CAP 21 - Part 1 - Concept Submissions

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ginganinja

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You could give it a bulkier stat spread and defensive abilities to start, and then mega evolution gives it an offensive ability and dump the 100 stat points into Attack and Speed or Special Attack and Speed.

Alternatively, it could be a sweeper that changes its type once it mega-evolves, so that you try to defeat its counters before mega-evolving with the base form, then you mega-evolve and sweep the opponent.
So basically Mega Mawile then?
 
I thought about this as well when I read his post. The problem is, you can't really give it a moveset conducive to two different playstyles, unless you're basically turning its mega into the equivalent of the CAP itself, but with a Choice item. What I mean, is, three stall moves to keep itself alive and one offensive move that works best when it MEvoes. At that point, what was the point behind giving it a mega when you could just Choice Specs it?

This is the kind of stuff that would be a concern about viability.
It could be a slower, bulkier sweeper, and then it mega-evolves and becomes a faster, frailer sweeper. Those two would have similar enough movesets to make it work without either form suffering. Or they could both be fast, frail sweepers, only with different types and abilities that make them get past different counters.

So basically Mega Mawile then?
No, because Mega Mawile almost never finds a situation in which it pays to mega-evolve later. The only time you want to delay mega-evolution is if the opponent is about to use an ability replacing move or skill swap, which far too rare to actually care about.
 
I think the concept is in danger of turning out like Gyarados, who you may not MEvo if you're more worried about Garchomp/Landorus than you are about MegaMeta/MegaZam. Gyarados works really well when you have a team that can manage his checks and counters both before and after it MEvos, effectively giving you a seventh teammate. A statistical overhaul and role change is asking for a hell of a lot, is the problem. It's not a bad idea by any means, and a more researched argument/explanation for CAP22 may open it up to more discussion, but while we're in uncharted territory, it's most likely safer to create something that's going to MEvo right away.
 
So, you guys have definitely convinced me that the concept would require a good deal of finesse to get right, and knowing that, should probably wait until after we have a Mega CAP under our belt so we can do it justice. Maybe even by CAP 22, if we're not Mega-fatigued by that point. That said, I just want to throw in my own thoughts on the way the discussion is going.

First of all, I think Mawile and Gyarados are both bad comparisons to what this CAP would be intended to do. Even though they both get a defensive ability switching to an offensive one, it doesn't really qualify because both of the defensive abilities are Intimidate, which wouldn't really fit the concept because you can still MEvo immediately after you switch in and essentially keep the benefit of both abilities, which is the opposite of what the concept should achieve. Furthermore, as Yveltal stated, Gyarados really only delays MEvoing when it has a reason to keep its ground immunity, which makes it much more of a situational play than the expectation. Type changes are certainly a big part of what could make the concept work, but if the only reason you don't MEvo right away is to hold onto a type immunity, then I don't really think the concept would be achieved (at least, not in any way that would be interesting to us.)

That said, I also want to address something else nyttn said, specifically
AND still make it worthwhile to actually slap on a megastone instead of some other item.
This is more about Mega CAPs in general, but I kinda feel that, unless we specifically want to make something like a Mega Beedrill, any Mega we design, Patient or not, should also be viable on its own with a different held item. If the base form is worthless, then what exactly is the point of making a Mega CAP in the first place when you could just design the Mega form alone and call it a day, because the base is competitively irrelevant? Not only does it make it a more worthwhile exercise for us to consider both forms competitively, it also adds competitive depth by forcing your opponent to guess which Pokemon is your Mega. Obviously its very bad if no one's actually running the Mega form at all, but I think it's a very promising sign for us if people are using both the Mega and base forms equally.
 

Rowan

The professor?
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there's more than just a gyarados approach to the patient mega CAP. intimidate+ground immunity is a cool way to approach the concept, but there are plenty of abilities which allow the concept to succeed. it doesn't even have to be defensive abilities.

immunity abilities are obvious ways to appraoch the concept. stuff like water absorb/volt absorb that allow CAP to check things throughout the match, and then evolve to be able to handle something else. other immunity abilities like bulletproof could also be useful.
but there are more... magic bounce would be an interesting defensive ability. early game it could pressure the opponent into not getting hazards up, then megavolve to something more useful on the offensive side.
offensive abilities could be useful. something with moxie that needed a moxie boost to sweep, might be patient in evolving to KO something. rattled could be used in the same vein as moxie, hoping to get that vital speed boost before it mega evolves. another interesting one is scrappy. if MegaCAP could be walled by ghost types, but it's non-mega could be scrappy to help it handle ghost types with fighting/normal moves, before it megaevolves into something that is more useful later on. any of the -ate abilities would also be similar to scrappy in that they could provide different coverage early game, but once pokemon are removed, it can mega evolve into a better pokemon. changing to a different -ate ability would be a cool way to provide pseudo-coverage. an rock type pokemon using refrigerate to provide coverage on ground types, then changing to aerilate to provide coverage on fighting types, could be an interesting take

As for mega cap abilities, it depends on the primary ability but speed boost could be something to explore. i can see a moxie->speed boost combo working. or even moxie for the mega, as it can be useful for sweeping but might only want it once it's ready to sweep.

the trick would be finding an ability that's generally useful late game, but isn't useful early game and vice versa. intimidate is a good example, but already has a decent example with gyarados, but there are many unexplored directions of this concept.

i just wanted to offer out some interesting ways of approaching this concept, understand if people wanna wait before doing it, but i do think it's the best mega cap concept - maybe it is better to wait, since we don't wanna fuck up such a good concept!
 
