Resource [Crown Tundra] Sword/Shield BSS Viability Rankings

DerpySuX

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I'm glad I got Darm-G promoted and Raikou at least voted on, but what about Gyarados? It isn't in the vote for being dropped. It's not terrible since it has DD and Airstream, but I really don't see it being on the same level as Lapras. B is fine, maybe B-.
Dragonite is probably the main reason Gyarados doesn’t see a ton of use. As Dragonite has the same DD airstream niche that Gyarados fills, but does so much more reliably with multiscale and the fact that he doesn’t have a 4x weakness to the STAB of the most used mon in the format.

Oh and also dual wingbeat is better than bounce outside of max
 

Thick Fat Azumarill

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:slowking-galar: Galarian Slowking to B/B+: while what it does didn't change much in the past few months(SpDef wall with AV, or decent against fatter teams with Calm Mind), it skyrocketed in usage this last season(at least at the time of writing), and apparently it took a page from Smogon OU's book and started running Future Sight. I guess the board control you get from Future Sight enabling something else on the team is a strong option.
 
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I agree. Also for underrated mons I think Porygon-z should go up a bit. EEven though I've never used it or even thought bout it, it goes great w/ Dynamax thanks to Adaptability. BoltBeam coverage hits many things.

It is a little slow before Max Strike, and frail besides so it can't go up much. But I got Darm-G to go up, and this mon seems like a slightly worse special version, w/ similar obese power but w/ frailty and a somewhat disappointing Spe stat.
That is hardly sufficient evidence to nominate Porygon-Z to B-. Its currently outside of the top 100 in usage and has next to no high ranking team representation; searching Nouthuca, I found one team in Season 18 that had PZ and it only peaked in the mid-1000's. Pure speculation does not make for a good nomination.

In regards to the Darm-G comparison... no. Darm-G has a very relevant offensive STAB, Gorilla Tactics which boosts all attacking moves and several proven sets that give it some unpredictability at team preview. Compare this to PZ where Adaptability only boosts Normal STAB (neutral damage at best) and almost no development has occurred because it hasn't found a niche that isn't done better elsewhere. This is somewhat in hindsight since Darm-G's glory days are behind it of course, but by that comparison Porygon-Z isn't even close to Darm-G in terms of relevance. I'm down for pleasant surprises in metagame development, but as the facts currently stand PZ absolutely should not rise.
 
I know this ruleset is taking a break again, but I think there are some nominations still worth considering:

:slowking-galar: : Rise to B+/A-

Gonna echo TFA on this thing going up, maybe even farther to A-. Not even LO Zapdos can 2HKO with Max Airstream against the AV sets; it gets to switch in against a plethora of special attackers, cause some havoc with its broad coverage then switch to a teammate at the first sniff of danger all while Regenerator keeps it healthy. It isn't Toxapex, but it occupies a similar niche while being more offensively oriented. With it now sitting in the top 30 usage, its overdue for a bump.

:garchomp: : Fall to A-

The apex 4th generation Dragon-type just wasn't able to maintain its traction. I attribute this to three things. First, it is in sharp competition with Dragapult and Dragonite. Second, it breaks even or does worse against popular cushions such as Landorus-T and Porygon2 (compare this with the other two big Dragon-types, who both have abilities to block Intimidate for instance.) Third, it gets middling depth out of Dynamax and as a result struggles with four moveslot syndrome. No Dragon Dance or Max Airstream REALLY hurts its viability. Do you run Scale Shot and trade consistent damage for the ability to boost speed? Do you want Rock Tomb for speed control or Stone Edge to actually pose a threat to Zapdos? At the end of the day, it has a lot of tools but its forced to specialize a little too much. Having to choose a role though doesn't make it bad. With that in mind, I think it fits in with the other A- mons: lots of versatility with decent splashability, but it definitely has painful matchups and can't fit enough toys into one set.

:kartana: : Fall to B+

On the other hand, I don't think Kartana fits in A- anymore. This thing is still a terror if you let it set up, but it lacks the same splashability the other A- mons have. This is in part due to how hostile the current meta is to Steel-types, with tons of Fire and Fighting coverage. Add to this its propensity to dying to faint wind from special attackers, and actually getting this thing into position to go ham is tough. This is all on top of the fact that it gets ganked by Zapdos, let alone the defensive ones. Cinderace, Naganadel and special Dragapult are all issues too if it can't boost beforehand, and prematurely committing this thing to Dynamax can be a huge risk. Again, terrifying under the right circumstances and it does demand a certain level of respect at team preview, but its awkward defensive problems combined with almost always requiring Dynamax makes it more fitting in the B+ category.
 

DerpySuX

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:garchomp: : Fall to A-

The apex 4th generation Dragon-type just wasn't able to maintain its traction. I attribute this to three things. First, it is in sharp competition with Dragapult and Dragonite. Second, it breaks even or does worse against popular cushions such as Landorus-T and Porygon2 (compare this with the other two big Dragon-types, who both have abilities to block Intimidate for instance.) Third, it gets middling depth out of Dynamax and as a result struggles with four moveslot syndrome. No Dragon Dance or Max Airstream REALLY hurts its viability. Do you run Scale Shot and trade consistent damage for the ability to boost speed? Do you want Rock Tomb for speed control or Stone Edge to actually pose a threat to Zapdos? At the end of the day, it has a lot of tools but its forced to specialize a little too much. Having to choose a role though doesn't make it bad. With that in mind, I think it fits in with the other A- mons: lots of versatility with decent splashability, but it definitely has painful matchups and can't fit enough toys into one set.
I honestly wholly agree with this. As much as I love Garchomp, and anyone who knows me at all will attest to how much I love using this thing on ladder, there are more splashable, easier to use options for dragon offense in Dragonite and Dragapult.
Garchomp can absolutely be a terror, and I’ve run over numerous teams with him throughout both series 7 and 9, but the fact of the matter is he has to specialize, which can force certain teammates or complimentary sets. A- is definitely where he belongs.

As for Kartana, I honestly don’t see why people still run this thing. Almost every time i see one it’s just the most free beast boost for my Celesteela on the planet, that’s not even mentioning other monsters that absolutely love seeing it such as Naganadel and Zapdos
 
As for Kartana, I honestly don’t see why people still run this thing. Almost every time i see one it’s just the most free beast boost for my Celesteela on the planet, that’s not even mentioning other monsters that absolutely love seeing it such as Naganadel and Zapdos
That's not surprising as I would consider Celesteela its absolutely worst matchup, since its best option is a meager 90 BP Max Knuckle. At least with Zapdos you have 150 BP Giga Impact, which will actually do something after a Beast Boost or Swords Dance.

But to elaborate a bit more on your remark, Kartana is still a threat because of its ridiculous 180 base attack, 100+ speed tier and Beast Boost snowballing. If you're Sash + Swords Dance + Giga Impact, you can take Zapdos if it has to switch into you, for instance.

Unlike Garchomp though (I'll make that comparison since we were just talking about him,) (1) its switch-in opportunities are much more limited as even resisted special attacks do a healthy chunk of damage and (2) its type weaknesses are much more heavily exploited by the other top tier, higher speed sweepers. I would say his snowball potential is actually higher than Garchomp, but his specialization is far more narrow so his overall flexibility is worse as a result. EDIT: (3) Let's not forget his limited offensive options.

As a side note. I was running LO Kartana on my most recent team; I'm trying Sash Swords Dance Kartana now. We'll see if it changes my mind at all, but I think as long as the top tiers exploit him as much as they do he's going to be very feast-or-famine.
 

DerpySuX

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That's not surprising as I would consider Celesteela its absolutely worst matchup, since its best option is a meager 90 BP Max Knuckle. At least with Zapdos you have 150 BP Giga Impact, which will actually do something after a Beast Boost or Swords Dance.

But to elaborate a bit more on your remark, Kartana is still a threat because of its ridiculous 180 base attack, 100+ speed tier and Beast Boost snowballing. If you're Sash + Swords Dance + Giga Impact, you can take Zapdos if it has to switch into you, for instance.

Unlike Garchomp though (I'll make that comparison since we were just talking about him,) (1) its switch-in opportunities are much more limited as even resisted special attacks do a healthy chunk of damage and (2) its type weaknesses are much more heavily exploited by the other top tier, higher speed sweepers. I would say his snowball potential is actually higher than Garchomp, but his specialization is far more narrow so his overall flexibility is worse as a result. EDIT: (3) Let's not forget his limited offensive options.

