Project OM Mashup Megathread

[BandedBodyPress]

In prep for the upcoming DLC, Alphabet Soup council has made the following changes:

- Unban Clefable
- Unban Wingull
- Unban Snow Cloak + Snow Warning
- Unban Sneasler
- Restrict Dire Claw
- Unban Revavroom
- Unban Proto+Drought
- Unban Terrain Extender
- Unban Heat Rock
- Ban ATales

These bans are in part due to the possible change in power level, as well as questioning if the meta was just underdeveloped for proper checks to these mons and strategies.

 

[BandedBodyPress]

I think I'm just going to semi-regularly make a post about the meta in Soup or maybe Camove just because I think it could help someone get into the meta and I think trying to explain it will make me understand it more. Plus I just find some of it interesting.

Rain Teams in Alphabet Soup!



These are just some of the Pokemon you can expect to see have a spot on a rain team, but there's others that aren't usually dedicated to rain teams. Some are also just relevant to rain.

Sun is usually the strongest weather in gen 9, so it's nice to see rain make an appearance. There's not as many things that make use of rain, particularly because Orichalcum Pulse exists, though some of the rain mons are just as strong, if not stronger.


40/98/95/170/108/228 (739 BST)
Kyogre (Wingull) @ Choice Specs/Heavy Duty Boots
Ability: Drizzle
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- (W)ater Spout
- Hurricane
- (W)ildbolt Storm
- U-turn
Kyogre makes its appearance on Soup rain, even if just as a fusion. If you're against a Wingull, chances are you're going against these moves. Its massive speed and special attack makes it, as far as Soup goes, the face of minmaxxing. Being the fastest (viable) mon in Soup by far, it can afford to not only run max SpAtk but also Specs to max out its power. But wouldn't it rather have Boots to keep its Water Spout strong? Not really. Wingull's natural abilities, Rain Dish and Hydration, keep it status free and gradually recovering health in Rain. Rain which Wingull calls. The most common water immunity, Quagsire, has to worry about switching into a Hurricane on switch in, for any water types thinking they can tank a Water Spout, the infinite accuracy Wildbolt Storm will eat. It has notable switch ins in Snorlax and Hisuian Goodra, who both can Stone Axe and Salt Cure in its face. Hoodra can also threaten with Knock Off. Specs Wingull Water Spout in rain against Ice Scales Snorlax does around 42%, meaning that this is the only special attackers Snorlax has to worry about unboosted. Hoodra being able to resist all of Wingull's attacks makes it take full power Water Spout and only lose 25%. As it was famously stated, Kyogre is a bastard. However Wingull is our Kyogre. My money is on this thing getting banned.


70/100/172/88/169/140 (739 BST)
Kyurem-Black (Marill) @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Teravolt
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- (A)qua Step
- (M)agical Torque
- Knock Off/(M)ountain Gale
- Belly Drum
Marill has been pretty much the Great Tusk of Soup, except with healing. It got Mortal Spin, Knock, Matcha Gotcha, Milk Drink, and a strong attack due to Huge Power to strengthen its Liquidations and Magical Torque. However council decided to unban Belly Drum and it made Marill a dedicated sweeper. It never healed anymore, Fluffy and Magic Guard turned into Mold Breaker and Sword of Ruin. Where Liquidation stood as a bastion of liberty, Aqua Step was erected as a monument to the god of double dance. Uh Quagsire uses Ability Shield to have a turn where it can fire off a Will-o-Wisp and burn it. A burned +6 KyuB Marill deals around 90% to a knocked off GargQuag with Magical Torque. It's so sad.


120/148/99/105/120/101 (693 BST)
Araquanid (Basculegion) (M) @ Life Orb/Choice Band/Mystic Water/Heavy Duty Boots
Ability: Water Bubble
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant/Jolly Nature
- Wave Crash/Liquidation
- (B)olt Beak
- Flip Turn
- (B)ullet Seed/Phantom Force
How is Water Bubble not banned? Well that's because the other water water sweepers prefer other abilities, as I just explained. But Basculegion has stacked natural abilities. Mold Breaker to deal with non-AShield Quag. Swift Swim to outspeed in rain. Adaptability because damage. But with Last Respects its only ghost physical attack is Phantom Force, ew. So with that, maxing out to power if its water attacks is the key. Luckily, Water Bubble does exactly that., doubling the power of water attacks. That means that a Basculegion's STAB Wave Crash in rain is 720 base power. Erm... that's nuts. Also Quag can't burn this one because Water Bubble does that.


65/105/91/169/135/174 (739 BST, again)
Kyurem-White (Jolteon) @ Choice Specs/Life Orb/Heavy Duty Boosts/Magnet/Choice Scarf
Ability: Turboblaze
Tera Type: Electric
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid/Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- (E)lectro Shot
- (E)nergy Ball
- Shadow Ball/Weather Ball
- Volt Switch
This is a very new strat. Constantly firing off Electro Shots and gaining SpAtk and bypassing Ice Scales and Volt Absorb makes this mon very strong. In the case that some other mon takes up the Mold Breaker slot, Jolteon can opt for fusing with Chi Yu instead. Rain teams basically always require an electric immunity, and Jolteon heals when hit by electric type moves. If Rain stays a good weather, Jolteon could be a consistent member of rain teams.


40/118/103/165/128/185 (739 BST againnnnnn)
Kyogre (Wattrel) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Drizzle
Tera Type: Electric
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Thunder
- Hurricane
- (W)ater Spout
- Volt Switch/U-Turn
Worse Wingull. Has Volt Absorb.


These are both rain callers, but it's harder to use them as one. Wingull using up the Drizzle slot doesn't allow Alomomola or Pex to set rain defensively and switch out.


My hero

 

[BandedBodyPress]

Alphabet Soup Update

Soup had quite the vote, with us voting on 14 items. To keep this ban post short, I'm going to just address the things that had a change in their status.
Below is the rest of the vote outcomes.

rest of it

Alomomola - 2 Abstain, 2 DNB, 1 Ban
Ice Scales - 2 Abstain, 3 DNB
Marill - 1 Abstain, 3 DNB, 1 Ban
Regieleki - 1 Abstain, 2 DNB, 2 Ban
Revavroom - 4 Abstain, 1 Ban
Sand Rush+Sand Stream - 1 Abstain, 4 DNB
Sneasler - 4 Abstain, 1 DNB
Snorlax - 1 Abstain, 4 DNB
Squawkabilly - 1 Abstain, 3 DNB, 1 Ban

​

​

	Banded Body Press	TTLT	We Up	Pure Hackmons	Dasocks	RESULT
Magnemite	Ban	DNB	Abstain	Ban	Ban	Ban 3-1
Numel	DNB	Ban	DNB	Ban	Ban	Ban 3-2
Triage	Restrict	Restrict	Restrict	Restrict	Abstain	Restrict 4-0
Water Bubble	Restrict	Restrict	Restrict	Restrict	DNR	Restrict 4-1
Wingull	Ban	Ban	Ban	Ban	DNB	Ban 4-1

Magnemite, Numel, and Wingull are now banned from Alphabet Soup! Triage and Water Bubble are restricted!


M is one of the best letters with Alphabet Cup. Though it's usually used for healing with Milk Drink and spinning with Mortal Spin, Magnemite makes perfect use of it by getting STAB in Make it Rain and coverage in Matcha Gotcha, Moonblast, and Magma Storm. It's not as bulky as Magnezone or as fast as Magneton (barely), but it makes up for it in power. Off of scale, it has base 182 SpAtk, which it always raises to 205 by fusing with Miraidon, which is pushed even further with Hadron Engine giving it a 1.3333x boost to its SpAtk and giving its STAB electric type attacks a 1.3x boost. Magnemite benefits extremely from its base abilities Magnet Pull and Analytic, meaning Corviknight and other steel types are forces to take a Thunderbolt or whatever move is in its arsenal of evil. Whatever can switch out is forced to take an additional 1.3x boost thanks to Analytic, meaning that the only things that can safely switch into it is Ice Scales Snorlax, Hoodra, or Quagsire. Wait, it gets Matcha now, screw Quag. Its speed isn't nothing. Miraimite's 129 speed can threaten a lot. It actually runs boots for what it doesn't sometimes. Sturdy is the final ability that Miraimite makes use of, making it survive a hit from full on its uninvested bulk, and counter with an Analytic attack. If it's specs, or even any other item, if its slower it can Volt Switch into its opponent and deal incredible damage. Soup doesnt have many viable ground types, and those it does have fear Miraimite's Matcha Gotcha.

Hide

25/88/159/205/133/129 (739 BST)
Miraidon (Magnemite) @ Choice Specs/Heavy Duty Boots/Choice Scarf
Ability: Hadron Engine
Tera Type: Electric
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Volt Switch
- Make It Rain
- Matcha Gotcha
- Moonblast/Thunderbolt/Magma Storm


N is one of the worst letters in Alphabet Cup. There's like Night Daze, Nuzzle, Nasty Plot, and No Retreat. What can even make real use of No Retreat? Ghost types and Simple? Yep. Numel takes full advantage of Simple No Retreat and uses it to mow down unprepared teams. Its a special attacker that uses its STABs. Fire Blast, Flamethrower, or Magma Plume for fire, and Earth Power for Ground. It should be walled by Snorlax and WBB Corv, right? Well first, WBB Corv fell down a well. Second, it uses Turboblaze from KyuW. While it still doesn't appreciate AShield WBB Corv, that doesnt see usage anymore. Snorlax doesnt get to wall Numel because Numel is not other special attackers. It's mixed. Instead of dealing with Snorlax with its +2 162 Attack, it uses Body Press on its +2 110 Def. This will absolutely take care of Snorlax, especially if Snorlax switches into a full power +2 Earth Power. Snorlax may be able to get a Mortal Spin or Salt Cure in return, but all that does is put Numel on a timer. Numel can and will make full use of that timer so long as nothing with Aqua Jet is on the opposing team. Numel's only real weakness is that it's hard to get set up. However it can make full use of its teammate Alomomola and it's Aurora Veil. Plus it has good defensive and offensive type.


