1yr
formerly I❤BerryKind
yeah i think the same thing the only way it can beat it is like if roaring moon already terad or if dozo is using body press but then again roaring can still tera to a resistNo not with Taunt and Booster Energy + Attack
yeah i think the same thing the only way it can beat it is like if roaring moon already terad or if dozo is using body press but then again roaring can still tera to a resistNo not with Taunt and Booster Energy + Attack
Avalanche Dozo is one hell of a cope, but actually pretty decent into Moon - hell, even Avalugg could deal with it.yeah i think the same thing the only way it can beat it is like if roaring moon already terad or if dozo is using body press but then again roaring can still tera to a resist
I just run Diancie for roaring atp it kinda fries it because taunt>>>>>>>eqAvalanche Dozo is one hell of a cope, but actually pretty decent into Moon - hell, even Avalugg could deal with it.
mega slamencewhat ubers (if any) do u guys think should be suspect tested to be emitted into nat dex ou
mega slamence
Mega Metagrosswhat ubers (if any) do u guys think should be suspect tested to be emitted into nat dex ou
Preferably with Tera gone, but Galarian Darmanitan and Heartflame Ogerpon.what ubers (if any) do u guys think should be suspect tested to be emitted into nat dex ou
Horrible, horrible take. Darmanitan-Galar was one of the most obscenely broken mons to ever be permitted in a non-Ubers format.Preferably with Tera gone, but Galarian Darmanitan and Heartflame Ogerpon.
That's your opinion, I would rather a mon be retested every Generation than for it to be assumed broken only for it to be Mid when we finally decide we want to test it/drop it. This is also known as the Blaziken Method.Horrible, horrible take. Darmanitan-Galar was one of the most obscenely broken mons to ever be permitted in a non-Ubers format.
Rotom wash does lowkey wall the hell out of darm but I’m more concerned about hearthflame like I used to terrorize people with that idk if it’s the Tera that pushed it over the edge though like mold breaker with swords dance fire grass stab with play rough is just disgustingThat's your opinion, I would rather a mon be retested every Generation then for it to be assumed broken only for it to be Mid when we finally decide we want to test it/drop it. This is also known as the Blaziken Method.
Mate, we don’t need to spend time testing stuff that’s obscenely broken, like a 140 base Attack monster that can either double its Attack stat with CB to annihilate defensive teams or get both CB and Scarf to outrun and kill offense. This would effectively pigeonhole every team into running Dondozo or Alo (I don’t even know if Alo can take CB + G-Tactics Icicle Crash without being 2HKOed. I’ll calc it soon.)That's your opinion, I would rather a mon be retested every Generation then for it to be assumed broken only for it to be Mid when we finally decide we want to test it/drop it. This is also known as the Blaziken Method.
nah, its not even 2x. the multiplier for cb+gtactics is 2.25x LOL. yeah pls keep it banned. not to say every damn move is a predict bc if you go pex or tran to resist that icicle crash, and you get hit with an eq, no matter how bulky you are you are dying. every move is a play w/ that mon around, its ohko or no ohko. and theres tera here too. why would u want it susd. ndou would cripple like an elderly man.Mate, we don’t need to spend time testing stuff that’s obscenely broken, like a 140 base Attack monster that can either double its Attack stat with CB to annihilate defensive teams or get both CB and Scarf to outrun and kill offense. This would effectively pigeonhole every team into running Dondozo or Alo (I don’t even know if Alo can take CB + G-Tactics Icicle Crash without being 2HKOed. I’ll calc it soon.)