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Name: Tortoise beats the Hare

General Description: A semi-fast Pokemon who can only get outclassed by slower Pokemon.

Justification: There are a lot of fast AND slow Pokemon in the tier of OU. Now, usually Pokemon get outclassed by typing, or abilities. But this pokemon gets outclassed by slow Pokemon. Basically, you being in the middle of group, whilst tanks are dangerous and speedy pokemon are just things to laugh at. And as for Pokemon near the same speed as you, well, they're just other Pokemon that do damage.

Questions To Be Answered:
- Would Baton Passing slower speed to this Pokemon make it unfair in the meta?
- With all the fast Pokemon in OU, is it possible to take it down easily, even with STAB?
- Would giving it low HP balance out the damage reduction?
- How many speed lowering moves would this Pokemon have access to?
- Would this Pokemon act as a wall for fast sweepers?
- If this Pokemon makes an appearance, will opponents be Baton Passing slow speed upon themselves?

Explanation: Basically, if we gave this Pokemon say, 90 speed, Pokemon like Garchomp, Gardevoir, Alakazam, etc. would only do 0.66x damage to this Pokemon, while slower Pokemon, like Excadrill, Conkeldurr, and Dragonite do 1.33x damage to this Pokemon. You may be thinking, 'But Conkeldurr doing 1.33x damage on top of everything else is Overpowered', well there are some things you could do to prevent this, like; tricking a Choice Scarf. On top of that, this Pokemon takes less damage from priority, so Sucker Punch won't do as much damage as it should be doing. Slower Pokemon may make more of an appearance, but that's alright. Remember, you have a speed lowering move(s) and in place of Leftovers, Life Orb etc. you can be holding an Iron Ball to slow yourself in your tracks. But watch out for threats as an enemy Tricking a Choice Scarf, Knocking Off your Iron Ball, or Baton Passing slower speed onto themselves, which may appear more often. So in conclusion, try to face faster Pokemon, avoid slow ones and you should be fine.
 
Name: Tortoise beats the Hare

General Description: A semi-fast Pokemon who can only get outclassed by slower Pokemon.

Justification: There are a lot of fast AND slow Pokemon in the tier of OU. Now, usually Pokemon get outclassed by typing, or abilities. But this pokemon gets outclassed by slow Pokemon. Basically, you being in the middle of group, whilst tanks are dangerous and speedy pokemon are just things to laugh at. And as for Pokemon near the same speed as you, well, they're just other Pokemon that do damage.

Questions To Be Answered:
- Would Baton Passing slower speed to this Pokemon make it unfair in the meta?
- With all the fast Pokemon in OU, is it possible to take it down easily, even with STAB?
- Would giving it low HP balance out the damage reduction?
- How many speed lowering moves would this Pokemon have access to?
- Would this Pokemon act as a wall for fast sweepers?
- If this Pokemon makes an appearance, will opponents be Baton Passing slow speed upon themselves?

Explanation: Basically, if we gave this Pokemon say, 90 speed, Pokemon like Garchomp, Gardevoir, Alakazam, etc. would only do 0.66x damage to this Pokemon, while slower Pokemon, like Excadrill, Conkeldurr, and Dragonite do 1.33x damage to this Pokemon. You may be thinking, 'But Conkeldurr doing 1.33x damage on top of everything else is Overpowered', well there are some things you could do to prevent this, like; tricking a Choice Scarf. On top of that, this Pokemon takes less damage from priority, so Sucker Punch won't do as much damage as it should be doing. Slower Pokemon may make more of an appearance, but that's alright. Remember, you have a speed lowering move(s) and in place of Leftovers, Life Orb etc. you can be holding an Iron Ball to slow yourself in your tracks. But watch out for threats as an enemy Tricking a Choice Scarf, Knocking Off your Iron Ball, or Baton Passing slower speed onto themselves, which may appear more often. So in conclusion, try to face faster Pokemon, avoid slow ones and you should be fine.
It's relatively difficult for us to control how well a mon we create fares, especially when we want something this specific. Naviathan and Aurumoth are examples of why such is difficult; you either make a set that is underwhelming or is too overpowering. You are also asking for a concept that involves mechanics that may not even exist in the ORAS metagame, which is not what the purpose of the concept is about.
 

ginganinja

It's all coming back to me now
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Name: Tortoise beats the Hare

General Description: A semi-fast Pokemon who can only get outclassed by slower Pokemon.

Justification: There are a lot of fast AND slow Pokemon in the tier of OU. Now, usually Pokemon get outclassed by typing, or abilities. But this pokemon gets outclassed by slow Pokemon. Basically, you being in the middle of group, whilst tanks are dangerous and speedy pokemon are just things to laugh at. And as for Pokemon near the same speed as you, well, they're just other Pokemon that do damage.

