldn't be used over other defensive walls/ Stealth Rock setters, the thing it does have is Static which can help cripple and slow down physical attackers to be picked off later. Normally Stunfisk is max HP max Defense, but this set adds a little bit of SpDef to turn Defensive Lanturn's Scald and Palossand's Earth Power into 3HKOs while the added Speed allows you to get off a Toxic on Palossand or -Spe nature Gastrodon in a last ditch effort before they KO you. Overall still a mediocre mon that I don't recommend using over Palossand or something like that but if you must, this EV spread isn't bad.
Only replay I could find bc I'm awful at remembering to save them: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7pu-717457315

 

[Aaronboyer]

Carracosta @ Fightinium Z
Ability: Solid Rock
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Shell Smash
- Superpower
- Stone Edge
- Hydro Pump

This is the awesome set I ran on Carracosta on my "The Desire to Fight" RMT during the Passimian Suspect Test. Z-Superpower is neat for catching Ferroseed, Non-Scarfed Togedemaru, and Gastrodon (that doesn't Recover on the same turn you All-Out Pummeling) off guard. Z-Superpower also hits the abundance of bulky Normal-types that are growing in popularity such as Stoutland, Kangaskhan, and Miltank, and is overall an underutilized coverage move for Costa, and works even better with Healing Wish support.


Togedemaru @ Eject Button
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Fake Out
- Gravity
- U-turn
- Iron Head

Gravity HO is one of the most niche team archetypes in the history of Pokemon, but that niche playstyle couldn't be more happy for PU to receive it's first (non-Smeargle) Gravity + U-Turn user, and it has Sturdy to boot. While at first glance it may seem weird to make EQ even more spammable for the 4x weak to Ground-type rodent, it doesn't really matter as it's primary job is to set up Gravity and that's it. Fake Out breaks any potential Focus Sashes and Sturdys from the opposing side, while Eject Button and U-Turn allow the conservation of limited Gravity turns. A very very very niche set for a very very very niche archetype, but Togedemaru has become by far the best lead for Gravity HO.

 

[asa]

View attachment 108401
Zangoose @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Toxic Boost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Quick Attack
- Knock Off
- Close Combat

Summary

You may think you've seen this set before. The reason why it's underrated is its use of quick attack and no facade on a Toxic Orb set. While
there are many different ways to play zangoose, the most effective way however is to keep hazards off your side and wittle down checks with toxic boosted knock off. Then you can go for a sweep on a choice locked poke (preferably scarfed), or a very passive one.The sheer base power of CC and coverage beside knock off lets me use quick attack. Although you must beware of togetic, it struggles on rocks. Which brings up hazards. Stealth Rocks is more or less mandatory to use Zangoose, wittling down many checks. As said earlier, hazards on your side are awful for zangoose to attempt its hit, run, and sweep strategy. Play smart, healing wish helps, and have fun.

Replays:

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7pu-725567040
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7pu-725563069

The problem I have with this kind of set is that you need Facade to have that crazy high damage output that doesn't require you to set up in hopes only achieving a fraction of that power like it does. This kind of idea is sort of done better by the Belly Drum set, to some extent.

 

[Chandell]

The fact that they expect it to have facade shapes their response to it, letting you easily get ghosts and rock types out of the picture(Other Toxic SD variants usually lack Close Combat. Zangoose is a wallbreaker, a short lived one, and even his power can be played around.
252+ Atk Toxic Boost Zangoose Facade (140 BP) vs. 252 HP / 160+ Def Weezing: 235-277 (70.3 - 82.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Black Sludge recovery
+2 252+ Atk Toxic Boost Zangoose Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 160+ Def Weezing: 218-257 (65.2 - 76.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
At +2, Knock Off and Close Combat can meet, or exceed the power of unboosted facade. Also, standard Zangoose can be killed by things like this:
252+ Atk Toxic Boost Zangoose Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 56+ Def Regirock: 190-224 (52.1 - 61.5%) -- 97.7% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers
recovery
252+ Atk Toxic Boost Zangoose Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Eviolite Dusclops: 170-202 (59.8 - 71.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Whereas with my set:
+2 252+ Atk Toxic Boost Zangoose Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 56+ Def Regirock: 376-444 (103.2 - 121.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Toxic Boost Zangoose Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Eviolite Dusclops: 340-400 (119.7 - 140.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Also preventing revenge kills:
+2 252+ Atk Toxic Boost Zangoose Quick Attack vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Floatzel: 319-376 (102.5 - 120.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Toxic Boost Zangoose Quick Attack vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Primeape: 297-349 (109.5 - 128.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Toxic Boost Zangoose Quick Attack vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Swanna: 288-339 (98.9 - 116.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252+ Atk Toxic Boost Zangoose Quick Attack vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Zebstrika: 286-337 (98.2 - 115.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252+ Atk Toxic Boost Zangoose Quick Attack vs. 208 HP / 0 Def Hitmonchan: 240-283 (81.9 - 96.5%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO after 1 layer of Spikes
In conclusion, this zangoose can overcome barriers other sets struggle with. As for belly drum, it may outclass this set when it comes to straight up sweeping, this set lets you cripple the opponents team with Toxic boosted knock offs, letting zangoose have a purpose on teams more resistant to sweeping, and making it contribute early in the game as well.

