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Azumarill @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Huge Power
Tera Type: Water / Fairy
EVs: 92 HP / 252 Atk / 164 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Tickle
- Belly Drum
- Liquidation / Play Rough
- Mud Slap / Helping Hand / Chilling Water
I see Liquidation sets being more consistent than Play Rough due to the accuracy and potential Defense drop, but it's an option if you want slightly more power. Speed is for neutral Samurott.
If you're gonna run any sort of Belly Drummer, please use BD AFTER the stat-reset turn. Time is better spent Tickling (lol) tbh
I have a question about the Azumarill set.
Whilst the Azumarill can wall off most of Samurott's attacks, it doesn't have any Super-Effective attacks against Samurott, so I'm not sure on how much damage it can deal against Samurott.
Would it be better to run a Azumarill support set?
Azumarill @ Leftovers
Level: 100
Impish Nature
Ability: Sap Sipper
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def
- Chilling Water
- Tickle
- Amnesia
- Charm
I have a question about the Azumarill set.
Whilst the Azumarill can wall off most of Samurott's attacks, it doesn't have any Super-Effective attacks against Samurott, so I'm not sure on how much damage it can deal against Samurott.
Would it be better to run a Azumarill support set?
Azumarill @ Leftovers
Level: 100
Impish Nature
Ability: Sap Sipper
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def
- Chilling Water
- Tickle
- Amnesia
- Charm
I think a support set would work fine (although I don't think you'd want all four moveslots taken up with stat-changing moves), but having super-effective attacks isn't as important as you might think. Generally, the only Pokemon that can even come close to the Turn 2 damage output of a Belly Drum booster or a Steely Spirit core are Pokemon with access to Nasty Plot or Swords Dance and a super-effective STAB move. Unfortunately, Fire- and Rock-types are probably going to be a very bad idea here and Flying-types rarely have the right combination of quick setup capabilities, a powerful and reliable STAB move, and good enough stats to compete. Your Gyarados set exemplifies this problem, since it has to wait several turns before it even has access to a Flying attack.
If Samurott sets up Rain Dance immediately to neutralise its Fire weakness then certain Flying Pokemon with Hurricane could maybe be a decent option, but Rain would also boost Azumarill's Liquidation even further, likely making it the stronger option regardless.
Are you and a couple others proposing fire types forgetting this is a WATER type pokemon that's very likely to have either rain or sword dance (or both) boosted water stabs?
A bit, but that doesn't quite serve any purpose other than being a fast chilling water spammer with mediocre bulk. Also why Tera Grass and Tera Blast exactly?
A bit, but that doesn't quite serve any purpose other than being a fast chilling water spammer with mediocre bulk. Also why Tera Grass and Tera Blast exactly?
The main deal with 7 stars so far is that you don't just "ha ha click supereffective" like you do on regular raids.
They have significantly higher HP (30x the base), are lvl 100 compared to lvl 75 (which means, significantly higher stats), and generally will have strong setup moves or some kind of gimmick you have to account for.
Es the most recent one, Decidueye, would cast Sword Dance eventually then start attacking twice per turn (regular attack followed by Air Cutter), and also packed Feather Dance to nullify phisical attackers, so you had to have someone who could clear the buff in the raid while having strong special attackers who could take a hit and nuke back.
Which resulted in the Bellibolt + Miraidon combo, with Bellibolt acting as supporter and Miraidons setting up for a 2-3 turn nuke while being able to resist leaf blade and air cutter.
In this case, being bulky and able to at very least resist Water and the inevitable Megahorn seems like a given to even think to not istadie to this raid.
The main deal with 7 stars so far is that you don't just "ha ha click supereffective" like you do on regular raids.
They have significantly higher HP (30x the base), are lvl 100 compared to lvl 75 (which means, significantly higher stats), and generally will have strong setup moves or some kind of gimmick you have to account for.
Es the most recent one, Decidueye, would cast Sword Dance eventually then start attacking twice per turn (regular attack followed by Air Cutter), and also packed Feather Dance to nullify phisical attackers, so you had to have someone who could clear the buff in the raid while having strong special attackers who could take a hit and nuke back.
Which resulted in the Bellibolt + Miraidon combo, with Bellibolt acting as supporter and Miraidons setting up for a 2-3 turn nuke while being able to resist leaf blade and air cutter.
In this case, being bulky and able to at very least resist Water and the inevitable Megahorn seems like a given to even think to not istadie to this raid.