60/162/110/185/124/100 (741 BST)
Kyurem-White (Numel) @ Heavy-Duty Boots/Leftovers/Shed Shell
Ability: Turboblaze
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Fire Blast/Flamethrower/Magma Plume
- Earth Power
- Body Press
- No Retreat


Triage is very new to this metagame, only being able to fuse with Comfey for it on DLC2. It doesn't have some long storied history with Soup, but it did need to be banned. Conkeldurr exists. It has Guts, Iron Fist, 186 attack, Drain Punch, Bulk Up, Thunder Punch, and Knock Off. It can reverse sweep after one Bulk Up, which is really easy to get with its big bulk. It could not be statused again due to its burn. It resists Stealth Rocks. Idk how else to say it but unless you're a Ghost Type that can 1hko or Marill getting in safe you are not taking this thing out.


105/186/139/88/107/80 (705 BST)
Comfey (Conkeldurr) @ Flame Orb
Ability: Triage
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Drain Punch
- Knock Off
- Thunder Punch
- Bulk Up


I just did a whole dissertation on what these do just read the post above.

 

[adpg.2007]

A little bit late but...

INHERIMONS CUP DLC 2 CHANGES

With all the new mons and moves added in the DLC, the Metagame is gonna have some pretty cool changes, so... Here's the list of actions

Bans

Avalugg: a nearly unbreakable Physical Wall, it can run strong defensive abilities not affected by Mold Breaker like Intimidate, unlike special walls, so, after some testing, it got banned

Blaziken and his Preevos: Sorry, the chickens had to go. Providing one of the best abilities ever in Speed Boost, making strong Sweepers being able to snowball with no effort because, unlike Yanmega, those provides a wide and strong Movepool, mostly physical, but with some special tools too.

Deoxys-Speed: Yeah, we're not testing this, this thing is just too fast that even various scarfers can't outrun it, It also provides a very strong and wide movepool, with Support, Recovery, Hazards, Stat Boosting Moves and a wideworld attacking movepool, including Extreme Speed

Watchlist

Lucario: It got removed from the Watchlist because it have no usage, even with some pretty strong moves, it has useless abilities so it wasn't considered an option.

Chansey: the opposite of Avalugg, this is the nearly unbreakable special wall, unlike Avalugg, however, it lacks offensive presence, is forced to hold Eviolite and his abilities are mostly, Mold Breaker affected. Most of this applies to Blissey

Dragapult: a very debatable thing is that Dragapult is really healthy for this meta. It has presence on most offensive Teams, it can go physical, special, mixed, and has a pretty unmatched Speed tier.

Iron Bundle: mostly the same as Dragapult, but as a full special sweeper. It has an Speed Tier only matched by the unused Barraskewda, and is also really strong compared to other Pokemon with High Speed.

Sableye: Like in the base Inheritance, is an amazing defensive donor, Prankster Will-o-Wisp can be pretty unbeatable most of the time, and if you can technically, you need to be dark too because of Encore. You need to watch out for it

Restrictions

Burning Bulwark: this move basically inutilizes the physical attackers with no drawback, so get's restricted. Can be banned, thought, because Gourging Fire is a Great donor on his own right too.

Fickle Beam: pretty much a dice roll game, but if you're lucky enough, it can make the damage of Gigaton Hammer with no drawbacks and better offensive typing.

AND, that's all. Srry for not making this before, some things happen. Hope y'all enjoy the new meta of Inherimons Cup! The changes are little, but can be watched

 

[BandedBodyPress]

Restrictions

Burning Bulwark: this move basically inutilizes the physical attackers with no drawback, so get's restricted. Can be banned, thought, because Gourging Fire is a Great donor on his own right too.

Fickle Beam: pretty much a dice roll game, but if you're lucky enough, it can make the damage of Gigaton Hammer with no drawbacks and better offensive typing.

I disagree with both of these and let me tell you why.


Let’s go in order. First is Burning Bulwark. This isn’t even a true protect move, it’s a modified King’s Shield. You can still use status moves while your opponent is using it. Most things won’t run protect or the like anyways due to the massive drawback it comes with if you don’t accurately predict. I also don’t think burning is really the problem if you got Sableye with priority wisps running around + Sacred Fire unrestricted.

Good thing that there is no other B move that burns on contact+provides a good defensive type.

GRAHHHH Beak Blast jumpscare! This one can’t be taunted grahhhhh!


Next let’s look at Fickle Beam. This is a 160 base power move that comes with the drawback of being mid 70% of the time.

The offensive type in question here is Dragon. If you take a look at all the mons that could get Fickle Beam.

I sorted this by what gets Calm Mind and Nasty Plot. The optimal strategy for utilizing Fickle Beam is going to involve taking hits so you can get lucky enough to get a full power FB. Boosting and reliable healing is almost essential to that.

So what’s left is Fezandipiti, Flittle, Florges, Frosmoth, and Meowscarada.

Fezandipiti is kind of mid, but it allows access to either CM or NP, and gives you good STAB options in Dark Pulse, Moonblast, Sludge Bomb, and Shadow Ball. (For every mon on this list, Fire Blast, Fiery Dance, Fiery Wrath, Fleur Cannon, Freeze Dry, Freezing Shock and Flash Cannon are also options)

Florges is the same story but with worse abilities and it has fewer STAB options: Moonblast, Giga Drain, Psychic/Psychic Noise.

Meowscarada: Great move diversity and typing, but Protean is actually detrimental to setting up. You get Mortal Spin and Strength Sap tho. All the other M and S moves are great.

Flittle: Bro just ban Speed Boost you’ve banned over half of what can naturally get it. Flittle can run Calm Mind Stored Power.

Finally Frosmoth. I recognize that Ice Scales is banned. However, Frosmoth still has a good ability in Shield Dust, instant healing, Quiver Dance, Ice Beam, Giga Drain, Dazzling Gleam, all the F moves I mentioned, and Scald, Steam Eruption, Scorching Sands, Secret Sword, Seed Flare, Shadow Ball, Sludge Bomb, and Strange Steam.

Now I don’t want to argue that Frosmoth is probably the best user of this move. But I don’t think Hydrapple is far behind.

First off Regen. Second off, still has Nasty Plot. It has access to Giga Drain, Hydro Pump, Hydro Steam, Earth Power, Apple Acid, Aeroblast, Discharge and Doom Desire.

Im just trying to illustrate the point that these don’t have that much difference to each other and limiting your metagame to one user of Fickle Beam might not be necessary at all.

Plus even if Frosmoth is a problem, Ice Scales is already banned. And you could argue that you can unban it if Frosmoth is gone due to Frosmoth getting Quiver Dance and Flip Turn.

Edit: oh you can also have Torch Song Fickle Beam Talonflame

 

[adpg.2007]

I disagree with both of these and let me tell you why.


Let’s go in order. First is Burning Bulwark. This isn’t even a true protect move, it’s a modified King’s Shield. You can still use status moves while your opponent is using it. Most things won’t run protect or the like anyways due to the massive drawback it comes with if you don’t accurately predict. I also don’t think burning is really the problem if you got Sableye with priority wisps running around + Sacred Fire unrestricted.

Good thing that there is no other B move that burns on contact+provides a good defensive type.
View attachment 583510
GRAHHHH Beak Blast jumpscare! This one can’t be taunted grahhhhh!


Next let’s look at Fickle Beam. This is a 160 base power move that comes with the drawback of being mid 70% of the time.

The offensive type in question here is Dragon. If you take a look at all the mons that could get Fickle Beam.
View attachment 583511
View attachment 583514I sorted this by what gets Calm Mind and Nasty Plot. The optimal strategy for utilizing Fickle Beam is going to involve taking hits so you can get lucky enough to get a full power FB. Boosting and reliable healing is almost essential to that.

So what’s left is Fezandipiti, Flittle, Florges, Frosmoth, and Meowscarada.

Fezandipiti is kind of mid, but it allows access to either CM or NP, and gives you good STAB options in Dark Pulse, Moonblast, Sludge Bomb, and Shadow Ball. (For every mon on this list, Fire Blast, Fiery Dance, Fiery Wrath, Fleur Cannon, Freeze Dry, Freezing Shock and Flash Cannon are also options)

Florges is the same story but with worse abilities and it has fewer STAB options: Moonblast, Giga Drain, Psychic/Psychic Noise.

Meowscarada: Great move diversity and typing, but Protean is actually detrimental to setting up. You get Mortal Spin and Strength Sap tho. All the other M and S moves are great.

Flittle: Bro just ban Speed Boost you’ve banned over half of what can naturally get it. Flittle can run Calm Mind Stored Power.

Finally Frosmoth. I recognize that Ice Scales is banned. However, Frosmoth still has a good ability in Shield Dust, instant healing, Quiver Dance, Ice Beam, Giga Drain, Dazzling Gleam, all the F moves I mentioned, and Scald, Steam Eruption, Scorching Sands, Secret Sword, Seed Flare, Shadow Ball, Sludge Bomb, and Strange Steam.

Now I don’t want to argue that Frosmoth is probably the best user of this move. But I don’t think Hydrapple is far behind.

First off Regen. Second off, still has Nasty Plot. It has access to Giga Drain, Hydro Pump, Hydro Steam, Earth Power, Apple Acid, Aeroblast, Discharge and Doom Desire.

Im just trying to illustrate the point that these don’t have that much difference to each other and limiting your metagame to one user of Fickle Beam might not be necessary at all.

Plus even if Frosmoth is a problem, Ice Scales is already banned. And you could argue that you can unban it if Frosmoth is gone due to Frosmoth getting Quiver Dance and Flip Turn.

Thanks for all your thoughts. Honestly I did those pretty fast thinking because I was in a Rush moment with no internet and I wanted to get the Meta semi-updated atleast for the time.

I still don't find people for Council, so help from more experienced players is well recieved.

Gotta make some changes soon, starting with a better analysis of all what the DLC got.

 

[adpg.2007]

Well. The thoughts from before make me realize that I really rushed the new rules, so...

QUICK SECOND CHANGES FOR THE DLC TO INHERIMONS CUP

Bans and Unbans

The Birds and Speed Boost: Before this DLC, the Espathra and Yanma line were the only ones with Speed Boost, with the Espathra line being to only broken. Know that most of them are broken by Speed Boost and not for themselves, so are getting unbanned and Speed Boost banned.

Also, I think Water Bubble is banned from Base Inheritance already. If for some reason it isn't, then I ban it manually

Restrictions

Burning Bulwark: I didn't test this move enough at the moment, if I would know this was a King Shield, probably I wasn't restricting it. So get's unrestricted

Sacred Fire: GOD DAMMIT, HOW I didn't realize this was free? I literally hate Ho-oh for how uncompetitive this move is. 100 Base Power with 50% of Burning in an already amazing letter like S.

