Metagame AG Metagame Discussion



Offensive
Eternatus-Eternamax @ Power Herb / Black Sludge
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dynamax Cannon / Sludge Bomb
- Flamethrower
- Meteor Beam
- Recover

With Eternatus now having the massive added bulk it can afford to get off multiple Meteor Beams and boosts its Special Attack to insane levels.

Unkillable
Eternatus-Eternamax @ Power Herb / Black Sludge
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Meteor Beam
- Flamethrower
- Cosmic Power
- Recover

This is the good set. Cosmic Power allows Eternatus-E to fire off even more Meteor Beams and increase its Special Attack. Misses out on coverage but Rock-type has no immunities and it's not like anyone is killing you anyway especially at +6/+6. Unless you run into something like Protect Heatran you will be fine.

+6 252+ SpA Fairy Aura Xerneas Max Starfall vs. +6 248 HP / 0 SpD Eternatus-Eternamax: 138-163 (19.3 - 22.8%) -- possible 5HKO
+6 252 SpA Life Orb Mewtwo Max Mindstorm vs. +6 248 HP / 0 SpD Eternatus-Eternamax: 276-328 (38.6 - 45.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Jesus christ I forgot Cosmic Power existed on this thing. This is going to be hell to play around. GG meta

Also, with no species clause can't someone just spam Eternamax? I know this is AG but I somehow think that this might be a problem.

Geysers Eternamax ate all of your cookies so people are leaving. Sorry.
 

Amberr

Banned deucer.
Okay so, Instead of discussing ways to use eternamax, i'm gonna suggest solutions

Some will be viable, some Not,This will be a large post to i'll spoiler it.
Also i'm a galar player so you natdex players can find ur own solutions

Solution 1, Pressure Stall
Suicune,Giratina,Dialga, Dusclops.
Dusclops And Giratina especially can deal with eternamax as they have spite. Pressure+Protect+Sub can outstall eternamax and may be the most common solution, but you have to keep in mind that calyrex shadow and Zacian crowned are still going to be massive threats towards things which can deal with eternamax.

Solution 2, Scarf Magearna
Scarf Dmax Magearna can use heart swap to remove the boosts as eternamax often wont run enough speed to beat scarf 252 speed timid mage, maybe someone will come up with a good speed tier to hit to outspeed eternamax and potentially deal with it in the future

Solution 3, Bulky Zygarde C
This will be very similar to my next solution as they both will be running haze, but zygarde also has what is imo the best stab move in the game. It also would resist Flamethrower+Meteor beam. But zygarde is already a metagame staple so it would also be able to help with other threats

Solution 4, Haze
This one is obvious, use haze and just remove the boosts. But it's not foolproof as there is the potential of eternamax knocking out your haze mon before you are able to use haze

Solution 5, Taunt
think.
Taunt doesn't allow it to get insanely high defenses and removes the ability for it to heal, works best if you make sure to knock off it's black sludge first though.
I don't think i should have to explain any more then that.

Solution 6, Swoobat
Okay so this one seems pretty dumb but in this case, it might actually be useful
Calm mind+sub+spower+bpass/heat wave with unaware/simple
Unaware would allow you to not be affected by potential spatk boosts and allows you to ignore the spdef boosts, which more or less allows you to sub/cm to +6 and deal with it "easily". Heat wave hits zacian, ndm, and dark types for example, but bpass would allow you to get a +6 special attacker ie:yveltal, caly shadow, Your own eternamax, kyogre, kyuw, xern, and some others.

Solution 7, Your own eternamax.
Okay this one is obvious, just run offensive eternamax on quickpass or smth like everyone else is going to cmon why do I have to explain this one
Or like run bulky and pp stall it

Anyways what I can say is that the meta is about to change completely and some mons who used to not see much usage are about to get spotlight.
My dumbass wrote this before i knew it was an afd joke so im just gonna finish at 7 instead of writing all of my ideas idc if this list sucks its just the first things I thought of lmao
 
I don't normally post here, but the announcement lied - the Eternamax kickoff tournaments actually occurred weeks to months ago in Showdown's Tours Plaza room.

Tournament winners often had at least one OHKO move user on their team to keep Eternamax on its toes regardless of overflow:

:ss/lapras:
Lapras-Gmax @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Freeze-Dry / Horn Drill
- Sheer Cold / Horn Drill
- Rest
- Sleep Talk

:ss/groudon:
Groudon @ Leftovers
Ability: Drought
EVs: 252 HP / 28 Def / 228 SpD
Careful Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Precipice Blades
- Stone Edge
- Fissure

Calyrex-Shadow also doesn't need that many Nasty Plots to sweep Eternamax on both sides - 1 lets it deal significant damage if not 2HKO, 2 gets close to OHKOs, and 3 should get it into OHKO range. Pack your Mystical Fires, Eternamax users.