Questions To Be Answered:
- Would Baton Passing slower speed to this Pokemon make it unfair in the meta?
- With all the fast Pokemon in OU, is it possible to take it down easily, even with STAB?
- Would giving it low HP balance out the damage reduction?
- How many speed lowering moves would this Pokemon have access to?
- Would this Pokemon act as a wall for fast sweepers?
- If this Pokemon makes an appearance, will opponents be Baton Passing slow speed upon themselves?

Explanation: Basically, if we gave this Pokemon say, 90 speed, Pokemon like Garchomp, Gardevoir, Alakazam, etc. would only do 0.66x damage to this Pokemon, while slower Pokemon, like Excadrill, Conkeldurr, and Dragonite do 1.33x damage to this Pokemon. You may be thinking, 'But Conkeldurr doing 1.33x damage on top of everything else is Overpowered', well there are some things you could do to prevent this, like; tricking a Choice Scarf. On top of that, this Pokemon takes less damage from priority, so Sucker Punch won't do as much damage as it should be doing. Slower Pokemon may make more of an appearance, but that's alright. Remember, you have a speed lowering move(s) and in place of Leftovers, Life Orb etc. you can be holding an Iron Ball to slow yourself in your tracks. But watch out for threats as an enemy Tricking a Choice Scarf, Knocking Off your Iron Ball, or Baton Passing slower speed onto themselves, which may appear more often. So in conclusion, try to face faster Pokemon, avoid slow ones and you should be fine.
You can get points for enthusiasm, but we are not doing this concept.
 

Rowan

The professor?
is a Community Leader Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus
Name: Bring two, pick one!
General Description: A Mega Pokemon that encourages the use of double-mega teams, by synergising well with another mega pokemon.
Justification: Double mega teams seem great in theory. The fact you can choose for 1 Pokemon to mega evolve based on the opposing team seems great, however they don't work with the current megas we have due to it generally not being worth it, to lose an item on something. However, double mega teams do have potential to minimise team disadvantage, and with the right pokemon could this potential could be realised.
Questions To Be Answered:
Which Pokemon is best to pick as a partner?
How do we make up for the fact that one Pokemon can't use an item if it chooses not to mega evolve?
How do we make the core synergise well, with each mega having to synergise well with each of their non-mega forms?
Is offensive or defensive synergy more important?
How do we determine which Pokemon is best to mega evolve during the match?


Explanation: Many people have tried double mega teams, but they don't usually work. This is because it's usually better to just use an item. However if we created a mega pokemon that truly synergised well with an already existing one, in a way that we haven't had before, there is definitely potential. The possibility of choosing your mega based on the opposing team, could give you a massive team advantage. The main problem is how to make up for the fact you'll be running 1 pokemon without an item. This is why synergy is really key. Each non mega form will have to synergise super well with each mega form. Defensive vs Offensive is another interesting question. Will both pokemon have offensive megas and we can decide which one is best to sweep? Will both of them wall different threats, and we decide which is the best Pokemon to mega evolve based on which is on the opposing team? Will we have 1 defensive mega and 1 offensive mega which are suited to fighting different team archetypes. maybe 1 mega can rip through bulky teams, but the other destroys faster offensive teams. Unfortunately there are not many good options for a pokemon that we can pair this CAP well with. Most likely candidates would be Slowbro or Gyarados imo. Both can be late game sweepers with cm/dd respectively yet sometimes it might be best to stay in their normal forms if the utility provided by regen/intimidate is more important. Other candidates would be garchomp, who can use more speed before evolving to help vs different teams than the power that mega garchomp provides. finally, for other ou viable in base forms, there's tyranitar, scizor and the latis.
 
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Rowan Are you trying to suggest a twin CAP or another core? I'm confused, and I'm not sure how a twin CAP process would work (we've also made Voodoom, Volkraken, and Plasmanta for cores; that's three of them so far), considering how conservative CAP has been over the years.
 

Rowan

The professor?
is a Community Leader Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus
Rowan Are you trying to suggest a twin CAP or another core? I'm confused, and I'm not sure how a twin CAP process would work (we've also made Voodoom, Volkraken, and Plasmanta for cores; that's three of them so far), considering how conservative CAP has been over the years.
a core. made some edits, i see how i confused you
 
a core. made some edits, i see how i confused you
Yeah, I think we've learned through prior experience that CAP simply cannot handle cores. Like, at all. Voodoom was underpowered, Volkraken was nigh unusable in OU, and Plasmanta was an utter trainwreck for a number of reasons that did not always have to do with the core issues but ended up downing the project. I'm not sure we want another core project anytime soon, at least until CAP proves they are capable of making a Pokémon that fits with the current power levels.
 