 

[MZ]

The fact that they expect it to have facade shapes their response to it, letting you easily get ghosts and rock types out of the picture(Other Toxic SD variants usually lack Close Combat. Zangoose is a wallbreaker, a short lived one, and even his power can be played around.
252+ Atk Toxic Boost Zangoose Facade (140 BP) vs. 252 HP / 160+ Def Weezing: 235-277 (70.3 - 82.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Black Sludge recovery
+2 252+ Atk Toxic Boost Zangoose Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 160+ Def Weezing: 218-257 (65.2 - 76.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
At +2, Knock Off and Close Combat can meet, or exceed the power of unboosted facade. Also, standard Zangoose can be killed by things like this:
252+ Atk Toxic Boost Zangoose Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 56+ Def Regirock: 190-224 (52.1 - 61.5%) -- 97.7% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers
recovery
252+ Atk Toxic Boost Zangoose Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Eviolite Dusclops: 170-202 (59.8 - 71.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Whereas with my set:
+2 252+ Atk Toxic Boost Zangoose Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 56+ Def Regirock: 376-444 (103.2 - 121.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Toxic Boost Zangoose Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Eviolite Dusclops: 340-400 (119.7 - 140.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Also preventing revenge kills:
+2 252+ Atk Toxic Boost Zangoose Quick Attack vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Floatzel: 319-376 (102.5 - 120.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Toxic Boost Zangoose Quick Attack vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Primeape: 297-349 (109.5 - 128.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Toxic Boost Zangoose Quick Attack vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Swanna: 288-339 (98.9 - 116.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252+ Atk Toxic Boost Zangoose Quick Attack vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Zebstrika: 286-337 (98.2 - 115.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252+ Atk Toxic Boost Zangoose Quick Attack vs. 208 HP / 0 Def Hitmonchan: 240-283 (81.9 - 96.5%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO after 1 layer of Spikes
In conclusion, this zangoose can overcome barriers other sets struggle with. As for belly drum, it may outclass this set when it comes to straight up sweeping, this set lets you cripple the opponents team with Toxic boosted knock offs, letting zangoose have a purpose on teams more resistant to sweeping, and making it contribute early in the game as well.

The fact that Zangoose could still set up to +2 and not be able to OHKO a Weezing when its entire niche is "I'm frail and awkward but really, really strong" basically defeats the point of using it. If you drop Close Combat, you struggle with Rock-types, but at least those can be chipped by running other mons to help you out. The lack of Facade means you're intentionally giving up the ability to be as immediately threatening. Whether you drop CC or Facade you're going to miss out on hitting some targets, the difference is Facade is noticeably more important because it allows Zangoose to not be worthless before it sets up an SD, something which isn't awfully easy to do. I think the idea of being immediately threatening was what Allstar was trying to allude to, but it didn't quite come across.

 

[Chandell]

Keep in mind that the downgrade is not from Facade-Quick Attack, but from Facade-CC/Knock Off. If you do 3 consecutive battles, the chance of the opponent having a bulky rock or steel type is nearly 100%. And it makes sense, in a tier with Boomburst spammers and plenty of Hurricanes. A +2 knock of will fail to KO things like Aggron,Magcargo,Relicanth,Bastiodon, Regirock,Carracosta and Probobass, with the formers able to tank it even after a decent amount of prior damage. There are even more dangerous checks such as Carbink(resists knock off) and Shuckle(encore+bulky). In order to adapt to this, Facade is replaced with Close Combat. Sure, if the team is built without the rock/steel wall, which is rare, Facade will be more useful. But since rock/steel types are used often, I adapt my Zangoose to this trend in the meta. In conclusion, yes Facade could be more useful in certain situations, but if you're up against these common checks, Close Combat will prove more useful. Thanks for the feedback though, it made me more thoroughly examine my set.

 

[Darkinium]

Combusken @ Fightinium Z / Firium Z
Ability: Speed Boost
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Protect
- Fire Blast
- Focus Blast
- Defog

This is a set that I've used recently as an offensive remover, and it has not disappointed. Although at first sight it seems that it might compete heavily with Hitmonchan as a Fighting-type remover, what it offers over it is a far more offensive alternative. The basis behind this set is Combusken's ability to force switches and get off free Defogs, as well as a nice matchup against certain removers such as Weezing, Ferroseed, and Regirock; even if it doesn't beat certain setters such as Mesprit and Palossand 1v1, it can pressure them very well with its STABs. However, this set is not without its flaws: being affected by all forms of entry hazards and no recovery, this gets worn down extremely easily. Despite this, Defog Combusken is definitely a set that I think merits consideration on teams wanting offensive hazard control.