I also have the feeling that Eternamax will only be legal in AG for 1-2 days as an AFD joke. I also checked today's Serebii.net post and the Eternatus distribution mysteriously wasn't there. ;-)
 
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Eternatus-Eternamax @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Recover
- Dragon Tail
- Facade

feel like now that this mon is finally allowed, we can start messing around with the possible DD sets it can have. since this mon takes 42-50 to a LO pblade from groudon, didnt think there was a need to invest anything onto def and just go for attack. this mon does not get many solid physical attacks, but dtail seems like the most optimal, stopping opposing phazers (which we will inevitbaly see more of cause nothing kills this) and also facade for those annoying ho-ohs and etc.
 
Eternatus-E, while honestly quite passive, has a monstrous amount of bulk that leaves it almost impossible to KO through conventional means. It also possesses setup in Dragon Dance, (although has a pitiful physical movepool), cosmic power(honestly quite redundant given its bulk) and reliable recovery in recover. It also has utility in tspikes or even screens, and very importantly has dragon tail, which leaves it less vulnerable against many things.
Sample sets

Eternatus-Eternamax @ Shed Shell
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Dragon Tail
- Recover
- Toxic Spikes / Toxic
- Flamethrower / Sludge Bomb
Basic utility set, has an extreme amount of survivability, can deal with most offensive threats with dragon tail. Flamethrower has no immunities, but sludge bomb spreads poison and punishes fairy types. Shed shell keeps it from getting cheesed out by trapping.

Eternatus-Eternamax @ Black Sludge / Mental Herb / Dragon Fang
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 SpD
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Substitute / Recover
- Dragon Tail
- Poison Jab / Flamethrower

Attack boosting set, various ways of preventing the opponent from ending your sweep or increasing your damage/survivability are avail.

Note, these sets feature attack EVs because in this meta every etern should be max speed, lest you lose to the best mon in the tier, and with the way this things stats are distributed it gets way more out of attacking evs than defensive ones.

See an above post by Chloe for other usable set options.

Notable Pokemon
:sm/magearna:
Magearna @ Leftovers / Shed Shell
Ability: Soul-Heart
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Stored Power
- Calm Mind
- Draining Kiss
- Shift Gear
Calm Mind Magearna takes advantage of Eternatus's limited movepool and offensive stats with its exceptional typing and access to stored power, being unable to be phased by dragon tail, and beats opposing setup eternatus, due to how little it takes from flamethrower after boosts, and how slowly etern can raise its special attack with meteor beam. It can struggle setting up directly in front of a max special attack etern, but its incredibly hard for eternatus to stop mag after the ball starts rolling.

:sm/dugtrio:
Dugtrio is a very very very good partner for eternatus because it massively compliments it in terms of what needs to be removed, Magearna and protect tran are large thorns in eternatus's side, and dugtrio can run sets that remove other trappers like wob and goth. Scarf Dugtrio can also run fissure, a potential last ditch effort to remove an eternatus, this can be facilitated by clicking encore with another trapper though.

:sm/wobbuffet: :sm/Gothitelle:
no sets here its quite self explanatory, wobb has comparable hp to etern and can deal massive chunks to it with mirror coat, etern can never dragon tail unless it was already clicked, as encore will go first. Goth also has ways to screw over a variaty of etern sets, to a lesser extent than wobb though.

:sm/Bellossom:

Bellossom has access to ingrain and baton pass, which can be incredibly hard to set up in the AG tier but can be devastating when pulled off, enabling a large amount of STAB stored power setup sweepers to be unphasable, blowing past any etern set and many teams.

:sm/hippowdon: :sm/articuno: :sm/gastrodon: :sm/mew:
bulky OHKO move users can strike fear into the hearts of any non substitute etern, as they take advantage of its passivity to get many chances to claim kills. Do note that this can be especially unreliable due to pressure, rendering you with 4 or less chances to nab a KO on etern, although mind reader articuno and recycle leppa mew and try to circumvent this.

:sm/azumarill:

Azumarill @ Chesto Berry
Ability: Thick Fat
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Perish Song
- Whirlpool
- Protect
- Rest
This classic set has extra useful applications against etern lacking poison type moves, as a dragon immunity, a quad resist to fire, and protect for meteor beam can stonewall many sets, and kill them off one by one with perish song.




There are SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO many options to counter this pokemon, lots that i didnt mention, so get out there and be creative! thats what ag should be all about.

also yes i know theres a bug that makes etern invunerable on either the special or physical side, I chose to ignore it because goddamit i put time into this :)
 

Yubellia

Banned deucer.
Ye from my experience with playing SS Pure Hackmons and the eternamax stat overflow thing this thing can literally be a sponge to either physically or specially offensive attacks (ie: 252 HP and 240+ in either defensive stat iirc)

I really hope this is not a permanent form change cause dear lord that will make Galar AG even more centralized then it alrdy was...
 