Beak Blast: This move is... I truly pass this out of the radar, but It has a big Base Power and a strong defensive usage in, again, burning.

Watchlist

Quiver Dance: this time, for getting banned as a whole. This moves is in pretty strong bases like Frosmoth and Masquerain, with good moves as bases, but also giving the strong letters S, F and M. Letters with powerful moves like Steam Eruption, Secret Sword, Seed Flare, Matcha Gotcha, Make It Rain, recovery in Milk Drink and Slack Off, and utility like Mortal Spin. Other abusers of this can be Quagsire inherited Mons, abusing an strong Unaware + Boosting combo.

Secret Sword: Even if Normal/Ghost is a type you would see more often here, the way this move workout with Shadow Ball is absolutely perfect, so probably thinking about hardlocking this is something for the good.

And that's all. Sorry for rushing things. It's been a rough day for me but I Hope y'all have a Happy holidays (if you celebrate them, ofc). Also it allows me to tell that...

I'M SEARCHING FOR COUNCIL MEMBERS.

How y'all see, this have been pretty... Funny to manage for me, but the recent events show that I need some help, so I'f you think you're qualified for the task and are gonna be active, message me here or on Showdown.

 

[adpg.2007]

After multiple tests myself and in the Room

DRAGAPULT IS BANNED FROM INHERIMONS CUP

Being Inherimons a mostly BST Based Meta, the absolute blazing and unmatched Speed Tier of Dragapult in 142, the mixed offenses in 120/100 and decent bulk for an offensive mon in 88/75/75 make it enough for getting banned.

Pretty obvious anyways, but I'm dumb, lol

 

[Notgamingreally]

https://pokepast.es/de02ee67c217d167 yo I made a Pokebilities bh team

This shit needs to be banned ngl forcing ting lu is very, very bad it 2hkos scales mega ttar with beads after minor chip

Can improof mirai and handles spa mons nicely

Breakers being like nigh un improofable means chansey is fantastic

Improofs ting lu, good fc mon

Regen+scales is an interesting combo. Improofed by ghostceus

Wanted smth interesting to deal with the dear, does big boy damage into anything that isn’t like ho oh

Also so many of the Megas are like, somewhat interesting in poke bh but idk if their really that good stuff like
looks interesting considering how much it runs regen in standard, also mildly less passive after poison and can pivot on glare

 

[BandedBodyPress]

Alphabet Soup Update

Because Alphabet Soup had such a large vote last time, and that's going to be repeated. We had watchlisted so many mons that we could only really assess the most broken parts. Now due to the best and worst filtered out, we should have a smaller and smaller power watch list. We had 13 last time, we have 16 now.

No Change votes

	BBP	TTLT	We Up	Dasocks	PH	Result
Alomomola	DNB	Ban	DNB	Ban	DNB	DNB (3-2)
Marill	DNB	DNB	DNB	DNB	Ban	DNB (4-1)
Pikipek	DNB	DNB	Ban	DNB	Ban	DNB (3-2)
Quagsire	DNB	DNB	DNB	DNB	DNB	DNB (5-0)
Revavroom	DNB	DNB	Abstain	DNB	Abstain	DNB (3-0)
Sand Rush+Sand Stream	DNB	DNB	Ban	DNB	Abstain	DNB (3-1)
Revival Blessing	Unban and Restrict	Keep Banned	Keep Banned	Keep Banned	Keep Banned	Keep Banned (4-1)

	Banded Body Press	True L Taker	We Up	Dasocks	Pure Hackmons	RESULT
Blobs	Unban	Unban	Abstain	Unban	Unban	Unban (4-0)
Conkeldurr	Ban	Ban	Abstain	Ban	Abstain	Ban (3-0)
Gurdurr	Ban	Ban	Abstain	Ban	Abstain	Ban (3-0)
Ice Scales	DNR	Restrict	Abstain	Restrict	Restrict	Restrict (3-1)
Lokix	Ban	Ban	DNB	Ban	Ban	Ban (4-1)
Regieleki	DNB	Ban	Ban	DNB	Ban	Ban (3-2)
Salt Cure	Restrict	DNR	Restrict	DNR	Restrict	Restrict (3-2)
Sneasler	Ban	Ban	Abstain	Ban	Abstain	Ban (3-0)
Triage	Unrestrict	Unrestrict	Keep Restricted	Unrestrict	Keep Restricted	Unrestrict (3-2)
Trumbeak	Ban	Ban	Ban	Ban	Ban	Ban (5-0)

Keep reading to understand why these still exist


If you remember the last update, we restricted Triage mainly due to its set on Conkeldurr. The tiering precedent would be to ban Conkeldurr, but the entire Timburr line does exactly the same thing, although Timburr itself is already banned. Its been seen more and more that the Conkeldurr line is just fundamentally broken in this metagame, even Timburr has decent bulk and massive attack and the best speed in the line, and each evolution just makes the Pokemon bulkier and bulkier. Conkeldurr recently is also making a name for itself on Trick Room, but that doesnt really factor in. Bottom line is the Timburr line is destroying an archetype of mon. So we really had to decide between Comfey and murdering an entire family. Anyways Timburr, Gurdurr, and Conkeldurr were banned and Triage is unrestricted.


Ice Scales has ultimately been a restricting force in the metagame forever. Before 2 Ability Clause, the ability was so valuable that people would put Snom as a fusion in addition to Frosmoth. But Ice Scales has evolved overall. It started out to make just any mon a strong special attacking sweeper, so that they could use whatever tools they had naturally to counter sweepers. Things like Quagsire, Slowpoke, Sableye and others would just slap on Ice Scales and be an actually very good special defensive wall. But these special attackers kept getting stronger, requiring stronger walls, and the special walls got powercrept as well. Snorlax, Marill, and Hoodra all became the sole special walls. Ignoring their type differences: Snorlax and Hoodra have Salt Cure, Stone Axe, and cannot be poisoned; Snorlax and Marill can both spin and poison with Mortal Spin; Hoodra and Marill can both Knock off; and Marill can actually do damage. But these walls are (or were in Marill's case, Marill pivoted to offense) so strong in their role that Tail Glow and Beads of Ruined became not balanced, but kind of weak. Pretty much every special attacker is forced to use Turboblaze to get around Ice Scales, as even Psystrike and Secret Sword don't ignore it. The inevitable truth is that everything that would use Ice Scales is now going to switch to using Vessel of Ruin, which is about 66% the effectiveness. Additionally, Turboblaze no longer circumvents these special walls. Turboblaze and other moldy abilities not only got around Fluffy, Ice Scales, and type immune abilities. They do not ignore Vessel. If the watch list is even bigger than it is now, this restriction is why.

Also unbanned Blobs because they provide different and not objectively better value than Snorlax.


160/143/90/106/149/50 (698 BST)
Frosmoth (Snorlax) @ Leftovers
Ability: Ice Scales
Tera Type: Normal
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Shore Up
- Mortal Spin
- Stone Axe
- Salt Cure


80/116/115/141/172/76 (700 BST)
Frosmoth (Goodra-Hisui) @Covert Cloak
Ability: Ice Scales
Tera Type: Dragon
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Shore Up
- Knock Off
- Stone Axe
- Salt Cure


I'm kind of sad to see him go, but it needed to happen. Lokix was way too enabling for stall teams. Its not a stall mon, obviously. But it is the ultimate entry as the sole offensive pressure in stall. Lokix is hard as hell to switch in, being whittled down by rocks and very frail. But stall teams enable it by having slow bulky pivots like Corviknight, Alomomola, Corviknight, Clefable, etc getting it in without having to worry about attacks doing massive damage. With Alo especially, any damage it could take from rocks is invalidated by its wish passes. This further enables it to forgo boots, and opt for choice bands, lorbs, or even silver powder. It main attack is also a Sword of Ruin/Adaptability U-Turn or First Impression. Coinjoined with its massive speed, attack, and natural Tinted Lens, this basically guarantees that its safe by its nature of First Impression hitting first, or not being able to be hit by switching to its beefy teammates, allowing the process to repeat. On top of that, there arent really any defensive measures for Lokix, further incentivizing stall teams to run a Lokix, but faster. This is without mentioning Knock Off, which makes stall teams even more vulnerable for the rest of the game. The original set for Lokix used Crawdaunt, which gives it Adaptability and 30 Atk + 13 Speed. The speed creep started when Lokix started running Basculegion, who fuses to give 28 AtK and 19 Speed. This happened once more with Basculin (23, 24) before reaching its final form, Chien Pao. This no longer used Adapt, and opted for the less strong Sword of Ruin so it could speed creep. That sounds like a fair trade off before you realize that this thing still has 172 Attack, stab U-Turn, stab Knock Off, one of the fastest speed tiers in soup, and still mostly runs Choice Band.


70/172/128/94/92/161 (718 BST)
Chien Pao (Lokix) @ Choice Band/Life Orb/Silver Powder
Ability: Sword of Ruin
Tera Type: Bug
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- U-turn
- Knock Off
- First Impression
- Leech Life/Noxious Torque


Regieleki was banned at the start of the format because it added on 50 speed as a fusion, and Electric Terrain teams were at their strongest, so introducing a mon which made those Rising Voltages functionally 210 base power, not factoring in STAB or Terrain, seemed like a recipe for disaster. But that was Regieleki as a fusion. When it was unbanned as a test, it was not a popular fusion. Instead of fusing to power other Rising Voltages, it took on Miraidon and used its own. It now had an incredible 137 base special attack and 241 speed. This is even faster than the previous speed king of Soup that set a field condition to make its main attack stronger, Wingull. This also allows it to run full special attack and specs without the fear of being outsped. While the regular answer to anything Regieleki related is to swap in a ground type against it, that's not as viable an option. There are maybe like 7 viable ground types in all of Soup, and only like 3 of them see regular usage (Excadrill, Quagsire, Silicobra). It wasn't a beneficiary of electric terrain, it was the reason to use electric terrain.

80/125/77/137/80/241 (740 BST)
Miraidon (Regieleki) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Hadron Engine
Tera Type: Electric
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Rising Voltage
- Tera Blast
- Ruination/Razor Leaf
- Volt Switch


Salt Cure just might be a more influential ban than Ice Scales. "S" has so many Pokemon and moves that it is by far the most busted letter to have. Salt Cure might be the best move for the best letter. It forces offensive mons to take between 12.5-25% of their health every turn and wear them down more. Defensive mons the same, but theyre even more incentivized to stay out. But Salt Cure is mainly for defensive mons who do damage to things that they cannot chip down otherwise, mainly with Snorlax not hitting steel types. It also forces steel types to switch out so that the defensive mon, usually Snorlax, can pressure in a Mortal Spin to get rid of its hazards. Though this was sometimes taken advantage of, with some things like Kingambit using the opportunity to set up against a mon that could do nothing to it. Also theres like 4 water types, so I hope they get a bounceback.