252+ Atk Choice Band Gorilla Tactics Tera Ice Darmanitan-Galar Icicle Crash vs. 252 HP / 244+ Def Rotom-Wash: 167-197 (54.9 - 64.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recoveryRotom wash does lowkey wall the hell out of darm but I’m more concerned about hearthflame like I used to terrorize people with that idk if it’s the Tera that pushed it over the edge though like mold breaker with swords dance fire grass stab with play rough is just disgusting
I remember playing SS OU during the gdarm meta, and I can tell you that rotom-wash is not enough of a check - people used rotom-heat instead since u-turn otherwise chips you way too much (the mon does have a choice band ability alongside a 140 atk stat...), and the mon still was very easy to chip down with icicle crash, even from scarf sets. Obviously it's even worse if you try to switch into the choice band set or if it just uses tera (252 Atk Gorilla Tactics Tera Ice Darmanitan-Galar Icicle Crash vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Rotom-Heat: 101-119 (33.2 - 39.1%) -- 100% chance to 3HKO)Rotom wash does lowkey wall the hell out of darm
Well the original post is going under the presupposition that Tera is banned and I was referencing the scarf set because I believe it’s much better than band bc u would obv need speed or else everything would just outspeed and kill it making my argument even better to sus it if Tera were to get banned and I’m p sure Rotom walls the scarf one pretty well the thing that does the most damage is Uturn 252 Atk Gorilla Tactics Darmanitan-Galar U-turn vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Rotom-Wash: 84-99 (27.6 - 32.5%) -- 71.8% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery not to mention the protect recovery and potential reads you can make like if u have lets say volcorona u can’t keep clicking u turn in fear of getting burnt and speaking of getting burnt darm also can’t stay in on Rotom because of wisp and let’s not even talk about how alomomola treats this thing 252 Atk Gorilla Tactics Darmanitan-Galar Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Alomomola: 144-170 (26.9 - 31.8%) -- guaranteed 4HKO just farms with easy flip turns and if it decides to click Uturn rocky helmet just destroys it but then again these calcs are all scarf but if you don’t run scarf you get out sped by literally everything and abused not to mention rocky helmet dondozo also owns thisI remember playing SS OU during the gdarm meta, and I can tell you that rotom-wash is not enough of a check - people used rotom-heat instead since u-turn otherwise chips you way too much (the mon does have a choice band ability alongside a 140 atk stat...), and the mon still was very easy to chip down with icicle crash, even from scarf sets. Obviously it's even worse if you try to switch into the choice band set or if it just uses tera (252 Atk Gorilla Tactics Tera Ice Darmanitan-Galar Icicle Crash vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Rotom-Heat: 101-119 (33.2 - 39.1%) -- 100% chance to 3HKO)
Guys, we should suspect Kingambit in National Dex OU again. Seriously.
NatDex has been plagued by an onslaught of hyper-offense recently, with Stored Power CM+IDef Iron Crown being immune to Toxic and Stored Power often straight up OHKOing Special Walls through RESISTS. It can also use multiple Teras and sets to its benefit, such as Tera Ghost to be immune to Fake Out/CC from Medicham and set up Iron Defense, or Tera Water to patch up the weaknesses in its typing. It can also run more sets other than CM+IDef, including Sub (to beat Garg), Specs to surprise the opponent (although not as effective), or bulky Volt Switch pivot (outclassed but sure). It can also use Tera to tech past counters, such as Tera Blast Fairy for AV Hoopa-U, TB Fire for Steels (that don't already get nuked by Stored Power of course) and Wisp immunity, and Tera Electric to get past TWave shenanigans. It can afford to run so many different sets and teras when it cannot do so in the OU tier, all because in OU the omnipresence of Kingambit prevents Dark weak setup sweepers from getting any nasty ideas.
Apart from Mr. King there, Gouging Fire has also been quite popular on HO, since it is a Physical setup sweeper with a burn immunity. Usually, this guy does not get out of hand in OU, even with +6+6, since Tera Dark Black Glasses Sucker Punch from Kingambit chunks it for a respectable 50% at just 2 fainted. However, in NatDex, we have no such luxury, and we must hope Gouging Fire does not have Morning Sun, lest the puny 15% from Lopunny-M get healed off (Frustration doesn't even 2HKO). It can also use multiple different Teras, such as Tera Steel for Toxic, and Tera Ground to boost Earthquake damage and have a Thunder Wave immunity. Guess why it can use so many different Teras? Of course! Kingambit doesn't exist so it doesn't need to Tera Fairy for Sucker Punch! (also Dondozo is the only reliable check unless they pull out the Fire Spin Breaking Swipe tech)
Trick Room is kinda shit in OU since Kingambit somehow solos them, but in NatDex, counterplay is more limited. (now that I think about it only Protect can save you)
Alright so basically there are some really broken threats that cannot be checked (they both happen to resist Scizor BP), and so Kingambit should be suspected to prevent having to suspect those two guys. Kingambit does have Pursuit, but that is just a tool, allowing one to chip down HO threats more easily. Knock Off is also not quite so bad, considering that Megas do take reduced damage. The power level in NatDex has increased with the introduction of new mons in the DLC, so we should try to give Kingambit a chance (or else only Stall and HO are really viable in NatDex). With him, the only real loser is Stall, but there are enough tools to check him (if he uses other sets then he cant beat HO).
Also this is without even factoring in tera, as Darm-G can tera ground to both lose its rocks weakness and gain stab on earthquake. It's got a ~50% chance to 2hko alo from full hp with no chip if its scarf. Even funnier though is how banded 2hkos dondozo from full hp every single time. It's just unreasonable to ask to suspect it back down because of how blatantly overtuned it is and unsuited for the metagameMate, we don’t need to spend time testing stuff that’s obscenely broken, like a 140 base Attack monster that can either double its Attack stat with CB to annihilate defensive teams or get both CB and Scarf to outrun and kill offense. This would effectively pigeonhole every team into running Dondozo or Alo (I don’t even know if Alo can take CB + G-Tactics Icicle Crash without being 2HKOed. I’ll calc it soon.)
blaziken was banned for like the past 4 gens prior to the test, and has actual reasons to why it was worse in nd than smThat's your opinion, I would rather a mon be retested every Generation than for it to be assumed broken only for it to be Mid when we finally decide we want to test it/drop it. This is also known as the Blaziken Method.
