Project A Last Look (Week 2: Clefairy)

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Approved by erisia. OP stolen from Tony's version of the thread. In need of new Banner.



With Pokémon Sun and Moon rapidly approaching, now is your chance to still make the most out of your ORAS NU experience before the Sun and Moon hype takes over full control of your body.

Welcome to A Last Look! Our goal is to try out and give certain Pokémon that are currently overlooked in NU a final chance to find out if we've been sleeping on a gem (or two) throughout this generation, before it's too late. This project combines elements of both the Dark Horse project and Research Week to close out this generation on a positive note.

Throughout the upcoming weeks leading up to the Sun and Moon release we're going to try out several Pokémon that don't quite make it into NU based on usage, but could very much be worth a slot on your team.

Current Subject:


Now, with this week's Pokémon chosen, this is what we expect from (and offer) you this week:
Before you can post a truly informed opinion on a Pokémon's uses and roles in the NU metagame, it's important to have tried it out first. We highly recommend to not only play games on the NU ladder, but to also save and share battle replays that show off Clefairy's role and effectiveness on your team, but also NU as a whole. This way you not only get to show off the team you've crafted around Clefairy, but it also gives the other participants an insight as to which direction you decided to take your team, which could inspire new ideas and interesting discussion points. Speaking of which...

After building a team and playing games with it we'd want you to come back to this thread to talk to us about your experiences. What did you think of Clefairy in NU? How did you go about building your team? Was your team successful on the NU ladder? If not, in what way did it struggle to perform? How did you work around Clefairy's flaws? These examples are interesting thinking points we'd love to see some insight on. Don't forget, we're going to have different people participating, so there inevitably will be different results, too. We strongly encourage discussing your findings with the other participants, since it might help you see your findings in a different perspective, which in turn might help you learn from your experiences, or helps someone else learn from theirs.


For the competitively driven among you, there will also be a ladder ranking aspect to the project, which is optional and by no means mandatory. For those of you interested you can ladder up using a "LL1 (insert name here)" alt (LL1 AJB, for example) and we'll check which LL1 alt is ranked highest at the end of the week. The highest ranked LL1 at the end of the week will be inducted into the Hall of Fame.
Important! We would very much still like to see discussion and thoughts on the Pokémon we're featuring even if you're aiming to be inducted into the Hall of Fame. This means you'll only be able to be inducted if you also post about your experiences on the ladder in the thread; having the highest ranked LL1 alt isn't enough to be inducted into the Hall of Fame.

This project aims for an interesting and collaborative discussion, not an argument about whether something's better or worse, or right or wrong. I expect shit posting to be kept to a minimum and to maintain a healthy, friendly and productive atmosphere as we look into ORAS NU one last time together before we dive into Pokémon Sun and Moon.

Now then, without further ado, go out and have fun exploring Clefairy's potential in NU this week. We look forward to hearing about your findings!
 
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The starting Pokemon for the first week will be Simisage. Simisage has been gaining a lot of hype and attention in the Viability Rankings recently, and for good reason. Known for its immediate power and colorful coverage options which allow it to bypass traditional Grass-type counters, Simisage is a very versatile and unprepared for pokemon in the ORAS NU metagame. With the ability to go either full special or mixed, and boasting an impressive 101 base Speed, Simisage has many notable niches that separate it from more popular Grass-types such as Lilligant and Shiftry. The posting and laddering period will begin now and end on Wednesday, November 2nd. Have fun!
 

twinkay

these bugs love all the sugar in my blood
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didn't realize we had to post our name here, sorry
LL1 KittenGaming
 
Wanted to post my thoughts, not going to ladder with it since i'm pressed for time but have tested a few Simisage teams on ladder and room tours so thought I'd say my bit on how I used it.



This is the team I've settled on to use with Simisage. Pretty standard, covers most of the weaknesses Simisage has or things it needs covering.

Mesprit- Defensive with leftovers covers the threat of Tauros which threatens Simisage if it's safely in on it. Rocks are always nice to wear down mons for Simisage too.