Getting banned for like, a third time. The set that ruined everyone's day was different this time. With past paradoxes themself becoming more valuable (Drought+Proto unbanned) and fully able to utilize Dire Claw, Sneasler's Booster Energy Swords Dance set was swapped for a Serene Grace set. Dire Claw gives it the ability to paralyze, sleep, or poison any non-steel 33% of the time each, and steels still have to eat a Close Combat. Gholdengo is immune to both of these, but Sacred Fire is its final attack, and Serene Grace makes it burn 100% of the time 95% of the time. Its also non contact so Fluffy hates it.


Shaymin-Sky (Sneasler) @ Life Orb/Leftovers/Choice Band
Ability: Serene Grace
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Close Combat
- Dire Claw
- Sacred Fire
- Swords Dance/U-Turn


So Trumbeak got banned, but not Pikipek? Yeah, this is becauase Trumbeak is better. They both get Skill Link Pop Bomb, Bullet Seed, Dual Wingbeat, and Pyro Ball, so it obviously runs Technician. Pikipek has better stats for an immediate attacker anyway. What does Trumbeak get that makes it so much better? Well, to start with its bases. Pikipek has a very very good attack and speed, 184, and 159. Stronger and faster than Deoxys Attack. Trumbeak only has 154 and 136. These are very good, too, but not for an immediate attacker. Well, that leads me to bring up its next point: it is a set up sweeper. It has more than double the bulk, allowing it to take a hit, especially behind veil, and sweep teams with one Tidy Up. Its speed allows it to run max attack to easily score more kills and still outspeed thanks to its 164 base speed with Ambipom. Lets get back to its moveset. Pop Bomb is for massive damage to anything that breathes (get it, ghosts). It has access to Dual Wingbeat for good stab damage, Pyro Ball for non-WBB Corvs (WBB Corv is back) and Fluffy, and Bullet Seed for Fluffy and 1HKO'ing Houndstone Alomomola at +0. It usually has to choose between one of these moves, as its last slot is taken up by something curiously absent from Pikipek's set: Rock Blast. Looking at the rest of its moves, Skeledirge and WBB Corv still wall it, but not with Rock Blast they do. It also gets other attacks like Triple Axel, Triple Dive, and Triple Kick.


55/179/106/87/106/164 (697 BST)
Ambipom (Trumbeak) @ Protective Pads
Ability: Technician
Tera Type: Normal
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Population Bomb
- Rock Blast
- Bullet Seed/Pyro Ball/Triple Axel/Triple Dive/Dual Wingbeat/Triple Kick
- Tidy Up

 

[StompyStomps]

Here is my idea for an OMM, this is Bouns STAB! This OM combines Bonus Type, meaning pick Extra Type with Tera Type, which gives you all moves of that Tera Type thanks to STABmons. Allow me to show you a couple of sets for this OMM
Basculegion @ Life Orb
Ability: Adaptability
Tera Type: Dragon
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Surging Strikes
- Poltergeist
- Glaive Rush
wanna see a magic trick?
ABRA KADABRA!

funny calc

+2 252 Atk Life Orb Adaptability Tera Dragon Basculegion Glaive Rush vs. 252 HP / 192+ Def Toxapex: 338-400 (111.1 - 131.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Archaludon @ Assault Vest
Ability: Stamina
Tera Type: Flying
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Electro Shot
- Body Press
- Draco Meteor
- Hurricane
This makes Archaludon much harder to deal with offensively

Darkrai @ Focus Sash
Ability: Bad Dreams
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Nasty Plot
- Hypnosis
- Fiery Wrath
- Moonblast
Focus Sash Hypnosis, with STAB Moonblast? This should hurt

Toxapex @ Assault Vest
Ability: Regenerator
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Impish Nature
- Mortal Spin
- Flip Turn
- Knock Off
- Clear Smog
because fuck you in particular
this is just a concept, but I would be happy if someone could help make it real!

 

[longhiep341]

Here is my idea for an OMM, this is Bouns STAB! This OM combines Bonus Type, meaning pick Extra Type with Tera Type, which gives you all moves of that Tera Type thanks to STABmons. Allow me to show you a couple of sets for this OMM
Basculegion @ Life Orb
Ability: Adaptability
Tera Type: Dragon
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Surging Strikes
- Poltergeist
- Glaive Rush
wanna see a magic trick?
ABRA KADABRA!

funny calc

+2 252 Atk Life Orb Adaptability Tera Dragon Basculegion Glaive Rush vs. 252 HP / 192+ Def Toxapex: 338-400 (111.1 - 131.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Archaludon @ Assault Vest
Ability: Stamina
Tera Type: Flying
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Electro Shot
- Body Press
- Draco Meteor
- Hurricane
This makes Archaludon much harder to deal with offensively

Darkrai @ Focus Sash
Ability: Bad Dreams
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Nasty Plot
- Hypnosis
- Fiery Wrath
- Moonblast
Focus Sash Hypnosis, with STAB Moonblast? This should hurt

Toxapex @ Assault Vest
Ability: Regenerator
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Impish Nature
- Mortal Spin
- Flip Turn
- Knock Off
- Clear Smog
because fuck you in particular
this is just a concept, but I would be happy if someone could help make it real!

Unfortunately, it's not possible since STABmons only looks at a Pokemon's original typing and there's no way around this.

Also to discuss something else, I have updated the banlist for TSAAA. Notable changes include:
Eviolite is now freed. Grab your Chansey, grab your Rhydon, grab your Porygon2, it's gonna be a wild night (it's actually painful when you consider aerobee)
Most of Ubers are freed. Some exceptions are Calyrex-S, Ho-Oh, among others. Ho-Oh was the strongest or second strongest Pokemon last gen and the lowest peak boost makes me think it will be too dominant.
Reminder that Tera, Poison Heal and FurScales are still allowed.
And the elephant in the room

I can't believe I'm saying this, but this thing is free for now. Based on the games I have seen, it surprisingly has not taken over. You probably recall Slaking in AAA and wonder how a similar Pokemon that receives an extra 150 BST should even be considered. The main factor that made me change my decision is its lack of a setup option. With the cut of Power-Up Punch, Regigigas really has 0 way to boost its Attack, unlike Slaking's Bulk Up. No Slack Off is also a downside of sort even if it's not easy to wear down, this is pretty much the case for all Poison Heal Pokemon. In fact it even competes with Dudunsparce since Dudunsparce has Coil and can even tech stuffs like Dragon Tail to prevent counterplay. Obviously Regigigas's still very strong and pretty much guarantees progress long-term, between Facade and Knock Off's 32 PP easily running Fur Coat mons out of recovery PP, but I view this as a good thing unless it will be shown to bulldoze utterly anything. But for now it shall stay free, it might even end up healthy, who knows...

 

[Clas]

POST-DLC POKEAAABILITIES UPDATE 2​

Hi, we're alive for now. Anyway, we finally updated this tier's banlist with some very important updates that should've come three weeks ago, admittedly. Nevertheless, we did some stuff, and it'll be shown in three parts.


PART 1: NEW BROKENS

This'll come to nobody's surprise, but there are some new legendaries that just shouldn't be here! We collectively voted on them all at the same time instead of individually, so here's the list!

Deoxys-Attack​

Deoxys-Base​

Ho-Oh​

Kyurem-Black​

Kyurem-White​

Lugia​

Lunala​

Necrozma-Dawn-Wings​

Necrozma-Dusk-Mane​

Reshiram​

Solgaleo​

Zekrom​

PART 2: OTHER THREATS​

While there are some clearly big threats, there are also some notable other problem Pokemon that are equally potent. Some of these are obvious, while others are less immediately clear for some. These were voted individually and so will have the full vote list.

	Clas	Eggs	longhiep341	RICEMAN	RESULT
Darkrai	Ban	Ban	Ban	Ban	4-0 Ban
Keldeo	Ban	Ban	Abstain	Abstain	2-0 Ban
Kyurem	Ban	Ban	Ban	Ban	4-0 Ban
Ogerpon-Hearthflame	Ban	Ban	Abstain	Ban	3-0 Ban
Porygon-Z	Ban	Ban	Ban	Ban	4-0 Ban
Ursaluna-Bloodmoon	DNB	Ban	Abstain	DNB	1-2 DNB
Weavile	Ban	Ban	Ban	Abstain	3-0 Ban
Toxic Debris	Ban	Ban	DNB	DNB	2-2 DNB

Darkrai, Keldeo, Kyurem, Ogerpon-Hearthflame, Porygon-Z, and Weavile are banned! Ursaluna-Bloodmoon and Toxic Debris stay legal!

PART 3: OLD FACES​

That's not to say that this is only a ban slate! We also considered some previously borderline that could be considered in the new DLC to be unbanned. Like part 2, these were individually voted on.

	Clas	Eggs	longhiep341	RICEMAN	RESULT
Basculegion	DNU	DNU	Abstain	Unban	2-1 DNU
Basculin	DNU	DNU	Abstain	Unban	2-1 DNU
Zoroark-Hisui	Unban	Unban	Unban	Unban	4-0 Unban

Zoroark-Hisui is freed! Basculin and Basculegion stay banned!

PART 4: RESULTS​

In summary, Darkrai, Keldeo, Kyurem, Ogerpon-Hearthflame, Porygon-Z, Weavile, Deoxys-Attack, Deoxys-Base, Ho-Oh, Lugia, Lunala, Necrozma-Dawn-Wings, Necrozma-Dusk-Mane, Reshiram, Solgaleo, and Zekrom are banned! Zoroark-Hisui is freed!