Floatzel @ Choice Band
Ability: Water Veil
Happiness: 0
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Waterfall
- Frustration
- Pursuit
- Ice Punch

Inspired by Many's Next Best Thing nomination, I genuinely believe that, despite my occasional memeing around this, this ORAS classic deserves more love. It's able to lure common answers to specially offensive Floatzel, such as Clefairy and Eelektross, making them eat a Banded Waterfall on the switch, as well as chipping Lanturn far easier. Unlike the Bulk Up set, this set also has immediate power. Pursuit is a nice perk, allowing you to trap Pokemon such as Magmortar and Oricorio-Sensu as pointed out by Many in their post. Focus Punch and Brick Break are options to lure Ferroseed as well, but I prefer the given options most of the time. I made a post in the Good Cores thread featuring this set, so give that a look as well!

 

[Lugia Proto]

Kecleon @ Fightinium Z
Ability: Protean
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Focus Punch
- Knock Off
- Fake Out
- Sucker Punch
(This isn't to say that this is the only Z move Kecleon set, just an example, but Z fire blast, Z blizzard, Z solar beam, etc. are also kool options)

Now I'm pretty certain this isn't exactly the most optimal spread for a Kecleon, and it's moves can be changed to fit other teams. Z-move Kecleon is something I wanted to try for a while, and due to it's abundance of good coverage moves it can make use of a LOT of powerful Z moves. Kecleon is an often overlooked pokemon in the tier, and it should get the recognition it deserves. Kecleon is able to help lure a teams weaknesses and help it's partners sweep after luring other mons.

List of mons that this Z move kecleon can lure:
0- SpA Protean Kecleon Bloom Doom (190 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Gastrodon: 576-676 (135.2 - 158.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Protean Kecleon Corkscrew Crash (180 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Eviolite Clefairy: 542-638 (157.5 - 185.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Protean Kecleon All-Out Pummeling (200 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Skuntank: 352-415 (101.1 - 119.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Black Sludge recovery
252 Atk Protean Kecleon All-Out Pummeling (200 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Eelektross: 306-361 (81.8 - 96.5%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
252 Atk Protean Kecleon All-Out Pummeling (200 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Eviolite Type: Null: 354-416 (89.8 - 105.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
Knock off into Z fire blast kills tang:
252 Atk Protean Kecleon Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Eviolite Tangela: 73-87 (21.8 - 26%) -- 100% chance to 4HKO after Stealth Rock
0 SpA Protean Kecleon Inferno Overdrive (185 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Tangela: 318-374 (95.2 - 111.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

 

[gz]

Kangaskhan @ Normalium Z
Ability: Scrappy
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Double-Edge
- Power-Up Punch
- Sucker Punch
- Fire Punch

This is a set I've been playing around recently. Kangaskhan is getting a lot of hype newly, being a staple on hazard stacking teams which is booming lately. It also acts as a decent blanket check against offense with the ability to pressure most setup sweepers with dual priority. As of late, more and more people realized how good PuP actually is; turning Kangaskhan in a terrifying sweeper. That's were Fire Punch comes into play. With PuP in the set, most people only carry STAB and priority with them but honestly, Fake Out + Power-Up Punch is not really that beneficial. Most of the time after Kangaskhan enters the field, they are switching into their defensive mon anyways fearing the Fake Out, but with PuP you'll instantly grab momentum and have a huge nuke in +1 Breakneck Blitz. Without Fake Out it opens one slot for either Fire Punch or Earthquake, which pressures Ferroseed and Regirock respectively.

+1 252+ Atk Kangaskhan Fire Punch vs. 248 HP / 128 Def Eviolite Ferroseed: 272-324 (93.4 - 111.3%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7pu-737698576 replay vs HJAD for PU ssnl semi finals. You see the merits of Fire Punch Kangaskhan instantly even if I slightly misplayed in not clicking PuP first.

Eelektross @ Assault Vest
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD
Quiet Nature
- Volt Switch
- Flamethrower
- Knock Off
- Flash Cannon

Also an interesting set I tested a lot in the past couple of days/weeks. I would consider this set more "niche" though because you have to drop Giga Drain and you only really hit Clefairy, Aurorus and Carbink I guess. But especially for Clefairy thats a nice lure cause after one Knock Off you beat it 1v1. Furthermore having the chance to Ohko Aurorus is also excellent. However as previously mentioned I would only recommend this if you have a reliable way of beating Gastrodon like Lurantis, Lilligant or Bellossom for example.