Another question: does Eternamax always use Max Moves? No recover would be amazing for the rest of the tier, and it cant do Cosmic Power shenanigans either. On the other hand, Max Moves are still Max Moves, and it get to spam moves like Eternabeam and Meteor Beam without drawbacks. Not to mention Max Ooze just so happens to be the Max Move that boosts SpA...
 

Mbouchon

Pure Hackmons
is a Community Contributoris a Contributor Alumnus
Overflow will become a very, very centralizing force in the metagame, invalidating the likes of Xerneas, Groudon, Zekrom, Zacian-C, etc.

Eternatus-Eternamax @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 240 Def / 4 SpA / 12 SpD / 252 Spe
Bold Nature
- Dragon Tail
- Recover
- Flamethrower
- Sludge Bomb

This is a physically defensive set that will take 1~2 damage from moves targeting its Defense.

This can also be replicated specially, through investing with 240 EVs in Special Defense, and having a +SpD nature.

On another note, I think the introduction of Eternamax has made Calyrex-S even better than it would've been otherwise
 

ausma

imperfection is beautiful
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Eternatus-Eternamax @ Blunder Policy
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Toxic
- Toxic Spikes
- Dragon Tail
- Eternabeam

this is the best eternatus set in the game. here's the scoop
if you miss your dragon tail or toxic, you are now supa fast, and that means even faster eternabeams and toxic spikes and toxic and dragon tails! your dragon tails in particular will always go first. no switch ins either im just saying. eternabeam is also the strongest move in the game and is an obvious move to run!

sorry for breaking your tier guys
 
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eternatus-eternamax.gif


Thanks to the overflow mechanic detailed here, if Eternamax invests 240 EVs into a defensive stat of its choosing with a boosting nature, it will have either a Defense or Special Defense stat of 0, allowing it to take virtually nothing from any physical or special attack. This allows 2 Eternamax (1 physically defensive, 1 specially defensive) to form the best defensive core in the game, hard walling nearly every Pokemon. While it seems near impossible to beat, it does have a few shortcomings.

1. OHKO moves

lapras.gif
mew.gif


This one should be simple to understand: Eternamax's defensive stats don't protect it from getting blown back into its Poke Ball by an OHKO move. Lapras and Mew are the most common users I've seen due to their access to multiple OHKO moves, which invalidates attempts to use immunities as counterplay, as well as their good special bulk. This limits counters to Sturdy Pokemon & Shedinja, although more flexible options such as Substitute on Eternamax are still effective. Kyurem-White and Excadrill also seem viable due to their abilities bypassing Sturdy and Wonder Guard, but their inability to sit in front of Eternamax makes them more niche options in my opinion.


2. Hazards

1617282963559.png


While Eternamax is a defensive behemoth, its offensive stats are pretty average, meaning it is very likely to switch in and out many times during a match, especially with every team having their own 2 Eternamax core. This gives it a susceptibility to Stealth Rock and Spikes, so I expect to see quite a few teams focused on hazard stacking, as well as reliable hazard removal cores in response.


3. Trapping

1617283590996.png


Gothitelle traps and PP stalls Eternamax just like any other target, with Substitute Gothitelle blocking Eternamax from phazing it with Dragon Tail. It also has to ability to trap a lot of other passive partners opposing Eternamax may have that aim to punish Gothitelle's teammates (eg. Skarmory, Ferrothorn, Spikes Mew, etc.), removing pressure off of its team while placing it on the opponent. I do expect to see teams becoming more prepared for Gothitelle because of how big a threat it poses, but it's still certainly a great Pokemon.


Other options:

4. Residual damage


Things like burn and sandstorm/hail can wear down Eternamax over (a lot of) time, especially in conjunction with Knock Off, although it requires careful team building to ensure the opposing Eternamax is outlasted by your team. Rest Eternamax can foil this plan as well. You'd probably see this on teams with good hazard setters to accentuate the amount of passive damage Eternamax takes.


5. Baton Pass

espeon.gif
clefable.gif
bellossom.gif


While Eternamax does wall Espeon (as long as it doesn't have both Psyshock and Stored Power), it can force Eternamax to stay in and burn PP as it Baton Passes, as the Eternamax user risks a Pokemon dying if Espeon predicts a switch. Annoying but manageable.


6. Calyrex-Shadow

calyrex-shadow.gif


Calyrex's access to Psyshock with Nasty Plot makes it a nuisance to deal with, as specially defensive Eternamax gets weakened by +2 Psyshock and is KOd by Calyrex the next time it gets +2 if Eternamax is unable to recover, and if Calyrex Dynamaxes it can KO physically defensive Eternamax. It is difficult for the Calyrex user to get that many opportunities, but it can still potentially be a problem. Choice variants with Trick can also cripple Eternamax for teammates.