New Codes

/challenge gen9pokebilities @@@ !Obtainable Abilities, Ability Clause = 1, Sleep Moves Clause, Terastal Clause, AAA Restricted Abilities, *Comatose, *Contrary, *Fur Coat, *Good as Gold, *Gorilla Tactics, *Huge Power, *Ice Scales, *Illusion, *Imposter, *Innards Out, *Magic Bounce, -Magnet Pull, *Neutralizing Gas, *Orichalcum Pulse, *Parental Bond, *Poison Heal, *Pure Power, *Simple, *Speed Boost, *Stakeout, *Unburden, *Water Bubble, *Wonder Guard, -Annihilape, -Basculin, -Basculegion, -Baxcalibur, -Chien-Pao, -Clefable, -Conkeldurr, -Darkrai, -Deoxys-Attack, -Deoxys-Base, -Dragapult, -Dragonite, - Enamorus-Base, -Espathra, -Gholdengo, -Great Tusk, -Hariyama, -Ho-Oh, -Hoopa-Unbound, -Iron Hands, -Iron Valiant, -Keldeo, -Kingambit, -Kyurem, -Lugia, -Lunala, -Magearna, -Necrozma-Dawn-Wings, -Necrozma-Dusk-Mane, -Noivern, -Ogerpon-Hearthflame, -Porygon-Z, -Reshiram, -Sneasler, -Solgaleo, -Spectrier, -Ursaluna, -Urshifu, -Urshifu-Rapid-Strike, -Walking Wake, -Weavile, -Zapdos-Galar, -Zekrom, -Comatose, -Revival Blessing, -Regenerator + Wimp Out, -Regenerator > 1, -Drizzle + Swift Swim, -Primordial Sea + Swift Swim, -Drought + Chlorophyll, -Desolate Land + Chlorophyll, -Electric Surge + Surge Surfer, -Hadron Engine + Surge Surfer, -Hadron Engine + Quark Drive, -Electric Surge + Quark Drive, -Drought + Protosynthesis, +Regieleki, +Palafin

/tour new [Gen 9] Pokebilities, Elimination,,,[Gen 9] Pokebilities AAA
/tour rules !Obtainable Abilities, Ability Clause = 1, Sleep Moves Clause, Terastal Clause, AAA Restricted Abilities, *Comatose, *Contrary, *Fur Coat, *Good as Gold, *Gorilla Tactics, *Huge Power, *Ice Scales, *Illusion, *Imposter, *Innards Out, *Magic Bounce, -Magnet Pull, *Neutralizing Gas, *Orichalcum Pulse, *Parental Bond, *Poison Heal, *Pure Power, *Simple, *Speed Boost, *Stakeout, *Unburden, *Water Bubble, *Wonder Guard, -Annihilape, -Basculin, -Basculegion, -Baxcalibur, -Chien-Pao, -Clefable, -Conkeldurr, -Darkrai, -Deoxys-Attack, -Deoxys-Base, -Dragapult, -Dragonite, - Enamorus-Base, -Espathra, -Gholdengo, -Great Tusk, -Hariyama, -Ho-Oh, -Hoopa-Unbound, -Iron Hands, -Iron Valiant, -Keldeo, -Kingambit, -Kyurem, -Lugia, -Lunala, -Magearna, -Necrozma-Dawn-Wings, -Necrozma-Dusk-Mane, -Noivern, -Ogerpon-Hearthflame, -Porygon-Z, -Reshiram, -Sneasler, -Solgaleo, -Spectrier, -Ursaluna, -Urshifu, -Urshifu-Rapid-Strike, -Walking Wake, -Weavile, -Zapdos-Galar, -Zekrom, -Comatose, -Revival Blessing, -Regenerator + Wimp Out, -Regenerator > 1, -Drizzle + Swift Swim, -Primordial Sea + Swift Swim, -Drought + Chlorophyll, -Desolate Land + Chlorophyll, -Electric Surge + Surge Surfer, -Hadron Engine + Surge Surfer, -Hadron Engine + Quark Drive, -Electric Surge + Quark Drive, -Drought + Protosynthesis, +Regieleki, +Palafin
/tour autostart 10
/tour autodq 7

(This will also affect HGPL! Tagging sundays)

 

[Schpoonman]

POST-DLC POKEAAABILITIES UPDATE 2​

Hi, we're alive for now. Anyway, we finally updated this tier's banlist with some very important updates that should've come three weeks ago, admittedly. Nevertheless, we did some stuff, and it'll be shown in three parts.


PART 1: NEW BROKENS

This'll come to nobody's surprise, but there are some new legendaries that just shouldn't be here! We collectively voted on them all at the same time instead of individually, so here's the list!

Deoxys-Attack​

Deoxys-Base​

Ho-Oh​

Kyurem-Black​

Kyurem-White​

Lugia​

Lunala​

Necrozma-Dawn-Wings​

Necrozma-Dusk-Mane​

Reshiram​

Solgaleo​

Zekrom​

PART 2: OTHER THREATS​

While there are some clearly big threats, there are also some notable other problem Pokemon that are equally potent. Some of these are obvious, while others are less immediately clear for some. These were voted individually and so will have the full vote list.

	Clas	Eggs	longhiep341	RICEMAN	RESULT
Darkrai	Ban	Ban	Ban	Ban	4-0 Ban
Keldeo	Ban	Ban	Abstain	Abstain	2-0 Ban
Kyurem	Ban	Ban	Ban	Ban	4-0 Ban
Ogerpon-Hearthflame	Ban	Ban	Abstain	Ban	3-0 Ban
Porygon-Z	Ban	Ban	Ban	Ban	4-0 Ban
Ursaluna-Bloodmoon	DNB	Ban	Abstain	DNB	1-2 DNB
Weavile	Ban	Ban	Ban	Abstain	3-0 Ban
Toxic Debris	Ban	Ban	Abstain	Abstain	2-0 Ban

Darkrai, Keldeo, Kyurem, Ogerpon-Hearthflame, Porygon-Z, and Weavile are banned! Ursaluna-Bloodmoon and Toxic Debris stay legal!

PART 3: OLD FACES​

That's not to say that this is only a ban slate! We also considered some previously borderline that could be considered in the new DLC to be unbanned. Like part 2, these were individually voted on.

	Clas	Eggs	longhiep341	RICEMAN	RESULT
Basculegion	DNU	DNU	Abstain	Unban	2-1 DNU
Basculin	DNU	DNU	Abstain	Unban	2-1 DNU
Zoroark-Hisui	Unban	Unban	Unban	Unban	4-0 Unban

Zoroark-Hisui is freed! Basculin and Basculegion stay banned!

PART 4: RESULTS​

In summary, Darkrai, Keldeo, Kyurem, Ogerpon-Hearthflame, Porygon-Z, Weavile, Deoxys-Attack, Deoxys-Base, Ho-Oh, Lugia, Lunala, Necrozma-Dawn-Wings, Necrozma-Dusk-Mane, Reshiram, Solgaleo, and Zekrom are banned! Zoroark-Hisui is freed!

New Codes

/challenge gen9pokebilities @@@ !Obtainable Abilities, Ability Clause = 1, Sleep Moves Clause, Terastal Clause, AAA Restricted Abilities, *Comatose, *Contrary, *Fur Coat, *Good as Gold, *Gorilla Tactics, *Huge Power, *Ice Scales, *Illusion, *Imposter, *Innards Out, *Magic Bounce, -Magnet Pull, *Neutralizing Gas, *Orichalcum Pulse, *Parental Bond, *Poison Heal, *Pure Power, *Simple, *Speed Boost, *Stakeout, *Unburden, *Water Bubble, *Wonder Guard, -Annihilape, -Basculin, -Basculegion, -Baxcalibur, -Chien-Pao, -Clefable, -Conkeldurr, -Darkrai, -Deoxys-Attack, -Deoxys-Base, -Dragapult, -Dragonite, - Enamorus-Base, -Espathra, -Gholdengo, -Great Tusk, -Hariyama, -Ho-Oh, -Hoopa-Unbound, -Iron Hands, -Iron Valiant, -Keldeo, -Kingambit, -Kyurem, -Lugia, -Lunala, -Magearna, -Necrozma-Dawn-Wings, -Necrozma-Dusk-Mane, -Noivern, -Ogerpon-Hearthflame, -Porygon-Z, -Reshiram, -Sneasler, -Solgaleo, -Spectrier, -Ursaluna, -Urshifu, -Urshifu-Rapid-Strike, -Walking Wake, -Weavile, -Zapdos-Galar, -Zekrom, -Comatose, -Revival Blessing, -Regenerator + Wimp Out, -Regenerator > 1, -Drizzle + Swift Swim, -Primordial Sea + Swift Swim, -Drought + Chlorophyll, -Desolate Land + Chlorophyll, -Electric Surge + Surge Surfer, -Hadron Engine + Surge Surfer, -Hadron Engine + Quark Drive, -Electric Surge + Quark Drive, -Drought + Protosynthesis, +Regieleki, +Palafin

/tour new [Gen 9] Pokebilities, Elimination,,,[Gen 9] Pokebilities AAA
/tour rules !Obtainable Abilities, Ability Clause = 1, Sleep Moves Clause, Terastal Clause, AAA Restricted Abilities, *Comatose, *Contrary, *Fur Coat, *Good as Gold, *Gorilla Tactics, *Huge Power, *Ice Scales, *Illusion, *Imposter, *Innards Out, *Magic Bounce, -Magnet Pull, *Neutralizing Gas, *Orichalcum Pulse, *Parental Bond, *Poison Heal, *Pure Power, *Simple, *Speed Boost, *Stakeout, *Unburden, *Water Bubble, *Wonder Guard, -Annihilape, -Basculin, -Basculegion, -Baxcalibur, -Chien-Pao, -Clefable, -Conkeldurr, -Darkrai, -Deoxys-Attack, -Deoxys-Base, -Dragapult, -Dragonite, - Enamorus-Base, -Espathra, -Gholdengo, -Great Tusk, -Hariyama, -Ho-Oh, -Hoopa-Unbound, -Iron Hands, -Iron Valiant, -Keldeo, -Kingambit, -Kyurem, -Lugia, -Lunala, -Magearna, -Necrozma-Dawn-Wings, -Necrozma-Dusk-Mane, -Noivern, -Ogerpon-Hearthflame, -Porygon-Z, -Reshiram, -Sneasler, -Solgaleo, -Spectrier, -Ursaluna, -Urshifu, -Urshifu-Rapid-Strike, -Walking Wake, -Weavile, -Zapdos-Galar, -Zekrom, -Comatose, -Revival Blessing, -Regenerator + Wimp Out, -Regenerator > 1, -Drizzle + Swift Swim, -Primordial Sea + Swift Swim, -Drought + Chlorophyll, -Desolate Land + Chlorophyll, -Electric Surge + Surge Surfer, -Hadron Engine + Surge Surfer, -Hadron Engine + Quark Drive, -Electric Surge + Quark Drive, -Drought + Protosynthesis, +Regieleki, +Palafin
/tour autostart 10
/tour autodq 7

(This will also affect HGPL! Tagging sundays)

Toxic Debris got 2 ban votes and 2 abstentions and you have the result as a ban on the table, but say it's unbanned and I don't see it in the code (unless it's included in the AAA clauses).