252+ SpA Eelektross Flash Cannon vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Aurorus: 356-420 (91.9 - 108.5%) -- 50% chance to OHKO
252+ SpA Eelektross Flash Cannon vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Clefairy: 156-184 (45.3 - 53.4%) -- 36.3% chance to 2HKO AFTER KNOCK OFF

Skuntank @ Poisonium Z
Ability: Aftermath
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Crunch
- Poison Jab
- Sucker Punch
- Defog

Skuntank is an interesting mon in terms of item choice. It can run Black Sludge, Rocky Helmet, Black Glasses, Lum Berry or Darkinium Z without a problem just because it's not really that reliant on it's item. Poisonium Z is a really underrated set in my opinion that more people should look into. The benefit of this set is hitting the ever so popular fighting types for a lot of damage like Ohkoing AV Hitmonchan which normally wins the 1v1. It also does quite a chunk to Gurdurr so revenge killing it is getting alot easier.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7pu-738035975 Again vs HJAD. Turn 32 I used it against Gurdurr to end the game otherwise it could have been a little more exciting in the end.
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7pususpecttest-741005665 Turn 3 killed Hitmonchan with Acid Downpour

Pyroar @ Grassium Z
Ability: Unnerve
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Fire Blast
- Hyper Voice
- Solar Beam
- Taunt

Pyroar is going through an interesting phase at the moment. Most people used it exclusively as a choice locked user (Specs or Scarf) and everytime people were seeking for a Z-Move user, Magmortar often was the go-to choice. After Mag's ban more people have tested out Z-Move Pyroar, Firium-Z in particular, just because fire types with Taunt are really good in the current meta. I also really like the Firium-Z set, but Z-Solar Beam is just so good as well, nuking common switchins like Lanturn or Regirock. The only slight disadvantage is, that you can only use the move once so you have to be careful.

252 SpA Pyroar Bloom Doom (190 BP) vs. 248 HP / 196 SpD Regirock: 304-358 (83.7 - 98.6%) -- 75% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Pyroar Bloom Doom (190 BP) vs. 40 HP / 248+ SpD Lanturn: 314-370 (78.3 - 92.2%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7pu-712441217 cool, but older replay vs zdrup15 which just shows how valuable z-solar beam can be. Gastro 6-0d that team so I had to nuke it with the z-move while also playing around the Altaria.

Weezing @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 248 HP / 164 Def / 96 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sludge Bomb
- Toxic Spikes
- Taunt
- Destiny Bond

Everybody who knows me, experienced my love for Destiny Bond. I used it back in the day on Qwilfish, but I also think it's the best set on Weezing. Will-O-Wisp is super underwhelming and Destiny Bond is just a superb move to have in a meta with a lot of slow setup sweepers like Clefairy, Spiritomb or Type: Null. I don't really have much to add just try it for yourself.

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7pu-721327737 vs Dundies Seasonals game. Turn 20 I use it vs his already setup Clefairy which would have won the game.

Primeape @ Poisonium Z / Rockium Z
Ability: Defiant
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Close Combat
- U-turn
- Stone Edge
- Gunk Shot

Choiced Primeape is really weird right now. Like everytime its in you really want to click CC, but end up clicking U-Turn anyways just because you don't want to lose all of your momentum when you Close Combat into mons like Spiritomb or Mesprit. Z-Move Primeape is actually really nice allowing you to click CC more often and you don't lose that much momentum at all. It's also always nice bluffing the scarf and nuking Clefairy with Acid Downpour. But in general I feel like Rockium is the more reliable Z-Move, killing Sensu 100% and chipping Spiritomb heavily.

 

[Tunemu]

I tried to play chatot in RU and it's the best pokemon of my team, I win a lot of matches because of him. Let me explain the set i'm using for this:

Worst Nightmare (Chatot) (M) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Keen Eye
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Boomburst
- Chatter
- Nasty Plot
- Heat Wave

Okay so basically you start by using nasty plot to raise your special attack stats. then if the foe attacks it's not a problem; Because of the focus sash chatot is holding he will stay at 1hp and then you can just sweep the foe's team with boomburst. you can change chatter but heat wave is very important to pass steel type pokemon. Hope this can help and that it will be a new meta or something, it's pretty good to be honest.

megazard edit: moved here, please don't start new threads without moderator permission

 

[Ganso]

Golem-Alola @ Leftovers
Ability: Magnet Pull
EVs: 248 HP / 216 Atk / 44 Def
Adamant Nature
- Rock Slide
- Substitute
- Curse
- Rock Polish

This mon and set turns one of the most used and annoying mons(ferroseed) in a liability. You sub on it and start the party. It also sets up on non eq metang and cb heavy slam locked aggron.