As a side note. I was running LO Kartana on my most recent team; I'm trying Sash Swords Dance Kartana now. We'll see if it changes my mind at all, but I think as long as the top tiers exploit him as much as they do he's going to be very feast-or-famine.
For my tastes Kartana is just far too matchup reliant to be worth adding to most teams. Sure, you can blow past fini and stuff, potentially snowballing to a sweep, but the vast majority of the time it feels like dead weight until you can find an opportunity to get it in. Even then, it gets chased off the field rather quickly by almost any scarfer (unless kart is also scarfed, in which case it’s even easier to check with bulky mons like Steela), even Lele’s resisted STAB cleanly 2 hit KOs Kart thanks to his pitiful SpDef, or anything with fire coverage/a decent special attack.

Like you pointed out, the snowball potential is definitely there, and if left unchecked, then yeah, Kartana can be super scary. But I would be very surprised to find a team that doesn’t have at least one good natural check to Kartana. Cinderace and Celesteela are terrific mons that can offensively (and in Steela’s case, defensively as well) pressure Kartana and force exploitable plays from the opponent, as neither ace or Steela are mons you want to be giving free turns to.
 
:kartana: : Fall to B+

On the other hand, I don't think Kartana fits in A- anymore. This thing is still a terror if you let it set up, but it lacks the same splashability the other A- mons have. This is in part due to how hostile the current meta is to Steel-types, with tons of Fire and Fighting coverage. Add to this its propensity to dying to faint wind from special attackers, and actually getting this thing into position to go ham is tough. This is all on top of the fact that it gets ganked by Zapdos, let alone the defensive ones. Cinderace, Naganadel and special Dragapult are all issues too if it can't boost beforehand, and prematurely committing this thing to Dynamax can be a huge risk. Again, terrifying under the right circumstances and it does demand a certain level of respect at team preview, but its awkward defensive problems combined with almost always requiring Dynamax makes it more fitting in the B+ category.
Gonna have to agree to this as well. i'd also like to add that kartana does have a lot of issues against standard offense but some of stall team's premier pokemon like chansey or quag (and to less of a degree, toxapex) lose to this thing so it's very good against stall. i've been using a substitute + swords dance + pinch berry set that's very adept at murdering lots of premier stall threats but doesn't come much into standard offensive teams because of how many top pokemon can check this mon.
 

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Sorry for the super late update, I know we're on a different meta now but I did say we'd still be taking updates into account for this meta so here we are. Going to keep this nice and simple since there haven't been too many nominations. Ultimately we decided to keep Kartana and Garchomp at their current spots, so there's not much to change. However, for a quick summary:

Slowking (Galar) rises from B- to B+. This was a pretty much unanimous agreement that more or less lines up with the discussion in this thread, Galarian Slowking is a fairly popular recent trend and has seen solid results on teams that can capitalize on the Future Sight pressure. Galarian Slowking follows in the footsteps of its OU presence with the rise of Future Sight's usage, though ultimately its probably not going too much higher than this since it's somewhat team-reliant. However, Galarian Slowing really stands out lately so it's hard to deny that it's deserving of a rise.

Registeel moves from UR to C+. While this one comes a bit out of nowhere, Registeel saw a very surprising surge in usage last season and a great deal of respect from some of our VR team, mostly notably from greilmercenary9. With its impressive natural bulk and Light Clay Lapras as a teammate, Iron Defense and Amnesia both make Registeel a very bulky tank that handles Max Airstream spam very well, while also boasting a powerful Body Press to actually threaten foes. Similar to Slowking, this is simply a case of people realizing that Registeel can actually be effective, though it's not quite at the level of relevance of Galarian Slowking of course.

That's about it for now though, with BSPL coming around I'm sure we'll see some trends in that environment so hopefully we'll get a chance to revisit this in the future. As a quick note I know that there's been some questions about a VR for Series 10, details TBD on if/when that goes up but it will likely be a more trimmed down list similar to the Series 8 VR. In the meantime I'd recommend checking out that list but note that Pokemon that utilized Dynamax are not as standout in Series 10 (Airstreamers, Lapras, etc). Otherwise feel free to discuss any trends or odd placements on this VR as always!
 

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