Lanturn- A really vital partner for simisage since it covers it's obvious fire weakness by checking mag, pyroar etc. and can allow Simisage to be a slightly safer scald switch in by using heal bell to get rid of filthy burns.

Garbodor- A few layers of spikes can really help Simisage be more of a threat by OHKO ing more of the tier.

Hitmonchan- Although Simisage isn't weak to rocks, it's always nice to not take hazard damage on top of the life orb recoil. Also nice for finishing off mons Simisage has weakened.

Tauros- Always nice to have something on the team with 350 or above speed. Tauros also benefits from things like gastrodon, steelix, quagsire etc. being worn by Simisage.

Now onto the Simisage set-

Simisage @ Life Orb
Ability: Overgrow
EVs: 152 Atk / 104 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Leaf Storm
- Superpower
- Rock Slide
- Knock Off

Just standard mixed attacking Simisage just with knock off instead of the suggested giga drain/ gunk shot. Didn't feel it necessary to run giga drain since it seemed rare that you wouldn't want the extra damage in most scenarios from leaf storm. And knock off seemed very helpful in helping deal with things like rotom.

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/nu-468934327 (a replay from a random room tour final vs Disjunction with this team.) Simisage doesn't do too much in the replay, other than threaten out Rhydon, kill rotom and get rid of Hariyama's AV but this was very helpful in allowing tauros more freedom to do damage.

Overall thoughts on Simisage- Overall I think Simisage is a very viable grass type of the likes of Shiftry, and to some extent liligant but obviously fulfils a different roll. You definitely need to consider what other grass types bring to the table first and what benefits your team most. It's base speed is really helpful, albeit a little awkward. A major benefit, i found, over shiftry. Although knock off isn't stab like shiftry, it's access also to superpower, and base speed allowing less need to not predict things with Sucker punch like Shiftry does, meant you could almost always cause some trouble if in safely with this pokemon. Definitely worth a shot for anyone who hasn't used it yet. Seemed best for me when used early to mid game to break away at things tauros has trouble with.

edit- also 100th post woo
 
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twinkay

these bugs love all the sugar in my blood
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Better late than never, am I right?

Simisage, although it seems like it faces competition from a bunch of other offensive Grass-types, has some pretty good niches that set it apart from them. It has a very good speed tier, outpacing base 100s, and amazing coverage, which not a lot of Grass-types have. Superpower hits Steels and Abomasnow hard, Rock Slide hits Scyther and Charizard for very good damage as well as doing considerable damage to other Flying types, Gunk Shot hits Grasses, and Knock Off provides good damage as well as general utilty. Also 98 / 98 offenses aren't the greatest but they definitely are usable and keep in mind that one of the most prominent Grass-types in the tier has 100 / 90 offenses, so stat-wise it's not that bad.

One thing I find annoying when using Simisage is how frail it is. Now, obviously offensive mons are frail, but unless you have slow pivoting there are literally no opportunities to switch it in, especially against mons with priority, besides having a teammate die. Speaking of priority, It's very weak to priority! It has avery hard time taking priority well, which further means you can't seitch into anything. But perhaps the biggest flaw of Simisage is that when you build a team, and you want an offensive Grass-type, there are other Grass-types that can just perform their roles better. Lilligant can provides sleep support and be a sweeper or be a revenge-killer, Shiftry can provide Defog support, priority, STAB Knock Off, and be a sweeper, revenge killer, or wallbreaker. Simisage doesn't really come to mind. This doesn't meen Simisage isn't good, but it's spotlight is just stolen by other Grass-types.

I'll share a team with you:

Archeops @ Focus Sash
Ability: Defeatist
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Taunt
- Endeavor
- Head Smash

Simisage @ Life Orb
Ability: Overgrow
EVs: 152 Atk / 104 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Leaf Storm
- Superpower
- Rock Slide
- Gunk Shot

Poliwrath @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 96 HP / 252 SpA / 160 Spe
Modest Nature
- Scald
- Focus Blast
- Ice Beam
- Vacuum Wave

Rotom @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Volt Switch
- Thunderbolt
- Shadow Ball
- Will-O-Wisp

Liepard @ Black Glasses
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Knock Off
- Encore
- Sucker Punch
- U-turn