-some calcs
0 Atk Ferroseed Gyro Ball (63 BP) vs. 252 HP / 40 Def Golem-Alola: 31-37 (8.5 - 10.1%) -- possibly the worst move ever
252+ Atk Choice Band Aggron Heavy Slam (40 BP) vs. 252 HP / 40 Def Golem-Alola: 75-88 (20.6 - 24.1%) -- possible 6HKO after Leftovers recovery
116+ Atk Metang Meteor Mash vs. 252 HP / 40 Def Golem-Alola: 76-90 (20.8 - 24.7%) -- possible 6HKO after Leftovers recovery
+6 216+ Atk Golem-Alola Rock Slide vs. 248 HP / 128 Def Eviolite Ferroseed: 156-183 (53.6 - 62.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
+6 216+ Atk Golem-Alola Rock Slide vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Gastrodon: 226-267 (53 - 62.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
+6 216+ Atk Golem-Alola Rock Slide vs. 252 HP / 64 Def Eviolite Gurdurr: 175-207 (46.7 - 55.3%) -- 71.1% chance to 2HKO
192+ Atk Gurdurr Drain Punch vs. +6 252 HP / 40 Def Golem-Alola: 44-54 (12 - 14.8%) -- possibly the worst move ever
- replay (will post more)
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7pu-751116596 sets up on aggron

 

[tafugu]

Victreebel @ Grassium Z
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Sleep Powder
- Power Whip
- Poison Jab
- Swords Dance

Physical Grassium Sun Sweeper Victreebel
Instead of going the standard special sun sweeper route, I've been enjoying this physical sweeper set. The physical set can do almost everything the special set can do, just on the physical side and comes with its own set of advantages. The biggest advantage is that it allows you to keep sweeping a lot of the time after the sun has ended. Z-Sleep Powder gives you +1 in speed and it has access to all of its attacking moves outside of the sun whereas the special set will be slower outside of sun with only access to 1 of its 3 attacking moves.

VS the standard special sun sweeper set:
Advantages
- Sweeping capabilities outside of sun
- Flexibility in z-move, +1 speed or powerful Bloom Doom
- Base attack is actually a bit higher than base special attack
- Can get +2 in attack outside the sun
- Grass and poison STABs are the same base power as the special STABs

Disadvantages
- Lack of coverage, mons like Ferroseed wall this set easily
- Not 100% accurate, probably the most infuriating aspect of this set

Quick Tips
This mon pairs wells with steel trappers (like the set above) to maximize its sweeping capabilities. I like to use this late game as it can easily reverse sweep teams providing you hit all your moves. Even down 1 vs 5 it seems this set can still give you a possible out. Plan how many attack boost you need and if you need a +1 in speed. Play around sucker punch with sleep powder.

Replays
vs stall
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7pu-751363452

z-sleep powder allowing me to set up and sweep all sixs mons even after the sun
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7pu-751724467

 

[JustoonSmitts]

**artwork by me**

I've noticed that Eelektross has some interesting options to deal with special walls. Here's some interesting options I've used before.

Eelektross @ Assault Vest
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Quiet Nature
- Volt Switch
- Giga Drain
- Superpower / Acid Spray
- Flamethrower

This is the same as the standard set except for Superpower. This move allows it to better deal with special walls such as Drampa, Audino, and most importantly Aurorus and Pyroar. It can easily Volt Switch after the drops and come back with full power. Here's some calcs.

- 0 Atk Eelektross Superpower vs. 136 HP / 0 Def Drampa: 224-264 (67.6 - 79.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
- 0 Atk Eelektross Superpower vs. 248 HP / 8 Def Audino: 218-258 (53.3 - 63%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
- 0 Atk Eelektross Superpower vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Aurorus: 508-600 (131.2 - 155%) -- guaranteed OHKO
- 0 Atk Eelektross Superpower vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Pyroar: 254-300 (81.1 - 95.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

Acid Spray on the other hand is here mainly for Clefairy. It lowers the target's Special Defense by 2 stages, turning a 6HKO into a 3HKO after one use. It also discourages other special walls from coming in or risk lowering thier special bulk.

There's also this set:

Eelektross @ Assault Vest
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Thunder Punch
- U-turn
- Drain Punch
- Knock Off / Iron Tail

This set is design to fool your opponent into thinking you're the special pivot set so they send in thier special wall. Thunder Punch is the preferred STAB over Wild Charge so that Eelektross doesn't wear itself down by recoil. Drain Punch is so Eelektross can heal itself against Pokémon like Audino, Drampa, Aurorus, Ferroseed, and Pyroar. U-turn is the pivot move of choice so its not completely walled by Ground-types. The next move is up to you. Knock Off is so Eelektross can remove the foe's item while keeping Mesprit at bay. Iron Tail is so it can deal with Clefairy better.

 

[m3po]

Pinsir can be pretty versatile in the tier being a Z-Me First Moxie cleaner, a scarfer, or an SD user. But it also has access to Stealth Rock, which is often overlooked and can expand its role. This is a set that is useful and can take the opponent completely by surprise

Pinsir @ Groundium Z
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Swords Dance
- X-Scissor
- Earthquake

Pinsir can serve as an effective anti-lead. Adamant is better as it gets notably more KOes, but Jolly can outspeed Timid Mesprit and Skuntank. This set also breaks through stall (thanks to Mold Breaker) with the added bonus of being able to set up rocks when needed. Gurdurr, Hitmonchan, Audino, Clefairy, and Ferroseed are all set up fodder for Pinsir. Since Pinsir provides so much offensive pressure, Stealth Rock can be used on a predicted switch-in to Oricorio-G (which completely walls this set).

