Doubles OU Roles Compendium

talkingtree

large if factual
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Top Social Media Contributor Alumnusis a Senior Staff Member Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Top Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis a Two-Time Past SCL Champion
Solid vs shaky is pretty much the only split that I'm worried about with respect to viability. Otherwise, except in a few specific cases, I'll just order them based on their placement in the viability rankings. If I ordered them mon by mon then we'd never come to a consensus.

Btw, hose few specific cases I'm referencing are where something is on the border of solid and shaky so I put it at the end of solid.

Also I haven't forgotten about the edits that I promised to make - just gotten busier than I expected. Stay tuned, changes coming eventually !_!
 

Checkmater

It’s just us kittens left, and the rain is coming
is a Tiering Contributor
I don't mean they just get u-turned. I mean they get u-turned and lose sizeable chunks of hp, both swinging momentum into landos favor while also chunking said mons into easy ko range

there's a difference between "oh no I see your keldeo and my lando can't touch that I'll u-turn on this thing" vs "hey look a cresselia! time for a free switchin and 60%"

sorry if that wasn't clear
 

talkingtree

large if factual
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Top Social Media Contributor Alumnusis a Senior Staff Member Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Top Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis a Two-Time Past SCL Champion
Added Gastrodon mentions, removed regular Abomasnow, fixed the Deoxys sprites to become Deoxys-A, and made a few solid vs. shaky changes with the help of n10sit!

Since Darkrai has Dark Pulse to get rid of Aegis, which is a huge problem for hail, as well as a fast Will-O-Wisp, we decided it should still be there, but it has been moved to the back of the category.
 

Platinum God n1n1

the real n1n1
is a Tiering Contributor
Metagross is a priority attacker and strong priority attacker. Breloom is also strong priority imo.
Metagross could be a shaky Heatran check considering it quite often carries hammer arm

Why is Jirachi shaky tr reset rather than solid?

And CharY is a solid tr attacker
 

Platinum God n1n1

the real n1n1
is a Tiering Contributor
Charizard is not a Trick Room Pokemon. I can't believe how many times you've gotten this wrong.
You can't make an argument against it. You just repeat yourself saying it's not.
You are just discrediting me every chance you get because you're a jerk.
I am not the only one using it, I know Nido and mizu use tr CharY use it as well

In the ev compendium we have CharY
In the sample teams team building compendium. we have a charY team
pastelle and KyleCole delete TR CharY from your lists if I am wrong and l51is right
 
Last edited:

Stratos

Banned deucer.
You can't make an argument against it. You just repeat yourself saying it's not.
You are just discrediting me every chance you get because you're a jerk.
I am not the only one using it, I know Nido and mizu use tr CharY use it as well
u can use tons of mons on trick room. i built a team with trick room in spl where one of the attackers was a specs rotom wash. hell i built a tr team for joim in spl5 where the tr attackers were kyurem-b and moltres. Just being able to use a mon on a TR team doesnt really mean it belongs on that list imo; the mons listed in that section either provide an important service to TR other than their attacking power or are slow enough that their main attacking niche is in TR.

anyways, this is probably more because level 51 is sad he missed his chance to tell you that charizard isn't a TR mon, the first half dozen times, when your posts were 100% completely wrong, like when he deleted your post saying "why would you use venu? charizard only belongs on TR" so while your post may not have been entirely bullshit this one time (zard can be good on TR) the sentiment behind it absolutely was (zard is only good on TR).
In the ev compendium we have CharY
In the sample teams we have a charY team
KyleCole delete TR CharY from your list if I am wrong and l51is right
im not exactly sure what tr char y sample team youre referring to because the only char y team in the samples is mine and i assure you it is not tr
 

Platinum God n1n1

the real n1n1
is a Tiering Contributor
Meant to say team building frame works rather than samples. It is the mizu team.

Considering CharYs biggest threats tend to be faster than it, I say CharY benefits from speed control immensely. Not limited to tw.

Also tr CharY is far more common and successful than moltres+kyurem or w/e silly things have been thrown in tr
 
TR Charizard is more successful mostly due to your attempts to use it all the goddamn time, if somebody used banded Pyroar enough then it would become more successful than life orb Entei eventually. Also, define silly things on tr if Charizard isn't silly please, you can literally just click Heatran or something and have a mega slot open to spend on something like Kanga or Maw or Abomasnow. The sun doesn't really justify charizard>heatran because Heatran can just run orb and do like the smallest bit less, and the ground immunity doesn't really mean much considering there are only like 2 "viable" tr setters that lose to Lando.
 