I feel like you're giving HO too much credit here. Iron crown, while a strong setup sweeper, is also incredibly easily to pressure offensively due to how weak it is before boosting. It's also very easily checked by any pokemon with taunt, as it only having a single boost is really manageable. Standard gouging also gets farmed super hard by mola teams, as eq doesn't deal too much and mola can threaten debilitating toxics. Also once again this mon heavily loses to taunt lando, as you can either smack it with a super strong earthquake or taunt it to deny setup and recovery. Trick Room in natdex is perpetually a meme. It's best matchup is offense but even then it's pretty easily stalled out. Once hatt's fallen you can super easily just taunt the setters to deny room, as they're oftentimes super passive pokemon like cresselia or pory2. Hoopa-u as a setter is also just super easily dealt with, again, by taunt lando as a single u turn often outright ohkos it.Guys, we should suspect Kingambit in National Dex OU again. Seriously.
NatDex has been plagued by an onslaught of hyper-offense recently, with Stored Power CM+IDef Iron Crown being immune to Toxic and Stored Power often straight up OHKOing Special Walls through RESISTS. It can also use multiple Teras and sets to its benefit, such as Tera Ghost to be immune to Fake Out/CC from Medicham and set up Iron Defense, or Tera Water to patch up the weaknesses in its typing. It can also run more sets other than CM+IDef, including Sub (to beat Garg), Specs to surprise the opponent (although not as effective), or bulky Volt Switch pivot (outclassed but sure). It can also use Tera to tech past counters, such as Tera Blast Fairy for AV Hoopa-U, TB Fire for Steels (that don't already get nuked by Stored Power of course) and Wisp immunity, and Tera Electric to get past TWave shenanigans. It can afford to run so many different sets and teras when it cannot do so in the OU tier, all because in OU the omnipresence of Kingambit prevents Dark weak setup sweepers from getting any nasty ideas.
Apart from Mr. King there, Gouging Fire has also been quite popular on HO, since it is a Physical setup sweeper with a burn immunity. Usually, this guy does not get out of hand in OU, even with +6+6, since Tera Dark Black Glasses Sucker Punch from Kingambit chunks it for a respectable 50% at just 2 fainted. However, in NatDex, we have no such luxury, and we must hope Gouging Fire does not have Morning Sun, lest the puny 15% from Lopunny-M get healed off (Frustration doesn't even 2HKO). It can also use multiple different Teras, such as Tera Steel for Toxic, and Tera Ground to boost Earthquake damage and have a Thunder Wave immunity. Guess why it can use so many different Teras? Of course! Kingambit doesn't exist so it doesn't need to Tera Fairy for Sucker Punch! (also Dondozo is the only reliable check unless they pull out the Fire Spin Breaking Swipe tech)
Trick Room is kinda shit in OU since Kingambit somehow solos them, but in NatDex, counterplay is more limited. (now that I think about it only Protect can save you)
Alright so basically there are some really broken threats that cannot be checked (they both happen to resist Scizor BP), and so Kingambit should be suspected to prevent having to suspect those two guys. Kingambit does have Pursuit, but that is just a tool, allowing one to chip down HO threats more easily. Knock Off is also not quite so bad, considering that Megas do take reduced damage. The power level in NatDex has increased with the introduction of new mons in the DLC, so we should try to give Kingambit a chance (or else only Stall and HO are really viable in NatDex). With him, the only real loser is Stall, but there are enough tools to check him (if he uses other sets then he cant beat HO).
No, this stupid ass mon terrorized gen 8 and can break through all of its checks either via Hax or just sheer forceMega Metagross
Horrible take. For Landorus-Incarnate to have any chance of being OU, there needs to be multiple splashable mons with high special bulk that either have massive, massive Blissey-tier special bulk or resist or are straight up immune to Ground-type moves without being weak to its coverage. Right now, the only mons that fit the bill that aren't extremely niche options are Mega Latias, Chansey/Blissey, and Cresselia. History has shown that Gamefreak is unwillingly to design mons that can handle Landorus-Incarnate, so it shall likely remain Uber for the foreseeable future.Not this generation, but next generation, I wanna suspect Landorus Incarnate.
This thing is strong, no doubt there, but it's not like it can withstand power creep forever. One day there will be better Ferrothorn that just won't be beaten by Landorus I and then we can have a metagame where the REAL Landorus can function.