The calcs do most of the explaining

Unboosted calcs

252+ Atk Mold Breaker Pinsir Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Aurorus: 306-360 (79 - 93%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Mold Breaker Pinsir Earthquake vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Skuntank: 324-382 (93.1 - 109.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Mold Breaker Pinsir Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Aggron: 280-332 (99.6 - 118.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Mold Breaker Pinsir Tectonic Rage (180 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Eelektross: 504-594 (134.7 - 158.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Mold Breaker Pinsir Tectonic Rage (180 BP) vs. 252 HP / 160+ Def Weezing: 284-336 (85 - 100.5%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
252+ Atk Mold Breaker Pinsir Tectonic Rage (180 BP) vs. 40 HP / 220 Def Lanturn: 476-562 (118.7 - 140.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Mold Breaker Pinsir Tectonic Rage (180 BP) vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Solid Rock Carracosta: 246-289 (85.1 - 100%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

Boosted calcs

+2 252+ Atk Mold Breaker Pinsir X-Scissor vs. 252 HP / 240+ Def Mesprit: 392-464 (107.6 - 127.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Mold Breaker Pinsir X-Scissor vs. 252 HP / 216+ Def Pyukumuku: 171-202 (54.4 - 64.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
+2 252+ Atk Mold Breaker Pinsir Earthquake vs. 208 HP / 0 Def Hitmonchan: 283-333 (96.5 - 113.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252+ Atk Mold Breaker Pinsir Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 160+ Def Weezing: 316-374 (94.6 - 111.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252+ Atk Mold Breaker Pinsir Tectonic Rage (180 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Regirock: 362-426 (99.4 - 117%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
+2 252+ Atk Mold Breaker Pinsir Tectonic Rage (180 BP) vs. 248 HP / 128 Def Eviolite Ferroseed: 263-310 (90.3 - 106.5%) -- 75% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

Here is a replay of it in action against stall. I think I was using Jolly though

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7pu-752498696

 

[Katy]

Mesprit @ Fairium Z
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dazzling Gleam
- Healing Wish
- Psychic
- Stealth Rock

Regular Calcs:

Hide

252 SpA Mesprit Dazzling Gleam vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Skuntank: 113-133 (32.4 - 38.2%) -- 2% chance to 3HKO after Black Sludge recovery
252 SpA Mesprit Dazzling Gleam vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Spiritomb: 142-168 (46.8 - 55.4%) -- 68.8% chance to 2HKO
252 SpA Mesprit Dazzling Gleam vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Swanna: 109-129 (37.4 - 44.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
252 SpA Mesprit Dazzling Gleam vs. 136 HP / 0 SpD Drampa: 164-194 (49.5 - 58.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

Twinkle Tackle Calcs:

Hide

252 SpA Mesprit Twinkle Tackle (160 BP) vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Skuntank: 224-264 (64.3 - 75.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Black Sludge recovery
252 SpA Mesprit Twinkle Tackle (160 BP) vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Spiritomb: 282-332 (93 - 109.5%) -- 56.3% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Mesprit Twinkle Tackle (160 BP) vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Swanna: 217-256 (74.5 - 87.9%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
252 SpA Mesprit Twinkle Tackle (160 BP) vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Electivire: 171-202 (58.7 - 69.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252 SpA Mesprit Twinkle Tackle (160 BP) vs. 136 HP / 0 SpD Drampa: 326-384 (98.4 - 116%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

 

[yogi]

Been a while huh

Rotom-Frost @ Icium Z
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Blizzard
- Volt Switch
- Thunderbolt
- Defog

While the analysis set features the SubSplit version of Rotom-Frost, I believe that offensive with Volt Switch and Defog is very good right now. Rotom-Frost is a fantastic offensive check to rising threats in Bellossom and Bulky Oricorio-G, along with having very few switch-ins on most Bulky Offense and Offense teams. Ice and Electric is almost unresisted as an offensive typing, with only a few things, like Lanturn, resisting both STABs, and with Icium-Z it can nuke a load of standard checks. This is also why I think Defog is really a good move on it, because it forces switches easily because nothing wants to take a Z-Blizzard to the face!

Clefairy @ Eviolite
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Wish
- Soft-Boiled
- Calm Mind
- Moonblast

The only reason I thought to use this set was because I already had a Stealth Rock user on my team, and drastically needed another check to strong special attackers. While Knock Off and Thunder Wave are also good options, I like the utility that Wish actually bestows to the rest of your team, especially when passing to members that are unable to reliably heal themselves. It's really another showcase of Clefairy's superb role compression, and thanks to good bulk + Magic Guard, it's able to reliably pass Wishes to other team members.