EternalSnowman

DPL Champion
Yeah, I think we've learned through prior experience that CAP simply cannot handle cores. Like, at all. Voodoom was underpowered, Volkraken was nigh unusable in OU, and Plasmanta was an utter trainwreck for a number of reasons that did not always have to do with the core issues but ended up downing the project. I'm not sure we want another core project anytime soon, at least until CAP proves they are capable of making a Pokémon that fits with the current power levels.
The Pokemon themselves are usable, the cores just fail though. I agree with this since cores tend to be harder to make for CAP mons plus the concept of Double Mega teams can be quite successful, for example, if you are running a Scizor and Ttar on the same team, most people would assume you are running MScizor, but you can always reveal MTtar as a wincon or something.
 

tehy

Banned deucer.
Name: Bring two, pick one!
General Description: A Mega Pokemon that encourages the use of double-mega teams, by synergising well with another mega pokemon.
Justification: Double mega teams seem great in theory. The fact you can choose for 1 Pokemon to mega evolve based on the opposing team seems great, however they don't work with the current megas we have due to it generally not being worth it, to lose an item on something. However, double mega teams do have potential to minimise team disadvantage, and with the right pokemon could this potential could be realised.
Questions To Be Answered:
Which Pokemon is best to pick as a partner?
How do we make up for the fact that one Pokemon can't use an item if it chooses not to mega evolve?
How do we make the core synergise well, with each mega having to synergise well with each of their non-mega forms?
Is offensive or defensive synergy more important?
How do we determine which Pokemon is best to mega evolve during the match?


Explanation: Many people have tried double mega teams, but they don't usually work. This is because it's usually better to just use an item. However if we created a mega pokemon that truly synergised well with an already existing one, in a way that we haven't had before, there is definitely potential. The possibility of choosing your mega based on the opposing team, could give you a massive team advantage. The main problem is how to make up for the fact you'll be running 1 pokemon without an item. This is why synergy is really key. Each non mega form will have to synergise super well with each mega form. Defensive vs Offensive is another interesting question. Will both pokemon have offensive megas and we can decide which one is best to sweep? Will both of them wall different threats, and we decide which is the best Pokemon to mega evolve based on which is on the opposing team? Will we have 1 defensive mega and 1 offensive mega which are suited to fighting different team archetypes. maybe 1 mega can rip through bulky teams, but the other destroys faster offensive teams. Unfortunately there are not many good options for a pokemon that we can pair this CAP well with. Most likely candidates would be Slowbro or Gyarados imo. Both can be late game sweepers with cm/dd respectively yet sometimes it might be best to stay in their normal forms if the utility provided by regen/intimidate is more important. Other candidates would be garchomp, who can use more speed before evolving to help vs different teams than the power that mega garchomp provides. finally, for other ou viable in base forms, there's tyranitar, scizor and the latis.

like, like, a thousand times like

not to jump your nuts or anything but this is such an exciting concept, i am literally grinning right now

cap can't pull off cores? let's try and see man
 
Name: Start and Finish

General Description: A Pokemon that is best utilized at the beginning and end of a battle.

Justification: Many teams have Pokemon specifically intended to be used at the very start of the battle. Many of these leads Pokemon that are expendable once they set something up, suicide leads such as Azelf or Infernape. However, this 'mon would be able to also serve as a useful cleaner late in a battle. This also means that if the Pokemon doesn't get an opportunity to be useful at the beginning, it wouldn't immediately become dead weight, unlike most suicide leads.

Questions To Be Answered:
Would this Pokemon be able to be useful at the start of the match without fainting, so it can still be used later?
Can a Pokemon serve two drastically varying purposes without getting 4MSS?
Can such a 'mon be made without fulfilling one role much better than the other?
How would this 'mon affect the usage of pre-existing suicide leads and late game cleaners?
Without items that are useful for both leads and cleaners, will this 'mon be able to fully utilize its item?

Explanation: I imagine this Pokemon as a rather frail, fast 'mon, similar to many cleaners and suicide leads. It would be able to set up something (hazards, screens, trick room) at the beginning of the battle, switched out, and used again to finish of the opponent last couple Pokemon. This would also be different from Pokemon like Garchomp, which can set up rocks early on and then be used for the rest of battle, because this Pokemon wouldn't be able to switch in and out as frequently as more tanky 'mons.
I was going to suggest something similar to this now that Mega CAP has been approved, but looking back through the thread revealed that somebody had beaten me to it. I know that Ginja initially had concerns about how much we'd have to pigeon hole it in order to make it work (probably ending up with something Greninja-esque), but now that we're talking about doing a Mega I'm not so sure that's the case anymore.

If the base form is designed to fulfill the early game role while the mega fulfils the late game role, we now have a way of actually creating a difference between the capabilities of the two rather than having to create a single Pokemon with the right stats and typing to do both jobs. If the base form is mediocre offensively, but is effective in the early game for some form of hazard control or scouting (without consuming too much of its movepool), combined with an appropriate ability (e.g. Regenerator as a scout, assuming we don't give it spectacular enough defences to see substantial use as a pivot through the game), it would encourage its use in that role. The mega might then alter the typing and/or ability (e.g. one of the -ate abilities for a Pokemon that otherwise lacks a good STAB option) to shift into a much more offensive role, but have a reasonable number of common Pokemon that act as hard stops but that typically don't survive into the late game.

There are a whole range of ways to fulfill this concept now that a mega is on the cards. It lets us explore a type of mega Pokemon that has a reason to postpone Mega Evolving, while giving clear cut enough roles that protect against creating such an overpowering Mega that it's better to evolve immediately or such a good base form that it's better with a different item. It also lets us explore not only the roles that make a Pokemon good in the early and late games, but also the roles that are useful in the mid game that we have to avoid giving this CAP. I'm happy enough to rewrite the application to be more appropriate to a Mega CAP, if that's deemed desirable by the mods, but since somebody had already submitted essentially the same concept I felt it most appropriate to bump it along with my reasoning why first.
 
Name:
180° Turn of playstyle

General Description:
A pokemon that changes into an unrecognizable playstyle upon Mega Evolution or Formchange, for example a paper thin defense but skyhigh attackstats and after that vice versa, just an example to give you the idea. Another good example would be aegislash, but insteaad of constantly changing back and forth you STAY in that alternate playstyle for the rest of the match.

Justification:
This would basically allow a player to have 7 Pokémon in their team, the 7th Pokémon would be only available if the 6th one is sacrificed though. This already exists in the meta, Slowbro for example which smart players won't mega unless they are sure that regenerator is no longer needed. But wouldn't it be an interesting twist if the wall that has blocked every single one of the opponents attacks for about half of the match suddenly turned into an absolute glasscannon? Or vice versa, a glasscannon turns into a wall after the player realised that hyperoffense doesn't work on the opponents team.

Questions To Be Answered:
-What does it take to encourage a player to not use megaevolution for about half of the match?
-How does one make this mon good enough to encourage the behaviour said above but not too good so the opponent can still roughly predict what is going to happen?
-Will it blend?

Sorry for potential grammar and spelling mistakes, I'm really tired.
 
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Max Carvalho

Que os jogos comecem
Name: Abuser of Opposing Hazards (I'm terrible with names)

General Description: This will be a Pokemon that can abuse the presence of hazards in its field. By abuse, I mean get some benefit from it, not just adapt to hazards (Magic Guard and Mountaineer).

Justification:
  • Setting up Stealth Rock may be a more thougtful and throughout process than it currently is, making the user of Stealth Rock be wary before setting up (I hope you catch this, I kinda want to make setting up Stealth Rocks have some risks with the creation of this CAP).
  • How Stealth Rock and hazards in general currently affect the metagame, what are the effects of granting some risks in having hazards on the opponent's field.
  • I think abusing the presence of Stealth Rock in your own field is unique.

Questions to be Answered:
- Is setting up hazards, after all, zero risk high-reward?
- Granting risks on having Stealth Rock in the opponent's field causes a positive effect in the metagame?
- Looking at the implemented CAP, was it too nichy or too centralizating?
- How the different playstyles were affected by this CAP?
- Are hazards in the OU metagame a competitive and healthy aspect?

Explanation: I'm not proposing Stealth Rock or any hazard might be unhealthy for the metagame, there are counter-measures to it that are quite viable. We already see what I suggested above in the form of Sticky Web abusers, mainly Bisharp and Serperior. The former makes up for the Speed loss in form of a nice +2 boost to its high attack and a powerful priority move. The latter doesn't gain a Speed drop, it gains a Speed boost, making cleaning even easier if the Sticky Web's team has a Scarfer or something that would be faster than Serperior. Serperior truly abuses the presence of a hazard (Sticky Web) on its own field, with no drawbacks. Thing is, Sticky Web is a not-so-good style in the OU metagame. You can't really do the same with Stealth Rock or Spikes, unless you are going for a sack, which is not abusing the presence of hazards with a specific trait of your Pokemon. So basically, this CAP should abuse the presence of hazards in its own field for itself or its whole team; doesn't need to be all hazards that are in the game, I think being able to abuse Stealth Rock only would be fair-game in order to achieve the goal of this CAP.
 
In response to Abuser of Opposing Hazards, it's very difficult to envision any situation whatsoever where chip damage is actually beneficial(unless you run a 2 HP stat and Custap Explosion or aim for pinch berries), and the only other way of benefiting from hazards is through Magic Bounce, so it's difficult to see how this concept would be implemented.
 

EternalSnowman

DPL Champion
180° Turn of Playstyle:
This is essentially Patient Mega, along with the fact that its even more restricting. Also, MDiancie is pretty much this, but you can't fit 2 different roles into 4 moveslots, with the same EV spread (Think Mew, Ttar, can't run offensive and defensive at the same time).

Abuser of Opposing Hazards:This would either come out to be a Magic Bounce mon (which I don't see as a bad thing I don't want to funnel it into 1 ability) or it will have to be made into an ability move that CAP currently doesn't have right now, and we don't want to make new stuff that doesn't exist in the game.
 
Name: I Use My Own Weather, Thank You Very Much

General Description: A Pokemon that, in its base form, brings out weather, and in its mega form takes great advantage of that weather

Justification: With the advent of Generation VI, weather has suffered a great nerf due to its shortened effects. However, a Pokemon that sets weather in its base form and then takes advantage of it as a Mega bypasses this crucial flaw by eliminating the need to switch for the weather to be beneficial, allowing the weather to see more use by saving time. In this way, we can learn how a Pokemon and its Mega Evolution can complement each other optimally, with either one being a good Pokemon on its own, but together forming a single great force to be reckoned with.

Questions To Be Answered:
  • Can we make the base form supply additional support to its team, as well as its Mega?
  • How can we limit the power of this Mega so that a Pokemon that capitalizes on its own weather does not become an extremely centralizing force that can't be stopped easily, even by unconventional Pokemon it is supposed to encourage the use of?
  • Which combination of weather and ability is most able to stop some of OU's most popular Pokemon, encouraging the rise of lower ranked Pokemon?
  • Does a certain weather condition require that a select type needs to utilize it for full viability? (Example: Can a Pokemon that isn't Steel/Rock/Ground benefit from the sandstorm condition?)
  • How would an increase in weather viability affect the usage of common OU Pokemon while bringing up lower Pokemon? (In other words, what kind of Gastrodon Effect would this create?)
  • To what extent would this Pokemon be able to bring down top threats while increasing the power of lesser Pokemon?
Explanation: Really, this concept was inspired by the fact that I wanted to think of a way that we would fully benefit from creating both a base form and a Mega. In this way, it would bot be a waste of time to create both of them, as both would be fully usable and the Mega would benefit from the base form. Additionally, this would force the base form to be the one that provides great team support, meaning there is a legitimate reason to not immediately Mega Evolve. Therefore, this project would allow us to learn a great deal about the pros and cons of Mega Evolving, something we don't get to do very often because most Pokemon, outside of a few circumstances (like Charizard not turning into Charizard X to avoid Ground moves) benefit from immediately Mega Evolving.

I know I haven't been very specific with my concepts in the past, but this time I really wanted to point out a way we could make both the base and the Mega great Pokemon in their own right, and this way seemed to make sense. Naturally, we would need to prevent this Pokemon from being overpowered, but we still need to make it a powerful force.

I'll end with a few examples of how this could work out in case I wasn't very clear above:
Base Form: Type - Grass ; Ability - Drought
Mega Form: Type - Grass/Dragon ; Ability - Chlorophyll
Such a Pokemon could be an individual sweeper in its Mega form, possibly with access to moves like one-turn Solarbeam, but a team resource in its base form, meaning when it would Mega Evolve would be a large decision that could make or break a person's strategy. Additionally, in its Mega form it prevents being overpowered by falling easily to things like Chansey, Talonflame, and Weavile. Additionally, it could rise the viability of Pokemon with Sap Sipper.

This example is, of course, just one possible direction out of many this project could go, with a number of factors to explore (as I mentioned earlier, it is largely unexplored how Pokemon outside of a few types perform with weather, so we could learn many new things. For instance, could a Water type succeed with Drought as an ability? What about a Flying type with Sand Stream? This can even extend to other areas, like a Drought Pokemon switching to a Flash Fire Pokemon, preventing opposing Fire types from benefiting. The possibilities are many, but there is just enough structure to make this an interesting project.
 
EpicUmbreon29 said:
Name: I Use My Own Weather, Thank You Very Much

General Description: A Pokemon that, in its base form, brings out weather, and in its mega form takes great advantage of that weather

Justification: With the advent of Generation VI, weather has suffered a great nerf due to its shortened effects. However, a Pokemon that sets weather in its base form and then takes advantage of it as a Mega bypasses this crucial flaw by eliminating the need to switch for the weather to be beneficial, allowing the weather to see more use by saving time. In this way, we can learn how a Pokemon and its Mega Evolution can complement each other optimally, with either one being a good Pokemon on its own, but together forming a single great force to be reckoned with.

Questions To Be Answered:
  • Can we make the base form supply additional support to its team, as well as its Mega?
  • How can we limit the power of this Mega so that a Pokemon that capitalizes on its own weather does not become an extremely centralizing force that can't be stopped easily, even by unconventional Pokemon it is supposed to encourage the use of?
  • Which combination of weather and ability is most able to stop some of OU's most popular Pokemon, encouraging the rise of lower ranked Pokemon?
  • Does a certain weather condition require that a select type needs to utilize it for full viability? (Example: Can a Pokemon that isn't Steel/Rock/Ground benefit from the sandstorm condition?)
  • How would an increase in weather viability affect the usage of common OU Pokemon while bringing up lower Pokemon? (In other words, what kind of Gastrodon Effect would this create?)
  • To what extent would this Pokemon be able to bring down top threats while increasing the power of lesser Pokemon?
Explanation: Really, this concept was inspired by the fact that I wanted to think of a way that we would fully benefit from creating both a base form and a Mega. In this way, it would bot be a waste of time to create both of them, as both would be fully usable and the Mega would benefit from the base form. Additionally, this would force the base form to be the one that provides great team support, meaning there is a legitimate reason to not immediately Mega Evolve. Therefore, this project would allow us to learn a great deal about the pros and cons of Mega Evolving, something we don't get to do very often because most Pokemon, outside of a few circumstances (like Charizard not turning into Charizard X to avoid Ground moves) benefit from immediately Mega Evolving.
Rain Dish/Ice Body, Hydration/Leaf Guard, AAA Swampert, Sand Force, and maybe even Solar Power are all good ways this can do well. Me like
 
I Use My Own Weather, Thank You Very Much: I think it's interesting. If you mega evolve immediately after showing up, you kind of get a burst-mode version of the Mega that you can't get again without having another way to set up weather later. So you're picking an ability that lets it do as much as it can within those five turns...I'm kind of digging that make-or-break style. My first reaction is "late-game sweeper", but I would love to explore this more.
 
I received PM permission from plaindrome (the original poster of Start and Finish), so here goes my version of the concept updated for Mega Evolution.

Name: Captain Boomerang
General Description: This Pokemon is designed to specialise in the early and late game phases of a battle.
Justification: There are Pokemon in the metagame that specialise in various phases of a battle. Suicide leads have been around for a long time, setting Screens and/or hazards. Late game sweepers and cleaners wait until their counters and checks are removed or weakened, and come to the fore in the late game. Pivots and clerics are typically most effective some time in between. This concept would allow us to investigate these roles in more detail, as we attempt to create a Pokemon that has an early game role and a late game role, but has limited utility during the middle phase of the game (thus avoiding making a Pokemon that is generically good all game). In light of the Mega CAP, it also allows us to investigate the differences in roles that can be established between the base form (most likely fulfilling the early game aspect) and the Mega Evolution (most likely fulfilling the late game aspect), and the triggers within a game that make Mega Evolution desirable even when the base form has utility.

Questions To Be Answered:'
- How do the various roles on a team relate to the different stages that take place throughout a battle?
- Which attributes make a Pokemon successful in the various stages of a battle, and which of these attributes must be included/excluded for a Pokemon to be a specialist at a particular stage?
- Can two distinctly different roles be fulfilled by a single moveset without 4MSS making it preferable to specialise in one?
- It it worth risking a base form with utility in the early game rather than preserving it for its Mega being used in the late game?
- Does the value of having a late game role as a Mega Evolution outweigh the loss of an item for its base form?

Explanation:
In the simplest version of this project, I see the base form of this Pokemon most probably interacting with the hazard game, although an alternative would be scouting. The safest role is probably as a hazard setter, given that hazard control is more likely to have midgame utility, but it could be explored. If we made it a scout, we'd have to be careful not to give it the bulk and/or speed to serve as a midgame pivot. About the only early game role that we lose out on is Screen setting because of the enforced lack of Light Clay; apart from that, there are plenty of directions we could go with the project that would cause us to learn more about early game roles. In terms of the late game, sweeper or cleaner would be the low hanging fruit. It would be interesting to consider what other late game roles might be useful though - perhaps it could act as an effective response to other common end game strategies, thus weakening the opponent's win condition and facilitating its own team's win condition. I suspect that the key to encouraging late game use of the Mega would be limited coverage, but again, this isn't the only way to achieve it. Part of what I like about this concept is that, while it plays with the idea of delaying Mega Evolution that has been encouraged in many of the other concepts, it gives a much more rigid structure in which this should take place, mitigating some of the risks associated with trying to balance the two forms relative to each other. If the base form is basically useless after a certain point in the game, and the Mega most effective in the late game, there is a clear separation between the two and an incentive to use both throughout the battle.
 
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Even if I'm not very into CAP concept discussion, I just wanted to say that The Patient Mega is almost the only way of realizing a Mega CAP, for three main reasons:
  • We don't have yet a Pokemon that takes a real advantage of this characteristic of Megaevolution. There are only some examples, like Gyarados or Altaria, but none of the existing Megas focuses on this possibility offered by the Megaevolution;
  • Making a Megaevolution that is only an improved version of the CAP, would make the existence of the base form useless, because it would mean that you wouldn't use that CAP if not with a mega stone;
  • Making two different concept for the base form and the mega would mean that the base form can fulfill its role even without its mega stone, constituting a Pokemon on its own. You would have to decide to use the mega or not in base of what you need in your team.
A change of typing upon Megaevolution would be a method to realize this concept, because it would give the CAP different weaknesses. I made a list of all the typing changes that modify totally the weaknesses of the Pokemon (I only added a type to single-type, tell me if I missed any combination)(if it isn't possible, I wrote some combinations of typing+ability to change the weaknesses or nullify them between "[...]"):
  • Grass (Bug, Fire, Flying, Poison, Ice) -> None [Grass/Steel+Flash Fire (Fighting)]
  • Water (Electric, Grass) -> Water/Dragon (Dragon, Fairy), Water/Grass (Bug, Flying, Poison)
  • Fire (Rock, Ground, Water) -> None
  • Electric (Ground) -> Electric/Flying (Rock, Ice), Electric/Bug (Rock, Fire), Electric/Grass (Fire, Ice, Poison)
  • Flying (Rock, Ice, Electric) -> None [Flying/Steel+Volt Absorb/Lighting Rod/Motor Drive (Fire)]
  • Fighting (Psychic, Fairy, Flying) -> Fighting/Steel (Fire, Ground, Fighting)
  • Psychic (Bug, Dark, Ghost) -> None
  • Ghost (Dark, Ghost) -> Ghost/Dark (Fairy)
  • Poison (Psychic, Ground) -> None [Poison/Steel+Levitate (Fire), Poison/Dark+Levitate (None)]
  • Ice (Fighting, Steel, Fire, Rock) -> None
  • Bug (Flying, Fire, Rock) -> None [Bug/Steel+Flash Fire (None)]
  • Rock (Fighting, Water, Ground, Steel, Grass) -> None
  • Ground (Water, Ice, Grass) -> None [Ground/Water+Sap Sipper (None)]
  • Steel (Fighting, Fire, Ground) -> None
  • Dark (Fighting, Fairy, Bug) -> Dark/Poison (Ground)
  • Normal (Fighting) -> Normal/Ghost (Dark), Normal/Psychic (Bug, Dark), Normal/Flying (Rock, Ice, Electric), Normal/Poison (Ground, Psychic), Normal/Bug (Flying, Rock, Fire)
  • Dragon (Fairy, Ice, Dragon)-> Dragon/Steel (Fighting, Ground)
  • Fairy (Steel, Poison) -> Fairy/Steel (Ground, Fire)

Electric and Normal are obviously the types that offer more possibility, because they have only one weakness.
EDIT: I bolded the rarest or not exisisting in OU type combinations.
EDIT 2: I discovered also (it may not be a new information for you) that adding 32 base points to a stat is almost equivalent to giving it 252 EVs (+1 point). This means that, for example, if we give to Mew 252 EVs in HP and 252 EVs in SpD and we make it evolve in a mega that has a stat spread like this: 68/132/100/100/68/132 (I know that decreasing HP upon Megaevolution is impossible, but it's only an example), this mega's stat spread would be almost the same as a 252 Atk / 252 Spe Mew. This means that 32 base points are sufficient to turn a supporter into a sweeper :D
 
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Even if I'm not very into CAP concept discussion, I just wanted to say that The Patient Mega is almost the only way of realizing a Mega CAP, for three main reasons:
  • We don't have yet a Pokemon that takes a real advantage of this characteristic of Megaevolution. There are only some examples, like Gyarados or Altaria, but none of the existing Megas focuses on this possibility offered by the Megaevolution;
  • Making a Megaevolution that is only an improved version of the CAP, would make the existence of the base form useless, because it would mean that you wouldn't use that CAP if not with a mega stone;
  • Making two different concept for the base form and the mega would mean that the base form can fulfill its role even without its mega stone, constituting a Pokemon on its own. You would have to decide to use the mega or not in base of what you need in your team.
A change of typing upon Megaevolution would be a method to realize this concept, because it would give the CAP different weaknesses. I made a list of all the typing changes that modify totally the weaknesses of the Pokemon (I only added a type to single-type, tell me if I missed any combination)(if it isn't possible, I wrote some combinations of typing+ability to change the weaknesses or nullify them between "[...]"):
  • Grass (Bug, Fire, Flying, Poison, Ice) -> None [Grass/Steel+Flash Fire (Fighting)]
  • Water (Electric, Grass) -> Water/Dragon (Dragon, Fairy)
  • Fire (Rock, Ground, Water) -> None
  • Electric (Ground) -> Electric/Flying (Rock, Ice), Electric/Bug (Rock, Fire), Electric/Grass (Fire, Ice, Poison)
  • Flying (Rock, Ice, Electric) -> None [Flying/Steel+Volt Absorb/Lighting Rod/Motor Drive (Fire)]
  • Fighting (Psychic, Fairy, Flying) -> Fighting/Steel (Fire, Ground)
  • Psychic (Bug, Dark, Ghost) -> None
  • Ghost (Dark, Ghost) -> Ghost/Dark (Fairy)
  • Poison (Psychic, Ground) -> None [Poison/Steel+Levitate (Fire), Poison/Dark+Levitate (None)]
  • Ice (Fighting, Steel, Fire, Rock) -> None
  • Bug (Flying, Fire, Rock) -> None [Bug/Steel+Flash Fire (None)]
  • Rock (Fighting, Water, Ground, Steel, Grass) -> None
  • Ground (Water, Ice, Grass) -> None [Ground/Water+Sap Sipper (None)]
  • Steel (Fighting, Fire, Ground) -> None
  • Dark (Fighting, Fairy, Bug) -> Dark/Poison (Ground)
  • Normal (Fighting) -> Normal/Ghost (Dark), Normal/Psychic (Bug, Dark), Normal/Flying (Rock, Ice, Electric), Normal/Poison (Ground, Psychic), Normal/Bug (Flying, Rock, Fire)
  • Dragon (Fairy, Ice, Dragon)-> Dragon/Steel (Fighting, Ground)
  • Fairy (Steel, Poison) -> Fairy/Steel (Ground, Fire)

Electric and Normal are obviously the types that offer more possibility, because they have only one weakness.
EDIT: I bolded the rarest or not exisisting in OU type combinations.
EDIT 2: I discovered also (it may not be a new information for you) that adding 32 base points to a stat is almost equivalent to giving it 252 EVs (+1 point). This means that, for example, if we give to Mew 252 EVs in HP and 252 EVs in SpD and we make it evolve in a mega that has a stat spread like this: 68/132/100/100/68/132 (I know that decreasing HP upon Megaevolution is impossible, but it's only an example), this mega's stat spread would be almost the same as a 252 Atk / 252 Spe Mew. This means that 32 base points are sufficient to turn a supporter into a sweeper :D
I think you missed that Fighting/Steel is weak to fighting-types.
 
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