Platinum God n1n1

the real n1n1
is a Tiering Contributor
Yes, I almost exclusively use CharY in tr. When I say it only belongs in tr I am joking/trolling. Surprisingly so many people think it's serious which is shocking considering how many people have beat me with sun venu

Also how do you know it has 188 speed? The spreads are not given
 
Last edited:

Platinum God n1n1

the real n1n1
is a Tiering Contributor
rhypheor isnt solid TR attacker. its ohko by ammonguss. move to shaky imo. Its something I never even see in TR actually; usually just a CharY support. and Evolite rhydon is usually better
 

Checkmater

It’s just us kittens left, and the rain is coming
is a Tiering Contributor
On comparing Rhyperior to Rhydon:

No you should, in most cases, definitely be using Rhyperior. First you get Solid Rock and also Life Orb, both things that FullRoom wants over Lightning Rod/Eviolite. The goal of a FullRoom team is to kill kill kill kill, and more damage means less turns for opps to switch around = more wins. While I can see a case made for the general bulk of Eviolite, on the whole you're going to want that Life Orb damage. Lightning Rod is a niche interaction that FullRoom especially doesn't need as it's not really as afraid of full paras (fuck those people that twave your mons because that's their only "tr check") as more offensive teams, and because electric-weaks aren't quite an issue for fullroom.

On shakyness/solidity of Rhyperior:

Have to agree that Rhyperior functions as a shaky tr attacker. Its plethora of weaknesses, frankly kind of abysmal coverage, and its damage output leave something to be desired. Considering how hard it loses to Amoonguss and its inability to matchup vs most of the metagame halfway decently outside of room, along with intimidate presenting a serious "slow the fuck down m8", Rhyperior is probably shaky as a Trick Room attacker.
 

talkingtree

large if factual
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Top Social Media Contributor Alumnusis a Senior Staff Member Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Top Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis a Two-Time Past SCL Champion
EdgeQuake is so great that it has its own recognized name describing the coverage so I'm not sure I agree with EdgeQuake + Ice Punch being "frankly kind of abysmal coverage", but otherwise I agree with the above post completely. Rhydon tends to be outside of fullroom teams for the reasons that check stated.

The OP has been edited to reflect this, and also Zard Y is now in shaky for TR attackers.
 

Mishimono

mish mish
is a Top Tiering Contributoris a Past SCL Champion
DPL Champion
Maybe you could add Gyarados to Trick Room attackers as it appreciates being able to go first and fire off strong attacks. It also helps check rain and sun.
 

talkingtree

large if factual
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Top Social Media Contributor Alumnusis a Senior Staff Member Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Top Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis a Two-Time Past SCL Champion
A few updates:
  • Added Gyarados to Trick Room Attackers; placed in Shaky to reflect that only the Band set should be used under TR.
  • Added Darkrai to Heatran checks because my Heatran just got OHKO'd by a Focus Blast Darkrai.
  • Moved Mega Gardevoir to Shaky in Taunt users, as it is generally worse than Garde's other options for a third move.
  • Updated the positions of everything to reflect the recent VR changes
  • Added two potential new categories, Thundurus Checks and Attack Control, with subcategories shown on the OP. Let me know if you think they're in the wrong section (Essential vs Nonessential), or if you think one or the other shouldn't be included. I'll give about three days for responses and then add sprites into the categories as necessary.
Let me know either here or on PS if you have any more suggestions! Also, I'll be adding Volcanion (aka Big Steamy) to the OP once it is released.

Edit: I also made some stylistic changes, so hopefully they've improved this resource.
 
Last edited:

talkingtree

large if factual
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Top Social Media Contributor Alumnusis a Senior Staff Member Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Top Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis a Two-Time Past SCL Champion
I've removed Defiant/Competitive because it's only Bisharp and Milotic anyway and their role is pretty different from other "Attack Control" mons. For now, the category as a whole will be placed in Essential, with Wisp and Snarl users set as Shaky as their default to reflect that they are less essential forms of attack control.

Does that work better?
 

talkingtree

large if factual
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Top Social Media Contributor Alumnusis a Senior Staff Member Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Top Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis a Two-Time Past SCL Champion
More updates, to correspond with VR updates!
  • Removed Chesnaught and Mega Latias
  • Added Bronzong
  • Adjusted positions to reflect new tiering
  • Added Encore section to Utility Moves, will add mons soon
Let me know if I missed anything, or if you have any opinions on Encore being included. I'll add Volcanion once it's ranked, but does it deserve its own section dedicated to finding checks to it? Probably too soon to tell but I'm open to any suggestions.
 

Platinum God n1n1

the real n1n1
is a Tiering Contributor
I don't think this should be dependent on viability rankings. If I want to try a new set up sweeper mega latias is good to note here even if a group of people don't consider it viable

You can make a judgment of your own on what deserves to be on the list of set up sweepers, priority attackers, ect
 

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 1, Guests: 0)

Top