EDIT:

Abstains don't count as DNB votes in this instance

I think I understand that, so if I'm reading the votes correctly (2 to ban, none to DNB), shouldn't Toxic Debris be banned? How does Keldeo's vote result in its ban but not Toxic Debris?

 

[Velcroc]

Toxic Debris got 2 ban votes and 2 abstentions and you have the result as a ban on the table, but say it's unbanned and I don't see it in the code (unless it's included in the AAA clauses).

Abstains don't count as DNB votes in this instance

 

[Clas]

Toxic Debris got 2 ban votes and 2 abstentions and you have the result as a ban on the table, but say it's unbanned and I don't see it in the code (unless it's included in the AAA clauses).

EDIT:

I think I understand that, so if I'm reading the votes correctly (2 to ban, none to DNB), shouldn't Toxic Debris be banned? How does Keldeo's vote result in its ban but not Toxic Debris?

OOPS THATS 2 DNB

 

[BandedBodyPress]

Alphabet Soup Update

Alphabet Soup has become kinda repetitive with its super large ban votes due to partially to me putting multiple votes on Pokemon before dismissing them. But This should be the last one we do with more than like, 8.

	Banded Body Press	Dasocks	Pure Hackmons	TTLT	We Up	Result
Alomomola	Abstain	Ban	DNB	Abstain	DNB	DNB (2-1)
Beads of Ruin	DNB	Abstain	DNB	Abstain	Abstain	DNB (2-0)
Deoxys-Attack	DNB	DNB	Abstain	Restrict	Abstain	DNB (2-1)
Hadron Engine	Restrict	Restrict	Restrict	Restrict	Restrict	Restrict (5-0)
Jolteon	DNB	DNB	Ban	DNB	DNB	DNB (4-1)
Marill	DNB	DNB	Ban	DNB	DNB	DNB (4-1)
Nymble	DNB	DNB	Abstain	Abstain	Abstain	DNB (2-0)
Pikipek	DNB	DNB	Ban	Ban	Ban	Ban (3-2)
Quagsire	Ban	Ban	DNB	Ban	Abstain	DNB (3-2)
Sceptile	DNB	Abstain	Abstain	Abstain	Abstain	DNB (1-0)
Tail Glow	DNR	Abstain	Restrict	Abtain	Restrict	DNR (1-2)

Alomomola is very hard to kill. Every like 2 turns you don't kill she, something else gets farther from death too. She takes hits on the physical side like a champ and heals its team with its huge Wishes. It does that regardless of what team its on, but it often does more. On sun teams, she fuses with Groudon and sets sun. On rain, she fuses with Kyogre and calls rain. On any team, but particularly stall, it fuses with Houndstone to take hits even better than it already does. On any non-weather team, particularly balance, she fuses with Abomasnow at finally uses a move not in its native moveset: Aurora Veil. This allows it to keep its teammates even bulkier than they would be, additionally being able to pass wishes even safer. This is one of the strongest physical walls, and it looks like its going to stay that way.


Beads of Ruin was just tested because Ice Scales was banned, and we feared that Beads of Ruin would blast through special mons. Due to Vessel and Blissey and Snorlax are still around, thats not really a concern.


Not being affected by scale at all, Deoxys-Attack still has its base 150 speed and 180 spatk. It would be taken care of by priority, but it fuses with Indeedee for being a Psyspammer, additionally one that doesnt really just quit when a Blissey switches in.


Hadron Engine is a must for special electric sweepers. Miraidon's great special attack and just how Hadron Engine functions is necessary for all special attackers, and has made 3 banworthy. Magnemite and Regieleki have already been banned due to Hadron Engine, and Jolteon would have been, too. Needless to say that this made us question the unhealthier part, and council concluded that it was Hadron Engine.

Surge Surfer and Hadron Engine are also allowed together now, only being legal on Miraidon. Magnemite and Regieleki also are unbanned.


With DLC2 came Electro Shot. This let Jolteon be rain's strongest soldier. Obviously benefitting from Hadron Engine, in rain it could 2HKO even Ice Scales Snorlax. It has Energy Ball and Weather Ball as coverage, making its only counter Hood Quag.


Belly Drum Aqua Step


Lokix was banned earlier in the generation for being unwallable and unkillable with its fast, strong U-Turns and synergy with slow pivots. Nymble actually has even stronger and faster U-Turns. What changed? Nymble is actually much more balanced because it no longer has STAB Knock Off, or Knock off at all. It has no real coverage, its only non-STAB option being Trailblaze or Noxious Torque. That means it has no good way of hitting any bug resists, except maybe Fairy. Its former partner, Corviknight, is now his greatest enemy.


When Pikipek hits the field, something thats not Corviknight will probably die. Skill Link Technician Pop Bomb off of 209 attack is not something to sniff at. Can't really outspeed him, unless you're faster than 177 speed. Pikipek also runs Protective Pads, so good luck with Rocky Helmeting your problems. Its only solutions are really to use priority, and hopefully get it to take Stealth Rocks damage enough times by forcing it to switch against Corviknight.


The ultimate tank. Quagsire doesnt care how hard you hit it. He will Wisp, he will Wrap, and by god will he Recover. Quag makes it so hard to wear down stall. Mola isn't the best at taking hits repeatedly, thats why she doesnt usually spend more than 2 turns in. When she leaves, she's probably switching to Quagsire. Quagsire forces all physical attackers to switch out, except if its grass. Except again, the most popular sets are Houndstone and Goodra, which are either strong enough to take a hit, or dont feel it at all. Quag is a behemoth and is gone. Quagsire is survived by Wooper, who is slightly less physically bulky and much less specially bulky.


Sceptile is a great mon. He has Torch Song to activate his Throat Spray, and therefore unburden, turn 1. This means that Sceptile comes in, attacks once, and has immediately doubled his special attack and speed. Torch Song can also be used again to further boost its special attack. He also has Seed Flare as its main attack, potentially halving its opponent's special defense, provided that it could actually live the first Seed Flare. If you match up against Snorlax or Blissey, Secret Sword can hit them on their worse defensive stat. Uh Thunderbolt for Flying types. Tail Glow? Sceptile is very strong against mons, but falters against special walls or Hood Quag.


Not as strong as we thought tbh. Could be good potentially.

 

[HiZo]

Godly Power Update!
​

Rising from the dead once more. Now with a multitude of changes as a result of both Shared Power and Godly Gift simultaneously involving a new "restriction" category, allowing us more flexibility when it comes to bans!

Now, because both of our main tiers have changed, it makes no sense to currently keep the tier in the state it is now. So, council (read: me and ctproonie217) got together and went through the Pokemon and abilities. The tier may have some weird bans and/or unbans, but we're working with what is effectively a clean slate, and adjustments will be made when brokens are found. The move and item bans will be a combination mix of the two formats for simplicity's sake.

The main changes

Mons broken as gods (banned): Deoxys-N, Deoxys-A, Blissey, Chansey, Miraidon, Koraidon, Calyrex-Shadow

Mons broken as receivers (restricted): Annihilape, Arceus, Baxcalibur, Calyrex-Ice, Chi-Yu, Chien-Pao, Dialga, Eternatus, Flutter Mane, Giratina, Groudon, Ho-Oh, Iron Bundle, Kyogre, Kyurem-Black, Kyurem-White, Landorus, Lugia, Lunala, Magearna, Mewtwo, Necrozma-Dawn-Wings, Necrozma-Dusk-Mane, Ogerpon-Hearthflame, Palafin, Palkia, Rayquaza, Regieleki, Reshiram, Shaymin-Sky, Sneasler, Solgaleo, Spectrier, Terapagos, Ursaluna-Bloodmoon, Urshifu, Zacian, Zamazenta-Crowned, Zekrom, Maushold, Hoopa-Unbound, Toxapex

Abilities broken (banned): Huge Power, Pure Power, Arena Trap, Magnet Pull, Moody, Neutralizing Gas, Regenerator, Sand Veil, Shadow Tag, Snow Cloak, Speed Boost, Stench, Unburden

Abilities broken when shared (restricted): Armor Tail, Comatose, Contrary, Dazzling, Fur Coat, Gale Wings, Good as Gold, Huge Power, Illusion, Imposter, Magic Bounce, Magic Guard, Mold Breaker, Multiscale, Poison Heal, Prankster, Protosynthesis, Pure Power, Purifying Salt, Queenly Majesty, Quick Draw, Quick Feet, Sand Rush, Simple, Slush Rush, Stakeout, Stamina, Sturdy, Surge Surfer, Tinted Lens, Triage, Unaware, Water Bubble, Teravolt, Turboblaze, Opportunist, Chlorophyll, Swift Swim, Slush Rush, Sand Rush

We hope you enjoy the tier going forward.

codes

/challenge [Gen 9] Shared Power @@@Godly Gift Mod,+AG,+Uber,+Clefable,+Dondozo,+Greninja,+Kingambit,*Annihilape,*Arceus,*Baxcalibur,*Calyrex-Ice,*Chi-Yu,*Chien-Pao,*Deoxys,*Dialga,*Eternatus,*Flutter Mane,*Giratina,*Groudon,*Ho-Oh,*Iron Bundle,*Kyogre,*Kyurem-Black,*Kyurem-White,*Landorus,*Lugia,*Lunala,*Magearna,*Mewtwo,*Necrozma-Dawn-Wings,*Necrozma-Dusk-Mane,*Ogerpon-Hearthflame,*Palafin,*Palkia,*Rayquaza,*Regieleki,*Reshiram,*Shaymin-Sky,*Sneasler,*Solgaleo,*Spectrier,*Terapagos,*Ursaluna-Bloodmoon,*Urshifu-Base,*Zacian,*Zamazenta-Crowned,*Zekrom,*Toxapex,-Blissey,-Chansey,-Deoxys-Attack,-Deoxys-Base,*Maushold,*Hoopa-Unbound,-Huge Power,-Pure Power,-Focus Band,-Quick Claw,-Shed Tail,*Chlorophyll,*Drizzle,*Opportunist,*Turboblaze,*Teravolt


/tour new [Gen 9] Shared Power, Elimination,,,[Gen 9] Godly Power
/tour rules Godly Gift Mod,+AG,+Uber,+Clefable,+Dondozo,+Greninja,+Kingambit,*Annihilape, *Arceus, *Baxcalibur, *Calyrex-Ice, *Chi-Yu, *Chien-Pao, *Deoxys, *Dialga, *Eternatus, *Flutter Mane, *Giratina, *Groudon, *Ho-Oh, *Iron Bundle, *Kyogre, *Kyurem-Black, *Kyurem-White, *Landorus, *Lugia, *Lunala, *Magearna, *Mewtwo, *Necrozma-Dawn-Wings, *Necrozma-Dusk-Mane, *Ogerpon-Hearthflame, *Palafin, *Palkia, *Rayquaza, *Regieleki, *Reshiram, *Shaymin-Sky, *Sneasler, *Solgaleo, *Spectrier, *Terapagos, *Ursaluna-Bloodmoon, *Urshifu-Base, *Zacian, *Zamazenta-Crowned, *Zekrom,*Toxapex,-Blissey,-Chansey,-Deoxys-Attack, -Deoxys-Base, *Maushold, *Hoopa-Unbound,-Huge Power,-Pure Power,-Focus Band,-Quick Claw,-Shed Tail,*Chlorophyll, *Drizzle, *Opportunist,*Turboblaze, *Teravolt


 

[longhiep341]

I'm here for some announcements.
I have added 2 sample teams for AAA Doubles. You can find them in the main hub in the first page.
Secondly, I'm stepping down as Project Leader. I'm confident the rest of the team will still do a good job of developing the project.