I have some more, but I can't reveal all my tech now can I

 

[Darkinium]

Skuntank @ Black Sludge / Black Glasses
Ability: Aftermath
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant / Jolly Nature
- Taunt
- Poison Jab
- Crunch / Sucker Punch
- Defog / Sucker Punch

Two things Defog Skuntank is known for are, 1: exceedingly poor matchup against Ferroseed, Regirock, and Weezing, allowing them to bring their hazards right after they're removed or, in Weezing's case, cripple Skuntank with a burn, and 2: difficulty in pumping out firepower. Taunt helps in multiple ways; it gives Skuntank a massive edge over the aforementioned setters, preventing them from continuously setting up Stealth Rock, Spikes, and Toxic Spikes, and even allowing it to 1v1 Weezing! It also gives it new life as a stallbreaker. It 1v1s Weezing as mentioned previously, but also beats Pyukumuku, Audino, Sableye, Spiritomb, and Gourgeist-XL, and shuts Stall as a whole by virtue of it being reliant on status moves. As for the other slots, I like Defog, because it utilizes the improved setter MU, and Crunch, but Crunch + Sucker Punch is fine should you have another remover.

 

[Ktütverde]

Gourgeist-Super @ Firium Z
Ability: Frisk
EVs: 252 HP / 108 Atk / 148 Def
Impish Nature
- Seed Bomb
- Will-O-Wisp
- Leech Seed
- Synthesis

This set does several things. Firstly, it walls gurdurr, kingler, hitmonchan, primeape, togedemaru, ferroseed, and non crunch skuntank, as well as non icebeam floatzel, poliwrath, non RockiumZ kabutops/carracosta. It still does all of this without 252 defense EVs. So it does the same job as the full defense gourgeist people usually use. For exemple: 252+ Atk Life Orb Kingler Knock Off vs. 252 HP / 148+ Def Gourgeist-Super: 138-164 (36.8 - 43.8%) -- 0.4% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock (= 0% bro).
What is interesting here is that its item FiriumZ
1)reduces knock off damage while having some extra utility unlike the colbur berry
2)burns through taunt
3)boost gourgeist's attack by one stage.

If you add 116 atk evs, look at what it can do after +1 in attack with seed bombs:

Hide

-99.6% chance to 2HKO (=100% bro) on clefairy
-100% 3hko on audino even if it protects every turn
-vs full defense pyukumuku without leftovers and burned: 55.9% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and burn damage
-100% 2hko on pursuit spiritomb after rocks
-100% 2hko on eelektross after Stealth rock

You may ask: this is kinda useless, why would u send pyuku on gourgeist anyway??? That's true, the only relevant calcs are the first one and the last one. Being able to 2hko clefairy means it can't ppstall you and prevent the leech+wow spam. Idk if u have ever faced a gourgeist, but it is extremely hard to get rid of it and the best way to do it is to use eelektross or clefairy, since they can tank seedbomb relatively well and flamethrower / toxicstall it. But with +1 atk and 116 evs, you gain a ton of momentum vs eelektross because u aren't forced out, while destroying clefairy. It also pressures audino a lot so it won't be able to properly stall it. Ik it won't be a god set in practice, but since it does everything the standard set does + beating clef and eelektross, it's just a cool tech to use without drawbacks. Note that you shouldn't use wow if clefairy is already in, but Z willowisp a gurdurr/chan/skunk etc, and get the +1 atk while the oppo sends eel/clefairy in for exemple.

Another very good reason to use this: taunt aggron doesn't force you out (taunt aggron is good). Z wow burns through taunt. If gourgeist is your physical wall you will probably not have another mon able to stomach hits from something like aggron, so better not be forced to switch out with a gourgeist vs aggron.

I'm open to any criticism, thanks for reading!


edit: weird calcs with kingler and clef, but note that if clef lives with 0.0001%, it will die to the next seed bomb if it softboils unless u are so unlucky with the rolls that 10 crits in a row must be a normal thing in your life. While dying to kingler's knock offs will happen once every year as long as you face 1,000 kinglers every year (and that all have their rocks up and predict gourgeist and knock on the switch uh).