Dragon Dance + Tera Blast can make Gyarados a threatening pokemon. Intimidate is used to weaken Samurott's physical attack, whilst Sharp Beak is used to boost Gyarados's flying moves. Alternatively, Shell Bell can be used to heal the pokemon whenever it launches a powerful attack. Taunt is used to stop Samurott from setting up Swords Dance. Yache Berry can be also used to weaken Samurott's Ice attacks.
The fourth move is up to the player. Chilling Water can be used to weaken Samurott's attack further, whilst Sunny Day can be used to weaken all water attacks. Keep in mind that Gyarados will lose its water resistance when Tera into Flying, and Samurott's water attacks can be used to overwhelm Gyarados.
Arcanine @ Heavy-Duty Boots (MEME)
Level: 100
Impish Nature
Tera Type: Water
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpD / 4 Def
- Will-O-Wisp
- Snarl
- Sunny Day
- Helping Hand
This is more of a meme support set (not to be taken seriously). However, it can be useful in certain circumstances. Intimidate is used to lower the Samurott's physical attack, combined with Will-O-Wisp. Snarl can be used to weaken Samurott's special attack. Sunny Day can be used to weaken Samurott's water attacks whilst Helping Hand can be used to boost offensive mons like Gyarados.
Have you heard of lord and savior Tauros-Paldea which actually also packs Chilling Water as well as Curse and Rock coverage in case it wants to go on offensive
Edit: it just clicked to me, that while I was thinking of what kind of gimmick they can go with, this run they could go for turn 0 Focus Energy with Night Slash / Aqua Cutter / Sacred Sword and even Slash in the moveset.
I did get the gimmick right on Greninja as far as trolling went, I would be scared if i get this thing right lol
"So I heard you wanted to debuff me, though life sirs" monkaS
Have you heard of lord and savior Tauros-Paldea which actually also packs Chilling Water as well as Curse and Rock coverage in case it wants to go on offensive
Edit: it just clicked to me, that while I was thinking of what kind of gimmick they can go with, this run they could go for turn 0 Focus Energy with Night Slash / Aqua Cutter / Sacred Sword and even Slash in the moveset.
I did get the gimmick right on Greninja as far as trolling went, I would be scared if i get this thing right lol
"So I heard you wanted to debuff me, though life sirs" monkaS
I’m preparing to see a lot of Koraidon with Flare Blitz. Koraidon wouldn’t actually be a bad choice if it got a better physical fire move though.
from this thread/twitter/Reddit I think the consensus is support Azu, offensive Cloyster, potentially offensive Corviknight. But none of them seem to have natural offensive pressure.
also its gimmick is more than likely going to be critical hit focused to avoid defensive boosts. this is probably going to be a slog due to the awkward typing/coverage
I will, because odds are if they're throwing Koraidon they're not going to think to use Boosts and just want Big Brrrrr. I had a Tera Grass Blissey the other day led by a Flare Blitz Koraidon (you can guess how that goes with HP scaling). We barely one because this thing KOing itself got longer cooldowns so it couldn't KEEP killing itself, but the lesson Iearned from this and Decidueye is no amount of players who pick the dragons, even when they're theoretically strong for the raid, know what they're actually doing with them
That's what this post is for :P
So far we're just theorycrafting, most likely Clodsire and Gastrodon are going to be top tier supporters
Cloyster seems very promising *if the boss doesn't pack Grass Knot* as both supporter and setup win condition
The quad-steel combo (3x Persserker + X) could be strong if it doesn't pack Drill Run or too strong water attacks
However speaking of intimidaters...
Have you heard of lord and savior Tauros-Paldea which actually also packs Chilling Water as well as Curse and Rock coverage in case it wants to go on offensive
Idk if you saw my calc on the other page, but I tested Grass Knot vs Cloyster and if you're max SpDef, Light Screen + Defense Cheer makes GK do pathetic damage lol, especially if you pair it with Leftovers + Aqua Ring. Just invest one Speed EV to always outspeed Samurott, since you're the same base speed as it (70).:
0 SpA Samurott Grass Knot (100 BP) vs. +1 252 HP / 252+ SpD Cloyster through Light Screen: 59-70 (19.4 - 23%) -- possible 6HKO after Leftovers recovery
You'll also want Bulk Up over Curse on Tauros.
I've also been thinking about a couple of the Friend Guard Pokemon:
Vivillon @ Leftovers
Ability: Friend Guard
Tera Type: Bug / Flying
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD or 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpDef
Bold / Calm Nature
- Iron Defense
- Pollen Puff
- Struggle Bug / Quiver Dance
- Light Screen / Hurricane / Air Slash
Through Spewpa, Vivillon gets access to Iron Defense, letting it withstand Samurott's physical moves. Thankfully, Samurott doesn't have any Rock-type moves in its movepool. If it has Ice Beam or other strong Special Attacks like Hydro Pump, Light Screen will help you and your team, as well as Struggle Bug and Friend Guard for your allies. If no Special Attacks, could probably sub SB and LS out for QD and either Hurricane or Air Slash to go on the offensive and provide shield chip. Pollen Puff helps any of your teammates that are at very low health. Wish this got Roost, though.
Jigglypuff @ Eviolite
Ability: Friend Guard
Tera Type: No lol
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpD or 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
- Wish
- Any of Chilling Water / Fake Tears / Both Screens / Defense Curl / Taunt / Sunny Day / Charm / Helping Hand / Heal Pulse
This one's funny af. While it has abysmal stats, it has a massive HP stat to compensate, which means Eviolite + defensive investment can go a long way in letting it shrug off powerful hits.
0+ Atk Samurott Liquidation vs. 4 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Jigglypuff: 105-124 (28.2 - 33.3%) -- 0% chance to 3HKO
0+ Atk Samurott Liquidation vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Jigglypuff: 105-124 (24.1 - 28.5%) -- 98.2% chance to 4HKO
0 SpA Samurott Hydro Pump vs. 4 HP / 252 SpD Eviolite Jigglypuff: 135-159 (36.2 - 42.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
And those calcs are before any of the support moves listed above or Defense cheers. It has Wish to heal itself throughout the match, which makes it imo the one required option for sustain. Its support movepool is nuts, though. Can be a CW spammer, set up both screens, Fake Tears support, Heal Pulse for ally recovery, Sunny Day to weaken Water moves, Taunt to stop Samurott setup, Charm or Defense curl to further neuter Samurott's damage output, you name it, Jigglypuff likely does it.
That being said, Jigglypuff has the massive drawback of being hella passive and can't do meaningful damage at all. Plus, I can imagine randoms will back out after seeing poor Jiggly :^(
Scream Tail's another option that can do anything Jigglypuff can while looking more attractive to randoms, being bulkier overall, and holding an item like Leftovers. You just miss out on Friend Guard, but Sunny Day + Protosynthesis boosting a defense stat could be a neat tech.
Idk if you saw my calc on the other page, but I tested Grass Knot vs Cloyster and if you're max SpDef, Light Screen + Defense Cheer makes GK do pathetic damage lol, especially if you pair it with Leftovers + Aqua Ring. Just invest one Speed EV to always outspeed Samurott, since you're the same base speed as it (70).:
0 SpA Samurott Grass Knot (100 BP) vs. +1 252 HP / 252+ SpD Cloyster through Light Screen: 59-70 (19.4 - 23%) -- possible 6HKO after Leftovers recovery
I did, however this does require hefty investment, Light Screen, and assuming it's not +Spa, which is a lot of assumptions to make. For comparison, Sacred Sword already barely tickles without investment, so I kinda dread Grass Knot way more.
Do we actually know if Friend Guard even works in raids? There's some wonky interactions with "party wide" stuff, like I still don't even understand if the Ruin abilities affect the party or not....
I did, however this does require hefty investment, Light Screen, and assuming it's not +Spa, which is a lot of assumptions to make. For comparison, Sacred Sword already barely tickles without investment, so I kinda dread Grass Knot way more.
I somehow completely missed it gets it
Do we actually know if Friend Guard even works in raids? There's some wonky interactions with "party wide" stuff, like I still don't even understand if the Ruin abilities affect the party or not....
Main concern is that Vaporeon has to be able to get the 3 attacks to Tera in before it would have the Fire damage, plus needs a way to Boost itself, which overall makes it very slow as an attacker. Standard Chilling Water and then stuff like Wish might make it a decent Support option.
That's what I was thinking. Plus, before I made my post, I was looking around about it and people on Reddit were still posting about Friend Guard strats since at least a month ago.
Been further thinking about Sunny Day Protosynthesis Scream Tail as a possible option since my last post and here's something I cooked:
Scream Tail @ Leftovers
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
- Sunny Day
- Fake Tears / Calm Mind
- Wish
- Flamethrower / Fire Blast
Sun does two things for you; boosts your physical Defense even further, and gives a 1.5x boost to your Fire-type attack. Wish gives you semi-reliable recovery.
0+ Atk Tera Bug Samurott Megahorn vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Protosynthesis Scream Tail: 79-94 (18.2 - 21.6%) -- possible 7HKO after Leftovers recovery
While Tera Fire seems very counter-intuitive against Samurott, keep in mind that the Sun is up and Scream Tail is extra chonky. Water moves and STAB Megahorn just bounce off:
0 SpA Tera Bug Samurott Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Tera Fire Scream Tail in Sun: 110-132 (25.3 - 30.4%) -- 0.3% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
0+ Atk Tera Bug Samurott Liquidation vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Protosynthesis Tera Fire Scream Tail in Sun: 54-66 (12.4 - 15.2%) -- possibly the worst move ever
+2 0+ Atk Tera Bug Samurott Liquidation vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Protosynthesis Tera Fire Scream Tail in Sun: 110-132 (25.3 - 30.4%) -- 0.3% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
0+ Atk Tera Bug Samurott Megahorn vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Protosynthesis Tera Fire Scream Tail: 39-47 (8.9 - 10.8%) -- possibly the worst move ever
If it ends up having Hydro Pump as its main water STAB, you could opt for Calm Mind over Fake Tears. You still wanna go full PhysDef for solid overall bulk, though.
The aim with this set isn't to be the main damage dealer, as the Sun is mainly here to help your teammates withstand Water STAB better, but at least you can provide shield chip w/ SE Tera Fire moves.
I will, because odds are if they're throwing Koraidon they're not going to think to use Boosts and just want Big Brrrrr. I had a Tera Grass Blissey the other day led by a Flare Blitz Koraidon (you can guess how that goes with HP scaling). We barely one because this thing KOing itself got longer cooldowns so it couldn't KEEP killing itself, but the lesson Iearned from this and Decidueye is no amount of players who pick the dragons, even when they're theoretically strong for the raid, know what they're actually doing with them
by the way shoutouts to this INSANE trio of iron hands I grabbed for a Psychic Blissey where somehow between the three of them none of them thought to just use. Thunder Punch? Which would do neutral, stab-boosted damage and probably do more than:
-THUNDER
-Giga Impact
-Drain Punch
Which of these three started spamming after doing belly drum. yes even the Thunder user.
While I was using Ting-Lu!
The ability of your generic pokemon player to have absolutely no clue of what they are doing is not to be underestimated.
After all, this is a game for kids, played by a lot of kids.
The ability of your generic pokemon player to have absolutely no clue of what they are doing is not to be underestimated.
After all, this is a game for kids, played by a lot of kids.
Well er yeah when I said solo, I did mean solo by yourself, with AI. Are rewards better online or something? Cos for most raids I’ve been in (with a few exceptions) just playing alone is much easier.
Well er yeah when I said solo, I did mean solo by yourself, with AI. Are rewards better online or something? Cos for most raids I’ve been in (with a few exceptions) just playing alone is much easier.
Afaik there's slightly better rewards for the host.
Other than that, really the only benefit of playing online is not needing to have to reset the clock to respawn raids and not having to constantly fly around to start them.
Well er yeah when I said solo, I did mean solo by yourself, with AI. Are rewards better online or something? Cos for most raids I’ve been in (with a few exceptions) just playing alone is much easier.
I hunt online for 6*'s without having to reroll my raids with clock jumping, plus I can watch for version exclusives I want like Dragapult. Also saves constant laps looking for 5*'s with lesser rewards.
Pro-Tip, if you're hosting raids instead of joining them, build Supports because randos almost invariably bring DPS and don't understand that they need to not die too.
That's honestly my big issue with the raid system in general, there's no way to kick or remove players who are bringing unfavorable Pokemon (which I guess is because they don't want to encourage griefing or upsetting kids), but then the game punishes you for other people using those sandbags, meaning the optimal play is to kill the room and kick out any potentially helpful teammates anyway. Maybe if the system was individual timers and your own running out excluded you from fighting the boss further or capturing it, because I've seen not only bad players, but griefers running stuff like Memento/Steel Beam Gholdengo to kill themselves and end the raid in a loss faster (or at least trying to)