Closing note

While Eternamax is undoubtedly one of the most restricting Pokemon to have existed in the history of the game, this should not be a reason to deter people from playing AG, as the metagame is still fresh and unexplored. I look forward to seeing everyone's creativity in the future :]
 
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Hi everyone. I've done plenty of playtesting and even though the metagame is ridiculously centralized, I'm enjoying it so far! The change of landscape from Yveltal + Necrozma-DM + Eternatus to this is genuinely refreshing. Here's a summary of my thoughts:

Eternamax

:ss/eternatus-eternamax::ss/eternatus-eternamax:
Eternamax is obviously the elephant in the metagame; its presence is literally and figuratively vast. Having at least two in each team is mandatory: one with overflowing Defense and the other with overflowing Special Defense. The best set is probably Dragon Tail / Toxic / Flamethrower / Recover, but some other moves like Substitute (blocks OHKO spam) and Screech (PP fodder) have some purpose too. In my experience though, the moves don't even matter too much: two Eternamax can pretty easily PP stall entire unprepared teams by just switching into one another infinitely. The choice of items is a little less brainless although still pretty straightforward. Black Sludge cancels out any damage done on the overflowed side, Heavy-Duty Boots shields you from entry hazards, Shed Shell proofs you against Gothitelle and Perish Song + Whirlpool, and Rocky Helmet chips down anyone that's still running physical attackers for whatever reason.

Eternamax pretty much invalidates the overmajority of traditional wincons. Offensive Pokemon that can only hit on the physical or special side (so 99% of previously viable options) are unviable, period. As a result, the metagame is centralized around winconditions that cán beat Eternamax. I'll discuss these options here. Beyond that, 99% of the previous defensive staples are unviable as well, with the Eternamax duo walling all that needs to be walled already. Nonetheless, a few Pokemon have still been able to carve out a niche for themselves, which I'll discuss as well.

Entry Hazards and their effects

:ss/skarmory::ss/mew:
With Defog being an unviable move due to every team packing multiple unkillable Pressure walls, Spikes is incredibly powerful and probably the strongest playstyle there is. The rate of progress you can make in this very bulky metagame is catalyzed significantly with three layers of Spikes on the opponents field. The best setters are by far Skarmory and Mew due to their unique traits. Skarmory is immune to OHKO moves, is able to fit Stealth Rock on top of Spikes, and can force progress with Whirlwind. On the other side, Mew has access to pretty much every move in the game, including useful ones like Horn Drill, Fissure, Knock Off, Heal Bell, Whirlwind, Recycle, and Stealth Rock. Apart from Spikes (Stealth Rock if you run Spikes Skarmory) and Rest or Soft-Boiled + Heal Bell, you can easily customize Mew to your needs, which makes it very splashable. The best sets in my experience are Stealth Rock - Spikes - Roost - Whirlwind with Shed Shell for Skarmory and Horn Drill / Fissure - Recycle - Spikes / Stealth Rock - Rest with a Leppa Berry for Mew. Ferrothorn is a fine Spikes setter too, but easier to wear down than Skarmory and Mew.

As discussed, Mew and Skarmory are the most convenient Stealth Rock setters, but others like Fissure Groudon and Knock Off Necrozma-DM work fine too.

:heavy-duty-boots: Heavy-Duty Boots :heavy-duty-boots:
With entry hazards being broken, Heavy-Duty Boots are too. Pretty much any Pokemon will benefit significantly from Heavy-Duty Boots, whether it be Eternamax, OHKO spammers, or entry hazard setters.

Knock Off
With Heavy-Duty Boots being broken, Knock Off is too. Sadly, there aren't a lot of viable Knock Off users. Some that stand out are Mew, Necrozma-DM, Cryogonal, and Ferrothorn.

:ss/cryogonal:
With entry hazards being broken and Defog being unviable, Rapid Spin is pretty luxurious. Cryogonal is by far the best Rapid Spin user. It's immune to Spikes, Sheer Cold, and Fissure, and has access to valuable moves in Sheer Cold and Knock Off itself. Excadrill is another niche option that also has access to Fissure and Horn Drill, but can be worn down relatively quickly.

OHKO Moves

:ss/mew::ss/lapras::ss/kyogre::ss/groudon:
OHKO moves are the easiest and fastest ways to make progress in the metagame. Some notable abusers are Mew, Lapras, Kyogre, and Groudon. All four can sit in front of Eternamax and fire off repeated OHKO moves. On top of that, Mew can set entry hazards, Groudon can set Stealth Rock, and Kyogre can easily break through the premier Sturdy Pokemon in Skarmory. The Kyurem forms and Excadrill are notable too due to their ability to ignore Sturdy, but they can't switch into Eternamax reliably.