 

[Roldski32]

Tried to get this one up

Mix and Mega LC Speed Tier

Pokemon	Mega Stone	Nature	IV	EVs	Speed Stat	Boost
Yanma	n/a	Positive	31	236	40	+2
Yanma	n/a	Neutral	31	236	38	+2
Drifloon	n/a	Positive	31	196	34	+2 (Unburden)
Drilbur	n/a	Positive	31	212	34	+2 (Sand Rush)
Drifloon	n/a	Neutral	31	196	32	+2 (Unburden)
Drilbur	n/a	Neutral	31	212	32	+2 (Sand Rush)
Bulbasaur	n/a	Positive	31	236	30	+2 (Chlorophyll)
Cranidos	Metagrossite	Positive	31	236	30	+1
Growlithe-Hisui	Metagrossite	Positive	31	236	30	+1
Yanma	n/a	Positive	31	236	30	+1
Bellsprout	n/a	Positive	31	196	28	+2 (Chlorophyll)
Bulbasaur	n/a	Neutral	31	236	28	+2 (Chlorophyll)
Girafarig	n/a	Positive	31	236	28	+1
Gligar	n/a	Positive	31	236	28	+1
Murkrow	n/a	Positive	31	188	28	+1
Sandshrew-Alola	n/a	Positive	31	196	28	+2 (Slush Rush)
Toedscool	Pinsirite	Positive	31	196	28	+1
Yanma	n/a	Neutral	31	236	28	+1
Diglett	Diancite	Positive	31	236	27	+0
Bellsprout	n/a	Neutral	31	196	26	+2 (Chlorophyll)
Cutiefly	Diancite	Positive	31	244	26	+0
Diglett-Alola	Diancite	Positive	31	196	26	+0
Sandshrew-Alola	n/a	Neutral	31	196	26	+2 (Slush Rush)
Gastly	Diancite	Positive	31	196	25	+0
Toedscool	Altarianite	Positive	31	196	25	+1
Torchic	Pinsirite	Positive	31	236	25	+1
Growlithe-Hisui	n/a	Positive	31	236	24	+1
Magby	Metagrossite	Positive	31	252	24	+0
Torchic	Pinsirite	Neutral	31	236	24	+1
Zorua-Hisui	Diancite	Positive	31	196	24	+0
Gastly	Absolite	Positive	31	196	23	+0
Glimmet	Diancite	Positive	31	196	23	+0
Voltorb	Glalitite	Positive	31	196	23	+0
Gothita	n/a	Positive	31	236	22	+1
Torchic	Altarianite	Positive	31	236	22	+1
Gothita	n/a	Neutral	31	236	21	+1
Torchic	Altarianite	Neutral	31	236	21	+1
Cranidos	Metagrossite	Positive	31	212	20	+0
Finizen	Pinsirite	Positive	31	236	20	+0
Growlithe-Hisui	Metagrossite	Positive	31	236	20	+0
Pawniard	Metagrossite	Positive	31	196	20	+0
Yanma	n/a	Positive	31	236	20	+0
Girafarig	n/a	Positive	31	236	19	+0
Gligar	n/a	Positive	31	236	19	+0
Magby	Red Orb	Positive	31	252	19	+0
Misdreavus	n/a	Positive	31	236	19	+0
Mudbray	n/a	Positive	31	236	19	+0
Murkrow	n/a	Positive	31	188	19	+0
Qwilfish-Hisui	n/a	Positive	31	236	19	+0
Toedscool	Pinsirite	Positive	31	196	19	+0
Wingull	Blue Orb	Positive	31	236	19	+0
Yanma	n/a	Neutral	31	236	19	+0
Finizen	Altarianite	Positive	31	236	18	+0
Mudbray	Lopunnite	Positive	31	236	18	+0
Mudbray	Lopunnite	Neutral	31	236	17	+0
Pawniard	Rusted Sword	Positive	31	236	17	+0
Toedscool	Altarianite	Positive	31	196	17	+0
Sandshrew-Alola	Scizorite	Positive	31	196	15	+0
Wattrel	n/a	Neutral	31	36	14	+0
Larvesta	n/a	Neutral	31	36	13	+0
Vullaby	n/a	Neutral	31	0	12	+0
Hippopotas	n/a	Neutral	31	0	10	+0
Vullaby	Sablenite	Neutral	31	0	9	+0
Foongus	n/a	Neutral	31	0	8	+0
Slowpoke	n/a	Neutral	31	0	8	+0
Hippopotas	Sablenite	Neutral	31	0	7	+0
Munchlax	n/a	Neutral	31	0	7	+0
Munchlax	Sablenite	Neutral	31	0	6	+0

 

[Yoru97]

from a mashup where an otter slaps at least 3 mons every game...
LC Mix and Mega has RESTRICTED Elekid!

	Clas	Yoru97	Roldski32	Result
Elekid	Ban	Ban	Abstain	2-0-1 BAN

Elekid's ability to outspeed or speedtie the entire metagame bar Choice Scarf Duraludon and Diancite base 19 Speed Pokemon was alone incredibly notable, but its flexibility from its movepool that isn't shared by its Electric bretheren in Hisuian Voltorb was really what let it shine a bit too much. Metagrossite sets were easily the best, as it had BoltBeam coverage in the form of Ice Punch, a contact move that already threatens a 2HKO on every Electric resist and immunity in the entire metagame bar Duraludon and Hippopotas, the former of which fears Cross Chop and Focus Blast from other sets, and the latter being prone to Knock Off along with simply not being common. Absolite and Lopunnite sets were also equally notable, however, as they allowed Elekid to gain new prowess in the form of 2HKOing or even outright OHKOing Duraludon after minor chip, an otherwise incredible stalwart in such an offensive metagame. Offensive checks such as Altarianite Mienfoo, Scarf Duraludon, and Scarf Gligar could provide counterplay to Elekid, but all 3 had notable disadvantages compared to their most common sets, with Altarianite Mienfoo being disadvantaged vs opposing Pinsirite Mienfoo which is possibly the best Pokemon in the tier, while Duraludon and Gligar have Eviolite sets with valuable defensive roles that many teams couldn't afford to sacrifice.

 

[LordBox]

As if one obscure AAA variant wasn't enough, I've happened to take a deeper look at the STAAABmons banlist as the concept had interested but I was too busy playing other obscure AAA variants (NDAAA). Here are some of my quick thoughts, which may not be too accurate as I have not had the chance to play with the lack of games.



I don't see much reason as to why this is banned compared to normal AAA. Infernal Parade can be irritating but at the same time you're trading off immediate power on mons that usually are inclined towards it. Compared to some of the other seeming monsters in the tier this seems almost mild.



Same reason as above, though it can take advantage of Infernal Parade better. However as a bulky setup mon there seem to be more than enough power and defensive options to aptly handle it with stuff like extremely broken Weavile, Surging Strikes Barraskewda and the new RegenVests that can mostly handle it, outside of getting unlucky and burned (or I run Meloetta gg).



I don't see why this is banned. I didn't entirely support the ban when it initially when through in SVAAA when it had extremely limited competition and forced Regen slot (which I didn't think was true). Now there's a bunch of new defensive counterplay in SVAAA like Deo-D, Zapdos and better Toxic distribution (and you even have stuff like Roost Gliscor here) which should apply here, and there's more than enough power going around to force it out. Doesn't even monopolise the Regen slot since it already gets Shore Up (and this shouldn't make BU sets obnoxious as otherwise they're left with one real attack or can't boost speed and should be easily revenge-able with something like Corv pivot into Azelf)



Lol? I can understand it being banned in STAB with its near-exclusive access to Sheer Force but that is obviously not the case here and I don't see what it even gets from STAB except like Hurricane?



This one makes a bit more sense but it seems like a remnant from the STAB banlist. It does get some decent shiny moves in Blue Flare/Fiery Wrath but all in all isn't THAT bad in theory and considering its fragility, speed and rocks weakness meaning it has zero usage in SVAAA I don't see why it shouldn't be given a chance. Unless it already has but I don't see anything indicating it has?

Outside of the mons that I think deserve a lookover out of the banlist, there's quite a few that do look a bit suspect to me on how they remain.



Yeah this makes no sense to me. Chien-Pao is banned even so why not Weavile, I know it's slower but not even by that much. Otherwise it still retains ridiculously strong Glacial Lance with SoR or Technician-boosted Triple Axels and Beat Up that can be even stronger. All while packing SD, a still great speed-tier, endless spammable utility with Knock/Ceaseless and great priority even in Ice Shard/Sucker Punch.



Barraskewda is a fairly strong mon already and Surging Strikes is an extreme boost in power from Liquidation while even able to ignore the annoyances of Intimidate, though it still hold some of its old limitations so maybe I could see it not being dummy broken.

Okay, I kind of can get this more sticking since I've put up with it before but literally every Electric getting access to it does seem a bit absurd with all the other moves they can get, though most are usually still poor abusers. Raging Bolt still looks supremely dumb though with its usual Specs or Sub CM shenanigans.