 

[dwib]

Mudsdale @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Stamina
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Roar
- Earthquake
- Rest

Mudsdale is an incredible defensive wall, sporting great mixed bulk and an incredible ability in Stamina, making it capable of switching into myriad threats such as Togedemaru, Aggron, Primeape, Skuntank, Hitmonchan, and Kangaskhan, among others. Stealth Rock, Roar, and Rocky Helmet all make Mudsdale a chipping machine, aiding teammates in netting KO's they might not otherwise have. Rest, even without Sleep Talk, is incredibly useful here as Stamina makes Mudsdale very difficult to kill via physical attacks by anyone not named Kingler. Using Rest with a Rocky Helmet makes Mudsdale a wincon when the opponent is left with only physical attacking Pokemon. 4 Speed EV's are to creep Spiritomb, which I have found useful on multiple occasions.

calcs

252+ Atk Choice Band Aggron Head Smash vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mudsdale: 129-152 (31.9 - 37.6%) -- 91.1% chance to 3HKO
252 Atk Primeape Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mudsdale: 121-144 (29.9 - 35.6%) -- 31.7% chance to 3HKO
252+ Atk Iron Fist Hitmonchan Ice Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mudsdale: 136-160 (33.6 - 39.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

replays

Wincon starting at turn 14: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7pu-751577279
Mudsdale checks half a team: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7pu-775061552
Edit: New Wincon replay that ends with Mudsdale v Primeape, Hitmonchan, and Aggron: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7pu-785114489

While it has obvious issues with anything that floats coming in on it (Mesprit, Weezing, etc), this thing has one job and does it incredibly well blanket checking a ton of common threats. Mine has been partnered with a Poliwrath and Exeggutor-alola to handle many of the tier's water-type and grass-type pokemon, respectively, ensuring any momentum lost by Mudsdale can be gained right back.

image credit to limecatmastr on Deviant Art

 

[ManOfMany]

necc (Exeggutor-Alola) @ Normalium Z
Ability: Harvest
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Celebrate
- Trick Room
- Giga Drain
- Dragon Pulse

Set up Z-Celebrate on something and then set up Trick Room while you become bulky enough to tank every hit except Ice Beam, and keep regaining health through Giga Drain. If you can get rid of the Toxic users on the opponents team you can use the added bulk to repeatedly setup Trick Room and sweep entire teams late-game. Even with Modest Nature and Celebrate Speed, Eggy is still slow enough to underspeed pretty much every offensive mon under TR. Not an Aromatisse replacement, but a fun gimmick that can surprise some teams.

 

[MaroGod]

Hi

Qwilfish @ Black Sludge
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Spikes / Toxic Spikes
- Liquidation
- Taunt
- Protect

Qwilfish has a fairly versatile 4th slot option and something I feel is underrated is Protect alongside Black Sludge besides the obvious passive healing it gets Protect allows it to scout on HO teams and stall out on T-Spikes teams (Mostly referring to Hail/T-Spikes).

Lycanroc @ Lycanium Z
Ability: Steadfast
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Stone Edge
- Drill Run
- Sucker Punch

This alternate move was shown to me by Specs Jigglypuff pointing at the use this has over Accelrock at the current time. With Spikestack and Offense in general being so strong at the moment Lycanroc is thriving as an offensive sweeper and Sucker Punch might just be the best option for it to use allowing it to OHKO Togedemaru after slight chip from hazards at +2 alongside being slightly stronger than Accelerock against neutral targets.

calc

+2 252 Atk Lycanroc Sucker Punch vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Togedemaru: 203-239 (74.9 - 88.1%) -- 50% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock and 1 layer of Spikes

Below will be some replays, I'll add more when I have the time later today.

Replay

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7pu-785198679

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7pu-784820203

 

[Katy]

Total Speed Control



Articuno @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 240 HP / 16 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Tailwind
- Freeze-Dry
- Hurricane
- Roost

Helps the Rest of the teammates to gain some Speed. Especially Articunos Bulk is really good here and also having the longevity due to Leftovers and Roost gives it more than only 1 Chance to setup a Tailwind.


Pyroar @ Firium Z
Ability: Unnerve
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Flame Charge
- Fire Blast
- Hyper Voice
- Hidden Power [Grass]

One Flame Charge boost gives you the Speed to Outspeed Revege Killers like Scarfed Primeape, Scarfed Togedemaru and Scarfed Mesprit and you are able to Kill these for Pyroar otherwise problematic mons with a strong Z-Fire Blast or weaken them severly.

 

[MZ]

Scyther @ Eviolite
Ability: Technician
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Brick Break
- Swords Dance
- Aerial Ace
- U-turn / Roost

I think Scyther is very mediocre. It's just got too many bad matchups against a whole bunch of common stuff. Max HP SD Roost dual STAB is a massive let-down because of how few teams don't have Kabutops, Alolaslash, Togedemaru, Aggron, etc. SD Brick Break just gives this thing 10x the opportunities to actually wallbreak if you want to use it in that capacity. I've been running it without Roost, forfeiting the kind of bulky cleaner thing it has going, but the ability to actually kill things before 40 turns of chipping them with Spikes is really nice. I hope we see more Scyther tech here or elsewhere, because getting walled by Rock- and Steel-types on 90% of sets has made this look so much worse than it probably is.

 

[MZ]

I can double post if I want to. HJAD and yogi and I just did another untier talk and basically talked about a bunch of sets we think are creative or underrated so this seems like a good place to post it. Here is a pokepaste of the 9 main sets or mons we talked about.