Setup Sweepers

:ss/calyrex-shadow::ss/xerneas::ss/necrozma-dusk-mane::ss/hatterene:
These are some of the very few offensive options that can still put in work in the current metagame. Calyrex-Shadow is still broken; with careful play, it can break past the Eternamax duo between Nasty Plot-boosted Psyshock and Psychic / Astral Barrage / Max Mindstorm, and easily spirals out of control afterwards with As One boosts. Xerneas uses Eternamax as setup bait; it can't be poisoned courtesy of Substitute and is immune to Dragon Tail. After setting up multiple Geomancy boosts, Xerneas can then threaten the Eternamax duo with Moonblast / Max Starfall and Psyshock. Necrozma-DM is immune to Toxic, can negate Dragon Tail with Substitute, and set up to its heart's content with Calm Mind. It can then beat the Eternamax duo with Psyshock and Stored Power / Earth Power. Hatterene ignores Toxic and Dragon Tail with Magic Bounce and its Fairy-typing. It uses Eternamax as setup bait and defeats the duo with Psyshock and Stored Power / Moonblast.

Generally speaking, the key to break past Eternamax is access to Psyshock + a super-effective special move + a setup move + ways to combat Toxic and Dragon Tail.

Some Other Wincons

:ss/salazzle:
This is pretty straight-forward; Salazzle outstalls Eternamax pretty easily with Corrosion-enhanced Toxic + Substitute + Protect (+ Disable if you want).

:ss/gothitelle::ss/azumarill:
These are probably the best trappers out there. Substitute Gothitelle outstalls Eternatus with Rest + Cosmic Power + Taunt and Azumarill removes Eternamax with Whirlpool + Perish Song, being immune to Dragon Tail as a Fairy-type. Even though its special bulk is worse, Azumarill is better than Primarina because Thick Fat cuts down Flamethrower damage. A lot of other Pokemon have access to a trapping move + Perish Song, but Azumarill and Primarina are the only options immune to Dragon Tail.

----------------------------------------------

In terms of viability, Eternamax and Calyrex-Shadow are easily the best Pokemon in the metagame. Hypothetically speaking, Eternamax would definitely be S+ and Calyrex-Shadow would be S. The A-ranks would consist of Mew, Skarmory, Lapras, Gothitelle, and Yveltal (maybe Hatterene too because Magic Bounce is awesome). Everything else would come afterwards.

That's all, ciao!
 
I think for Eternax, despite it getting Recover, RestTalk actually might be the better choice.

I had quite good success on the ladder with that set:

Eternatus-Eternamax @ Shed Shell / Rocky Helmet
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 16 HP / 240 Def or SpD / 252 Spe
Impish / Careful Nature
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Dragon Tail
- Dynamax Cannon / Flamethrower / Cosmic Power

I had a couple of these, paired with reliable hazard setters/knoff users (to get rid of boots on enemy mons) to stack rocks and spikes and then phaze with Dtail. Etern might be tanky, but it is as vulnerable to hazards as any other mon.

Etern is so tanky, especially with an overflowed defense, that having to burn two sleep turns is a non-issue. It actually is a great advantage when it comes to PP-stalling; and lucky Sleep Talk rolls calling Dtail before the enemy can move are funny too :D
 