Garbodor @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Aftermath
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Spikes
- Gunk Shot
- Drain Punch
- Seed Bomb


This was an attempt at Simisage HO that I built around Sash Lead Arch + Simisage because Simisage really appreciates SR support. Poliwrath checks Fires and also provides valuable prioriy support. Good Klinklang check as well because that's a pretty big threat to Sash Lead. Rotom was added as a fast revenge killer, provides Volt Switch support (then again, it's not going to be slower than anything notable unless it's Scarf gets knocked off), and pressures Flyings and Psychics. Scarf Wisp is because I wanted to do something unique on the team, and since I had a way to beat most Trick targets (Rhydon, for instance) I decided crippling Physical attackers would be more beneficial to HO, because, of course, Liepard and Simi can't take a hit and the rest of the team appreciates it. Rotom is also a spinblocker, so I guess you could call it the glue of the team. Pard was added because I wanted a fast mon who could beat Scarf Haunter without risking ties and who could beat Psychics after Rotom died. Band is addictive but I decided to go with standard Pard because Vacuum Wave is pretty weak priority and I wanted Sucker to clean up fast mons. Garb was finally added to check Fightings and provide spike support as well as luring Don and Quag becuase there is no way they are staying into Simi. Electric checks are non-existent on the team so I'm normally forced to sack a mon. Scarf Jynx also scares me but I have Sucker for that. Pretty succesful on low ladder, but that's not much of an accomplishment lol.

I would say this is a team where Simi can fit on well because of its good spped tier which is very beneficial to HO as well as it's coverage supporting the team very well. There's not much ways HO can handle frailty except for Garb but the team also focuses on eleiminating fast mons that threaten Simi, mainly Tauros and Pyroar. So yeah, that's my thought on Simi hope you guys liked it.
 

Disjunction

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Hi, I'm mostly done with laddering for now. I'm 10-0 on my alt, but I've also used the team a bit on my main on ladder and in room tours.

Simisage @ Choice Specs
Ability: Overgrow
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 Def
- Leaf Storm
- Focus Blast
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- Giga Drain

Garbodor @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Aftermath
EVs: 252 HP / 156 Def / 100 Spe
Impish Nature
- Gunk Shot
- Drain Punch
- Spikes
- Toxic Spikes

Rotom @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Will-O-Wisp
- Substitute
- Discharge
- Hex

Rhydon @ Eviolite
Ability: Lightning Rod
EVs: 252 HP / 16 Atk / 104 Def / 136 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Stone Edge
- Earthquake
- Swords Dance

Hariyama @ Assault Vest
Ability: Thick Fat
EVs: 252 Atk / 236 SpD / 20 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Bullet Punch
- Stone Edge
- Close Combat
- Knock Off

Tauros @ Life Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Rock Climb
- Earthquake
- Fire Blast
- Zen Headbutt

I went with Specs cause I'm a sucker for a good Specs mon and Simi's main purpose is spamming Leaf Storm anyhow. It's a completely 2 dimensional threat -- ether you click Leaf Storm or you click one of the three other moves in an aggressive fashion to get the upper hand on your opponent. Simi does this reliably and only needs to come in once or twice a game to get its job done. Provided you have a good amount of offensive momentum on your side, Simisage will be able to pull its weight on your team and be able to get work done in a majority of its matchups.

Here's a dope replay showcasing simi's offensive prowess:
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/nu-468918834
 

Thanks to all those who contributed last week! This weeks Pokemon is none other than Clefairy. For a long while now, people have realized how good Clefairy really is, as it's excellent mono-Fairy typing combined with great mixed bulk when factoring in Eviolite allows Clefairy to be a blanket check to many of the tier's top threats. Clefairy has multiple different sets between CM and support with a very colorful move pool to boot. Players like Teddeh have used it to great success on both ladder and tournaments, and i'm sure would just love to give their expert input here as well. Reminder, if you plan to ladder with Clefairy, post your alt name "LL2 (insert name here)" before hitting the ladder and posting here about your findings. With that said, the posting and laddering period will begin now, and end on Saturday, November 12th. Good luck!
 
ayte i aint tiltin this time. i didnt build any stellar simisage teams, but i feel like it's worth using. the mix set is decent but the specs set is more consistent since grass nukes have always been pretty good in this tier. the speed tier is a little awkward but it works nonetheless

ll2 festivalist
 
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twinkay

these bugs love all the sugar in my blood
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This thread needs more love :(

(I'm mainly going to be talking about CM because I like that set) Clef is a really good mon rn. First and foremost, mono-Fairy typing is really good and even though Dragons aren't relevant you still have useful Fighting / Dark resistances and a less useful but still appreciated Bug resistance. Eviolite gives you really good bulk and allows you to set up on a multitude of Pokemon. Combine that with Magic Guard so you can't be whittled by status and you've got yourself a combination that can be really hard to break for certain teams. This makes for some easy set-up against stuff like Poliwrath and Abomasnow. CM + Softboiled also makes it really easy to set up one you get going. Also T-Wave makes offensive threats like Tauros easier to handle while Fire Blast means you don't have to get to +6 to 2HKO Steels and Poisons. It's flaws are still notable, relying on Eviolite to tank most hits and thus being Knock Off weak, also being very passive without a boost and T-Wave variants can't really win with Fairy resists around. But other than that, Clef is a nice wincon for some bulkier teams that want a Fighting check.

I have three Clef teams but I'll show my favorite.

Clefairy @ Eviolite
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 84 Def / 172 SpD
Calm Nature
- Calm Mind
- Moonblast
- Soft-Boiled
- Thunder Wave

Zangoose @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Toxic Boost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Facade
- Knock Off
- Close Combat
- Quick Attack

Hitmonchan @ Life Orb
Ability: Iron Fist
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Drain Punch
- Mach Punch
- Ice Punch
- Rapid Spin

Xatu @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Magic Bounce
EVs: 252 HP / 100 Def / 140 SpA / 16 Spe
Timid Nature
- Psychic
- Roost
- Grass Knot
- U-turn

Skuntank @ Lum Berry
Ability: Aftermath
EVs: 232 Atk / 132 SpD / 144 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Sucker Punch
- Pursuit
- Poison Jab
- Taunt

Rhydon @ Eviolite
Ability: Lightning Rod
EVs: 252 HP / 16 Atk / 240 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Rock Blast
- Megahorn


I started with Clef + Goose because its a p cool core that beats many threats. Basically Zangoose lures Steels for Clef and in turn Clef provides a Fighting check and T-Wave support. Facade also just breaks things for Clef to clean late-game. Next I added Xatu + Chan because Xatu beats Poisons and lures stuff like Don and Quag while Chan beats Darks and Steels naturally. The Xatu spread is for something but I forget, but I like the extra power it brings to Pivot Xatu, you can change it to 136 SpA to hit a jump point or just use the standard spread if you want. Phys Tank can beat bulky Psychics, provides powerful priority, and can actually damage M-Audino. You can run special because the team is abit physical heavy but I think psychical suits the team better. Finally I added Tank Don as a good blanket check to physical attackers and a rocker. The team's not the best but it's pretty fun and also has a really good matchup vs hazard stack (which doesn't matter).

Overall, Clef is a good mon and it's very fun to use and not that hard to fit on a team.

Thanks for reading!
 

yogi

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I have no intention in laddering or showing off teams but I thought I'd drop my thoughts on Clefairy.
I've always liked this mon, though I rarely find a spot for it on my teams because I often run more offensive play-styles, as its ability to stop a myriad of both physical and special attackers make it extremely valuable glue on balance/bulky offense; whilst having great utility in its support moves. It's rather difficult to actually play against and I think the hype that surrounded (surrounding?) it is completely justified, as conventional checks and counters to typical fairies are worn down by Seismic Toss (Steelix for example) and more offensive checks are crippled by Thunder Wave (Klinklang), meaning that it has to be carefully played around to avoid several of your mons being either paralysed, knocked off or damaged by the reliable Seismic Toss.

I really enjoy NFE mons that don't get much love making a splash, and it's certainly not the first or last that can in the ORAS NU metagame n_n
 
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