+ ALL THE UBERS

It seems that this meta has not been updated for DLC2, which is quite sad. For now, invest in NDM stocks!!!

That's the most obvious for me but here's a list of other strong offensive mons that get stronger and I'm probably missing a bunch more:

(Dragon Energy, Fiery Wrath)
(Dragon Dance, Headlong Rush, Glaive Rush, Shore Up)
(Roost, Brave Bird/Dragon Ascent, Wave Crash)
(Boomburst, Lumina Crash)
(Torch Song, Eruption, Blue Flare, Mortal Spin)
(Ceaseless Edge, Glaive Rush)
(Dragon Ascent, Shore Up)
(Glaive Rush, millions of Fire-type moves)
(Dragon Energy, Clanging Scales, Clangorous Soul, Psystrike, Lumina Crash, Expanding Force)
(All the moves they share lol)
(Ceaseless Edge, Behemoth Bash, Knock Off, Bullet Punch)

There is a LOT of offense in this tier and I don't see how the tier exactly tackles this very well. There is an abundance of extra defensive options, the main reason that attracts me to the tier, as well but it doesn't really seem to convince me that they can match up very well with all the bullshittery that offense gets with all their new shiny and directly more powerful tools.

I'm not going to push for any action because I do not (or well, moreso cannot) play this meta and am very biased. For now I'll leave my thoughts and go back to finishing that NDAAA guide I've been procrastinating on for ages and hopefully that incentives some more development for what looks like a cool concept but lacks the player which is a unfortunate trend for these niche metagames but if I can push one niche AAA variant I can push another one!!

 

[Yoru97]

from a mashup where an otter refuses to stop slapping babies...
LC Mix and Mega has BANNED Duraludon!

	Clas	Yoru97	Roldski32	Result
Duraludon	Ban	Ban	Ban	3-0-0 BAN

Duraludon has been one of the best pokemon in LC mnm since its release, with it having the defensive stats and typing to be a critical defensive cornerstone of the metagame while having a great special attack and coverage to limit which checks can effectively answer it. Using a moveset of Draco Meteor/Flash Cannon/Body Press/Stealth Rocks, Duraludon is capable of denying checking attempts from any of the limited Fairy types of the tier immune to Draco Meteor with Flash Cannon and 2HKO Munchlax, one of the few non-Fairies capable of consistently taking Draco Meteor while potentially threatening a 2HKO, with the ability to support its own damage potential as well as those of its teammates with Stealth Rocks. Choice Scarf variants also existed, sacrificing the survivability and flexibility that define Eviolite variants for speed that allows it to outspeed every other relevant offensive threat in the tier while being able to catch opponents who expect an Eviolite set off guard. Despite the threat of Choice Scarf, Eviolite sets are what pushed Duraludon over the edge, resulting in council voting unanimously on its ban.

 

[aerobee]

Blissey, Chansey, Marill, Pikipek, and Reuniclus are banned from Alphabet Soup! Electro Shot is now restricted!
​

	Banded Body Press​	TheTrueLTaker​	we up​	Dasocks​	Pure Hackmons​	Result​
Alomomola​	Abstain​	DNB​	DNB​	BAN​	DNB​	Remains Unbanned (3-1)​
Blissey & Chansey​	BAN​	BAN​	Abstain​	BAN​	BAN​	BAN (4-0)​
Electro Shot​	Restrict​	Restrict​	Abstain​	Abstain​	Restrict​	Restrict (3-0)​
Jolteon​	DNB​	DNB​	DNB​	BAN​	DNB​	Remains Unbanned (4-1)​
Marill​	BAN​	BAN​	BAN​	BAN​	BAN​	BAN (5-0)​
Pikipek (previous slate)​	DNB​	BAN​	BAN​	DNB​	BAN​	BAN (3-2)​
Reuniclus​	BAN​	BAN​	BAN​	BAN​	BAN​	BAN (5-0)​
Tail Glow​	DNR​	DNR​	DNR​	Restrict​	Restrict​	Remains Unrestricted (3-2)​
Salt Cure​	Abstain​	DNU​	DNU​	Unrestrict​	DNU​	Remains Restricted (3-1)​
Single Unaware Clause​	DNI​	DNI​	DNI​	Implement​	DNI​	Not Implemented (4-1)​

It was near-unanimously agreed that Blissey and Chansey warp teambuilding to an unhealthy extent – in order for special sweepers to get past them, they would need to run Secret Sword, as otherwise the blobs can remove boosts with Clear Smog or Haze. Blissey in particular could also make good use of Boomburst, with its base 90 Special Attack before boosts from potential fusions, and could run Burning Bulwark or Baneful Bunker, making it the preferred choice overall; however, we also voted on Chansey as it would be a near-1:1 replacement to Blissey if the latter left the tier. Both could also run Ceaseless Edge and Chilly Reception, making them suitable picks on non-stall teams as well.



Electro Shot is simply incredible in Rain – it simultaneously provides a boosting option and extremely strong STAB move to Electric-types fused with Kyogre. The most common users were Jolteon, Hisuian Electrode, and Elekid, as their generally high Speed allowed them to spam the move without much reproach from non-Stall teams, though they were susceptible to getting forced out by even faster attackers like Unburden-boosted Hawlucha. Ground-types apart from Wooper fused with Hisuian Goodra would lose to coverage, like Energy Ball and Weather Ball from Jolteon and Grass STAB from Hisuian Electrode, and Blissey had to run Prankster + Haze to reliably wall Electro Shot users or pivot to a faster attacker with Chilly Reception.



Initially, Marill was seen as a defensive titan thanks to good mixed bulk, great offensive utility thanks to Huge Power, its natural movepool, and Magical Torque, and an amazing defensive typing, which included a 4x resistance to Fire thanks to Thick Fat and a Grass immunity with Sap Sipper. However, people began to explore Belly Drum sets, which would break through Unaware switch-ins with Knock Off and a Kyurem-Black fusion, limiting long-term defensive counterplay to Sticky Hold + Unaware walls with Ability Shield, like Swalot. These offensive sets became ubiquitous, and it was unanimously agreed upon that offensive Marill's impact on the metagame was detrimental enough to the metagame to warrant its removal.



Trumbeak was recently banned for many of the same reasons, though Pikipek sports higher base Attack and Speed to take advantage of Population Bomb and other attacks better. Pikipek's inability to boost with Tidy Up wasn't much of an impediment due to naturally getting Swords Dance, which let it get past non-Rocky Helmet Corviknight without too much trouble. Even Rocky Helmet variants could be disposed of with Protective Pads, which Pikipek could opt for thanks to Skill Link, or a well-timed Knock Off. Precipice Blades and Pyro Ball also messed up checks like non-Orthworm fusion Coalossal and the occasional non-Dachsbun fusion Corviknight. Pikipek was banned in a close 3-2 vote in the previous slate, but it was missed so I just mentioned it in this one.



With a Lunala fusion, Reuniclus was incredible defensive utility, boasting Regenerator, Shadow Shield, and Magic Guard all in one. It put these qualities to great use as well, as its seemingly infinite support movepool, including Knock Off, Rapid Spin, Stone Axe, Strength Sap, and Psychic Noise, would allow it to make difficult-to-deny progress against offensive and defensive teams alike. Games against bulkier teams often devolved into how to wear down the opposing Reuniclus first, as it was the best switch-in to itself due to not minding getting Knocked Off in such matchups and being tough to punish thanks to Magic Guard.

 

[NeonJolteonWasUsed]

STABmons Ubers

( Art by JesskyKhemically )

What is STABmons Ubers?: STABmons Ubers is all in the name. It's Ubers, with the STABmons modification applied to it, no more, no less, simple as that. As a tier, the threshold for something to be banworthy is much, much higher, such is the nature of Ubers as a tier.

Council
NeonJolteonWasUsed
JesskyKhemically
Velcroc

Resources

Viability Rankings

S

Eternatus
Groudon
Kyogre
Necrozma Dusk Mane
Zacian Crowned

S-

Ho-Oh

A+

Garchomp


A

Dialga
Deoxys Speed
Giratina Origin
Kyurem Black
Lunala
Toxapex

A-

Calyrex Ice Rider
Landorus Therian
Mewtwo
Palkia Origin
Terapagos
Ting-Lu
Zamazenta Crowned


B+

Deoxys Attack
Dragapult
Rayquaza
Ursaluna

B

Chi-Yu
Giratina Altered
Gliscor
Grimmsnarl
Kyurem White
Rotom Wash
Skarmory
Urshifu Single Strike
Zekrom

B-

Blissey
Ditto
Enamorus Incarnate
Great Tusk
Kingambit
Ribombee
Roaring Moon
Skeledirge

C+

Blaziken
Chansey
Chien-Pao
Clodsire
Dondozo
Landorus Incarnate
Magearna
Ogerpon Cornerstone Mask
Ogerpon Hearthflame Mask
Tyranitar
Walking Wake

C

Corviknight
Forretress
Gothitelle
Glimmora
Hatterene
Indeedee Male
Iron Bundle
Latios
Ogerpon Wellspring Mask
Palkia Altered
Raging Bolt
Reshiram
Thundurus Therian
Ursaluna Blood Moon
Urshifu Rapid Strike

C-

Alomomola
Clefable
Dugtrio
Excadrill
Gholdengo
Heatran
Hisuian Zoroark
Kleavor
Komala
Lugia
Manaphy
Regieleki
Scizor
Shaymin Sky
Solgaleo
Spectrier

D

A reminder that these Pokemon are only Ubers by tiering and possess no real metagame niche.

Araquanid
Azumarill
Basculegion Male
Basculegion Female
Cloyster
Deoxys
Dialga Origin
Dragonite
Hisuian Lilligant
Necrozma Dawn Wings
Pecharunt
Porygon-Z
Zacian Hero of Many Battles

Set Compendium

STABmons Ubers Official Set Compendium (WIP)
( Format by Zrp200 )

Banlist

Pokemon
Arceus (All Forms)
Calyrex Shadow Rider
Koraidon
Miraidon
Flutter Mane
Moves (Restricted)
Shell Smash
Revival Blessing
Moves (Banned)
Last Respects

Sample Teams

Coming Soon!

Challenge Code

/challenge gen9ubers @@@ Standard OMs, Sleep Moves Clause, STABmons Move Legality,*Shell Smash,*Revival Blessing, -Last Respects, -Arceus, -Koraidon, -Miraidon, -Flutter Mane, -Calyrex-Shadow

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