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Moves and Teammates | Combos | Leads
Code:
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| Rank | Pokemon            | Use  | Usage % |  Win %  |
+ ---- + ------------------ + ---- + ------- + ------- +
| 1    | Yveltal            |   88 |  91.67% |  50.00% |
| 2    | Necrozma-Dusk-Mane |   85 |  88.54% |  49.41% |
| 3    | Eternatus          |   56 |  58.33% |  44.64% |
| 4    | Zacian-Crowned     |   50 |  52.08% |  52.00% |
| 5    | Calyrex-Shadow     |   34 |  35.42% |  50.00% |
| 6    | Ditto              |   29 |  30.21% |  58.62% |
| 7    | Kyogre             |   28 |  29.17% |  57.14% |
| 8    | Ferrothorn         |   20 |  20.83% |  60.00% |
| 8    | Lunala             |   20 |  20.83% |  60.00% |
| 10   | Zygarde            |   18 |  18.75% |  44.44% |
| 10   | Xerneas            |   18 |  18.75% |  38.89% |
| 12   | Groudon            |   15 |  15.62% |  53.33% |
| 13   | Marshadow          |   11 |  11.46% |  54.55% |
| 14   | Kyurem-White       |   10 |  10.42% |  30.00% |
| 15   | Blissey            |    7 |   7.29% |  71.43% |
| 15   | Gothitelle         |    7 |   7.29% |  57.14% |
| 15   | Zekrom             |    7 |   7.29% |  42.86% |
| 18   | Excadrill          |    5 |   5.21% |  20.00% |
| 18   | Landorus-Therian   |    5 |   5.21% |  20.00% |
| 20   | Porygon2           |    4 |   4.17% |  50.00% |
| 20   | Slurpuff           |    4 |   4.17% |  25.00% |
| 20   | Lapras             |    4 |   4.17% |  25.00% |
| 23   | Kyurem-Black       |    3 |   3.12% | 100.00% |
| 23   | Quagsire           |    3 |   3.12% |  66.67% |
| 23   | Shuckle            |    3 |   3.12% |  33.33% |
| 23   | Tyranitar          |    3 |   3.12% |  33.33% |
| 23   | Dracovish          |    3 |   3.12% |  33.33% |
| 28   | Mewtwo             |    2 |   2.08% | 100.00% |
| 28   | Regieleki          |    2 |   2.08% |  50.00% |
| 28   | Umbreon            |    2 |   2.08% |  50.00% |
| 28   | Zacian             |    2 |   2.08% |  50.00% |
| 28   | Tangrowth          |    2 |   2.08% |  50.00% |
| 28   | Toxapex            |    2 |   2.08% |  50.00% |
| 28   | Skarmory           |    2 |   2.08% |  50.00% |
| 28   | Ho-Oh              |    2 |   2.08% |   0.00% |
| 28   | Grimmsnarl         |    2 |   2.08% |   0.00% |
| 37   | Scolipede          |    1 |   1.04% | 100.00% |
| 37   | Magearna           |    1 |   1.04% | 100.00% |
| 37   | Espeon             |    1 |   1.04% | 100.00% |
| 37   | Indeedee-F         |    1 |   1.04% | 100.00% |
| 37   | Dubwool            |    1 |   1.04% | 100.00% |
| 37   | Dialga             |    1 |   1.04% | 100.00% |
| 37   | Lycanroc           |    1 |   1.04% | 100.00% |
| 37   | Cloyster           |    1 |   1.04% | 100.00% |
| 37   | Giratina-Origin    |    1 |   1.04% | 100.00% |
| 37   | Solgaleo           |    1 |   1.04% | 100.00% |
| 37   | Chansey            |    1 |   1.04% | 100.00% |
| 37   | Calyrex-Ice        |    1 |   1.04% |   0.00% |
| 37   | Giratina           |    1 |   1.04% |   0.00% |
| 37   | Celesteela         |    1 |   1.04% |   0.00% |
| 37   | Heatran            |    1 |   1.04% |   0.00% |
| 37   | Corviknight        |    1 |   1.04% |   0.00% |
| 37   | Mew                |    1 |   1.04% |   0.00% |
| 37   | Darmanitan-Galar   |    1 |   1.04% |   0.00% |
Here are the winter seasonal usage stats from round 8 onwards for those who were curious!
 

Fc

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Thread's kinda dead so I'll just drop some thoughts on cool mons in the meta rn.

:ss/zekrom:
Zekrom @ Leftovers
Ability: Teravolt
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Dragon Claw
- Bolt Strike
- Magnet Rise

Magnet Rise Zekrom is a super fun set that I brought last week in AGPL, taking advantage of a good amount of teams. It's not the most consistent thing ever, given that Groudon can still SD and Dynamax to beat it and Ferrothorn just kinda hard walls, with it not being able to force 50/50's against Lunala with Substitute either. The main thing it does is beat Necrozma-DM really reliably, and it can wall Groudon / Quagsire if it baits a defensive Dynamax out of them. Substitute or Roost are the more traditional sets and Substitute is probably a tiny bit better, but this is still very fun.

:ss/landorus-therian:
Landorus-Therian (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 Spe
Impish Nature
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock
- Toxic
- U-turn

Defensive Lando-t is a newer set, but I think it's pretty solid at role compression. It checks Groudon and Zekrom well enough for speed control teammates to finish them off in the worst case scenario, and it's a pivot into Zacian-C with Intimidate. It also takes advantage of NDM and sets its own rocks while pressuring the main Defogger, Yveltal, with Toxic. Naturally with 8 Speed evs it outruns para'd Caly-S which is nice, so it's a cool mon.

:ss/xerneas:
Xerneas @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Fairy Aura
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Moonblast
- Thunder
- Aromatherapy
- Defog

Choice Scarf Xerneas is another really cool set. I've ran more bulk on it in games usually for some specific calcs, and you can definitely calc for whatever hits you want to live, but I'll keep it simple here. It's solid Speed control and soft checks a few really notable threats like Marshadow, Zygarde, and Zekrom. The strong Moonblast can revenge those mons as well as even Dynamaxed Yveltal with some chip, and it catches them off guard trying to just fire off a strong hit to take out the Xerneas sometimes if scarf isn't revealed. Aroma and Defog are good support for if you predict a switch, with Moonblast and Thunder just being the solid coverage options they always are on Xerneas.

:ss/calyrex-shadow: + :ss/yveltal:
Calyrex-Shadow @ Life Orb
Ability: As One (Spectrier)
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Astral Barrage
- Draining Kiss
- Nasty Plot
- Baton Pass

Yveltal @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Dark Aura
EVs: 72 HP / 252 SpD / 184 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Dark Pulse
- Oblivion Wing
- Roost
- Defog
I brought this core in week 1 of AGPL, and t I think it's honestly a really solid breaking core. Yveltal doesn't need any investment if it gets +2 and can Dynamax given how broken Dark Aura, Max Airstream, and Max Darkness are, and it checks opposing Yveltal pretty well with its defensive capabilities. NP Caly can 50/50 dyna with Yveltal, living even a Foul Play from the rare scarf sets when Dynamaxed. If it can Baton Pass to Yveltal there isn't a ton that can wall the core outside of Tyranitar, so I really like the idea. Defensive Special Attacking Yveltal doesn't have natural utility or a huge amount of power so without NP Caly-S I can't say it's great, but it's a fun tech option with the stat boosts.

:ss/garchomp:
Garchomp @ Bright Powder
Ability: Sand Veil
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Earthquake
- Scale Shot
- Substitute

This mon sucks but it's funny. (LO chomp is actually good too)

| 37 | Scolipede | 1 | 1.04% | 100.00% |
| 37 | Magearna | 1 | 1.04% | 100.00% |
| 37 | Espeon | 1 | 1.04% | 100.00% |
| 37 | Indeedee-F | 1 | 1.04% | 100.00% |
| 37 | Dubwool | 1 | 1.04% | 100.00% |
s/o's BP re: post above btw
 

Icemaster

Few will truly understand.
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Eternatus @ Expert Belt
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 40 HP / 152 SpA / 252 SpD / 64 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Draco Meteor
- Flamethrower
- Recover
- Sludge Bomb

This set compresses offensive and defensive etern allowing you to have an eternatus which can break things on teams far more easily as it still switches into kyogre pretty well. Draco Meteor / Flame with Ebelt OHKO opposing SpDef Eternatuses, and 2HKO opposing NDM with a pretty good roll (you do roughly 50% so if you core this with zacian flaming NDM once either makes them waste literally all their morning suns praying for low rolls, or they swap out, or you just 2hko it and zacian wins). Sludge bomb makes this set actually able to hurt yveltal / hooh to make it properly solo defensive cores while having a good stab to spam since meteor has its own issues.
https://pokepast.es/630a11d5dee9e85a
https://pokepast.es/32a6d24570a538fb
used this vs QT and wsun

Eternatus @ Light Clay
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 160 HP / 252 SpD / 96 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Reflect
- Light Screen
- Dynamax Cannon
- Recover

Eternatus is an insane mon underrated by the VR, definitely better than kyogre its pretty much mandatory on teams (even most HOs) imo, and can do a lot of different things
Screens on Eternatus is pretty OP enabling you to beat xerneas/yveltal without dynamax if they try setup in your face while massively easing switchins to things like assurance zac / caly and makes teams more ditto proof in general, screens balance is a good team type imo
https://pokepast.es/01c232d1f59545c3 used this vs pannu, though etern didnt actually screen up given he had hooh and so being aggressive with zekrom was a better winpath
https://pokepast.es/67397d46717638ec used this on ladder for 97.8 gxe its not as bad as it looks

Also physdef ID+BPress ferro is pretty broken since it gives a big advantage vs teams with yveltal being their only defogger (the majority of teams) and helps beat all the dd mons. It fits pretty well with both these eterns
 

Mbouchon

Pure Hackmons
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Looks like people are revealing their ideas; I guess I'll go too.

These aren't necessarily metagame sets but they've been working pretty well for me recently.

:ss/groudon:

Groudon @ Life Orb / Lum Berry
Ability: Drought
EVs: 32 HP / 252 Atk / 32 SpD / 192 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Swords Dance
- Precipice Blades
- Stone Edge
- Aerial Ace

This set was pretty widespread earlier on in the metagame (albeit with different EVs), but it's fallen out of favor on the grounds of being relatively reliant on Dynamax to break through opposing checks, as well as new Groudon checks like defensive Landorus-T and Giratina-O being much more common than before. However, I feel that it's every bit as threatening as it was before, as defensive Lunala isn't slapped onto as many teams nowadays; with an Adamant nature and a Swords Dance boost, Groudon can deal significant damage to its checks, and it's pretty clear that defensive counterplay is difficult to come around. In addition, even without Dynamax Groudon can be a menace - in this game Groudon straight-up OHKOed an opposing Groudon after using Swords Dance. Most of its checks generally don't provide sufficient offensive pressure to prevent Groudon from overpowering them - Groudon can set up Swords Dance twice against defensive Landorus-T if healthy, and it can even run Lum Berry for Lunala and Giratina-O.


Speaking of resurging Pokemon, here's another one:

:ss/ho-oh:

Ho-Oh @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 248 HP / 192 Def / 52 SpD / 16 Spe
Impish Nature
- Sacred Fire
- Toxic / Thunder Wave
- Defog
- Whirlwind

Ho-Oh @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 248 HP / 244 SpD / 16 Spe
Careful Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Thunder Wave / Toxic / Earthquake / Brave Bird
- Defog
- Whirlwind

I've seen this Pokemon be used more recently - it's not just me.

Sometimes Necrozma-DM isn't enough as a sponge against opposing defensive Pokemon - I've really come to like Ho-Oh recently. A relatively easy-to-work-with typing, a godsend Ability in Regenerator, and its ability to pressure Necrozma-DM and Zacian-C are simply too valuable to forgo, at least from my experience. Both physically defensive and specially defensive sets are valuable - the former can reliably check defensive Necrozma-DM, opposing Ho-Oh, Xerneas, and defensive Eternatus, while also soft-checking Zacian-C and Calyrex-S, while the latter checks Calyrex-S, Xerneas, and Eternatus more strongly, although it loses the ability to switch into most Marshadow. A possible Choice Band or Life Orb set also means there's not much one could use to reliably check every Ho-Oh set; its versatility and ability to perform defensive roles with impeccable quality is really, really valuable.

One last perk it has is enabling Sucker Punch Yveltal:

:ss/yveltal:

Yveltal @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Dark Aura
EVs: 248 HP / 72 Def / 188 SpD
Careful Nature
IVs: 20 Spe
- Knock Off
- U-turn
- Sucker Punch
- Roost

which can OHKO opposing Calyrex-S, heavily damage opposing Marshadow going for significant damage with Close Combat, and KO a heavily damaged Choice Specs Kyogre.


:ss/calyrex-shadow:

Calyrex-Shadow @ Life Orb / Colbur Berry / Kasib Berry
Ability: As One (Spectrier)
EVs: 192 HP or Def / 252 SpA / 64 Spe
Modest / Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Nasty Plot
- Astral Barrage
- Draining Kiss
- Psyshock

Slow Calyrex-S might be surprising, but I've found it to be an interesting and frankly, threatening Pokemon if used right. Its obscene Speed stat means that, much like Zacian-C, it can forgo most Speed investment to hit hard and body opposing attacks. The Defense investment used for this set is enough to survive a Life Orb Shadow Sneak from Marshadow with Dynamax (it's almost guaranteed with HP investment) - if the opponent has used their Dynamax already and Calyrex has a Nasty Plot boost under its belt, the game is pretty much over. Additionally, opposing Zacian-C don't want to risk getting hit first by Calyrex-S, so in practice the speed generally isn't very necessary, aside from some endgames.

When I build with Sucker Punch Yveltal I prefer HP because I can reliably OHKO Dynamaxed Ditto with it.


:ss/necrozma-dusk-mane:

Necrozma-Dusk-Mane @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Prism Armor
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Relaxed Nature
- Cosmic Power
- Stored Power
- Stone Edge
- Morning Sun

Stored Power Necrozma-DM has been basically nonexistent in Gen 8 AG, which is understandable - its importance as a Stealth Rock setter, or as a potent setup Pokemon with Dragon Dance, cannot be overstated. However, it's been working quite well for me, as Stone Edge OHKOes opposing Yveltal after Weakness Policy activates. Stored Power, after being boosted to ludicrous levels with Weakness Policy and Cosmic Power boosts, can 2HKO or OHKO even resists like Ferrothorn and Necrozma-DM. Having 16 PP helps as well - in this game Necrozma-DM was able to KO Yveltal, set up, KO Ferrothorn, force a Dynamax from opposing Necrozma-DM, and then KO it. It's something one doesn't ordilarily prep for, and is a set that should be looked at more.


A few ideas I had that I don't have much to say about are: Arcanine AV Audino HDB Audino Genesect HDB Palkia Scarf Palkia LO Xerneas CB Groudon AV Ho-Oh CB Zekrom Specs Etern HC Gira-O SpD Sub Ogre
 
Last edited:

Flynn Watson

Banned deucer.
The National Dex Anything Goes metagame right now is decently scattered right now, lots of things to cover in 6 slots, for example, you could use a xerneas to avoid instantly losing to the popular "Dynamax abuse yveltal", but then losing to the physical steel wing set, not saying it's good; But the element of unpredictability is certainly something, I'd also say stall teams are the most useless play style in the current metagame, tho it has some uses, it fails to do work against hyper offensive cores such as nasty baton pass calyrex shadow with either a xerneas or yveltal to baton pass to, or both of them, I noticed stall teams really struggle against that one core, and more popularly, banded mega rayquaza, is the epitome of a wallbreaker, it's bloody powerful of a wallbreaker, for say, it two hit KOes defensive support arceus formes if not steel or rock, and it's access to waterfall and delta stream let's it blow past groudons.
 
:ss/Sandaconda-gmax: :ss/centiskorch-gmax:
One thing I’m surprised about is the lack of discussion on Sandaconda and Centiskorch, particularly their G-Max moves. These 2 have G-Max moves that are essentially upgraded versions of Sand Tomb and Fire Spin respectfully.
However, what many people don’t know is that those effects remain even if the user switches out. Basically, Sandaconda/Centiskorch can Dynamax, use their respective G-max move, hopefully hit something passive and without ways to escape, and then switch out to a set up sweeper.
With Grip Claw, you can have 6 whole turns being able to do what ever you want while what ever was trapped takes 7/8th of damage from being trapped.
 

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