Since the megathread got closed ... and pardon the sensationalist title.
I'm having some serious trouble dealing with stallbreaker Clefable. There are three sets:
Clefable @ Life Orb
Double Edge
Fire Blast
Grass Knot
Softboiled
And:
Clefable @ Toxic Orb
Facade
Fire Blast
Softboiled
Trick
And finally:
Clefable @ Life Orb
Calm Mind
Thunderbolt
Ice Beam
Softboiled
What beats these things? All three sets are checked by Hitmontop, although it can be worn down. Beyond that far as I can see counters get really shaky. Uragg suggested Magcargo to check the first one, which come to think of it works well, but it is only one Pokemon and a NU one at that. The Clefable analysis currently being prepared suggests SpD Spiritomb, which looks unreliable because it can be taken down quite quickly with Grass Knot (in addition to Fire Blast). It won't like getting Tricked by the 2nd set, while the third set just sets up on it. Hariyama will get worn down quickly vs. boosted Double Edge.
For the second set I can't see any firm counters to. I guess there's Heatran, except it's OU ... otherwise all I can see is to try to get it to Trick Toxic Orb onto something that doesn't mind it that much (such as RestTalk Milo) but RestTalk Milo can be 3HKOed by Orb-boosted Facade without Leftovers, and steel types like Registeel get pwned by Fire Blast. RestTalk Spiritomb perhaps ... finally the third set breaks through stall completely except for Hitmontop (which is, as always, worn down) and potentially last-ditch TrickScarfers.
So the list of checks are three Pokemon: Hitmontop, Spiritomb and Magcargo. Looks dangerously short to me.
If Clefable isn't BL for crushing stall there has to be more Pokemon on this list. Help?
PS: I blame Oglemi and SilentVerse for making me play 4th gen UU. Sheesh. :naughty:
I'm having some serious trouble dealing with stallbreaker Clefable. There are three sets:
Clefable @ Life Orb
Double Edge
Fire Blast
Grass Knot
Softboiled
And:
Clefable @ Toxic Orb
Facade
Fire Blast
Softboiled
Trick
And finally:
Clefable @ Life Orb
Calm Mind
Thunderbolt
Ice Beam
Softboiled
What beats these things? All three sets are checked by Hitmontop, although it can be worn down. Beyond that far as I can see counters get really shaky. Uragg suggested Magcargo to check the first one, which come to think of it works well, but it is only one Pokemon and a NU one at that. The Clefable analysis currently being prepared suggests SpD Spiritomb, which looks unreliable because it can be taken down quite quickly with Grass Knot (in addition to Fire Blast). It won't like getting Tricked by the 2nd set, while the third set just sets up on it. Hariyama will get worn down quickly vs. boosted Double Edge.
For the second set I can't see any firm counters to. I guess there's Heatran, except it's OU ... otherwise all I can see is to try to get it to Trick Toxic Orb onto something that doesn't mind it that much (such as RestTalk Milo) but RestTalk Milo can be 3HKOed by Orb-boosted Facade without Leftovers, and steel types like Registeel get pwned by Fire Blast. RestTalk Spiritomb perhaps ... finally the third set breaks through stall completely except for Hitmontop (which is, as always, worn down) and potentially last-ditch TrickScarfers.
So the list of checks are three Pokemon: Hitmontop, Spiritomb and Magcargo. Looks dangerously short to me.
If Clefable isn't BL for crushing stall there has to be more Pokemon on this list. Help?
PS: I blame Oglemi and SilentVerse for making me play 4th gen UU. Sheesh. :naughty: