Metagame Camomons

Euphonos

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How many of you have any idea what Camomons is all about? How many of you are simply lurking in this thread for a new post to happen?

Thank you, and good day, everyone. This is your former Camomons meteorologist, Euphonos, and welcome to my team dump from the Other Metagames Premier League and my insight essay post-tour. I would like to thank first Ransei and Racool for welcoming me into the Five-Star Jolteons family, and to the fellow teammates Quantum Tesseract, beauts, PA, motherlove, The Immortal, Pigeons, S1nn0hC0nfirm3d, Greybaum, damflame 3, Smove_$wag, and SparksBlade for bearing with my teambuilding madness I've done in the room, and I had lots of fun interacting with you. Also, I would like to thank newly-appointed metagame leaders a loser and Chazm, and council member The Number Man, for indulging me into this two-part post, and I would like to thank those who are about to read this lengthy post. Since I haven’t been contributing this much after my preparations from that tournament, it’s time for me to pay forward.

So, first, you may have noticed that I’m not part of the council anymore. Unfortunate as it is, I would like to share the story that apparent irreconcilable differences between me and the former Camomons leader ultimately got me booted out of the council before he himself stepped down. To be blunt about it: I still am not at peace with that decision because it’s just part of the problem OM leaders -- including that person whom I refer to -- don’t realize.

And this became fuel for working on something that I myself envisioned in this community and the metagame. As such, I am going to share what I have learned throughout this season because I am here to help curious Pokemon Showdown players go from not having an idea what Camomons is all about to becoming proficient in this metagame, and I am currently building a side Discord server that focuses on Camomons-focused projects and tournaments. With that, here are my nine teams that I have built all throughout this ninth OMPL season. Feel free to click the strips for the team paste.




Result vs. Sylveon. [ZERA]: LOSS
Team Status: CURRENT

Being the very first week in the league, I had lots of ideas worth using in my head against Sylveon., such as Tornadus-Therian, Kommo-o, and Volcarona. I was all over the place whenever I was experimenting with lots of stuff in the Camomons metagame, given geerat’s lack of activity since the last OMPL season, until my teammates Greybaum, Poison Adhesive, and Quantum Tesseract helped me narrow down my choices into using Volcarona and Garchomp. Speaking of those two Pokemon, as I got off fresh from the inaugural Camomons Draft League I hosted, it is definitely a fortunate sight to see both Poison Adhesive and Quantum Tesseract, two of my co-division rivals, as my teammates in this season’s OMPL. As such, the ideas I got for this team came mostly from Quantum Tesseract’s Draft League composition featuring those two Pokemon.

My Garchomp spread is meant to deal as much damage as possible with its Adamant nature while still outpacing neutral Base 100’s without a Scale Shot boost and +Spe Pheromosa after such. With that in mind, I have to find ideas on how to deal with Hydreigon, and this is where three Pokemon came into mind: Choice Scarf Landorus-Therian as a revenge attacker, Assault Vest Slowking as a tank from boosted Draco Meteors, and Articuno as a sponge against Hydreigon’s usual Water shenanigans. Finally, Steel/Ghost Kommo-o served as a general Special wall capable of setting up Stealth Rock and blocking key attacks coupled with Bulletproof.

I eventually noticed how geerat’s Ice/Fighting Pheromosa with Shock Wave and Drill Run managed to run over my defenses, and given Shock Wave being a rather weak attack and managed to lure unsuspecting Water/Flying shenanigans is good preparation on geerat’s part, so mad props to him. Over the course of this battle, one of the key turns included geerat’s Calm Mind Necrozma putting up a war against my Grass/Psychic Volcarona. As my Volcarona eventually lost the Calm Mind war, this is one of the instances wherein some key moves would’ve been game-changing against him, like placing Flamethrower/Fiery Dance on Volcarona’s last slot over Substitute, or Haze over U-turn on my Articuno to avoid such Calm Mind wars from happening. This is the same instance where one move would’ve sealed the deal against him but I didn’t manage to trust my guts and take advantage of those moves (
such as putting Memento over Endure on Polteageist during my last season in OMPL against him).

Fun fact: Based on the Week 1 usage stats, there were seven people who used Tornadus-Therian over the course of that week. I’m very sure that, by now, you know who that one person was who shied away from using that Pokemon. Hihi!




Result vs. Terracotta [BOOM]: WIN
Team Status: RETIRED (Latias banned)
My loss from the first week made me want to use Victini given its wall-breaking capability with Choice Band-boosted V-creates. However, before ending up with Victini, I ended up taking advantage of a Pokemon with a Poison/Fighting combination that I am longing to use. Usually, my Poison/Fighting type combination takes advantage of Body Press, but I’m going to break that stereotype by virtue of Toxic + Aura Sphere Latias.

This is one of those teams which uses my formula featuring a Pokemon with a Poison/Fighting combination. I usually pair it with a Dark/Dragon one; this time keeping Garchomp from last week - this time with Crunch as STAB, and with Poison Jab to lure in Fairy-types. While I was gunning for a Steel/Flying per my formula, I just simply found Steel/Psychic Reuniclus one of the nice additions to the team for added offensive pressure and some specially defensive footing. Also, I find this offensive Salamence quite an interesting fit to the team as it is capable of running both high-octane Hydro Pump and Hurricane and is capable of removing hazards handily. With that, I finally get Victini to fit into the team, but this time using Heavy-Duty Boots and Toxic to deal with defensive Pokemon nicely, and then I finally decide on Clefable’s typing to be a deceptively Physically defensive Grass/Fairy with Grass Knot.

My match with Terracotta happened to be the most intense I’ve gotten into, especially with my match-up being even, and with The Number Man recognizing my building capabilities and trying to break through my usual build. There are three things that happened over the course of the match: one is I did not get to use Latias because it got caught in the crossfires of opposing Reuniclus’s Future Sight. The other one is the one misplay I felt I made, which is letting my Garchomp use Crunch against Rocky Helmet Salamence when I realize Scale Shot is not a contact move. Finally, the one key turn that I believed pulled off a win is I let my Salamence use Roost that recovered to full health, which eventually forced Terracotta’s Spectrier to play Nasty Plot on the last turn.




Result vs. Meta [WIGG] - WIN
Team Status: CURRENT
MetaRiolu7 is one of the main Camomons players who has fallen under the radar after his stint in the last iteration of World Cup of Other Metagames, so running some of my specialty sets would deem threatening against him. As such, I’m going to run one of my double-edged specials: Poison/Flying (Toxic + Hurricane) Volcarona.

The idea of the team is to eliminate as many obstacles as possible, such as Dark/Poison Clefable, to pave the way for a Volcarona sweep; as such, I ended up using both Grass/Dark Rillaboom (with Swords Dance) and Fire/Fighting Cinderace (as an all-out attacker). While a Clefable of my own can sound cool in this team with its common Electric/Fairy variant, I was looking for a more offensive, momentum-bearing Pokemon with that same type combination, and there I managed to nab Xurkitree, one of the underrated gems in this metagame. With Grassy Terrain active courtesy of Rillaboom’s Grassy Surge, I get to use Specially Defensive Steel/Ground Heatran so that it gains more HP alongside Leftovers, boosting its longevity even more. Finally, I was torn on a defensive Water-type that can compress roles as a Defogger and momentum bringer easily, until I got to a rather unconventional Tornadus-Therian with Rain Dance and U-turn as its first two moves to acquire the Water/Bug typing.

This match didn’t get the signature Poison/Flying Volcarona to shine because Fire/Electric Victini and most especially Steel/Ghost Kommo-o were extremely annoying to deal with. However, Xurkitree became the team’s unsung hero and managed to rack six kills against MetaRiolu7’s team - something no one might realize until I reveal it here. It's not that explicit, though, because Xurkitree switched in on different occasions before it nabbed kills, like an Energy Ball on a Zygarde-10% switch, then a not-very-effective Thunderbolt chipping and eventually KO'ing Victini, and finally a Dazzling Gleam KO'ing Salamence, Kommo-o, Tornadus-Therian, and Mew.




Result vs. Mossy Sandwich [SPIN] - LOSS
Team Status: RETIRED (Pheromosa banned)

After lots of contemplation, I ended up bringing one of the secret weapons against the likes of Water/Poison Latias and Electric/Fairy Clefable running rampant in the Camomons metagame before the wave of bans happened, and it is no other than the Grass/Steel (Power Whip + Iron Head) Gyarados. However, this one took me the most time testing and modifying especially with how promising this Pokemon can be.

I ended up pairing this Gyarados with the OG Dragapult with a Fire Blast to lure in Steel-types as they deem annoying for Gyarados to deal with. I formulated lots of defensive cores to pair well alongside this offensive core, and Heatran has consistently been part of the defensive backbone - this time, with a Specially defensive Fire/Ground type combination, and completing the core ends up being a Water/Fairy Mew, and here comes another formulaic approach to this team by putting up the standard Ice/Fighting Pheromosa with Rapid Spin - which makes Mew a Spikes setter as well - and eventually deciding to run another special of mine: SubPlot Dark/Poison (Dark Pulse + Sludge Wave) Naganadel.

In the match against Mossy Sandwich, some spectators say that Mossy Sandwich attempted to throw that match by staying Mew in on a Dragapult who can potentially have Fire Blast (which it eventually revealed and missed); among all other RNG elements he threw at me, this is where me getting annoyed at those elements got the best of me, and ended up misplaying my Pheromosa by not using Close Combat against Blissey (not to mention his Landorus fainted so I didn’t realize it) and eventually paralyzed my Pheromosa which actually lost the game for me. Despite this being one of toughest losses I ever had - especially luck not on my side, I felt satisfied with the output of Grass/Steel Gyarados because it can fill a niche no other set-up attacker can do.




Result vs. anaconja [TRUM]: WIN
Team Status: RETIRED (Hydreigon + Pheromosa banned)
Based on my ladder battles I had before OMPL, I know anaconja being one of those Camomons players who can build in par with me, putting up unusual themes in his teams, and this is where I get to put my creativity up a notch by pulling off one of my tricks up my sleeve: Zoroark. Among all possible Pokemon up for disguise, I actually got fond of a more unconventional version of Pheromosa, which is a Dragon/Fighting variant (I last used it in World Cup of Other Metagames IV - shoutout to Frrf for being the first witness) all thanks to Outrage being part of its learnset, and there I have a nasty idea.

With Dragon/Fighting Pheromosa being bait for Fairy-type Pokemon like Clefable, this is where Zoroark comes in as one of the most unconventional lures, all thanks to Sludge Bomb in its arsenal. Zoroark was initially Dark/Poison, but with Ghost-types being quite problematic to Pheromosa as well (especially the likes of Ghost/Fighting Slowbro), I ended up using Shadow Ball, making it Ghost/Poison, and running Focus Blast as Zoroark’s coverage to leave an impression that Pheromosa has Focus Blast making it a mixed attacker. Of course, for Zoroark, I have to run Expert Belt because I don’t want to make stuff obvious. As for its teammates, I elected for a defensive core with a Physically defensive Steel/Flying Volcanion and Specially defensive Water/Fairy Mew (both of them being quite unconventional in my book because they’re meant to be Specially and Physically defensive respectively). It is also coupled with Grass/Dark Rillaboom as a strong priority attacker by virtue of Grassy Terrain-boosted Grassy Glide, and I eventually end up using Hydreigon as a back-up illusory disguise for Zoroark, as a back-up Band Victini resist (hence its unusual EVs), and as a bulky Nasty Plot attacker before that Pokemon gets banned.

I feel like your minds got blown by the madness I’ve made with Zoroark + Pheromosa. It is definitely hands down one of my proudest - if not my proudest - moments in my entire OMPL journey, and Think would deem that Turn 2 being the best turn in OMPL history.

Sigh, I didn’t even get Latias and Hydreigon to work this OMPL before they get the ban hammer...




Result vs. Siamato [ALCR]: LOSS
Team Status: CURRENT
Siamato is definitely one of those players who acknowledge me as one of the most original builders in the metagame. While it is really ironic this is the one time that I haven't given any much thought regarding the story about this team, I believe there's one thing I wanted to showcase against Siamato, and it is no other than the defensive Dragon/Ghost Garchomp to take advantage of Rocky Helmet and Rough Skin. From there, I mapped out some ideas coming from past excerpts. I honestly cannot remember how I managed to build this team apart from starting with Dragon/Ghost Garchomp, but the idea around the team is another formulaic and balanced approach such as putting Pokemon with a priority move, a mandatory defogger and Stealth Rock user, and fast attackers.

I ended up with Zapdos and Azumarill, both with their original Electric/Flying and Water/Fairy type combinations respectively, as the most unique Pokemon ever showcased; it is all because they're capable of taking attacks from numerous threats. I also put in Bug/Fighting Cinderace with Protective Pads because the propensity of bringing a Pokemon with Rocky Helmet made me a bit paranoid especially with the lack of recovery. Heatran is included as one of the most reliable Specially Defensive Pokemon that can set up Stealth Rock with ease. Finally, a Fire/Dark Nasty Plot Naganadel is placed as a rather conventional late-game attacker.

At the end of my match against Siamato, I retrospectively thought I should've brought the Garchomp at Turn 1 after Cinderace U-turned because regardless of whatever move he would do next (apart from the conventional Taunt, or probable switching out), I would've wasted Siamato's efforts, and I could've saved that Azumarill in the first place. Then, late in that game, I thought Siamato would bring Close Combat on his Dark/Steel Lycanroc-Dusk, which could be tad scary on my Heatran; as such, I had to play a little bit more carefully (and it revealed that it had Crunch and Sucker Punch, meaning it lacked Close Combat). I would've survived a Crunch with some more turns of Leftovers recovery; sadly, I didn't play that endgame quite well especially with the potential Close Combat he brought, so huge props on Siamato for playing that well.




Result vs. Bushtush [ROZE] - WIN
Team Status: CURRENT
Initially, I was planning on bringing up some of the craziest strategies I pulled off in the past such as Magic Room shenanigans, Psychic Terrain + Polteageist, Final Gambit spam, or a meteorologist route (weather). This is all because I was against Bushtush, who, having literally zero idea what Camomons is, got baptized by fire (and actually managed to beat geerat among all other players in the Camomons pool), and whose team being unfortunately out of playoff contention. However, with our team’s playoff chances still at stake, Quantum Tesseract and Poison Adhesive warned me not to throw caution in the wind and keep our chances of winning high. As such, I’m going towards a more formulaic route but still bringing some hidden gems.

Given my looming paranoia to Rillaboom for some reason (especially because it’s one of the rising trends these days), I ended up formulating a Pokemon that would resist all of Rillaboom’s possible attacks. I got torn between Poison/Fairy Cresselia and Fighting/Flying Corviknight, and through inspiration from my friend superstrike66 who used Corviknight in his Camomons Draft League journey (and Cresselia’s rather pitiful damage output even after with Calm Mind boosts on), I ultimately chose the latter. With Corviknight serving as one of the physically defensive Pokemon, I ended up choosing Heatran as its teammate because they cover each other’s weaknesses fairly well. That consequently brought me to pair with Rillaboom based on the experience I had in Week 3, and it granted a much needed priority against Pheromosa and other faster Pokemon. Nasty Plot Naganadel returns one more time (which was initially a Modest Scarf set), but with the OG Dragon/Poison one to avoid Rillaboom from knocking it (especially when weakened) with Grassy Glide. Finally, I ended up choosing Victini as a back-up answer against Pheromosa with Choice Scarf, and then Starmie fills in the gap for an offensive Special Water/Fairy Pokemon thanks to Analytic.

Apparently, Bushtush, having no idea about the Camomons metagame, ended up using the same team he brought against geerat from the previous week, which is a Sun team featuring some typical abusers like Venusaur and Entei. Actually, my plan in this affair is to open the game strong with Analytic Starmie as it is capable of forcing switches, and as Turn 1 happened, I landed a critical hit and knocked Slowbro down (which I didn’t expect to do so if no critical hit happened). Two key misplays happened on Bushtush’s end by not letting his Venusaur use Earth Power on my Steel/Ground Heatran and by not letting his Entei use Sacred Fire against my Fighting/Flying Corviknight which had a good chance of burning, and with that I sealed the win for the Jolteons in a rather convincing fashion. I don’t blame Bushtush for not having any clues whatsoever about Camomons, but mad props to him for showing up and fighting valiantly.




Result vs. Sylveon. [ZERA]: WIN
Team Status: RETIRED (Pheromosa banned)
It's a mixed feeling that I get to face geerat once again in the Semifinals of this tournament, because, for one, I have yet to defeat one of the smartest players in the Camomons pool. However, given my high knowledge and wide arsenal of Pokemon by my side, I know that I have the capability to defeat geerat. I just needed some form of inspiration, thus getting to invite The Number Man into our server. He graciously imparted to me his powerful Melmetal set that he used to bring headaches against numerous players, which I myself can also attest. When he sent his team blueprint featuring Melmetal, the team that I crafted during the Spectrier suspect test struck me a chord because it's that one team that I didn't get any success, and with his Melmetal over Rhyperior that has been my stronghold for quite some time (sorry, DraconicLepus), I get to tweak that team once again.

One of Melmetal's greatest assets is its monstrous HP and Defense stat, that when invested, it is capable of standing its Substitute strong even against a super-effective Flip Turn from a defensive Water Mew. Another feature of the team is Poison/Flying Tornadus-Therian set, which is reminiscent of the Poison/Flying Volcarona I had, but with a more accessible Sludge Bomb, and there I greatly improved the team's effectiveness by bringing up Pheromosa once again as an offensive form of hazard control, and bringing Water/Ghost Mew over my former signature Slowbro set (which is about to be revealed in the next one) to bring additional pressure by virtue of Spikes. For the final time, I brought a more high-octane Nasty Plot Naganadel by virtue of its Fire + Dragon STAB moves dealing at least neutral damage to different Pokemon that only Steel/Ground Heatran, among all other possible Pokemon, can take its onslaught well, whilst most Water-types can potentially get caught by a Thunderbolt.

I got somehow terrified when geerat brought Scarf Dark/Poison Tornadus-Therian which heavily damaged my Pheromosa (good thing it didn't KO), and with that crucial information, I get to take advantage of Melmetal and foiling Water/Flying Mew's plans with Thunder Punch. From there, I've finally gotten the upper hand, and despite his Porygon-Z scoring a critical hit against Blissey, I managed to recover. I actually made a rather risky play when in retrospect there is a better way in circling around his team instead of sacking Naganadel through his Rillaboom, which in turn, could potentially lose the match especially with Tornadus-Therian's Hurricane having a propensity to miss. Fortunately enough, my Tornadus-Therian gets to connect that Hurricane on the last turn, and that finally secured my win against geerat and secured a pass to the Finals.




Result vs. Mossy Sandwich [SPIN]: LOSS
Team Status: CURRENT

It's the Finals, and The Number Man imparted me with another idea worth using. However, when I tried it through test matches, I was so skeptical this time because of the not-so-impressive damage output and longevity issues. With that eventually sparked my mind: Assault Vest Jirachi, the one set I used from last season of OMPL. This time, I brought some ingenious strategies that could hopefully make this Jirachi and its eventual benefactor successful, and it's by virtue of my defensive core of Wish Blissey and Eject Button (+ Recycle) Slowbro. I ended up with Water/Flying Salamence and Dark/Dragon Garchomp, both of them coming from my Week 2 team against Terracotta that looked great with this build, and finally putting up Darmanitan for some sheer firepower.

In this Finals match against Mossy Sandwich, spectators say that I actually had one of the roughest match-ups, which is partly true especially with my build being more tryhard than I thought it would be. My plan of action there was to play aggressively with Garchomp; apparently, he played with his Pokemon quite well that I had difficulty breaking through his team. The critical hit against the Slowbro early in the game made it quite difficult for me to recover, not to mention the misses I've gotten from Salamence's Hydro Pumps and Hurricanes, which is all the more upsetting on my end; however, huge props to Mossy Sandwich for prepping well, especially with Colbur Reuniclus and Dragon/Flying Salamence with Earthquake (the latter which I actually anticipated) that further made it difficult for me to play around.



That concludes my team sharing for this post, and with that, I would like to ask the following people to share your teams / experiences in this metagame during this season of OMPL:

Spinda Wheels: Mossy Sandwich, Sabella, Zesty43
Zoomer Zeraoras: Sylveon., a loser, Karl Dude Guy
Temper Tyrantrums: anaconja, Chazm
Based Boomers: Havens, Betathunder, Terracotta, The Number Man
Wiggly Family: Meta
Fullmetal Alcremists: Siamato
Rozelias: Bushtush, shiloh, Alkione, K3ppr

Now that I have showcased all of the teams I have brought to the league, stay tuned for my next post regarding the insights I have observed during that tournament. Off I go - for now.
 
Last edited:

Ransei

Garde Mystik
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Due to chronic (extreme) inactivity, Camomons is no longer a permanent ladder. Everything else remains unchanged. Camomons will be treated similarly to how it was last year.


Also, amazing post Euphonos!
 

Euphonos

inanod ng mga luha; damdamin ay lumaya.
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As promised, here is Part II of my post-OMPL essay, this time focusing on the insights I have observed from OMPL.


I felt that the loss of Latias gives me a whole lot of breathing room in building such Camomons teams lately, while I feel quite indifferent when it comes to Latios, Slowking-Galar, and Hydreigon because I feel like there are some counterplay against those two; however, I understand the plight of some Camomons players regarding how those Pokemon, once switched in, can be capable of running over un(der)prepared teams. With that, allow me to share some of my observations I have found during this season in OMPL.

:ss/pheromosa:
UNDER OBSERVATION: Pheromosa
This is definitely one of the reasons why I felt indifferent towards Hydreigon and Latios, and Pheromosa is one of those reasons that, if I were still a Council member back then, I would hold back bringing the hammer. Pheromosa has gotten a whole lot better with Latias gone; not to mention Ice/Fighting (Ice Beam / Triple Axel) and even Dragon/Fighting (Outrage) variants can run over underprepared teams with the proper execution of lures; not to mention Pheromosa itself can lure some typical walls through the likes of Drill Run, Poison Jab, and even Shock Wave. As such, this Pokemon definitely is worth watching out for and should be under observation for a possible ban.

:ss/naganadel:
UNDER OBSERVATION: Naganadel
If you’ve seen me battle in OMPL, you noticed how I brought Naganadel four times - most notably bringing it in three consecutive weeks (Week 6, Week 7, Semifinals), and each of the Nasty Plot Naganadel sets I brought have different type combinations. That’s how intimidating Naganadel is, and those Nasty Plot Naganadel sets usually have lures in order to break through its usual obstacles, such as Thunderbolt / Sludge Wave for Mew, and Fire Blast for Steels (except Heatran). Those subtle yet game-changing nuances are worth looking at in the future.

:ss/tornadus-therian:
UNDER OBSERVATION: Tornadus-Therian
Chazm has finally touched on this matter; maybe it is because I brought this up to the Council as to how Tornadus-Therian is quite a difficult Pokemon to deal against. This Pokemon's stats and movepool made it more than capable of doing utility roles such as Knocking Off opponent's items and going out of sticky situations by virtue of U-turn and just regenerate all damage. It is also capable of setting up Nasty Plot and exert lots of pressure against bulky builds. On my end, I felt like there is no way in exerting pressure against a Tornadus-Therian at face value than just scaring it away with a Pheromosa (or Banded Tapu Koko to some extent); as such, if there are any plans of the new Council banning Pheromosa, this also deserves a ban hammer - unless anyone can have an outright way of dealing with Tornadus-Therian one-on-one.

:ss/rillaboom:
RISING TREND: Rillaboom
This is one of the reasons why I'm a little indifferent when it comes to dealing with Slowking-Galar, especially unlike Latias who has Levitate to gain an immunity from Rillaboom's High Horsepower. Of course, Rillaboom can't switch in on Slowking-Galar's potent Scald burns and Sludge Bomb, but once switched in from a slow momentum move through Teleport, Rillaboom is capable of scaring such Pokemon away. Rillaboom remained as a top-tier threat in the Camomons metagame since the introduction of Isle of Armor, and it has greatly benefited from the losses of those aforementioned Pokemon. Tornadus-Therian is one top-tier Pokemon among all other choices that holds Rillaboom back, but it doesn’t remove the fact that it is capable of dealing massive damage with its STAB Grassy Glide. With a mix of possible STAB options like Knock Off, Superpower, and High Horsepower, people would have a hard time scouting for its moves unless it has a Fighting/Flying or Fairy/Flying Pokemon.

:ss/heatran:
RISING TREND: Heatran
Heatran has become a rising trend since the start of OMPL, as it also benefited from Rillaboom’s Grassy Surge which allows it to heal more HP, and makes it one of the prime counters against Victini (especially in its Steel/Ground variant) which some people like myself get to use. It is one of the Pokemon that primarily holds Naganadel back from becoming one of the broken threats; as such, a lure may be needed in order to break Heatran down before Naganadel gets to break down teams.

:ss/mew: :ss/azumarill: :ss/starmie:
RISING TREND: Water/Fairy
I’ve never had enough of this type combination, as it definitely is one of the most sought-after defensive type combinations people like myself have used all throughout OMPL. On my end, while Mew is touted as one of the most sought-after Pokemon using that Water/Fairy combination, I have managed to pull things such as Belly Drum Azumarill in Week 6 and Choice Specs Starmie in Week 7. With that type combination, Mew gives Pheromosa users quite a hard time running over unless it has Poison Jab; Azumarill and Starmie could check them offensively.

:ss/zoroark:
HIDDEN GEM: Zoroark
With lots of prominent threats looming in this metagame, there’s one Pokemon that I felt is underrated and a Pokemon worth exploring, and it is no other than Zoroark. While it may be quite difficult to use in practice, it needs some intelligent planning on how you deal with the target attacking Pokemon’s threats (i.e. refer to the Ghost/Poison Zoroark alongside Dragon/Fighting Pheromosa in Week 5 vs. anaconja). Plus, Zoroark can be paired alongside numerous top threats such as Naganadel and Tornadus-Therian to take advantage of their overlapping movepool apart from Nasty Plot, or can be paired alongside Lucario or Scizor for Swords Dance ones.

For those who want to take advantage of Zoroark’s Illusion to their greatest potential, it is recommended that the partner Pokemon you’re using its Illusion with must NOT have an ability that can be revealed once switched in, such as Mold Breaker, Intimidate, or Grassy Surge, because opponents find it as a giveaway when, for example, you switch in a Zoroark disguised as a Rillaboom and Grassy Surge doesn’t activate.


:ss/xurkitree:
HIDDEN GEM: Xurkitree
Two things I'm going to be blunt with: first, I've been fed up with all those Electric/Fairy Clefable running rampant in this metagame lately, and second, I was looking for a Pokemon with the same type combination as Clefable but can pull off more firepower, until I stumbled on a Xurkitree. Apparently, with Pokemon who can slap a Ground-typing on them, it's quite difficult for Electric-types to function with a Choice item, as what Sylveon. said to me.

While Xurkitree has colossally downgraded with the removal of Tail Glow and Z-moves this generation, I feel that Xurkitree's monstrously high Special Attack is still enough to massively chip opposing Pokemon willing to take Electric and other secondary attacks. Its middling Speed fails to outrun Pheromosa with its positive Speed nature even with a Choice Scarf equipped and a Timid nature of its own, but that means it can outrun the likes of Timid Dragapult that way, and letting the damage output do the work (and sometimes allowing it to sweep).


:ss/melmetal:
HIDDEN GEM: Melmetal
Historically speaking, Melmetal is one of the most interesting specimens worth looking at. While Melmetal's colossal HP, Defense, and Attack coupled with Iron Fist made it quite devastating for opposing teams in theory, its middling speed prevents it from doing whatever it gets to do. While I have formulated a Poison/Fighting Melmetal set back in the day, The Number Man imparted a Substitute Steel/Ground Melmetal that takes advantage of its attributes very well (although it's unfortunate that Melmetal hasn't racked any wins coming from Zesty and TNM's teammate Terracotta in Weeks 1 and 7 respectively). This is why I consider it more of a hidden gem than a rising trend because I feel like more research should've been made in order for Melmetal to reach its high potential.


Also, since the Viability Rankings hasn't been updated since the loss of the aforementioned four Pokemon, here is my proposal for the council members a loser, Chazm, and The Number Man to peruse:

S
Mew
Pheromosa (from A)
Tornadus-Therian

A+
Clefable
Garchomp (from A)
Naganadel (from A-)

Rillaboom (from A)

A

Arcanine
Heatran (from A-)
Melmetal (from B+)
Reuniclus (from A-)

Spectrier

A-
Blissey
Dragapult (from B+)
Heracross
Landorus-Therian
Dusk Form
Lycanroc-Dusk
Toxapex
Victini

B+
Alakazam
Cinderace (from B)
Cresselia
Entei
Magearna
Necrozma (from B)
Salamence
Scizor
Slowbro
Slowking
Volcanion (from B)
Volcarona

B
Buzzwole
Celebi
Drednaw
Hippowdon
Jirachi
Kommo-o
Lucario
Pelipper
Porygon-Z
Regieleki
Rhyperior
Tapu Lele
Tyranitar
Urshifu-Single-Strike


B-
Barraskewda
Blaziken
Conkeldurr
Excadrill
Gyarados (new entry) [Grass/Steel; Grass/Water; Ground/Steel; Flying/Steel]
Haxorus
Tangrowth
Zarude (from B)
Zygarde-10%

C Rank
C+

Azelf (from C)
Coalossal (from B)
Cloyster
Ferrothorn
Glastrier
Hawlucha
Kingdra (from B-)
Magnezone
Metagross
Noivern
Tapu Koko
Vaporeon

C
Araquanid (from C+)
Avalugg
Chansey (from C+)
Chandelure
Crawdaunt
Comfey (new entry) [Grass/Fairy]
Dhelmise
Diggersby
Gengar
Hatterene
Torkoal
Toxtricity
Venusaur
Xurkitree (new entry) [Electric/Fairy; Electric/Grass]
Zoroark (new entry)
[Ghost/Poison; Dark/Poison; Ghost/Fire; Ghost/Fighting; Ghost/Dark, etc]

C-
Aegislash
Aerodactyl
Ditto
Espeon
Grimmsnarl
Jellicent (from C)
Keldeo (from C)

Moltres
Pikachu
Urshifu-Rapid-Strike (from C)
Zapdos


It's heartbreaking for me to receive news that Camomons got downgraded once again into a challenge-only metagame, which I understand thanks to the extreme inactivity over the past few months, especially with most players preparing for this prestigious tournament. I would've wished that this metagame, as solid as it is, would've been expanded to the rest of the Showdown playerbase, and this is what I'm currently working on. Do you remember that I am currently building a side Discord server for mostly its projects and tournaments? I was itching on doing Camomons-focused tournaments to be sanctioned here, but was rejected because the OM leadership wanted tours the way they wanted it to be run. So, if you're interested in helping me out, leave me a message on Discord (Euphonos#9726), and I'll leave you a link. There I will leave all of my OMPL teams on the team vault section of that server.

Again, leave me a message on Discord (Euphonos#9726) to signify your interest in this endeavor! Looking forward to seeing you!
 
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While I played exclusively AAA in this past OMPL, I also had a hand in building Camo for my team some of the weeks.

The teams:

PRE BANS
https://pokepast.es/9ab0f1f37b728f1e
1628681379058.png


This team was built around the idea of using Lati + Horse as dual special cheese mons to bank on finding a matchup where at least one of them had the capacity to easily win. Supported by av reuni and conk as answers to opposing bulky setup cheese while breaking well with FS + fighting move.

https://pokepast.es/bcf45ada8cd3a4ff
1628681309084.png


I think Beta ended up using Victini over Volc as his fire type, but the idea here was again trying to fish with dual special wincons that cover each other's weaknesses while trying to not lose to opposing fishes. Victini fits just as well here cause it checks things that check Hydreigon, while forming a good breaking core with Pheromosa.

https://pokepast.es/c4a7926790253d19
1628681332076.png


The idea here was supporting Naga as best as possible while again trying to cover most possible bulky setup cheeses, but unfortunately we ran into a physical spam HO which was a pretty abysmal matchup.

POST BANS
None of these teams were actually used, but some sets informed our building for weeks 6 and 7. With the bans of Lati@s, Hydreigon and Glowking, the most signicant change in the metagame was Levitate becoming significantly less common, which made checking certain Ground/X combination much harder. For example, while Ground/Steel, Ground/Ice and Ground/Fire were previously checked by the immensely splashable Water type Latis and Hydreigon, finding good switchins to these combinations is much harder now.

https://pokepast.es/5c3c5c7cb069494a MamoMosa + PexBro
1628682208025.png

The first mon I had my eye on was Mosa. With the best levitaters gone, Ice/Ground CB Mosa has no real reliable switchins besides Water/Bug, assuming you can Knock everything's helmet off. I paired it with CM Glowbro, basically an attempt at replicating Glowking, albeit noticably less strong.

https://pokepast.es/2023e0f1e679e84b
1628682622633.png

Another mon that felt much better was Melmetal. This was partly also a response to the prevalence of Water type Mew that chose flip Turn as its Water STAB of choice. Due to Melmetal's massive bulk it can be EVd so that uninvested STAB Flip turn from Mew never breaks the sub, which makes Melm a very dangerous threat to teams that rely on Water Mew to beat Steel/Ground mons. This team did very well in testing, with Melmetal taking over multiple games. Terra ended up using a modified version of the set on his trick room team he brought against the Zoomers.

https://pokepast.es/cb062d9e8af3e52a
1628682879202.png

Another team with the melmetal set, this time paired with flying NP torn. NP Torn is featured on both teams, as it felt like the next best special "bulky breaker" now that the latis and hydreigon were gone.

https://pokepast.es/6f9c31d7710b95ae
1628683036490.png

Last mon that felt much better since levitating steels weren't a thing anymore is DD Roost Landomew (Brave bird/EQ). This mon did really well in tests as well, having very good sweep potential with a minimal amount of support. It's also unexpected since Mew usually runs utility sets so people don't really play with it in mind until it's revealed. Unfort I built this team after the Boomers were already knocked out so we didn't get to use it. I also haven't really built a Landomew team that completely satisfied me yet, but the set has been good enough that it usually just won anyway.

I don't really have much more insight into the meta since I only played test games, however another thing that felt good to me was Spect + Guts Normal type. The reasoning here is that Spectrier is a Dark type that doesn't beat opposing Spectrier, so unless you wanna stack Darks you have to find some other way to check it. While Normal/Fairy Blissey works, its not ideal in a meta dominated by Poison type Tornadus, so I ended up gravitating towards offensive mons that blank the horse - FF Normal/Fairy Arcanine and Guts Conk/Hera. Given that the horse is more of a wincon than a breaker, I felt that Guts mons fit horse team comps better so you aren't filling out 2 offensive slots without a dedicated breaker as you would with Horse/Arcanine.

Camo feels a bit matchuppy atm, but it's still a fun meta to build for. Hopefully the removal of the ladder can spark some more interest since its now eligible for omotm voting again. And perhaps we may see a tournament in the future as well... :blobpex:
 

a loser

I'm a loser, baby, so why don't you kill me?
is a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Community Contributor Alumnus
In case you missed it, make sure you sign up for the RIP Camo Ladder Tournament!! There will be an option in this tournament, if both players agree beforehand, to play the games with a "team type preview" that shows the Camomons typing of each team member at the start of battle.

In this tour, the council will be keeping a close eye on a few mons in particular to help us decide their place in the metagame.

These mons are all very good in the current metagame and are potent offensively thanks to their good if not great attacking stats, Speed tiers, and abilities. Pheromosa and Naganadel are glass cannons but can be very threatening with the ability to use setup moves, powerful coverage, and potentially snowball with Beast Boost. Spectrier is similar but slightly less frail and has much worse coverage options to choose from, but can also snowball with Grim Neigh and blow past special walls with Hyper Beam. Tornadus-T has much more defensive utility thanks to having Regenerator + U-turn and several other great utility moves but Torn-T can be very hard to deal with when it sets up with Nasty Plot.

Personally, I find :pheromosa:Pheromosa to be the only one of these four that is clearly too strong. Ice/Fighting sets can tear through walls with Choice Band or lure in walls with mixed sets running Ice Beam and coverage like Shock Wave even. IMO, :tornadus-therian:Tornadus-T is the best mon of these four just thanks to its incredible ability in Regenerator and how it can play both offense and defense very effectively. Its typing choices also allow it to check threats like Spectrier and Rillaboom, along with many others, quite well. I've found that :naganadel:Naganadel can be somewhat hard to use as I never seem to find good setup opportunities due to its low bulk. Maybe I'm using it wrong, but I've yet to see why this mon is unhealthy for the meta at the moment. I voted not to ban :spectrier:Spectrier in the suspect test and still feel the same way about it. I think the mon is good but its limited movepool holds it back from being too strong still.

I hope to see you all in the tour so we can continue to develop this meta! We also will be working on updating the viability rankings and sample teams once we have a clearer picture of the meta and any tiering decisions we might make.
 

Euphonos

inanod ng mga luha; damdamin ay lumaya.
is a Tiering Contributoris a Community Contributor Alumnus
Good day, everyone!

As the RIP Camo Ladder: The Tournament is now in its second round, I have written a weather report usage stats sheet now accessible here! This report comes from tabulating eighteen Round 1 replays from eight different matches (out of ten pairings).
. . . . . . . . . .


5. MELMETAL
Frequency: 22.22%
Win Percentage: 87.50%
Prominent Type:
(100%)
. . . . . . . . . .


4. PHEROMOSA
Frequency: 30.56%
Win Percentage: 45.45%
Prominent Type:
(63.64%, winning 42.86% of the matches)
. . . . . . . . . .


3. CLEFABLE
Frequency: 30.56%
Win Percentage: 72.73%
Prominent Type:
(45.45%, winning 80% of the matches)
. . . . . . . . . .


2. MEW
Frequency: 72.22%
Win Percentage: 42.31%
Prominent Type:
(34.62%, winning 55.56% of the matches)
. . . . . . . . . .


1. TORNADUS-THERIAN
Frequency: 72.22%
Win Percentage: 50.00%
Prominent Type:
(38.46%, winning 50% of the matches)
. . . . . . . . . .
Metagame Observations and Thoughts
  • Dark/Poison Clefable has resurfaced as the sought-after Special sponge in the Camomons metagame. It may come as a surprise given Electric/Fairy variants ran rampant before, but this is one of the main reasons specially offensive threats like Naganadel (without STAB Draco Meteor), Spectrier, and Tornadus-Therian (Nasty Plot variants) have a hard time dealing with this Pokemon.
  • Time and time again, Pheromosa stands out as one of the most sought-after threats in the Camomons metagame because of its proficiency in either attacking stat and has moves from either spectrum (Triple Axel + Close Combat or Ice Beam + Focus Blast) to fill in with the Ice/Fighting typing, which is the most prominent type combination.
  • Speaking of Pheromosa, 9 out of 11 Pheromosa appearances in Round 1 are paired with Tornadus-Therian; as such, for upstart players who wish to get their hands dirty on this metagame, they have to prepare for Pheromosa + Tornadus-Therian in order for you to at least win a match. As such, this concludes that the metagame is centralized around this duo. Not to mention, with 7 out of 9 Pheromosa + Tornadus-Therian appearances in Round 1 having a Mew as the middle ground supporting those two Pokemon, they're in for an uphill battle.
  • Mew can have multiple type combinations thanks to its movepool, but right now, it's more centered toward two main ones: Water and Flying (not just the Water/Flying combination, but the other types paired with either Water or Flying). Apparently, Water/Flying is the most prominent thanks to its overall bulk and utility moves no other Pokemon with the potential Water/Flying type combination to pull off.
  • Finally, another observation that makes me the only one shying away from this team building trend: every team used in that round has a type used more than once, with Poison leading with 11, Dark with 10, Steel with 9, and Fighting with 8.

Hopefully everyone else can help me interpret the data based on the stats sheet I made all by myself. Cheers!
 

a loser

I'm a loser, baby, so why don't you kill me?
is a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Community Contributor Alumnus
Announcement: Euphonos is rejoining the Camomons council! Their passion and dedication to this metagame is near unmatched and we believe Euphonos will be a valuable council member (again).

While I'm here, I'll share some thoughts that I've gathered from watching / playing in the RIP Camo Ladder Tournament. I recently talked about four mons in particular before the tour began (:pheromosa::naganadel::tornadus-therian::spectrier:) Of these four, I think :Pheromosa:Pheromosa is still the most unhealthy mon for the meta. It might not win every game, but I think its power and speed is very imposing on teambuilding and leads to building styles that get stale in attempt to check it. :Tornadus-Therian:Tornadus-T has been used the most, but for good reason as it is incredibly splashable thanks to U-turn + Regenerator and a variety of excellent typings. Nasty Plot turns this into a different animal though, as you can't tell from typing alone which Tornadus-T will be running it or not until it is suddenly at +2. As for :naganadel:Naganadel, I've finally seen the problematic aspect of this mon with Nasty Plot sets having the potential to snowball with Speed boosts from Beast Boost. While this is scary, a lot needs to go right for Nagandel to get in this position and fully taking advantage of the snowballing aspect means not running Draco Meteor and losing to Unaware Clefable. Heatran also is a fairly solid check to this mon. :spectrier:Spectrier has had little usage and no success, so far, but I haven't seen anything to change my mind on it yet.

Other mons that are doing well in the tour and seeing decent usage are:

Ground / Steel is a common typing for each of these, but they have several other nice options to choose from as well. I don't believe either of these mons are unhealthy for the meta right now, but just wanted to point out that they are very good currently. Both of these mons greatly benefit from the removal of good Levitate mons like Latios, Latias, and Hydreigon.
 

Euphonos

inanod ng mga luha; damdamin ay lumaya.
is a Tiering Contributoris a Community Contributor Alumnus
Good day, everyone!

First of all, I would like to thank a loser for re-appointing me to the Camomons Council, and now it's my first time for almost half-a-year to make a post as a re-appointee.

RIP Camo Ladder: The Tournament is now in its semifinal round, and cumulative usage stats are now updated - accessible here! Before that, here are the top 10 Pokemon solely from Round 2:

1633094777592.png


...and for the cumulative usage stats, here are the Top 6:



6. HEATRAN (up 3)
Frequency: 23.33%
Win Percentage: 64.29%
Prominent Type:
(35.71%, winning 60% of the matches)
. . . . . . . . . .


5. MELMETAL (unchanged)
Frequency: 28.33%
Win Percentage: 76.47%
Prominent Type:
(88.24%, winning 73.33% of the matches)
. . . . . . . . . .


4. CLEFABLE (down 1)
Frequency: 30.00%
Win Percentage: 55.56%
Prominent Type:
(44.44%, winning 62.50% of the matches)
. . . . . . . . . .


3. PHEROMOSA (up 1)
Frequency: 36.67%
Win Percentage: 50.00%
Prominent Type:
(72.73%, winning 50% of the matches)
. . . . . . . . . .


2. MEW (unchanged)
Frequency: 71.67%
Win Percentage: 46.51%
Prominent Type:
(25.58%, winning 54.55% of the matches)
. . . . . . . . . .


1. TORNADUS-THERIAN (unchanged)
Frequency: 73.33%
Win Percentage: 47.73%
Prominent Type:
(47.73%, winning 52.38% of the matches)
. . . . . . . . . .
Metagame Observations and Thoughts
  • Nothing much has changed for the Top 5, except for Pheromosa eclipsing Clefable in the cumulative usage thanks to Pheromosa having more appearances than Clefable in Round 2. Prominent type combos of each Pokemon haven't changed.
    • Dragapult was the sixth most used Pokemon in Round 1 before being eclipsed by Heatran.
  • Here are some of the statistics wherein teams have a type used more than once:
    • Poison - 19
    • Dark - 16
    • Steel and Fighting - 12
Hopefully everyone else can help me interpret the data based on the stats sheet I made all by myself.
. . . . . . . . . .

EXPLOSIVE ANNOUNCEMENT!

With all the data extracted and tabulated in the RIP Camo Ladder: The Tournament, and all things considered in the past such as OMPL IX, the Camomons Council has finally decided to vote on Pheromosa:

Pokemon​
Pheromosa​
BAN
BAN
BAN
BAN

and I, on behalf of the Camomons Council, hereby announce that Pheromosa is now banned in Camomons. With that, we are looking forward to more changes moving forward. Tagging Kris to implement this change.

Those who are still battling in the Semifinals of the RIP Camo Ladder: The Tournament when Pheromosa is not allowed (unless doing the gentleman code), please use the code below:
Code:
/challenge gen8camomons@@@+pheromosa
Stay safe, guys!
 
Last edited:

a loser

I'm a loser, baby, so why don't you kill me?
is a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Community Contributor Alumnus
Just as a thought exercise, what unreleased (non-mega) National Dex Pokémon might have the biggest impact in Camo? Some of the first ones that come to mind for me include Infernape, Gliscor, Shell Smash Huntail/Gorebyss, any legal Deoxys forms, Staraptor, Rampardos, and Minior.
This isn't the place to talk about this, but the main (non-mega) mons that are truly missed in Camo thanks to Dexit are shown below.

Many of these mons fill niches that are currently unfilled in this generation's metagame. They were great to decent last gen and would have no trouble finding a place in the current metagame.

Back to this gen though, be on the look out for more council action on the meta concerning some of the mons that were discussed in recent posts. Following this will be an updated VR, Speed Tiers, and Sample Teams!
 

a loser

I'm a loser, baby, so why don't you kill me?
is a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Community Contributor Alumnus
1634653789308.png
1634658377863.png

The Camomons Council has voted on Tornadus-Therian and Naganadel and as a result, both are now banned!
Pokemona loserChazmEuphonosThe Number Man
:Naganadel: NaganadelBANBANBANBAN
:tornadus-therian: Tornadus-TherianBANBANBANBAN

After seeing these two in action in the RIP Camo Ladder tour, for multiple rounds in the finals, especially, it became clear how unhealthy each was for the metagame. Usage of Nasty Plot Torn-T was very high and its impact on games was undeniable. When looking at Torn-T, the unpredictability of its sets due to Nasty Plot and its incredible defensive utility make it very difficult to play against. Its common typings like Dark / Poison, Poison / Flying, and Fighting / Flying can all easily be defensive variants like RegenVest, Defog, and other utility moves but they can also be deadly setup sweeping sets with Hurricane and Focus Blast. Taking this into consideration made the council believe that Tornadus-T is unhealthy for the metagame despite the defensive utility it can provide.

Naganadel trades defensive utility for power. Nasty Plot along with powerful moves like Draco Meteor and Fire Blast make Naganadel difficult to check without hard counters like specially defensive Heatran and the Speed boost from Beast Boost can make it difficult to revenge kill. Its nice Speed tier helps too, as few offensive threats can outspeed it and KO it before it KOs them. The fact that it is a Speed-tie with Tornadus-T makes things even more focused on these two mons, as games can be decided on coinflips.

Tagging Kris to implement these changes, please!
 

a loser

I'm a loser, baby, so why don't you kill me?
is a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Community Contributor Alumnus
Hi again, I'm here now to dump some teams that I used during the RIP Camo Ladder Tour. These teams got me to the finals and helped me stick around until the third round of finals. The quality varies, especially depending on the matchup, but most of these were fun to make and fun to use. Click on the mons to see the teams.


0-1 (Slightly outdated with Torn-T)
This is an older build that I brought for Round 1 Game 1 and played pretty poorly with. It has the "cool" new Mew set that tries to be Glowking and this can win some games but overall the team needs some restructuring to be optimized now.

2-0 (Retired due to Torn-T and Phero ban)
My go-to team that I shared on the last page. Sadly has been invalidated without having Pheromosa anymore but I could always count in this one in the clutch.

1-0 (Outdated due to Phero, Torn-T, and Naga ban, but has been updated)
This is an attempt at status spam with a weird Hex Naganadel set that never really took off due to the presence of Torn-T. I've updated this one with a Spectrier now and some different players due to the recent bans but it isn't as dynamic at the moment.

4-1 (Slightly outdated with Torn-T)
This was my most reliable team for the tournament and the build I was most happy with. I was inspired by a Siamato Heatran set using Nature Power that owned me many times and I thought it would be perfect on a team with two terrains to surprise the commonly used Water / Flying Mew. The only time this team lost was in an unfortunate game with a Hurricane Volcarona set I currently despise.

1-2 (Outdated due to Naga and Torn-T ban, but has been updated)
I really wanted to try out Heracross since it had been a while and figured it would appreciate pivot support so I paired it with lots of pivots basically. Scarf Lando-T came in clutch and the Eject Pack Torn-T with Acrobatics was a really fun set to use. Poison / Fire Naganadel is awful in hindsight with Heatran hanging out and I ended up changing it in the team version below. I thought Eleki would be fun to play with a mixed set and Thunder Cage but this is also invalidated by Heatran.

1-1 (Screens version)
This is basically the same team but with Poison / Dragon Naganadel and dual screens Eleki. I felt better about this one since it allows Heracross and Naga to more safely setup but Dragapult does annoying things to this team with Infiltrator.

1-1 (Slightly outdated with Torn-T)
This is another older build that I resurrected with some tweaks. Coalossal is like pre-DLC vibes and I think I have too many Fairy-types on this team but it feels solid enough. I never really got to use the Mew set to its fullest potential but I thought a random Nasty Plot with Spikes could be annoying. Would have gone 2-0 and won me the tour if not for a Hurricane miss :(

0-1 (Slightly outdated with Torn-T, has been updated)
Here's a random attempt at webs with some Melmetal check overkill. Mew is interesting but wasn't ideal even with webs with Torn-T around cause it was usually immune and could annoy it with super effective hits. It might be better now but I'll have to see. LO Porygon-Z that hits RegenVest sounded cool and might have some potential without Torn-T as well. This Torn-T set was built with Unaware Clefable and FF Heatran in mind so that you can hit them and other special walls with a pretty powerful LO Superpower and just heal off with regen.

1-1 (Slightly outdated with Torn-T)
This team combines some previous ideas and sets with slight tweaks to some typings. Stomping Tantrum is a pretty neat move when paired with Rocks and Toxic to get a 150 BP STAB move but I think it works better on the Water / Poison Chomp since Poison Jab can fail much more reliably. This Mew is cool on paper but it's hard to give it a nice secondary STAB that provides good utility/coverage that doesn't make it weak to Ground-type moves.


0-1 (Currently legal)
This is a re-hash of the screens team from earlier but more optimized for a post Torn-T and Naganadel meta. Dragapult is a better screens setter than Eleki for now since Heatran is so common and Pult can pivot out on anyone. The Spectrier set could probably be optimized with Nasty Plot over Substitute to make it more broken. Mew is here mainly to deny Lando-Mew variants from getting out of hand.

0-2 (Slightly outdated with Torn-T)
I was inspired to make a sand team after seeing it used some in this tour but I got tired of seeing Dracozolt get switched around on with Heatran and Flying-types so I cut that out with Low Kick. This did pretty well in tests but I played poorly with it in the tour and also lost on a Torn-T moment with it. Gigalith is kind of a meme compared to a Hippowdon with more longevity but it was fun to use with Explosion and Rocks. Chomp is normal Chomp but with funny Sand Veil that picked up some Hurricane misses in tests and a clutch Tbolt miss in the tour. Celebi is a pretty cool set, similar to the Mew on my webs team but the idea is Healing Wish gives Zolt or Chomp another chance to sweep late game.

0-1 (Slightly outdated with Torn-T, but bad team don't use)
This was an attempt to revamp my semi-stall team but I made this very last minute and wasn't pleased with how it turned out. Might play around with it some more but it'll need a lot of work.

That's all of them! Not gonna lie I got pretty burned out by the end of this tour, especially the last round of finals, and as a result I didn't play my best. I was happy with my team ideas though and definitely think they have some potential with a little more work. Thanks The Number Man for hosting the tour and helping me test some ideas and congrats (and thanks) to PandaDoux for winning (and finally ending) the tour! Thanks also to anaconja, Osake, XxSevagxX, Dr. Phd. BJ, and Euphonos for playing test battles with me too.
 
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a loser

I'm a loser, baby, so why don't you kill me?
is a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Community Contributor Alumnus
Hello yet again! Despite not having a ladder, Camomons is still going on in the World Cup. In these games, we've been seeing a ton of usage from spike stack Mew, bulky setup Reuniclus, and other setup from mons like Spectrier and Volcarona.

The theme in these games in generally Mew setting up three layers of Spikes so that bulky setup users like the ones mentioned above can eventually wear down opposing teams and break through for the win. Hazard control is at a low point with next to no good reliable Rapid Spin users and Defog becoming harder to fit on teams. Heavy-Duty Boots are also very common on these teams, with Spikes Mew opting for them and teammates like Blissey and Slowbro using them as well to avoid chip damage and pivot into the setup mons. Breakers like Reuniclus can also ignore chip with Magic Guard and are seemingly treating every mon in the meta as setup fodder (I've seen Reuniclus setting up in front of Heatran several times). They can get away with this because Heatran isn't lucky enough to have recovery outside of Leftovers and they can chip it and switch out to recover or recover later while ignoring hazards.

Here are some WC replays with bulky setup users and/or hazard stack seeing high usage:
Spikes Mew and Boots teammates along with CM wear down opposing team and mostly ignore the opposing hazards
More offensive setup spam but shows how bulky setup like Celebi and Magearna can stack up and tear down teams
Regen CM Reun paired with Blissey, Mence, and Spikes Mew to wear down and stall out checks like Heatran, Cinderace, and Volcanion
Multiple CM users leading to setup wars and eventual crits
CM Mew sets up in front of everyone
Not WC, but gross game with lots of hazards and bulky setup mons just getting chip and healing until finding a time to break through

It becomes tough to see the root of the problem here. This generation of Camomons has been overrun with bulky setup users. Latias, Latios, Hydreigon, Slowking-G, and Tornadus-T have all met the same fate due to their shared ability of setting up to become powerful sweepers with colorful movepools while shrugging off chip damage with reliable recovery options. Each of these used Calm Mind to setup, except Torn-T and Hydreigon which used Nasty Plot. As a result of these bans, some of the best Defog users and support mons have been removed from the meta because of their ability to serve as a setup sweeper too. I think this has put Camomons in a very strange spot and hasn't necessarily helped the meta develop into something healthier.

Calm Mind is still seeing a ton of usage. As I have mentioned, Reuniclus is using it as well as others like Clefable, Mew, Spectrier, Cresselia, and Magearna. Not all of these are largely problematic, though, but can still be devastating under the right circumstances. With Calm Mind still being in the spotlight after several bans of Calm Mind users, this could lead one to think that Calm Mind is the issue here rather than the mons themself. However, it has been made very clear from OM leadership that a Calm Mind ban is out of the question. There are also other bulky setup methods involving Nasty Plot, Bulk Up, and Dragon Dance that would not be impacted by any action taken on Calm Mind.

With that being said, the council has decided to vote on several troubling aspects of the metagame currently in attempt to make it healthier and less focused on hazard stack and bulky setup. We voted on four mons, with the results shown below.
Pokemona loserChazmEuphonosThe Number ManResult
:mew:MewDNBBANBANBAN(3-1) BAN
:reuniclus:ReuniclusBANBANBANBAN(4-0) BAN
:spectrier:SpectrierDNBBANBANBAN(3-1) BAN
:volcarona:VolcaronaDNBDNBBANABS(1-2-1) DNB
So the face of Camomons (Mew), Reuniclus, and Spectrier have all been banned! The council will continue to keep an eye on how the metagame shifts with these bans to see if the impact has improved the quality of the metagame. We'd love to see your thoughts on this news and how, if possible, teams will replace the utility the Mew provided for almost every team.

Tagging Kris to implement these bans, please and thank you!
 
:ss/volcarona:

As the post-ban meta evolved during WC playoffs it became clear that Volcarona became a massive problem for teams to check. Despite staying as one of the few bulky special based wincons left, which should in theory have made it easier to deal with, Volcarona has continued to dominate and put pressure on players in the builder, while also leading to CM war gamestates that are decided by whoever crits first. The immense set flexibility makes it a pain to prep for.

It can viably run various Fire type sets (Flying, Grass, Psychic) with Fire/Flying additionally being able to opt for Grass coverage to beat non Toxic Tran and Substitute or Safeguard to beat Toxic Blissey. Additionally, it can run Poison/Flying to remove almost all forms of defensive counterplay while punishing physical attackers with Flame Body on a typing with few weaknesses that are not very common in the meta. It can also end up running Grass/Psychic or Grass/Poison, but these sets are more niche. Volcarona is already hard to check, with practically no mon beating all of its sets. One of the better ways to check it has been using Toxic Blissey alongside a strong Steel or Psychic type that can punish the Poison variant. However, Sub/Safeguard Volc completely bypasses this. In order to have a good Volc matchup one must therefore also run a physical based Water/Dragon/Rock type that can 1v1 mono Fire Volc or Taunt Heatran. This means that effectively, the only way to truly check Volc is to dedicate at least 2 slots to it, if not 3. Even Unaware Clefable doesn't beat all Volc sets, as Safeguard can just wait for the Clef to get burnt off Flame Body and then stall out its Softboileds.

Its setup capabilities are not the only thing it has going for it. Flame body is a dangerous ability for the u-turn spammers in the tier, mainly Rillaboom, and would-be checks that fail to Ohko, get burnt and are no longer capable of checking it. This may look like marginal utility, but Gliding into Volc and getting burnt for it can mean game over in certain scenarios.

Overall we felt that Volc was not a healthy presence in the current meta and unanimously decided to ban it. Tagging Kris to implement it please!
 

a loser

I'm a loser, baby, so why don't you kill me?
is a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Community Contributor Alumnus
Big updates for Camomons!!

We've finally got new sample teams. Check out the teams now and try them out on the ladder!

Sand Balance by Siamato


Double Swords Dance Bulky Offense by a loser


PexChomp + DonTran Bulky Offense by The Number Man


Specs Dragapult Balance by The Number Man


In the Enchanted Garden II Double Setup by Euphonos

We've also updated the viability rankings! For the time being, since the meta is still developing, we're using slightly different rankings of Top Tier, High, Mid, and Low opposed to the normal A+, B-, type of ranking. With more development in the meta, the usual VR ranking style will come back into place. See the VR here below or in its normal spot on the first page.
Camomons Viability Rankings
Pokemon in each rank are listed in alphabetical order

TOP TIER
Clefable [Electric/Fairy, Poison/Dark, Fire/Fairy]
Dragapult [Dragon/Ghost, Water/Ghost, Water/Dragon, Water/Electric, Etc.]
Garchomp [Water/Ground, Ground/Steel, Dragon/Steel, Water/Steel, Water/Dragon, Water/Poison]
Heatran [Fire/Ground, Steel/Ground, Fire/Steel]
Rillaboom [Grass/Fighting, Grass/Ground, Grass/Dark]

HIGH
Arcanine [Normal/Fairy, Normal/Fire, Normal/Dark]
Blaziken [Dark/Fighting, Ground/Dark, Ground/Fire]
Blissey [Normal/Ghost, Normal, Normal/Psychic, Normal/Fairy]
Buzzwole [Steel/Flying, Fighting/Flying, Flying/Ground]
Celebi [Fairy/Ghost, Ghost/Ground]
Coalossal [Ground/Steel, Fighting/Steel, Water/Fighting, Water/Ground]
Cresselia [Fairy/Poison, Fairy/Ghost, Fairy/Electric]
Heracross [Normal/Ghost, Normal/Dark, Fighting/Dark]
Landorus-Therian [Bug/Fighting, Bug/Ground, Dark/Ground, Bug/Steel]
Dusk Form
Lycanroc-Dusk [Fighting/Dark, Dark/Steel, Dark/Fairy]
Magnezone [Steel/Electric, Electric/Fighting]
Melmetal [Steel/Ground, Electric/Steel, Fighting/Poison]
Necrozma [Dragon/Fairy, Fire/Ground, Psychic/Ground, Steel/Fairy]
Porygon-Z [Electric/Ghost, Electric/Ice]
Salamence [Water/Ground, Steel/Flying, Dragon/Ghost, Dragon/Flying]
Slowbro [Water/Ghost, Water/Fighting, Ghost/Fighting, Water/Psychic]
Slowking [Water/Ground, Fire/Ground]
Toxapex [Poison/Dark, Poison/Water]
Victini [Fire/Electric]

MID
Alakazam [Ghost/Fighting, Ghost/Fairy]
Barraskewda [Water/Fighting, Water/Psychic]
Cinderace [Poison/Fighting]
Conkeldurr [Normal/Fighting, Fighting/Dark]
Drednaw [Water/Ground]
Entei [Normal/Fire]
Excadrill [Normal/Ghost, Ground/Ghost, Ground/Steel]
Ferrothorn [Grass/Steel, Grass/Poison]
Haxorus [Bug/Ground, Bug/Fighting, Fighting/Ground]
Hippowdon [Ground/Rock, Rock/Poison, Rock/Dark]
Jirachi [Steel/Fairy]
Kingdra [Water/Flying]
Kommo-o [Fire/Normal, Normal/Dragon, Ground/Steel, Ghost/Fighting]
Lucario [Normal/Fire, Normal/Ground, Normal/Dark, Normal/Ghost]
Magearna [Steel/Fairy, Electric/Fairy, Steel/Ghost]
Noivern [Normal/Dark, Normal/Ghost, Normal/Fire]
Pelipper [Water/Bug, Dark/Poison, Water/Flying, Water/Dark]
Regieleki [Electric/Normal]
Rhyperior [Water/Steel, Water/Ghost]
Slowbro [Water/Poison]
Scizor [Steel/Flying]
Tangrowth [Poison/Grass, Dark/Poison]
Tapu Lele [Psychic/Fighting, Psychic/Fairy]
Tyranitar [Rock/Dragon]
Urshifu-Single-Strike [Poison/Dark, Steel/Dark, Fighting/Dark]
Volcanion [Fire/Ground, Poison/Ground, Steel/Flying]
Zygarde-10% [Normal/Ground]

LOW
Aerodactyl [Normal/Dark, Ghost/Rock, Normal/Water]
Araquanid [Water/Poison]
Avalugg [Steel/Fighting, Dark/Steel]
Azelf [Normal/Dark, Fire/Electric]
Chandelure [Ghost/Grass]
Cloyster [Normal/Ice, Bug/Ground]
Dhelmise [Steel/Ghost]
Diggersby [Ground/Bug, Ground/Dark, Poison/Dark]
Ditto [Normal]
Dracozolt [Electric/Ground, Electric/Fighting]
Glastrier [Ground/Steel, Dark/Fighting, Dragon/Steel, etc.]
Gengar [Fairy/Electric, Ghost/Fighting, Poison/Fairy, Electric/Poison]
Grimmsnarl [Fairy/Dark]
Hatterene [Fairy/Grass, Grass/Fire]
Hawlucha [Fighting/Flying, Steel/Flying]
Metagross [Steel/Fighting]
Moltres [Fire/Flying, Fire/Ground]
Pikachu [Normal/Fairy, Normal/Dark]
Tapu Koko [Electric/Grass, Electric/Fairy, Steel/Flying]
Torkoal [Fire/Fighting]
Toxtricity [Normal/Ghost, Normal/Electric]
Vaporeon [Water/Ghost]
Venusaur [Poison/Ground, Fire/Ground]
Zarude [Grass/Steel, Dark/Steel]
Lastly, this will be my last post as Co-Leader and council member for Camomons. If you didn't see my post in the BH thread, I'm stepping away from mons-related responsibilities to focus on other things. But I'll still be on the ladder this month as having the Camo ladder back up can't be missed! The Number Man will be taking my spot as Co-Leader.

Thanks to everyone for making Camomons awesome and I look forward to the rest of the month as we enjoy having a ladder again!
 
Last edited:

Euphonos

inanod ng mga luha; damdamin ay lumaya.
is a Tiering Contributoris a Community Contributor Alumnus
Good day, everyone!

Iron Chef Camomons Deluxe is still up and running, and is now on its sixth episode, building phase! As such, interested participants may now build their masterful creations based on that episode's secret ingredient. Looking forward to those submissions!

Another thing: while I'm actually under isolation for quite some time, I actually made a YouTube video featuring a challenge former tier leader a loser brought to me; huge thanks to him for bringing up an idea for an upcoming YouTube video!


Also, there will be a tournament only exclusive to the Camomons Discord Server; those who are interested in participating in the tournament should come there! See you around!
 
:greninja-ash: Siamato's feedback on the Camomons metagame :greninja-ash:

baguette.png
Introduction


Since my last posts (this one and this other one) related to Calm Mind (CM) (but not only), the Camomons metagame drastically changed with many bans.
:hydreigon: :latios: :latias: :slowking-galar: :pheromosa: :naganadel: :tornadus-therian: :mew: :reuniclus: :spectrier: :volcarona: (from the oldest to the most recent)
All these bans were, in my opinion, necessary* and helped to improve the Camomons metagame for the best (while some of them induced other issues but we'll talk about that later).

Outside from these bans which are related to the metagame, Camomons finally lost its place in OMPL and WCoOMs for the benefit of the Godly Gift. Is this the final blow will finish off Camomons? We don't know for the moment but that's definitely a huge one considering its including on the most "famous" teamtours in OMs was a non-negligible source of interest pushing peope to try the metagame.
Considering Camomons also lost its ladder before, there's now no more opportunities to play Camomons outside from friendly games. Again, independently from attractiveness, a metagame which is not playable on teamtours or ladder isn't a metagame that we can develop and lead to the best due to the lack of feedback on the real state of the metagame.
I will not try to question the removal of Camomons by Godly Gift because the decision is already made and I don't think the leaders will come back on it. So I just hope Godly Gift will benefit from this opportunity which is a real chance to develop.

However, Camomons can maybe see a hope with the return of the ladder for this month (post started around 10th of January kek). This chance will probably be the last one to develop the metagame and discuss about certain things before a potential cryogenic sleep or change of mind from the leaders. Then, I will take this opportunity to talk about the metagame before it's too late to do so.
For those who think that I'm not aware of the state of the current meta due to my absence in WCoOMs (for instance), let me say that I built all the Camomons teams of the France team, discussed a lot about Camomons with some people and more recently try the ladder (and enjoyed it!).

Finally, I will try to adopt a more favourable tone to dialogue because I know that I could be too inflammatory in my previous posts and hurt some people. But this post is also adressed to these people and it will not serve my point to be inflammatory again.

* considering no other options were on the table

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After all these bans, where are we now?

Compared to my previous posts, I'll lie if I said that nothing improved. The meta is definitely in a better state now in particular since highly restrictive threats are gone, opening more the teambuilding and favorising the diversity. Finally the council banned all the mon I wished to see banned, but some month after haha.

The meta is open for many playstyle ranging from classic balanced, BO and fat team to stall and HO. I also saw (and played) weather teams on ladder and it seems also a good playstyle to try.

Due to this improvement, I have no regret that we have chosen to run this path (many bans) and maybe we had to do it because, well, we can't say if we don't try.

However, some issues haven't been resolved with this process and we'll discuss them now.

Spikes and hazards stacking

One of the main reason to ban Mew, the heart of the Camomons since its birth, was to remove the best Spiker in the meta. Mew could indeed run many viable typing and easily set few layers of Spikes considering it was able to beat almost all hazard removers (Deffoger mainly).

However, we finally know that, this ban has little consequences to this issue. Indeed, Mew was the best Spiker but certainly not the only Spiker. Thus, its ban has only made the other Spikers better considering they were all viable but generally outclassed by Mew.
Here the list of the dominant Spikers in the meta:

:coalossal:
/
/
/
/
A-/A viability
:skarmory:
/
/
B+ viability
:ferrothorn:
/
/
B+ viability


I will not really question Mew's ban utility considering there was other reasons to ban it (even if we can discuss it later maybe).

Actually, the problem is essentially unfixable now because, Spikers are not really the root of the problem in fact. The real issue is, Deffogers, the most common way to remove hazards, are not good and generally lose against Spikers.
Indeed, we ended up banning almost all the best Deffoger in the meta with TornaT, Lati@s and Mew but that was the price to pay to get rid of their unhealthy/broken part. Rapid Spinner are in general more viable but hazards spam can easily fit a Ghost type to remove this kind of counterplay.

Calm Mind, the problem is still there?
Part 1: Where do we come from?

First, let's see where do we come from. Since the, let's say, first ban slate of CM users (Gking and Lati@s), what happened? Some others ban happened after those ones (mid OMPL), Pheromosa, Naganadel and Tornadus-Therian during the RIP Camo ladder tour. After this tour, Camo started a sleep due to its absence in OM circuit and the removal of its ladder. While some people thought there were still mons than can cause issues in the meta, it was difficult to take any tiering action due to the absence of a real picture of the meta.
Then started WCoOMs, another chance (and the last in fact) for Camomons to be played and to developed its metagame.

Let's see some statistics in WCoOMs related to setup in general, seen as a general problem of Camo (and not CM only):
Move​
Usage​
Sweep*​
Kills​
Sweeprate**​
Calm Mind​
23​
7​
35​
30%​
Quiver Dance​
11​
2​
13​
18%​
Sword Dance​
9​
0​
7​
0%​
Dragon Dance​
5​
0​
2​
0%​
Bulk Up​
5​
1​
10​
20%​
Nasty Plot​
5​
1​
11​
20%​
Howl​
1​
0​
2​
0%​
*Sweep: A mon taking 2 kills or more ending the game
** Sweeprate: Ratio bewteen Sweep and Usage in %

These stats are provided by PandaDoux, thanks to him for his work!

Seeing these stats easily shows the dominance of CM among the others form of setup. One can see that as a consequence of CM users being much more numerous than the others. But that's not only the setup move the most played, that was also the most effective one and again, quite far above the others.
WCoOMs was also the scene of particularly uncompetitive CM (or pseudo-CM) war at the number of 5.

These stats easily show that, since the first ban slate, the Camomons metagame did not solve its issue with CM and then, tiering action should again take place.

Council and a part of the playerbase agreed on CM being the real root of the problem but OM leadership, in order to avoid such a ban, quite borderline with respect to Smogon's standard, decided to forbidden the ban of CM and asked the council to take another road.

Then the only way was to continue banned mons and it ended up with Spectrier, Reuniclus, Mew and Volcarona being banned from Camomons. Spectrier due to its access to CM and NP, Reuniclus for CM only, Mew for Spikes and multiple form of setup and Volcarona for QD.

And that's where we are now. I will not blame OM leaders for prohibiting a ban of CM because, compared to my first post asking to ban CM from Camo, I effectively changed my mind and also thought that, try to resolve the problem by the usual way (banning abusers) first was the legitimate path to run. Since the first ban slate, we have seen that it was insufficient and then process to another ban slate.
But is it sufficient now? What was the price to pay for what improvement? Was it indeed the good path to run or do we have now to reconsider this choice and ban CM instead? Let's talk about it in the second part.

Part 2: Where are we now?

Let's see who are the remaining CM users first.

Banned CM users: :latios: :latias: :slowking-galar: :reuniclus: :mew: :spectrier: (I will not count Zeraora and Lando-I because CM wasn't involved in their ban)
Allowed CM users known as good: :clefable: :cresselia: :necrozma: :magearna: :slowbro-galar: :celebi:
CM users still unexplored because they were overshadowed by others CM users: :sigilyph::slowking::slowbro::tapu fini::hatterene::suicune::keldeo:

So at the end of the day, we progressively retrieve the CM abusers present in the pre-DLC meta because they weren't bad, just basically overshadowed by others. But CM abusers are still not reduced to pre-DLC meta with new addition which are still here.
1644675033149.png

Chazm said that Spectrier didn't count as a CM sweeper but at the end and especially in WCoOMs, it was essentially play with CM and not NP. Necrozma is now known as one of the best and borderline Calm Minder in the meta. Sigilyph started to see some usage. Cresselia + Magnet Pull appeared as a good way to fit CM Cress on Magnezone team as a defensive glue and a more reliable wincon thanks to Magnezone. And if indeed, some mons named in my initial list stayed unused, some also appeared like Gbro or Suicune in WCoOMs.
So indeed, get rid of some Calm Minders just shifted the problem to others even if they were initially less good.

The question now is, how good the remaining CM user are? Are they broken, unhealthy or fine? Let's see in details.

:clefable:
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/
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/
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Most viable typing
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/
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/
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/
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/
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Other typing you may see

This mon is generally presented as the best example of how Camomons's mecanic interact well with CM bulky setup. When Clefable stays only Fairy we can use the fact that it's weak to Steel and Poison to prepare against it, count on slowpivot strat into strong breaker like CB Rilla with Wood Hammer or setup against it based on the fact that you resist Moonblast and you're not that weak to coverage. But even with that, Clefable manages to be one of the most consistent mon in OU since ORAS.
The way you prep against Clef in Camomons is definitely more tricky.

Clefable has in Camomons many possibilities.
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gives you an additionnal weakness to Ground but the additional resists and immunity to para are really helpful. But still, Clefable isn't able to deal with
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like Heatran (Taunt/EQ) or Melmetal or
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Volcanion. But what's about
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Clefable? Well, Tran and Volca are still answer but Melmetal isn't able to check it now. But Clefable is also played with the
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typing. Now, Clefable can pressure every Steel mons with Sball and is immune to trap that partially remove this kind of counterplay. But finally, what's about
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Clef? While Water Pulse is a bad move (in general we search to optimize usefulness of the moves while trying to get a good typing),
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is great and actually completely change the way to check it.
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is designed to beat other Calm Minders thanks to Unaware and paired well with Magnezone to trap Steels. All this versions are viable meaning that, in practise, it's particularly hard to prep against Clef and it often introduces an excessive importance of the MU.

A loser vs me, Ghost Clef + hazards spam (ehleskoko is my alt)
Top ladd game with hazards spam, TNM vs me (Maltasio is my alt)
Top ladd game (jrdn vs a loser, CM Clef + CM Slowbro-G)
[OUTDATED] WCoOMs Revenge Killer vs Euphonos
[OUTDATED] WCoOMs Alternatif vs PA (Unaware CM Clef managed to beat a CM Slowbro-G)
[OUTDATED] WCoOMs Alternatif vs Havens (A "regular" Clef manages to win the game with a little luck)

:necrozma:
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/
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Most viable typing (for CM Necrozma)
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/
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/
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Other typing you may see as a Calm Minder

Necrozma was previously known as one of the best defensive glue with the
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typing but it did a crazy ascent as one of the best Calm Minder atm. With a large movepool including a Steel move, a solid coverage (Fire & Ground), a healing move that, although imperfect, brings him the very useful Fairy typing, a talent reducing its weaknesses and a really good overall bulk, Necrozma is undoubtedly one of the most powerful Calm Minder atm. The
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variant is the most used one thanks to the amazing defensive utility of the typing. With Earth Power, Necrozma is able to threat effectively Fire or Steel mons particularly annoying for usual Steel Calm Minder (see Magearna).
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is known as one of the best typing in Camo and, even if Toxic is quite suboptimal here, Necrozma only needs Dark Pulse to do the job. Other variant are also good especially
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quite underrated atm. The other are weak to Toxic but well, if you play Camo you know that Toxic isn't always a way to be prep to multi form of setup because many of them try to be immune to Toxic.

CM mono attacker Necrozma 1 (roomtour featuring Dragonillis)
CM mono attacker Necrozma 2 (roomtour final featuring Panda Doux)
Mid ladder game (Elfamosoyasop is my alt)
atha tried to make me lose but CM Necro did it (no relevant just for fun)
[OUTDATED] WCoOMs, pseudo-CM war (Altthiel vs Anaconja WCoOMs semi-final, Necrozma lost the pseudo-CM war here)
[OUTDATED] WCoOMs Artic vs Anaconja

:cresselia:
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/
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Most viable typing
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Other typing you may see

This one is not really broken due to its restricted movepools. But still, Cresselia is known since gen7 as a monstruously tanky mon with only 2 (rare) weaknesses. While Cresselia isn't broken, it stays an important mon to take into account in the builder under penalty of being 6/0'ed. And we know now that bring a (non passive) Steel isn't sufficient to prevent Cress from sweeping considering it paired well with
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Magnezone able to remove almost all the Steels. Fun to see that one of the usual counterplay against Cresselia is CM war + Fairy resist due to its weak power and limited recovery (8 pp).

:magearna:
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Most viable typing
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/
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/
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Other typing you may see

Magearna struggled a bit in Camo compared to OU. This was due to the incapacity of the Choice Specs to work as well as in OU. Indeed, you cannot abuse the Steel type defensively anymore because you need Flash Cannon for that, and Flash Cannon is a bad move. There's also more counterplay with things like
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Heatran/Slowking/Volcanion,
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Heatran/Melmetal are good checks and others like
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Slowking, Blissey or
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Necrozma. Nevertheless, the double dance set stayed the same thanks to SG/ID to give the Steel typing. But, again, this set is less effective in Camo due to things like
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Toxapex able to wall it forever. Nevertheless, it has shown some interest again recently especially in offensive team.

[OUTDATED] WCoOMs Mossy Sandwich vs Anaconja (Double Dance Magearna ended up sweeping)

:slowbro-galar:
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Most viable typing
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/
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Other typing you may see

This mon is basically Slowking-G but nerfed. It has almost the same movepool and is used to do the same thing, abuse from the pairing of Regen + Scald/Sludge Bomb coverage and secondary effect + recovery + CM. The main difference is located at the level of the SpD. Slowking had more facility to setup and was immediatly able to endure hits like Tbolt from Specs Dragapult. Slowbro needs basically one more turn to achieve the same meaning that there's more immediate perspective of counterplay. We didn't see much about Slowbro-G so it's hard to say if "the nerf" was sufficient or if this mon is less but still broken like his cousin.

Mono CM lol (dead brain irrelevant replay of mono CM winning)

:celebi:
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/
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Most viable typing
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/
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/
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/
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/
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/
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Other typing you may see

Celebi was seen since a long time as a good NP user thanks to the excellent and rare Ground coverage, its ability to remove its status coupled to a good bulk and recovery. Nevertheless, the metagame and its natural bulk progressively opened the way to the CM sets which are now common. But if the Ground coverage is an advantage against usual counterplay to Calm Minders like Heatran, Melmetal or Toxapex, that's also a weakness for a mon which want to stay because our god Rilla is always around. Thus, Celebi is somehow a fishy mon when you expect you're oppo trying to cover CM with things like Toxapex or Unaware Clef but not that good in general being weak to some standard combo like Bliss/King TP + Rilla.

Top ladd game with CM Celebi (Celebi managed to win vs stall even with Poison)

We end up here our review of the "current" (we know that it already evolved with new ones, see additional*) Calm Minders in the meta. As I tried to show, they're some mons close to be broken and others which are still far to be called like that.

*
:sigilyph:
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/
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1622382167075.png
/
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1622382114832.png
/
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/
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/
1622382114832.png
1622382336413.png

One of the most interesting "new comer" is definitely Sigilyph. The progressive return to a fat meta and the departure of certain Calm Minders (and Volcarona) means that Sigi is viable again. It's an interesting mon a bit different than the other Calm Miners that we have to follow.

TNM vs me, Sigi is good?

:tapu-fini:
1622382167075.png
1622382201466.png
/
1622382167075.png
1622382189869.png

Ngl Fini could be a decent Calm Minder now. I always thought that the most viable mons in OU can also perform in Camo and Tapu Fini seems indeed a realistic option to try. CM + Taunt prevents mono attacker Pex to Haze or Toxic after the disappearance of the misty surge. It also a way to prevent slowpivot strat based on Blissey or Slowking. Finally it's also a way to win against other Calm Minders even without a reliable healing move.

:suicune:
1622382201466.png

I'm not a believer of the
1622382189869.png
played by Euphonos during the WCoOMs because it's walled by any Normal mon and provide low utility in general. Nevertheless, Suicune has certainly something to do in Camo with the standard set.

:keldeo:
1622382398639.png
1622382336413.png

Back in the game again? The dominance of
1622382416095.png
1622382336413.png
Mew at a time made this mon unviable. But what about now? Blissey is mainly Ghost but that's not a problem for Keldeo, it can just sub and setup because Shadow Ball does nothing. Other SpD wall like Pex or Slowking can do better being pressured easily. The only really annoying mon for it which remains is Clefable but I don't think it's sufficient to invalidate this mon completely.

Note that the "outdated" replays are still quite relevant to show, even at the previous state of the meta, the mons cited above were used and good. They're bascially better now due to the reducing of the competition.

Part 3: Banning* CM is probably the best way to improve the meta, explanation and reasoning

Calm Minders are still quite numerous and constitute an unhealthy presence in the metagame

That's a point which, I think, was probably not sufficiently adressed during the debate. If Calm Mind makes indeed some mons broken that we have to ban (if banning CM itself is out of consideration), the remaing Calm Minders are not healthy. Simply because in a metagame where we often have to blank things with low interaction typing and bulk due to the incapacity to prep well against the variety of viable sets that a mon can run in Camomon, Calm Minders are too much. We cannot really cover Calm Minders with usual defensive counterplay meaning that Calm Minders are something more we have to cover and constrict even more the teambuilding. But the fact is, and it was the goal of the last point, we cannot even take into account properly the main Calm Minder because they're numerous and with a large variety of sets with sometimes different kind of counterplay. Calm Minders are essentially the root of the, known as Camomons theorem: "We can always lose to a random setup mon in Camomons". We show previously that this is not true for the others form of setup because they're restricted to some mons meaning that it's easier to prep against. Physcial setup is nerfed by burn which is common with Scald or Flame Body. NP has now a restricted pool of viable users and by "viable" I meant "not really good".
We generally look the abusers and ban the most problematic ones instead of the move itself but when we reach the point where the move makes too many broken and unhealthy mons, we have to look at it.

CM brings to much uncompetitiveneness with a high MU dependance

This is directly linked to the above paragraph. The fact that Calm Minders are still numerous and versatile make them particularly unhealthy for the meta because we cannot prep for all of them meaning that we have to accept to lose to the MU sometimes. Let's be clear, that's not an issue of bad building. This is not realistic to think that we can build a good balanced team while taking into account all the Calm Minders. It's possible when their number is limited but that's not the case here with like a mon per set (different typing) with enough mons to make this number too huge. There's basically no mid-ground against Calm Minder. That's not like an offensive mon which break your defensive core because, in that case, there's something to do with revenge killing and playing to not let him come as much as you can. The perspective of counterplay like that are definitely reduced against Calm Minders because, it breaks your defensive core and, you may not be able to rk it.
The climax is when we have to go for the CM war because that's the only way to prevent the opposing CM to win and only rely on luck.

Banning CM is an improvement to the issue of hazards stacking

We already discussed that hazards stacking in a slow metagame like the one we currently have is something which is strong but, due to the absence of reliable way to remove them, hazards are kinda busted even with the existence of HDB. Moreover, Spikes and Calm Minders generally synergize well meaning that it's particularly hard to deal with both. The banning of TornaT, Mew and Lati@s, the most reliable Deffogers, is the main reason to this issue. if TornaT was banned due to NP (we will talk about CM vs NP later) and Mew for being the most reliable Spikes setter, Latias was banned due to CM.
Thus, another thing that we're looking for with a CM ban, is to free Latias (which is perfectly fine de facto) and then nerf hazards spam with a mon which will probably be the best Deffoger in the meta.

There was no attempt banning mons instead of CM itself

That's not true anymore. We tried to resolve the issue with 2 ban slates including Calm Minders but the issue is still there while reduced.

Banning CM is open a Pandora's box where we can, for instance, ban NP after and so on

This one, my previous posts and the discussion in the Camomons channel have shown that there's no way to ban something else. Physical setup moves are not a problem due to the restricted pool of users and the burn as an effective counterplay. Moreover, there's only a few mons with physical setup and recovery meaning that there're not too linked to the so called "bulky setup issue". NP isn't an issue anymore, banning abusers solved this issue and the price to pay wasn't too much.

Banning CM isn't something in accordance with tiering policy

Smogon's tiering policy and OMs tiering policy can allow this kind of ban. If we generally try to avoid this path because, in fact, there's often another way to solve the problem like bannning mon. But sometimes, stay against unusual or complex ban is detrimental for the metagame when that's however the best solution for it. Let's just see how a generation known as one of the most competitive one, ADV OU, ended up complex banning Baton Pass. The fact is this complex ban have been considered as the best solution to keep the metagame competitive while perserving a whole dimension of the meta. This kind of ban aren't an isolated case.
OMs tiering policy which is and have to be a simple extension of the classical tiering policy adapted to OMs often allows that. Thus, I don't think there's a hard line to be drawn while banning CM from Camomons. All is a matter of justification and that's what I wanted to do in this and my previous posts.

Finally I want to conclude this part with an extract of a discussion with BKC, veteran on Smogon and one of the best players of all time. I presented to him the subject of CM in Camo and asked for some feedback to know what he thought with the information I gave to him.

1644670470303.png

Although I don't want to accord to this discussion and the others I had with non-Camomons players too much relevancy and importance, I think it proves that banning CM should not be prohibed by OM leadership for any reason at least. The Camomons council is the only legitimate and competent body up to decide what can be the best way to lead the metagame and decide if something should or shouldn't be banned with proper justification.

I recognize that, compared to the first time I called for a CM ban, my mind has changed and I understood my mistake. We had to run this path with banning and see if the things improved or not. Maybe I was too visionary considering I was almost convinced that banning some abusers will not end up solving the problem. But still, we had to try it.

baguette.png
Conclusion

Let's the council and eventually to a more extend, the Camomons playerbase, decide if CM should or shouldn't be banned from Camomons. There're really solid arguments in favor of a ban and if it happens, no, the meta will not turn into a mess where everything is allowed.

*Also by "banning CM", there's in fact 2 ways to do so for me.

  1. Simply ban CM from Camomons. Mons like Clefable, Latias or Reuniclus keep their healthy part (utility, deffoger and regenvest respectively) and we get completely rid of the broken part.
  2. Complex ban CM + Recovery move. The issue of CM is almost indistinguishable from CM + recovery in fact. Deal with Calm Minders will be definitely much easier if they cannot stay forever. Although, some bulky CM + Sub/Taunt will be viable, it's a really HUGE nerf and probably sufficient to balanced CM. It basically allows the existence of setup like Keldeo, Tapu Fini, Suicune, Magearna, etc and maybe Regen (counted as recovery?) Calm Minders. I think that's also something we might think about considering complex ban should not necessary be prohibed.

I'll leave it at that. If I managed to drastically reduce my time on PS I also have to reduce even more my time dedicated to mon (I have absolutely no time to make this kind of text wall LOL). This post will thus be the last one where I talk about CM in Camomons and probably my last post in this thread. My will will be taken up by The Number Man, tier leader involved for the tier, amazing player and pokefriend. I hope Camomons will have again the opportunity to shine!

Do not hesisate to follow the NatDex Camotour in the Camo Discord where you will find me before my new (and last hopefully) attempt to quit Smogon and PS. And don't worry, we do not plan to ban CM from NatDex Camo :psysly:

Shoutouts to Euphonos for his involment for the meta up to now. You're amazing man and we definitely don't deserve everthing you do for the meta and its playerbase. Take care of you, such involvment for, unfortunaly, disappointing results sometimes can end up getting burned.

Magnezone Psyspam::dragapult: :tapu-lele: :magnezone: :necrozma: :landorus-therian: :blissey:
Double CM fat: :necrozma: :coalossal: :rillaboom: :toxapex: :dragapult: :sigilyph:
Double setup fat: :snorlax: :rillaboom: :coalossal: :salamence: :clefable: :noivern:
Sun: :torkoal: :venusaur: :cinderace: :slowking: :salamence: :necrozma:

Thanks for your reading, wish you all the best! :heart:
 

Attachments

Last edited:
Newly minted co-leader THE The the (the) T H E [number man] TNM here to announce a large tiering decision. After discussing this matter with OM leadership, we got the green light to proceed with a Calm Mind ban. I'm not gonna go in depth about why CM was banned - anyone keeping up to date on Camo matters knows what the issue is. For those that don't, both Siamato and a loser have written a bunch of quality posts on the topic (1,2,3 / 1,2).

With that said, Calm Mind is now banned from the Camomons metagame. Additionally, the council decided to vote on certain mons that we felt CM pushed over the edge into broken territory - Lati@s, Glowking, Reuniclus. We will be monitoring deez mons in order to see their impact on the post-CM metagame, so you might see further changes down the road.

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EDIT: Also thanks to loser for his contributions, and also welcome Mossy Sandwich to the council!
 
Camomons typing compendium

Typing​
Viable moves*​
Explosion, Boomburst, Double Edge, Hyper Voice, Body Slam, Tri Attack
Recover, Soft Boiled, Wish, Slack Off, Rapid Spin, Heal Bell, Substitute
Close Combat, Superpower, Focus Blast, Aurasphere, Body Press, Drain Punch, Brick Break
Seismic Toss, Bulk Up
Brave Bird, Hurricane, Dual Wingbeat, Air Slash, Acrobatics
Roost, Defog
Gunk Shot, Sludge Wave, Sludge Bomb, Poison Jab
Toxic, Toxic Spikes
Earthquake, High Horsepower, Earth Power, Thousand Arrows, Drill Run
Spikes
Stone Edge, Meteor Beam, Power Gem, Head Smash, Rock Slide
Rock Polish
Megahorn, Bug Buzz, Leech Life, U-Turn, X-Scizzor
Sticky Web, Infestation, Quiver Dance
Poltergeist, Shadow Ball, Shadow Claw, Hex
Night Shade
Double Iron Bash, Iron Tail, Iron Head, Flash Cannon, Bullet Punch
Iron Defense, Autotomize, Shift Gear
Flare Blitz, Pyroball, Fire Blast, Magma Storm, Heat Wave, Flamethrower, Eruption, Blaze Kick, Lava Plume, Mystical Fire
Will-O-Wisp
Hydro Pump, Surf, Aqua Tail, Liquidation, Waterfall, Scald, Flip Turn, Steam Eruption, Surging Strikes
Whirlpool
Wood Hammer, Power Whip, Energy Ball, Giga Drain, Grassy Glide, Leaf Blade, Seed Bomb, Grass Knot
Leech Seed, Synthesis, Sleep Power, Spore, Stun Spore, Aromatherapy
Bolt Strike, Thunderbolt, Discharge, Volt Switch, Bolt Beak, Wild Charge, Thunder Punch
Thunder Wave
Future Sight, Psychic, Psychic Fangs, Zen Headbutt, Psyshock, Stored Power
Reflect, Light Screen, Teleport, Trick, Healing Wish
Triple Axel, Ice Beam, Icicle Crash, Ice Punch, Freeze Dry
Aurora Veil
Draco Meteor, Dragon Darts, Scale Shot, Dragon Pulse, Outrage, Dragon Claw
Dragon Tail, Dragon Dance
Dark Pulse, Crunch, Knock Off, Wicked Blow, Darkest Lariat
Knock Off, Nasty Plot, Taunt
Moonblast, Play Rough, Dazzling Gleam, Draining Kiss
Moonlight

*The viability of the move is estimated taking into account both the overall viability of the move but also the viability of its users.
** It's possible to play other moves to get the typing you want but you really need good justification to do so because bad moves with a good typing often end up to an overall bad mon.

Offensive
Typing​
Easy to get?​
Examples*​
YES​
:alakazam::slowbro::latios::lycanroc-dusk:
YES​
:tyranitar::hippowdon::tyrantrum::lycanroc-dusk:
YES​
:heracross::garchomp::weavile::noivern::dragapult:
MID​
:latios::porygon-z:
MID​
:garchomp::hippowdon::necrozma:
MID​
:arcanine::noivern::kommo-o:
NO​
:nidoking::mamoswine:
NO​
:ninetales:
NO​
:celebi::lycanroc-dusk:
NO​
:lycanroc-dusk::azelf:
NO​
:alakazam::magearna:

Defensive
Typing​
Easy to get?​
Pairs well with​
Examples*​
YES​
/
/
/
/
/
/...
:slowking::salamence::garchomp::coalossal:
YES​
/
/
/
/
/
/...
:scizor::salamence::volcanion::buzzwole::corviknight:
YES​
/
/
/
/
/
/...
:heatran::melmetal::volcanion:
YES​
/
/
/
/...
:landorus-therian::corviknight:
YES​
/
/
/...
:salamence::vespiquen::mandibuzz::buzzwole:
MID​
/
/
/
/...
:porygon2::blissey::noivern:
MID​
/
/
/
/
/
/...
:slowking::latias::dragapult:
MID​
/
/
/
/
/...
:reuniclus::dhelmise::magearna:
MID​
/
/
/
/
/...
:salamence::buzzwole:
NO​
/
/
/
/...
:cresselia:
NO​
/
/
/
/
/
/...
:jirachi::magearna:
NO​
/
/
/
/
/
/...
:necrozma:
NO​
/
/
/
/
/
/...
:clefable:

Good overall

Typing​
Easy to get?​
Pairs well with (defensively)​
Examples*​
YES​
/
/
/
/
/
/...
:garchomp::tangrowth::thundurus::toxapex:
YES​
/
/
/
/
/...
:slowking-galar::garchomp::toxapex:
YES​
/
/
/
/
/
/...
:moltres::salamence::landorus-therian::volcanion:
YES​
/
/
/
/
/
/...
:skarmory::landorus-therian::hawlucha::buzzwole::corviknight::zarude:
YES​
/
/
/
/
/...
:salamence::latios::garchomp::dragapult:
YES​
/
/
/
/
/
/...
:clefable::latias::azelf::victini:
MID​
/
/
/
/
/...
:zapdos::buzzwole:
MID​
/
/
/
/
/...
:clefable::jirachi::magearna:
MID​
/
/
/
/
/
/...
:salamence::latios::dragapult:
MID​
/
/
/
/
/
/...
:latias::garchomp::buzzwole:
MID​
/
/
/
/
/...
:slowbro::haxorus::buzzwole:
MID​
/
/
/
/
/
/...
:slowbro::slowking-galar::dragapult:
MID​
/
/
/
/
/...
:latios::porygon-z::dragapult:
NO​
/
/
/
/
/
/...
:starmie::tapu-fini:
NO​
/
/
/
/
/
/...
:salamence::pelipper:
NO​
/
/
/...
:slowbro::latios::magearna:
NO​
/
/
/
/
/
/...
:clefable::azelf:
NO​
/
/
/
/...
:latias::latios::dragapult:

* Viable (or close at least) mons that can effectively get the typing.
 
Camomons Role Compendium
[last updated March 6th, 2022]
1. Utility

Entry Hazards:
Spikes::Skarmory::Ferrothorn::coalossal:

Niche::heracross::scolipede::diggersby:
Toxic Spikes::Toxapex:
Niche::weezing-galar::vespiquen::scolipede::Nihilego:
Stealth Rock::clefable::Blissey::Skarmory::tyranitar::torkoal::Garchomp::Heatran::Hippowdon::rhyperior::Ferrothorn::Landorus-Therian::kommo-o::necrozma::coalossal:
Niche: :nidoking::corsola-galar::chansey::miltank::jirachi::uxie::azelf::seismitoad: :cobalion::terrakion::lycanroc-dusk::mudsdale::nihilego::stakataka:
Sticky Web::Ribombee::Shuckle::slurpuff:
Niche::galvantula::vikavolt::araquanid:

Hazard Control
Defog::zapdos::moltres::skarmory::pelipper::salamence::latias::latios::rotom-wash::landorus-therian::volcanion::Corviknight:

Niche::weezing-galar::articuno::togekiss::mandibuzz::conkeldurr::noivern::tapu fini:
Rapid Spin::torkoal::Excadrill::coalossal:
Niche::starmie::Avalugg::Dhelmise::Regieleki:
Court-Change::cinderace:

Clerics
Heal Bell / Aromatherapy::clefable::Blissey:

Niche::vaporeon::articuno::Celebi::audino:
Lunar Dance::Cresselia:
Healing Wish::Hatterene::Latias::jirachi:

Wish::clefable::Blissey::latias::Vaporeon:
Niche::salamence::jirachi::audino:

Item Removal
Knock Off:

Defensive::clefable::tangrowth::Ferrothorn::reuniclus::Landorus-Therian::Toxapex::necrozma:
Offensive::heracross::blaziken::crawdaunt::weavile::Azelf::Bisharp::conkeldurr::rillaboom:
Niche: :alakazam::marowak-alola::uxie::audino::seismitoad::mandibuzz::incineroar:
Trick / Switcheroo::clefable::jirachi::latias::latios::porygon-z::rotom-wash::cresselia::victini::noivern::Tapu Fini::magearna:
Niche::Alakazam::Azelf::darmanitan::chandelure::Dhelmise:

Hyper offense tools
Screener::ninetales-alola::tapu-koko::grimmsnarl::regieleki:

Niche::azelf::klefki::dragapult:
Suicide lead::azelf::landorus-therian::slurpuff::ribombee::lycanroc-dusk::regieleki:
Niche::cobalion::aerodactyl:

2. Offensive roles

Wallbreakers

Physical::marowak-alola::scizor::heracross::blaziken::salamence::garchomp::lucario::weavile::victini::darmanitan::hawlucha::zygarde-10%::lycanroc-dusk::melmetal::rillaboom::cinderace::barraskewda::dracozolt::dragapult::urshifu:(both)
Niche::gyarados::zapdos-galar::azumarill::tyranitar::mamoswine::azelf::excadrill::scolipede::conkeldurr::bisharp::terrakion::landorus-therian::aegislash::dhelmise::stakataka::glastrier:
Special::alakazam::slowking-galar::celebi::latios::porygon-z::Heatran::noivern::tapu-lele::magearna::dragapult:
Niche::nidoking::kingdra::togekiss::thundurus::thundurus-therian::keldeo::clawitzer::volcanion::tapu-koko::tapu-fini::xurkitree::toxtricity:

Choice Item Users
Choice Band::weavile::victini::haxorus::Zygarde-10%::rillaboom::Cinderace::barraskewda::urshifu:(both)
Niche::scizor::entei::tyranitar::mamoswine::azelf::lycanroc-dusk::Dhelmise::tapu-koko::melmetal::dragapult:
Choice Specs::Latios::porygon-z::noivern::Tapu Lele::magearna::dragapult:
Niche::kingdra::azelf::Heatran::chandelure::clawitzer::volcanion::xurkitree::toxtricity:

Setup Sweepers
Belly Drum::Kommo-o:
Niche::poliwrath::slowbro-galar:
Bulk Up::buzzwole:
Niche::scrafty::cinderace::corviknight::urshifu:(both):zarude:
Calm Mind::clefable::slowking-galar::Latias::Latios::cresselia::Tapu Lele::Necrozma::magearna:[CALM MIND IS BANNED FROM GEN8CAMOMONS]
Niche::slowbro::slowking::suicune::sigilyph::keldeo::Tapu Fini::Hatterene:
Dragon Dance::gyarados::Salamence::haxorus::dragapult:
Niche::tyrantrum::Kommo-o:
Growth::Venusaur:
Howl::arcanine::entei:
Nasty Plot::Alakazam::slowking-galar::celebi::porygon-z::Azelf:

Niche::Togekiss::rotom-wash::zoroark::thundurus::thundurus-therian:
Shell Smash::barbaracle::cloyster:
Niche::Polteageist:
Swords Dance::scizor::heracross::blaziken::weavile::Garchomp::lucario::haxorus::hawlucha::lycanroc-dusk::rillaboom:
Niche::Marowak-Alola::rhyperior::scolipede::Bisharp::Terrakion::Landorus-Therian::aegislash::mimikyu::drednaw:

Speed control

Aqua Jet::Barraskewda:
Niche::azumarill::urshifu-rapid-strike:
Bullet Punch::Scizor:
Grassy Glide: :rillaboom:
Extreme Speed::Arcanine::Entei::Lucario:

Niche::Pikachu::regieleki:
Ice Shard::Mamoswine::weavile:
Mach Punch::Conkeldurr:
Triage::comfey:

Choice Scarf::latias::latios::victini::tapu fini:
Niche::ditto::zapdos-galar::jirachi::garchomp::togekiss::porygon-z::rotom-wash::cresselia::darmanitan::landorus-therian::tapu-lele::xurkitree::magearna::cinderace::dragapult::urshifu:(both)

3. Defensive roles

Walls
Physically defensive::slowbro::zapdos::moltres::skarmory::salamence::tangrowth::ferrothorn::landorus-therian::toxapex::kommo-o::tapu fini::buzzwole::necrozma::corviknight::coalossal:
Niche::arcanine::scizor::corsola-galar::miltank::vespiquen::hippowdon::rotom-wash::cresselia::avalugg:
Specially defensive::blissey::slowking::slowking-galar::latias::heatran::ferrothorn::reuniclus::toxapex::tapu-fini:
Niche::chansey::snorlax::articuno::mantine::porygon2::jirachi::hippowdon::mandibuzz:
Mixed::clefable::slowking-galar::latias::heatran::Ferrothorn::volcanion::toxapex::Tapu Fini::necrozma::corviknight::coalossal:
Niche::chansey::starmie::vaporeon::corsola-galar::cradily::porygon2::gastrodon::hippowdon::uxie::cresselia::jellicent::mandibuzz:

4. Pivots

Pivot offensif::Azelf::Landorus-Therian::victini::noivern::Tapu Koko::magearna::rillaboom::cinderace::Barraskewda::dragapult::urshifu:(both)
Niche: :Zapdos-Galar::scizor::jirachi::porygon-z::darmanitan::inteleon::regieleki:
Pivot défensifs::clefable::Slowbro::blissey::zapdos::moltres::slowking::pelipper::Landorus-Therian::corviknight:
Niche::chansey::vaporeon::articuno::porygon2::Scizor::Jirachi::vespiquen::rotom-wash::uxie::mandibuzz::vikavolt:


5. Weather, terrain and Trick Room

Weather
Rain setter::politoed::pelipper:

Rain abusers::poliwrath::kabutops::zapdos::kingdra::latios::beartic::thundurus::thundurus-therian::keldeo::volcanion::inteleon::drednaw::barraskewda::dragapult::urshifu-rapid-strike:(RS)
Rain utility: :zapdos::corsola-galar::latias::jirachi::ferrothorn::corviknight:
Sun setter::torkoal:
Sun abusers::venusaur::charizard::entei::shiftry::heatran::victini::darmanitan::heliolisk::volcanion::cinderace::zarude:
Sun utility::slowking::latias::heatran::kommo-o::necrozma::coalossal:
Sand setter::tyranitar::hippowdon:
Sand abusers::garchomp::stoutland::excadrill::celesteela::dracozolt:
Sand utility:clefable::slowbro::slowking::zapdos::heatran::ferrothorn::coalossal:
Hail setter::ninetales-alola:
Hail abusers::sandslash-alola::scizor::blaziken::garchomp::porygon-z::beartic::bisharp::thundurus::thundurus-therian::lycanroc-dusk::arctozolt::arctovish:
Hail utility:clefable::slowbro::slowking::zapdos::heatran::landorus-therian:

Terrain
Grassy terrain setter::rillaboom::tapu-bulu:

Grassy terrain abusers::sceptile::heatran::hawlucha::dhelmise::sirfetchd::zarude:
Electric terrain setter::tapu-koko:
Electric terrain abusers::raichu-alola::sceptile::thundurus::thundurus-therian::hawlucha::xurkitree::regieleki:
Psychic terrain setter::tapu-lele:
Electric terrain abuser::alakazam::starmie::celebi::sceptile::azelf::hawlucha::blacephalon:

Trick Room
Trick Room setter::slowbro::porygon2::uxie::cresselia::magearna::stakataka::hatterene:

Niche::victini::reuniclus::diancie::runerigus:
Trick Room abuser::marowak-alola::crawdaunt::conkeldurr::melmetal:
Niche::beheeyem::aegislash::dragalge::clawitzer::dhelmise::stakataka::hatterene::sirfetchd::copperajah::glastrier:
 
:rillaboom: CAMOMONS NEWS :rillaboom:

Hello everybody! Newly appointed council (after a thousand requests from The Number Man and a betrayal from Osake :blobtriumph:), I come back (retired but Camomons) as your humble servitor to inform you about what is planned until the end of the gen.

After a long frozen period for Camomons without tour and ladder, the Spotlight Trios tour finally gives Camomons a chance to come out of the shadows! It was an opportunnity for Camomons to be explored by players and give us a more accurate picture of the state of the metagame since the last tiering actions (ban CM and free Lati@s, Reuniclus and Slowking-Galar).

If I personally enjoyed watching Camomons games and found the meta to be fun and balanced, what's about you?

In order to get some feedback from the Camomons community and, to a large extend, from the OMs community having followed Camomons games, we propose to you to complete this survey (click below)!

It will be greatly appreciated if you manage to find the time to answer our questions. The council thanks you in advance for that!
You will find questions about:

- The state of the metagame (enjoyment and competitiveness)
- Feedback on the last tiering action (ban CM and free Lati@s, Reuniclus and Slowking-Galar)
- Toughts on some threats (help us to take or not tiering actions against one or another mon)
- Thoughs on resources (VRs, Speed Tiers, Role Compendium, Typing Compendium)
- Thoughts on activity (interested by a tournament, will play Camo if the ladder comes back, etc)

And, of course, we will come back to you later to discuss the results!

Players that participated as Camomons slot during the Spotlight Trios are particularly invited to answer as well as sharing more detailed thoughts on this thread!

:garchomp:CAMOMONS SAMPLES SUBMISSION:garchomp:
With the end of the Spotlight Trios, we're interested in new sample teams to help beginners to start Camomons! If you have teams that you expect to be good, do not hesitate to share them with some brief explications to understand better how the team works and what was the idea behind its building!


We will come back soon with the stats of the Spotlight Trios, the results of the survey and the VRs changes so stay tuned!
 
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